Medieval Winter Ghosts

Summary

Gone Medieval – “Medieval Winter Ghosts”

Host: Dr. Eleanor Jennica (History Hit)
Guest: Dr. Michael Carter (Senior Properties Historian, English Heritage)
Date: December 23, 2025

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Episode Overview

In this chilling holiday episode, Dr. Eleanor Jennica explores the deep-rooted European tradition of winter ghost stories, tracing their origins, meanings, and enduring power. Senior properties historian Dr. Michael Carter joins to unravel the complex medieval attitudes toward ghosts—particularly in the context of winter, Christmas, and religious belief. Together, they delve into chilling tales from monastic manuscripts, the striking “Snowball the Tailor” legend, the art and psychology of death, and the ghostly continuities running through to Victorian and modern traditions.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Winter as the Season of Ghosts

• The episode opens on the connection between winter—its dark, long nights—and traditions of ghost storytelling (01:07–03:34).
• Literary Roots: References to Shakespeare’s The Winter’s Tale and Marlowe’s works reveal that winter ghost storytelling predates even the 16th century (01:40–02:30).
  • Dr. Jennica notes: “When we gather to terrify each other with scary stories at Christmas...we're actually participating in a tradition that stretches back over millennia.” (02:20)

2. “Snowball the Tailor” – A Medieval Ghost Tale

• A dramatic retelling of the “Snowball the Tailor” story from Byland Abbey manuscripts.
  • Snowball, a humble tailor, encounters uncanny phantom creatures—a raven, a monstrous black dog, a spectral man—and must undertake religious acts to free a tormented soul (03:34–07:01).
  • Notable quote:
    • “You alone can free me or share my fate. It demanded absolution, 180 Masses said in its name and secrecy. Refuse, and Snowball's flesh would begin to rot while he still lived...” (Matt, 05:27)

3. Why Are Ghost Stories Associated with Winter and Christmas?

• Dr. Carter explains the religious underpinnings:
  • The church calendar’s turn to winter at All Saints/All Souls (November 1st).
  • Advent as a time of spiritual preparation and confrontation with mortality, contrasted with today’s festive “front-loading” of Christmas (08:12–10:30).
  • Dr. Carter:
    • "At the onset of winter...you are also preparing yourself for the second coming when the graves will open...these stories tell you...you need to be at the side of Christ..." (09:08)
  • Medieval Christmas was about preparing for the end as much as celebrating a beginning.

4. The Role and Purpose of Medieval Ghost Stories

• Ghosts act as didactic messengers—warning and seeking help from the living.

  • Most medieval ghost stories hinge on souls in purgatory, asking the living for prayers/masses to shorten their suffering (12:39–13:24).
  • Dr. Carter:
    • "...the vast majority of us are going to end up in purgatory, where we are going to undergo torment and we are going to need the help of the living to then get up to heaven…” (11:45)
  • Ghost stories encourage charitable acts, the giving of alms, and, crucially, the sponsorship of requiem masses.

• Stories also serve as moral warnings—ghosts admonish the living to correct their own ways (12:55–13:24).

  • Medieval ghost advancement mechanism: Living must take expensive, time-consuming steps (e.g., paying for masses, almsgiving, public prayers).

5. The Snowball Tale and the Ghostly Economy

• Dr. Carter elaborates on the specifics and symbolism of the Snowball tale (18:17–22:43).
  • Even “ordinary” medieval people, like Snowball the tailor, could engage in freeing souls—albeit at great risk and expense.
  • Religious devotion, such as veneration of the Blood of Christ, features in these tales and indicates changing practices in late medieval belief.
  • The tales include references to contemporary art motifs like “the three living and the three dead”—a popular memento mori image underscoring mortality’s universality.

6. Art, Memory, and the Leveling Power of Death

• The motif of “the three living and the three dead” teaches humility before death; even the rich and powerful will be “consumed by worms” (23:05–27:46).

  • Dr. Carter:
    • “Your posh clothes, your concern with your worldly status, it ultimately doesn’t matter because you, like everybody else, are going to end up like us…” (23:33)

• Medieval tombs and monuments often included grotesque images of decaying bodies—as warnings and reminders.

• Good works and donations (like founding colleges, almshouses) were attempts at spiritual and social immortality.

7. Wealth, Inequality, and the Ghostly ‘Shakedown’

• Surviving ghost stories often reflect church interests—monks and priests record tales in which “masses for the dead” and donations are needed (31:28–37:53).

  • The process could be as much shakedown as salvation:
    • Host: “It's very convenient, isn't it, for the church to say, oh, yeah, and I'm afraid you're going to need to buy...90 masses?” (33:28)
  • Rich benefactors received extra prayers in the “book of life," but Christ’s biblical message favored humble givers.

• Visual affirmations: Monasteries displayed coats of arms of wealthy donors as both memorial and warning (“Don’t mess with us, we have powerful friends.”)

8. Revenants: The Corporeal, Dangerous Dead

• Many medieval ghosts (revenants) are not just spirits but tangible, rotting bodies—a far cry from “harmless” modern ghosts (39:37–45:11).

  • Tales include the dreadful James Tankerly, whose body was forcibly taken from a prestigious burial in Byland and thrown into a mysterious lake due to transgressions.
  • Disgraced dead could return as “night walkers,” “satellites of Satan,” or “shroud chewers,” sometimes requiring violent exorcism.

• Dr. Carter:

  • “Most of the [revenant] stories...do involve people who should have known better...those who fall from the highest places fall farthest.” (41:00–42:00)

9. Physical Effects of Encounters with Ghosts

• Encounters with ghosts often had real-world, bodily consequences—fevers, illness, even death—highlighting their danger and power (45:11–49:30).

  • Some stories detail ghosts grabbing, injuring, or otherwise physically impacting the living.
  • Dr. Carter: “Several of the Byland stories describe how people are really, really physically affected by this encounter with the dead...the returning spirit.” (46:08)

• The motif of “ghost sickness” echoes through time and even across cultures, being paralleled in Japanese folklore.

