Selena Gomez: Actress, singer, beauty mogul

Summary

Good Bad Billionaire: Selena Gomez – Actress, Singer, Beauty Mogul

Episode Release Date: April 28, 2025

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Introduction

In this episode of Good Bad Billionaire, hosted by Simon Jack and Zing Seng from the BBC World Service, the focus shifts to Selena Gomez—a multifaceted artist who has traversed the realms of acting, singing, and entrepreneurial ventures to become one of the youngest female self-made billionaires. Through an in-depth exploration of her journey, the hosts evaluate whether Selena stands as a good, bad, or typical billionaire.

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Early Life and Career Beginnings

Selena Gomez was born on July 22, 1992, in Grand Prairie, Texas, into a Mexican American family with a challenging background. Her paternal grandparents immigrated to the U.S. hidden in the back of a truck, a story that resonates deeply in today’s political climate (05:01). Selena’s father, Ricardo Joe Gomez, settled in Texas after his parents gained citizenship 17 years later (05:30).

At a young age, Selena aspired to be on television. Her first role was in a commercial for Joe’s Crab Shack, which, while modest, marked the beginning of her acting career (07:15). At seven, she landed a role on the beloved children’s show Barney & Friends, earning approximately $3,000 per episode and appearing in 13 episodes before age ten. This early exposure laid the foundation for her future in the entertainment industry (08:24).

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Rise to Fame with Disney and Expanding Horizons

Selena’s breakthrough came in 2007 with the Disney Channel series Wizards of Waverly Place, where she played Alex Russo, a teenage wizard navigating life in New York City. This role catapulted her into the limelight, making her a household name and leveraging her image across television, music, movies, and merchandise (09:55).

Alongside her acting career, Selena launched her music career with the band Selena Gomez and the Scene, releasing the album Kiss & Tell in 2009. By 2012, her solo endeavors began to take shape with her debut album Stars Dance, which featured her first top 10 single, "Come & Get It" (12:00).

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Personal Struggles: Health and Mental Health Battles

Despite her professional success, Selena faced significant personal challenges. In 2013, just as her solo career was gaining momentum, she began experiencing health issues. She was diagnosed with lupus, an autoimmune disease, and underwent chemotherapy. This period was marked by cancellations of tours and public speculation about her mental health (20:08).

Selena publicly revealed her struggles with anxiety, depression, and later, a diagnosis of bipolar disorder in 2016 and 2018 respectively. These revelations were groundbreaking, especially coming from someone in the public eye, as they helped destigmatize conversations around mental health (21:20; 28:03). Her openness about her conditions, including a kidney transplant in 2017, showcased her resilience and commitment to mental health advocacy (26:09; 28:21).

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Transition to Entrepreneurship: Rare Beauty and Wondermind

Leveraging her immense influence, Selena ventured into the business world with the launch of her beauty brand, Rare Beauty, in 2020. Rare Beauty is not just a cosmetic line but a mission-driven company aiming to break down unrealistic standards of perfection. Notably, 1% of all sales go to the Rare Impact Fund, targeting the raising of $100 million over ten years for mental health organizations (30:32; 31:28).

In addition to Rare Beauty, Selena co-founded Wondermind, a mental health platform, with her mother Mandy and Daniela Pearson. Valued at $100 million in 2022, Wondermind offers mental fitness tools, podcasts, and resources aimed at fostering healthy mental habits (33:07).

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Philanthropy and Advocacy

Selena’s philanthropic efforts extend beyond her business ventures. Through Rare Beauty’s Rare Impact Fund, she has pledged significant donations to mental health causes and other nonprofits. For instance, each episode of her cooking show, Selena and Chef Sheb, donates $10,000 to charitable organizations, totaling $400,000 over three seasons (44:22; 44:50).

Moreover, Selena has been an active voice in social and political issues. She executive produced the Netflix documentary series Living Undocumented and used her platform to support the Black Lives Matter movement by temporarily handing over her Instagram account to activists, amplifying their messages to her 400 million followers (30:35; 46:56).

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Becoming a Billionaire

Selena Gomez officially joined the Bloomberg Billionaires Index in September 2024, with an estimated net worth of $1.3 billion. The bulk of her wealth—81%—comes from her stake in Rare Beauty, while the remaining 19% is attributed to endorsements, acting, record sales, and her mental health platform Wondermind (39:08; 39:58).

Rare Beauty alone is valued at $2 billion, with annual sales estimated between $350 million and $400 million. Despite rumors of a potential sale, Selena has no plans to sell her beauty empire, cementing her status as a formidable entrepreneur in the beauty industry (37:46; 38:33).

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Conclusion: Judging Selena Gomez

After a comprehensive evaluation of Selena Gomez’s journey, Simon and Zing conclude that she embodies the qualities of a good billionaire. Her philanthropic endeavors, mental health advocacy, and commitment to using her wealth for social good position her favorably. Despite facing personal and professional challenges, Selena’s resilience and dedication to meaningful causes differentiate her from typical billionaires (48:08; 48:57).

Final Ratings:

• Wealth: 4/10 (Zing: 5/10)
• Villainy: 0/10
• Philanthropy: Simon: 3/10; Zing: 4/10
• Power: 7/10
• Overall Verdict: Good Billionaire

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Notable Quotes

• Zing Seng (02:23): "Because the woman at the center of this storm is none other than Mexican American superstar Selena Gomez."
• Simon Jack (05:01): "Selena Gomez is officially done with playing it safe."
• Zing Seng (20:31): "I was diagnosed with lupus and I've been through chemo. That was my break."
• Simon Jack (37:46): "Anyone with nearly half a billion followers on Instagram is pretty powerful."

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Time Stamps

• [05:01] – Selena's grandparents' immigration story
• [05:30] – Father’s work and early life
• [07:15] – First acting role
• [08:24] – Early earnings and role on Barney & Friends
• [09:55] – Breakthrough with Wizards of Waverly Place
• [12:00] – Solo music career launch
• [20:08] – Public health struggles
• [21:20] – Lupus and its impact
• [26:09] – Kidney transplant revelation
• [28:03] – Bipolar disorder diagnosis
• [30:32] – Launch of Rare Beauty
• [31:28] – Rare Beauty’s mission and sales
• [33:07] – Founding of Wondermind
• [44:22] – Philanthropic initiatives through Rare Beauty
• [44:50] – Donations through her cooking show
• [46:56] – Support for Black Lives Matter
• [37:46] – Valuation and future of Rare Beauty
• [39:08] – Entry into Bloomberg Billionaires Index
• [39:58] – Breakdown of Selena's net worth
• [48:08] – Power and influence on social media
• [48:57] – Final judgment as a billionaire

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Next Episode Teaser

Next week on Good Bad Billionaire, the hosts will delve into the life of Ike Perlmutter, the former Marvel CEO and chairman. Known for his role in resurrecting Marvel Comics and launching the Marvel Cinematic Universe, Ike's story is one of media shyness and strategic profitability.

