Killer Stylist: The Murder of Joleen Cummings // 633

Summary

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Going West: True Crime

Episode 633 – Killer Stylist: The Murder of Joleen Cummings
Release Date: August 11, 2026
Hosts: Daphne Woolsoncroft & Heath Merryman

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Episode Overview

Daphne and Heath delve into the harrowing 2018 disappearance and murder of Florida hairstylist Joleen Cummings. What appears at first to be a tragic domestic dispute swiftly morphs into a truly bizarre and chilling case involving multiple stolen identities, an elusive co-worker with a dark past, and a community shocked by one woman’s hidden double life. Listeners are taken through the twists and turns of the investigation, the sinister red herrings, and the extraordinary unmasking of Joleen’s killer.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

The Disappearance of Joleen Cummings

• Introduction to Joleen:

  • Born May 13, 1984, in Hilliard, FL; devoted mother of three and beloved hairstylist ("hairpist").
  • Endured a combative divorce and custody battle with Jason Cummings, marked by protective orders and heated exchanges.
  • Despite hardship, described as an attentive, loving mother:
    “Jolene’s kids were the most important thing in her life. Everything she did was for her kids.” – Brooke Harley (06:55)

• Circumstances Around Her Disappearance:

  • Last seen at work (Tangles Hair Salon, Fernandina Beach) on May 12, 2018—Mother’s Day and her 34th birthday.
  • Failed to show up for scheduled child exchange; family and friends immediately suspicious as Joleen “would never abandon them.”
  • Police reports filed; search commences with volunteers, scent dogs, and media pleas.

The Investigation & False Leads

[07:30 – 18:54]

• Early Suspects:

  • Jason Cummings (ex-husband): Cleared quickly due to an airtight alibi; noted Jolene could “pull Houdini acts” but not on such an important day (10:41).
  • Jason Gee (recent boyfriend): History of violence, domestic battery, and drug offenses. Frantically hides from police but ultimately offers a verifiable alibi for the night Joleen vanished.
    • “...he was hiding among dozens of cardboard boxes in his dad’s house, hoping to elude police.” (12:52)
    • “You’re kind of almost...you’re starting out the gate with, like, blaming her.” – Heath (10:07)
    • Despite suspicious behavior, is arrested on unrelated charges but cleared as a murder suspect.

• Discovery of Jolene’s Car:

  • Found abandoned at a Home Depot in Yulee, FL, three days after disappearance.
  • Surveillance shows a woman in black (not Jolene) dropping off the SUV in the early hours and then leaving in a cab.
    • “...no sign of Jolene in or around the vehicle, nor was there any indication as to what had happened to her.” (18:54)

The Prime Suspect Emerges: Jennifer Sybert (aka Kimberly Kessler)

[19:25 – 44:40]

• Co-worker Under Suspicion:

  • Video confirms salon co-worker Jennifer Sybert disposed of Jolene’s car; she fabricates stories about ex-boyfriend stalking her.
  • Quits job abruptly, asks to have last paycheck mailed to a PO box, doubts arise about her true identity and background.
    • “...the woman who disposed of Jolene’s car was Jennifer Seibert, Jolene’s 44 year old co-worker...” (19:26)
    • “It’s almost like, oh, yeah, I left my car here because I don't have enough money for gas. But it’s like, no, because that’s not your car, bitch.” – Daphne (20:22)
  • Salon colleagues describe Jennifer as cold, secretive, and hostile—Jolene herself confided, “there’s something off about her, creepy.” (27:21)
  • Tensions at work; escalating verbal altercation on Joleen’s last day.

• Mounting Physical Evidence:

  • Luminol at the salon reveals blood everywhere—sink, walls, floors, mop, even a pair of scissors—DNA matches Jolene (30:07).
  • Surveillance catches Jennifer discarding large trash bags in the dumpster after the salon closed.
    • “On a hunch, they sprayed luminol on the area, and it lit up. There was blood everywhere...” (30:05)
    • “Her car could be seen driving behind the salon multiple times until the dumpster was emptied...” (31:24)

• Pursuit and Arrest:

  • Jennifer tracked to a Florida rest stop, sleeping in her car, bearing scratch marks on her face. She lies about using Jolene’s car.
  • Arrested for grand theft auto on May 16, 2018, displays bizarre “cheerful” demeanor.
    • “Disturbingly, she seemed, like, upbeat and jovial about being arrested.” (34:05)
    • “Every freaking picture I’ve seen of this woman...she’s, like, smiling. Like, she scares me. This person is evil.” – Daphne (34:14)

Revelation: Jennifer Sybert is Fugitive Kimberly Kessler

[34:52 – 44:40]

• Real name revealed as Kimberly Kessler, missing from Pennsylvania since 2004.

• Lived entire adult life using aliases (at least 18 found), moving through 330 cities in 14 states.

• Past includes escalating violence: stabbing boyfriends, animal cruelty, threats to CPS with weapons, erratic behavior, digging “graves.”

  • “He described Kimberly as mercurial and temperamental and said that she had frequent outbursts which would easily turn violent.” (36:41)
  • “She told him...she couldn't take care of him, so she shot him with a shotgun.” (37:41)

• Selected new identities from gravestones (notably Jennifer Sybert and Pamela Kliber).

  • “She had a passport and a Social Security number as Jennifer Siebert, which she had stolen from a 13-year-old girl who died in a car crash in 1987.” (43:41)

• Digital Forensics:

  • Searches include “trial convictions without a body,” “co-worker guilty of murder, missing person, body not found.” (44:40)
  • Purchased trash bags, gloves, ammonia, carving knife night of murder.

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Trial, Mental Health, and Aftermath

[44:51 – 55:03]

• Behavior in Jail:

  • Aggressive, unhinged: smears feces on cell, hunger strikes to appear frail, constant accusations at staff and attorneys.
    • “...she ripped her clothes off and smeared feces on the walls...even attempting to throw it on the officers.” (48:10)
  • Determined competent to stand trial despite suggesting insanity, ultimately found to have a personality disorder.

• Courtroom Antics:

  • Extreme outbursts—frequent yelling, false accusations (claiming defense attorney is victim’s cousin).
    • Audio clip montage, repetitive accusations about public defenders (46:37 – 47:27)

• Conviction and Sentencing:

  • Kessler found guilty of first-degree murder and grand theft auto; sentenced to life plus five years (December 9, 2021).

