Kevin Gentry (4:45)

Well, you do a great job with that. But help us understand a little bit more the idea behind founding the Jobs Foundation. What is this latest endeavor? What are you trying to do here and how is it working out so far?

Lord Matthew Elliot (4:57)

Thank you. So after all this research, I think how can this best be represented? And I had the idea, along with a colleague, my co founder, George Ola Bristol, of setting up a charity called the Jobs Foundation. And we really do two things. We work on a practical level and a policy level as well. And on the practical side of things, we're really looking at the role that business plays in terms of taking people on from more disadvantaged backgrounds, if you like, that might be people who are on welfare, people in poverty, perhaps people who are ex offenders, perhaps homeless people. So really the role that business plays, taking those people on and giving them a helping hand and giving them a new start, a fresh start in life, and then training them, helping them with social mobility. So that's really the practical side of things. That we really look at, because there are a whole lot of companies out there that do this automatically as part of their just everyday being, almost sort of unconsciously do this. But what nobody had done was actually work out what's the best practice. If you're a new business wanting to do more in this area, how can you learn from other businesses to do great work in this area and replicate it in your own business? So we have the practical side of things that we do, but then the second stream of work is really the policy side of things, because if you believe that business is a force for good, as I do, you want business to thrive. And that means making sure that within the economy you have the right business environment, the right economic policy environment, the right skills and educational environment to make sure that business is really thriving, to make sure it can give people those opportunities in life that they need.

Kevin Gentry (6:48)

Well, we've talked in this podcast series so far a lot about the proper role of government, proper role of the individual, the proper role of business in a free society or in a Society today. Daniel DeMartino spoke about the consequences in Venezuela when the role of government changed dramatically at the expense of the individual. Dario Paella discussed this situation in Chile and other parts of Latin America, as did Daniel Garza. And then Andreas Whitmer, who's at the Catholic University of America at the Bush School of Business, talked about the term principled entrepreneurship. Would you speak a little bit more about how you see those roles? It's hard to imagine today what bigger issue constitutes the greatest part of any ongoing political conversation in any country, almost in the world, or at least there's a democratic process than the different roles by business, the individual and government, and certainly in our modern time. So talk, if you will, a little bit about that, taking from what you've already said about your aspirations for the Jobs Foundation.

Lord Matthew Elliot (7:59)

So if you look at the role of individual businesses, we've done a whole lot of research actually going into different areas of the country, cities, towns, rural areas, coastal areas, different parts of the country, really trying to understand the role that different individual businesses play in those local communities, what they contribute to the greater good in those areas. And I could give you countless stories of small businesses have been set up, you know, family businesses, ones that have been around for generations, more new businesses as well, who, who feel really deeply the role they play within society and within their local communities. And they don't need, you know, fancy ESG schemes or CSR schemes to actually perform this role within society. They just do it naturally. They feel it's actually part of their role as an entrepreneur in a local community to actually help out that community. And they feel this very deeply. They feel very deeply about the. The role they have in terms of looking after their employees. And they actually often talk about their employees being a family and how they want to look after them. And I can give you again, countless examples of business leaders who, when an employee within their company have had a difficult time in life, perhaps death in the family, perhaps bereavement, perhaps sickness, where they basically kept them on their full pay to make sure that they can get through that period without the worry of basically when their next paycheck is coming in. And countless examples like that. Now, this is a long way of saying that I think business leaders are naturally very conscious of that role that they play within society. But when you have a society where government is becoming bigger and bigger and bigger and taking more and more of our taxation, just as, you know, to be frank, as individuals, when that happens, we often feel, well, the government's taking so much my money, so much my paycheck. Well, we have less responsibility to help other people. We have less responsibility to give to charity or give to our local churches because the government's doing that for us. They're taking all taxes. They're looking after this for us. And I think similarly, when you have the government really taking more and more from business, from business leaders, and they face those constant demands for taxation from the government, they also feel perhaps less responsibility to their wider community as well. So to come back to your question, I actually think that when you have a more modest size of government, when you don't have a government trying to do everything, the slack is actually picked up by business leaders, by businesses and other societal institutions, charities, community groups, etc. Churches, they pick up the slack as well. So that really comes back to my overall philosophy of believing in a more modest role for government. But all of us as individuals and communities and business leaders, also picking up some of the slack and looking out for other people as well.