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Produced by Louise Morris. Research by Annie Rose, Harrison Dunn, and editor Paul Smith.

Transcript

[Simon Jack]

This BBC podcast is supported by ads outside the uk.

[Unknown]

As Africa stands on the brink of accelerated development, the 2025 Africa Markets Conference brought global and African investors, risk leaders, policymakers and regulators together to discuss our economic future, discover key themes, including how to meet the continent's structural needs while driving sustainable growth. And at StandardBank Co ZA CIB Standard bank is an authorized FSP and registered credit provider. Ts and Cs apply.

[Su Lin Wong]

Hi, I'm Su Lin Wong. I'm a journalist at the Economist. And for the past year, I've been investigating how the CEO of a bank in rural Kansas was duped out of $47 million. This wasn't your classic scam. He'd been ensnared by a new global criminal industry, one that's coming for you and me. My new series is called Scam Inc. To listen and subscribe, just search economist podcasts plus.

[Simon Jack]

Okay. It's the summer of 2016, and we're on tour with one of America's biggest pop stars. Behind the glitz and the glamour of the stage, behind the thunderous applause, the thousands of adoring fans, things are not so picture perfect. Backstage are meltdowns, insecurity, exhaustion. And outside the arena walls, a hungry press pack that never sleeps. Whether it's New York or London or Bangkok, Tokyo, Sydney, no matter where she goes, they're there. She's small, big, glasses firmly on and a hoodie pulled tight, hurried through airport terminals and hotel lobbies, barely looking up as the camera flashes explode around her. And the paparazzi are, as they always are, ruthless. Did Justin Bieber make you go to rehab? Are you jealous of Justin's new girlfriend? Are you drinking again? Are you depressed? They shout anything to provoke anything to get that headline shot. But our star just keeps walking, face blank, head down. And then three months into the tour, she pulls the plug, cancels the rest, disappears from the spotlight. The following year, she checks into a rehab facility. And of course, the gossip machine kicks into overdrive. Rumors of her being just another troubled child star wrestling with addiction, too much partying. But there's more to this story than meets the eye.

[Zing Seng]

Because the woman at the center of this storm is none other than Mexican American superstar Selena Gomez. And as you'll find out, there's a whole lot more to her rise, her breakdown, and her billion dollar comeback than the tabloids ever told you. Welcome to Good Bad Billionaire from the BBC World. Each episode, we pick a billionaire and we find out how they made their money. And then we judge them. Are they good Bad or just another billionaire.

[Simon Jack]

I'm Simon Jack. I'm the BBC's business editor and I'm Zing Seng.

[Zing Seng]

I'm a journalist, author and podcaster.

[Simon Jack]

And this week I have to say, you're gonna be leading this one. Yeah, this is more in your wheelhouse, as they say in my world than mine.

[Zing Seng]

I'm assuming you're not a Selenator. Selenator. I'm never sure how to pronounce that.

[Simon Jack]

Selenator. Seleniter. Yeah, no, no, it's the simple answer.

[Zing Seng]

I actually think Selena Gomez and Justin Bieber who comes into this story later on, they were like the Britney and Justin of their era.

[Simon Jack]

The Britney and Justin Timberlake.

[Zing Seng]

Exactly.

[Simon Jack]

Okay, got it.

[Zing Seng]

And it's kind of all the same points you'll hit, you know, former child stars, too much partying, breakdowns, you know, they very much were the kind of tabloid couple of that era.

[Simon Jack]

Okay, so we're going to be talking about Selena Gomez, aged just 32, but already had a long career.

[Zing Seng]

Yeah, she's been in the game for 25 years. So she's one of our newest billionaires. She's currently worth 1.3 billion.

[Simon Jack]

By the way, when I told my wife who we were doing this week and I said Selena Gowers, she literally fell off her chair. She said she is a billionaire.

[Zing Seng]

Well, yeah, she is, although a really recent one. So she only made the Bloomberg billionaires index in 2024. She also claims the title of the most followed woman on Instagram in the world with 421 million followers.

[Simon Jack]

That is wild.

[Zing Seng]

It's more than Kim Kard.

[Simon Jack]

That is incredible. Listen, whether you know the Mexican American star from her Disney kid days as a singer, award winning actress or as a mental health advocate, it's her beauty brand, rare beauty that made her one of America's youngest female self made billionaires with more than 80% of her net worth deriving from her stake in that company. Ring some bells with other billionaires we've talked about in particular Rihanna.

[Zing Seng]

Yes, exactly. Rihanna with fenty beauty. And you know, her personal life is also key to understanding that success as a businesswoman. So we will be covering a lot of that too. We also watched the Selena Gomez documentary Selena Gomez, My Mind and Me, which we found a really useful source.

[Simon Jack]

Well, let's go back to the beginning, from zero to a million.

[Zing Seng]

So we're going to go back a little earlier than we usually do before Selena was even born because this is a really important part of her origin story. So we're going all the Way back to the 1970s. And the back of a truck, which is driving across the Mexican U.S. border, Selena Gomez's paternal grandparents are actually hidden in the back of that truck. They are anxiously hoping to make it across the border undetected. And they do. Selena's father, Ricardo Joe Gomez, was born in Texas shortly after.

[Simon Jack]

Couldn't be more topical than it is right now, that origin story. And it would take Selena's paternal grandparents 17 years to gain U.S. citizenship, Selena remembers. That was such a huge deal. My grandpa was working in construction. He was hiring hundreds of people, and still they were living on the edge, covering up exactly how scary it was.

[Zing Seng]

Riccardo met Salena's mum, Mandy Teefey, in high school, and the couple got pregnant at just 16.

[Simon Jack]

So Selena Gomez was born on July 22, 1992, in Grand Prairie, Texas. That's two months after Tejano music icon Selena Quintanilla Perez released her breakthrough album. And these two teen fans couldn't resist naming their daughter after her. Shades of things to come. Yeah.

[Zing Seng]

Selena grew up living with her mum and maternal grandparents in a Mexican American neighborhood. And she said about having such young, you know, it was hard on me. They were kids, so we were all.

[Simon Jack]

Growing up together, but not together for long, because when Salina was five, her parents split up. Her mum, at that time, just 21 years old, held down several jobs to make ends meet. But Selina said that her mum shielded her from any sense of hardship that was going on.

[Zing Seng]

And her mum, Mandy, also had dreams of her own. She wanted to be an actress, so she would squeeze in rehearsals for local theater productions between work shifts. And then one day, she, little Selena, came along to watch dear old mum. And according to Mandy, Selena was only about 6 or 7 at the time. And she sat through this whole rehearsal completely still transfixed. And on the way home, she didn't say a lot until suddenly she turned to her mum and said, you know, Mum, you might actually be funnier if you did it that way.