• Family's Ongoing Grief:

  • Joleen’s body never found; family left without closure on her final moments or precise fate.
  • Mothers’ emotional statements at trial:
    • “It’s been a long three years. Three years, seven months, and nine days that my daughter Jolene was taken from us. Today, we praise God...that it gives us some type of closure. While my daughter Jolene has not been found, we have at least the verdict...” – Ann Johnson (51:47)
  • Memorial bench erected in Joleen’s memory at Buchanan Park, Hilliard, FL—moving statement by ex-husband:
    • “They don’t have a gravesite to go visit. This is the only thing they have to remind them of their mother.” – Jason Cummings (52:23)

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Memorable Quotes & Notable Moments

• “Every time we have a case like this, I’m like, how have we not covered this because I feel like we have covered all the stories that are unbelievable. But when we were researching this, I was like, hold on. Yeah, there is another one.” – Daphne (02:41)

• “The woman who disposed of Jolene’s car was Jennifer Siebert, Jolene’s 44 year old co worker, who was supposedly the last person to see Jolene alive.” – Daphne (19:26)

• “It’s so creepy. And you know what? Jolene is doing what any of us would do because all of us would sleuth that out as well.” – Daphne (27:35)

• “...when detectives descended upon her, she was lying in the backseat. She was just sleeping in her backseat.” – Heath (32:52)

• “...she was a missing person...and she had been reported missing by her mother, Connie Kessler.” – Daphne (34:52)

• “I think that says so much about her that you can’t take care of your cat, so you shoot it with a shotgun instead of just...oh, my God.” – Daphne (38:00)

• “There was blood everywhere on the sink, on the walls, on the floors, and on the mop, which had clearly been used to cover up what had happened.” – Daphne (30:07)

• “And after the sentencing was read, Jolene’s mom, Ann Johnson, spoke to the crowd...” (51:32)
  (Full heartfelt statement at 51:47)

• “This is where we come visit her.” – Jason Cummings at Jolene’s memorial bench (52:22)

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Key Timestamps

• 02:21 – Hosts introduce the wild complexities of the case
• 03:29 – Joleen Cummings’ life, family, and recent struggles
• 07:30 – Last known movements and disappearance
• 09:19 – 17:43 – Scrutiny of primary suspects (ex-husband, boyfriend), both cleared
• 18:54 – Joleen’s car is found abandoned; the “woman in black” seen dumping it
• 19:25 – Investigation pivots to co-worker Jennifer Sybert
• 27:21 – Disturbing reports from colleagues about Jennifer’s abnormal behavior
• 30:05 – Salon blood evidence and luminol results
• 31:41 – Jennifer caught on camera dumping trash bags; landfill search fails
• 32:47 – Arrest at the rest stop; physical evidence of struggle
• 34:52 – Revelation of Sybert’s true identity: fugitive Kimberly Kessler, serial alias changer
• 44:40 – Internet searches and evidence point to premeditation
• 46:31 – 47:27 – Audio of Kimberly’s courtroom outbursts
• 48:10 – Jail antics and competency evaluations
• 50:22–52:43 – Verdict, sentencing, family impact statements
• 55:03 – Discussion of whether Kessler may have more victims

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Theories & Lingering Questions

• The possible experience-driven disposal of the body raises questions about other possible victims.
• Uncertainty over the final moments: Did Joleen directly confront Kimberly? Was the murder premeditated or sudden?
• Despite conviction, Joleen’s remains have not been found—her family and community still lack this closure.

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Final Thoughts

This episode powerfully documents not only Joleen’s vibrant life and tragic end, but also exposes the chilling double life of her killer—a woman who spent decades evading detection, escalating her crimes, and ultimately taking a mother’s life. Through shocking detail, the hosts highlight gaps in systems for tracking identity theft, warning signs missed by those around Kessler, and the devastating ripple effects of her violence.

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For photos, surveillance footage, and further discussion, visit the Going West podcast social channels and YouTube.

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All content faithfully attributed and timestamped per episode flow. Advertising and non-episode content omitted as requested.

Transcript

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[B]

What is going on? True crime fans? I'm your host, Heath.

[A]

And I'm your host, Daphne.

[B]

And you're listening to Going West.

[A]

Hello, everybody. Holy shit.

[B]

Yeah, holy shit. Exactly.

[A]

We have a twisty tale for you guys today that at times is genuinely terrifying. Yeah.

[B]

Today's story. The killer in today's story has many different aliases and I'm not going to give any more away than that because this is truly. I feel like this is one of the craziest stories we've ever talked about on this show.

[A]

Every time we have a case like this, I'm like, how have we not covered this because I feel like we have covered all the stories that are unbelievable. But when we were researching this, I was like, hold on. Yeah, there is another one.

[B]

Mine was absolutely blown.

[A]

Super, super blown. I mean, like I said, very twisty. We have a lot of different people that we're going to talk about today. You think we're going down this road and then we need freaking U turn. It's just these. It's wild. So without further ado.

[B]

Alright guys, this is episode 632 of Going West. So let's get into it.

[A]

In May of 2018, a 34 year old Florida hairstylist finished her shift at work and seemingly vanished into thin air. But inside the salon where she worked, police uncovered signs of a violent crime and a co worker whose past was beyond mysterious. As investigators unraveled nearly two decades of stolen identities, the case transformed into something stranger than fiction. This is the murder of Jolene Cummings. Killer stylist Jolene Jensen was born on May 13, 1984 in Hilliard, Florida to her mother, Ann Johnson. Though she was later joined by a stepfather and grew up alongside a younger brother and sister as well. Well, and for those wondering, yes, an did name her daughter after Dolly Parton song Jolene, but different spelling.

[B]

Jolene. Jolene. I was hoping you were going to say Jolene.

[A]

So after graduating from high school, thank you for that. Jolene moved to the Jacksonville area of Florida, which is only about 40 minutes southeast of Hillyard, to attend cosmetology school. She eventually settled in Fernandina beach, which is actually up towards Hillyard, but it's on the coast instead of inland. So again, not going super far. And she found a job at a salon. By 2018, she had married a man named Jason Cummings, hence why she became Jolene Cummings and gave birth to three kids, two boys and one girl. Also, by 2018, she had gotten separated and began co parenting with Jason. So all of this happened before she turned 34 years old. Around that time, she and Jason were navigating a combative divorce and a big bitter custody battle which began the year earlier in 2017. Like at one time, it had been so contentious that a restraining order or a protective order, a no violence order, was established between them during their legal proceedings. Jolene once texted Jason, quote, these kids have seen and heard enough. Jason then responded sharply, quote, see you in court, Jolene. I fucking hate you. And tomorrow you, you will hate me. I promise that.

[B]

Damn.

