Dr. Andrew Spencer (3:09)

Thank you very much, Max. Good to be here.

Matt Lewis (3:12)

You say that now. We've given you an incredibly tricky task here. We're going to try and deal with one of the most significant medieval kings of England in under an hour. And there is so much to pack in that we're going to try and fly through the whole of his life and try and give people a picture of the whole of Edward I. So if you're up for the challenge, we're going to strap ourselves in and we're going to see how far we can get through the life of Edward. I guess, first of all, to give us a little bit of context, can you just tell us who Edward is? Who are his parents? Where does he sit in the line of medieval kings? What kind of time are we talking about for his life?

Dr. Andrew Spencer (3:48)

So Edward is born in 1239, so roughly 20 years into his father's reign. His father is Henry III. Henry III is the son of King John, so we're talking 13th century. And Edward dies in 1307, so at the beginning of the 14th century. So really his life covers most of the 13th century, in particular in an English context. The aftermath of Magna Carta. And much of Edward's kingship and life is really about the monarchy adapting to a Magna Carta kingship. His father, as I said, is Henry III, who came to the throne in 1216 at the age of nine. And by the mid-1230s, he's looking around for a wife. He has some difficulty in actually securing one, until finally he manages to secure Eleanor of Provence, who is the Provence region in what is now France, but at the time was in the Holy Roman Empire. And she marries Henry in 1236 at a relatively young age. There is then a three year gap and there is some talk, gossip that, oh, maybe she's not going to produce a child. And Edward's birth is, or conception is actually very dramatic. Nine months before he was born, someone breaks into the royal apartments with the intention of killing Henry ii. But he's not there, he's in the Queen's apartments. And so historians tend to think that this was actually the moment at which Edward I was conceived. Maybe, maybe not, but, yeah. So he's born in June 18th of June 1239, and grows up in the 1240s and 1250s, an important time in his father's reign, what's known as the personal rule of Henry III. And by the mid-1250s, the future of England is Edward is coming to embody that. And there starts to be a battle in Henry's court over control of the future. Edward I, of course, it's a very strange name. We should perhaps focus on that. Edward.

Matt Lewis (6:09)

Yeah. I was going to pick up on the name because it's not a Norman name at all, is it?

Dr. Andrew Spencer (6:14)

It's not a Norman name, of course. It's an English name and would have sounded very strange to people around court other than, of course, Edward the Confessor, and that is whom Edward I is named after. It's slightly weird that we call him Edward I when he's actually Edward iii, I think. But he's named after the Confessor, who is his father's patron saint. Henry is very devoted to Edward the Confessor starts to rebuild Westminster Abbey around the time in which Edward is born. Henry's second son, Edward's younger brother, is called Edmund, named after another Anglo Saxon, St. Edmund of East Anglia. So these are two very odd names. But as is common, once the King chooses the names Edward and Edmund, you start to see those names appearing amongst the aristocracy and indeed even across the Channel in France. Edouard becomes, you know, quite a. Not a common name, but not unknown, probably the first time.

Matt Lewis (7:19)

Yeah. It's interesting that Henry chooses that and that Edward then is growing up with, I mean, some pressure. His dad's named him after his favorite saint. He's also named him after what we would consider to be more kind of English, Anglo Saxon, pre Norman. Is there any nationalism involved here? Is it simply Henry's worship of Edward the Confessor, or is there a little bit of a signal here of a more emergent sense of Englishness in naming his son Edward?

Dr. Andrew Spencer (7:47)

I think that's a tricky one to answer. I think there is. I suspect it's more to do with his devotion towards Edward the Confessor and Edmund. Now, does that have an English national element to it? I think maybe a little bit. I mean, Henry's in lots of ways a contradiction. He names his children after English saints. And one could argue and say, well, this is a consequence of the English monarchy now being based in England, really, after the loss of Normandy and the loss of the French lands under King John. The English king, having spent roughly two thirds of his time outside of England in the 12th century, is now based in England nearly all of the time. So one could see this as part of a recognition and acceptance of that and a desire to sort of promote that. But then, on the other hand, Henry spends much of the 1230s, 1240s and 1250s, trying either to restore his lands in France or seeking to expand elsewhere with his attempts to get his younger son Edmund, as made of King of Sicily. So it's difficult, it's always difficult to see into the minds of medieval actors. So I think one could take it in either way, especially Henry iii.

Matt Lewis (9:05)

Do we get any sense of what Edward was like in terms of either his personality or physically? You know, we know he will earn the nickname Longshanks to do with his height. Do we have a sense of what he looks like? And also, does he inherit that famous Plantagenet temper? Do we know much about his personality as he grows up?

Dr. Andrew Spencer (9:25)

Yeah, so great questions. So let's start with the what he looks like. Yeah, Long shanks. He has very long legs. When his tomb is opened in the 18th century in Westminster Abbey, he's measured at 6 foot 2. He was 67 when he died. And I always remember my grandfather shrinking as he got older. So I reckon he was probably more like 6 foot 4 when he was in the prime of life. Chronicler describes him as having sort of almost silver hair when he was a boy. It turns to golden and then it turns to black when he is mature and then to sort of snow white by the time, you know, he's. He's an old man. He was supposed to be a very great wielder of the sword. He clearly stood at 6 foot 2, 6 foot 4, whatever we're going to call it. He's head and shoulders above everybody else. He looks and feels like a king, with perhaps two exceptions. One is he inherits from his father, who's a man of middle height. Nobody says Henry is, you know, particularly tall or anything. He inherits a drooping eye. So one eye is sort of drooped down slightly. And also a lisp, a slight lisp. So in some ways he might not sound like a king. Although the chronicler, Trevor, says, you know, although he has this lisp, it doesn't. It didn't stop him from being very eloquent in argument.

Matt Lewis (10:53)

And also, given his size, it would be a brave person who would point out his lisp to him.

Dr. Andrew Spencer (10:56)

I think that's right. And he absolutely inherited the Plantagenet temper. There's a very famous story in the 1290s where Edward is taxing the church very heavily and the dean of St. Paul's is designated by the convocation to come and talk to Edward to ask him to reduce the tax. And he approaches Edward and is so frightened about what's going to happen that he has a heart attack and dies. So Edward's sort of reputation of fierceness and fearsomeness sort of goes abroad. I mean, as a young man he gets in with a sort of fast set and there are some sort of dark stories. The chronicler Matthew Paris, who dies in 1259, is writing in the late 1250s about Edward and his friends sort of running about the country, you know, behaving quite poorly as sort of, you know, Bullingdon set type, trashing places and, you know, attacking people. And this one, and he laments and thinks, gosh, you know, if this is what, if this is what the youth is going to be like, what's it going to be like when he grows up? So there is. And the. At the time of Henry III's civil war, the Barons War in the 1260s, there's, there's a fair amount of sort of negative commentary about Edward's personality by some of Henry's opponents, which we might want to touch upon a bit later.

Matt Lewis (12:24)

Yeah, definitely. It's interesting. And Edward has a really long apprenticeship before he becomes king. He packs an awful lot in before he even becomes King Edward. I. Do you think that has a significant impact on him, his experiences as Prince Edward? For want of a better term, we'll call him Prince Edward. Do you think that has an impact on him? Because I'm struck that quite often we see people who are, are born and raised to be king and become kings sort of into their adult lives. It's not always a good recipe. It can lead to bad kings. Does his apprenticeship serve him well?