[Simon Jack]

Ouch. Tough feedback from your kid.

[Zing Seng]

You know, criticism from a child. Yeah. Selena wasn't just interested in acting, though. She wanted to be on television specifically.

[Simon Jack]

And it didn't take long for that to happen. Her first job, a commercial for a restaurant chain called Joe's Crab Shack. Not exactly glamorous, but you gotta start somewhere, right?

[Zing Seng]

Yep. And Joe's Crab Shack certainly has a claim to fame now.

[Simon Jack]

Yep.

[Zing Seng]

She also landed something much bigger after that. So you might remember a certain big purple dinosaur who captivated children from the 90s. Onwards. I certainly remember him.

[Simon Jack]

Yeah, me too. Actually, I do remember Barney.

[Zing Seng]

Yeah. Well, at the age of seven, Selena got a role as Gianna on Barney and Friends, that famous show, the Long Running children's TV show on pbs.

[Simon Jack]

He was this rather lovable, goofy, kind of slightly dopey dinosaur, Right?

[Zing Seng]

Yes. Played by a guy in a suit.

[Simon Jack]

Yeah. And, well, she loved this. And she once said, I didn't have to live real life. I could go play in Barney World, dancing, having a great time. And that thing about not being in the real world, I think is one of those things that's gonna crop up again and again.

[Zing Seng]

Definitely. Because, you know, while this feels like fun for a kid, it's also serious work. So Salina reportedly earned around $3,000 per episode, although we can't confirm that figure. But either way, she appeared in 13 episodes in total, which is quite the paycheck for a child under the age of 10.

[Simon Jack]

And get this, by the time she was 10, after two seasons, she'd outgrown the role and was let go. In her words, I got the boot because I was too old.

[Zing Seng]

Ouch. That is a real lesson for a very young girl to learn.

[Simon Jack]

For sure.

[Zing Seng]

Well, obviously she had to go back to school, so that wasn't exactly easy either. Selina described herself as feeling like a bit of an outsider.

[Simon Jack]

So there were a few small roles after Barney's World or Barney. But most of her time was spent auditioning for a very specific target. Your kid actor. The holy grail Disney.

[Zing Seng]

Exactly. The big mouse himself. This, however, is not as glamorous as you might imagine it. These children do not get flown out on private jets. Selena and her mom would travel back and forth between their hometown of Texas and la, often scraping by on whatever Disney's per diem allowance could cover.

[Simon Jack]

At one point, they were living in a one room loft in downtown la, along with Selena's Barney co star, Demi Lovato and her entire family.

[Zing Seng]

Demi Lovato also had her own pop career, although arguably not as big as Selena.

[Simon Jack]

Okay, I know about Selena, don't know about Demi.

[Zing Seng]

That's the litmus test.

[Simon Jack]

Okay, have heard of, haven't heard of.

[Zing Seng]

This is like when I asked you to explain Private Equity.

[Simon Jack]

Oh, there we go.

[Zing Seng]

This is my version of private of explaining Private Equity. But you know, let's go back to Selena, because the hustle of her mom and her finally pay off. She lands her first major role, which is starring in a brand new Disney Channel show, Wizards of Waverly Place in 2007. Now, this show was huge. She and her mom pack up for good. They leave Texas and they move to la.

[Simon Jack]

And this show centers on Alex Russo, Selina's character who's a teenage wizard growing up in New York City. Her family runs a small restaurant. But behind the scenes in the show, the siblings are in magical training. One day, only one of them will inherit the family's powers. It premiered in October 2007, when Selena was just 15.

[Zing Seng]

And you know, I talked about how the show was massive while it was a hit. She was everywhere because of the show. Tv, music, movies, merchandise, red carpets. So Salina's image is constantly being circulated. And she later told Vogue, that was my job, in a way, to be perfect. You are considered a figure that kids look up to and they take that seriously there.

[Simon Jack]

And as we know, with fame comes scrutiny, massive scrutiny. And Selena soon experiences the downside of that fame. She's only 15 years old when paparazzi stopped following her, even snapping pictures of her on the beach with family. Selina remembers. We saw faraway grown men with cameras taking Pictures of a 15 year old in her swimsuit. That's a violating feeling, was what she said at the time.

[Zing Seng]

Yeah, really sobering stuff. And then there came her first high profile relationship with another teen star of the time, Justin Bieber, if you remember him, he also made a cameo in our Martha Stewart episode.

[Simon Jack]

Yeah, he was on the comeback trail at that time.

[Zing Seng]

He was on the comeback trail. Yeah, exactly. Well, he had this on again, off again romance of Selena. It became a media obsession. I think the term for it was Jelena. Jelena, Jelena.

[Simon Jack]

When we sort of say her first high profile relationship. Pretty hard to have a higher profile relationship than those two at that time. You know, he was huge.

[Zing Seng]

There were a lot of cryptic posts, Instagram comments. You know, it was like a kind of breadcrumb trail. And, you know, Jelena fans would really try and piece this all together to create this grand overarching narrative of were they, Weren't they? Were they on again, off again?

[Simon Jack]

Well, her mom spoke about that period. Seriously, she said, you have the added pressure of them under the spotlight. They're trying to grow and be themselves and then they don't get to do that free of judgment.

[Zing Seng]

And in what's become sort of a rite of passage for Disney stars, Selena also launches her music career. She forms a band called Selena Gomez and the Scene.

[Simon Jack]

Yes. Their first album, Kiss and Tell, came out in 2009, following a similar path to her peers, like, for example, Miley Cyrus, who I do know.

[Zing Seng]

Yes, okay. And Sabrina Carpenter. Sabrina Carpenter, you might know.

[Simon Jack]

No, sorry.

[Zing Seng]

Okay. What about the Expresso song? Come on. No, no.

[Simon Jack]

Okay, so, I mean, there are always drawbacks to fame, right? There's Rough with Smooth.

[Zing Seng]

Yeah, exactly. You know, Salina achieved what she wanted to do. She was on television. She was earning big money as well.

[Simon Jack]

Yeah. In fact, reports say she was earning between 25 and $30,000 per episode. Per episode of the Wizards of Waverly Place. Over four seasons, 106 episodes, if you do the math, adds up, somewhere between two and a half and $3.2 million.

[Zing Seng]

Yeah. But we have to remember it's not all take home pay. So a lot of that gets eaten up. There'll be commissions, there'll be taxes, and then there's something called the Coogan account, which is a legal requirement in California where a portion of child actors earnings have to be put into a trust that they cannot touch until they turn 21. So when Wizards wrapped up in 2012, Selena still wasn't 21. So the money was there, but locked away. But still, if you want to go by anyone's measure, you know, she is officially a millionaire.