[A]

Yeah, Things were not going well between them. It was, there was a lot of fighting, a lot of anger in this situation. But I will say, once the divorce was finalized, they did seem to manage a pretty cordial relationship for the kids. So it's just like as the divorce was actively happening, as it goes.

[B]

Yeah. I mean, many cases they end up messy sometimes.

[A]

Yeah. But then after it was over, it's kind of like, okay, the storm is done, let's move forward and just make things work for the kids. Now. After the divorce, Jolene moved into a trailer that was rented to her by her brother in law. And though she acknowledged that it wasn't the best accommodation, she was saving up in hopes of moving into a bigger and nicer place for her kids. At the time, the time this story takes place, she was working at Tangles Hair Salon in Fernandina beach alongside multiple other stylists, of course, in a strip mall called Amelia Crossing. Her friends and co workers lovingly nicknamed her a hair pist because she was always willing to talk to her clients about their problems and their feelings.

[B]

Yeah. As most hairstylists typically do.

[A]

Yeah, she was, she was really there for people. And despite that messy divorce, her friends maintained that she lived for her kids. So she loved doing hair, had a lot of great clients who appreciated her, loved her kids. You know, she, things were going well for her. A friend of hers named Alma Powers remembered, quote, jolene loved her kids. Like it was so hard to get her away from them. I'd be like, hey, can you get a sitter, let's go see a movie. Because I always felt like she needed a break. Her friend Brooke Harley chimed in in agreement, saying, quote, jolene's kids were the most important thing in her life. Everything she did was for her kids. Which is going to lead right into what Heath is going to tell us about how important they were to her and how she would never abandon them.

[B]

Right. Well. On Saturday, May 12, 2018, 33 year old Jolene spent a seemingly uneventful workday at Tangles. The following day was both Mother's day and her 34th birthday, and she was really just excited to spend it with her three kids. Actually, she and Jason were planning on exchanging the kids in the parking lot of a grocery store that day. But to Jason's surprise, Jolene never showed up. According to her mom, Ann, she would occasionally disappear for a few days at a time when she needed space. But Ann maintained that she never would have done so without letting anybody know, considering that she wanted to spend the holiday and her birthday, of course, with her kids. On top of that, she would have never missed wishing her Own mother a happy Mother's Day.

[A]

Yeah. So, like, so many things are pointing to her not just walking off.

[B]

Yeah, it just didn't seem right. So both her mother, Ann, and her ex husband, Jason waited all day to hear from her, but. But when they didn't, Ann headed to the police station at 8am on the morning of Monday, May 14, 2018. So this is the next day. And reported her daughter missing. So Jolene's phone was last used at the salon, this is again tangles, on May 12, 2018. And there had been no activity on it since then. So, fearing the worst, volunteers searched the vicinity of the salon for any sign of her, and the authorities took to horseback and boats to search for her in the surrounding marshes. Scent dogs were also deployed, but found no trace of Jolene. Thus, a heartbroken Ann Johnson took to the media to make an impassioned plea for answers, saying through tears, quote, I beg you as a mother to please come forward with any information that you have that can help locate my daughter for her and my three grandchildren who miss her so much.

[A]

So, of course, considering that very contentious divorce I was just telling you guys about, the next day, Tuesday, May 15, Jolene's ex husband, Jason Cummings, was questioned, but he maintained that he still had love for Jolene as the mother of his children, and he wanted to make sure that she was safe again. They didn't, like, hate each other anymore. That was in the past.

[B]

And yeah, they were at that point, they were more cordial towards each other.

[A]

Exactly. And he's trying to, you know, point that out to them. However, he also said that she struggled with depression, which she would generally suppress, and added that she would frequently pull what he called Houdini ax and disappear without notice for days at a time. Now, I want to say usually he thought I would be like, okay, deflection king.

[B]

Yeah, like you're kind of almost. You're starting out the gate with like, blaming her.

[A]

Yeah. Blaming her and being like, oh, well, it must have. She must have done this to herself and she must have just walked off. But I will say her mom, Anne, agreed that Jolene did do this sometimes. So of course, naturally they're wondering, even though it's not matching up with the day that she vanished because it was Mother's Day and her birthday. Like, they're like, she wouldn't have done that on the day that she was picking up the kids, on the day where two holidays are, you know?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So. But just wanted to mention that usually we would think that was really suspicious.

[B]

Yeah. And probably the public would think that is suspicious as well, you know?

[A]

Yeah. And I will say it became even less suspicious when Jason was asked his whereabouts on the day that she disappeared, because he claimed that he spent the day with his parents and his kids, heading to church and then taking them out to eat. And his alibi checked out, and he was cleared as a suspect. But he did tip off police that they needed to interview the new man that she had been seeing, whose name was also Jason. So I'm going to call him by his full name, not to confuse you guys. Her ex husband explained that Jason gave, with whom Jolene had recently broken up, was dangerous, and had a criminal record, as you guys can see if you're watching on YouTube. In this terrifying mugshot, a friend of Jolene's named Brittany Sway said in an interview, quote, jolene loved to try to fix people. Her mom agreed, adding that she had a soft spot for underdogs and that this sometimes worked for her disadvantage, because now Jason gave looking like a pretty good suspect. Well, get this. When Jolene's home was searched, investigators found alarming signs that perhaps a struggle had taken place. There were multiple holes, either kicked or punched in the wall, and kitchen cabinets were left open, including one whose door had been yanked off and was hanging by a single hinge.

[B]

Jason G. Is just out there drinking monsters and punching holes in drywall.

[A]

Yeah. So to find this disturbing scene, you know, especially when, by the way, when they went to look for Jason G. To question him, he was nowhere to be found. So this is painting a really dark picture. And although he didn't even have a car, he appeared to be moving around very frequently. He was eventually located at his dad's house in Jacksonville, Florida, but attempts to track him down or find his phone were futile. When they eventually did find him, he was hiding among dozens of cardboard boxes in his dad's house, hoping to elude police.

[B]

I'm sorry. That's the funniest part of this game that creeped me out. What are you talking about? No, just the fact that he's like, you couldn't pick a better hiding place than just a bunch of cardboard boxes.

[A]

Maybe he didn't. Maybe he saw them outside. He's like, shit, dive into the pile.

[B]

Dive right in there.

[A]

I've certainly never heard of this happening before. Well, when he was brought in for questioning, law enforcement noticed that he had scratches on his hands and arms that appeared to be from a struggle, though he claimed that they were from playing with his dad's dog. The scratches he had on his back and chest, he explained, were from tree branches at his dad's house. You know, just naturally being scratched up to bits. This guy from different things.