Dr. Andrew Spencer (12:59)

Yeah, I think it does and I think for it's. I mean, I would sort of put it the other way in that it tends to be the young kings that, that do badly. I think Edward doesn't, I mean, becomes King at 33 and doesn't return to England until he's 35. So really he's not sort of acting in England as king until the age of 35, which as you say, is really rather old for a medieval king. So he has had this very long apprenticeship and I think it is very useful for him in a few ways. One is it allows him to make mistakes when he's not king. Young people. I work at a university with young people and lots of research shows that young people take lots of risks and make lots of mistakes between the ages of 14 and 25. And Edward makes a fair number of mistakes between the ages 14 and 25, but he's not the king when he makes those mistakes, so they matter slightly less than they do for, let's say, Richard II, when he's making mistakes in his teens and early 20s. So that's helpful for him. It's also helpful for him, I think, in that he gets to know everybody, so he starts to develop his own relationships, both with the sort of older generation, but also with the generation that is going to come through of nobles and household knights. And so there are people that he feels that he comes to learn that he can trust. And I think that that is really helpful for him when he becomes king. And then I think also in lots of ways, the disasters of Henry III's reign and the 1260s are helpful for Edward when he becomes king, because things have gone so badly wrong. And England has turned really vicious and violent in the 1260s in a way it hadn't really done before, really. Well, not since the anarchy in King Stephen's reign. Really, I think that's the most serious and prolonged pieces of violence in England. And I think there is a sense that when Edward comes to the throne, that actually we're going to cut him a bit more slack than we don't want to return to. We know where opposing the king and violence leads, and we really don't want that. And one of Edward's great achievements as king is that he's the first king since the Norman Conquest not to face an armed rebellion from his English subjects. So I think the apprenticeship really helps. One can see another very good example of an apprentice king who makes his mistakes early and benefits from them when he becomes king is Henry V. So I think there are some advantages to that, and I think Edward takes full advantage of that long period to learn the craft of kingship, to learn what his father was good at and might not have taken that long, and to learn what he was bad at and what he wanted to do differently.

Matt Lewis (16:04)

I was gonna say that's a bit of a burn on Henry iii, but it's probably fair. Edward is also married when he becomes king. So could you tell us a little bit about when he gets married, who he marries, and kind of why this bride? Is there a political motivation or a romantic one to the choice of his marriage?

Dr. Andrew Spencer (16:22)

Yep. There's no romance whatsoever at the start. He is. Classic medieval marriage. It's designed to stop a war from happening. So he marries Eleanor of Castile. So a Spanish princess, she's the sister of the king of Castile, and her brother Alfonso, has designs on Gascony. He is descended from one of Henry II's daughters and so has a residual claim upon upon the duchy of Aquitaine, or what remains of the Duchy of Aquitaine in southwest France, which is the only bit of the Plantagenet empire, the Angevin Empire, that survives in the hands of the English kings. And in the early 1250s, Simon de Montfort has been governor of Aquitaine, of Gascony has stirred up a lot of resentment amongst the Gascon nobles and they start to look across the Pyrenees to Castile and suggests that maybe Alfonso might want to activate his claim. Henry heads this off at the pass by offering a marriage between Eleanor and Edward. Alfonso makes sure that Edward and his sister gets as much out of it as possible. So Edward is given control of Gascony. He's given the. The royal lands in Wales, he's given the earldom of Chester, he's given Ireland, he's given huge estates across the Plantagenet dominions to such an extent that Matthew Paris says, oh, Henry has mutilated himself as a king by giving away so many lands. Now these are given away in name only. And that's part of Edward's frustration, actually. Henry and Eleanor of Provence, his mother, really continue to run the estates for a number of years after Edward's marriage in 1254. Now, having said that, there's no romance in the relationship. Romance clearly develops between Edward and Eleanor. They have 12 or 14 children. She accompanies him everywhere, including on crusade. They are an immensely close and loving couple. And it is one of the, in many ways, one of the great sort of medieval romance stories. And when she dies, the series of Eleanor crosses that Edward creates for her, from marking the journey from her death place in Lincolnshire down to Westminster, the last of which is Charing Cross in London, are a fitting monument to the love that does grow within medieval narratives. We tend to be sort of quite cynical about, you know, medieval marriages, but they think about marriage in a different way to the way that we do. We fall in love and get married, they get married and then hopefully fall in love. And that's clearly what happened with Edward. Elena.

Matt Lewis (19:19)

Yeah. I do think the Eleanor crosses might be an episode all of their own, hadn't they? It is a beautiful story. When do we see Edward become more kind of politically active in his father's kingdom? So I guess one of the first things that he does is the 1258 provisions of Oxford. He backs those sort of against his father. So is that a bid to strike out on his own, or does he genuinely oppose his father's policies at this point?

Dr. Andrew Spencer (19:47)

Yeah. So, I mean, Edward's positioning during what becomes known as period of reform and Rebellion or later, the barons wars is complex and is a sort of combination of Edward's own needs as a magnate, let's call him the greatest magnate in the realm, which is probably what he is at this point, and his developing political ideas. So in some ways it comes about because of the situation in Wales. Edward, as I said, was given the royal lands in Wales. And in 1257, the most powerful remaining native Prince of Wales, Llywelyn ap Griffith of Gwynedd, crosses into English lands in what are known as the Four Cantrifs, which are sort of between Cheshire and Gwynedd, Flintshire and that sort of area around there, northeast Wales, defeats Edward's forces and Edward is left in a very sort of difficult situation. His father isn't really able to support him. And in many ways it's that rebellion in 1257 in Wales that precipitates the crisis of 12 state, which leads to the provisions of Oxford and Henry's power being taken away. Initially, Edward opposes that because he's allied himself with one particular group at Henry's court, which is the Lusignans, which are Henry's half brothers from Poitou in southern France, but then allies himself with Simon de Montfort in late 1258, 1259, and starts, I think, his influence by Montfort's thoughts about reform, but also he is seeking independence gradually. As the reform period develops, Edward can see that what Mountfort and the reformers are doing is taking away power from the crown. And when he becomes king, he does not want that situation to continue. You can see many of their ideas about reform are important and need to be pursued, but he wants the keen to pursue them rather than them being pursued by a barrenial council.

Matt Lewis (22:08)

I guess for Edward, it's a slightly delicate balance, isn't it, because he might believe that those reforms are necessary or required, but he can't strip power from the crown that he's hoping to inherit one day, because that's his own future power that he's allowing to be taken away.

Dr. Andrew Spencer (22:22)

Exactly. And he feels that the best vehicle for delivering reform and a reform that's going to last is going to be through the crown. And so I think that that's where he comes to in about 1261, when Henry regains power temporarily in 1261. Edward is very much on his side by that point and remains on his side throughout. It's complicated by the fact that many of Edward's friends are enemies of his mother, or at least in tension with his mother. And so that takes another Couple of years to sort of work out so that by the time we get to 1263, the sides are drawn basically, and Edward is very firmly on the royalist side, along with his close friends. And I mean, actually there are many more Royalists in 1263 than there are baronial supporters, at least among the magnates. But one of Sim d' Amfort's sort of great achievements is a militarily, he outmaneuvers both Henry and Edward in 1264, but also he has significant support from some of the lesser landowners, what we would later call the gentry, but also from significant towns, including London.

