AMANZA SMITH: FROM SURVIVING ABUSE & ADDICTION TO STARING IN NETFLIX’S SELLING SUNSET

Summary

Great Company with Jamie Laing
Episode: AMANZA SMITH: FROM SURVIVING ABUSE & ADDICTION TO STARING IN NETFLIX’S SELLING SUNSET
Release Date: May 13, 2025

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Introduction

In this powerful episode of Great Company with Jamie Laing, host Jamie engages in a heartfelt and inspiring conversation with Amanza Smith, a resilient survivor who has transformed her life from enduring abuse and battling addiction to becoming a prominent figure on Netflix’s reality show, Selling Sunset. This episode delves deep into Amanza’s tumultuous journey, exploring themes of trauma, recovery, and personal growth.

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Early Life and Experiences with Racism

Amanza opens up about her upbringing in Vincennes, Indiana, a predominantly white, small-town setting. She recalls being the only black child in her school, which exposed her to overt racism from a young age.

• Amanza ([12:24]): "I was the only black kid in my whole community. My biological father's black, my mom's white, but I was raised by my white stepdad and my white mom."

She describes the daily challenges she faced, including derogatory remarks about her skin and hair, which profoundly affected her self-esteem and sense of belonging.

• Amanza ([13:36]): "There was a big, big racism. In high school, my boyfriend's family told me they didn't want him to date me anymore because I'm black."

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Struggles with Abuse and Addiction

Amanza bravely shares her darkest moments, including years of sexual molestation by her stepdad and stepgrandpa from ages three to eleven. These traumatic experiences led her into a cycle of self-medication through drugs like cocaine and methamphetamine during her twenties.

• Amanza ([23:18]): "I had been sexually molested by my stepdad from the time I was three until I was eleven."

Her battle with addiction was intense, but a pivotal moment came when a friend confronted her about her destructive behavior, pushing her to seek help without formal rehabilitation.

• Amanza ([31:03]): "A friend pulled me aside and said, 'What are you doing? You're throwing your life away.'"

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Path to Recovery and Personal Transformation

Amanza credits her decision to move to Los Angeles and prioritize her sobriety as crucial factors in her recovery. Through self-determination and the support of friends, she managed to overcome addiction without entering rehab.

• Amanza ([31:45]): "I cleaned up my life, got a job, and never looked back. It was incredibly hard, but I knew I had to change."

Her journey also involved confronting her past through therapy, which enabled her to address the deep-seated trauma she had buried for years.

• Amanza ([25:50]): "Starting therapy allowed me to finally speak aloud the things that had been haunting me."

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Career Breakthrough with Selling Sunset

Amanza’s resilience and unique perspective eventually led her to the world of reality television. As an interior designer and interior design specialist with the Oppenheim Group, she brought a fresh aesthetic to Selling Sunset, distinguishing herself from her peers through her emphasis on design over competition.

• Amanza ([42:14]): "I'm not about knocking anyone down. I focus on aesthetics and creating beautiful spaces."

Her role on the show not only showcased her professional talents but also highlighted her personal growth and ability to thrive despite her challenging past.

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Overcoming Health Crises and Embracing Life

Amanza recounts a life-threatening health scare that further solidified her outlook on life. After experiencing severe back pain initially dismissed as a spasm, she was later diagnosed with a blood infection (osteomyelitis) that required extensive medical intervention, including spine surgeries.

• Amanza ([53:38]): "I almost didn't make it. The infection was deteriorating my vertebrae, and I was in excruciating pain."

This brush with death reinforced her commitment to living fully and pursuing her passions, such as painting, which became a therapeutic outlet during her recovery.

• Amanza ([58:28]): "Emerging from the hospital, I knew I had to seize every moment. I began painting as a way to heal."

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Navigating Personal Relationships and Forgiveness

Amanza discusses the complexities of her personal relationships, including her decision to cut ties with her abusive mother to protect her mental well-being. She emphasizes the importance of forgiveness as a tool for personal liberation, sharing her experiences of forgiving those who wronged her.

• Amanza ([50:32]): "Forgiveness is for yourself, not for them. It’s about releasing the weight you carry."