[B]

We've got just, you know, too many things happening here to Jason getting scratched

[A]

up all over, which looks really weird. Obviously. It's like, oh, that one's from the dog. That one's from the tree.

[B]

This one's from a rock.

[A]

Yeah, yeah. So on top of all of this, just to give you guys a little bit of a back history on Jason G. He had multiple drug charges on his record, as well as prior arrests for both battery and aggravated battery. Actually, two different women had taken out domestic violence injunctions against him in the past, which is like a. Kind of Brought this up earlier, a protective order or a restraining order.

[B]

Right.

[A]

He had also been charged with a count of domestic violence against Jolene stemming from an incident on Wednesday, May 9th of 2018. So just three days before she had last been seen. But the charges were later dropped because, of course, Jolene was never seen again.

[B]

This guy is looking like a very good suspect. Scratches all over. He's hiding in some boxes. He's got priors. Three days before Jolene disappears, he. Yeah, so this guy is looking like a pretty good suspect. You know, like, he's got scratches all over his body. He's hiding out from the police in fricking boxes.

[A]

He's a criminal.

[B]

He's a criminal. You know, there's violent criminal. A violent criminal at that. Yeah. Because, you know, three days before Jolene disappeared, Jason actually arrived at Jolene's house without warning, demanding to stay the night. But Jolene was a little bit freaked out by this, so she refused to allow him to do so, which absolutely enraged Jason. He then stormed into her home and began smashing up the cabinets in the kitchen. And a neighbor actually heard the commotion and actually ended up calling the police because of this. Now, when they arrived, Jason G. Panicked, and he fled because he had a warrant out for his arrest already. So when the detectives asked him about this, Jason admitted that he had broken the cabinet by slamming it shut when they were in the midst of this fight, and that Jolene had actually been the one to punch holes through her own wall using a hammer, which is like, why would she do that?

[A]

Feels like a him thing. Just saying.

[B]

Yeah, it was definitely a Jason thing. But, of course, police were suspicious of his retelling of events, so detectives asked to search his phone, and Jason conveniently told them defensively that he didn't know where it was. And that he had lost it either at his cousin's or his dad's, where he was staying for the time being. Well, it didn't take long for Jason G. To break down and admit that he hadn't lost it and that he had removed the battery in an attempt to prevent the police from tracking him and pursuing his outstanding warrant. But just like Jolene's ex husband, he too was also able to offer up a solid alibi, explaining that he had spent the night of Saturday, May 12th at his dad's house, waking up between 10 and 11am and then heading over for. Heading over to a family member's house for a barbecue. And this was back in north Jacksonville, and that he remained there until Sunday night. So he's saying, you know, I wasn't even near there. I was in Jacksonville at a barbecue.

[A]

Which is why it's so tough, because he's lying about things and making himself look worse. But then he has an alibi, so

[B]

it's like, yeah, he looks sketchy.

[A]

I think he was lying to protect the other crimes that he committed.

[B]

Well, yeah, he had a warrant out, you know.

[A]

Yeah, but it's like, okay, they've got you. Like, stop lying. You're making yourself look really bad.

[B]

Yeah. Well, despite the sufficient evidence against him, detectives noted that he did seem genuine in his feelings for Jolene and his sorrow that she was missing. He told investigators that he loved her and that he was concerned about her well being. And he had even texted her to wish her a happy Mother's Day and happy birthday. But of course, he received no response. Though Jason G. Was officially cleared of suspicion, he was arrested on his active warrants for violating his felony probation as well as possession of a controlled substance, landing him in court during the first week of Jolene's disappearance. So they didn't get him on, you know, doing anything to Jolene, but they're like, well, you do have warrants, so we are going to still arrest you.

[A]

Yeah, he, he still did other things, but. So police at this point heavily circulated missing persons flyers and a press release with a picture of both Jolene and her car. Because suddenly the two really solid seeming persons of interest that they had were out of the running.

[B]

Yeah, they're completely out the door now and they're like, back to square one.

[A]

Which is why we said in the beginning, like, you're going down this road and you're like, wow, that's a really, that's a really solid path. And then turn, turn right around, guys. Well, guess what? Jolene's Car was located with the driver's door left unlocked while on May 15, three days after she was last seen, when a tip came in that her SUV was parked in Yulee, Florida, in actually a Home Depot parking lot, which happened to be located near her salon. So detectives were thrilled at this tangible lead, really the first tangible lead thus far, even though there was no sign of Jolene in or around the vehicle, nor was there any indication as to what had happened to her. But this at least told them that she hadn't like driven off somewhere. This is, you know, more so pointing to somebody had done something to her and then planted her vehicle.

[B]

Right.

[A]

Luckily, investigators were able to comb the surveillance footage from an adjacent credit union and saw a person dressed in all black park the car and climb out of the driver's seat, walking away from the vehicle at 1:13am the person then walked to a nearby gas station and convenience store. And when they entered, their identity was much more clear. Or should I say her identity.

[B]

Didn't see that one coming, did you?

[A]

Because the woman who disposed of Jolene's car was Jennifer Siebert, Jolene's 44 year old co worker, who was supposedly the last person to see Jolene alive. Back at the salon, Jennifer then entered the convenience store and struck up a conversation with the cashier who noticed that she seemed paranoid and nervous. She mentioned being afraid of an ex boyfriend, worried that he was following her, and asked if the cashier could summon a taxi for her. Then she could be seen climbing into the cab and driving off. Police were able to track down the cab driver who picked her up that night. And strangely, the driver remembered her telling him that she did not have enough money for gas to get home. Which is why she left her car there, even though it was Jolene's, but that she was able to pay him with a credit card for the cab ride.

[B]

Yeah, which makes absolutely no sense.

[A]

No, it's not connecting. So it's almost like, oh, yeah, I left my car here because I don't have enough money for gas. But it's like, no, because that's not your car, bitch.

[B]

Yeah, exactly.

[A]

Well, then he dropped her off next to a black Kia Soul in the parking lot of the Tangles hair salon, which was later determined to be her own vehicle. So, eager to speak with her, detectives arrived at Tangles to wait for Jennifer to show up for work. Right, but when she drove into the parking lot and spotted a sheriff's van, she sped away, missing her shift at Tangles that day.

[B]

But not just that.

[A]

She then texted her manager very unceremoniously asking for her to send along her last check to her P.O. box so she didn't have to come pick it up because she was quitting.

