B (2:35)

It was both. It's almost always both. We have yet since we've been here to have just a holiday. But that is actually the goal for 2026, a holiday with no work attached, just going somewhere where there's no family. Although we love our family dearly and just doing our own thing. That's great.

C (2:56)

It's hard to turn off. I mean, there's so many demands in all directions. And then, of course, we left just after, you know, our trip to the United States was just after Poopy passed away.

C (3:09)

And that couldn't be delayed because my father was not well. And fortunately, we arrived the day before he passed away. So we there for that process, which is, you know, at the end of it all, it's exactly how it should have and needed to be so we could be there for my mom, be there, say goodbye to him, and process that a little bit, and then spend enough time with my mom before jumping into work obligations, which were actually part of a little bit of a relaxation trip. Going back out to the San Juan Islands for a film festival. Friday Harbor Film Festival, which was so much fun. A lot of great films, a lot of great people. And once again, the Rumba Effect won yet another award. She's won the award all over the world and getting lots of accolades for the piece that was created with Rambo's Story.

B (4:06)

Yeah, for now, it's not available to the public. Well, to us it's weird, but to people who do this, I'm sure it's not weird at all. When you do the festival circuit, you can't release it in any way where it would actually make money. So for now, it's in the festival circuit. Once it's done with that, then it can shift to being more public and people will actually be able to see it. But for now, Claire is doing the festivals and she's traveling around the US to go to some of the festivals. And it really is great. The people that are at them that make films that they've really poured so much of themselves into.

B (4:45)

That'S a nice crowd to be around and to meet and to talk with and to learn about things that you don't know about, especially not in the depth that they go into.

C (4:53)

A lot of inspiring stories and just an honor to be part of that.

A (4:57)

Fantastic. So when is it coming to Europe, Claire? Let us know.

C (5:01)

I think you can follow notices online through the Rumba. I think it's therumboffect.com I don't remember.

B (5:08)

Terrible.

A (5:08)

We'll put it in the links. I know there's Facebook. Put it in the Facebook page.

B (5:11)

Yeah, there's an Instagram page.

C (5:12)

I know, I should. So then you can follow along that way. It's super exciting. Really exciting to see what's happening. And the thing for Us. It's always weird watching yourself on the big screen, you know, it doesn't feel right. But the bottom line especially surrounded by.

B (5:30)

A bunch of other people and then the lights come up and you have to be like hehe.

B (5:36)

As an introvert, really uncomfortable.

C (5:39)

Yeah. Cat even got on stage this time, which was a big milestone. But you know, the bottom line for that is Rumba's story, you know, and what it took for her to make that process and all the hurdles and all the bureaucracy and all the joy at the end, even though short lived, the impact that had on so many people just to see that whole life differently. What it means to be an elephant in that, what it means to be given a chance, what it means to have that. And you feel it, you know, you feel that struggle through Rhomba and did a great job. It hits people, it hits people pretty deep. And it's exciting to see because it's pretty powerful.

B (6:18)

It's nice to talk to people afterwards. They did a Q and A and you know, even in that short Q and A, having somebody that said when I was younger I did this and I never really thought about it and now I understand more of the role I'm playing in it and that it wasn't actually okay and what that meant for the elephant. So I mean it's always one of those things where you feel like if you open one person's mind, you know, that's. It already did so much. But it seems like whenever you have a crowd, watch it, you know, you have multiple people come away with that realization along with many others. So it's really nice.

A (6:57)

That's great. I only saw the, the trailer on Facebook, but I, yeah was already very touched and very moved. So I hope it will come to Europe soon. But as you explained, first the festivals, then publicly in the US and then it will, it will slop over to Europe. So just briefly because people probably think we're not going to brush over the very personal moment. You just share with us that your father passed away. So my sincere condolences and I'm sure the supporters.

A (7:27)

Share and send their love to you as well and your family. And Pupi passed away leaving Kenya. So many supporters are wondering how Kenya has been doing. I saw a video the other day and a post that she has begun to come out of her shel and she's exploring the, you know, her little, her habitat more. So how is she?

C (7:51)

First off, let me just say thank you, Nadia. I know there's a lot of people that are going to Be sharing the same sentiments. And thank you for everyone listening. You know, I appreciate those words very much. And yes, just after Pupi passed away, it was a little bit of double hit, but at the same time.