[Simon Jack]

Such an interesting thing, this Coogan account. I think in a way, it's quite an enlightened thing to do to sort of basically say, I know that there'll be all sorts of people trying to rip you off at this point, so let's put some money aside for when you're a bit older.

[Zing Seng]

Yeah, exactly. Well, it makes sense. But this road from millionaire to billionaire for Salina came with a lot of public highs and very public lows, as.

[Simon Jack]

We will see as we chart her progress from a million to. To a billion.

[Unknown]

As Africa stands on the brink of accelerated development. The 2025 Africa Markets Conference brought global and African investors, risk leaders, policymakers and regulators together to discuss our economic future. Discover key themes, including how to meet the continent's structural needs while driving sustainable growth. At StandardBank Co ZA CIB, Standard bank is an authorised FSP and registered credit provider. Ts and Cs apply.

[Su Lin Wong]

Hi, I'm Su Lin Wong. I'm a journalist at the Economist. And for the past year, I've been investigating how the CEO of a bank in rural Kansas was duped out of $47 million. This wasn't your classic scam. He'd been ensnared by a new global criminal industry, one that's coming for you and me. My new series is called Scam Inc. To listen and subscribe, just search Economist podcasts plus.

[Simon Jack]

So just a Year before Wizards of Waverly place wrapped up, 19 year old Selena decided to put some of her Disney dollars to work by buying her very first home.

[Zing Seng]

We're talking $2.1 million for a little starter mansion in Tazana, California. So a sprawling estate, there's six bedrooms, nine bathrooms, sits on a full acre of completely gated, cordoned off land. There's a basketball court and a fruit orchard. And of course, why not? Celina added a media room, a card room, an outdoor pool with a spa, and a separate guest house later. Oh, and when she sold it in 2014, she sold it to the Australian rapper Iggy Azealia and NBA player Nick Young. They were the ones who scooped IT up for 3.5 million, which is not actually a bad flip.

[Simon Jack]

But I do also like the idea of a starter mansion.

[Zing Seng]

Yeah, it implies much bigger, much better coming later on.

[Simon Jack]

So she's clearly making some big grown up moves here. She's bought a house, stepping away from her Disney show, but Hollywood's still keeping her in the wholesome tween, as they call it, the tween zone. So she's popping up in other movies in that genre.

[Zing Seng]

Yeah, I mean, you just look at the titles to know what they're about. Another Cinderella story, Princess Protection Program, Ramona and Beezus and the Muppets. You know, I have to confess, I did not watch a single one of these movies.

[Simon Jack]

I am one of the world's biggest Muppet fans. I try and catch everything the Muppets do. I miss this one.

[Zing Seng]

Yeah, which tells you something, even for a Muppet super fan.

[Simon Jack]

Yeah, but here's the thing. That child star clout does mean she can command some serious money. For her role in Monte Carlo in 2011, Selena reportedly got two and a half million dollars playing an American tourist mistaken for a British heiress in France.

[Zing Seng]

And then, boom. A riot of dayglo bikinis, bumping, grinding guns, chaos. It all explodes onto our screens. And in the words of the movie, it's spring break, y'all, and Selena Gomez is officially done with playing it safe. So she split from her band, she goes solo, and what now? So she's stepping outside her PG past with this bold, risky role in a 2012 indie flick called Spring Breakers. It's raunchy, it's violent, it's directed by a kind of enfant terrible of film harmony. Karine Selena plays a girl called Faith. So she's one of four college girls, including another ex Disney star, Vanessa Hudgens. They rob a fast food joint to Fund a wild spring break vacation. And, you know, there's booze, there's drugs, there's police arrests. They're always in bikinis. And the girls are bailed out by James Franco playing this gun toting, grill wearing drug dealer character.

[Simon Jack]

I did, just for research purposes, look at the trailer of this film, and I found myself saying, I hope that no one is watching me watch this. It's sort of. It's research. I promise you, it's research.

[Zing Seng]

Yeah. I mean, Celaena's character, I have to say, is probably the least morally vile character in the whole show. You know, she's the moral compass. She's the one who's. She checks out. She gets spooked a bit by all the crazy stuff. She checks out. She goes home before things get really gnarly, and they really do. The rest of them are not so lucky. But I will say it is a good film. It is entertaining. What Selena made clear at the time was that it's about taking a really calculated risk, not blowing up that image for the shock factor, you know, in the same way Miley Cyrus had done in that Wrecking Ball music video where she's basically posing naked on top of a wrecking ball. So she actually told the New York Times that she wouldn't have taken on one of the edgier roles in that film because it's as far as I could go at this point in my career and life. It's me taking baby steps. I know people will judge my involvement in the film as a whole, and I'm prepared for that. So that's interesting. She didn't want to go the full.

[Simon Jack]

Arc, and the critics were divided, right?

[Zing Seng]

Yes. Some called it provocative, brilliant. Others thought it was pure trash. But Spring breakers was actually a commercial success, which is relatively rare for an indie film, and it even earned a spot in competition for the golden lion at the Venice Film Festival.

[Simon Jack]

2013 was, in fact, a whirlwind year for Selena Gomez. She was working to reintroduce herself to the world, all grown up. As we've discussed, she had a couple of films out. She was hitting the promotional circuit hard. She was on every show. Dancing with the Stars, Late show with David Letterman, Good Morning America, Jimmy Fallon's Late Night Show. And the goal is simple. Get in front of an audience who'd never even heard of Wizards of Waverly Place and probably didn't know who Barney was.

[Zing Seng]

Yeah, exactly. So while she was still pivoting professionally, though, there was still kind of problems in her personal life because it was making Just as many headlines. So she was still weathering a very public fallout from a breakup with Justin Bieber. They'd actually called it quits the year before, reportedly due to crazy schedules and some quote, unquote, trust issues. But the press just wouldn't let it go.

[Simon Jack]

Still, Salina had no shortage of other stuff going on in her life. Just after turning 21, her debut solo album, Stars Dance, shot straight to number one. Her single Come and Get it was her first to crack the top 10. So things were looking up.

[Zing Seng]

And then in August, she kicked off her solo tour. But after powering through 60 shows, she abruptly cancelled the remaining 13 dates across Australia and Asia. And her reason, she said, was, it's become clear to me and those close to me that after many years of putting my work first, I need to spend some time on myself to be the best person I can be. And then came even more headlines.

[Simon Jack]

Yeah. In January 2014, Salina quietly checked herself into a rehab facility in Arizona. The media calls went wild. Whispers of addiction, heartbreak, burnout. Classic child star narrative was practically writing itself.

[Zing Seng]

But everyone had it all wrong. So a year later, in a 2015 interview with Billboard, Salina set the record straight. She'd been battling lupus, which is a serious autoimmune disease. She'd undergone chemotherapy. She was sick, she wasn't coming off drugs. And in her words, I was diagnosed with lupus and I've been through chemo. That's what my break was really about. I could have had a stroke. And the worst part, she says, was I was angry. I even felt the need to say that. It's awful walking into a restaurant and having the room look at you, knowing what they're saying. I locked myself away until I was comfortable and confident again.