Her approach to co-parenting and supporting her teenage son through the absence of his father showcases her strength and dedication as a single mother.

• Amanza ([62:12]): "I explained to my son that sometimes your brain gets sick, just like your body. It’s a way for him to understand daddy’s absence."

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Artistic Endeavors and Future Aspirations

Amanza has channeled her life experiences into her art, with her collections featured in galleries across London and Los Angeles. She views art as a continuation of her healing process and a means to inspire others.

• Amanza ([63:25]): "Art has become a dream I never knew I had. It’s a journey I’m excited to continue."

She expresses her intention to explore new creative avenues, including international exhibits, further establishing herself as a multifaceted artist.

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Closing Thoughts and Inspirational Message

Throughout the interview, Amanza's story is a testament to the human spirit's capacity for endurance and transformation. Her ability to overcome severe trauma, addiction, and health crises to achieve personal and professional success serves as an inspiration to listeners facing their own challenges.

• Amanza ([53:38]): "If you're struggling, know that there's a path forward. Forgiveness and self-love can change your life."

Jamie Laing and producer Jemima commend Amanza for her unwavering strength and infectious energy, concluding the episode with admiration for her remarkable journey.

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Notable Quotes

• Amanza ([12:24]): "I was the only black kid in my whole community."
• Amanza ([23:18]): "I had been sexually molested by my stepdad from the time I was three until I was eleven."
• Amanza ([31:45]): "I cleaned up my life, got a job, and never looked back."
• Amanza ([50:32]): "Forgiveness is for yourself, not for them."
• Amanza ([58:28]): "Emerging from the hospital, I knew I had to seize every moment."
• Amanza ([63:25]): "Art has become a dream I never knew I had."

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Conclusion

This episode of Great Company with Jamie Laing not only highlights Amanza Smith’s extraordinary resilience and triumph over adversity but also offers valuable insights into dealing with trauma, the power of forgiveness, and the pursuit of one’s passions. Amanza’s story is a beacon of hope, demonstrating that through sheer willpower and support, one can overcome even the most daunting life challenges.

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For those inspired by Amanza’s journey, her artwork is available at Grove Gallery in Fitzrovia and MASH Gallery in West Hollywood. Follow her artistic endeavors and support her mission to inspire others through resilience and creativity.

Transcript

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[Jamie Laing]

First three months only, then full price plan options available, taxes and fees extra.

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[Jemima]

I've got an idea of how I want to introduce this.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Okay, go.

[Jemima]

Okay, hang on, I need to get in the zone.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Hello everyone, My name is Jamie Laing and this is great company 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8.

[Jemima]

No, I'm counting in.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Why are you counting in?

[Jemima]

Basically, this morning I was coming into work and I was listening to what have you done?

[Ryan Reynolds]

My Pink Pony Club.

[Jemima]

Actually, that isn't even the song I'm thinking of. Anyway, there's another song by Chapel, Jamie. Suculite me. Like, I've gone back.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Can I just caveat this for a second? So people have just tuned in, right? Jemima said this to me.

[Jemima]

I'm the producer. Jamie's the presenter.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Correct. I'm the host. This is our producer, Jemima. Welcome. If you're new to the show, you probably know who Jemima is and you probably think she's a pretty stable, interesting person. She said to me before we started, I've got a really good way of launching this show. In this episode, I went, great, let's do it. This is how you're doing it. And you've sung the wrong song.

[Jemima]

No, no, you haven't. Let me finish my story. Yeah, I thought you were going to say the fact that I said that and then just closed my eyes for about five seconds, trying to get in the zone. Right. So there's a song. I was listening to some music on my way into work and one of Chapel Roan songs begins and she goes, 5, 6, 7, 8. Or maybe 1, 2, 3. And I thought, that's quite fun. Oh, that's how I'm going to start Great Company today. But I was having to try and visualize the music because obviously when a show starts, there's music playing underneath, but which isn't we. I add in later. So I wanted to do the count in because it would be really annoying if I went, five, six, seven, eight. And the music's like, no, it's faster. Okay. Five, six, seven, eight. Welcome.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Welcome to Great Company Podcast.

