A (3:00)

Excellent. And are you working on something right now?

B (3:03)

Yes, I'm working on, you know, new projects. New.

A (3:08)

Can you tell us what it is or a secret?

B (3:11)

No, no, I'm in the world of Chris Nolan right now. So just. Yeah, that's. That's taking up my time and it's really fun.

A (3:22)

Well, we're. We're talking to you. We're talking to Ryan Coogler today. We're thrilled to talk to him. I'm a huge fan and I'm really excited. And one of the things I've been learning as I've been getting to know him is how dedicated he is to the people he works with and how he has really long relationships with the people that he works with. And you two met in. At USC together?

B (3:45)

Yeah, we met at USC 2000, early 2008, I believe. Yeah.

A (3:50)

What was your first impression of him? Do you remember meeting.

B (3:53)

Yeah, of course I was. When I first moved to la, I moved. I lived in Culver City, and every. Everyone in America told me that you need. You need to move. You need to get a car. Right? You need to have a car. But I thought, silly Americans, they don't get the idea of walking right, so. But I quickly understood that, like, the bus just. Just doesn't come right? So. So I moved to USC to live close to campus I could walk from. And I. And it ended up. I ended up moving into, like, a fraternity house. It was. That was only open for grad students. And it literally felt like I didn't know what fraternity was at the time. Like, I literally felt like I moved into a American Pie movie.

A (4:34)

Yeah.

B (4:36)

So one night we had a party. Ryan came over and we ended up playing pool together. And he had. And I remember Ryan had these super long locks, you know, down to his. To his back and kind of, you know, kind of muscle, muscular in a way, because he had just, you know, he had just come from football. He played football for Sac State, for college. So he, you know, so that. And. And we started talking, playing pool. And then I remember specifically talking about music, and he had a lot of knowledge about. We talked about Swedish artists. And that's kind of what. We kind of started bonding over music. And then that translated into film. And so, yeah, we were just kind of college kids in the beginning. Started just hanging out at parties and talking about music and film.

A (5:29)

Was there a moment when you decided, we're gonna kind of work together forever? Like, you know, it's one thing to like each other's taste, but sometimes people work a certain way that doesn't connect with the way you like to work. How do you two like to work together and why does it work?

B (5:46)

The first score I did was for a little feature, the student film he had called locks and I, I played guitar on that. And he was like, he was. It was just so funny because I remember his reaction when he first heard his. My music for his little short film, and he was like, blown away. Oh, my God, I can't believe someone writes, like, music for that, for my film. And it's, you know, and that. And I was like, obviously, you know, I was kind of worried he was not going to like it first. So when he was just blown away, I get that reaction. It was just so. It was so fun and that. And then every time we were together, it was like. It was. He had such an. It was like such a. He was so passionate about his work and it was always so fun. Right, so. And so we both are addictive. Like, we love our work. Right. And when you get to combine that friendship with work, so that makes it very special. You can hang out with your buddies, right, While working.

A (6:50)

Can I geek out with you for a second? On three films. Fruitvale, Black Panther and Sinners. When you think of those three films, what instrument comes up in your mind.

B (7:02)

First for each Fruitvale was guitar. Because I knew. I was like, I knew how much Ryan loved guitar, you know, and.

C (7:14)

I.

B (7:14)

Guess I never really thought about why he loves the guitar, and I never understood why he loves it until, like, we started working on Sinners and I was like, I understand. Like, okay. Well, his uncle, you know, was a great blues. He loved blues music and he always played blues. And obviously in blues music, guitar is the, the main instrument. Right? So. So Ryan kind of grew up listening to that music. And it's always been in his, in his, in his bones and in his mind. And my dad is a guitar player. And blues music that changed my dad's life to become a, A blues guitar player. 1964, he bought his first. My dad bought his first blues album, John Lee Hooker. And that music, you know, coming from the other side of the world to Sweden, his life to become a guitar player and that obvious. And that made my, you know, he put a guitar in my hands when I was seven. So it's kind of a full circle there.

A (8:13)

That's really cool.

B (8:14)

Yeah. So with provostation, I would say the guitar is the main instrument and Black Panther is the, The. The. The talking drums.

A (8:28)

I don't really know what talking drums are. Could you explain?

C (8:31)

Yeah, it's.

B (8:31)

It's. It's the first type of communication device. It's the first telephone. So in, In. In. In Africa and, And I was specifically, I went to Senegal and West Africa. But this talking drum exists in. In so many different regions down. Down in Africa. But it's. It's. It's basically a drum that. That you can play messages with because it's very small, and you can breathe and you can squeeze it to have different pitches. So with these different pitches and these different rhythms, you can talk. It's almost like Morse code, you know, but analog on a drum. And in every village, they would have a talking drum that would relay messages to everyone. He would stand in the middle. He or she was in the middle, and then play, and they would. You could tell, oh, the king has died, or. Or someone's back from being gone for a long time, or, you know, everyone get together. And so. And I met this incredible musician in. In Senegal, Massamba Diop, who. Who's. Who put together an amazing talking drum crew. And. And we recorded a bunch of stuff in. In Senegal. And also it was like one. One. One thing that I thought was so interesting was, like, how would you say t' Challa's drum? T' Challa's name on that instrument? On that.

A (9:48)

Yeah. Oh, wow. Very cool.

B (9:50)

The theme. And then. And for Sinners. Yeah, it's guitar again. And we're back to where it all started.

A (9:56)

Yeah. And buddy guy and who was in the film and who I want to talk to Ryan about. It's just, like, amazing. Like an amazing moment at the end of the film.

B (10:08)

Yeah.

A (10:09)

Thank you for talking about Ryan, and I'm really excited to talk to him today. Do you have a question for me before we go that you think would be fun for me to ask? It's. It could be big or small. It could be asking him a story to tell. It could be a private joke of your many years together, or it could be something about the film or anything at all.

B (10:29)

I mean, you could ask him, you know, because when we were doing Sinners, he was. He was practicing guitar. He was playing almost every day. You know, he had a guitar in his office. He had. He took it with him when he moved to New Orleans for. For production. So, you know, and I spent. I spent a little. Not a lot of time, but a little time on. On with him, just, like, showing him how certain riffs was going. And so, you know, that's something you could. You could check in with him. Like, how. How. How is this chops coming along?

A (11:02)

Perfect. Perfect. Okay.

B (11:04)

And only because the movie's over doesn't mean that he just, you know, does. Does it. Does that he doesn't need to keep it up.

A (11:11)

Yeah, right, right. That Ludwig says, like, you know, you just can't put it down. Like, next time I see you, I expect you to be. I expect you to have improved.

B (11:20)

Exactly.

A (11:20)

Yeah. Yeah.

B (11:21)

Great.

A (11:22)

Well, thank you so much for your time. It really means a lot that we got you in what I know is probably a busy day with a young up and coming filmmaker, Christopher Nolan. I wish him the best and just such a fan of your work and really, really appreciate your time, Ludwig. Really nice to meet you.