[B]

Yeah, she didn't want to physically go in there and pick up her last

[A]

paycheck, but that's how she's saying I'm quitting. Hey, can you just send my last paycheck to this PO box address? Like I'm done. I'm quitting because I was going to go to work and then I saw a sheriff's van. That's not suspicious.

[B]

Suspicious, yeah.

[A]

She explained away that her behavior was due to being scared of her ex boyfriend. So she's keeping that story consistent, you know, because she had also told this to the cashier at the gas station. But what was even more suspicious was that when she learned that they were looking to speak with her, she called the Nassau County Police Department and left a lengthy phone message about how she feared retribution from her ex boyfriend if he found out that she had spoken to the police and that she really wanted to help in the search for Jolene but that she couldn't for her own safety. Need a boost? Sometimes all it takes is tapping into your inner cool. Icebreaker's gum helps you unleash the confidence within. Each chew releases a rush of icy flavor powered by cooling flavor crystals, sending a wave of refreshment to reinvigorate all your senses. Icebreaker's convenient pack fits everywhere from car cup holders to backpack pockets so you can find your cool wherever you go. Grab Icebreakers gum online or at a store near you.

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[A]

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[B]

Homechef.com goingwest must be an active subscriber to receive free dessert. Well, detectives attempted to stop by Jennifer's home instead, but found that she had offered up an address in Fernandina beach that didn't even exist, which is likely why she needed a PO Box in the first place. So because they couldn't locate Jennifer, detectives spoke with her co workers in an attempt to get to know her better. But it turned out that she had been keeping her cards pretty close and she never gave them the neighborhood in which she lived. So she's not telling anybody where she lived. She was actually remembered as cold and standoffish to her co workers even amid their close knit group. According to their co workers, Jolene found Jennifer to be odd and felt that she was hiding something, telling her friends at work that there was, quote, something off about her creepy. So she's already, she's got this intuition. This once even escalated into a verbal altercation between them that took place in front of a client. Like that's how contentious things were between Jennifer and Jolene. At the conclusion of this argument, her co workers recalled Jolene saying that there was, quote, something going on with Jennifer and that she was determined to find out what it was. She noticed that Jennifer was wearing wigs to work and seemed like she was trying to disguise herself.

[A]

It's so creepy. And you know what? Jolene is doing what any of us would do because all of us would sleuth that out as well.

[B]

Yeah, you're weird. You're, you know, nobody knows anything about you, what's going on and you're working

[A]

really closely with this person, so you want to make sure that they're all right.

[B]

Well, she also refused to offer up any background about her life, relationships or family. Now, obviously this could have been a case of her being, you know, a particularly private person. But Jolene was growing fearful for her safety and the sanctity of their workplace. Their co worker, Ein, who had worked with both women on the day of Jolene's disappearance, later testified that tensions were running particularly high that day as police

[A]

searched desperately for any leads. They came upon another salon at which Jennifer had worked. At a Great Clips in Yuli, one of her former co workers, Elisa, recalled that Jennifer ran very hot and cold, and that she also had a temper and professionalism would absolutely go out the window if one of her clients upset her. Her former manager, whose name was also Jennifer, recalled coming to the conclusion that Jennifer was a liability.

[B]

Real quick, we've got. We've got two Jason's and two Jennifer in this story. It's so interesting.

[A]

Well, maybe one Jennifer that doesn't make sense right now, but it will.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

So, you know, Jennifer, head honcho Jennifer, she's saying you're a liability because multiple people complained. You know, like, clients and co workers alike complained about her. So she's like, you got to go. So when she was fired, Jennifer actually threw her keys at her manager before storming out and then sitting in her car in the parking lot for the next six hours. So we don't know if she was trying to, like, intimidate her former co workers. Like, I'm outside.

[B]

Like, I just think she didn't have anything going on.

[A]

She had nowhere else to go.

[B]

Yeah. Just nothing.

[A]

Yeah, very possible. So either way, Jennifer in police's eyes was not looking good.

[B]

No.

[A]

And this is the third time we've said this pretty much because there's a lot of strange people in this story, but this is really, like. This is really top tier. So now that police felt confident that the struggle in Jolene's home was. Was not connected to her disappearance, law enforcement searched the Tangles Hair salon from top to bottom. And though there was no overt sign of a struggle, one detective noticed a slight red ring around the drains in one of the sinks. On a hunch, they sprayed luminol on the area, and it lit up.

[B]

Oh, that is bad news.

[A]

There was blood everywhere on the sink, on the walls, on the floors, and on the mop, which had clearly been used to cover up what had happened. A pair of scissors was also found in the vicinity. And though they were clean, the screw attaching the two halves had blood on the underside of it. So, you know, that. That's kind of terrifying that it, you know, this pair of scissors could have been used in a crime.

[B]

Yeah, yeah. And you, you know, you don't expect that going into a hair salon. You're like, why is there. Why when I pour luminol everywhere, why is there blood everywhere? Why is it lighting up?

[A]

And Jolene is missing. The co worker seems to be hiding something, really painting a particular picture here.

[B]

Freaky.

[A]

Especially because that blood was a match to Jolene's. Well, guess what they found next. The security cameras affixed to the back of the store. Captured something damning and seemed to offer the proof they needed as to who had committed this crime. Because not only did they have the footage to tell them that Jennifer had been the one to move Jolene's car, but on the footage outside the salon, Jennifer was seen discarding several large trash bags into the dumpster. After the salon closed on the day Jolene went missing, her car could be seen driving behind the salon multiple times until the dumpster was. Was emptied, in which case, her car was not seen again. So it's almost like she's checking to make sure that what she threw away was picked up, because she. She doesn't want that sitting there.

[B]

Yeah, it's gotta go somewhere else. Well, this dumpster was emptied to the Chester Island Road landfill in Georgia. And obviously, because Fernandina beach is in northern Florida, it is very close to Georgia. Actually, this landfill is near where Jolene grew up. It's just about an hour away from the salon, right across the Georgia border. So the FBI spent multiple days searching for Jolene's remains within that landfill, believing that Jennifer had murdered her in that salon and then disposed of her body in those trash bags and then into that dumpster. But none were found at that landfill. So time was really of the essence here because they felt confident that Jennifer was involved. But the only factual information that detectives had about Jennifer was her phone number. And when they obtained a warrant and pinged the phone, it came up at a rest stop in St. Johns, Florida, which is an hour south of Fernandina Beach. It's basically a suburb of Jacksonville. And this made a lot of sense, given that she was most likely living out of her car, so of course she'd be staying at a rest stop.

[A]

What'd I say a few weeks ago? I don't go to rest stops. That's where murderers are.