[Jemima]

That was a really long winded intro, guys. Sorry.

[Ryan Reynolds]

I'm your host, Jamie. This is Jemima.

[Jemima]

I've been cooking that up all morning.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Have you been. It tasted good.

[Jemima]

I don't. We'll see if that lands.

[Ryan Reynolds]

I think it will land. I think it's going to. Hey, seven, eight. Hey. By the way, I want to ask you a question before we start.

[Jemima]

Go on, shoot.

[Ryan Reynolds]

So I've been listening to a few of the episodes, as I always do. Typically, we record, right, for an hour and a half, sometimes more, sometimes maybe pushing two hours, but you edit it down to being around 50 minutes, maybe an hour. So you cut out sometimes quite a lot. Why is that?

[Jemima]

Well, often bits of it are like, ums, and ahs and fine.

[Ryan Reynolds]

So you sharpen it up. I get that.

[Jemima]

Sharpen it up. Then there will be full sections that I'll remove.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Why? Why do you remove them? Why do you choose to remove some ones?

[Jemima]

So my advice, if anyone's ever editing, you, always top load, which means putting your best stuff first. I don't want to wait 20 minutes for that big laugh.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Agreed.

[Jemima]

I want to come in straight away with it. Straight away. Sometimes you need a little bit of setup to get me to that big laugh. But often, like, the best moments in the episode aren't at the top.

[Ryan Reynolds]

That's interesting. And if you. If you promise the audience something in a title or something like that, you kind of want to get to that pretty quick. You don't want to lie to whoever's listening right now.

[Jemima]

That's very interesting. And there's often bits which are really interesting, but they're. They're less than other parts. So what I'll do, I'll try and get something funny or like, like really accessible at the top. Say, like last week with Lindsey Browning, we started with, like, really broad questions, and then later on we got into, like, the more. So like, if someone's listened for half an hour and they're really enjoying it, then they're more invested in those more niche questions of, like, I love that.

[Ryan Reynolds]

That is so interesting. Well, that is interesting, though, because today's episode, we have Amanza Amanda Smith. Amanda Smith. Now, Aman's a Smith, maybe a name that you haven't heard of before, but you may have heard of her now, if you haven't heard of her, I'm so glad you've clicked on this episode because I can promise you this, this is a story that is going to totally blow your mind.

[Jemima]

Yeah.

[Ryan Reynolds]

And if you know Amanza, then you'll know that she's been on a very famous television show in the States, which is on Netflix, called Selling Sunset.

[Jemima]

I love that show.

[Ryan Reynolds]

It's a reality show about selling amazing homes in California, in Los Angeles. And it's based around the people in the office that do it.

[Jemima]

Yeah. And Amanza's quite a funny character in it because all of them are really realtors. What do we call that in England? Estate agents.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Estate agents.

[Jemima]

But they need to have a license in the States to be an estate agent. And Amanza is a character who's known the guys who set up the estate agent Oppenheimer Group. She's friends with them and she's not. I think she might actually now be a realtor. But when this. Then when the show began, she wasn't.

[Ryan Reynolds]

She's an interior designer.

[Jemima]

She's an interior designer. So she has come in and she, like all, like, lots of the show is about them being competitive, trying to sell houses, whereas Aman is just kind of there as, like, just a fantastic character. And she has lived, like, an insane life. She's one of the characters in the show where I'm like, I don't really care if she's selling houses or not. Like, I just. I just want to know what's going on.

[Ryan Reynolds]

And her life is fascinating. She has nearly died a few times. She had a really traumatic upbringing. Her husband one day just left unannounced.

[Jemima]

Yeah. And that was in the show. And I hadn't realized that she still has never heard from him again.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Heard from him since literally one day just left. She's got two kids. She is in her late 40s, about to hit 50, and she looks absolutely.

[Jemima]

She looks insane.

[Ryan Reynolds]

She looks insane. So whatever lotion she is drinking, that is what you want to take.

[Jemima]

I don't drink lotion. You apply lotion to your skin.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Right, got it.