[Simon Jack]

Yeah. And it is a serious disease, lupus. It's one of those ones which can have huge variety of symptoms and it is really debilitating.

[Zing Seng]

It's incredible. She was even touring with lupus.

[Simon Jack]

Yeah. Really, really amazing. And we're clearly getting an idea where she's, you know, battling quite a lot of things, both on her physical and her mental health. And she says she wants to hide away. The trappings of fame, however, and success do mean that her hideaway is not that bad. She retreated to her $3.7 million estate in Calabasas, which is a sort of private, quiet, kind of nice area of Los Angeles, away from all that tabloid noise.

[Zing Seng]

Yep. Famously also the home to the Kard.

[Simon Jack]

Yes, of course it is. Yeah. They're probably neighbours.

[Zing Seng]

Yes, exactly. Well, neighbours in negated communities. But just after a month after she settles into that Calabasas estate, Selena drops a bombshell. So she fires her mum and stepdad as her managers. Mandy. Do you remember Mandy? Her mom said it was a total shock, but honestly, this is kind of a classic coming of age moment in the entertainment world. Right. Selena says it was awkward and at the time it felt like she'd lost everything, but she wasn't about to stay down for long.

[Simon Jack]

It's such an interesting moment that isn't when you basically realize, I've gone into a professional sphere where having mum and dad, or mum in her case, is not the most appropriate person, the most clued up, the most experienced to be your manager. It happens with sports stars as well. If you think about it like McEnroe, there comes a point in saying, I've taken you so far and actually I'm pretty ill equipped to deal with the level of fame that you've now achieved.

[Zing Seng]

Yeah, exactly. You know, parental feelings come in, they can interfere and things can get Messy.

[Simon Jack]

Yeah. In 2016, Selena, he was back on the road again, this time to promote her second solo album, Revival. New album, new energy, and a new label, Interscope. So couldn't get a bit more further away from Disney than Interscope. Very famous for being hip hop kind of music label.

[Zing Seng]

Yeah. So this revival tour was meant to be this new chapter in her life, like a full reboot of that music career after years of health battles. But just like her first solo tour, it really didn't go the distance. So three months in, while she was in New Zealand, Selena pulled the plug on the whole thing. She shared publicly that she was struggling with anxiety, panic attacks and depression, things that she says were side effects of her lupus. And she said, I know I'm not alone. And by sharing this, I hope others will be encouraged to address their own issues. The tour by then had brought in over $30 million in ticket sales, and.

[Simon Jack]

It did nothing to slow down her star power, because in 2016, she became the most followed person on Instagram, 103 million followers at the time, edging close friend and another one of our billionaires, Taylor Swift. Beating Taylor Swift on social media is no mean feat.

[Zing Seng]

Yeah, I mean, I think this is a really interesting kind of inflection point in pop star celebrity, because, and I know now Taylor Swift seems completely untouchable in the same way that Beyonce is completely untouchable. But you have moments in some pop stars careers where they really weren't just on top and there were lots of people coming up behind them to snatch the crown, like Selena Gomez could have become one of those people. It's actually strange that Selena isn't even bigger than she already is. You know, as we talk, she's got a new album coming out with her fiance, Benny Blanco. Maybe that will be the thing that pushes her finally to the top tier. But, you know, I do think her health conditions have been the kind of thing that have maybe held her back from becoming a total global superstar.

[Simon Jack]

Interesting. Held her back or enhanced her appeal to a generation who basically welcomed the idea that mental health issues, physical health issues, whatever, were difficult for everyone and, you know, actually struggling. Caus Swift comes across as kind of almost like an Amazonian queen, but she's. She's very strong. And where Selena Gomez. It's slightly different message, which I would say channels into quite a lot of people's experiences.

[Zing Seng]

Yeah, it's an interesting debate. I do feel like if you want to make a lot of money, and this is what I learned from our Taylor episode, if you want to make a lot of money in music and you want to do it through touring and your actual music, you have to be an absolute machine. You can't stop touring, you can't stop making new music, you can't take a break in the way that Selena has. But Selena's found, as we'll see later on in the episode, a different way to make those billions.

[Simon Jack]

Yeah. And of course, the brands, the brands, the brands, the brands, of course, are paying attention. Anyone who's got over 100 million followers on any social media platform in the attention economy, as it's called, you are hot property.

[Zing Seng]

Exactly. Selena locked in deals of brands like Coach of Louis Vuitton. Each one was reportedly worth $10 million. And the following year, she had a partnership for $30 million of Puma Sports brand.

[Simon Jack]

Yeah.

[Zing Seng]

So making serious bank of brands.

[Simon Jack]

Exactly. And then in 2017, Selena shocked the world again with an Instagram post that went viral. She revealed she'd undergone a kidney transplant due to complications from lupus, and that her best friend, actress Francia Raisa, had been the one to donate hers. The photo pictured Salina and Francia holding hands in their hospital beds. A pretty raw shot of Salina's post surgery scar. And that post alone racked up over 10 million likes.

[Zing Seng]

Yeah. So quite the kind of disclosure, I guess.

[Simon Jack]

Yeah, sure.

[Zing Seng]

And in 2018, Selena announced that she was actually stepping away from social media altogether. Not long after, she quietly entered another mental health treatment facility.

[Simon Jack]

Yeah. And then in 2018, Selena's mum, Mandy. Remember, she's been fired as her kind of manager. Her mum gets a call, but it's not from Selena. It's from the tabloid press. And they are asking, why is your daughter in the hospital with a nervous breakdown? Well, Mandy was blindsided. She later said Selena didn't want anything to do with me and I was scared she was going to die. Meanwhile, Selena's mental health had taken a terrifying turn. Things had escalated. She was hearing voices. She had experienced an episode of psychosis.

[Zing Seng]

Now, Salina says she doesn't remember much from this time, but she does know that she spent several months in a treatment facility. She was paranoid. She couldn't trust anyone. And at her lowest, she was saying she didn't want to be alive. And there were real fears that she might never recover.

[Simon Jack]

And it was around this time that doctors diagnosed her with bipolar disorder. And for Selena, that diagnosis finally made everything else click. The crushing lows, the manic highs, all of it suddenly made sense. She later told Rolling Stone there were times she couldn't sleep for nights in a row. Times she felt she needed to buy a car for everyone she knew. And then there were the crashes, weeks, months, sometimes when she couldn't get out of bed. I didn't want anyone to talk to me, she said.

[Zing Seng]

And while this diagnosis brought her some clarity, the treatment itself was anything but smooth. So Selena was prescribed multiple medications, some of which left her feeling like a ghost. She said eventually, there was a new psychiatrist who stepped in, cut back most of her meds, and slowly, Selena said, she began to feel. Feel human again.