Matt Lewis (23:30)

I want to talk a little bit about Edward's role in that period of the second Barons War. We have covered this in a bit more depth in episodes on Henry III's reign. But from Edward's kind of point of view, what is his role? Because it always strikes me that he gets captured at Lewis and I feel like he's tricked by Simon at Lewis and maybe feels a bit embarrassed and enraged and that Evesham is almost just about revenge for Lewis as much as it is about you freeing Henry and everything else. What do you think are Edward's kind of motivations in the second Baron's war? What is driving him and what is he hoping to get out of the end of it?

Dr. Andrew Spencer (24:10)

Yeah, good question. So I think at Lewis, it's a close run thing. Edward mates a classic battlefield mistake. He is leading one wing of the, of the Royalist army. He breaks the Londoners, chases them off the field. By the time he gets back, Simon has won the battle against his father. Now Edward at that point has a decision to make and it's a really interesting decision that he takes at Lewis when he comes back to the battlefield in that he doesn't have to surrender. He could have done what many of the Royalist barons do, which is essentially fly to the coast, go over to France where his mother is and where his younger brother are, and, you know, develop a, you know, force there and reinvent what he does. And it's, it's, it's one of the sort of, I think, lesser known and more endearing things about Edward is that what he does is he feels he needs to be with his father. So he rides to Lewis Priory, which is where Henry has sort of taken refuge, and he goes there to be with Henry and they surrender together. And I think that's a very honorable act. And what it does in some ways is it's, it is, it has some political access to it in that Henry they surrender to actually they don't surrender to. To Simon, they surrender to Gilbert the Clare, the Earl of Gloucester. So they are thinking quite politically, I think, in that it's quite a neat.

Matt Lewis (25:38)

Tactic, isn't it, to undermine Simon just a little bit.

Dr. Andrew Spencer (25:40)

Exactly so. And I think that they feel, well, by this. In this way, then perhaps rather more royal power can be preserved. It doesn't really work out like that. Simon, gradually, over the course of the next year, really strips both Henry and Edward of any power and influence that they have. And in January, the January Parliament of 1265, very famous Parliament, where the Commons and burgesses are summoned. Edward is. It's a huge piece of daylight robbery. Edward's estates are essentially stripped from him and handed over to Simon and his sons. And Henry and Edward, in front of everybody, are forced to swear that they will agree with this arrangement of government that Simon has come up with, and that if they ever try to undermine it, then people are able to rebel against them. It is one of the most humiliating moments for the Crown at any point in the Middle Ages. Far more humiliating than Magna Carta, in that under Magna Carta, John is still king, he still has power. It's just that he's being monitored in how he's doing it. In this. Henry and Edward have no power. It's all been taken away. The royal estates are being taken away from them. It's massively humiliating. And I think that it's revenge for that as much as for anything else, that what happens at Eveshin happens. I think it is also, though, it's a political recognition that we will not be able to move forward unless Simon de Montfort is dead at this point. They don't, you know, there has not been an execution of an English earl since 1076, 1075. You don't execute people at this point. So what happens at Evesham is essentially what happens at Hastings, which is that Edward, echoing William the Conqueror, develops a death squad led by Roger Mortimer of Wigmore, with the sole purpose of killing Simon de Montfort. And Montfort is killed along with many of those around him. One chronicler describes it as the murder of Evesham for battle. It was none. And I think, yeah, there is. That's. That there is a, you know, a. Both a personal and a political motive going on there. And it does bring to a, you know, not quite immediately to a close, but it does tidy things up somewhat in a rather grisly way. Yeah.

Matt Lewis (28:01)

And after the end of the barons war, so Simon de Montfort is done away with and we enter this period of kind of relative peace, Henry is sort of back in control. It seems to me that he's leaning on Edward a little bit more during this period. But then also Edward goes off on crusade. It's so hard to do Edward's life in a nutshell, isn't it? Because he's done all of that already and now he's gonna head off to the Holy Land, which, again, you know, is a massive episode in any medieval person's life. And for a future king of England to be heading off on crusade is absolutely massive news. Why do you think that Edward chooses to go, given that his father is aging, doesn't have the best track record as a ruler, has been, I think, leaning on Edward a fair bit during this period of his reign. Why does Edward pick this moment to head off to the Holy Land?

Dr. Andrew Spencer (28:55)

Right, okay. So I think, again, there are a number of factors involved. I think one is Edward's own devotion. You know, the. The Holy Land is. Is regarded as the ultimate crusade, is the ultimate destination for a night. You know, it is to, you know, the best way to. To act in a nightly manner is to go on crusade. I think Henry himself had taken a crusading vow and had been criticized for not fulfilling it, or then for intending to fulfill it by going to Sicily and fighting fellow Christians in Sicily rather than going and fighting the Muslims in the Holy Land. So I think perhaps there is a sense of unfinished business, family business.

Matt Lewis (29:41)

And it's also an interesting connection to his father. Again, like you said, he goes to Lewis Priory to be with his father. And Edward is almost willing to fulfill his father's crusading vow, which he knows Henry can't. So Edward is sort of stepping in and supporting each other.

Dr. Andrew Spencer (29:56)

I think that's right. There is also the role of Louis IX of France. So this is not an English crusade. It is a French crusade designed to be led by Louis ix. Louis IX has emerged and France has emerged under Louis IX as the premier kingdom in Europe, taking over really from the Holy Roman Empire, which sort of falls into a period of dispute and civil war under Frederick II and his successors. So France emerges, Louis emerges as the preeminent monarch in Europe to the extent that actually in trying to resolve the barons wars, Henry and the barons appeal to Louis to adjudicate, which he does. Supports Henry and the baron's den liner, of course. But so Louis has his own desire after his disastrous first crusade to put things right. And so this is the big European adventure. And I think Edward doesn't want to miss out on that. I think he's reasonably confident that by this point England will be peaceful. It's notable he doesn't take his oath until 1268, at which point, really, the aftermath of the Barons war, the rather messy aftermath of the Barons war has been settled both amongst the English rebels and the situation in Wales has been temporarily settled as well by the Treaty of Montgomery. So I think that there is this breathing space, this moment when he can go abroad and I think he's relatively confident that the men who will be left behind to support Henry and then to take things on if he were to be away, and I say men and we should include in that Eleanor of Provence and Henry's wife and Edward's mother, that actually England will be in safe hands while he is away. And that does actually turn out to be the case. So it's, yeah, a number of combinations I think, bring things together to make Edward feel that he wants to go on Crusade. I mean, it turns out to be a bit of a damp squib. By the time he arrives, thinking he wants to go, he wants to go to the Holy Land, Louis has been persuaded that actually the Crusade should go to Tunis. By the time Edward arrives in Tunis, Louis is dead and all the French contingent decide they want to go home. But Edward decides, no, I'm going to go on, I'm going to fulfill my vow, I'm going to go to the Holy Land. He goes to Acre, the last remaining Christian stronghold in Outremer, doesn't do very much there, launches a couple of raids and then the Christians agree at a long truce with the Sultan, which Edward doesn't really agree with. So the Sultan tries to have him murdered. There is a famous assassination attempt which Edward survives, single handedly kills the assassin who's been sent to murder him, but is poisoned in the process.