[Jemima]

Drink a potion.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Drink a potion.

[Jemima]

Smear a lotion.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Smear a lotion. Remember that if you take anything from that. But this episode today is going to be fascinating. Now, if you haven't subscribed to the show. I said this last time, but if you haven't subscribed to the show, I cannot tell you how much that does for us. By clicking that button, it makes us able to continue the show. Jemima also gets paid. It also means we can keep the lights on. We can keep the lights on. And we get amazing new guests. So if you really like the show.

[Jemima]

Is that the new jeopardy you're adding to it?

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah.

[Jemima]

That if you don't subscribe, Jemima won't get paid. Oh, my God.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah. That is literally.

[Jemima]

We've had a contract change, so please subscribe.

[Ryan Reynolds]

So Jemima can get paid. And also if you want to get in touch with us and let us know what you think of the show, what new guests you would like us to get. Anything at all. You can send us an email. Great company. Or send us a direct message on Instagram greatcompany podcast.

[Jemima]

And on those messages, we have a. I read all of them and we're really. We really want to do some little extra stuff.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yes.

[Jemima]

Where we start. Like, I love all your messages, so. And, like, I'll share them with Jamie. And we really love reading them. And we don't necessarily like Talk about them in the intros.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Correct.

[Jemima]

But that is something that we'd really like to do. So keep sending them in because we are. We are planning.

[Ryan Reynolds]

We are planning to do a little bonus thing at some point. So that's going to be very, very exciting.

[Jemima]

You guys will be a big part of that.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Correct. And we love the community. So thank you and welcome back and please get ready to enjoy this episode because it's going to be a big one. Enjoy this episode of Great Company with Amanda Smith.

[Jemima]

Sorry. With Amanza Smith. Or just Amanza. I've ruined the intro. Just go without me.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Amanza Smith.

[Jamie Laing]

Hey, everyone. I'm Amanza and I'm in great company.

[Ryan Reynolds]

So where are you staying at the moment?

[Jamie Laing]

I don't know anything about where I'm at, where I'm going. I got into the taxi today and he said, are we going to Marradbay? And I was like, I guess so. I could be kidnapped and just like.

[Ryan Reynolds]

And end up.

[Jamie Laing]

And not realize, not have a clue. Be like, he dropped me off in the middle of nowhere. I'd be like, cool.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Okay. You know, when I do these interviews, right. I. We. We do like a lot of research and we go. Your life is so fascinating. Like, crazy highs, crazy lows.

[Jamie Laing]

Like, it's a colorful life.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah. And then meeting you now, especially with someone with your kind of experience, what's happened. You have a really great energy about you.

[Jamie Laing]

Thank you.

[Ryan Reynolds]

You really do.

[Jamie Laing]

The Adderall. It's the Adderall above the dose. I actually have not even taken Adderall in months.

[Ryan Reynolds]

But. But you do, right? And, like, I think you're sort of. You sort of personified, like a real survivor in every sense of the word. Which is. Which is kind of amazing for those people who don't know. Where did you grow up?

[Jamie Laing]

Vincennes, Indiana.

[Ryan Reynolds]

What was it like?

[Jamie Laing]

It's a very small town. It's very. It's a farm community. Like, we have a day every year in school called Agriculture Day where people actually. They drove their tractors to. I swear to God, they drove their tractors to school. They wore, like, Carhartt, you know, like farmer gear. And they painted one hand green. My hand is. My hand is orange. I wasn't going to show. I put fake tan on last night and I didn't quite wash it. So I've my hands orange. But for Agriculture Day, they would paint one hand green and they would drive their freaking tractors to school. So I was the only black kid in my whole community. My. My biological father's black. My mom's white. But I was raised by my white stepdad and my white mom. White cousins, white friends, white. The white white. Everybody was white. And I had like an Afro. And was this little black kid in this very slow farm town. A lot of racism. Yeah, that's been since Indiana. It hasn't changed too much, to be honest. I don't go back a lot, but yeah, I grew up in a really small town. I think there was 25,000 people and that included like the junior college where there was like three or four thousand kids. Yes. We had lots, that is wild train tracks and yee haw.