B (11:40)

Nice to you too. And I hope to see you maybe in Sweden next time.

A (11:44)

Anytime. And Tuck. Yes.

B (11:57)

Okay.

A (11:59)

Thank you so much. Bye. This episode is brought to you by Visible. Got a resolution to save? Kick 2026 off right with Visible. It's a one line wireless plan with unlimited data and hotspot for $25 a month, taxes and fees included, all on Verizon's 5G network. It's the ultimate wireless hack to save money and still get great coverage and a reliable connection. Now, for a limited time, new members can get the Visible plan for just $19 a month for the first 26 months. Ring in the new year with code. Switch 26 share the savings with is too good to keep quiet. Switch now@visible.com terms apply. Limited time offer subject to change. See visible.com for plan features and network management details. Ryan Coogler is here. I am so, so happy. Thank you so much for doing this.

C (12:56)

Thanks for having me. This, this is. It's amazing. I can't believe I got invited here.

A (12:59)

Are you kidding? Are you kidding? We're thrilled you want to do this. And I just got to start by saying, like, I'm going to glaze you a little bit in the beginning.

C (13:08)

Please don't.

A (13:09)

I know, I know you're not comfortable. It'll only take a few minutes. I promise I'll be done. But what of the. What I was thinking about what I wanted to talk to you about today, like, the big thematic thing is that. And what I love about your work and your characters is that you don't limit the possibilities of what you want to do as an artist and what your characters could do. Like, you're really into the idea of almost open borders in terms of what people can do and also like what's in them. Basically, what's in them. And I feel like that comes from. I've been reading so much about you and watching, of course, everything you make. And it feels like you're really into this idea of making sure that you get influences from everywhere like that that really Informs you. Why do you think it's important to be influenced all the time by many different things?

C (13:59)

I think for me, I'm interested in like a lot of different things, you know, and all of my experiences definitely, like, inform me where I find myself. Right.

B (14:14)

Yeah.

C (14:15)

And I think that what I do and you know, the position I occupy in the industry is, you know, I'm trusted to make things that can go into theaters and work for people from a lot of different backgrounds and environments and circumstances. Right.

A (14:38)

Yeah.

C (14:39)

So I think like, what I have to do is I have to stay true to myself and what I like and also consider, you know, what people came up consuming, if that makes sense. Is that, is that it does.

A (14:55)

And what you're saying is really interesting too, because as an artist you have to kind of like you're. You have such a strong instinct about what you want.

C (15:02)

Yeah.

A (15:03)

And it's almost like you can't. You almost want to forget who you're making it for. But what I love about your work is you don't.

C (15:10)

Well, yeah, yeah.

A (15:12)

You don't.

C (15:13)

Yeah, no, no, for sure. Because I. Cause I can't. Right. Like. Like, you know, I fell in. I fell in love with movies like at the multiplex, you know. You know, I mean, I ain't got to. I ain't got to an art house theater or to a film festival until I was like a fully baked adult, you know? You know what I'm saying?

A (15:28)

Like, so when you were a kid, what did you eat at the movies?

C (15:32)

Oof.

A (15:33)

Tell me about your movie experience. What would Ryan, would you bring stuff in, sneak stuff in? Would you get it there?

C (15:40)

I cannot confirm or deny any snack smuggling, but if I did, I might have brought a peanut butter and jelly sandwich or too, you know what I mean? That was what I would do if I was into that. But no, like I used to, like, I used to like it was a period in time where they used to let you weigh the candy.

A (15:58)

Yeah.

C (15:59)

You know what I mean? You pay by weight.

A (16:01)

Yeah.

C (16:01)

And I would do experiments trying to see like what candy was lighter, that looked crazy, which candy was heavier, you know what I mean?

A (16:08)

Did you get like a trash bag full of cotton candy?

C (16:10)

Yeah, yeah, exactly, exactly. We in there with limited funds, you know, and shouts out to all the cinemas that used to let us stay once we bought one thing, you know, we could go in, they wasn't tripping off us going to see something else. Get a little bang for your buck. But no, my go to was Peanut M and Ms. I'm not a big soda person, but, like, when they started to let you mix and match the drinks, I got involved with that, you know? Yeah. So, yeah, it was peanut MM's. And then. And then obviously the Junior Mints, if they in the freezer, you know, like, if they got them in the freezer, then I'm gonna do it.

A (16:48)

Like, the ritual of getting your snack and sitting down and lights going down. I know you've talked about it, but, like, it's so important for you for films to live in theaters.

C (16:59)

Yeah.

A (17:00)

Why is it so important for you, man?

C (17:03)

You. This is really cool. We talking about this? No, I just love how.

A (17:12)

How.

C (17:14)

I mean, shit is the word. Egalitarian. But I love how it's just you in there with a bunch of different types of people. You know, it's teenagers in there. Cause that's the only place I could go be alone. It's retired couples. You know what I mean? It's groups of friends depending on the movie you want to see. But everybody's in there together. And when a movie is great, you know, everybody kind of unifies, you know, Like. Like you feel. You could feel everybody's energy focused on the same thing.

A (17:45)

Yeah.

C (17:45)

And what I. What I actually really love about it, that I learned about myself since. Since, like, the streaming era is like, when I get. When I get overwhelmed, whether it's something's too funny or something scary or I got too much anxiety or I'm too, like. I'm too, like. Like turned on by what I'm looking at or whatever, I pause, like, almost, like, immediately, you know? You know what I mean? Like. Like. Like out of a fear that, yeah, maybe I'm gonna miss something ca. Too hard, or out of a worry that, like, I'm gonna get too worked up and I'm gonna have a fucking heart attack or something. Can you curse on this?

A (18:18)

Yeah, you can curse.

B (18:19)

Okay, Right on.

C (18:21)

I'm gonna have a heart attack or something. You know, I'm having a fucking panic attack. I'll pause. But, like, what's dope? In the theaters, you can't pause.

A (18:27)

That's so wrong.

C (18:28)

You know? Like, there's no. So when something's happening that has you, like, feeling like you. You out of control, you still gotta. You still gotta go with it. That feeling of giving yourself over.

A (18:37)

Yes.

C (18:38)

To something that you don't have to control, to pause, rewind, or fast forward like that, that is a really, you know, it's a really nice feeling. Like you come from. You come from an A. Well, you know.

A (18:47)

You're making me remember, like, when I went to the movie theater too. What also happened was, like, from, like, I wanted to be funny. So also it was a place where you could be kind of funny. Like, you know, you'd have a moment, a quiet moment, you know, like, especially like in the trailers. Not so much in movies. Sometimes people wouldn't like it, but in the trailer. A trailer would come out and someone would be like, nope. You know, or whatever.

C (19:15)

And after, after the challenge.

B (19:17)

Yeah.

A (19:17)

Or, you know, or something like. And you get to get a laugh in a group.