Matt Lewis (32:45)

And we should say it's an assassination attempt by the actual assassins.

Dr. Andrew Spencer (32:49)

Yeah, that's right. So they're engaged by the Sultan to attack Edward and he sort of poses as a messenger basically and wants to talk to Edward one on one gets him one on one and attacks him with a poisoned dagger. Edward overpowers him and kills him, but is poisoned in the process. One of the sort of apocryphal later stories is that his wife Eleanor sucks the poison out of the wound. A more contemporary one says that she was in tears and was led away. And actually it was a man called Otto de Grandison, who was one of Edward's knights, who does the deed.

Matt Lewis (33:24)

I mean, an incredible life to this point already. And he's just about to become King of England as well, while he's not even in England.

Dr. Andrew Spencer (33:31)

Yeah, that's right. So he learns. His father dies in November 1272. Edward leaves on crusade in the late summer of 1270. He takes a long time to come back. He goes through Italy, visits the Pope, wants to chase down two of Simon de Montfort's sons who are in Italy and have murdered his cousin. And their cousin, Henry of Almaine, is famously murdered in Viterbo Cathedral. And then Spens goes to Gascony and is the last English monarch to visit Gascony whilst King and spends time there ordering the estate, going off to do homage to the King of France, and finally doesn't get back to England until August 1274. So more than 18 months after he's actually become King.

Matt Lewis (34:24)

That in itself is quite a bold decision, isn't it, given the history you mentioned the anarchy a little bit earlier. That is essentially born out of this idea that someone will jump into the breach when the throne is vacant. Does Edward not worry that he ought to get back quicker?

Dr. Andrew Spencer (34:41)

Well, I mean, it is a really interesting point. His succession is the first undisputed succession, really. Gosh. Since again, since whenever before the conquest, really. One could go back to, oh, gosh, Aethelred the Unready, maybe arguably in 10th century. So in one way it's a gamble, but in another way, I think it speaks to Edward's success and Henry's success at the end of the reign in sort of creating a sense of peace and obvious continuity. I mean. I mean, there isn't another obvious person who's going to try and seize the throne. This is the advantage that the Plantagenets have developed by the. Under Henry III and for generations afterwards of it is clear who the king is, which is not the case before and not the case afterwards. Once we get into the 15th century, there are potential kings hanging about, Whereas in the 13th and 14th century it's obvious who the king is and nobody's really going to argue with it. So I think there is sort of sense of just. Well, yeah, and also just everyone knows.

Matt Lewis (35:52)

Don'T want any more war, thank you.

Dr. Andrew Spencer (35:53)

Edward's going to be a good king, so, yeah, let's not mess about.

Matt Lewis (35:56)

And Henry has, you know, his dad has slightly tweaked the law, hasn't he, to try and close that loophole of the kind of interregnum on the death of a king. So Edward is the first king to succeed immediately on his father's death without having to wait for his coronation. So he does have that kind of security blanket around him as well.

Dr. Andrew Spencer (36:14)

Absolutely. And when Henry dies, a number of the nobles and churchmen, they swear an oath. The government is now in the name of Edward. And I mean, it's an interesting fiction. There's a great sort of exchange between the Regents and Llywelyn at Griffith in Wales, where they write a letter to Llywelyn, essentially telling him to stop fighting the marcher lords. And they write it in Edward's name. You know, so this is coming from Edward and Llewellyn. Llewellyn writes back and sort of says, well, I know this isn't really from Edward because, you know, because he's not here and he wouldn't write in this way to me because he's got obligations to me. So there is this sort of delicate fiction being played out that actually Edward is fully in control, whereas actually it's the men that he had appointed in contingency, knowing that his father might die to carry on. And one of the things I think Edward is very good at is, is picking good administrators to run things for him.

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Matt Lewis (39:43)

I think as king, there are probably two things that people will most associate with Edward I. There's the conquest of Wales and the war with Scotland. Before we get to those, I just want to try and deal with a few things that there won't be things that people don't know about, but are perhaps the things we talk about a bit less during his reign. So one of those is his reforms to the legal system, because Edward is the one who starts to kind of properly codify in Parliament, create statutes for law that will apply across the whole of England. Why do you think Edward is keen to do that? Why the focus on the English law?

Dr. Andrew Spencer (40:23)

That's another really good question. And it's a really important part of Edward's kingship, as you say. We tend to focus on Wales and Scotland. But Edward's greatest achievement, I think, is as king of England and his development of the legal system. I think. How much of it is coming from Edward? I think a lot of it is coming from the generation of lawyers that are developing in the 13th century. The statutes aren't, you know, Edward's not sitting down writing the statutes himself. You know, these are being written by his justices. But he is very conscious and has become conscious of the need to bring these reforms in. And I think it's part of what is really the thread of Edward I's kingship throughout. And we can see it in his dealings with Wales and we can see it in his dealings with Scotland just as much as in England. His intention is to restore the power, prestige and importantly the rights of the monarchy, which he feels have been traduced during Henry's reign and particularly, of course, in the 1250s and 1260s. And Parliament is a key vehicle in which for doing this. And Edward is a parliamentary king, which again, is something we wouldn't necessarily think about in terms of Edward. We tend to think about Edward as this great domineering figure who imposes his rule upon others reluctantly. But Parliament has been developing during Henry III's reign, but it's very often a place of conflict and discussion and tension. In Henry III's reign, what Edward does through is to see that Parliament is a great vehicle for the development of royal authority. And if you pass a law in Parliament by bringing together the community of the realm, whether that is just the magnates and the lawyers, or very often in Edward's reign, the magnates, the lawyers, the churchmen and the Commons, that has a lot more force to it. You can't sort of turn around in Yorkshire and say, oh, well, this doesn't apply to me because I didn't agree to it. It was agreed in Parliament. And Parliament in Edward I's reign really starts to develop its functions. And those functions are in many ways similar to the functions it still has today, which is legislation, passing of laws, council. Edward takes counsel from those who come together in Parliament, petitioning. The idea of petitioning the King, petitioning the Crown in Parliament, we see that still today, petitions is an important part of parliamentary history. And Parliament today, the granting of taxation is another. And finally, Parliament as the highest court in the land. So what Edward really successfully does in the law and in politics is to make Parliament the centre of political discussion. But Parliament under the King's terms, whereby he listens to the concerns and then he acts upon them, and the opening words of the preamble to the first great parliamentary statute of Edward's reign, The Statute of Westminster, 1 in 1275, is a perfect sort of example of this. Edward says at the beginning, says, I've heard of all of these difficulties and problems. I've consulted broadly and these are my solutions. And I think looking at the preamble of those statutes gives a really good insight into the mind of Edward I, that he is prepared to. To listen to what experts, to listen to what his people are saying about the way in which England is being governed, and then he will consult and decide what to do about it, and then that will be pushed through in Parliament and then out into the country more broadly.

Matt Lewis (44:32)

It feels like a really smart move in terms of the fact that, as you say, Parliament is there now. It doesn't look like it's going anywhere. It has been a place of tension and he has seen what tension between the Crown and the barons did during his father's reign. So he embraces it, but he embraces it, as you say, very much on his terms, so that it becomes a. The King's vehicle Rather than being something that is butting into the king all of the time, it becomes a way for the King to deliver what he wants. And the king kind of flows through it, but has a grip on it which he might not otherwise have had if another king had chosen to go head to head with Parliament.