[B]

Yeah, creepy shit goes down there. And their hunch was actually correct because when detectives descended upon her, she was lying in the backseat. She was just sleeping in her backseat.

[A]

So scary that, I mean, for her to be sleeping and them and not, like, actively able to flee for a chase to ensue. Like, they're like, oh, you're out. Yep, we've got ya.

[B]

Well, she was then summoned outside by the officer who asked her if she had any knowledge about Jolene's detective disappearance, which, of course, she said she didn't. She was also asked if she had ever driven Jolene's car, and she maintained that she had not. But the surveillance footage and the deep claw marks on the left side of her face told a very different story. She had attempted to actually bandage them up, but it clearly showed remnants of fingernail scratches from her temples down to her cheeks. Thus, Jennifer was brought in for questioning. While she staunchly denied any involvement in Jolene's disappearance, she was able to be detained and arrested for grand theft auto of Jolene's car. Then she was officially arrested on May 16, 2018. And disturbingly, she seemed, like, upbeat and jovial about being arrested.

[A]

Every freaking picture I've seen of this woman pretty much. She's, like, smiling like she scares me. This person is evil.

[B]

Yeah. And we're not even scratching the surface yet, guys. When she was placed in handcuffs and the officer asked her if they were hurting her, she said, no, they feel great. You can put them on tighter if you want.

[A]

Girl loves it.

[B]

Freak. But get this. When she was questioned about being booked on her grand theft auto charge, she offered up a massive piece of information to investigators. Jennifer Seibert was not even her real name. This person didn't actually exist because her real name was Kimberly Kessler and she was a missing person.

[A]

Yes, the real Kimberly had disappeared from her hometown of Butler County, Pennsylvania, in 2004 when she was about 30 years old. And she had been reported missing by her mother, Connie Kessler. Like, I don't know that we've seen this where somebody has been reported missing by their family and then they're actually not missing for any nefarious reasons against them, but, you know, committed by them rather. And they're out on the run using multiple aliases.

[B]

I mean, this has happened before. We have seen people disappear, and then they, you know, they get discovered, like, 20 years later. It has happened. But it's just so shocking that, like, her family filed a missing persons report for her because they're like, my daughter's missing.

[A]

She's.

[B]

She could be dead.

[A]

Well, that's what I mean is like, where a family member thinks that something could have happened to them and she's just out there. It's crazy. Like, especially because we're talking about a woman, and we so seldom speak about women killers or women criminals. I mean, we do sometimes, but they're often like, she killed her husband or something. But this woman's rap sheet is insane. Connie claimed this is her mom, of course, that they had last spoken over the phone and that she then vanished without a trace. And despite that missing persons report, she never heard from her again. Since then, Kimberly has lived a very colorful and dangerous life. But growing up in small town Pennsylvania, she was actually Very popular and very outgoing.

[B]

Yeah, she was a cheerleader.

[A]

Yeah. Like, this is not the girl you would think would turn upside down.

[B]

Not at all.

[A]

She also got married in Arizona and told her husband that her name was Melissa, which was the name that he got tattooed on his chest.

[B]

Oh, no. Oh, no. Poor guy. You say, you know, cover that one up. Got to cover that one up.

[A]

She later reconnected with a high school acquaintance named Tom Sims when she was dancing in a strip club and they started dating. They actually moved in together, and they even adopted a kid. Cat. He described Kimberly as mercurial and temperamental and said that she had frequent outbursts which would easily turn violent. Tom even recalled a fight in which she stabbed him in the chest with a steak knife.

[B]

What the hell?

[A]

Another in which she clocked him on the side of his head with the iron burner from a stovetop. And yet another when she bit his father on the leg. What girl? How'd you get down there?

[B]

Dang, man. She is just. She is unhinged. Hinged.

[A]

Police were summoned to the home each time, like, for all of these occurrences, but he actually chose not to press charges, though eventually the fighting became too much, and they broke up. About a year later, she called and asked to meet up with him, and Tom obliged. But when he asked how their cat was doing, because she was the one to take their cat in the breakup, Kimberly told him matter of factly that she couldn't take care of him, so she shot him with a shotgun. Like. Like I said, evil.

[B]

Evil. Evil and deranged. Like, she is a piece of.

[A]

I think that says so much about her that you can't take care of your cat, so you shoot it with a shotgun instead of just. Yeah, I mean, God forbid, at least to the. To a shelter is better than shooting it. Like, give it to somebody. Like, give it up for adoption. Give it to a friend. Like, oh, my God.

[B]

Well, it actually doesn't stop there, because one time, a neighbor had reported Kimberly to Child protective Services because she had been digging a large hole in the yard with her son inside of it, which she actually told this neighbor was a grave. What?

[A]

Can't make this up.

[B]

She was acting so erratically that the neighbor feared that she was going to harm her child and then bury them in that hole. So this child was removed from the home. Kimberly explained to police that her son was, quote, stolen by Child Protective services and that this had sent her over the edge.

[A]

Yeah, all that stuff that came before, like shooting the cat and stabbing your boyfriend with a Steak knife in the chest that wasn't over the edge.

[B]

Yeah, I'm sure your whole life before the big old graveyard in your yard was completely normal.

[A]

Right.

[B]

Well, because at this point, she was still going by an alias. This time it was Christina. And she was so irate at her son being taken away that she brought a gun, a roll of duct tape, and a taser to the offices of Child Protective Services in order to threaten them. Then she was promptly kicked out. They're like, get out of here, crazy bitch. She continued to explain to investigators how she had been living on the fringes of society for over a decade and that she had been on the run from the FBI for 25 years, though she didn't explain why. And it's wild, because the way she talked about her life story almost sounded as if she was kind of like bragging while she claimed to be wanted in Arizona, Pennsylvania, and Virginia, and that she had worked as a tractor trailer operator in Virginia as well as a real estate agent in Arizona, which I don't know if I believe either of those things.

[A]

I think probably after so much time running and changing who you are, she probably thinks that she's so interesting and, like, she has the story to tell, and she's like, oh, yeah, I've done all this stuff.

[B]

That's what I think about it. But. But also, she probably is an embellisher as well.

[A]

Sure.

[B]

You know, like, I don't. I mean, maybe she was, but I kind of doubt that she was a real estate agent in Arizona.

[A]

It just feels like she really wants to be the main character. And now that she's caught, she's like, all right, take a seat. Get the popcorn.

[B]

Well, she told them that she'd been dating a man who was wanted by the FBI, whom she then housed as a fugitive of the law in her apartment. So, like, you're saying it's kind of like, are these just, like, grand lies that she's trying to tell to make herself seem cool and interesting?