10. Continuity of the Winter Ghost Story

• The tradition survived into the Victorian era and beyond, notably through M.R. James’s Christmas ghost story readings at King’s and Eton (52:18–54:00).
  • M.R. James, a medievalist himself, helped enshrine the tradition and directly transcribed and published the Byland Abbey stories.
  • He creatively merged medieval sources and motifs—relics, manuscripts, religious spaces—into classic English ghost fiction.
  • Dr. Carter: “…James has a direct connection with the Byland Abbey ghost story. He transcribed them and published them…And it’s thanks to James that…I think they have become probably the best known of all English medieval ghost stories.” (54:00)

11. The Power of Agency and Good Works

• Unlike many modern ghost tales, in medieval stories the living have agency: they can help, intercede, and change fates through action.
  • Dr. Carter: “...the great thing with the medieval ghost story. You have agency within them. You are not helpless. And... altruism makes you feel better about yourself.” (61:46)
• The tension between fear of the dead and fear of the living, as well as warnings about the corrupting influence of power and wealth, are ongoing themes.

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Notable Quotes and Memorable Moments

• On winter’s darkness:
  “When we gather to terrify each other with scary stories at Christmas...we're actually participating in a tradition that stretches back over millennia.”
  – Dr. Eleanor Jennica (02:20)

• On the purpose of ghost stories:
  “Ghost stories show the efficacy of what are called the suffrages. That's the giving of alms, the saying of prayers, and most of all, the singing of requiem masses for the salvation of souls. And so many ghosts. That is what they want.”
  – Dr. Michael Carter (11:45)

• On the leveling message of death:
  “Your posh clothes, your concern with your worldly status, it ultimately doesn’t matter because you, like everybody else, are going to end up like us. And you better think on your end. And it is an incredible leveler...”
  – Dr. Michael Carter (23:33)

• On the lived consequences of ghostly contact:
  “Several of the Byland stories describe how people are really, really physically affected by this encounter with the dead, the returning spirit.”
  – Dr. Michael Carter (46:08)

• On winter ghost storytelling’s survival:
  “…James has a direct connection with the Byland Abbey ghost story. He transcribed them and published them…And it’s thanks to James that…I think they have become probably the best known of all English medieval ghost stories.”
  – Dr. Michael Carter (54:00)

• On agency in medieval ghost tales:
  “You have agency within them. You are not helpless. And, you know, altruism, you're committing an altruistic act and altruism makes you feel better about yourself. There's a very, very strong Christian message in them there.”
  – Dr. Michael Carter (61:46)

• On what to fear:
  “Oh, boys, it's not the dead you need to be frightened of, but the living.”
  – Dr. Michael Carter quoting his mother (62:40)

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Important Story & Discussion Timestamps

• 01:07 – Opening reflections on the winter ghost tale tradition
• 03:34 – Dramatic reading of the Snowball the Tailor story
• 07:19 – Introduction of Dr. Michael Carter; how and why ghost stories relate to winter and Christmas
• 08:12 – The church calendar, Advent, and the apocalyptic medieval imagination
• 13:24 – Ghost stories as warnings and teaching tools
• 18:17 – The real world, symbolic, and psychological meanings of the Snowball story
• 23:05 – “The three living and the three dead” and the reminder of mortality’s reach
• 31:28 – The connection between social status, donations, and ghost stories
• 39:37 – Story of James Tankerly, the revenant priest and the motif of the corporeal undead
• 45:11 – Medieval ghosts’ physical effects on the living; comparison to global traditions
• 52:18 – M.R. James, modern medievalism, and Christmas ghost storytelling
• 61:46 – Agency, altruism, and the enduring messages of medieval ghost tales

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Closing Thoughts

Dr. Jennica and Dr. Carter weave a tapestry of chilling tales and thoughtful analysis, showing how medieval ghost stories—rooted in winter’s darkness, religious practice, and deep psychological needs—continue to haunt our imaginations. Winter remains the time when “the veil is thin,” and ghost stories are more than entertainment: they offer warnings, comfort, and reminders of our duties to the dead and the living.

“...the tradition of the winter ghost tale was still alive and well…these stories remind us that winter has always been a season of darkness and wonder, when the boundary between the living and the dead grows thin and when gathering together to share tales of the supernatural brings both delicious shivers and profound comfort.” (Dr. Eleanor Jennica, 63:34)

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For more chilling tales and historical explorations, follow Gone Medieval and join in this enduring winter tradition!

Transcript

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[Narrator / Host (Dr. Eleanor Jennica)]

Hello, I'm Dr. Eleanor Jennica and welcome to Gone Medieval From History Hit, the podcast that delves into the greatest millennium in human history. We uncover the greatest mysteries, the gobsmacking details, and the latest groundbreaking research. From the Vikings to the Normans, from kings to Popes to the Crusades, we delve into the rebellions, plots and murders that tell us who we really were and how we got here. At this time of year, when it already feels like nighttime by the mid afternoon and mist and frost begins to creep across the land, the veil between the living and the dead seems to become quite thin. This belief, held for millennia, gave rise to one of the most enduring winter traditions, the telling of ghost stories. A sad tale's best for winter. Shakespeare wrote in the Winter's Tale, I have one of sprites and goblins. And in the Jew of Malta, Christopher Marlowe recalled those old women's words, who in my wealth would tell me winter's tales and speak of spirits and ghosts that glide by night? These literary references suggest the tradition of winter ghost stories was already well established by the 16th century. But it goes back much further. Further than that. So when we gather to terrify each other with scary stories at Christmas or huddle around the TV to watch ghost stories, we're actually participating in a tradition that stretches back over millennia. The means of delivery may have changed from monk's Latin manuscripts to modern horror films. But the appeal remains the same, and that's what I'm going to be exploring today. But first, here's Matt with an abridged version of one of my favorite medieval spooky the story of Snowball the Tailor.

[Matt (Story Narrator)]

As night fell over the Yorkshire hills, a poor and simple tailor named Snowball rode home alone. The road was silent but for the clop of his horse's hooves. Bandits frequented these parts, but the thing that was following Snowball was older and much, much worse. Suddenly, a raven screamed out of the blackness, its cry like the tearing of a soul. The horse reared. Snowball fought for control. The bird crashed to the ground, dead, or so it seemed. When Snowball reached to touch it, fire burst from its body, casting his face in a hellish glow. Snowball fell back, crossing himself in terror. The creature rose again, shrieking like the damned, and vanished into the dark. But it was not long gone. With a sound like tearing metal, the raven struck Snowball from his saddle. His blade passed straight through it as if through smoke. Desperate, he raised the hilt in the shape of the cross. The phantom fled, but Snowball knew it would return. Moments later, the night erupted with the snarl of a beast. Out of the gloom charged a monstrous black dog, eyes burning like coals. Snowball invoked the name of Christ, and the beast convulsed, its form dissolving into a blazing specter. I am a soul cast out, it moaned. Damned by the church, bound in torment. You alone can free me or share my fate. It demanded absolution, 180Masses said in its name and secrecy. Refuse, and Snowball's flesh would begin to rot while he still lived, sick with fear. Snowball obeyed. He promised a huge amount from his salary to the priest of York as a bribe for a written pardon, arranged masses in every monastery, and buried the absolution by the ghost's grave under cover of night. When the spirit came again, it first took the form of a goat, then rose into the shape of a terrifying skeletal man wreathed in fire. You have freed me, it said. Three demons tried to keep me. But now, on Monday next, I shall enter everlasting joy with 30 souls beside me. But the spectre warned Snowball, while once more stay where you are and be rich. Move and be poor. You have enemies near. Then it vanished, leaving only the smell of ash. Snowball returned home broken, fevered and half mad. Yet he had done the impossible, freed the damned, defied the devils, and proven that even a humble tailor could release a tormented soul from The Gates of Hell.

