The Green Widow Murders // 520

Summary

Summary of "The Green Widow Murders" Episode 520 on Going West: True Crime

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Introduction

In Episode 520 of Going West: True Crime, Daphne Woolsoncroft and Heath Merryman delve into the chilling case of the Green Widow murders. Released on July 15, 2025, this episode unpacks the disappearance and murder of Hollywood camera operator Robert "Bob" Samuels, unraveling a web of deceit, manipulation, and murder that ultimately led to multiple convictions and one death row sentence.

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Background: Robert "Bob" Samuels and Mary Ellen Gurnick

Robert Briscom Samuels, known as Bob, was born on September 20, 1948, in North Carolina but spent most of his life in Santa Ana, California, a vibrant hub near Los Angeles. From a young age, Bob aspired to work on movie sets, cultivating a successful career as a camera assistant and contributing to several iconic films, including The Color Purple and Beverly Hills Cop 2. His colleagues remembered him as a hard-working and personable individual:

"He's not a player, he was a hard-working guy." — Geary McLeod ([06:05])

Despite his thriving career, Bob yearned for a stable family life. This desire led him to reconnect with his high school crush, Mary Ellen Gurnick, at his 10-year reunion, culminating in their swift marriage six months later in 1986.

Mary Ellen, two years Bob’s senior, was the quintessential high school popular girl with dreams of show business that never materialized. Her relationship with Bob, though initially promising, soon revealed deep fissures. Mary Ellen's ex-husband described her as a compulsive liar and a gambling addict, traits that would later become significant in the unfolding tragedy.

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Marital Struggles and Escalating Tensions

Bob and Mary Ellen's marriage, though initially harmonious, quickly deteriorated. Mary Ellen struggled with the suburban lifestyle and Bob's steady but unglamorous career in Hollywood. Her excessive spending, gambling, and drug use put immense strain on their relationship. For instance, Mary Ellen once spent $22,000 in a single month, equivalent to nearly $91,000 today, on shopping sprees and nightlife:

"She spent $22,000, which already sounds like a lot, but that's nearly $91,000 by today's standards, in just one month on shopping and going out." — Nicole ([13:26])

Bob's attempts to salvage their marriage included unconventional measures, such as franchising a Subway sandwich shop for Mary Ellen to manage, hoping to provide her with structure and purpose. However, Mary Ellen misused the business as a front for selling cocaine, further exacerbating their financial issues and mistrust.

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The Murder of Bob Samuels

On December 7, 1988, Bob returned home from work and was brutally murdered in his Northridge residence. An intruder allegedly entered through the back door, shooting Bob in the head with a shotgun modified to act as a silencer. His body remained undiscovered for two days until Mary Ellen and their daughter, Nicole, found him:

"The back door appeared as if someone had taken a crowbar to it, making it look like a break-in had occurred." — Nicole ([22:35])

Initial investigations raised suspicions due to the lack of evidence supporting a random home invasion. Authorities noted that nothing of value was stolen, and Bob's belongings remained largely intact, suggesting the scene might have been staged.

Mary Ellen was the primary person of interest, especially given her erratic behavior post-murder. Prosecutor Jan Morrise noted:

"At one point, she put her hand on one of the detective's bald heads and talked about how she liked bald guys." — Heath ([25:06])

Despite Mary's initially truthful polygraph results, inconsistencies soon emerged, leading investigators to doubt her innocence.

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Unraveling the Plot: Hiring of Hitmen

The investigation took a significant turn five months after the murder when an anonymous tip linked Jimmy Bernstein, Nicole's fiancé, to the crime. Jimmy confessed his involvement, revealing that Mary Ellen had orchestrated the murder to secure life insurance money and control over Bob's estate. He detailed how Mary Ellen manipulated him into the plot, leveraging Nicole's involvement to eliminate Bob.

Additionally, Jimmy's attempted murder in June 1989 further exposed Mary Ellen's relentless pursuit to cover her tracks. She hired additional hitmen, Paul Gaul and Darryl Ray Edwards, to silence Jimmy when he began to show remorse and fear of being caught.

"Mary Ellen wanted to pocket the insurance money and take control of Bob's estate as well as the sandwich shop so that she could sell it." — Nicole ([35:13])

These revelations painted Mary Ellen as a relentless and manipulative orchestrator of murder, deeply entwined in criminal activities to preserve her financial gains.

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The Trial and Conviction

Mary Ellen's trial in March 1994 was marked by harrowing testimonies and damning evidence. Prosecutor Jan Morrise described her as:

"Selfish, manipulative, a predator, the mastermind of two evil plots." — Jan Morrise ([51:07])

Despite Mary Ellen and Nicole's claims of being framed by the hitmen, the evidence, including financial transactions and eyewitness testimonies, proved overwhelmingly against them. Nicole, although initially a key witness for the defense, faced accusations of lying under pressure from her mother.

The jury found Mary Ellen guilty of murder, leading to her sentencing to death on September 16, 1994. This conviction was a significant moment, highlighting her calculated and ruthless nature:

"How many bodies does it take? We're talking about murder for the sake of the almighty dollar." — Deputy District Attorney Jan Morrise ([52:19])

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Aftermath and Continuing Impact

Following her conviction, Mary Ellen became known as the "Green Widow," a moniker stemming from an infamous photo found at her residence depicting her amidst her husband's blood money. Despite her death sentence being reversed in 2019 due to procedural errors, Mary Ellen remains incarcerated, now 78 years old.

Darryl and Paul, the hitmen, received substantial prison sentences but were eventually paroled in 2009. Surprisingly, Nicole evaded legal repercussions, marrying and starting a family, leaving many questions about her ongoing relationship with her mother and the true extent of her involvement.

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Conclusion

The Green Widow murders stand as a testament to the destructive power of greed and manipulation. Mary Ellen Gurnick's orchestrated plot to eliminate her husband for financial gain, coupled with her influence over her daughter, showcases a deeply disturbing case of familial betrayal and criminal endeavor. Through meticulous investigation and compelling courtroom drama, Going West: True Crime illuminates the dark corridors of human behavior, offering listeners a profound exploration of one of Hollywood's most unsettling true crime stories.