Dr. Andrew Spencer (45:08)

Absolutely. And so for the first 25 years or so of Edward's reign, really, the. The Parliament and the King work in consort with each other in a very effective way. And this is. In many ways, we tend to think of Edward as a great war leader, warmonger, depending on where you're sitting. But actually, the period from 1275, 1274, when Edward returns to 1294, when the war starts, first of all with France and then with Scotland, is one of the most peaceful and effective periods of government in English history. Really?

Matt Lewis (45:48)

Yeah, yeah. The second thing I wanted to deal with, outside of the biggies that we're going to get to, is the 1290 kind of expulsion of the Jewish population from England. This is something that lots of people will know Edward for It remains illegal to be a Jew in England essentially for almost 400 years after Edward does this. I wonder if you could give us an idea of kind of why Edward chooses to do this. Is it part of a wider antisemitism or is there something very particular about Edward that leads him to do this?

Dr. Andrew Spencer (46:23)

I don't think there's anything particular about Edward. I think we have to accept that medieval Europe is anti Semitic. Everybody is. And so, you know, it's not that, you know, Edward is more. More anti Jewish than any other king that comes before. Everybody essentially is anti Semitic. The Jews are characterized as Christ killers, as enemies of the faith. And it's quite. You know, I think there are two approaches that in the 13th century in England and more broadly within Europe, and this is not just an English phenomenon, Jews are expelled from all sorts of other polities within Europe at a similar time. But there are two basic approaches that one can take. One is. Or maybe three, actually. One is ghettoization. So isolating them within England, because the Jews perform a useful function from Christian society, which is money lending, essentially. They are a key way of raising money. And the other is conversion. The idea that actually what you really want to do in order to bring about the Second Coming is to get the Jews together and convert them to Christianity. Henry III wants to convert them. And the old National Archives, the old public record office, was on the site in Chancery Lane of Henry the Third's house of conversion. It doesn't work, the Jews don't want to be converted. But Henry uses the Jews in the 1240s and 1250s as a convenient way of raising money. The Jews are the King's personal property, which means he can tax them at any time he likes without having to get permission from anybody else, that is Parliament. So Henry taxes the Jews very, very heavily and essentially uses up their wealth so that by the time we get to Edward I's reign, the Jews are no longer really an effective economic weapon for. For the King in the way that they had been earlier in the 13th century and in the 12th century. So there isn't as much reason to keep them around for the King. Now, the Jews are very unpopular in part because of their money lending. Lots of people are in debt to the Jews and also various members of the royal family have bought up Jewish debts and then are using them to foreclose on landowners. And there's various sort of political debates about. Sorry, historical debates about the extent to which the gentry feel under pressure in the 13th century, in part because of the debts that they owe to the Jews. So in many ways, the pressure for the expulsion of the Jews actually comes from below. And in 1290, there is a series of political and legislative compromises that come together in the parliament of 1290 in order for Edward I to get the biggest tax of his reign, over £100,000, which is four times the annual revenue of the Crown. Edward has a great incentive to persuade Parliament to grant this tax. And part of the deal is that actually the Jews will be expelled. So I think Edward is not opposed to expelling the Jews. I'm not trying to create in any way the idea that Edward was as some savior of the Jews. He was not. He was quite happy to sacrifice them in order to gain the support of his subjects for a large grant of taxation. And essentially that's what happens. And that's why the Jews are expelled in 1290.

Matt Lewis (50:03)

Yeah, yeah. So, I mean, it's obviously something we would consider incredibly wrong and horrible, but we don't need to think of Edward being excessive or unique in his approach to this.

Dr. Andrew Spencer (50:15)

No, no. As I say, it's something we've seen Jews expelled from individual towns in England. Simon de Montfort expels the Jews from Leicester when he arrives. Edward's mother expels the Jews from her lands. The Jews by the late 1300 1200s are concentrated in very small number of areas compared to where they had been a century before. And elsewhere in Europe. Philip iv, for instance, in France, expels the Jews from France, temporarily. What's different about England is the leng. Length of time, actually, that they are expelled for is that it's Edward who expels them. And we remember that. What we forget is that all of the subsequent kings of England don't allow Jews to cut back. And it's not until Oliver Cromwell in the 1650s that the Jews returned to England.

Matt Lewis (51:05)

Yeah, yeah. The third thing that I wanted to cover before we just finally get to Wales and Scotland is Edward's relationship with. With Gascony, with France, and perhaps on the wider stage. How does Edward deal with his foreign policy? What is his relationship, particularly with France, like?

Dr. Andrew Spencer (51:23)

So in many ways, Edward wouldn't see it as foreign policy. You know, he sees it. You know, these are his lands in France. They are as important to him as his lands in England. He spends three years in the late 1280s in Gascony helping to sort things out there. What. What is difficult for Edward is that his English subjects do think of it as foreign and are less willing to spend their time and money defending Gascony than Edward would like. What Edward is dealing with, though, in the 1270s and 1280s is a relatively peaceful period in Anglo French relations in the aftermath of the Treaty of Paris, which sort of brings to an end King John and Henry III to wars. So Edward is able to develop a relatively stable and peaceful Gascony for much of the 1270s and 1280s, actually to expand the territories within Gascony through another treaty in 1279. And it's not really until the early 1290s that the Gascon question becomes open again. And in many ways, I think it's. I mean, it's really interesting how it becomes a live question. Once again. Part of it is structural. We talked about lawyers earlier on. Both the English and French monarchies are developing their own legal expertise, and lawyers don't like loose ends. And Gascony is a loose end, both from the English perspective and from the French perspective. For the French, they don't like the idea of another monarch having lands in France. That's dangerous. The English have always managed, have always used their position within France to stir up other French nobles against the French king, particularly their relations with the Dukes of Brittany and the Counts of Flanders and the areas in the Low Countries. And for the English, they don't like the idea of their king doing homage to another king. So your two obvious extremes in this sort of develops, really, by the time we get to the Hundred Years war in the 14th century. One is the idea of Gascony should be held in sovereignty, in sovereignty by the English crown. And the other is that the English should just be out of France altogether. And you can work out which side takes those two different views. So that's the structural part. And then I think there is a personal element to it as well, which is Edward, by the early 1290s, is in his 50s. He is the most famous, most well respected monarch in Europe. He is called upon as a peacemaker. When the kings of Aragon and Sicily fall out with each other. Everybody knows if there's going to be another Crusade, Edward is going to be the person to lead it. So he has this sort of very strong reputation. And then we have a young, thrusting, ambitious king of France who is in his late teens, early 20s, and resents the fact that one of his subjects, as he sees it, is more prestigious, more respected than he is. And I think that there is always this faction at the French court that is anti English, want to see the English pushed out of France and they sort of get control or get closest to Philip and start telling him the things that he wants to hear. And we start to see tension developing in the early 1290s over disputes in the Channel between English, Gascon and Norman sailors. And Philip and those around him in the French court use this as an excuse to summon Edward to the Parlement of Paris and to put pressure on the English position in Gascony. Edward is keen to avoid a war. A because he doesn't want to fight the French, France is much bigger and more powerful than England, and B because he wants to go on Crusade trust. Acre Falls in 1291. Edward has taken the cross in the late 1280s, is determined to go on crusade again, wants to avoid anything that stops that. So he gets into a position where essentially he gives Gascony away temporarily to Philip in agreement for a marriage. Edward's wife has died at this point, and a new marriage with a French princess and he's hoodwinked, or rather his younger brother is hoodwinked in the negotiations in France. And Edward hands over Gascony and then Philip doesn't return it and declares it confiscated. And we really need to understand that in order to be able to understand the Scottish wars. Because much of why Edward goes to war in Scotland is to do with actually the fact that he's at war in France trying to regain Gascony, which he eventually does after a huge amount of, of effort and money that is expended.