[Narrator / Host (Dr. Eleanor Jennica)]

Doctor Michael Carter, the senior properties historian at English Heritage, has dedicated years to uncovering the rich tapestry of medieval supernatural tales that emerged from England's monasteries, revealing a tradition far more complex and fascinating than many realize.

[Interviewer / Podcast Host]

I've recently made a terrifyingly good film.

[Narrator / Host (Dr. Eleanor Jennica)]

With Michael, which you can see now when you subscribe to historyhit.com Michael, welcome to Gone Medieval.

[Dr. Michael Carter]

Real pleasure to be back with you.

[Interviewer / Podcast Host]

It has been a little while since I met you in the shadow of a priory to talk about one of my favorite topics of all time, which is of course ghosts. But more specifically for our purposes today, I'm really interested in talking about the fact that ghosts in the medieval mind are often something that is linked to the winter or Christmas more specifically. You know, these are the sort of stories that one tells at this time of year. And I think that we, we don't share that same idea now. Now we think of it more as an October phenomena. What do you think about that?

[Dr. Michael Carter]

That's really interesting. I always think of Shakespeare in a winter's tale, you know, about a sad story being appropriate for winter. And, you know, there's something about gathering by the fire and scaring one other out of their wits, I think. And also, you know, we do think of October tide and things like that, but 1st of November in the church calendar effectively was the start of winter. You went from the summer portion of the breviary over to the winter portion of the breviary and thinking about All Saints and All Souls, you know, the very onset of winter. And there is something about the dark, isn't there? We don't have to use too much imagination to think why winter is associated with that. And then Christmastide as well, of getting people together, of hunkering down and entertainment. And to quote Mr. James, they are a pleasing terror. But they also have specific didactic purposes and they also illuminate the religious mindset of the Middle Ages. And we have to consider how Christmas is one of the most important feasts in the Christian calendar. You know, it's the nativity of Christ and the period running up to it. Advent. We front load all our Christmas celebrations now into Advent, don't we? You know, but you're not just preparing yourself for the coming of Christ incarnate at the Nativity, but you are also preparing yourself for the second coming when the graves will open, when people will rise to be judged. And boy, these stories tell you that when that happens, you need to be at the side of Christ where he is pointing to you. Benevolently rather, being ushered off by demons to eternal torment.

[Interviewer / Podcast Host]

And that's the sort of thing that medieval people are incredibly aware of. I mean, maybe not comfortable with, because how does one ever get comfortable with that idea? But it's something that they live. You know, churches have frescoes of people jumping out of their graves at the end of the world. Everyone understands the apocalyptic nature of the season and that's really what they're reflecting on. You know, we're at a real remove from that now because now we're just like, oh, it's mince pies and your office will have a Christmas party kind of an idea. But they are relating to the season as something entirely different. So from my point of view, I think it's kind of no wonder that they also begin to think about death, because the entire season running up to Christmas is about that very thing.

[Dr. Michael Carter]

Yeah. And also, it's like, again, we think of hey, hey, December all jolly. Advent is a time of austerity, spiritual preparation, and that is shown by the colour of vestments that are worn in the Roman Catholic Church. To this day, you wear violet purplish vestments and high Anglicans will do the same in the Sarum rite. In the middle. Middle Ages, here in England it'd be blue, but it is marking out as being a sombre season. And it is about your spiritual preparation. And why has Christ come? Why has the Word been made flesh? Why has Christ been born in Bethlehem? It is to save humanity from their sins, to offer them a chance of salvation. And how are you going to achieve that? Salvation is through Christ. And, boy, is it going to be difficult as well. We are all going to err and we are all going to need help and the vast majority of us are going to end up in purgatory, where we are going to undergo torment and we are going to need the help of the living to then get up to heaven, to shorten our time there. And, boy, do ghost stories show the efficacy of what are called the suffrages. That's the giving of alms, the saying of prayers, and most of all, the singing of requiem masses for the salvation of souls. And so many ghosts. That is what they want.

[Interviewer / Podcast Host]

I mean, and I would say that that is kind of the ghost story of the Middle Ages. Somebody is in purgatory, they are suffering the torments of hell and they are asking the living for intercession in order to make this stop.

[Narrator / Host (Dr. Eleanor Jennica)]

Right.

[Interviewer / Podcast Host]

I suppose that there's also an alternative twist on that, which is warning the living about how they are in purgatory. It's like, oh, you need to straighten up and fly right. You, you should consider that I did the wrong thing. So you need to make sure that you don't end up in the same way that I do. But it's really two sides of the same coin, isn't it? You know, in order to be a ghost, you sort of like come out of hell in order to bother the living about it.

[Dr. Michael Carter]