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Notable Quotes

• "He's not a player, he was a hard-working guy." — Geary McLeod ([06:05])
• "She spent $22,000, which already sounds like a lot, but that's nearly $91,000 by today's standards, in just one month on shopping and going out." — Nicole ([13:26])
• "At one point, she put her hand on one of the detective's bald heads and talked about how she liked bald guys." — Heath ([25:06])
• "Mary Ellen wanted to pocket the insurance money and take control of Bob's estate as well as the sandwich shop so that she could sell it." — Nicole ([35:13])
• "Selfish, manipulative, a predator, the mastermind of two evil plots." — Jan Morrise ([51:07])
• "How many bodies does it take? We're talking about murder for the sake of the almighty dollar." — Deputy District Attorney Jan Morrise ([52:19])

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Additional Resources

For those interested in exploring this case further, Going West: True Crime has shared photos related to the Green Widow murders on their social media platforms. Listeners are encouraged to visit Instagram @goingwestpodcast and their Facebook page for visual insights into this harrowing story.

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Upcoming Tour Announcement

In a brief promotional segment, Daphne and Heath announce their upcoming tour scheduled for September, including stops in Denver, Dallas, Atlanta, Boston, and Chicago. Fans are invited to attend interactive sessions and games, promising a blend of true crime discussion and engaging entertainment. Tickets can be purchased at goingwestpod.com/tour.

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Note: All timestamps correspond to the original podcast transcript provided.

Transcript

[Heath]

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[Heath]

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[Daphne]

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[Daphne]

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[Heath]

What is going on? True crime fans, I I'm your host.

[Nicole]

He and I'm your host Daphne, and.

[Heath]

You'Re listening to Going West.

[Nicole]

Hello everybody. Hope you're doing well today. Heath was actually looking for a good case for us to cover for our upcoming tour when he found this one and we thought it would probably be better for Going west episode because we kind of want to do a different type of case for tour. We want our tour to be a little bit lighter and something super fun for you guys. Something that you guys will still be so invested in. We have some seriously fun things planned.

[Heath]

Yes, but this one was definitely in consideration because it is absolutely wild. By the way, if you want to get tickets to come see us in September, you can get those tickets. Go to goingwestpod.com tour we're going to be in Denver, Dallas, Atlanta, Boston and Chicago. You guys do not want to miss it. We're going to do some interactive games with you guys. It is going to be a blast.

[Nicole]

Yes. And we are still going to talk true crime, but we promise it's going to be so much fun for you and your friends or your partner or whoever that you come see us with. We cannot wait to see all you guys. But anyway, so today's case actually has a very famous photo associated with it which we will post on our socials for you all to see.

[Heath]

Yeah, that is a wild photo.

[Nicole]

Like woof. Buckle up for this one guys.

[Heath]

Alright guys, this is episode 520 of Going West. So let's get into it.

[Nicole]

In the late 1980s, a Hollywood camera operator was murdered in his home in the Los Angeles suburbs. At first glance, the scene appeared to be a tragic and random home invasion. But with little evidence to support this conclusion, a far more sinister story emerged which would leave two people dead, two people in prison and one person on death row. This is the story of the Green Widow murders. Robert Briscom Samuels, or Bob as he came to be known, was born on September 20, 1948 in North Carolina, but he grew up across the country in Santa Ana, California. So he was in North Carolina for a very short amount of time. And for those who don't know, Santa Ana, California is just about 30 miles or 48 kilometers southeast of Los Angeles. And he was raised there alongside his sister Susan and his brother Frank.

[Heath]

So not directly in Los Angeles, but pretty close.

[Nicole]

Yeah, very close. I'm going to talk about Disneyland in a sec. It's kind of more towards Disneyland. But first, from a young age it was Bob's dream to work in movie sets. You know, he was like, you're saying Los Angeles adjacent. A lot of people who grew up here naturally kind of get into that.

[Heath]

Industry of course, because it's literally the biggest thing that LA is known for.

[Nicole]

Yeah. And you're like surrounded by it and it's so magical. So it's, it's very easy to, to fall into. And also growing up he really knew his way around a camera and he always loved photography. So. So in the 1970s, while in his 20s, Bob began working as a camera assistant, man on set. And soon he had a flourishing career. A friend of his named Geary McLeod remembered, quote, I worked with Bob for a long time. He's not a player, he was a hard working guy. Another friend of Bob's named Sherry Carter fondly remembers him working on the set of Winter People, which is a movie starring Kelly McGillis and Kurt Russell and Sherry. And Bob once chatted on the phone alongside the stars, as well as of course, Goldie Han, who is Kurt Russell's longtime partner. I'm sure we all know that. And Bob, like passed the phone around making introductions. He was so well liked by stars and crew alike. He was just this great guy.

[Heath]

He was a man of the people.

[Nicole]

He really was. Sherry also remembered, quote, movie stars like to hang around with Bob because he's such a nice guy. So Bob worked on over a dozen productions over the course of his career, including the Color Purple starring Oprah and Whoopi Goldberg, and the second Lethal Weapon movie, both of which came out in the 80s when Bob was in his 30s. He also worked on Beverly Hills Cop 2, like a lot of those classic 80s movies he was on.

[Heath]

Love it.

[Nicole]

Yeah, I was thinking of you when I was looking at his IMDb. But back in the 70s, so before all these films, as his career was growing and growing, he would often think of how he had always dreamed of also having a wife and children. And he felt like this was like a missing piece in his life. He had his career, but he wanted the other side of it too. Now, Bob was described as a patient, loving and hardworking family man. All he needed was the family aspect. And in the late 1970s, while at his high school reunion, you know, this would be his 10 year high school reunion, he reconnected with his high school crush, a woman named Mary Ellen Gurnick. Now, Bob and Mary Ellen grew up just a block apart in Santa Ana. And two years his senior, Mary Ellen was the star of their high school plays. She was bright, she was bubbly and popular, whereas quiet Bob kind of faded into the background. You know, he was the nice, quiet guy. So he always knew who she was and he had an eye for her. And it's kind of funny that it wasn't until 10 years later he finally kind of got up the courage to talk to her.