Matt Lewis (56:19)

I always find it fascinating. It's kind of that you know, square peg in a round hole, isn't it? How does a king do homage to another king for lands that he wants? And how, from the king of France's point of view, how does he recognize the ownership of a piece of land in his kingdom by someone else he also recognizes as a king who is therefore his equal in a different way? And nobody ever, I don't know, does anyone ever manage to, to make that square peg fit in the round hole. It seems to be, you know, the cause of so much contention throughout this whole period.

Dr. Andrew Spencer (56:50)

Yeah, and it involves a lot of mental gymnastics and goodwill essentially. And I think that's why Henry and, and Louis eventually come to an agreement that actually, you know, goodwill will get us through this and that continues long into Edward the first reign. But when goodwill goes, then actually, yes, those, those inherent tension come to the fore and really they can't be resolved in a European setting of national monarchies that are starting to develop in England, in Scotland, in France, in Spain and elsewhere.

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Matt Lewis (58:56)

It's one of those interesting medieval issues that you kind of, you need to, to make it work. They need to look at it with their glasses off and allow it to be a bit blurry because as soon as you try and bring it all into sharp focus, all you see are the problems can't resolve. Yeah, right. We ought to get on to the two biggies, I guess. And I'm conscious, you know, I'm gonna have to ask you to do this relatively quickly, which is unfair because there's another huge chunk of Edward's life that we could spend. Spend an immense amount of time talking about. So we've got a conquest of Wales. I mean, Wales is somewhere that Kings of England have been trying to get a proper grip on ever since, I don't know, 1066, if not before, you know, Athelstan is quite keen to get the homage of all of the rulers in Wales as well. No one has ever really managed to do it until Edward. Why does he decide to tackle this apparently unachievable goal?

Dr. Andrew Spencer (59:50)

So I think part of it again comes back to the 1250s and 1260s. So much of Edward's life really can be explained through the prism of those early experiences. So what Wales has always been difficult to conquer because it is so diverse politically. You can't just have a Hastings type event where you kill the king and you take over, you know, Wales, great weakness, but also its strength in terms of it is it is politically divided. So it's difficult to conquer as well, of course, as the territory. The territory itself is difficult to campaign in. And frankly, the English kings, while they would like to be recognized as overlords of Wales, for the most part, have been more interested in defending their lands in France than in Wales. Not least because the crown, for most of the time, doesn't have lands in Wales. Up until the 13th century, it's the march of lords who pushed into Wales. There aren't really any crown estates up until Henry III and Edward I. So Edward, of course, is involved in Wales. That is, part of his growing up is this dispute with Llywelyn. Llywelyn gets what he wants in 1267, which is recognition of the title of Prince of Wales. He's the only Welsh ruler to do homage to the King of England. All the other native Welsh rulers then do homage to Llywelyn. So what we are seeing in the 1250s and 1260s and stretching back to the beginning of the 13th century, is Gwynedd emerging as the predominant native Welsh power. And that creates difficulties for the English, but also difficulties for the princes of Gwynedd, in that many of the native Welsh princes don't really like the idea of doing homage to the Prince of Gwynedd. They'd much rather do homage to the King of England. So there is tension within native Wales, There is tension between Llywelyn and the Marcher lords because the Treaty of Montgomery is, at the moment of grape, a high tide of Gwynedd power. So the marchers have lost out quite a lot and are quite keen to chip away at it. So what we see in the 1260s and early 1270s is disputes between Llywelyn and the Marcher lords. Edward comes back from crusade. He does not have the intention of starting a war with Wales. What he wants is for Llywelyn to do homage, as he should do under the Treaty of Montgomery. Llywelyn understandably says, well, I'm not going to do homage until you sort out all of these issues. I've got all of these problems within Wales of people who've been breaking the treaty. And Edward goes, no, you do homage first, and then we'll resolve your grievances. And he offers several occasions for Llywelyn to do it, including coming all the way to the borders of Wales so that Gwen doesn't have to come to Westminster to do it. Llywelyn refuses to turn up. And I think what Llewellyn has done is overestimate his own strength and underestimate both Edward's own capabilities as somebody he defeated when he was a teenager, but also actually the power of the English monarchy and the English state when it is united. And the first war in 1277, is a relatively easy victory for the English. They capture Anglesey and Llywelyn is strangled into submission. Edward strips away many of Llyn's territorial gains, but leaves him with the title of Prince of Wales. But he's got much less power and authority than he had. One of the things that Edward is not very good at is seeing things from other people's point of view. And through the period between 1277 and 1282, when the next Welsh rebellion happens, we see both Llywelyn, his younger brother Dafydd, and other Welsh lords suffering at the hands of English officials who are interpreting the law, interpreting things in a way that suits Edward and suits the English rather than the Welsh. So naturally, the Welsh rebel in 1282. And at that point, Edward essentially feels that what Llywelyn has done has gone back on his word. He's Edward's vassal, and he is now a contumacious vassal, a rebellious vassal, and therefore any claims to his lands are forfeit. And so it's only the war of 1282, 83, that turns into a war of conquest. So by that point, I think Edward has come to the conclusion that what needs to happen in Wales is the end of the Gwynedd dynasty and the English taking over. But in order to do that, it takes a lot of time, a lot of effort, a lot of money, both to defeat the Welsh initially, but then to make sure that they are kept down. And that's where the castles come in, the famous castles of Harlech and Conwy and Caernarfon, et cetera.

Matt Lewis (64:48)

Yeah, yeah. It's interesting, though, for someone that we associate particularly when it comes to Wales and Scotland, as maybe a warmongering conqueror, that Edward is so slow to go to war with Wales. You say he makes all of that effort to go to the border of Wales to receive the homage. He is. He's moving towards Llewellyn. It's Llewelyn who's refusing to move back.

Dr. Andrew Spencer (65:10)

To move back. That's right. So again, no one's saying. I'm not trying to say in this, Edward is blameless. He has his interests and he wants to see them fulfilled and on his terms, but it didn't have to work out in the way that it did. And I don't think that Edward has this grand plan at the start of his reign that he's going to conquer Britain, conquer Wales, conquer Scotland. He would quite happily have accepted a position where Llywelyn was one of his vassals, but on his terms. Llywelyn, as I say, I think overestimates his own position and ultimately pays for that with both his life and in the end, with Welsh independence.

Matt Lewis (65:53)

Yeah, yeah. And, you know, for Edward, as King of England, he's achieved something that none of his forebears have managed to do.

Dr. Andrew Spencer (66:00)

His predecessors have done in bringing Wales.