C (19:23)

Yeah.

A (19:24)

Like, you'd get like. That was sometimes like a lot of people's first laughs.

C (19:27)

Oh, that's awesome. I never thought about these.

A (19:29)

And also in movie theaters, a lot of action happens. Like your first date.

C (19:33)

Yeah.

A (19:33)

Yeah. You're scared. You grab someone's hand. The first time I held someone's hand was in a movie theater. Like, it is so intimate. It's so cool. Who were the, what were the movies when you were like, what were the movies that you can remember as a young person going in and walking out of that theater and feeling like you had been completely transformed?

C (19:50)

Yeah, it'll be two big ones. Boys in the hood. And I was a baby in there, man. Younger than my eldest kid is now. And she can't get through a Pixar movie without being like, dad is too crazy. My dad had me like, boys in the hood. Like, right here, son. I'm like four years old. Oh. But then, but then Beauty and the Beast.

A (20:16)

Yeah.

C (20:17)

And then, and then Malcolm X. Yeah. All of these was like kindergarten, first grade. And then I would say, I would say probably one of the biggest ones was Jurassic Park. We saw Jurassic park when Oakland still had a drive in. And I remember being in. I remember being in the, in the car, like. And I used to hook the speakers up to the window.

A (20:43)

Yeah.

C (20:43)

And I'm in there. And it's the scene where. The T. Rex scene at night, you know, that thing comes off. They in a car driving away from me. And then they got the shot in the, in the, in the like, side view mirror where it says, objects may be closer than they appear. And the T. Rex is right on him, screaming. And I'll look at, I look at, I'll look at my side, you mirror. And it's got the same shit written on it. So I'm like, ah. Like, it's just gonna be a T. You know, I mean, like a T. Rex jumping off, you know, Like, I'll never forget. I'll never Forget that shit, man. And, like, I got addicted to that feeling.

B (21:20)

Yeah.

A (21:20)

Yes. Yes.

C (21:21)

So I got the opportunity now to try to attempt to give people that feeling, you know?

A (21:25)

So you mentioned Oakland. You grew up in Oakland. You're going to school there. You're really good at sports. You're really good at football.

C (21:31)

I was. All right. Yeah.

A (21:32)

Okay. You're a really good.

C (21:34)

What position did you play in college? I played receiver. Yeah, So I return kicks. Play receiver.

A (21:42)

When you're a receiver and you're in college, are you always worried about your hands? Like, you know, do you. When you're, like, out and you're like, I can't do that.

C (21:52)

No, I didn't think about it like that.

A (21:53)

You don't treat your hands like.

C (21:54)

No, I didn't. I didn't.

A (21:55)

Okay.

C (21:55)

Okay. Yeah. Yeah. No, we was. I mean, I was like.

A (22:01)

But, I mean, it feels like. Like, it would be like you didn't get.

C (22:03)

No, that's. I mean, if I was smart, I would have been able. Like, I was, like, 17, you know? You know, I mean, I wasn't tripping, like. Like. Like, I was. I was literally, like, slamming my hand in car doors and shit.

A (22:13)

Right, Right.

C (22:13)

Like, so it wasn't. It wasn't really something we was. I should have been thinking about, but, like, now the kids get paid, which is great. Yeah.

B (22:18)

Yeah.

C (22:18)

You know, I was on scholarship, which is, like, the most you could do legally. You know what I mean, like, at the time. And I was, like, thrilled that I could pay for school because my parents was busting their ass, put me through private school most of my life. So y' all was just. I was thrilled, man. I was not thinking about my.

A (22:37)

No, you were. Did you love that? Did you love that feeling of playing football? Like, what was so great?

C (22:43)

Oh, yeah, I loved it.

A (22:43)

And were you. You're a Raiders fan growing up, Obviously.

C (22:46)

Man, I was agnostic. Yeah. Like, in the Bay, I was agnostic.

A (22:49)

Do you have any posters on your wall? Did young Ryan have posters on.

C (22:53)

I did. I did.

A (22:55)

Who were they of athletes or were they artists?

C (22:58)

Yeah, athletes. Artists. I had them all. Like, who'd you have? I had Crazy. I had Jerry Rice.

A (23:03)

Oh, yep.

C (23:05)

I had Tim Hardaway. Warriors. Warriors. Around tmc. You know, down the road, you know, I would get into, like, other athletes. Like, Hakeem Olajuwon was a big one for me. Um, you know, and then. And then football wise, I. Once I started playing receiver, I just love. You know, I liked all the receivers, man. Randy Moss, Terrell Owens, Tim Brown, you Know, Steve Smith. Who is Steve Smith I love, because he was, like, short like I was, you know, and was still out there making it happen.

A (23:35)

It's interesting. Like, athletes, just like any. Anyone else are like, I find. Looking for people that rep, like, look like them.

C (23:43)

Absolutely.

A (23:44)

That. That are.

C (23:44)

That are good.

A (23:45)

Because it's like, absolutely. Yeah.

C (23:47)

But I mean, I also knew that, like, you know, I would meet players like Maurice Jones, Drew or Marshawn lynch, like, players I would play against, and I'd be like, man, they got a lot better than me. You know what I mean?

A (24:00)

You were like, oh, they're gonna be.

C (24:02)

Yeah. You come across players that's like, oh, that's something different happening there. And that was kind of how I also kind of could see earlier maybe football wasn't gonna be what I did forever.

A (24:12)

How about Marshawn being like a comedy star now?

C (24:15)

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

A (24:17)

Was he always funny?

C (24:19)

I mean, he not funny when you trying to tackle him. You know what I'm saying? I used to really play against him. You know, we came across each other a lot, and he would actually, in high school, he was trying to guard me, so I was dealing with him on offense and defense. I had some success on the offensive side against him, but, like, trying to tackle that man was impossible. So, like, yeah, he was not funny on the field, but, yeah, as a person, man, he hilarious.

B (24:48)

You know what I mean?

C (24:49)

Like, his whole family like that, though.

A (24:50)

Yeah, yeah.

C (24:51)

You know, like. Like, our family's from the same. From the same part of Auckland, and he. His mom, hilarious. You know what I mean? Like, his brothers, you know?

A (24:58)

Yeah, but how do you go from. So you're playing and you're a finance major, and then you switch to becoming a film major?

C (25:04)

Nah, like, so.

A (25:05)

So you leave and go to USC after you.

C (25:08)

Yeah, yeah, yeah. So. So I went to. I went to high school. I went to. I went to high school in Berkeley.

A (25:13)

Yeah.

C (25:14)

And at this point, I was living in Richmond, another city that. That's even. That's even more blue collar than Oakland, right?

B (25:19)

Yeah.