[Heath]

Well, yeah, I mean, in high school he wasn't, you know, much. He was kind of just the wallfly, watching everybody else do everything. And then after high school, he blossomed into this, you know, this great career in Hollywood. So he's kinda got a little bit more confidence to do so.

[Nicole]

Yeah, absolutely. So he was just elated to have a shot with her after all those years. And LA County District Attorney Jan Morrise, who eventually prosecuted his murder case, explained, Bob started out smitten with her as a young child. And was completely enamored of her when he met her. Then again as an adult, which I think will help explain his side of things a little bit as their relationship flourishes. And not to spoil anything, but I think it kind of shows why he worked, maybe why he worked so hard to keep their relationship going, because it was almost like another version of a childhood dream for him was to be with Mary Ellen.

[Heath]

Absolutely agree. Well, let's talk a little bit about Mary Ellen. So she had been a young bride and mother, marrying a man named Ronnie Lee Jameson on her 21st birthday and having a daughter that they named Nicole shortly afterwards. She and Ronnie were married for 11 years. But when Ronnie eventually lost his job, Mary Ellen was furious at losing her stream of income and sense of security. So she divorced him and kicked him right out of the house. Ronnie Lee later described Mary Ellen as a compulsive liar, a gambling addict, and a drug user. So although Bob was really smitten with her, it seems that there was kind of this other side to Mary Ellen that he really hadn't seen yet. Now, like Bob, she once had lofty aspirations in show business and loved the movies, spending much of her teen years at drive ins and also Disneyland. So she had moved to Los Angeles with the dream of becoming famous and even modeled for a little bit, doing ads for stockings. But her career really never took off like she thought it was going to.

[Nicole]

Probably because of her lack of specific passion and her just wanting to be famous.

[Heath]

Yeah, I mean, that's never a good move. Just having that sense of like, I need to be famous, but I don't know how.

[Nicole]

Yeah. And it's not like, oh, I want to work hard towards this specific goal because this is my passion. It's just like I just want to be known for something. And it's feel like it's hard to.

[Heath]

Succeed with that attitude with this woman. She had a massive ego, so I can really see where that comes from.

[Nicole]

Oh, yeah.

[Heath]

Well, Bob was just transfixed with her beauty and her outgoing nature, and Mary Ellen was just drawn to the security that he could offer her since, of course, you know, he had this career cemented and he was locked into the Hollywood biz. So just six months after they met up at the reunion, the pair were married. Like Daphne said, Bob had always loved and wanted children. So he, he took to Mary Ellen's daughter Nicole instantly and was thrilled to step into the role of an additional father figure for her. He bought them a modest home in Northridge, California, which is a northwest suburb of Los Angeles, located in the Valley, and started sending Nicole to private school with Ronnie Lee. Eventually, like, out of the picture. Here, Bob even adopted Nicole officially. And for Bob, this arrangement was just a dream come true. But Mary Ellen found herself tiring quickly of the suburban monotony of her new life, even though it was kind of seemingly what she wanted.

[Nicole]

Yeah, it was almost like he wasn't Hollywood enough or that his life in the industry wasn't as glamorous as she wanted it to be. Even though he was such a great guy.

[Heath]

I mean, what else do you want? I mean, the guy works in film. Like, maybe he's not a massive movie star, but neither are you.

[Nicole]

Yeah. Like, girl, what are you bringing to the table? Like, yeah, but she wants something very specific. And it seems like, you know, they got married, like you said, with within six months. So it's almost like they kind of maybe rushed into a marriage, and she's realizing, oh, no, I want, like, a Brad Pitt. And it's like, hey, too bad you're.

[Heath]

You're not getting. You're not getting that. Well, I mean, she was this really, like, flashy party girl and had aspired to be arm candy for a celebrity, which Bob never even claimed to be. Instead, he was a simple, devoted family man whose career kept him busy, and he enjoyed providing for his girls.

[Nicole]

I mean, God forbid the man takes care of her, you know, as if that's not enough, because it really does seem like he took care of her, even though we're saying that they had, you know, a more modest house in the Valley in the suburbs. You know, they're not living in the Hollywood Hills. But he still had. He made really good money, and she was able to pretty much buy whatever she wanted, and she really took advantage of that security, and it kind of brought them to a head a little bit because she was just spending like crazy. Actually, Bob confided in friends that she wants. This is just one occasion. She spent $22,000, which already sounds like a lot, but that's nearly $91,000 by today's standards, in just one month on shopping and going out.

[Heath]

That's insane.

[Nicole]

Which, if you're going to spend 91k in a month, that goes to show you how secure his financial situation is.

[Heath]

And mind you, again, she's not contributing anything. Like, no. No financial contributions from her.

[Nicole]

But this also, like, just to give you guys an idea, it's not like she spent $91,000 on clothes. It was a bunch of different stuff that were more vanity, like clothes and shopping. Sprees and that kind of nature, because Mary Ellen also really loved herself some cocaine and alcohol alongside that party crowd of 1980s Los Angeles. And it wasn't long before she started going home with men that she would meet on these wild nights out while Bob was working hard and late providing for the family.

[Heath]

So he's working, and she's just out there spending his money on coke and cheating on him. All the while, Bob is just working late nights, and it's just. It's just sickening.

[Nicole]

And all the while, she's also complaining about her life, that it's not good enough for her. But all of this, you know, the cheating, this really shouldn't have been too much of a surprise for anybody, given that her vanity license plate read Nast Vixen. So N A S V X N. Kind of like nasty vixen. So she was like her. She had a really.

[Heath]

She knew.

[Nicole]

Yeah, she. She. She was very out there with this big, wild, wild gal personality.

[Heath]

Yeah, I'm a nasty vixen, you know, that steals my husband's money.

[Nicole]

Well, she was also known by the nickname Betty Boop. Like, a lot of people called her Betty or Betty Boop. And when you check our socials for photos, you'll kind of see why.

[Heath]

Yeah, she's definitely got that hair, for sure.

[Nicole]

So Bob and Mary Ellen separated multiple times because of her infidelity, But Bob was determined to work things out between them. Again, that kind of. I think it lends to what I was saying before about how, you know, she's this beautiful woman. She's kind of like, she makes herself the center of attention. Like, maybe almost makes you want to be around her.