[A]

Honestly, I wouldn't. That one. Like, I wouldn't. That doesn't sound too far fetched for her, because it would make sense that she's running with somebody who's doing something similar to her. But, like, sure. But it does seem like she's giving them a little tell all. Like, now that she's caught and she knows that girl wants to write a book. Right. She surprised she hasn't. Well, in 2018, a man named David Trempass received a friend request on Facebook from a woman named Mia Stone. This is obviously the same year. And around the time that Jolene went missing and Mia Stone was apparently living in Florida. So the pair got to chatting, and he recalled that Mia seemed very kind and empathetic. So he told her that if she ever made it to Texas, they should go on a date. And the very next day, she was in Texas.

[B]

Yikes.

[A]

So they met for a meal, and David was shocked when Mia proposed moving in together after one date, you know, so he kind of, like, had to gently talk her down, and then he left the restaurant, and they never saw each other again. But, of course, this was Kimberly, and it seemed like she was looking for a place to kind of shack up and hide out and shift to a new identity. She's done with Jennifer Siebert now. She wants to become. Yes, Stone.

[B]

Yeah, it's just so crazy, because that is such a wild thing to do, though, you know, go on Facebook. You meet a guy, and he says, hey, you know, if you're ever in my. You know, in my state, my part of town, come over.

[A]

We'll.

[B]

We'll go to dinner or whatever. And then, bam, she shows up the next day, first date. She's like, hey, can I move in with you? What?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

No.

[A]

Yeah. So all this back history and so many. I mean, so many things that we probably don't know still to this day. So as she's telling police all these stories, you know, the detective, actually, I don't know why he asked. Maybe he wanted to see what her reaction would be, because it's not like he needs her permission. He asked Kimberly if he could run her name through their database, and she kind of reverted back to her bubbly, almost flirtatious, I'll say nature. And she told them, do it, please. You'll see my mug. I'll look a lot younger then. And thinner, too. I won't be £200. So she's like, yes, look me up, and. But as soon as they brought up Jolene, like, that was the one thing that she didn't want to talk about. And at that point, she demanded a lawyer. Well, after searching her name in the database, the results were shocking, to say the least. Or maybe not with where we've been going with this story. Now, Kimberly had as many as 18 different identities and had moved to over 330 cities in 14 different states. According to her mom, Connie, she once plucked the name of a deceased child, Pamela Kliber, from a gravestone when she stopped by the cemetery to visit her dad and began using the little girl's name. As her newest identity. So it seems like she had been doing this for a long time. And we're going to kind of get into the mental health side of this in a second. But this was something that was always kind of a part of her.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

[A]

Like you could probably already guess this kind of multiple personality element. She actually also had a passport and a Social Security number as Jennifer Siebert, which she had stolen from a 13 year old girl who died in a car crash in 1987.

[B]

Yeah. So Jennifer Siebert actually was a real person, but you know, this person had passed a long time ago.

[A]

Yeah. Which is kind of crazy how people can get away with this. For my second, my thriller novel that just came out, the Season of Sinking, I had to do a lot of research about like stolen identities for it.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And learning really how people do that and take identities from people who are deceased. And I just like, I still can't believe that people get away with that. Yeah.

[B]

That people actually do that too if

[A]

like Social Security doesn't flag it or go after them. Like, it's just, it's wild. And she was doing this a lot, you know, because it's, it's wild as well to think that people are able to do this in this day and age and. But they sometimes are.

[B]

Yeah. And she had been doing it since 2004. Since she went on the run.

[A]

Yeah, she was pretty experienced. Well, when her phone was taken to be searched for forensic evidence, law enforcement found a treasure trove of Internet searches that pointed them in the right direction.

[B]

And these are just so dumb.

[A]

They always are. She was looking into trial convictions without a body, post mortem decomposition, and she even searched for co worker guilty of murder, missing person, body not found, which seemed pretty eerily on the nose there.

[B]

That's highly specific.

[A]

But more disturbing than that was the charge from her credit card at Walmart, just down the street from Tangles. On the night of Jolene's disappearance, she had purchased heavy duty trash bags, rubber gloves, ammonia, and an electric carving knife. So, you know, again with the fact that there was blood in the screw on the scissors, perhaps that was the murder weapon. Because I'll just tell you right now, we don't know. And if she bought an electric carving knife and there was that much blood

[B]

in the salon and there was also trash. Trash bags, plural.

[A]

Yeah. Then she may have dismembered Jolene's body right there in this salon. Well, despite the lack of body, Kimberly was officially charged with Jolene's murder on September 7. 2018, while awaiting trial, she was accused of being hateful to the officers and the other inmates. And she later accused one of her defense attorneys of being Jolene's cousin and therefore working against her from her own legal team. Though this, I will say, was not true.

[B]

Yeah, she's just making it up. And, you know, there's a clip on YouTube that you can watch where but

[A]

we'll play it right now. It's kind of like a compilation of what I just said.

[B]

Exactly. It's just her saying, like, you know, this person is Jolene's cousin, blah, blah. And she just keeps saying it over and over.

[A]

She's like, lobbing this around the entire trial, and it's super unhinged. So here's that clip. It's fun. Others just put me back myself.

[B]

Ma', am, come back.

[A]

I want to get rid of the public defender's office. Yeah, exactly. Jordan Beard is Johnson's nephew. Jordan Beard is Jolie's cousin. Jordan Beard is Johnson's nephew. Jordan Beard is Jolene Cummings cousin. Jordan Beard is Jolene's cousin. Jordan Jolene cousins. Gordon Beard is Jolene's cousin. Jordan Beard is Jolene Cummings cousin. Jordan Beard is Jolene's cousin. And I refuse this assigned counsel. I refuse the public defender's office.

[B]

Now, as you can imagine, Kimberly was trouble from the beginning of her tenure in prison. She yelled, cursed, and hurled insults throughout the entirety of. Of each of her hearings, just like you guys just heard and saw.

[A]

Yeah, she does that.

[B]

Yeah. I mean, even when she was being removed and placed in a room by herself to watch the hearing via Zoom, she's still acting nutty, which was at

[A]

the very beginning of that clip we just played. She was on Zoom.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

And there's this really scary still that we're going to post and you can see right now on YouTube where she's. Because she smiles so much and the camera's, like, above her and she's looking up with these women wide eyes and this little smile, and she looks like a scary bird. And like, yeah, scary bird scares me.