Well, coming up, we do have ghosts coming from Hel as well. And some of the very scary, I think for a lot of medieval ghost stories, I have to be honest, you would have to be of a very, very nervous disposition to her to be in a bit spooked by them. It's like, oh, you know, such and such is wandering down a country lane and this piece of flapping canvas, burning bale of hail. You get a sense, oh, my word, this is shocking. And then the person knows what they need to do, they need to conjure it. I command you, in the name of Christ by his precious blood, to reveal yourself, give me your name and tell me what you want. And this, of course, the apparition duly does and said, oh, I did this and I need to have 90 masses said for me. And the person at their own expense will trundle off and arrange for that to be done. The ghost will come back and say, thank you very much, I'm no longer in purgatory. But sometimes a little bit of a warning attached as well that, you know what, you have been sinning a bit, haven't you? And you better not end up like me. So make amends and be a good Christian. Observe the sacraments and say your prayers and pay for the masses, for the salvation of souls, and you are not going to be like me. There are some very touching medieval stories about this and actually some which you think, hey, what was going on there? There are a number of stories that were written in the 12th century by A. Written down by a guy called Peter of Cornwall. And some of them concern the Cistercian monastery on the outskirts, what's now the outskirts of London, Stratford Langhorn. And one of the stories basically involves a local priest, or a localish priest in Lesnes, in what's now southeast London, and somebody else. And they've made a pact that the person who dies first will come back and say where they are and what they need to do. And boy, there's an implication that they might have been indulging in a little bit of man on man action. And for that, one of them has gone to Hell. And what the other one has to do to save his soul is to become an austere Cistercian monk. And he doesn't to start off with like what he has been told, but he realizes the stakes are so high. Then we have another collection of ghost stories, one I know very well, and I know the monastery so well, and I have wandered around the fields and lanes in which so many of these stories are set. And they come from Byland Abbey in Yorkshire. Now that was a Cistercian monastery. It was one of the three shining lights of religion in the north in the 12th century, along with fountains and rivo, according to a local monastic chronicler. And in around about 1400, one of its monks found some blank leaves of vellum in a 12th century manuscript in the monastery's library. Don't think of the library in the Name of the Rose, by the way. We are talking about a little room off the cloister and to a cupboard. It's a very beautiful manuscript, though, I have to say, some very, very interesting marginal drawings and beautiful hand. The ghost stories, however, are written in this crappy script that even Mr. James, brilliant palaeographer, found difficult. And the Latin he describes as being refreshing, which I think he means bad. Most of them are set in the fields and lanes near the monastery and they in loads of them are set in northern England and they give really interesting insights into the range of supernatural beliefs in a medieval monastery, the interaction between high and low religion, the efficacy of prayer for the salvation of souls, and that sometimes, you know what, prayer isn't even gonna cut it. We are gonna have to take much more drastic remedies and like. Well, since childhood, since my late teenage years, every Christmas I've enjoyed Mr. James's ghost stories at Christmas and the 1970s and later BBC adaptations of them. But I also, for my pleasing Christmas terror, will turn to these stories as well. They've been widely translated and published, they quite easy to find on the Internet. And anybody who wants to get an insight into medieval ghost stories and, oh, have that chill down their spine on a winter's evening, have a read of them. They are some fantastic ones. The second story I think I'd like to talk about a little bit most of all, because it involves a character who rejoices in the wonderful surname of Snowball.

[Interviewer / Podcast Host]

We love Snowball, I assure you that.

[Dr. Michael Carter]

Is a surname and I think it's first recorded in the 13th century, possibly a little bit earlier, and it's actually first recorded in Yorkshire and it basically means not what we think A snowball, it means basically having a bald patch. I think it's a dark headed person with either a light patch of hair or somebody like me who's like, you know, my monastic tonsure has naturally developed. So I wonder if it was something like that. So Snowball, we're not given his first name. And near to Byland Abbey there is the village of Ampleforth, which of course now is famous for being home to a large Benedictine monastery and posh Catholic boarding school. It was quite a large village in the Middle Ages. And nearby is the village of Gilling. And this chap Snowball, who is a tailor, is travelling one winter's evening between the two. Very interesting that he's travelling at night. I always think, you know, you wouldn't really have thought of people wanting to make a journey at night along unlit roads and things. We take these things for granted. Let's not forget the safety of travel at night, our modes of transport, you know, getting yourself into a medieval mindset can be quite difficult. And he has a terrifying haunting on this journey. And I think it's ducks first of all. Then a raven which attacks him and comes to ground and sparks are flying off it. Then he sort of gets his sword. Quite a posh guy is on a horse and he's also got a sword that tells you that even though he's a tailor, he is a man of means. And he holds the sword like it is a cross. He conjures the ghost, commands it to appear. It speaks from its intestines, we're told, and tells him that, gosh, you've got to do these extraordinary things so I can escape. Must be from purgatory. There's no way out of hell. And you know, you've got to get me absolved. I've been excommunicated. Oh, gosh. Outside the sacraments of the church, that's not a good place to be. And this Snowball accomplishes, at great expense, five shillings, that's two weeks wages is shelled out to pay the necessary fees to get this parchment with basically kind of Certificate of Absolution on it and buries it in a churchyard. The story goes on to describe how there were fearsome demons watching him as he does that. The ghost is indeed redeemed and along with 30 other souls. Whoa. Well done, Snowball. What can I say? All that suffering you have. And then the ghost, whose name we are never told, does a good deed for Snowball and he tells him that, you know what, mate, that cloak that you got from your mate up in Amwick, you better give it back to him, because you've got that sin on your soul. Also says to him, you know what, you need to move as well, because you're going to end up poor because of consorting with ghosts, and that's going to destroy your business. And then he's done his good deed, and his reward for that is he's left seriously ill in bed for several days. Well, you know, talk about thinking about your Christian duties. Snowball really discharged his at the expense to his pocket and expense to his health. But he's done what's right, and he is also saving himself from purgatorial pain as well. And the story, I think, is fascinating as well, because it provides some real insights into developments in medieval religiosity, the kinds of expressions of religious devotion at the time. It mentions devotion to the blood of Christ. Other stories mention devotion to the holy name of Jesus. And these are very important late medieval cults. And I think it's actually some of the Bylan stories provide very early evidence indeed of the growing importance of the holy name of Jesus in medieval belief. And Cistercian monks were great promoters of that veneration. The Snowball story also mentions or alludes to the images of the three living and the three dead adorning churches. So we've got medieval art in them as well.

[Interviewer / Podcast Host]

So you've hit on something there, Michael, that I think is really interesting. So there's this art motif that is incredibly popular, especially from the 14th century onward, that we call the three living and the three dead. And it's popular enough that you could just say the name of it in this ghost story and the audience is supposed to know what it is. But for the benefit of our listeners, can you explain what it is?