[Heath]

Right. And he also wanted her for more than 10 years.

[Nicole]

Yeah. So she's like this. She's, like, popular in the real world as well, just like she was in school. So I think he kind of had some maybe superficial reasons to want to keep her around. Maybe she made him feel like he had bagged this. This hottie, you know? Yeah, that's just my guess. But actually, in order to give her something to do, because she didn't do.

[Heath]

Except for drink and do coke and bored as hell and shop.

[Nicole]

Yeah. He even franchised a Subway sandwich shop for her for her to, like, manage in hopes that it would keep her busy and bring her maybe some semblance of purpose and a more structured schedule.

[Heath]

I'm sorry, I'm laughing at this because it's like, oh, Bob, Bob, it's a.

[Nicole]

Really nice gesture, but, like, huge and expensive gesture. And Kind of funny to picture her behind a Subway counter when she's trying to be seen as more and more fabulous. Like, Bob, you're a sweetie and a good man, but I wonder where the hell this idea came from.

[Heath]

He's like, I just gotta get this woman out of the house.

[Nicole]

Gotta get her a job.

[Heath]

Yeah. She's gotta stop spending my money. So here's a Subway show.

[Nicole]

Like, why Subway? Not like a makeup store or like a bakery? Like, I don't know.

[Heath]

I don't know. I think maybe because Subway was really coming on the scene at that point, because it was. Had just come out, right?

[Nicole]

Yeah, I feels like it was probably like a.

[Heath]

So he's like, this is gonna be a hit, you know?

[Nicole]

Lucrative Subway, right? Healthy sandwich shop. So, yeah. But naturally, this venture really didn't work out too well. Not that the Subway shop didn't do well. Like, it didn't make them money. It's just, like, she wasn't doing a good job at managing it because she continued to maintain her life of excess. So she actually used their Subway shop as a home base to sell cocaine from.

[Heath]

Can you imagine back in the 80s, you go to get a Subway sandwich, and then you just get a little bit of coke on the side.

[Nicole]

Yeah, I. And I wonder, like, how discreetly she was doing that. Or maybe she just used that instead of telling people to come to her house. It would just be like, hey, meet me out back by the dumpster, you know? Yeah, I don't know. But she wasn't. She didn't give a shit about the Subway, you know? And Bob would also complain that every time that he went out of town for work, because working in film very often takes you out of Los Angeles, especially today. Um, but Bob would complain that the cash register at their Subway would miraculously get robbed when he was gone, despite him pleading with Mary Ellen to clear out the cash register and lock the cash away in the safe at night. So I don't know if this was, like, her stealing from them.

[Heath]

It had to have been, but.

[Nicole]

Or her just being an idiot. But I feel like she was stealing from herself.

[Heath]

Well, there's no real. Like. There's no scenario in which every single time he goes out of town.

[Nicole]

True.

[Heath]

The cash register gets robbed. I mean, let's be real here. It was Mary Ellen skimming off the top. She's like, well, I earned myself some cash today. So again, we're in the 1980s now, and Nicole, their daughter, was in her teens. But it's sad because she became a pawn in her mother's schemes and wild behavior as well. Some examples, Bob's friend Sherry Carter recalls that the girls once showed up to a chic afternoon wedding in matching leather jumpsuits just to call attention to themselves. And as Nicole got older, she and her mom became more like friends who liked to go clubbing together than like a mother and daughter duo. Nicole's best friend at the time, Selena, remembers going to bars to drink and flirt with men starting when they were just 16 years old. Because Mary Ellen really didn't care that her daughter and her friends were underage. And she would just bring them out in a group as if they were like her adult gal pals. So she's literally taking her underage teen daughter to go get messed up with her.

[Nicole]

She wants to be cool so bad. And she was known for being the cool mom to these very impressionable teen girls, obviously. But like, it feels like she just, she's not letting go. It's almost like she peaked in high school and she wants to remain popular and cool forever and she's gonna do whatever she can to be seen that way, even if it's just to these teen girls.

[Heath]

Well, on top of that, I feel like she's also trying to kind of like manipulate Nicole to be on her side. Because as you guys are gonna see, there's a wedge kind of goes in between Mary Ellen and Bob where Nicole's kind of like, well, do I choose my dad or do I choose my mom?

[Nicole]

Which does feel a little bit more natural because even though Bob adopted her, they were at this point, it's only been a few short years that they've known each other. So I feel like naturally, Nicole probably did have loyalty to her mom because that's her mom that she spent her whole life with.

[Heath]

Yeah, absolutely agree. And as time went on, Bob felt like he was kind of losing his daughter who was becoming a clone of her mother. So by 1986, just six years into their relationship, the couple had officially had enough of trying to make it work. So one evening, 37 year old Bob came home to what has since been described as a Dear John letter from Mary Ellen. Describing their relationship as stale. She explained, no matter what happens or what you think of me now or later, I will always care for you. We just can't live together. However, Bob continued to work on himself and consider rehabilitating their marriage. Like even up until two months before his murder, he was reading the self help book how to Save youe Marriage. So this poor guy, like, he's trying.

[Nicole]

He'S doing so much. He's doing the most.

[Heath]

Yeah, he's doing everything he can. Well, in the meantime, Mary Ellen and Nicole moved into a condo, and they agreed that Bob would pay about $1,500 a month in alimony. Their divorce proceedings dragged into Christmas time of 1988. So over two years after Mary Ellen and Nicole moved out, with the end of their relationship feeling pretty much at this point, truly over. But then everything got a whole lot darker and a lot more disturbing. On the evening of December 7, 1988, Bob came home from a hard day's work to his Northridge house, which he still lived in, and hopped in the shower. Afterward, he was believed to have been heading for his in home tanning bed when an intruder entered through the back, shooting him in the head and killing him instantly. Bob's body lay in the home for two days before anybody found him. Meanwhile, Mary Ellen called him multiple times, leaving voicemails to ask if he could watch her dog for a few days while she and Nicole were out of town. But she never got a call back.