C (25:20)

And I got a scholarship to a school called St. Mary's College was in a bay. I had a teacher there, Rosemary Graham, who read something that I wrote in the creative writing class, was like, yo, you should write screenplays. But at that time, I was a chemistry major, so I figured I was gonna try to be a doctor or something, right. But the chemistry labs was not working out with my football practices. I was having a real tough time. So I was like, yo, I gotta get out this chemistry Shit. So I can keep my. Keep my scholarship. And that. That football program collapsed, so I got another scholarship to Sacramento State, went there and majored in finance. But I took. I took filmmaking classes on the side. That makes sense.

A (25:59)

Yeah, yeah. I mean, when I. When I've been learning about you, like usc, you met so many people that's talking about. Talking about a team. It's where you met your team.

C (26:11)

Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah. So that was grad school.

A (26:15)

Right.

C (26:15)

And I met, I mean, I guess all the people I work with. Lulig was who I met first. Ludwig Jorsson, my composer. And then my co writer on Creed, Aaron Covington. And then eventually I meet Sev Ohanian. Yeah.

A (26:32)

Your producing partner.

C (26:33)

Yeah. Who works for me as. Yeah. Proximity.

A (26:35)

And you met your beautiful wife Cindy there.

C (26:37)

Well, I met in Auckland. Like, I met Zins.

A (26:40)

Oh, you met. You guys met when you were like, 13.

C (26:43)

I was 13, yeah.

A (26:44)

You guys grew up together. You grew up together. I think it's so amazing when you talk about all the stuff that you make. You talk about the people that you make it with, which, in my opinion, like, really, I don't know. I so respect artists who remind people that what they make is a communal effort. Oh, yeah, but people don't always want to do that, right? Like, they don't want. They. Sometimes that's just not their first instinct, and it really is. And I know Zinzi makes your films with you, and how important is she in terms of, like, your process? How do you guys work together?

C (27:24)

We just, like, since we. So we started dating in high school. We broke up for a little bit. And then what happened there? I mean, you know, that's not for the podcast, but high school shit. But we got back together right before we went to college. And what we would do, like, that summer before we left, because we was both on scholarship. She went to Fresno State, I went to St. Mary's like I mentioned in there, Sacramento State. But what we would do is we would just work out together to get ready for college and we'd go to the movies. That was it. We was either on the track, working out in the white room, lifting weights, or we was, you know, we was at the movies, you know, Emeryville and Richmond in Auckland. And for us, we got really used to just pushing each other, you know, and supporting each other, you know, being at each other's. Meets her being at my football games. She's incredibly shy, but, like, at my games, I could hear her voice, you know, while I was out there trying to. Trying to catch touchdowns and everything. I was trying to do the same for her to attract me. And when I got interested in filmmaking, you know, she was just really supportive, you know, like I was writing screenplays in Microsoft Word and kind of like venting to her, like, man, if one day I got the software that cost 300 bucks called Final Draft, and you know, maybe one day I could get that, you know, in the meantime, I gotta adjust the margins and all of that.

A (28:50)

Yeah.

C (28:51)

And then she set over her money. Got that from me. And it wasn't just like, here, baby, here goes the draft. She was like, hey, where's that script at? You know, like, where's that thing you working on? You know, that athletic mindset? So how it works is, you know, I always talk to her about what I'm thinking about working on and she'll. I kind of hone my pitch with her. Yeah, she'll be the first person to read, you know, what I write, give me feedback. So my scripts are always going. I really hone at the early stages of my career and the film school, she was with me, you know, all the time. She was down there, all the classes with me, asc, working on the sets, you know, producing and sometimes operating the camera, you know, if I had to jump in, you know. So it was that kind of support and it just kind of stayed that way through Fruitville. When we shot at home, that was when we first moved in and started living together.

A (29:47)

Wow.

C (29:48)

She was on set even though she had a day job. She'll just come, like, get off work, come straight.

A (29:51)

How many days did you shoot fruitvale Station in?

C (29:54)

20 days?

A (29:55)

20.

C (29:55)

Yeah.

A (30:00)

This episode is brought to you by HBO Max. Industry is back. When a splashy fintech startup bursts onto the London scene. Harper and Yasmin are drawn into opposing sides of a high stake financial deal that could bring them both down. Kiernan Shipka, Max Minghella and Charlie Heaton join Kit Harington and the cast for the Wildest season yet, HBO's Industry is now streaming Sundays at 9pm on HBO Max. This episode is brought to you by ebay. On ebay, every find has a story. Like if you're looking for a vintage band tee. Not just a tee, the band tee. You wore it everywhere until your ex stole it. Now you're on ebay. There it is. Same tea from the same tour. The things you love have a way of finding their way back to you. Especially on ebay. Shop ebay for millions of finds, each with a story. EBay, things people love this episode is brought to you by CarMax. When you shop with CarMax, you're in the driver's seat of every decision. So you feel calm, confident, and in control throughout the journey. Look, you can sell your car in pajamas. You can match your car color to your favorite sports team or your aura or your dog's favorite color. You can do whatever you want. CarMax lets you do that. Buy and sell used vehicles on your terms. Want to drive CarMax? Shop now@carmax.com what I'm learning or what I feel like I know about you, Ryan, is like, you're super collaborative and also you know what you want. Like, those two things are so important, I think, for any real leader, especially on set. But I don't think enough people know that a set is like a little town. Like, it's like so many people working.

C (31:47)

No, totally, totally. And your parents were school teachers.

A (31:51)

Yeah, yeah.

C (31:51)

So, like, you, You. You get it. Yeah, like. Like the, like. Like that, you know, that blue collar mindset, you know, the communal. The communal mindset, the need for communication. And for me, it really is. I think that's why movies work when they. When they work, you know, because you talking about like, like mass entertainment, you know, I mean, like a lot of people going to go engage with the.

A (32:13)

But that's why you're such a genius is because it's. It's. It's hard to make. It's hard to make a movie, number one. Just hard to make a movie. Then it's hard to make a good movie. Then it's hard to make a good movie that people enjoy making with you.

B (32:26)

Right.

A (32:26)

They walk away and go, that was a good experience.

C (32:28)

Right.

A (32:28)

Then it's hard to make a good movie that was enjoyable to make that people go and see. Yeah, those things are really hard to make it over and over and over again. And you've done it again. Sinners. So incredible.

C (32:41)

Oh, thank you.

A (32:42)

And I picture you going to your team and being like, I have an idea. And they were like, what was their first instinct was?

C (32:51)

So. So I went to Zinzi first.

A (32:52)

Yeah.

C (32:54)

And it wasn't fully baked. And she was like, man, that ain't ready yet. You know, Keep thinking on that. So. So I thought about her some more. Yeah, I think I went back. I don't think I went to her like three times before. She was like, okay, that makes sense. You know, and it was better for it. And then it goes to Seb Ohanian, who, you know, we're the three founders of proximity and we got A co founder in Ludwig Jorsson. And this is a. It's a music based film. So we brought Ludwig in crazy early. Yeah, exactly. Before that was a script, you know, while it was just an idea.