[Ryan Reynolds]

But was it when you experience something like racism? Right. Is it one of those things? Because. And look, you know, coming from someone who is. Who is white and hasn't experienced it. Right. So I'm just asking questions here. Is it one of those things where you don't realize it's racism until you get older? Because you were the only.

[Jamie Laing]

Oh, no, I knew it was.

[Ryan Reynolds]

You knew straight away.

[Jamie Laing]

I knew it. The N word was a big, big. Yeah, there. Yeah, I knew it.

[Ryan Reynolds]

So it wasn't just kids having a joke. It was full on.

[Jamie Laing]

Full on. Like, I mean, in kindergarten, like people. Because I. I looked a lot blacker when I was a kid. I had a full Afro and, you know, I stuck out like a sore thumb. And so like on the bus in kindergarten, they would make fun of my skin, they would make fun of my hair. And then it was such a small school, though. You know, you get your friend group. I was quite popular because I was really good at gymnastics. I got really good at gymnastics. And I think that, like, that was my end. But in high school, I felt it the most. When I was a freshman in high school, I had a boyfriend. And you know, in high school you just, you call. I'm going to age myself. You call on the house phone. We had house phones.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

We didn't have page. Oh, yeah, yeah, I had pager. Yeah, but. And I would call this. This boy's house. That, like, that's how that was our relationship, you know? And then when school started, like, I would call there all the time. And then when school started, I was a cheerleader and he played basketball. And the very first game, his parents, I guess, came to the game. And I called his house, like after that, that night when we got home, and the dad answered the phone and told me not that he couldn't come to the phone and not to call the house anymore, but I didn't know. Like, I still didn't I didn't know what that was. The next day at school, like, his younger brother was in my class. He was a couple years older than me. And his brother said, I'm so sorry. He said, my dad went to the. To the basketball game last night. My mom and dad. And they saw you and they saw that you were black, and they don't want his older brother to date me anymore. So there was like that type of racism. Wow. Yeah.

[Ryan Reynolds]

That is really full on.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah.

[Ryan Reynolds]

How does that.

[Jamie Laing]

Oh, my God. I was devastated.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah. It's a young, heartbroken teenager experiencing that.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah. So when I had kids, I wanted to make sure. I mean, we're. We're in Los Angeles, but my son was born in Laguna beach, and there wasn't a lot of black people in Laguna Beach. We were like the token black family. When we first moved, I was like, everybody is so friendly. For the first month, my husband and I, and my daughter was already born and I was pregnant. They'd be like, oh, Mr. And Mrs. Brown. I'm like, this place is amazing. Every time we go to eat, they know who we are. Like a month in, I was like, we're the only ones. So when my son was born, this place is so. This place is so friendly and it's beautiful. It's like Laguna beach is the place to be. And then when my son was born, I was at the park one day and my. My son was still like, in the buggy. My daughter, I'm pushing her in the swing, she wasn't quite two, and a lady came up and she was like this to my daughter's hair. And I was like, we've got to get out of Laguna Beach. Because I didn't want my kids to grow up the only ones. I didn't want them to be in their class and be the ones with different hair, you know, be the. And now it's. Laguna beach is. I mean, this was only 13, almost 14 years ago. It's changed a bit. There's like more culture. But I was like, we have to go back to la. I can't have my kids be the only ones.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah. And it's triggering.

[Jamie Laing]

That is as well. Yeah. And so we moved back to la and now, I mean, my kids, they don't even. It's like they. It's not that they don't recognize race, because they do. They have all diff, but they have so many different friends. Like, they've experienced so many different holidays that, like, you know, from different cultures. And I think it's so beautiful.

[Ryan Reynolds]

How does that manifest, like, in terms of, like, what it does to a young child when you experience something like that? What. What happens to. What does it do to you mentally? Does it lose your confidence? Do you. Can you speak to your friends about it? Who do you even talk to?