[Nicole]

Two days later, on December 9, 1988, Mary Ellen and Nicole decided to stop by and let themselves into their old house. And they found it totally ransacked. The back door appeared as if someone had taken a crowbar to it, making it look like a break in had occurred. And there was Bob on the floor, lying on his side, having sustained a gunshot blow to the back of his head. A pillow next to his body had been blown clean through with a shotgun, having acted as a makeshift silencer, which we've seen before, likely catching him off guard completely. So Mary Ellen called 911 right away, and she and Nicole were there to greet detectives when they arrived shortly afterwards. Now, initially, nothing about their demeanor seemed abnormal or suspicious at all. Like, according to investigators, Nicole and Mary Ellen seemed as if they were in complete shock over what they stumbled upon. However, from the jump, law enforcement felt like the scene had been staged.

[Heath]

So they didn't initially think that there was anything going on with Mary Ellen and Nicole, but they did notice that there was something kind of off here.

[Nicole]

Yeah, because like I said, the house was ransacked, but nothing of value had been taken. Like, even Bob's wallet, which was full of cash, was still on his person. That would have been the easiest thing for this person to take. Why would you go into a house, kill the person that lives there and not take anything? What did you gain from that? Right, right. So then they're kind of starting to feel like maybe this Was a hit. Naturally, Mary Ellen was brought in for questioning. She's the one who found the body, and she was even given a polygraph test, but her answers were found to be truthful. However, despite having just lost her husband, who she had been separated from for a couple years, Mary Ellen immediately employed her go to mo with any man she came into contact with, which was to flirt with them. And, you know, that's fine, do what you want. You're a single woman. However, this did not make her look good at all because according to prosecutor Jan Morrise, quote, at one point, she put her hand on one of the detective's bald heads and talked about how she liked bald guys.

[Heath]

Like, you couldn't be more obvious. In that moment, he's literally investigating your ex husband's murder, and you're like, smoozin'. Bald guys are kinda cute.

[Nicole]

Yeah. So right off the bat, her behavior was off in a different way than they had really seen before. Now, the only other person of interest for investigators was the estranged husband of a woman whom Bob had been seeing casually since his separation. So that would have been very recent and therefore very interesting to police. Oh, since he and Mary Ellen split, he started seeing this other woman, and her ex seems kind of sus.

[Heath]

Is that the connection?

[Nicole]

Especially because this woman's former husband used to work as a police officer, and he had since found work as a security guard. He also had a history of domestic violence and he owned a gun. So this is very interesting to them. But he was able to offer up an airtight alibi and thus was cleared of suspicion.

[Heath]

Now, just to recap, in per Bob's autopsy, the cause of death was a shotgun blast to the back of the head with a 16 gauge shotgun fired at close range through a pillow as a homemade silencer, as we mentioned. However, before the shot, he had been struck with a tubular instrument believed to be the barrel of this shotgun, which was likely done to kind of incapacitate him so that they could finish him off.

[Nicole]

And that makes sense why it would be a shotgun blast and there was a pillow, because it's not like, you know, you need two hands for a shotgun. So they probably put the pillow on top of his head on the floor and then pointed right.

[Heath]

And based on the angle of the bullet and the injury that he sustained before the shot that killed him, his assailant was believed to be someone who was a larger, or possibly larger and heavier than Bob, which is a good thing to note because I wouldn't describe Bob as, like, heavy, but he was A slightly huskier guy. And for reference, Mary Ellen was petite. At his funeral, of course, Mary Ellen was holding court as if she was hosting a party.

[Nicole]

Classic.

[Heath]

Like, in preparation for the event, she had flown to Las Vegas to pick out a fur coat while Bob's siblings were in shambles over the loss. At the time of the murder, Bob and Mary Ellen were still hammering out the details of their divorce agreement, meaning that she was still the beneficiary of his life insurance policy, as well as his estate. So she inherited both his home and his life savings, as well as a $250,000 payout from his life insurance policy. She also inherited the Subway sandwich shop, which, of course, she sold for a tidy profit. Because she's like, I don't want this fucking thing anymore.

[Nicole]

Fuck them sandwiches.

[Heath]

Yeah. But shockingly, or possibly not shockingly, she blew through this money. In only about a year, she and Nicole moved back into the house in which her husband was murdered and didn't even clean up the blood. Instead, she just simply placed a throw rug over it.

[Nicole]

That's crazy.

[Heath]

Insane. Like, first of all, why would you even move back into that place? Like, haunting, for sure.

[Nicole]

Cause she doesn't give a shit.

[Heath]

She doesn't care at all. Yeah. Instead of, like, cleaning up the blood, she's just, like, just throw something over it.

[Nicole]

That is beef.

[Heath]

Well, get this, because this is how she spent Bob's money. She bought herself a Porsche, paying $50,000 in cash for it, and a condo in Cancun for around $150,000 in cash, along with more fur coats and expensive custom lingerie. Then, just a few months after Bob's heinous murder, she threw herself a lavish birthday party, securing a country club as the venue where she and Nicole posed for glamour shots together, which I'm sure.

[Nicole]

Costs as much as, like, a normal person's wedding.

[Heath]

Yeah, she's just like, everything she does is, like, it has to be the biggest and the best. Like, even if she's gonna go broke, she's gonna spend all this money to secure a country club just for one day for her birthday.

[Nicole]

She's just not very wise.

[Heath]

Not at all. Well, she even purchased a pet parrot, whom she taught to make disparaging remarks about the police, and namely about Detective George Daly, who was investigating Bob's case.

[Nicole]

Like, why that is.

[Heath]

That is crazy. She literally bought a parrot to teach him how to say, like, fuck Bob, fuck George, screw the police. Like, what the hell, lady? Well, to ease her mind and to get away from the pulsing investigation, Mary Ellen escaped to her apartment in Cancun with her new fling, Dean Groover, but momentum on the case soon slowed and the lack of movement threatened to turn the murder cold. But then on May 1, 1989. So five months after his murder, LAPD officer John Bera received an anonymous tip from a man who claimed to know a lot of details about the murder of 40 year old Bob Samuels, telling the police that the murderer was James or Jimmy Bernstein, who just so happened to be Bob's daughter Nicole's fiance. Now is your time to get into a new Dr. Horton home by taking advantage of its national Red Tag sales event going on right now through July 20th. Stop by any of its participating communities and find select red tag homes at Incredible Pricing. So whether you're buying your first home or looking for an upgrade, you don't want to miss the red tag sales event going on right now. Discover the Dr. Horton Difference at Dr. Horton.com Dr. Horton America's Builder and Equal Housing Opportunity Builder Building a business may.