C (8:08)

Again, exactly as it needed to be for that whole process and that wonderful thing we call life. And with that, Kenya's been moving forward with her caregivers. It was a tough, tough go for a few, a couple weeks for everybody.

B (8:24)

I mean, she's so emotional, and it's the most beautiful thing about her. I mean, in a shallow way, she's stunning. But as far as the depth of her beauty, her sensitivity and her depth of emotion is definitely. It's so stunning. And, you know, we would expect nothing less than her having a hard time with dealing with the loss and what that meant for her and the space that that created, the empty space that that created and having to accept that.

B (8:59)

She found something that she only got to keep for a little while.

C (9:03)

Yeah, a very short introduction of what elephant love is, but an introduction nonetheless, and opened her heart in a different way. And she may have closed that off a little bit, but I think seeing her now, having come back after being gone for almost a month and seeing her now, she is doing very, very well. I think she's much more open.

C (9:27)

I think her growth is showing through in her emotional expression. She's gaining more trust and confidence with her caregivers. So as these things do, they are hard to go, but at the same time.

C (9:42)

They help us grow as individuals. They change us. And I think even though the sadness is there, I think in many ways those processes change us for the better.

B (9:52)

So if you look at Maya and how long her grief lasted and everything she went through and everything she had to process to the point where we didn't know if we would not see the same Maya, because no one will ever replace Geeta for her much more established relationship. They were together for 40 years before coming here, and then they had years together here. But everything she went through is what has made her the friend she is to Bambi, you know, so it's never like it's an easy thing. Loss for anyone you're attached to isn't. But one of the beautiful things about elephants is they seem to really process it and work through it and take lessons from it and use those moving forward.

A (10:35)

So I'll ask a question because I know supporters have asked it under comments that I've. I've seen on your social media posts. And obviously I know you can't answer straight away or you can't answer at all. But in the. In your video film, the Vision for Sanctuary, I remember it said. Well, I said, because I had the honor of narrating it, I said, I think 35 captive elephants are in South America waiting for, you know, possible sanctuary life. So is there another female African elephant among these 35? Because obviously, we've talked about it a lot. Asian and African elephants cannot be put together. They are different species. So is there maybe hope on the horizon?

B (11:17)

There's a couple.

A (11:19)

Okay.

B (11:20)

There is one that's by herself now that the elephant she's with passed away, and there's another one in a different country that is with a male, but that we are discussing options with them. So no guarantees ever. Even when people say they're down to send their elephants to sanctuaries until they actually get here. I mean, look at Sandro. They said he would come. They agreed that he would come. And, you know, three weeks later, that all turned into nothing. So.

B (11:52)

We are in discussions with both places.

B (11:57)

But we never know how that's going to play out. We would love to give her another African elephant friend, but we also know what it means for them to have that space to process and really learn from it and heal from it before just giving them another elephant. Because, again, nobody's going to replace Bupi for Kenya. You know, that was her first friend.

B (12:22)

And she was so good with her and so giving. And, yeah, there'll never be another poopy for her, but that doesn't mean she won't ever have another friend.

C (12:33)

You said, is there hope? There's always hope. You know, there's so much hope. There's so many elephants out there, and there's.

B (12:39)

There are many more Asians than Africans, but.

C (12:41)

But there's also more Africans in other countries that discussions had been, you know, in the works over the years, and nothing concrete, but, you know, that can always change in a heartbeat. You know, we never really know how things are going to unfold. So, yeah, you know, in the meantime, she's doing well. Her characters are there.

B (12:55)

She's rumbling and squawking and squeaking and tap dancing.

B (13:00)

And doing all of her lovely Kenya things.

C (13:03)

And she is. She's doing really, really well. She's, you know, walking around with the branches in her mouth as she's eating new trees and branches. Everything's nice and green again. Her next yard is really, really, really close to done. It was supposed to be done a couple weeks ago, but we had other projects that popped up that needed to be taken care of. So A little bit of a delay there, but it is really close to done. I think less than 50 meters of fence and two gates, something like that.

B (13:26)

And we have to decide where we're going to put a pond, if we're going to put it in that yard or yard five.

C (13:32)

And that can be done while she has access with moving her back and forth. But she can hopefully have access pretty soon working on a research project with getting some out here to really document that space before it happens. So hopefully all of this is going to come together at the same time and she'll be able to have access soon.