[Simon Jack]

And it's not the only thing she retraced because she also reconnected with her mom and stepdad, the very people she'd once pushed away.

[Zing Seng]

Yeah. She also opened up about the actual toll it took on her. She says, I had to learn how to remember certain words. I'd forget where I was in the middle of conversations. It took a lot of hard work, first, to accept that I was bipolar, and second, to learn to actually live with it because it's not going away.

[Simon Jack]

And she goes public with her bipolar diagnosis in April 2020 on an episode, funnily enough, of Miley Cyrus Lockdown, Instagram Live series. Bright minded, so, you know, brave move. The language around. All of this has changed. Back in Judy Garland's era, 100 years ago, nearly, you know, she was going through stuff, having mental breakdowns and depression. The studios would never have dreamt of allowing people to know that at the time.

[Zing Seng]

Yeah, she would never have been allowed to Talk about it. But I think what's so interesting about Selena opening up about this is that that, you know, having bipolar disorder is still a highly stigmatized condition. Not a lot of people know very much about it. You know, it's still kind of seen as this disorder that makes you really erratic, untrustworthy. It's seen as a kind of debilitating, severe illness. Whereas I feel like the mental health conversations now, we've managed to destigmatize a lot of stuff around anxiety and depression. But bipolar disorder is one of those conditions, I think that is still kind of falling behind.

[Simon Jack]

So that's interesting. So that you would put that in a separate category.

[Zing Seng]

Exactly. So I do think, genuinely, this was a brave thing for her to do.

[Simon Jack]

Yeah. And around this time, we sort of see a shift in her herself. A kind of political awakening, maybe.

[Zing Seng]

Yeah, definitely. Like, she opened up about her family history. You know, she told people that her paternal grandparents were undocumented when they came to the US that is actually a really big deal given how politically loaded that issue is. And she also executive produced a Netflix documentary series called Living Undocumented, which spotlights the stories of immigrant families facing deportation. Also, during the Black Lives Matter movement, she handed over her Instagram account, which was, you know, one of the most followed in the world, to black activists, so they could share their voices and reach millions directly. So, you know, a real pivot, I.

[Simon Jack]

Would say it's quite a thing to give away.

[Zing Seng]

We talk about the attention economy being worth millions, probably even billions, Hundreds of.

[Simon Jack]

Billions, I would say.

[Zing Seng]

Yeah. So that is a very powerful thing to do.

[Simon Jack]

We've talked a lot about her personal journey. Let's talk about the money.

[Zing Seng]

Yes, let's.

[Simon Jack]

Because that's why we're here in many ways. Because that same year, 2020, Selena decided to launch a beauty brand with a mission baked right into its DNA, which was about supporting mental health. And it's called Rare Beauty. I was talking to my daughter about this and saying, Selena Gomez. And whereas my wife fell off a chair thinking because she's a billionaire, my daughter had no problem believing that and said, it must be Rare Beauty. It's so popular. And so it is. But she's combined that with some of the previous issues we've talked about, because 1% of all rare Beauty sales go directly to Selena's Rare Impact Fund charity, with the goal of raising $100 million over the next 10 years for mental health organizations.

[Zing Seng]

And even the names of the products nod to these kind of, you know, popular affirmations. Stay vulnerable. Liquid eyeshadow. Always an optimist. Eye primer With Gratitude lip balm. I mean, I'm kind of a cynic, so I don't think I would be reaching for the With Gratitude lip balm anytime soon.

[Simon Jack]

It's a long way from the power suits and the makeup of the 1980s where it was all about projecting power.

[Zing Seng]

Right. The brand itself, actually, you know, to counter all the cynicism, says it's about breaking down unrealistic standards of perfection. But obviously if, you know, if you're a cynic, you'll agree with Time magazine's assessment, which is that there's a tension here. Gomez and her team are managing to sell millions of dollars worth of product while also promoting the idea that no one needs makeup.

[Simon Jack]

Yeah, buy this makeup you don't need. She was quick to respond though, saying, I hope I don't. And I hope Rare Beauty doesn't give off the vibe that you have to do anything. And when it comes to that double standard, people being judged for showing imperfections and wearing too much makeup, she said in more BBC friendly terms. Well, she said, but it's rubbish, let's put it that way.

[Zing Seng]

So Rare Beauty joins a very crowded market for celebrity beauty brands, including a few that's made some of our previous billionaires on the show very wealthy. So Kim Kardashian's skin and Rihanna's Fenty Beauty. But this is not a problem. Rare Beauty seems to be more than holding its own against those brands. In 2022, it sells $70 million worth of its best selling blusher and it raised 5 million for the rare Impact Fund.

[Simon Jack]

And Salina also co founded a mental health platform called wondermind alongside her mum, Mandy and Daniela Pearson. What is this kind of thing?

[Zing Seng]

Well, it calls itself a mental fitness ecosystem. So break it down. It's mental health tools, it's podcasts, interviews, newsletters. It's all aimed at helping people build healthy habits around their mental well being. This isn't just a passion project, though, it's a business.

[Simon Jack]

It is, because in 2022, Wondermine was valued at a cool $100 million and had backing from big names like Lightspeed Venture Partners, Sequoia Capital. Now, in my world, Sequoia Capital, if you've got the backing of Sequoia Capital, these are people who back some of the biggest Internet businesses in history. Even tennis legend Serena Williams has her own capital fund called Serena Ventures. So she's in as well.

[Zing Seng]

Well, apparently the mental health startup market is worth $5.5 billion in 2021.

[Simon Jack]

Yeah.

[Zing Seng]

Which seems like so much money.

[Simon Jack]

Yeah. There is a massive commercial opportunity in doing for mental health what medical technology has done for physical health. So it's an enormous pit of potential money.

[Zing Seng]

Yeah. What's the GlaxoSmithKline of mental health, basically?

[Simon Jack]

Well, I mean, GlaxoSmithKline would probably tell you that they are all over that too, so.

[Zing Seng]

But importantly, you know, she's not just doing wondermind. She hasn't actually left acting behind. Selena began starring in a Hulu TV show, only murders in the building. In 2021. She stars as a podcaster. So a girl after our own hearts. Yep. And it also paid off, both literally and figuratively. She earned her first ever Emmy nomination for acting in 2024. Later, a golden Globe nod, too.

[Simon Jack]

Yeah. She stars in all four seasons of the show. It's estimated she's earning at least $6 million per season. And that's not including her extra pay as an executive producer. And, you know, from ever watching the credits for any successful thing, there are lots of executive producers.

[Zing Seng]

Exactly. Very important people in the business in 2022.

[Simon Jack]

We love our own, by the way.