Kevin Gentry (11:14)

You know, Matthew, I. I know you come to the United States on occasion. I don't know how familiar you are with the restaurant chain Chick Fil? A. It has one of the strongest brands of any company in the United States and certainly in the restaurant dining space. And there was a big sort of joke during COVID to say, why don't we put Chick Fil A in charge of administering the vaccine? Because they're constantly innovating ways to improve the efficiencies of the process of deliver food and constantly improving customer satisfaction with it. So that's a just an aside as an illustration. Well, Matthew, you, you know, people obviously in a democratic society engage in politics in many ways. We just had elections in the United States where we had a near record turnout of voting. But those who would engage beyond voting is not that big. You know, it's only a couple percent of the population that will, you know, do any door knocking or literature distribution or anything like that. So the number of people who would actually become a political entrepreneur is very small. And hats off to you for doing that. You've obviously devoted your professional life, your personal life, your adult life to this. Tell us a little bit about your journey, getting along the way, and perhaps even as a bit of inspiration for those who might be listening and thinking about how they could advance their own principles and in the manner in which you've tried to advance your principles.

Lord Matthew Elliot (12:49)

Well, over here, people often say that if you don't vote, you don't have a right to have to complain afterwards if you dislike the outcome. And I think similarly, I sort of think if you don't go out there and actually try and change the world and try and change policy, in a sense, you don't have a right to complain because you have to be out there trying to change the world. And that really goes back to my driving force, which is really trying to change the world in a different whole series of different ways. And the first thing I did back in my sort of early 20s, at the time, the government was really increasing spending at a very rapid rate and taxation and typically when this happens, of course, a whole lot of wasteful spending and these countless examples of wasteful spending within the UK in the early 2000s, and I couldn't see anybody talking about this. Nobody was actually sort of trying to highlight these issues, trying to make the case that this money could be better spent elsewhere or used for tax cuts so people could spend their their own money as they wanted with their own priorities and nobody else is doing it. So it fell down to me and a few co founders to set up the Taxpayers alliance, which I'm proud to say still going 20 years later and making the case for more efficient government spending and lower taxes. So when I see an issue, I see a problem I want solving or something I want changing in society. I always feel this desire to actually go out there and set up a group to represent that interest and crucially to bring together that coalition of people who can really make the change. I can't do it. Alone. I need the right group of people from, you know, different walks of life, different business leaders who may support it financially, any cause, different volunteers who may help out with it, different people who are involved in the media space, who will write about and help to advance the message in the media space, both mainstream and social media. So it's bringing together that right coalition of people to actually really move the dial that's inspired me throughout my career. And it's taken me in a whole lot of different policy areas from I mentioned tax and spend and fiscal matters, through to civil liberties, through to Britain's membership of the European European Union right now, through to the role of business, society and the importance of jobs and training, that sort of thing. So I see these issues. I want to set up a group to make a difference in those areas.

Kevin Gentry (15:23)

Well, you really got my attention and got a lot of people's attention in the United States with your formation of Taxpayers alliance and the work that you did. And I think after that you had something called Big Brother Watch. Maybe that's what you're referencing with respect to civil liberties. You're really very gifted in leading organizations, but you've run some pretty big, heady efforts. Certainly Vote Leave your role there. Tell us, if you will, just a little bit about that. That's some big stuff. You've definitely gone big.