A (13:47)

Oh, that's great. Thanks for sharing that with us that there are other female African elephants and I'd just like to touch on two points. One, you said expansion and that is a third topic we want to talk about today and that is your end of year fundraiser, the expansion of the female Asian habitat. But I'd like to also just draw back and just give a big shout out to everyone who donated towards your Halloween fundraiser which was hosted by your support group on Facebook. Friends of Global Sanctuary for Eleph Elephants with their Treats for Feats fundraiser. The goal was 10,000. I mean, I think we said something like 11 billion is spent on Halloween in the U.S. but 10,000 were raised which was absolutely amazing. They reached their goals. So thank you to everyone who donated and thank you to everyone who shared the fundraiser. $10,000 for Kenya's Foot care. So how are her feet? Because I remember you saying it's rainy season now, so her feet are softer and you can do more work.

C (14:46)

Yeah, we're starting to do a little bit more. Still working on getting trust with her back feet presentation. She is lifting up her back feet but not enough and stable enough to let us do some trimming. But it's starting. She's getting closer and she only in.

B (14:59)

Mendoza would do her front feet presentation just because of layout of her habitat and only certain gates and as you know, it's just not ideal. So.

C (15:10)

So front feet need some work as well. Not as bad as her back feet, but there are some things going on there that we will be exploring more and let you know how things evolve. But her back feet are a mess. So it is a big priority for us to gain that comfort and do that. Yes, rain season is fully upon us. So they're much. Her feet are much softer than they are during the dry, dry season when they are like trimming stones. You are better off trying to trim a stone sometimes because their feet are so calloused.

A (15:34)

Over.

C (15:36)

But hopefully soon we can make some progress and send some photos and let you know where things are.

B (15:40)

As of now, I mean, she is having natural wear from the habitat, which, again, is something she's never had in her life. So one of her biggest issues on the fronts are very, very overgrown pads. I mean, they haven't ever been trimmed. So you have layers and layers and layers of pad that need to be worn down, and actual layers are starting to be worn down, which is great.

C (16:00)

I actually saw her lift up her foot the other day and I asked, did you do back foot trimming? Because it looks very different. It's got a long way to go. It's amazing mess. But it looks like they did. You know, I had started trimming a couple layers off and she said, no, they hadn't touched her back feet at all. It's like, I thought I missed the message because the way her feet look.

B (16:16)

Yeah, nature does a lot for them. You know, it's one of the benefits of sanctuary that even. And we saw this with Bambi, who when Bambi arrived, we prioritized social needs over physical. Once we saw she was putting on weight and that liver, kidney was not most likely going to be an issue. We prioritize socialization over working on her feet because of the issues she had with Mason, the elephant that she shared space with and how insecure she was and the intimidation there. You know, we wanted her to be able to quickly work on building up some sort of positive relationship with elephants. So that took priority over feet. But even she was great once we introduced her to positive reinforcement training and foot presents and what have you. But even during that time where we weren't doing anything, the habitat and nature and digging with their feet and cutting grass with their toenails and mud and all of that do a really good job with getting us a head start.

A (17:14)

That's great. Natural pedicure. So her expansion or the expansion of her habitat is nearly done. I remember in one of the podcasts when we were talking about her knocking down the trees, you said, cat, you're telling the welding team weld faster. She needs more trees. So we have the last month concentrated more on. On puppies arrival and then, of course, Kenya. And I wouldn't say neglected, but we haven't talked that much about your Asian elephants. And you are a 501c3 nonprofit. You do depend on donations to continue your work. So your end of year fundraiser. This podcast comes out after. After the big Giving Tuesday.

A (17:58)

Fundraising event. So Thanksgiving and Cyber Monday and Black Friday and everything. These are just sort of holidays that are just like slopping over to Germany now or to Europe. It's a very American thing. So all that is gone. But still your goal is to expand the female Asian habitat to raise funds for that. So can you tell us a little bit more about that?

C (18:21)

More space, more elephant separations? No, it's. I think we have about 80 acres fenced off right now. And the expansion is about 200. And that 200 is very diverse. It is lots of beautiful nooks and crannies and valleys and springs and trees and hills.

B (18:39)

And it's really random bamboo growing out of nowhere.

C (18:41)

It's so diverse. We actually have no idea how elephant relocation is gonna. Or how an elephant location is gonna happen because of how diverse it is. It's gonna be a challenge that we haven't had before. But it'll be well worth it because the space is beautiful. It's spectacular. The how long that's going to take, we don't really know. Don't have an exact idea. Most of the fencing is relatively straightforward, but there are going to be two hills that are going to be slow going.