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah, I talked to my friends about it. You know, it was. Yeah, I definitely struggled with self confidence. I was never the pretty girl, like, in school, because I wasn't the type of pretty that people were used to in my hometown. So I have, like, the cool, like, ugly ducklings, you know, Like, I was like. I blossomed later. And I think. I don't know, I mean, I would never change anything. I think it's made me who I am. I'm very humble, but it definitely. I struggled with, like, my hair. I hated my hair. You know, I. There was just multiple things that made me self conscious that I wasn't, you know, super crazy about, but grew out of it.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah, Ish. Yeah, I know. But it's also, I. The trickiest thing is when we're kids, all we just want to do is fit in. That's all we're trying to do all the time. Like, whatever that is. We just want to fit in all the time. And if. If people are making you feel that you can't fit in, it's like the worst thing that can happen to you because then you just feel alien.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah, well, luckily, I mean, that was. That was one experience with the boy. But my friend group, because my school was so small. Yeah, everybody was friends, like, you know, and like I said, I was really good at gymnastics, so that, that gained me some popularity. But we had a small. I mean, I graduated with the same, like, basically the same 72 kids that I went to kindergarten with. Very wild. Yeah. Was really small, and I was always, I think, meant for a bigger city. I was, I mean, obviously didn't really fit in, not just because I was black, but, like, I just. I need. Needed more action. I needed more, like, hustle, bustle, like, a little more edge. I think when I moved to Los Angeles, I felt like, okay, this is at least a good start to. To something.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Why did you decide. Why did. When did you decide to go?

[Jamie Laing]

I think. Well, I have been a cheerleader for the NFL, for the Colts, the Indianapolis Colts. And I got, like, a taste of, like, the spotlight, and it felt really good. And so I liked it. I liked entertaining. I've always liked to dance, to perform, but that's about as big as you can get in Indianapolis. So I was like, I just want to move to a bigger city. I literally decided on a Friday, like for sure I was going to go to la. And I told my friends, like, if you want to see me, come and say bye because I'm leaving. I think I left. I decided on Friday and I left on Saturday and literally packed everything that I could into a Jeep Wrangler and we drove across country. 36 hours to LA. I'd never been to LA. I didn't know anybody. Yeah.

[Ryan Reynolds]

That is wild.

[Jamie Laing]

My boyfriend Brad.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Are you serious?

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah. I had a car at the time. I left my car in Brad's cousin's driveway. I just guess I'll stop paying for this. Just moved to la.

[Ryan Reynolds]

That is wild. So hang on a second. So you and Brad.

[Jamie Laing]

Brad Harper.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Brad Harper. Was Brad Harper hot at the time?

[Jamie Laing]

I thought he was.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Okay, so you and Brad Harper, you're like, hey, Brad, I think we should go to la.

[Jamie Laing]

No, it was like Brad and I were gonna break up and I was like, I'm gonna move to la and I don't think that long distance is going to work. So you can either come with me or we can break up. So Brad decided to move too.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Wow.

[Jamie Laing]

We lasted like five months, I think.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Is that bad?

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah. Brad's a dick.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Really?

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah. He ended up cheating on me afterwards with like my two best friends. Yeah. Brad Harper.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Brad what?

[Jamie Laing]

I don't know. I heard that he was chubby and doing real estate in Indiana, last I heard. So I'm sure he's.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah. You prick.

[Jamie Laing]

I hope he loves watching Selling Sunset.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Wait, hang on. How did you. I need to go into the city.

[Indeed Ad]

So.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Wait, how did you find out Brad cheated on you?

[Jamie Laing]

Oh, it's so sad. We have moved in. Our friends Paul and Susanna moved from Indiana also. So we, the four of us got an apartment. So when Brad and I broke up, like, I couldn't stay because I couldn't afford to pay our half of the rent. You know, it would be divided by three and I couldn't afford it, so I was like couch surfing to friends that I had met, barely knew anybody. I used to like hook up with the bartender at this restaurant that I was waiting tables at just so I can stay all night sometimes. It's so sad.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Years ago, I'll go do this.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah. And then one night he wasn't working and Brad had said, you know, if you ever need to stay here, like I still had a key and I could come. And so it was like pouring rain. It was like 2:30 in the morning. Whatever. I'd gotten off work at my job and I went to the apartment and I, like, snuck in and I went to the hall closet to get a blanket to sleep on the sofa. And. Oh, let me give some backstory. My two best girlfriends that had been cheerleaders with me, Sonia and Michelle, they had moved out a few months after me, so they had their own place and they were friends. They all were still friends with Brad. So I sneak in and there's no blankets in the whole closet. So I like, go to push the bedroom door to, like, get a blanket out of what was our bedroom. And he was in bed with both of my best friends. Yeah. Oh, my God. That was.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Jesus.