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[Nicole]

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[Ann]

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[Nicole]

You love like Birkenstock, Nike, Adidas and more at dsw. About six months after Bob's murder, a young man named Jimmy Bernstein allegedly told a friend named Rennie Goldberg that he was feeling regretful about a murder he committed and that he was terrified of being caught. He even apparently admitted that he wanted to confess his involvement to the police, but he was afraid of the woman who had hired him to carry out the murder, which was none other than than Mary Ellen Samuels. He was even considering moving out of the area altogether because that's how afraid he was of what he had gotten mixed up in. This informant was later confirmed to be a man named David Navarro, who claimed to be Jimmy's literal partner in crime because David explained to police later that Mary Ellen had unsuccessfully attempted to recruit him to carry out the murder first, but that Jimmy had actually taken her up on it. According to David, Mary Ellen's motives were simple. She wanted to pocket the insurance money and take control of Bob's estate as well as the sandwich shop so that she could sell it, which feels so her right. So after their separation, Mary Ellen began quietly searching for hitman to kill her husband, knowing that the life insurance payout would be sweeter than any alimony settlement she could finagle.

[Heath]

Yeah, because remember he was only going to be paying her about fifteen hundred dollars a month. And through this life insurance, she was going to get an ass load of money.

[Nicole]

But she was, I mean, which is just feels so ridiculous because he's the one who wanted to save the marriage. She's the one that wanted out because of her own actions of cheating. Yet she still thinks that she deserves everything, including everything that Bob has worked for. So she would go to seedy bars and nightclubs in the San Fernando Valley and seek out somebody who is willing to take on this task for her. And it's really sad because she asked various people to do this and nobody ever reported it. Like nobody ever said hey nine one one, this woman just asked me to kill her husband. You know, maybe because they didn't know if she was serious or not or they didn't care.

[Heath]

And she knew what she was doing. She was going to these seedy bars so that she could find a criminal that was willing to do this for her. And it's not like she, you know, was going to like upscale places looking for somebody to do this. She knew that she had to go to some dumpy dive bars.

[Nicole]

And she's a flirty woman. Like she's very cunning, she's very convincing, she's manipulative. It's on her side. So even if someone was disturbed by this, she could always kind of schmooze her way out of that as well. To be like, oh my God, I'm just kidding.

[Heath]

Yeah, like I would never do that.

[Nicole]

Yeah, she's in like a pretty good position here, honestly.

[Heath]

Well, at least one person actually did agree to go through with it, but wound up stealing the money from her instead.

[Nicole]

Ha ha ha.

[Heath]

So she literally paid this guy to murder her husband and he's like, nope, I'm just gonna take the money. So Mary Ellen used Nicole, her 16 year old daughter, to lure someone to do their bidding for them. Nicole once mentioned casually to her friend Selena that she needed to secure a gun and she even asked other students at school where she could obtain one. Encouraged or likely forced by her mom, Nicole started dating Jimmy Bernstein, a 27 year old drug dealer who kept to himself and wasn't really known to have many friends or any past romantic connections.

[Nicole]

Dating a 16 year old girl.

[Heath]

Yeah, he's 20. Like what the hell? And on top of this, Nicole was also seeing another older than her man on the side. Despite still being in high school, she actually even received proposals from both of these men and accepted both of them, reportedly switching the rings back and forth depending on which fiance she was with at the time.

[Nicole]

And it's really sad because she's so young and her mom probably was encouraging this kind of thing. And Nicole doesn't know any better. Her influence is her mom. That's where she learns stuff.

[Heath]

So monkey see, monkey do, right? So of course Mary Ellen seized the opportunity and confided in Jimmy that Bob was verbally, physically and sexually abusive to both her and Nicole claims, which Nicole corroborated, saying that he had started sexually assaulting her at just the age of.

[Nicole]

12, which is so devastating. And it's crazy because at the time that they were telling this to Jimmy, Nicole happened to have a bruise on her face and on her neck and she explained that Bob had been the one to do that to her. But in reality she had Just gotten a plastic surgery procedure. So we know that that was a lie.

[Heath]

That's so crazy that you blame your dad for these bruises, but really, you used his money to get plastic surgery.

[Nicole]

Instead, which, again, it was all her mom's. Her mom is setting this up and telling her daughter what to do.

[Heath]

But I also think that, you know, I get it. You're a teenager, but you're old enough to know that creating a story about your dad, Bob, like that is. Is a bad thing to do.

[Nicole]

Oh, absolutely. I mean, she definitely. She definitely did the wrong thing here.

[Heath]

So Mary Ellen offered him $1,500, which would be like around $4,000 today, to kill Bob. And Jimmy agreed. Selena remembered, quote, nicole called me the day after it happened. It's done. We went to the house. He was there. It didn't look messed up enough, so we messed it up some more. Yeah, I didn't want to know that. I didn't think it was gonna happen in the first place. So to be put in that situation, I just didn't know what to do at all.

[Nicole]

Assuming what Selena is saying is true, that kind of shows that Nicole really didn't seem to have that much care. Like, it's done. We went to the house, and he was there, and we made it look so messed up. Like, it doesn't really sound like you're distraught over it or like you're regretful of it.

[Heath]

Yeah, it's almost like she really is Mary Ellen's little sidekick because she's excited. She's like, oh, well, the house really didn't seem all that messed up. So me and my mom, we just, like, pushed a bunch of other stuff over to make it look real messy. So detectives attempted to get a story out of young Nicole, but wanting to protect her mom, she refused to help them pursue charges. Instead, both maintained their assertion that Bob was abusive. Tom Odle, who was the sergeant investigator, recalled, there was no proof found whatsoever that Bob was molesting Nicole when she was younger. We tried to interview Nicole, but she didn't want to talk to us.