Matt Lewis (66:03)

Fully under the control of the crown of England. It's a significant achievement for a king of England.

Dr. Andrew Spencer (66:08)

It is.

Matt Lewis (66:08)

Rightly or wrongly, it is absolutely. It's maybe not the best thing for Wales, but for Edward, it is an achievement.

Dr. Andrew Spencer (66:14)

It is. And yeah, Wales has always been an issue back from. Well, since the Saxons arrived in England, dealing with the Welsh has been an issue and Edward achieved something that none of his predecessors have done and that is a significant achievement, whatever one thinks about the rightness or wrongness of it.

Matt Lewis (66:35)

Yeah, yeah. And we're going to have to fly up to Scotland now, having seen him take control of Wales. Essentially what happens in Scotland is a succession crisis that for some reason they choose to go to Edward to mediate. Do you think that's something that immediately activates something in Edward's mind about this long standing idea of English overlordship of the British Isles, which he's making a reality in Wales? Do you think Edward ever intended to invade Scotland or is it their appeal to him that makes him think, oh, there's maybe something in this for me?

Dr. Andrew Spencer (67:11)

So Anglo Scottish relations in the 13th century had generally been good. Moments of tension, but generally good. There's a Scottish contingent, for instance, fighting for Henry III at Lewis, including the Bruces and the Comyns and the Balliols, they're all fighting for Henry III at Lewes. So Anglo Scottish relations, generally good. There is this tension, though, about the nature of the relationship between the King of England and the King of Scotland. And as in France, there are different viewpoints. So the English viewpoint is that the King of Scots should do homage to the King of England for Scotland. The Scottish viewpoint is that they should do homage to the King of England for their lands in England. And there are many, not just the King of Scots, but many lords have lands on both sides of the border. And in 1278, when Alexander comes to do homage, Alexander III comes to do homage. There's an argument, but essentially they agree to disagree. They do homage and they do it essentially. You know, it means different things to different people.

Matt Lewis (68:13)

They take their glasses off and just allow it to be a bit blurry for a while.

Dr. Andrew Spencer (68:16)

It'd be a bit blurry, absolutely. That's right. And that suits everybody. Alexander dies in 1286. And this, I think, is really important for people to know when we're thinking about Edward's mentality. Edward is in France when Alexander dies. His heir is Margaret, the Maid of Norway. She's a child in Norway. If Edward had this grand design to take over Scotland, he would have come back immediately and implemented it at this great moment of weakness in Scottish history. He doesn't. He stays in France for three years. That's how little Scotland is a priority for Edward at this point. He comes back and one of the great sort of what ifs of medieval British history plays out, which is he arranges a marriage between the future Edward II and Margaret, the Maid of Norway, which, had it happened, there would have been no Hundred Years War, there would have been no Anglo Scottish wars. England would have developed and Britain would have developed in a very different way. Margaret dies, unfortunately. And that's where we get the succession crisis that you were referencing. Now, you said for some reason, they turned to Edward. He's the obvious person to turn to, for all sorts of reasons. One is, as I said earlier, he's got this reputation as a peacemaker, and there's a real danger that Scotland is going to descend into civil war. War between the various claimants. There are lots of potential claimants, three major ones, Hastings, Bruce and Balliol. And there's a real danger that Scotland will descend into civil war. But worse than that, from Edward's perspective, is that it will start to drag the English into it, in that all of these lords have lands on both sides of the border, but also they are married into English barennial and comical families. So the Bruces are married into the de Clares, the Earls of Gloucester, the Earls of Surrey. The Earl of Surrey is the father in law of John Balliol. So it would drag the English into a dispute. So Edward needs to intervene. But also the Scots recognize that anyone who they choose, anyone who is going to become King of Scots, has to have the acceptance of the King of England. Now, what Edward does is to use this moment to maximize his opportunity. He's an opportunist, and I think he's an opportunist in Wales. He's an opportunist in Scotland as well, and so he sees this as well. Now, I can tidy up, I can put the glasses on and tidy things up so that we no longer have to have this blurry situation. It's going to be clear from now on that the King of Scots owes homage to the King of England. And all of the Scottish claimants to the throne have to, before Edward will judge them, have to, have to agree. And they all do. Everybody agrees that Edward actually makes the right choice. The man who he chooses is the man with the best claim. One of the really interesting things when we think about Scotland afterwards is that the Bruce claim, Robert the Bruce's grandfather, so called Robert the Bruce the competitor, he's arguing that Scotland isn't a kingdom at all. It should be split up into, into three, amongst the. Amongst the claimants. But Edward agrees. No, Scotland is a kingdom and it should be held by John Balliol. The difficulty for Balliol and for the Scots more broadly is that Edward starts, well, now I'm overlord of Scotland. Anyone who's unhappy with anything that the King of Scots does can appeal to me. And of course, that's an impossible situation for Balliol to be left in. And Edward seems to see no irony in the situation that he's created in Scotland, which is exactly the situation that he resents in France months. But what precipitates the war in Scotland again is not Edward invading Scotland, it's Edward demanding military service from the Scots as allies against the French. And the Scots go, no way are we going to do that. The Welsh say the same, actually, first of all, there's a rebellion in Wales, then there's a rebellion. Well, then the Scots say no, and they agree a treaty with the French So from Edward's perspective, his vassals have literally just signed a treaty, military alliance with his great enemy, the person he's at war with, and then they invade England. So from Edward's perspective, this is, you know, this is obvious contumacious, rebellious behavior by the Scots. Now, he doesn't see it from their perspective, of course. He sees it from his perspective, from a feudal perspective of his vassals have rebelled against him and therefore their lands and the kingdom is forfeit. And that is his attitude towards Scotland throughout. The difficulty that he has is that he defeats Balliol. But there are these different claimants within Scotland. There is as much a civil war going on in Scotland between the Bruces and the Balliols as the English are the sort of third wheel in it. So it's very messy because the moment you defeat one faction within Scotland, the other faction sort of rise up and take over. So there is the great thing that the Scottish kings have achieved before Edward. So the war of independence is this idea of Scotland as a kingdom, Scotland as a people with a king that never seemed to disappear. And you get Edward twice conquers Scotland. And in 1304, there's a famous moment where he's besieging Stirling Castle, which is the last castle in Scotland. It's held by a man called William Oliphant, who is a member of the Balliol Cummin faction. But Balliol is in exile in France at this point. And the English negotiators say to him, what are you doing? Why are you holding out here? Your king is gone. He's in front. There's nothing to hold. In whose name are you holding? Stirling Cask. And Oliphant says to the Magosian, he says, I'm holding it in the name of the lion, that is in the name of Scotland rather than any particular king. One of the interesting things about this, and the sort of, again, complicating factor in it all, is that a few years later, we find William Oliphant fighting for the English against Robert Bruce, because he hates Bruce more than he hates the English. And that's part of what makes it so difficult for Edward is the Bruce's. They fight with Edward in 1296, against him in 1297, with him in 1303, 4, and then finally against him in 13. And it's at that point when Bruce seizes the throne again. Edward, I think, feels that he'd been betrayed. Bruce, Robert Bruce had been a household knight of Edward I. You know, he'd broken bread, taken his salt in 19th century parlance and betrays him. And that's where Edward really starts getting vindictive towards the Scots in a way that he had been also vindictive towards Dafydd Llywelyn's younger brother in Wales. Those whom Edward feels has betrayed him, he behaves harshly towards.