[Dr. Michael Carter]

Yeah, I think it's a story that should strike terror into your soul, if you are a medieval posh boy. And that's what it involved. The three members of the medieval 1%, well, probably 0.1% or something, and they go off for a lovely day, hunting and hawking, and they encounter three cadavers, three rotten, vile corpses, animated corpses. And they basically say to these posh boys, as you are once, were we, as we are now, so shall you be. It's a kind of memento mori. The vanities of life are so fleeting that the sinfulness of life that you can be tempted into that, your posh clothes, your concern with your worldly status, it ultimately doesn't matter because you, like everybody else, are going to end up like us. And you better think on your end. And it is an incredible leveler that the medieval world was incredibly unequal. It was those, the stratifications in wealth and status and even like, you know, the whole concept of being trying to buy salvation. If you were one of those medieval posh boys, you would already have made provision in your will. Well, if you were clever, you would have made provision in your will for the saying of possibly thousands of Requiem masses, probably endowing a chantry where these masses would be sung for all eternity if you were very rich. But everybody is going to die and you need to think about what comes next. And the most humble medieval person, well, it was a Christian duty of all people to pray for the salvation of their souls. And was it that these posh boys would have to think especially about their end? Because if you know the mighty you are, the greater your sins are going to be. I work for English Heritage and Battle Abbey is one of our stellar sites. It's founded by William the Conqueror on the very spot where he wins his blood soaked victory. And boy, did he need those prayers because he committed the most appalling violence. And we have a very Game of Thrones view of the Middle Ages and violence at times that it kind of takes place in a moral vacuum. It doesn't. Your sins have consequence and doing bad, slaughtering lots of people is a terrible stain upon your soul. And there's a story that really does always make my hair stand on end when I tell it or I think about it. And it really does appeal to the residual Catholic within me as well, I have to say. It's the story of a Norse knight called Reinfried, and he has taken part in the Harrying of the north, that is William the Conqueror's genocidal campaign in northern England to put down a rebellion. And we're told in various neo contemporary chronicles how Ryanfried encounters the holy places of ancient Northumbria, Anglo Saxon Northumbria, including Whitby Abbey. And he's so overcome by emotion that he puts down the sword and embraces the cowl. And that sounds to me as possibly slightly anachronistically of a case of, of a soldier having post traumatic stress disorder. He has seen and he has done the most appalling things. And it also speaks to the attendant spiritual needs that Reinfried needs to find salvation. He needs to find some kind of spiritual comfort. And he's thinking of his ends and thinking of making amends. And the medieval church and the monastic life was a route of doing that. And that is a leveler that those push boys are all destined to the grave where they will rot and be consumed by worms. And I'm thinking, you know of these transitombs as well, Eleanor.

[Interviewer / Podcast Host]

Oh, I love transit tunes. Sorry, I should have got so excited about, you know, the image of a rotting corpse. And yet here we are, I'm glad, clapping my hands.

[Dr. Michael Carter]

We have these, you know, these bishops in their full episcopal regalia, what's called their pontificalia. I always love that word because it sounds a bit like pomp as well, you know, and there they are. It's expression of the majesty of the church and also of the greatness of God. But underneath layer, underneath you can see this naked decomposing corpse and sometimes it's shown with worms or frogs crawling upon it. This is your end. And you know, without being too morbid, I sometimes think this still has lessons for today. We do live in a very now obsessed society and very good things about emphasis on health and fitness. But I have to say that sometimes when I have been lazily sat in the gym and I see people obsessing about working that tiny little muscle in their transept, I think, well, perhaps I should be a little more self reflective when I'm thinking this, that you know what mate, you're going to lose that. And all of us will age and all of us are gonna face our end. Those last moments on earth. We are all gonna have an hour of our death and what are we gonna be thinking of when that happens? And I also think there's some another message from the Middle Ages is that if there were great, great differences in wealth and status, how are you gonna be remembered if you were very rich, you know, and what would you do to try and secure your salvation? You'd found a monastery, you'd endower Oxbridge College, you would found scholarships at places, you would fund an almshouse. Okay, it's transactional, but you are doing something good. And some institutions founded in the Middle Ages still flourish to this day because of the generosity of their medieval founders. And the intention was that the fallows of a college, the brethren of an almshouse, would pray for the soul of the founder. But isn't that a better way to be remembered than someone who dodged their taxes and things that, you know, to some extent we all want more immortality, don't we? And didn't medieval Christianity provide a brilliant way of both? First of all the spiritual immortality, but also the immortality of being remembered? You had done the right thing. It really does touch me to be Honest as well, when I think about that, and I often think that is what the context of scholarship as well, you sometimes pen an article and send it off to some obscure journal, which I'm very glad exists, let me just say, and it will be read probably immediately by a handful of people, but hopefully if we're still around in 200 years time, somebody may encounter that article, think who was this person. Find other things you wrote, but you are living on because of a contribution you have made. And it is contributing that I think is at the heart of so much of the giving in the Middle Ages. It's about, yes, you are getting. The selfish side of it is you're trying to get a quicker passage to heaven, but you've done a good deed in the process.

[Interviewer / Podcast Host]

Well, I think that this is a really interesting point, Michael. And when we look at a lot of the medieval ghost stories that survive to us, they really hinge on this. You know, in particular, you've done something wrong during your life and so you've ended up in hell and, well, purgatory. But, you know, like, let's be honest, purgatory is hell with a timer. It's fine. You know, in particular, when we look at kind of classical tropes, there's a one in particular I'm really interested in which are the harlequin haunts or the harlequin hunts, where, you know, to a priest, usually suddenly a large procession of dead people will appear and they're usually experiencing ironic torments that correspond to what it is that they had done wrong in life. And very first recorded one we have that comes to us out of France, we have the priests say that one of the tormented comes up to him and says, you know, I'm. I'm in hell right now. Unless somebody does something, it could be turned into purgatory. But currently it's hell because I took a mill off a miller and I made more money off of that mill subsequently than the miller ever owed me. And now my whole family is going to go to hell if they don't take care of this. And so we do have this real specific discussion of wealth and inequalities and what is and is not acceptable for the powerful to be doing. And I suppose that it's not lost on me, though, that the major way that a lot of these ghost stories come to us is of course, through members of the Church. You know, so it's a priest that sees this harlequin haunt, it's monks who are writing down the Byland ghost stories and I mean, I don't think that we can discount the fact that these are a bunch of people who are talking to an incredibly privileged subset of society. You know, this isn't a neutral document.

[Dr. Michael Carter]

Right.

[Interviewer / Podcast Host]

I'm sure that they do believe that you could go to hell if you don't act appropriately, if you don't give charitable alms, if you don't look in on the church and take care of what needs to be done, if you don't take care of your neighbors, if you're taking mills off of poor, innocent millers. Obviously that, that would be part of it. But also it's very convenient, isn't it, for the church to say, oh, yeah, and I'm afraid you're going to need to buy. Oh, you're gonna have to buy like, what, 90 masses? Think that's gonna come out at five shillings? You know, like this is. Is it not also something that we could look at as a shakedown?