A (19:08)

It's going to be quite.

B (19:10)

Wow.

C (19:10)

Yeah. We have to go up and down over one hill and then down another hill that is. It's pretty, pretty steep. So we can do it. It's just going to be. It's definitely going to slow things down, but a lot of it should run forward pretty quickly.

B (19:24)

And unlike when we do the smaller yards, we don't have all those divisions, all those common fences. This is going to be just one big yard, so.

A (19:30)

Oh, wow.

B (19:31)

It's just one perimeter fence for that whole space.

C (19:34)

Yeah. This yard that. Kenya that we're almost done yard four right now for Kenya. And then the guys are already welding or getting set for the welding. Yard five for Kenya.

B (19:43)

It already has all of the.

C (19:45)

About half of it. Vertical post.

B (19:47)

Yeah, it has more than that.

C (19:49)

Three quarters. Okay. It's getting close. I still have to go clear some, so I know they didn't get all the way through, but they're close. They're doing. They're making quite a bit of headway on that. And with that, I think there's like seven or eight gates that need to be built and for this, you know, and those are pretty slow also. Those take a, you know, a few days each.

B (20:09)

But all of that's already paid for. The steel's already purchased, so it's just up to getting it in place and much, much, much welding.

C (20:18)

And then with The Asian expansion as an example, I think we only need to build two gates, you know, for that entire expansion. So, you know, again, very different structures. Cat's talking about. It's almost the same amount of fencing as the expansion for Africa. But because of its layout and not having division to two different yards, it's actually the same amount of fence but opening up a much larger area.

A (20:39)

And I was looking at some figures because 200 acres, I mean, what is 200 acres? So I was looking up 200 acres for all the. The decimal people here in Europe is 0.8 square kilometers. And even then I thought, well, what the hell is that? So 200 acres is about 113 European soccer fields. So that's then going to double to 226, 150American football fields. So that's 300American football fields. And Kat, you'll like this one. The entire expansion of the female Asian habitats, including the habitat they have now, is apparently. I hope ChatGPT gave me the right figures. Is half the size of Central park in New York. So. Yeah, yeah.

B (21:22)

Such a huge.

A (21:24)

Yeah. So just to give people an idea, and also two and a half times the size of Disney park in California.

C (21:35)

We'Re gonna have a contest. As you who remembered which of those facts. It's a big space. It's a really big space.

C (21:42)

You know, for me, what makes it even, as I already said, that diversity, you know, actually amplifies us so much more. You know, it's not 200 square, you know, a flat acres. It is, it's stunning.

A (21:54)

Up and down. Yeah. Do we need another Wall E drone?

B (21:58)

Probably at some point. Unfortunately, bad things happen to drones here.

C (22:04)

Wall E2 is still good.

B (22:05)

Yes, volley two is still good, but they do random things and decide their battery is dead, like instantly sometimes, which they're not supposed to do, and then they just land randomly and it's really hard to find them.

B (22:18)

But the space, I mean, as people know, space is one of those things that we talk about. There's so much to sanctuary, but being able to give them that sort of space, you know, with that diversity isn't just about the physical. Although for elephants like Yamina, who has a 20 something year old amount of energy to burn that amount of space and hills and diversity is the physical aspect of it is so significant, but it's the mental aspect that really offers elephants that much more. You know, it is the new spaces, it is the decisions of, you know, how far they want to go, where they want to go, what spot they want to be. In what's been in that spot that day, you know, with all the wildlife that's around, the different smells, different flowers, the different grasses. I mean, there's so much to that mental stimulation that comes when you increase space. And we always see, we were talking about this yesterday during an interview. There's always an increase in healing that you see whenever you increase the space. And this is something that they saw in Tennessee, and this is something that we've seen here. And, you know, in Tennessee, it was shifting elephants from 200 and something acres to 2200 acres. And how much that changed the elephants and how much that changed who would be considered the most damaged elephants. You know, we always talk about we build and we operate for the worst of the worst.

B (23:54)

And those are the elephants that have the hardest time recovering. And some don't ever recover really 100%. And it was those elephants that once they had that significant amount of space that we saw an independence and more self confidence. Absolutely.

C (24:14)

Yeah. I mean, their self assurance, their self confidence just grew exponentially of, hey, look what I can do. No, look at the decisions I can make. Look how comfortable I am out here. You know, elephants that took four weeks to leave the barn, you know, initially, when they first came several years earlier, are now away from the barn and never come back for months at a time, you know, they were completely immersed in their habitat, in their space.