A (33:25)

Oh, that's so interesting. That Ludwig. So were you always thinking about Michael B. Jordan from that you were always thinking about using? It was the twins. And the twins was always an early. Like that was. Why twins? It's hard to shoot.

C (33:39)

I know.

A (33:41)

Yeah, like this extra work.

C (33:43)

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. No, no, no, for sure. I mean, look like it was a hook for me. It was so sticky. Right? Like. And in this day and age you need. I think you need multiple reasons to like lean in, you know, like when there's so many great things available, you know, like I was in the white room, I'm watching you and I'm watching you and Julie Dreyfus talk. And it's so entertaining. Like it's an hour. It's an hour of like two really entertaining people being intimate and talking. You know, that's just on my phone for me to click. You know, there's so many ways to spend time. So for me, like, I think that I'm a firm believer in like some things having multiple hooks, you know? You know what I mean? And. And it's a hook for me because I have twins in my family and I love them and I got a lot of homies as twins, but I'm also. Also have a crippling fear of doppelgangers. Like a strike phobia. You know what I mean?

A (34:35)

No, I don't. What do you mean? Yeah, what are you afraid of? That you're going to run across your own.

C (34:44)

Yeah, I've had nightmares like that.

B (34:46)

Yeah.

C (34:46)

But also, like.

A (34:49)

Because I know what you mean, because no offense to twins, but twins. The idea of twins in general, a little creepy.

C (34:55)

It's a little creepy.

A (34:56)

Yeah, it's great. It's just creepy enough.

C (34:58)

Yeah, like, like, so.

A (34:59)

So I think someone who was in the womb with you.

C (35:02)

Well, yeah, that's. That's fascinating to me. Like.

A (35:05)

Yeah.

C (35:05)

And we dug deep with Mike. Like, I got two buddies who are filmmakers, Noah and Logan Miller. They actually wrote the script G20 that Viola was in when she was the president, like doing action shit.

A (35:18)

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

C (35:18)

But they from Northern California, a little bit farther north than where I'm from. And I actually asked him if they would be open to being consultants on the movie, like to work with me and Mike on developing the characters. And man, we dug so deep into the mindset. And the dynamics of what it's like to have essentially a copy of yourself next to you all the time. But Michael B. He just knocked. You should just knock me back. By his brilliance and how he portrayed these characters.

A (35:52)

Where did you first see Michael? Did you see him before you knew him? Did you see his. Did you see. Did you watch the Wire? I did so good in that.

C (35:59)

Yeah. He was heartbreaking.

A (36:01)

Heartbreaking.

B (36:01)

Yeah.

C (36:02)

Wallace. Yeah, Wallace. That was heartbreaking. I knew a lot of kids like that.

A (36:06)

Yeah.

C (36:06)

You know, both, you know, friends of mine and also when I was working with my dad, you know. So, yeah, like, it was a brilliant portrayal. And, you know, kudos to Mike for his performance and David Simon, you know, for writing the character, and HBO for having the show. You know what I mean?

A (36:27)

That show was next level. Yeah.

C (36:29)

And then he was great in Fighting Night Lights and apparently.

A (36:31)

Yeah, that's right. And did you, like. Do you think it's important for directors. A lot of directors have an actor that they get to kind of. You've had a few, but, like, an actor that you get to kind of keep working with and working stuff out with Wyat. Is that helpful, to work with the same person more than once?

C (36:49)

Yeah, I mean, I think it's great, man. Like, it's funny because it actually comes back to football for me because I play receiver and I play with a lot of different quarterbacks, you know, especially in college. And it was tough. Cause I never felt like I found my rhythm with one. With one person, you know, and that's so important. Like, I think finding a rhythm is like a. It's, like, fundamental to, I think, to achieving greatness, you know? So it's phenomenal to have found an actor who's so talented, you know, gifted, ambitious, you know. Cause Mike is constantly trying to push himself and get better at his craft. He's professional, but he's also, like, a good person, you know? Like, he's like, when you're doing a movie with him, if he's number one on your car sheet, you know, that you're gonna have a safe set for people. You know, he gonna be able to do great work without making people's lives miserable. He gonna treat people with kindness. He got nothing to prove. So he learns the pa's name, he learns the camera operator's name. The same way he'll know the producer's names, you know?

A (37:55)

Right, right.

C (37:56)

And that is something that I think permeates the set, like, at a foundational level. I've been very blessed in that.

A (38:04)

Well, one could argue, too, that that's also what you transmit, give off. That's your station. Like, your channel is attuned to that. So people take their cue from you.

C (38:16)

I try to, you know, but it's great to have Mike there to amplify it, you know? Cause that's who he is, you know? And he's ridiculously talented. Like. And he was doing work that required a lot of focus, you know, like, he was still generous to people, even though he'll come to set on a day where he's got to be, you know, two different people, you know, Was.

A (38:34)

It fun to call him up and be like, you're gonna be a vampire. What's crazy is because I would be psyched if someone was crazy.

C (38:42)

Hey, we might have to make the call at some point, man. We might have to figure that out. But for me, what it was, was how it ended up working. I was trying to get the screenplay together. Cause Mike's busy, you know, And I didn't wanna say, hey, I got a thing. And then having waiting for, you know, for. For a script. I didn't need him blowing my phone, like, hey, where it's at. But what ended up happening was he called me and pitched me something while I was working on this for him. And then. And I was like. At first, I was like, mike, I can't. You know, I can't work on that right now. And he got upset, like, hey, man, what's. Hey, what's going on, man? Like, you know, I want to. I want to get this going.

A (39:22)

Yeah.

C (39:22)

Like, it's something you're not telling me. So I'm like, look, I'm working on a thing.

A (39:25)

Oh, it's interesting. And you're like, I have a secret.

C (39:27)

But I'm not ready. I'm bringing this. This is what it is. It's twins, you know, it's period. It's vampires. And I remember how he reacted. Cause he just got quiet for a long time. And I was like. I was like, oh, shit, did I lose him? You know? And he's like. He's like, man, you know what? That sounds pretty interesting, man. He was like, okay, okay, when you want to do it? And so I got the script done and got it to him, and then he was in.

A (39:54)

I mean, there's a lot. I'm not a big heart. I. I get kind of scared at movies, and I'm not really a big horror fan. But what's so cool about vampires is vampires are sexy.

C (40:07)

Exactly.

A (40:08)

Zombies are not zombies.

C (40:09)

Not sexy. Nah.

A (40:10)

Vampires are Sexy. It's true. And your film has a. Like, there's so much going on. Sinners is so amazing and original IP and like, beautifully written and beautifully acted and shot. An incredible cast. The chemistry between the characters in your film is so real. And the way in which you basically create in the midst of horror, like. Like love and romance and sex. And you do a lot of things in this movie really, really well. And I would just like to say the most of the many things in the film that I loved. Can I just get small for a second to talk about the scene, the dancing scene in the film? Autumn, your incredible dp, first female DP to shoot in this IMAX format. Arkhipa.