[Dr. Michael Carter]

Definitely. And, you know, the whole concept of buying salvation is definitely there. I'd just add as well that every single religious, large religious institution would have had what's called a book of life, a liba vitae. And yet the kings are in there for giving their incredible gifts and are remembered. It would be placed on the high altar during every single mass once a year, read through in its entirety, the grateful community saying prayers for their benefactors. You would have a place in the liba vitae if you gave the. The tiniest gift to that monastery. And also there's this core biblical message, isn't there as well? And I'm trying to remember my gospels from my childhood scholarship of them, that Christ comments on people being ostentatious, saying their prayers, giving all this lavish thing. Who does he think most favourably of? It's the person who's humble. They can barely afford to give their, their gift to the temple, which costs virtually nothing, but boy, they have made the effort there is that message there as well. I think that everybody's gift will be esteemed and giving according to your means. Now also, let's remember that, you know, given another side of the thought, monks on the whole are from a kind of middling sort of people, but getting to be the head of a big monastery, you're getting of pseudo aristocratic status and you are hobnobbing with these people. Byland Abbey related that occurs in an extraordinary court case in the court of Chivalry in the late 14th century, about the same time that the Byland stories are written down. And it's because two Medieval posh boys, Sir Richard Scroope and Sir Robert Grosvenor have realised, to their horror, that they are using the same coat of arms. And this just, just isn't on. And, you know, oh, you know, England in the late 14th century, not a happy place. What do they do? They convene the course of chivalry. So to decide who has the right to use this. And it's very well documented and one of the things, it's very interesting is it talks about the placement of coats of arms around monasteries. And those coats of arms have been placed there to show the social reserve of these monasteries, that this guy, this powerful family, are historic benefactors of my monastery. Don't you dare think about taking us on, because he's on our side. And then another side of it is it's a visual record of who has been a benefactor. And the Scroope and Grosvenor case mentions coats of arms in various places at Byland Abbey, including a gatehouse chapel dedicated to Mary Magdalene. Often a place where actually there is a chantry chapel established in there. I think that's very interesting. But the monks are taught how to recognise these coats of arms so they know who to pray for. So I think there is definitely that thing of if you are rich, you're gonna have a bit of advantage in terms of prayers, but let's remember Christ is going to look so favorably upon you if you are poor that the sins of the. Of the powerful will often be so much greater that perhaps they need that extra help to buy their salvation.

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[Interviewer / Podcast Host]

You've mentioned something here that I just wanted to hit on as, which is, you know, the violent ghost stories report to us all these varying incredible chapels that have been endowed by wealthy people. But there's also a Byland ghost story about a member of the revenant dead who comes back one winter because he's paid to be buried in the abbey. But he was not a very nice guy and it doesn't do him any good.

[Dr. Michael Carter]

Yeah, that is one of the Byland stories that it kind of stands outside the other ones, which is they show the efficacy of prayer. And this one is about a guy called James Tankerly, and he's a local priest, place called Cold Kirby, just over the moors from Byland. And as you said, he's been buried in a very advantageous place at Byland Abbey. He's got an intramural burial. Actually, he's been buried in the East Cloister Walk before the entrance to the chapter house. Now, there were few better places to be buried in the medieval monasteries, and that is very, very visible to the community as they go to their daily chapter meeting and hopefully say prayers for the salvation of your soul. And he would probably. We don't have a will. In actual fact, it's been very difficult to track the guy down in medieval records, but he would probably have had to have made a very substantial gift to a monastery to secure that privilege. And it becomes very apparent from the story that Tankerly did not deserve to be buried in such a brilliant location and how he rises bodily from his grave. He is an animated corpse. He is a revenant, one who returns a night walker, or as they are often described in medieval chronicles as satellites of Satan. You know, it gives you an idea. Bloodsucker, they're sometimes called a shroud chewer. And he walks across the moors to Cold Kirby, and it is obvious from the story that he has been living a life of sin because he goes there, encounters his former concubine and Gouges or blows out her eye and then returns to his sepulchre, Byland. And unsurprisingly, the monks are much troubled by this occurrence. So they decide to exhume the body. They put it in an oxcart and they take it down to a local lake called the Gormeyer, which at that time was thought to be bottomless. And extraordinarily, it's not fed by streams, it's fed by underground springs as well, which I think probably added to its sense of mystery. It's owned by the monastery. It was given to the monastery as a gift in the 13th century, and they throw Tankerly's body into it. Now, that's a way of dealing with a revenant, that. Throwing them in deep lakes. And think about those bog bodies that are often encountered. They're often thought to be people who were on the edge, transgressive in some way. And there are other stories of supposed revenants being thrown into boggy and wet deaths. The oxes dragging the cart are said to be terrified and they almost bawl. The person who copied down the ghost stories then says, well, have they done the right thing? Thing? Was he truly beyond salvation? Because they have effectively condemned him to hell. And he said, well, if he wasn't really among the damned, may God forgive my brother monks who did this. And I think there's a reminder in that story that monks were meant to be in the business of saving souls, not damning them for all eternity. And, I mean, I think the story is, you know, it's quite a late revenant story. Most of the revenant stories we have are from the 12th century into the 13th century. They do come up later in the Middle Ages as well. But the Byland one there is about the moral ambiguity as well. But it also shows that those who fall from the highest places fall farthest. And a lot of revenant stories do involve people who should have known better. Nearby to Byland, there was Newborough Priory, and a guy called William of Newburgh writes for the Abbot of Rivo, a chronicle of English affairs. And it's peppered with revenant stories. And one of those involves a priest buried at Malrose Abbey called the Hound Priest because of his love of hunting. And he lived. He comes back as a revenant and has lived a very evil life. And then the Lanacross chronicle from the 14th century describes a Benedictine monk who comes back as a revenant, and again, he's lived an evil life. So there's something Consistent there that, you know, are you going to be a night walker, a satellite of Satan, if you have sinned so much that the devil may well animate your corpse at night and you're not going to be saved? You know, okay, there's the odd story of a revenant being saved by having a certificate of absolution buried with them. But most of them are exhumed, have the heart ripped out, head struck off, dismembered limb from limb, and their remains thrown on the fire. Kind of reminding you of vampire stories there. Indeed. And John Blair from Oxford has just published a brilliant book called Killing the Dead, where he discusses belief in revenants over what millennia?

[Interviewer / Podcast Host]

I think that this is a really interesting point, though, because a lot of the ghost stories that are told or that survived to us are very different from modern ghost stories in that the ghosts are often corporeal, you know, even if they aren't necessarily the revenant dead. They can touch you, they can be seized. That is something that happens quite often. Or in the case of poor Snowball, he gets very ill.