Lord Matthew Elliot (16:01)

That was a big one. And I could do an entire series of podcasts about the whole run up to Brexit and how it all happened. But just to give it in a nutshell, it wasn't simply, in a sense, a year long campaign, from the triggering of the referendum to the actual referendum day itself. It was really an effort over many, many years involving many groups of people and many individuals. And my involvement in it really started in a serious way back in 2013, when I could see that a referendum was on the horizon. And looking at all the different groups out there, lots of whom were doing brilliant work and really, really effective work, the gap I could really see was who was going to speak up to make the economic case for a change in relationship with the European Union. And best could that case be made. And it struck me the best case to make it, the best way to make it, was to bring together trusted business leaders who are respecting the local communities, who are willing to talk locally and go on the media locally to talk about why Britain needed a changed relationship with the European Union. And that led to the formation of Business of Britain, which is the foundation for the Vote Leave campaign. And then a year out from the referendum Vote Leave was set up. We knew a referendum was coming. And that became with a whole series of other challenges. How do you motivate people from across the political spectrum? How do you bring more people from the Labour Party and more the left political spectrum onto the campaign? How do you raise some money for a nationwide referendum effort? So the whole series of challenges there that I had to take on, but I'd had a practice run with a previous referendum five years previously on Changing Britain's Voting System started giving me a fair idea of how a nationwide referendum campaign can work and be scaled up at very short notice in a way which actually make a difference. So that gave me a bit of a testing ground to test my ideas and test some of the messages behind it. But Vote Leave was the big one and the big effort, and again, many, many people involved. But playing that role in terms of bringing the campaign team together, bringing the wider stakeholders together, bringing a broad base of parliamentary support, building that coalition was a huge privilege to be at the center of that.

Kevin Gentry (18:43)

Well, frankly, you're being modest. You are really adept at bringing people together, diverse people together, and a united front to make the case for an important issue. So. So kudos to you. Well, as I said, this is the Going Big podcast to you. What does it mean to go big? Because you, I mean, you, you're a visionary leader. Whether you'll concede that or not, you, you think big and then you act big. So for you, what does it mean to go big?

Lord Matthew Elliot (19:17)

I think it means setting up an organization, developing a strategy that actually solves the full problem. I think often when I see groups, sometimes people can perhaps just try and bite off a little part of a problem or try and tackle a little issue on its own. And that's good, you can make some advances through doing that. But actually, if you really want to change things in a big way, I really want to inspire people to join you and to give you their full support and really get behind you, whether it's financially or other types of support. You really need to be showing how you're addressing the Holdish issue and you've got an answer to really how you can significantly move the dial rather than just solve one small portion of it. So for me, sort of thinking big and acting big is really working out what's the problem we're trying to solve, what's the full spectrum solution to it? Some parts maybe been done already, you can point people to that, but what's the difference that needs to be made to actually really change things? And that's where thinking a bit comes in. It may seem like a daunting challenge, but to really form those really strong coalitions, it will make a difference. You've got to think big and you've got to show how your involvement and their involvement in what you're doing will actually make the big difference.

Kevin Gentry (20:48)

Well, around the world, I think, frankly, more than ever, people are craving leadership. They're craving political leadership, but they're also craving business leadership, leadership through all walks of life. Who have been some of your personal role models as leaders that inspired you to do what you've done?

Lord Matthew Elliot (21:14)

Great question. I do all sorts of political leaders who people would have heard of, who I could point to, who have, of course, played a huge role in terms of changing the course of history within the uk. But often the ones that inspire me most are the ones who are often sort of what we call backbench MPs over here or backbench politicians, not frontline politicians, but ones who plug away on an issue over many, many years or often many, many decades, and they become the focal point for that and the expert in that, the ones who are really making the difference in that policy area. And it's always waiting for that moment in time when the rest of society joins them or the rest of society really sees that that's an issue that needs changing. And they're at the center of that. Having done a lot of preparatory work, having thought through the issues, having thought through the policy changes, the legislative changes that needed to make a difference in that area, having, you know, all the key people in that sort of policy space who need to be brought together at that moment to give the big push to make a difference. So often I admire those people in those areas, and I can think of one in the UK who's not a household name globally, but a guy called Bill Cash, who was an MP from the 1980s right through to the last general election campaign, and the role that he played in terms of Brexit, really behind the scenes, but really plugging away on the legislation and encouraging people like me to get more involved was really crucial to making a difference.