B (41:04)

Autumn.

C (41:04)

Arkhipaw.

A (41:05)

Yeah. And Autumn. But how did you guys approach the scene? There's that beautiful scene where everyone's dancing and kind of enjoying themselves before the horror starts and their ancestors kind of. They join them. How did that scene look on the page?

C (41:20)

Yeah, I can tell you. Cause I had outlined the script before getting into final draft and writing it.

A (41:27)

Yeah.

C (41:28)

And I didn't have. I didn't have that surreal, like, element to it. It was just gonna be that, you know, preacher boy sings and people like it, you know.

A (41:42)

That's what it said in the script.

C (41:43)

No, no, no, no. That's what it said in the outline.

A (41:45)

Okay. The outline.

C (41:46)

In the outline. When I got to it in the script, like, I felt strange because I had fallen in love with all these. All these characters and I didn't want them to die. You know what I mean? Like. Like, that was. I realized in this movie, I gotta. I gotta, like, get bit in the neck and check out, you know what I'm saying? And I felt. I felt bad. And I was. And I realized that this scene was the midpoint. And it dawned on me that, like, these people, the real people, not in my script, but the real people that they based on, these black folks in the 1930s who were like, of age to be in this juke joint. They were living in Clarksdale during Jim Crow. They all were sharecroppers because there was nothing else that the society allowed them to be. Their grandparents were enslaved. Their children and their children's children would still be sharecroppers. But somehow they invented probably the most impactful American contribution the global popular culture. And they invented it just because they wanted to feel alive for a few hours Friday and Saturday night. And I don't think they had any idea that the music that they listened to would change the world. So I thought about that. I said, Man, I'm about to kill him and my vampires, you know, like, I gotta have something else in the movie that is like some type of victory moment, you know? And that was where the idea. The idea of depicting just how powerful and transcendent Sammy's voice is, if it could call a vampire, you know, maybe it could call these people's ancestors and descendants too. So that was. So I wrote the script. I wrote it all in italics. I clicked italics on, and I kept it all in one chunk, you know, like almost like a stream of consciousness, and left it like that in the script for when my partners read it and everybody read it to know. To really, you know, read that differently, you know.

B (43:59)

Yeah.

A (43:59)

It's so powerful. And thank you for putting that, giving that context to it, because that's what it felt like. It felt like you were. You were loving those characters in real time. That's what it felt like. It felt like a loving gesture. And we felt that when we saw it was so, so beautiful and so beautifully shot. Just the way the camera moves.

C (44:23)

I mean, it was everybody working in concert with each other. We brought in Akaman Jones, who's a choreographer, works a lot with Usher. Raymond choreographed, like, Pitch Perfect, and he did all the Panther films. I actually met him through Chadwick Boseman, Rest in Peace. And, you know, every department was in on that, like, from Hannah Biechler to our visual effects supervisors, Michael Rowland and James Alexander. They're all Arkapar cinematographer. Obviously. We had a brilliant Steadicam.

A (44:53)

Yeah, the Steadicam work was incredible.

C (44:56)

It's a kid named Rennie, Haitian American kid, ex football player. His shoulders, he used to be strong dude, man, and sharp, you know, and everybody had to. You know, everybody had to work together. The actors, the incredible dancers, you know, Ruth Carter with our costumes.

A (45:16)

Yeah, beautiful.

C (45:16)

And it was. It was like, that was the most team effort of everything that we did. That scene as well as it's. I used to call, like, the twin counterpart, which is the step dancing scene that happens. That happens a little bit later in the film.

A (45:29)

Yeah, it's so beautiful. And I want to say, you talk about your work on Black Panther and Chadwick. You gave a beautiful speech recently at the Hollywood Walk of Fame about Chadwick, which is beautiful. And I don't think people ask you enough or I don't hear enough, like, what did you guys laugh about when you would work together on Black Panther?

C (45:51)

Me and Chad.

A (45:53)

What did you see when you think.

C (45:55)

About, have you seen Chad on snl? Oh, yeah, he's hilarious.

A (46:01)

He Is hilarious.

C (46:01)

You know, he played James Brown.

A (46:02)

He could do anything.

C (46:03)

Yeah, yeah. No, but he. But his natural way of being, I think.

A (46:09)

Would he. Does he like to tease all the time? That's.

C (46:12)

Yeah. No, no, no, he was. No, but he would do it in accent, which is what's crazy about him on set. Yeah, he was very disciplined. So he's constantly in accent and just being. And just being like, you know, he'll be ridiculous, like, in between takes. Yeah, you know, like. Like, Like, I'm trying to. I'm trying to think of, like.

A (46:30)

Like, do you guys. Did you guys goof around when you're. I mean, it's. You're working hard?

C (46:34)

No, I was. I was ridiculously stressed out.

A (46:36)

Yeah.

C (46:37)

You know, like, like, like, like unbelievably stressed out.

A (46:39)

Yes, I bet.

C (46:39)

And. And. And we know. We know now what all Chad was dealing with, you know, but he was. He was incredible, man, and, like, deeply, deeply funny, you know, deeply funny, man. Like, he would tease with. With Lupita and Danai, you know, constantly, Constantly cracking jokes, man. Like, you know, we would laugh. We would laugh most about the costumes, you know, like, just how hard.

A (47:08)

And I bet it must be fun to, like, introduce a new costume.

C (47:11)

Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah, man. Like, yeah, but, like, some of the props, too, man. Like, we would joke. We would joke and say that we was gonna give him, like, it was a walking scene and we were joking. Say we was gonna give him the, like, the giraffe tail so that he can, like, swipe. Like, swipe flies away. While he was walking with. While he was walking with Lupiza. And he was a martial artist, so he took that. He took the. He took the little thing.

A (47:39)

Yeah, he had, like, the ability to, like, clown. He was so talented. So talented.

C (47:45)

He was gifted, man. Yeah, like, Like. But how to. You know, just had a great sense of humor.

A (47:49)

I feel like comedy sometimes is where we stay connected sometimes with the people that have passed, like. Like thinking about the times we laughed.

C (47:57)

With them 100%, and they.

A (47:58)

I feel sometimes like they make us laugh.

C (48:01)

Yeah.

A (48:02)

We. We see something that makes us laugh, that makes us think of us laughing with them. I don't know, I just think that, like, it's fun sometimes to think about those times.