[Zing Seng]

We love our own exec producers and producers. In 2022, Selena revealed her most vulnerable work yet. She actually took audiences behind the scenes of this mental health journey with a very raw and unfiltered documentary called Selena Gomez My Mind and Me Now. Important to know this footage wasn't originally even meant to tell this story. So it's directed by a guy called Alec Keshishian. He's the same guy who made an iconic documentary called Madonna Truth or Dare back in the 90s. He had set out to film this kind of behind the scenes, lighthearted look at the revival tour, you know, this post Disney reinvention. And Alec realized while filming that something was just really off. So he later said she was not in a great place. She was so young. Remember, at the time she was in her very early twenties. So he stopped filming. And then years later, they both decided to come back to that footage and weave it into my mind and me. Now, Salina actually later admitted she actually almost pulled the plug completely. She told Rolling Stone, because I have the platform I have, it's kind of like I'm sacrificing myself a bit for a greater purpose. God's honest truth. A few weeks ago, I wasn't sure I could do it.

[Simon Jack]

Yeah, I mean, these days, Salina deals with some of the intense spotlight by pulling back when she says she needs to. That includes from Social media. She's spoken openly about how toxic the comments can get. In a 2021 interview, she revealed she'd actually handed over the reins of her social media accounts to her assistant. That's not unusual, I don't think in that world. She still provides the photos and the captions, but she rarely posts directly.

[Zing Seng]

Still, that hasn't slowed down her popularity. In 2023, Selena became the first woman to reach reach 400 million followers on Instagram.

[Simon Jack]

Yeah, I'm a cynic about this stuff, I have to say, which is that if Selena Gomez was to come out and say, I'm absolutely fine, no one needs to worry about me ever again, all is well, would interest. Would her capital in the attention economy diminish somewhat?

[Zing Seng]

I mean, I kind of feel some sympathy for the people who have grown up, up famous and, you know, I know you shouldn't because, you know, they've had everything handed to them on a silver plate and they've been earning money since they were in kind of baby prams. But if you've only ever grown up in the public eye and you are on social media, both as a person and as a personality, I actually think the lines are really blurred. So while you and I might kind of go through a month and think, oh, I hate Instagram, I just want to leave, I'm just going to leave. Nobody's going to notice or care. But if Selena wants to do it, she's got it becomes a huge deal.

[Simon Jack]

Yeah, I'm really torn because part of me says, okay, you've got plenty of money. You've got a billion dollars. If it can be that risky to be in the public eye that much, where sometimes you like it and sometimes you don't, just don't do it. Take your money and go.

[Zing Seng]

I feel like every single person on the face of the earth, celebrities are just as addicted to being online as we are.

[Simon Jack]

All right. But meanwhile, the real guts of her wealth, the reason she's even on our list, is her beauty empire, which is booming. By 2024, rare beauty is valued at a staggering $2 billion. Even whispers, reported by Bloomberg, very credible financial news outfit, that Selena had hired advisors to explore a possible sale. But just a few months later, she told Time magazine she had no plans to sell. I just wonder what a beauty brand founded by Selena Gomez without her involved is really worth the same amount of money.

[Zing Seng]

Yeah, it's interesting, isn't it? I'm sure if she did sell the company, she would stay on as the kind of creative director. Exactly.

[Simon Jack]

Creative Consultant.

[Zing Seng]

They would invent a role for her to stay on as the face of it. But because it's a private company, you know, it's not listed on stock exchange. The full financial picture of Rare Beauty isn't actually public. Analysts estimate that it brings in about 350 and $400 million in annual sales. But with only a couple of known investors, including Nikki Aslami's New theory ventures and CEO Scott Friedman, who previously sold NYX Cosmetics, another huge beauty brand, to L'Oreal, the Bloomberg analysts assume that Selena holds a majority stake of 51%, which is important. Yeah.

[Simon Jack]

And as we've said, that is how in September 2024, Selena Gomez enters a whole new league. She's officially listed on the Bloomberg Billionaires Index for the very first time with an estimated net worth of $1.3 billion. And just breaking that down, 81% of that 1.1 billion is derived from her stake in Rare Beauty. 19% comes from endorsements with all sorts of people. Touring, mental health platform, record sales, acting, 1.3%. There you go. And record sales, 1.8. So acting and record sales combined, 3% of her worth.

[Zing Seng]

Well, actually, I think what's really interesting is how much streaming contributes to her wealth. So streaming accounts for 0.7% of her fortune. Think about it. This is a girl who is on Disney Records, who's had multiple albums, who's featured on loads of other artists tracks. She's probably got millions of, not billions of streams, and that is less than 1% of her wealth.

[Simon Jack]

Anyone below the top 5% gets very little compared to the old days of album sales.

[Zing Seng]

So Selena Gomez, Disney darling to beauty mogul to mental health advocate, or just at 32 years old. I mean, God, she's young.

[Simon Jack]

Wow. 32. And she's done all that.

[Zing Seng]

I think we will be hearing a lot more from Selena in the years to come. She's got a long way to go. She's got several more billions to make.

[Simon Jack]

You think so. Okay, we'll see. Okay. I reckon her profile will decline over the next 10 years.

[Zing Seng]

I can see a future in which someone like LVMH buys Rare Beauty.

[Simon Jack]

Okay. The same people who own 50% of Fenty Beauty.

[Zing Seng]

Exactly. And they pay her to just stay on as the creative director. I'm gonna put a bet on it now.

[Simon Jack]

Okay. Done. Well, at 32, she's been through a lot, but we have to judge her now. And this is where we judge our billionaires by a variety of categories from 0 to 10 on things like wealth Villainy, philanthropy, power, et cetera, et cetera. And we always start with wealth, so you go first.

[Zing Seng]

So, you know, she is worth about $1.3 billion. Selena used to live in the $5 million former home of the American rock musician Tom Petty with her grandparents. Though it's reported that she and her fiance, Benny Blanco, bought a kind of big Beverly Hills mansion for 35 million in December of 2024. And presumably that's where she is. Yeah, so she's spending money, but she's not really in the big leagues of billionaires.

[Simon Jack]

And also, she doesn't seem that kind of blingy. It's not like, fly out my nails, assistant, you know, on a private jet. I don't know, it doesn't seem that way to me.

[Zing Seng]

Interestingly, like a lot of her album promo, you know, the album artwork, the music videos, she's just in an oversized T shirt. Yeah, I mean, kind of like, you know, casual, down to earth. That's kind of her vibe. But I will say I think she scores a little bit higher for me in this category because of the journey that her and her family have been on. Essentially raised by a single teenage mum, grew up, you know, not very well off at all. Kind of took a big punt to becoming a Disney Channel star.

[Simon Jack]

Worked hard for that.

[Zing Seng]

So I think for me, her journey to where she is now, to a billionaire, pushes her up the league of wealthy people.