[Nicole]

And I'm glad that they did look into this. They're trying to get the full picture and the full story, but by all accounts, it fully seems like they made that up.

[Heath]

Well, and despite their accusations, Mary Ellen didn't mention them in her Dear John letter asking for a divorce, and she also declined to include them in her complaint when filing for divorce. So you would think if that was a big enough issue, that she would have said something about it.

[Nicole]

Yeah, but it took her over two years when she's being questioned about his murder, that she pulls this out of a hat.

[Heath]

Yeah, it's very clear that it's bullshit.

[Nicole]

Well, allegedly. In the six months since Bob was killed, Mary Ellen was growing increasingly suspicious of Jimmy. Not suspicious that he did something because she hired him to do it. She was just concerned that he was a loose cannon and that he was going to run to the police with what he knew of what he did. And obviously, as we know now, the murder was something that he was very worried about having committed and he did want to confess. So, no longer in need of assistance, Nicole dumped Jimmy, who figured out then that he had been taken advantage of all along. Angry at the women and afraid of an imminent arrest, he mulled over reporting their scheme to the police. So Mary Ellen decided that he needed to die as well and set her sights on finding a second hitman to take out her first hitman.

[Heath]

This is literally hitman inception.

[Nicole]

Like, well, I've never heard of this. So she tapped a few of her barfly friends, Paul Gaul, that is his name, and Ball Gaul, and a friend of Paul's named Darryl Ray Edwards. Now, Paul was dating another one of Mary Ellen's young party going friends, Ann Hambly, who reportedly owed money to Mary Ellen, likely for purchasing drugs like cocaine. So she was eager to help in an effort to settle up her debt. She's saying, oh, you know, I'll help cover up this other murder if it means that I don't owe you money anymore, Mary Ellen. Now, on the night of Jimmy's murder, June 27, 1989, almost seven months after Bob's murder, Paul and Darryl borrowed Mary Ellen's car to take Jimmy out in. While heading home from a bar, Paul climbed into the backseat behind Jimmy, who was in the front passenger seat, and attempted to strangle him from behind while Daryl was driving. Now, Jimmy did manage to flee from the car, but Paul and Daryl chased him down, strangling him and throwing his body down a ravine of Lockwood Canyon in Ventura County, California, which is just north of Los Angeles County. It's just the county just north of Los Angeles County. So they then headed back to meet up with Ann to celebrate what they had done. They. They seriously were doing that before Mary ellen paid them $5,000 for their work. A month later, Jimmy's body was pulled from the ravine. Detectives spoke with his brother, who pointed them toward David Navarro, his friend and fellow drug dealer, for more information. And that's when David admitted that he was the anonymous informant who had Tipped off police about Mary Ellen Samuels. So it was really good for Jimmy that he had confided about what he did to his friend David, because now David's like, oh, I know what happened. Fueling more suspicions against her was a phone card found at Jimmy's apartment, which showed a history of calls to both Mary Ellen and Nicole. Which might not be weird, but there were so many calls to them on the night that Bob was murdered that it made him look really suspicious and made them look really suspicious, like, there was a need for them to all chat consistently over that evening. They also discovered that shortly after Bob's murder, Jimmy took out a life insurance policy on himself to the tune of $25,000, naming Nicole as the beneficiary, Meaning Mary Ellen had played Jimmy, too, you know, trying to get his insurance money for his death through her daughter Nicole, because Bob's money wasn't enough. Now she's saying, oh, I. I could do this again.

[Heath]

It's like, you have a bad person in Jimmy who's a drug dealer and also a murderer, but then you have an even worse person in Mary Ellen. Like. Like, I kind of. No, I don't feel bad. I don't. I was going to say I feel bad because it's like Jimmy's also a predator. Yeah, he, like, fell in love with Nicole, but she played his ass, too.

[Nicole]

But it's interesting to see that he at least somewhat had a conscience because the only reason that he agreed to kill Bob is because he was under the impression that Bob had assaulted and abused his fiance. That is true, but that doesn't make him a good guy. It just means that he was doing something that he thought was right. Well, but it wasn't.

[Heath]

He was also a pedophile.

[Nicole]

Well, yeah.

[Heath]

You know, at the end of the.

[Nicole]

Day, he's not a good guy.

[Heath]

He was 27, and his girlfriend was 16. Like, what the.

[Nicole]

And he had been mixed up in so many other things, but it is kind of crazy that he was. He was played so hard.

[Heath]

So after the discovery of Jimmy's body, Mary Ellen was brought back in for questioning. She told a detective that she had at one point mentioned wanting to kill her husband to a man in a bar because she was madder than hell at Bob at this point and thought that perhaps he took it seriously.

[Nicole]

So she's already trying to use that. Oh, well, I was just kidding.

[Heath]

I was just kidding. But this guy actually did do it. Like what? Well, when he asked her why they would be talking about that at a bar, she Said smugly. You'd be surprised the conversations that happen in a bar. Anne, who remember was the hitman Paul Gaul's girlfriend was brought in for questioning as well. And Mary Ellen started to panic that she was gonna squeal.

[Nicole]

Too many people know about these murders.

[Heath]

Yeah. And Ann in turn was worried that Mary Ellen was gonna come after her next. So she told investigators everything. Finally somebody told investigators everything so that, you know, Mary Ellen couldn't keep putting hits on people.

[Nicole]

Well, and it kind of works out for Anne because she had this debt with Mary Ellen and Mary and she was afraid that Mary Ellen was going to come for her and she wasn't directly involved with the murder. So she's just kind of like, I can get Mary Ellen and police off my ass. It's kind of a win win for her to explain this, except for she is outing her boyfriend. So not fully win win.

[Heath]

Well, he was a bad guy too, so yeah. So on January 26, 1990, 13 plus months after Bob was murdered, 41 year old Mary Ellen was finally arrested when her home was searched. Investigators found a now infamous Polaroid photograph of her quote, clothed only with the blood money of her husband. As reported by the LA Times. She was laying naked in bed, papered in $20,000 in hundred dollar bills, which earned her the nickname the Green Widow.