C (48:11)

For sure, man. Like, in. I think for me, when I look back on my relationship with him, man, it taught me so much. But the biggest thing is to not take things for granted, you know, like even all of this. I mean, like, the success of the film, being invited to do podcasts with you doing awards press with my cast. Before losing him, you know, I would be not present in those moments, you know? Like, I would be overwhelmed or be considering it to be work or dealing with, like, imposter syndrome or what have you. But since losing him, because he would be the one to, like, snap me out of that, you know? Like, when I would be stressed on Panther, I would say, man, I gotta hurry up and do this or I'm gonna get fired. You know? And he would say, hey, man, stop saying that. He actually pulled me to the side. It was like, yo, stop saying that, man. You know? And I'm like, no, I truly believe that. He was like, yo, I'm not gonna let anything happen to you. He told me, I'm not letting nobody fire you, bro. Like, me. Like, so please stop, you know? Please stop saying that. Relax, man. You know? Do your work. Enjoy it, you know? And that very act of being present, he was so good at that. So I think about that all the time. Like, even walking in here with you, I'm like, man, I'm really here. Like, I seen the set on the podcast, and I'm here talking. I've seen you perform and watch all your movies and your shows, and it's like, damn, I'm being invited to come sit in the same spot, just being present. I literally learned that from him, you.

B (49:52)

Know.

A (49:55)

That lesson is, like, I feel like the lesson we just have to keep remembering and being reminded of over and over again. Like, be where you are.

C (50:02)

Yes.

A (50:02)

Be where your feet are. Be where you are. It's hard. It's not easy, but you're right. It's a gift every time you're reminded of it. So are you getting to enjoy the fact that you have a gigantic, successful movie that's like being rewarded and will be awarded, and you're with these people that you work with now for a really long. It's awesome.

C (50:24)

Yeah. I have a time in my life.

A (50:26)

And so we do this thing on the show where we talk to people who know our guests. We kind of talk well behind their back before we get. Before we talk to them. And we talked to Ludwig today.

C (50:34)

Okay. Oh, man. That's crazy.

A (50:37)

Okay. And first of all, so Swedish.

C (50:40)

Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

A (50:41)

My brother lives in Sweden, so I tried to talk a little Swedish to him.

C (50:45)

How'd it go?

A (50:45)

It didn't go well.

C (50:48)

He talked back to you in English?

A (50:49)

No, he talked back to me in Swedish, and I panicked. Like, I totally panicked.

C (50:53)

Well, you got through the first day.

A (50:54)

I got, like, two words and Then he answered me. And I.

C (50:57)

Usually, when I try to speak another language of people who. Native speakers, they just. Just talk back to me in English and be like, hey, yo, stop it.

A (51:03)

Oh, I know that there's nothing sadder than when they. Then when they talk back to you in English and they're like, please don't. They're like, what are we trying to do here?

C (51:11)

Yeah. So you got Swedish back.

A (51:13)

So I did get.

C (51:13)

Thank you.

A (51:13)

You're right. Maybe I should look at it as a win.

C (51:15)

So I got the first base. You know what I mean?

A (51:17)

Exactly. He definitely. He was humoring me. And he's so. Oh, I mean, what incredible talent. And the music. It's so interesting to me that you brought him in so early, because you can tell that. I mean, this is a movie about the power of music, too. And, you know, you have Buddy Guy be like, the embodiment of kind of like the before and now. You know, it's just like a living person.

C (51:46)

Totally.

A (51:47)

And in many ways, almost feels like a vampire in the way that, like, he's still here. He's still here. And was there then.

C (51:58)

He was there then. Yep.

A (51:59)

It's so cool.

C (52:00)

But it wasn't that long ago. Yeah, that's like, kind of like what the movie is saying.

A (52:05)

Right, Right. And a very good reminder.

C (52:07)

It's actually like. It's actually like, I cheated him for younger. Cause, like, if the character would have actually been Buddy's age, it would have put the movie into the 2000s.

A (52:16)

Right.

C (52:17)

It would have put it in 2002, as opposed to 92, which would have put the fashion like it is today. So it would have probably confused.

A (52:26)

Oh, right. Yeah. Because. Right. You need a little confused audience. That's really interesting. And you and Ludwig, you know, he's talked about how amazing it is to work with you, how collaborative it is to work with you. He also said, like, you know, there were a bunch of different versions of Sinners before the final version. And working on that together and figuring out what that was and. And how his dad and your family, the blues were.

C (52:57)

It brought us together.

A (52:58)

It did. How did it bring you guys together?

C (53:01)

Well, yeah. Like, so the history of how the blues kind of became this instrument of, like, global cultural change was really interesting. Like the Delta blues, when the record industry came, they made those records, race records. And this was a time where the country was segregated, and the record industry was a product of that. So they would kind of put race records over here. Anything made by a black person, the same record made by a White person. Now they call that maybe rock and roll or bluegrass or country. And black musicians, when the record industry was burgeoning, they couldn't tour, you know, but their records would travel, you know, overseas. And a lot of, you know, bands in Europe kind of fell in love with the music. Like maybe most famously the Rolling Stones, for instance, or the Beatles. And. And then those guys would come to the States and seek out these musicians and then take them on their European tours, you know, as opening acts. And in Sweden, Ludwig's father saw, I believe, John Lee Hooker and Albert King said, yeah, yeah. And was so inspired by seeing him that he decided that he wanted to become a blues guitarist and became one, you know, and when he had his first son, who was Ludwig, you know, he introduced him to guitar lessons, you know, and his dad made money as a guitar teacher.

B (54:51)

Wow.

C (54:52)

And what's crazy is Ludwig, you know how he tells me it was something that he liked spending time with his dad, but he wasn't necessarily crazy about the music that his dad was listening to until he heard Metallica, you know, and then, boom, he fell in love with it and became a guitarist, had a jazz quartet, all kind of different stuff going with the music school, and eventually came to the States to learn how to become a film composer. And that's how we met. We met in School in 2008.

A (55:23)

Yeah. You met at a party.

C (55:25)

We did, yep.

A (55:27)

Yeah.

C (55:27)

I mean, if you want to call it that. Yeah. It was pretty de.

A (55:34)

A bunch of people sitting around.

C (55:36)

It was a bunch of nerds sitting around, and we was two of them. You know what I mean? Thank God I found him.

B (55:42)

Yeah, yeah.

A (55:42)

His question to you is like a perfect musician, guitarist question, which. His question that he wanted me to ask you was, how is your guitar playing going?

C (55:50)

Oh, my God.

A (55:51)

He wants to know how it's going.

C (55:53)

Busy.

A (55:55)

Oh, okay. So maybe there's one thing you're not great at.

C (55:59)

It's a lot of things I ain't great at. You should bring Zenzi in here. She'll tell you. She'll tell you all of them. But no, no, I'm terrible.

B (56:08)

Yeah.

C (56:08)

Like, it's not going well. Yeah, it's not going well.

A (56:11)

Good. It makes the rest of us feel a little better that you're also not like, excellent at guitar, blues guitar, yet. Yeah, but you're learning. You're trying.

C (56:18)

You're better at typing. Yeah, but the guitar is still there. You know, my kids play it now, you know, but I gotta get back on my. I gotta get back on my lessons.

A (56:28)

Yeah, he wanted. He wanted to check in.

C (56:30)

Nah, that's not going well.