Matt Lewis (75:17)

It's interesting to wonder how much that goes back to, or at least is shown early in his relationship with Simon de Montfort. You know, that targeting of de Montfort for effective battlefield execution is a result of a sense of betrayal. And we see it again with Llewelyn, and we see it again with Robert the Bruce.

Dr. Andrew Spencer (75:33)

If you cross him, if you lose his trust, then it's a very uncomfortable place to be. And we start to see executions. Execution of Dafydd's younger brother. An execution of an English knight called Thomas de Turberville, who is a household knight who sends secrets to the French. The execution of William Wallace, who ironically, is one of the very. The few Scots never to actually do homage to Edward. But he's regarded as a great rebel and is executed. And then those who are around Bruce, the members of the Bruce family that Edward gets his hands on, essentially, he treats pretty harshly.

Matt Lewis (76:11)

Yeah, yeah. I mean, Edward will die in 1307 on his way back to Scotland to pursue this war even further. It's something that he never quite gets over the line. The conquest of Scotland. Is it an irony, then, that he's most often remembered as the hammer of the Scots? That he has Hammer of the Scots paint. It will be painted later on his tomb. This idea of him as the hammer of the Scots. It's a conquest that he never completes. Hammer of the Welsh, maybe. Why Hammer of the Scots?

Dr. Andrew Spencer (76:43)

Well, I think that is, you know, it's painted on the tomb in the 16th century during another series of Anglo Scottish wars. So I think it's sort of. It's very much a product of the 16th century rather than of the 14th century. One of the interesting things when thinks about Edward's tomb is how bare it is. You go to Westminster Abbey and you see it compared to Henry III's tomb or Edward III's tomb, or Henry V or Richard II's. There's no, you know, and even Eleanor of Castile, you know, Edward Twice. There's. There's no effigy. It's this big black marble block with. With nothing on it. Eduardus primus hick est pactum server. That's the original sort of thing that's there. But why Hammer of the Scots? Well, yeah, I mean, I Think, as you say, he never quite gets it over the line. But what one sees in the Scottish war is Edward's sense of determination. Both his great strengths and his great weaknesses are revealed in the Scottish wars. This sense of his own rights, the determination to pursue his own rights at the cost of everything, this stubbornness, but also determination to again, year after year, come back and do it again and again and again, as I say, conquer Scotland twice. Bruce is almost defeated in 1306. Had again. It's sort of. Historians tend to sort of talk about the Scottish war as unwinnable. I don't think it is unwinnable. I think that had Edward lived longer, I think he would have captured Bruce and he would have executed him. It would have been pretty unpleasant, but I think he would have succeeded. What Bruce benefits from is Edward II's failure to follow up. And Bruce gets three years of respite to solve things in Scotland. Edward, then Edward II goes on campaign in 1309, 10, doesn't really achieve very much, and then gives Bruce another three years before finally we get to Bannockburn. Scottish mythology is that Bannockburn is the moment when Scottish independence is won. It's not. It's the moment when Scottish independence is confirmed. It's already been won in the seven years between Edward I's death and Bannockburn. And I think that idea of hammer of the Scots is that Edward I came so close to achieving it. And Scotland is, throughout the remainder of the Middle Ages, is much more of a threat to England and its ambitions, particularly, of course, in France, than Wales is, with the exception of the rising of Vala and Glendour in the beginning of the 15th century. The fear of either the Scots coming in through the back door or them letting the French in through the back door is a constant fear. And this idea that Edward was the man who came closest to resolving that problem, I think is very alive in 14th, 15th and 16th century English minds.

Matt Lewis (80:00)

Fascinating. I'm conscious we've kept you for a very long time, Andrew, and you've done us an incredible service, leading us through this. This fascinating and long and complex life. I mean, we've met an Edward who is a crusader, a great warrior king, a politician, a man who is interested in law and legal reform, a statesman also someone who is often viewed as a kind of ruthless imperialist and an opportunist, as you've said, as well. How should we judge Edward I's reign in medieval terms? Is he a good king or a bad king?

Dr. Andrew Spencer (80:34)

It depends where you sit. I think, but I think from the perspective of the English, Edward is one of the great kings. I think he's a king that you might find uncomfortable at times. He's very demanding and demands a great deal of his subjects, but he offers a great deal as well. And I think it's one of those where. Where it's almost like you don't quite realize what you had until it was gone. And I think that that's one of his. One of his great achievements. I mean, I tend to sort of think that what Edward, if we think about Edward I and where he stands when I wrote my book on Edward and his relations with the nobility is. It's not really clear amongst historians whether Edward is a sort of last of the central Middle Ages kings or the first of the late Middle Ages kings. And I think that what Edward does is solve the structural problems of the 13th century monarchy. He solves the idea of, yes, we're going to work with Parliament, we're going to work with Magna Carta, we're going to deal with Wales. So many of these. We're going to reform the law and deal with many of the problems that have emerged. We're going to deal with the Jews, not necessarily in a way that we would approve of, but in a way that they approved of at the time. So Edward, I think, solves many of the structural problems of the 13th century, but his reign reveals or sets up the problems of the later medieval monarchy, of the war with Scotland, the situation, ongoing situation with France and essentially, eventually, what's going to be war with France? How does, how does the English monarchy pay for these wars? We move to a period from 1294 to the middle of the 1450s, where England is basically at war all of the time, with a few exceptions. And that starts in Edward I's reign and leads to a huge expansion in government, in law, in the power of the state, which opens up a whole series of other questions that, that English monarchs in the 14th and 15th century tackle with varying degrees of success or failure, but they are all dealing essentially with the legacy of Edward I. Yeah, yeah.

Matt Lewis (82:55)

I quite like the idea that people would not enjoy Edward being king until Edward was no longer king. And then they'd immediately say, oh, I wish Edward was king again where he was king again.

Dr. Andrew Spencer (83:06)

Yeah, absolutely.

Matt Lewis (83:07)

Well, thank you so much for joining us, Andrew, and thank you for taking us through this, this fascinating king who we have somehow managed to overlook in Gone Medieval's efforts so far. But it's good to have tried to do justice to the story of King Edward I thank you so much for your time and for leading us through that.

Dr. Andrew Spencer (83:24)

My pleasure. Thanks Matt.

Matt Lewis (83:25)

Thank you. I hope you've enjoyed this episode. You can find out more in Andrew's book Nobility and Kingship in Medieval England, the Earls and Edward I, 1272-1307. You can explore the reign of Edward's father, Henry III in two episodes with the inimitable David Carpenter. And there's also one about the declaration of our bro as part of the Scottish wars of Independence that you might find interesting. There are new installments of God Medieval every Tuesday and Friday, so please come back to join Eleanor and I for more from the greatest millennium in human history. Don't forget to also subscribe or follow us on Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts and tell all of your friends and family that you've gone medieval. You can sign up to History Hit to access hundreds of hours of original documentaries with a new release every week and all of History Hits podcasts ad free. Head over to historyhit.com subscribe right now. Anyway, I better let you go. I've been Matt Lewis and we've just gone medieval With History Hit.

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Dr. Eleanor Jaenega (85:19)

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