[Nicole]

And I just gotta say we're gonna post the photo because you can't see like her body at all really. But it's such a, it's such an awkward photo. It's not a sexy photo of like ah, laying naked in this cash. Like she's, she's laying with her legs straight out in front of her and her arms straight by her sides and then she's looking at the camera smiling. So she's like straight bodied, like it's a really awkward picture.

[Heath]

It is very cringy and also just like the fact that she even thought to take this photo also.

[Nicole]

Who took this picture?

[Heath]

Yeah, I have no idea. But you guys really gotta go to our socials and check it out. Detective George Daly mused. You know what people say about black widows? Well, she's a green widow. It's the same thing as a black widow which eats its mate when he's no longer useful to her. She was a very cunning predator. Meanwhile, after her mother's arrest, Nicole, in her early twenties at this point married a man named Lynn Moriganu and the pair had a son together. So the prosecution felt strongly that she was involved. But she was just referred to as an unindicted Co conspirator. Even after Mary Ellen's trial, the state of California considered pursuing charges against Nicole, stating that there was no statute of limitations on murder. But for some reason, they just ended up not doing that.

[Nicole]

Mary Ellen's murder trial commenced in March of 1994 and lasted for four months. Nicole testified on her mother's behalf at trial, affirming 45 year old Mary Ellen's allegations that Bob was abusive and denying any involvement in the murder for hire plot, which, as we know, her friend Selena came out and said, no, she was a part of it. You know, she said all this. Even Selena said, I didn't want to know about it. And she told me about it and I was really upset because I didn't want to know. So it really, I fully believe that Nicole completely lied on the stand.

[Heath]

Oh, she definitely did.

[Nicole]

And instead they just both claimed that they had been framed by Jimmy, Paul and Daryl. Surprisingly, even six years after the murder, Nicole seemed undeterred in her unwavering defense of and love for her mother. Like during one court recess, Mary Ellen smiled and mouthed, I love you. To which Nicole responded, I love you more. There was also an array of flimsy defenses lobbed by Mary Ellen and her defense team. For example, at one point she alleged that the police were unfairly coming after her because she had rejected their advances and refused offers for dates from multiple officers. What? She thinks very highly of herself. But they literally found receipts for checks written to both hitmen. And Mary Ellen couldn't explain why she had this when, you know, they would have only been for one logical reason, because she had hired them to kill for her. Like, they're like, hey, so what are these receipts for these checks for Jimmy and then Paul and Daryl? And she's like, I don't know.

[Heath]

I wouldn't be surprised if she literally put for murder.

[Nicole]

Literally, she would. Deputy District Attorney Jan Morrise did not hold back when describing her as selfish, manipulative, a predator, the mastermind of two evil plots. Jan addressed the jury during court saying, I ask you for a verdict of death for all the selfish and inhumane decisions she made in her life. I ask you, ladies and gentlemen, how many bodies does it take? We're talking about murder for the sake of the almighty dollar. However, Mary Ellen's defense attorney, Josh Groschen responded with quote, mary Ellen is a woman who lost her way in life. Call it a midlife crisis. Can you say she is so without redeeming value that you can say to her, you deserve to die and I can Kill you. Is she that far gone? And like, I would say so. It's not like she made a mistake. Like she plotted the murder of her loving, amazing husband that nobody had a bad thing to say about, accused him of abusing her and her daughter.

[Heath]

Roped her daughter into the whole scenario.

[Nicole]

Yeah. Got her daughter to be engaged to an older man and then hired other people to kill another man. Like, yeah, you're the repeat offender type, but you're literally a repeat offender.

[Heath]

You cannot be free.

[Nicole]

So ultimately, the jury was not buying her courthouse act. They were not buying any of this. They did not think that she was this innocent, poor woman. So she was convicted of murder on July 1, 1994.

[Heath]

On September 16, 1994, Mary Ellen was sentenced to death, joining only four other women on death row in California at the time. In the wake of the sentence, Bob's sister Susan told the press, I'm delighted she gave the exact same sentence to my brother. I think it's exactly what she deserves. Susan attended almost every day of the four month trial sporting a button with a picture of her brother on it. So as you can imagine, as the defense attempted to paint a portrait of her beloved brother as a abusive alcoholic and a pedophile, she had trouble maintaining her composure. Darryl and Paul both received prison sentences of 15 years to life after pleading guilty to second degree murder and also testifying against Mary Ellen. And both men were actually paroled in 2009. On the flip side, Nicole never faced any legal ramifications for her involvement in her father's murder and has managed to remain out of the spotlight since the trials. In November of 2019, the U.S. district Court of the Central District of California reversed Mary Ellen's death sentence, citing that the defense should not have permitted the prosecution's use of the mother daughter glamour portraits and the history of Mary Ellen's drug selling and use. Though the court maintained that the outcome of guilt was likely the same, they felt that these additions greatly swayed the decision to to invoke the death penalty. So six years after avoiding the death penalty and 31 years after receiving her sentence, Mary Ellen is still in prison. She's now 78 years old and locked up at the Central California Women's Facility in Chowchilla, California.

[Nicole]

Foreign thank you so much everybody for listening to this episode of Going West.

[Heath]

Yes, thank you guys so much for listening to this episode. What a crazy story. I don't think I've ever heard of someone hiring a hitman to count to kill her other hitman.

[Nicole]

I know I don't think I have either. I'm so glad that you found this case. What a freaking story. And I just, my heart goes out to Bob's family having to hear all that wickedness in the trial that again, there's no actual proof of. Like, that must have just been so hard for them.

[Heath]

Absolutely. And I just want to mention if you guys want to see photos from this case, head on over to our socials. We're on Instagram @goingwest podcast and we're also on Facebook. And real quick, before we leave, you guys going west is going on tour with Love Murder in September. We're going to be going to Denver, Dallas, Boston, Atlanta and Chicago. So get your tickets today, head on over to goingwestpod.com/tour.

[Nicole]

Yeah, we are going to have so much fun. Can't wait to see you guys there. But before then, we will see you on Friday for another episode.

[Heath]

All right, guys. So for everybody out there in the.

[Nicole]

World, don't be a stranger. Sam SA.

[Ann]

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