A (56:31)

Okay, we'll let him know. Well, I just wanna say, you know, before we wrap, is that the effect that Black Panther had on? You know, I went to the movies to see that with my sons, my teen sons.

C (56:47)

That's what's up.

A (56:48)

And to see something together, a shared experience like that, together, and to kind of walk out to your point, out into the world after feeling completely changed. Like, the color of the sky is different and the way we're talking to each other is different and the things we've heard is different. Like, the way in which their lives were truly changed by that film is so special to me. I really. I thank you for it because it's not always easy to find that, especially, like, a mom and her boys and teen boys and like, to find something that you can share in together and love equally. It's such an incredible piece of art. They would want me to ask you if you're making another one.

C (57:29)

Yes.

A (57:30)

Okay. That's all I want to know.

C (57:32)

They want me to know, like, my mom was my movie buddy, you know, and she still is, you know, so, yeah, like, hearing that story. I can't tell you how many times I've been in the car with my mom going to go see a movie she was excited about. She would go when I was too young to go to see movies. She would come back from dates with my dad, and she would. If the movie was good, you know, she would stand there in the living room and act out the movie for me. Like, walk me through everything that happened.

A (58:06)

That's so cool.

C (58:07)

My fondest memory was her doing that with the Fugitives. You know what I mean? Like, she's like, yeah, in the. Harrison Ford jumps down the waterfall, and then Tommy Lee Jones says, I don't care. And then, like, you know, that was my mom. So, like, hearing that you watched it with your boys, y' all had a nice time. That means everything to me.

A (58:22)

Thank you. It meant a lot to me, too. I really appreciate it. And the last question I want to ask you is your relationship to comedy. You have you. I think in all of the stuff that you do, you have fun with the ways. And again, you don't put boundaries on how your characters are going to react to things. Sometimes they're light and comedic. You want to have fun in the stuff that you make, and you want people to have fun when they go and see your films. What were some influential comedic films for you growing up? And what's Making you laugh now. How do you laugh, man?

C (58:59)

It's so funny. A lot of it for me these days. It's coming. Like, it's coming from the Internet.

A (59:10)

Yeah.

C (59:10)

Like, big time, man. But coming up, you know, like, one of my favorite movies is Coming to America.

A (59:18)

Oh, my God. Incredible movie.

C (59:20)

Like, that's my. You know, that's my incredible. That's got my heart to this day. And I love, like. I love Friday.

A (59:30)

Yeah.

C (59:30)

You know, like. Like, that's a big one. Yeah, I love. I love, like, McKay's. McKay's work. Like, one of my favorite movies. The Other Guys.

A (59:39)

Oh, yeah.

C (59:40)

I think that. I think that gets slept on.

A (59:42)

I totally agree.

C (59:43)

That's my favorite movie of his, even though he makes some great ones.

A (59:47)

That is a stupid, fun movie.

C (59:48)

Yo. I can't. Like, it's so much. It's like, it's so much. Yeah, it's so much in that movie that's so deeply hilarious, you know? And. Yeah, like, obviously snl, you know.

A (60:04)

Do you watch snl?

C (60:05)

Yeah, big time.

A (60:06)

You do.

C (60:06)

I Got Homies. That's been on there and just, you know, like, I love what Mike did on there with the stuff. The State Farm bit, you know.

A (60:13)

Wait, let's watch that. Wait, tell me again. Explain again. The State Farm bit.

C (60:19)

So Mike is. You want me to interrupt?

A (60:22)

Yeah, well, you said it.

C (60:24)

So Mike is Jake from State Farm, and it just goes dark, like, from there. It becomes like a David lynch movie.

A (60:38)

Oh, yeah. Jake from State Farm.

C (60:40)

He just totally replaces. He totally replaces this. He becomes this man's worst nightmare. Like, he replaces him.

A (60:46)

I can see how. Why you would like this. He's teaching his kid how to play. He's got his hand on the small of his wife's back.

B (60:57)

Yeah.

A (60:58)

Oh, he just gave him a look. Okay, so you're.

B (61:05)

You.

A (61:05)

Do you watch. You watch sketch to get.

B (61:08)

I do.

A (61:09)

Okay.

C (61:09)

Yeah. Yeah, I do. I love it.

A (61:10)

Oh, my God. I love it a lot.

C (61:11)

That's why I'm so excited to be here. I mean, obviously. I mean, that ain't that Enjoy. From Pixar, you know what I'm saying? But all of the comedy stuff, man, I'm like. I think it's like the highest level of what we do. So, like, you know, any of y' all that can kill it on multiple levels in multiple ways. You know what I mean? Live, scripted, or improv, it's like, you know? But you wouldn't know that from my work.

A (61:40)

I feel it. I feel it.

C (61:41)

I'm definitely in there.

A (61:41)

Yeah, I get it. And I know you're, like, beyond busy. It means a lot that you came. Thank you so much for coming.

C (61:49)

Thanks for having me.

A (61:49)

It was such a, such a. Such a pleasure. And thank you to every. Your incredible team of people, too, who made it happen. So thanks, Ryan. It means a lot. Thanks so much for coming. Thank you so much, Ryan. That was awesome. And I learned so much about you and about films and your love of them. So thanks for joining me today and for this polar plunge as we finish. You know, I asked Ryan what kind of posters were hanging on his wall, and I thought it was only fair to share what was hanging on my wall when I was growing up. So you should know that I had a poster of the band Whitesnake. Okay, that's number one. Number two, I think I must have had, like, a movie poster. It was probably, you know, something like Lily Tomlin and Bette Midler and like, big business or something like that. I don't remember. I probably had an 80s motivational poster, like a cat hanging on a branch saying, hang in there. When I was really young, I used to look at a magazine called Teen Beat and I would rip out posters of Sean Cassidy and put them on my wall and put lip balm on my lips and then kiss the picture. So I don't know, just felt like you guys needed to know that. Okay, Ryan, thank you so much for joining us. Thanks for listening.

B (63:15)

Bye.

A (63:18)

You've been listening to Good Hang. The executive producers for this show are Bill Simmons, Jenna Weiss Berman, and me, Amy Poehler. The show is produced by the Ringer and Paper Kite. For the Ringer, production by Jack Wilson, cat Spillane, Kaia McMullen and Alaia Zaneris for Paper Kite. Production by Sam Green, Joel Lovell and Jenna Weiss Berman. Original music by Amy Miles. This episode is brought to you by American Beverage. Ever wish you could double click on the ingredients in your favorite drinks without the Internet screaming at you? Same. That's why today's sponsor, American Beverage, launched Good to Know, a new platform with tons of information on your favorite beverages. It's all about transparency with zero spin, zero judgment, and a whole lot of facts. At the heart of it is the goodtonowfacts.org website where for the first time, you can look up over 140 beverage ingredients all in one place. Finally, a resource that trusts you to decide for yourself. It's a good first stop for clear, reliable information. Visit goodtonofacts.org for more information.