B (24:36)

And the other thing, of course, that it offers is the ability to take more elephants. Our habitats are specked by sema, our state government, by how many elephants we can have with the amount of space that we have. So there is a limit, which isn't a bad thing. I mean, they got the specs from us, so it's kind of our own fault. But, you know, the habitat has to be maintained in order for it to offer everything that it offers elephants. So you can't have them in a smaller space where they're going to decimate the trees and, you know, ruin the grass and all of those things. So they need the space. But in order for us to get above a certain number of elephants, we need to increase that space. And then you have situations like if we were to get Mason and Mason and Bambi don't want to share space, you know, with Bambi's insecurities, if she's not open to having that relationship, you want to have a significant amount of space for Bambi's comfort, to be able to be far away from her, because that's what creates comfort. That's what, you know, make sure There isn't conflict. So we want to make sure that we have another big space before taking specific elephants. So the expansion is pretty necessary.

C (26:00)

The space that we have right now is licensed for Asian elephants. Is licensed for up to 10 elephants. It would be tight to do 10 elephants there because of the impact that they would have in that environment. But if we needed to take elephants while the suspension is getting done, we could do that. Again, that depends on social behavior. You know, when lady was here and wanted to be, you know, separate from the others, that was a restrictive factor for us, you know, of what we could do. And all of it depends on who's here.

B (26:25)

Because we couldn't do it with honoring her. If we had somebody else that didn't get along with others, I mean.

C (26:30)

Yeah, it would have been. Yeah. Compromise to all further compromise. So with that, with this expansion, actually we will have. We should have licensing for up to 25 female African elephant. Female Asian elephants. With that, will we ever get to 25 female Asian elephants? Probably not, but we would be able to get licensing for that because the land offers that. It's a small space, small airspace compared to what we did for the Asian habitat in Tennessee. But the land offers so much more because of the climate and because of the. The region.

A (27:00)

Yeah, the topography as well. Is that the right word? The.

B (27:04)

Yes.

C (27:04)

Yeah, it's incredible.

B (27:06)

So to get down the hills.

A (27:07)

Yep, the hills, the ups and downs, the, the rivers, the crooks and crannies.

C (27:11)

Definitely have to do some more four wheeler training with people before they are loud.

B (27:16)

But to get to the. The details of it all, our goal for the end of the year fundraiser is to raise $150,000 towards that expansion. That definitely does not fund the entire thing, but it is a chunk of it. And we have some wonderful donors that have come together for a $75,000 match. So anything anybody donates during this fundraiser will be doubled up to 75,000, which would bring us to our goal of 150,000. The fundraiser will be open on our website until the end of the year. If anybody would like to give our Asian elephants some more space and donate to that, that'd be great.

A (27:57)

I'll put all that into the show notes and also it's a great Christmas present, you know, because we are. This podcast comes out the beginning of December, so still time to make some holiday gifts. Give girls some land or go shopping in your, in your store and buy some for some merchandise. Some T shirts like the wonderful Mara T shirt that I'm wearing here or.

B (28:20)

You can adopt an elephant.

A (28:22)

You can adopt an elephant. You can, of course, buy the sip rumble repeat mugs, but also other mugs and also wish baskets for the girls. So if. If, like me or somebody who doesn't want to, who's getting rid of dust collectors at home, donating a fence or donating some steel towards a fence or buying gift baskets for the girls or some merchandise, that's fantastic. So, yeah, that's a. That's a lovely note to end on.

C (28:46)

Who else can say that you bought somebody freedom or somebody gave you elephant freedom for the holidays, you know? What gift did you get? Freedom for elephants.

A (28:54)

Freedom for elephants. Okay. It was lovely catching up. Thank you for sharing all that news. And, yeah, we'll meet up for our next recording. Take care. Enjoy rainy season.

C (29:07)

Thank you. We are enjoying it. It's beautiful here.

A (29:10)

Fantastic. Okay, bye. You too.

C (29:12)

Thank you. Take care, Nadia.

B (29:13)

Bye.

A (29:13)

Bye. As we wrap up this week's episode, a reminder that you can stay up to date with current events at the sanctuary by following GSE on their various social media channels. You'll find all the details in the show notes or directly on their website, globalelephants.org thank you so much for your support. And until we meet up for our next episode, take care.