[Narrator / Host (Dr. Eleanor Jennica)]

Right.

[Interviewer / Podcast Host]

You know, there are physical effects as a result of consorting with ghosts, which I think is quite interesting, especially in terms of stories that we're telling in the winter. Right. Like the cold hand on the shoulder, the physical unwellness. You know, these are all things that tie together to paint us a picture of this world where, you know, there are actual consequences. This isn't just about seeing, you know, a little boy in Victorian clothes run through a wall. These are things that they are touching and feeling.

[Dr. Michael Carter]

Yeah, it's really interesting, these Bylawn stories. They're kind of a moulding of tradition in them. They are unmistakably Catholic monastic ghost stories, by and large. You know, they underline the efficacy of prayer for the salvation of souls. No two ways about it. But some of the even quite pious ghosts that they want to be saved do take corporeal form. And there's one of them of somebody thrusting their hand into this corpse, of someone carrying one on their back. You know, it's a pious ghost, but they're still taking kind of revenant form and that thing of ghosts leaving you very ill. Several of the Bylan stories describe how people are really, really physically affected by this encounter with the dead, the returning spirit. And I think as well, the dialogue of Miracles of Caesarius of Heisterbach, another Cistercian, a couple of hundred years earlier. And some of his stories talk of people having encounters with ghosts and how they subsequently, they Expire. It has been such a profoundly shocking experience that they too go and meet their maker. And I'm sure that they go and meet their maker with all their unconfessed sins shriven. And you have a very, very short time in purgatory as they've done their Christian duty as regards these ghosts. And there is something there about, you know, isn't there? Do we have resonances today in ghost stories? Stories about people's hair going white on encountering a ghost, of having it really taken out of them? There's one of the violent stories I'm always intrigued about, and that involves a monk. Well, he's a canon. You know, I'm going to get nerdy here. He's an Augustinian and he's stolen six silver spoons from the monastic refectory. You know, you see inventories from medieval monasteries and silver spoons are singled out, and I think that's because they're paid for by benefactors. So when the monks are having their pottage, or probably by that time, something much more tasty. The monastic diet does improve significantly over the Middle Ages, that you're saying prayers for the salvation of the soul of the banner. Patrick is there. Anyway, he's nicked these six silver spoons and he's never been absolved by the prior for doing that. So he appears to this workman, and I think it is on a cold winter's day in a field and scares the hell out of him, tells him what he's got to do, go find the spoons, restore them, get absolution. And then he comes back, the workman does that for him again at great time and some financial expense. The ghost comes back and rests in his black Augustinian habit and says, thanks, mate, in heaven. And the poor guy who has done all these wonderful things sickens, you know, he has to take to his bed. That these ghosts are. The physicality of them is extraordinary. It is such a topos, isn't it, that an encounter with a ghost, you will have a physical sensation with it, the coldness, the hair standing on end, the sort of resonances over the centuries of that.

[Interviewer / Podcast Host]

Absolutely. I mean, I find it quite interesting too, because we see a very similar thing in Japanese ghost stories, both from the period and moving forward, where, you know, ghosts, they can come grab you, you know, and they can make you ill. Like, you know, ghost sickness is a specific thing that is talked about both within the Japanese Buddhist and Shinto traditions, where, you know, if you are too in contact with a ghost, it can just make you ill and then slowly kind of leech the life out of you. And I find it so interesting that we have this direct link in the medieval ghost story, very particularly that we tend to lack in the modern. One can be shocked, one could perhaps be frightened to death. But there's less of this idea of the kind of leeching quality of a ghost.

[Dr. Michael Carter]

I suppose that's really interesting. Again, thinking of going back to the snowball story and how the ghost advises him, do you want to be rich or do you want to be poor? If you want to be poor, you stay where you are and it's because you have been consorting with the dead. People know you have been digging in my tomb and things like that. Is it that you have somehow become tainted? And you know, I almost hesitate to use the word but unclean because of your association with a troubled spirit. Very interesting indeed.

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[Interviewer / Podcast Host]

Listen, Michael, we've been talking a lot about all of the incredible ghost stories that one tells. Round fires in the winter in the medieval period. But that isn't necessarily a tradition that's died out, you know, As I say, I think people tend to now think of October as the spooky season. And I'm not mad about that, you know, and anytime anyone wants to get spooky, I'm happy. That's fine. But the tradition of the winter ghost tale was still alive and well, at least at the turn of the century. And with I Hasten to add one of your favorite medievalists and mine, Mr. James, and we have on gone medieval before, talked about Mr. James really extensively. But he is so interesting to me because he has this medievalism, you know, we call it when there's a medievalism is when you're trying to do something that is kind of medieval. You know, for example, Tolkien's stories are medievalisms, right? But he's got this life medievalism which is that he tells ghost stories every Christmas and he gets the boys in at Eton or he brings in the residence of kings and they all sit around the fire and they all turn out all of the lights and they all hear his spooky stories. So he's doing this medieval thing. But he's also oftentimes telling stories that very specifically involve medieval ghosts in that these ghosts have come through from the medieval period and are now terrorizing, well, let's face it, a series of Cambridge Dawns, because the man can only write about himself. But I find that really, really interesting.

[Dr. Michael Carter]