Kevin Gentry (22:56)

Matthew, what encouragement would you give to our listeners today who would like to go big for their cause? They're dedicated to a. A particularly important cause that's trying to help improve the lives of others, and. And they're struggling to understand how they can take it to a substantially higher level and increase the impact. What advice would you share?

Lord Matthew Elliot (23:21)

That's a great question. I think there's an element where you need you need that burning desire to actually really make a difference in the cause. And I've, you know, even now, I sort of constantly surprise myself at what can be done in a certain area. And, you know, sometimes the challenge seems huge and sometimes it seems like I'm not making a huge amount of progress and that things are a bit tough at times or, you know, in the early stages of a campaign, you wondering where you're going to get the funding from to pay that month's round of salaries. And things seem really tough at times. But actually sticking it out and actually getting through those tough times and actually pausing at different points to actually look back and see how much you've achieved, I find that really satisfying. Then, of course, you start seeing the change actually happening. Now, it may not be the full policy change at first, of course, that takes a long time to often happen, but to see different, for example, MPs, members of parliament change their position on an issue, or seeing different columnists coming around to your course on an issue, or seeing, you know, an unexpected supporter pop up who says, I've so admired what you're doing. I've been following it. You don't know that. But before it closely, I want to help you out now. You have those little, little wins, and they all add together into that big win. So I would encourage people to, you know, in some ways, bite off more than you can chew. You know, try and go for go big. Go big or go broke. And you'll be surprised at how much you can do. But the key thing is not to do it solo, not to try and take all the credit yourself to build a really effective team around you of people who are with you on your endeavor. And you'll be amazed and surprised at what you can do working as a team.

Kevin Gentry (25:31)

Well, that's excellent. All right, Matthew, we're going to give you the final word. What's the parting bit of advice you would give to those listening on if you were in their shoes 25 years ago, what may have motivated you all the more? What? No. Or, but, but. But even more importantly, knowing now what you know, what would you have wished that you'd known back then? Anything that you might send us off to go do good things with.

Lord Matthew Elliot (26:01)

I think the I was that classic phrase. Or I could have used my skills in policy, entrepreneurship and coalition building and campaigning. What have you to do what many of my, you know, good friends have done, going to the world of public affairs and PR and have made a fortune and that sort of thing. But for me, personally, um, when I look back on my life, um, I want to see those policy wins where I've made a big difference for society at large. That's what really gets me out of bed in the morning. And that takes a huge amount of perseverance and staying power to actually make it all work. But I would encourage people to really stick with it. You know, people who are setting up campaign groups, think tanks, other policy bodies. You're doing podcasts, you know, have you try and change the world. You are making a huge difference, and it's hugely, hugely rewarding when you actually see those wins coming through.

Kevin Gentry (27:05)

Well, Lord Matthew Elliot, thank you for spending some time with us today. Thank you, more importantly, for your leadership and for thinking big. Looking forward to working with you for many decades still to come. And thank you for encouraging us all to think big and to go big. All the very best to you.

Lord Matthew Elliot (27:23)

Thank you.

Kevin Gentry (27:24)

Kevin, thanks for listening to today's Going Big podcast. Hopefully you were inspired to go big for your cause. Remember, this is all about transforming your effectiveness by 10xing your fundraising. If you enjoyed today's episode, be sure to subscribe or leave us a review at iTunes, Spotify, iHeartRadio or wherever you listen to podcasts. You can also catch this episode on YouTube. And also there are lots of resources available to you at my website, which is 10xStrategies.com that's T E N X strategies dot com. You can sign up also for our free weekly fundraising tips. This is all about helping you get to the root causes of some of the biggest problems in society today by transforming your fundraising and your effectiveness. Thanks again. We'll see you again soon. Bye.