[B]

Yeah. So naturally, she wasn't much better when she was in custody. On more than one occasion, she ripped her clothes off and smeared feces on the walls and windows, even attempting to throw it on the officers. She also announced her intention to go on a hunger strike. And it seemed to be working. She had dropped to 74 pounds from 196 pounds and was so weak and feeble that she had to be brought into court in a wheelchair. However, she was seen Eating when she thought that there was nobody watching her. So it did seem like she was selectively starving herself and kind of acting out in order to be deemed, like, mentally ill. She opted out of participating in any group enrichment or activities and was taken to the hospital 30 times for various ailments. I mean, correctional officers, nightmare. So when she was eventually moved on to her permanent prison, the officers actually celebrated by getting a cake. Like, that's how much they wanted this, like, nutty woman out of their prison.

[A]

Yeah. Because she was so loud and persistent and she's throwing feces on him. I mean. Yeah, that is just beyond disgusting. Also, it's like, it's kind of hard to know what was really going on with that because you. You have to wonder if these antics were so that she could maybe avoid culpability or get, like, be deemed mentally insane.

[B]

Yeah. It seems like the antics really kind of, like, you know, leveled up when she was arrested. Like, she didn't seem. Yeah, of course she did kill somebody.

[A]

But she was strange in the salon.

[B]

She was strange in the salon, but it seemed like she was upping the ante when she got to jail, which

[A]

is why it's hard to know if she was doing that on purpose or if she genuinely was just kind of out of her mind. But initially, on July 2, 2019, she was found incompetent to stand trial. Then she was evaluated two more times, once on October 12, 2020, and another on June 30, 2021. And her evaluation found that she had a personality disorder like I was hinting at before, and not a mental illness. And the latter two tests that she took ruled that she would stand trial as a competent individual.

[B]

Yeah. So originally they thought, oh, well, maybe she is incompetent and she can't stand trial. But then they were like, we need to make sure that that's true. So they tested her a few more

[A]

times, which is great.

[B]

Yeah. And then they found out that, yeah, she. She definitely can stand trial.

[A]

She can. And she has a personality disorder, which makes sense, but it's not something that would. Would make it. So she cannot be really held culpable for this crime. Well, still, Kimberly remained so disruptive in court that she had to be kept in a separate room. On December 9, 2021, Kimberly Kessler was found guilty of the first degree murder of Jolene Cummings and given a life sentence plus five years for the grand theft auto charge. And after the sentencing was read, Jolene's mom, Ann Johnson, spoke to the crowd outside, and he here is A clip of what she said. It's been a long three years. Three years, seven months and nine days that my daughter Jolene was taken from us. Today, we praise God. We praise God that we got the verdict and that it gives us some type of closure. While my daughter Jolene has not been found, we have at least the verdict of the indictment, a first degree premeditated murder. We miss Jolene every second of the day. My family, our families, the Cummings families, the children. Not a day goes by, but I really feel like Jolene is with us today. Four years after the murder in 2022, a memorial bench was put up in her honor at Buchanan park in Hillyard, Florida. And here's a clip of her ex husband Jason visiting the spot and kind of speaking in Jolene's memory.

[B]

This is where we come visit her.

[A]

Does it hurt knowing that to have

[B]

that moment with her, you have to come see a bench all the time? Especially for the kids. You know, they don't have a gravesite to go visit. This is the only thing they have to remind their mother, Mama, she was a good mama.

[A]

That's. That's. I think that's got a lot to

[B]

do with why I love. Fell in love with her, because she was a good mom.

[A]

Jace says he'd never heard anything about Jolene's missing mysterious co worker. What prompted the attack that day, still unclear.

[B]

I don't know. Jolene seen something that wasn't right about her, and I guess it scared her.

[A]

If given the chance to say one thing to the person responsible, if you could look her in the eye like you're looking me right now, what would you say to her?

[B]

The first thing I would ask her is, where is she at? And she's called, it's over with. Let us have peace.

[A]

To this day, Jolene's body has still not been found, which means we don't know exactly what Kimberly Kessler did to her that day in the salon. Obviously, we kind of theorized what we think probably happened, and it seems like that's the general consensus, but her family doesn't have the actual closure of also how it got, how it escalated to the level of murder. Did Jolene confront her? Did she say something and then it sent Kimberly over the edge, or was

[B]

it something that was minuscule and just, you know, Kimberly, like that person said, was hot and cold, you know, and had a pretty bad temper. You know, she could. She could just kind of fly off the handle very quickly, which.

[A]

Yeah, so it could have been something as simple as Jolene Asking her a question about her past, and who knows? A bad day for Kimberly, like, her family, just doesn't have that answer. Kimberly has filed two appeals, but both of them were denied. So based on her ruthless disposition, many feel that she is connected to more murders, especially when you consider the fact that she likely dismembered Jolene's body. She obviously cleaned it up. She. She made it so that to this day, Jolene was never found. So is that from experience, or did she just get lucky? Not lucky enough to get away with it. But has she done this before? Because many people to this day are attempting to tie Kimberly Kessler to other murders. Thank you so much, everybody, for listening to this episode of Going West.

[B]

Yes, thank you guys so much for listening to this episode. I mean, what a great, crazy story. Would love to hear your thoughts on this story on this case. So head on over to our socials. We're on Instagram @goingwest podcast. We're also on Facebook as well as TikTok, and we're also now on YouTube. So if you're listening to audio, but you do want to explore your options and you want to see photos of the cases that we cover, head on over to YouTube.

[A]

Yeah. For anybody who listened to this on audio, go to check out all those photos in the videos that we talked about today. If you want to see the scary bird lady that I'm talking about, if you want to see the videos, like, also, like, all the surveillance, that's what's something that's really interesting as well, is she may have made it so that Jolene couldn't be found, which maybe she just got lucky that they couldn't find her in the landfill.

[B]

But there was too much evidence.

[A]

Too much evidence. She was caught on two different surveillance cameras. Like, girl. Right. Throwing away the evidence, you're caught on camera.

[B]

You're cooked.

[A]

You're cooked, girl. So thank you guys so much for tuning into this episode. I mean, truly an unbelievable story. And our hearts really go out to Jolene's family. You know, they. They still don't have the full closure that they deserve, like I said. And her poor mom, hearing her mom.

[B]

I know.

[A]

Speak so many times. Her mom got in front of cameras on multiple occasions to talk about how amazing her daughter was. And, like, why did this happen? It's so senseless.

[B]

Yeah. It just really does feel so senseless. Well, thank you guys again for listening or watching this episode of Going west. And we'll see you next time. All right, guys, so for everybody out

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