Yeah, really interesting. I mean, I think, you know, one thing that I always think about these ghost stories is we talked about them reading them around the campfire. The Byland stories and things like Caesarea's of Heisterback would have been read in a freezing cold cloister. And again, I think there's a, you know, there's something there about feeling, what's that at the back of my neck? But James is extraordinary. Now, James has a direct connection with the Byland Abbey ghost story. He transcribed them and published them in the English historical review in 1922. And it's thanks to James that I think they have become probably the best known of all English medieval ghost stories. And he writes a little commentary about them. He didn't translate them. They were translated in the Yorkshire Archaeological Journal a year or two later. And that is an excellent translation, I would add. And there's other translations available as well. But James talks about the stories as having something of Scandinavia about them. And there are definitely these revenant stories. Some of the ghosts do have resonances with pre Christian Scandinavia and James was very, very interested in that as well. And you mention his medieval ghosts, you know, like Canon Alberich's scrapbook. Well, it involves this extraordinary collection of plundered leaves from a chapter library at St. Bertram de Commage. And James describes the cathedral, the cloister, exactly as it is. A few 20 odd years ago we went on what was meant to be a walking holiday in the Pyrenees and I just dragged my mates around to Places of medieval interest instead. But I mean, that involves a 17th century cleric who has basically conjured a demon. The medieval manuscript, the topography of the medieval cathedral plays a key role. Then you have oh, whistle and I'll come to you. And probably his most famous story, and certainly I think the best ever adaptation of one of his stories. 1969, directed by Jonathan Miller, starring Michael Horden. But the story involves a whistle discovered in the ruins of a Templar preceptory on the East Anglian coast. It's blown and again we tie into folk traditions along the Yorkshire coast and into Scandinavia, and it summons a ghost of some sort. And then there's this character in it. He's a kind of figure of funk, a retired colonel, secretary of a London club, and possessed of opinions of a distinctly Protestant type. But it is the Protestant good sense of this guy who saves the day, you know, and there, I think there's a little bit of a theme of anti Catholicism in James's stories, that in the Treasure of Abbot Thomas, it's stained glass windows that provide the inspiration for it. Stained glass windows which you can still see to this day, incidentally, in the V and A. Most of them in the V and A, from the monastery of Seinfeld in the Ey Feld which James studied. He encountered them formally. They'd been in a private chapel. They'd been taken out of their context at the French Revolution, bought here, and then came to James's attention. The abbot of the story is a necromancer who has set this guardian, this awful beast, to defend his treasure. Then there's his Scandinavian tales. Both of them involve some way or another, something deeply, deeply sinister in Catholicism. There is the number 13. There's a bishop who's basically defended the devil himself, Count Magnus. Okay, it's a 17th century story, but there's something Catholic in that as well. There's the three crowns of East Anglia in a warning to the curious. And then one of his, I think, you know, casting the runes. It's not explicitly a medieval story, you know. You know, well, runes are very interesting, actually. There is a manuscript from Byland Abbey with runes in it, incidentally, which, you know, another kind of connection, I suppose. But the guy Carswell is described as being the abbot of Lufford, his house, and there was indeed a monastery called Rufford, and I do wonder if that is a coincidence. And yet Carswell is a terrible character. He's guilty of terrible scholarship. Oh, gosh, Downright evil. Then there's a view from a hill which Someone looks through dead eyes. He exhumes bodies from a monastic cemetery and gallows hill to see through their eyes. And seen through these dead people's eyes, he can see the magnificent tower of a long demolished medieval monastery. I mean, I argued in an article published in Notes and queries about 15 years ago that the guy who is the bad guy in A View From a Hill, a guy called Baxter, he's described as being a clockon watchmaker, a great antiquary, an excavator of a Roman villa whose most perfect examples are now in the Fitzwilliam Museum in Cambridge, might have been partly based on a guy called Thomas Inskip of Shefford, who was a clock and watchmaker and whose accomplishments in his obituary in the Gentleman's Magazine sound extraordinarily like those attributed to Baxter as well. So there is a lot of medievalism in James's story. He knew it. But there's also, let's be honest, as well with James's stories, some villains from later centuries as well. He's very interested in the 17th and 18th century and some thoroughly nasty characters there, untainted by medieval Catholicism or later Catholicism. And the stalls of Barchester Cathedral, it's a medieval cathedral, it's its modernisation, it's its Gothicization at his time, you know, which James was really, really against. But the stalls that are ripped out, they're not medieval stalls. They're kind of, you know, they're more classical in design. And the real villain in that story is an archdeacon in the Church of England. So he was, was ecumenical in his religious approach to them and also in his personal life. James showed, although he described Algar's dream of Gerontius as papalistic nonsense, he was very, very generous to Roman Catholic scholars and gave gifts to Roman Catholic charities and hard up Catholic boarding school. And I think there's another insight into James at the end of Canon Alberich's scrapbook. It ends with a Presbyterian, the guy who's experienced the haunting, basically saying that he has paid for the singing of requiem masses for the soul of the eponymous canon. And I think that's a good way of ending. It's prayers for the dead.

[Interviewer / Podcast Host]

Listen, you're never gonna get too far from prayers for the dead in any medieval ghost story. You're just not. It's kind of the panacea of the medieval ghost. And you know, I think that also it's something to think about when you are shivering in the cold, when everyone's coming around the hearth. That is something to Warm the soul itself. This idea that there is something that one can do even when presented with these horrors, you know.

[Dr. Michael Carter]

Yeah, that is the great thing with the medieval ghost story. You have agency within them. You are not helpless. And, you know, altruism, you're committing an altruistic act and altruism makes you feel better about yourself. There's a very, very strong Christian message in them there. And they're also so many ghost stories are psychological, you know, Boy. I mean, there's a whole raft of scholarship on James's psychology as well. And, you know, ghost stories have endlessly subjected to psychological analysis. But, you know, there's something there as well, I think, about doing good and doing good by the dead as well. Sometimes the stories, you know, my mum, my mum was Irish and we grew up on her knee being told ghost stories and especially in the winter months. And occasionally she realized she might have gone a little bit too far and there were four of us and she'd say in her accent, which was this wonderful mixture of Dublin and West Yorkshire, oh, boys, it's not the dead you need to be frightened of, but the living. And I think the reason why these medieval posh boys I've been talking about earlier needed so many masses saying for them underlines that point, the evil that man will do to other men.

[Interviewer / Podcast Host]

Well, Michael, on that cheery note, thank you so much for coming along to talk about my very favorite thing in the world.

[Dr. Michael Carter]

Well, I hope all the listeners have a happy and haunting Christmas.

[Narrator / Host (Dr. Eleanor Jennica)]

The medieval winter ghost story tradition that Dr. Carter has worked to preserve and illuminate continues to influence us today as we face our own long winter nights in the northern hemisphere. These stories remind us that winter has always been a season of darkness and wonder when the boundary between the living and the dead grows thin and when gathering together to share tales of the supernatural brings both delicious shivers and profound comfort in keeping these stories alive through his research and public engagement, Dr. Michael Carter ensures that the voices of the medieval dead and their ghostly son subjects continue to speak to us across the centuries. Thanks once again to Dr. Michael Carter and to you for listening to Gone Medieval from history hit. Remember, you can enjoy unlimited access to award winning original TV documentaries, including my new film about winter ghost stories and my recent film about the trials of Joan of Arc, as well as as ad free podcasts by signing [e-mail] subscription. You can follow Gone Medieval on Spotify where you can leave us comments and.

[Interviewer / Podcast Host]

Suggestions or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Narrator / Host (Dr. Eleanor Jennica)]

And tell all your friends and family.

[Interviewer / Podcast Host]

That you've gone medieval.

[Narrator / Host (Dr. Eleanor Jennica)]

Until next time.

[Dr. Michael Carter]

Foreign.

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