[Simon Jack]

Usually I give her, in terms of pure wealth, I'd give her a one, but I'm gonna give her a four.

[Zing Seng]

Yeah, I'm gonna be slightly more generous and give her a five out of 10.

[Simon Jack]

Okay, four for me, five for you. What about villainy? This is when we look at, you know, what people have done to get to the top and we've had some real wrong un's in there, she doesn't paint a particularly villainous picture to me. What do you think?

[Zing Seng]

No, there have been some big kind of controversies, I guess, in recent years. So, you know, there was this Woody Allen comedy called A Rainy Day in New York. She acted in that. Even though he's faced allegations that he sexually abused his then seven year adopted daughter, Dylan Farrow in 1992. Allen, for the record, has always denied these allegations. But Selena and her co stars from that film ended up donating their salaries to charities, including Time's up after Dylan Farrow, now grown up, kind of renewed the allegations around the time of the film's release.

[Simon Jack]

Yeah, okay, so what are you gonna give her for villainy?

[Zing Seng]

Well, you know, is she A bad woman. No, she's made some bad acting choices.

[Simon Jack]

That's not really villainy, is it?

[Zing Seng]

It's not villainy. That's just bad advice from your agent.

[Simon Jack]

Or just, you know, just taking a punt on something that doesn't work out. I'm gonna give a zero on villainy.

[Zing Seng]

Yeah. I'm gonna give her.

[Simon Jack]

Unless. Unless you believe that she mobilises mental health as a promotional tool. But, you know, she's had some well documented brushes with really serious conditions, like lupus, for example, bipolar disorder. And she has contributed to seminars. So she's put a little bit back in. So she's been a useful input into that process. But I'm going to give a zero for villainy.

[Zing Seng]

Yeah, I'll give her a zero.

[Simon Jack]

All right. So we both gave zero on villainy, which means giving back what she'd done philanthropically.

[Zing Seng]

Yeah. So she's obviously pledged 1% of all rare Beauty sales to the Rare impact fund in 2022. In their social impact report, the company said it's already raised 5 million out of its 100 million aim, 2 million of which had already been donated to 16 organizations around the world.

[Simon Jack]

And for each episode of her cooking show, Celine and Chef Sheb makes a $10,000 donation to a charitable cause in the first three seasons, $400,000 to 26 nonprofit organizations.

[Zing Seng]

Yeah, that's pretty interesting as well, Rare Beauty also made donations of an undisclosed amount to the bail project, which is a criminal justice project in America, and the NAACP's Legal Defense Fund during the Black Lives Matter protest.

[Simon Jack]

Yeah, you add all that up and I know she wants to aim a hundred, raise $100 million. I see 5 million so far and probably another million elsewhere. Less than half of 1% of her wealth. So, I mean, it all sounds well, meaning it doesn't add up to a whole lot just yet. I'm going to give her a four on this one.

[Zing Seng]

Yeah, I mean, I think I'd agree it's not a very efficient way of distributing those funds, is it?

[Simon Jack]

Yeah. And also 1% of sales to the Impact fund. I don't know. That sounds more like the dividing line between people will buy that because they're thinking it's a philanthropic exercise, but it's not high enough to be that generous. So I'm going to give a very guarded three on philanthropy.

[Zing Seng]

Right. I will give her. I kind of feel. I'm kind of torn on this one.

[Simon Jack]

Isn't she more useful philanthropically in kind of who she is rather than what she does? What she Gives.

[Zing Seng]

That's a good point. Yeah. In terms of what kind of awareness she raises for various causes, I think I'd be more generous. I'd give her a four out of 10.

[Simon Jack]

Okay, three and a four. And in a way, what we've just discussed bleeds into the category of power. She's got 421 million followers on Instagram. I mean, that's a meaningful chunk of the entire world's population.

[Zing Seng]

Yeah. And if you could get 0.01% of them to support a cause of bioproduct, that's a lot of power.

[Simon Jack]

She was very important. The Black Lives Matter movement. Very interesting to see where the Selena Gomez character goes in Donald Trump's America. Undocumented Mexican immigrant grandparents handing over your platform to Black Lives Matter during the George Floyd moment. All of those things, you know, sensitive issues in Trump's America right now. It's gonna be quite interesting.

[Zing Seng]

I actually think this is something she is probably grappling with at this very moment. Because I know that when Donald Trump got elected or inaugurated, she posted quite tearfully on her social media accounts, basically saying, you know, my grandparents were undocumented. What is going on with this country? And she kind of came under fire from some right wing media commentators for that. She deleted the post probably. Cause, you know, a whole lot of hate was directed towards her after she got kind of told off in that way. But I wouldn't put it past her to. In the next year or so to come out with something a lot more considered and thought out.

[Simon Jack]

Okay.

[Zing Seng]

Yeah, yeah. It's interesting because she also. She kind of fell short of officially endorsing Biden in 2020. In 2024, she kind of posted a picture and a video of herself posting her election ballot on Instagram and TikTok. She kind of didn't say who she was voting for, but there was a blue heart emoji, which many took to imply supporting Kamala Harris.

[Simon Jack]

Okay.

[Zing Seng]

So, you know, she's not r. Really pushed herself out there.

[Simon Jack]

Okay. On power, I'm gonna give a quite high score. I mean, anyone with nearly half a billion followers on Instagram is pretty powerful. So I'm gonna give her in the modern world a solid seven on that one.

[Zing Seng]

Well, actually, funnily enough, I would agree with your 7. Cause I don't think she could pick up the phone to the White House. No way.

[Simon Jack]

Yeah. Okay, so seven. Seven. We gotta decide whether she's good, bad, and lust of billionaire. This one's an easy one for me. She's not a bad person is she? So I'm gonna say she's a good billionaire.

[Zing Seng]

Yeah, I would say, I would say if she hadn't done all that stuff around mental health awareness, spoken about being bipolar, you know, she would be just another billionaire. She would just be another billionaire for sure. But for me, that is the stuff that edges her into being a good billionaire.

[Simon Jack]

Okay. Congratulations, Selima. You'll be very grateful to know that you have been passed as a good billionaire by the Good Bad Billionaire team. So who is next week?

[Zing Seng]

So it's former Marvel CEO and chairman Ike Perlmutter, the notoriously media shy billionaire who brought the comics company back from the brink of ruin and helped launch the Marvel Cinematic Universe.

[Simon Jack]

And for someone in showbiz, he is surprisingly camera shy. Ike even went to Iron Man's 2008 premiere disguised in glasses and a fake mustache. But when where he really stands out is making a profit from other people's mistakes.

[Zing Seng]

That's on the next episode of Good Bad Billionaire. Thanks for joining us. You've been listening to Good Bad Billionaire from the BBC World Service. This episode was produced by Louise Morris. Our researcher was Annie Rose, Harrison Dunn and our editor Paul Smith.

[Unknown]

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