[Jamie Laing]

That was. That was some big. That was a big one.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Oh, does it still hurt? No, it doesn't.

[Jamie Laing]

It doesn't hurt. I mean. Yeah, I'm a survivor.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

I love that. They'll probably watch this.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah. There was a moment you said when you had your daughter and you went to your parents house, you went to your stepdad and your mom's house, and your daughter was playing in the other room, and you suddenly, these memories came back and you had a panic attack.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Can you talk about that?

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah. So I was actually at my best friend Jamie's house, and I had been holding on to something for my entire life, buried it deep down, thought I was okay with it, made myself be okay with it. And that was the fact that I had been sexually molested by my stepdad. So from the time I was three until the time I was 11, I was molested by either my stepdad or my step grandpa. And I had my stepdad walked me down the aisle at my wedding. Like, I just blocked it. Completely blocked it. And they say, I don't know what anybody's beliefs are, but they say God gives you what you need, not what you want. And when I was pregnant, I wanted to have a little boy because I was like, had this terrible relationship with my mom. And I just thought, I just need to have a boy. And when I found out my daughter was a girl, I was like, I was terrified of how this relationship, I mean, I couldn't imagine being like my mom, but it was just this thing in my head. And when she was. I was about six months pregnant with my son, so my daughter wasn't even two years old yet, and I had gone home and I was at my best friend Jamie's house, and she has three daughters. And my stepdad was there. He had driven me to my best friend's house. She was Going to take me to the airport later that day and he was playing with her little girls, like talking to them just like normally that would have been totally fine in my head because I'd pushed this down for God knows how many, you know, years. And all of a sudden everything that happened to me I just imagined if it happened to my daughter and I had a full on panic attack. It was the first time I'd ever experienced a panic attack. I couldn't breathe, my heart was racing. I just wanted him to stop talking to her kids. I wanted it to stop. I didn't understand what was going on and went back to LA and went immediately to a therapist. It was the first time I'd ever went to therapist really. It was the first time I had said out loud like some of the things that had happened to me and yeah, that's. Then they encouraged me to, you know, how to like navigate that relationship ending. And I wrote an email and basically just told him everything that had happened with his dad. He didn't know and just cut off the relationship. And that's been, that was well, almost 14 years ago because. Well, 14, about 13 years ago.

[Ryan Reynolds]

What was his response?

[Jamie Laing]

He responded with an email. I don't remember exactly what it says. Nothing would have been good enough. But I remember thinking like, wow, this wasn't even close to like good enough. I mean he admitted everything and, and talked about, you know, some of the shame and feelings that he had had since it happened. But that was. I don't have the emails anymore. I deleted them after a certain point. I just didn't want that energy even on my computer. But yeah, that was the first time. My daughter definitely was a girl for a reason and she saved me because that was the first. That was the, you know, that got me into therapy and that got me to say out loud what had happened and like actually like deal with it.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Do you think you would have died without your daughter?

[Jamie Laing]

I think I probably, yeah, I think I would have. I think I probably would have at some point been so strung out on drugs that I probably would have ended up overdosing at a point. There was a time in my 20s that I was very hooked. I was self medicating and I thought I was fine. You know, I didn't understand what self medicating. I mean at the time I didn't even know. It was like shortly after I moved to la, I got into cocaine and meth. I did a lot of self. I mean nobody, it was never like to the point nobody knew because I Was so good at hiding it. But I think, you know, had I not turned my life around, I would. It wasn't just my daughter. Like, I had a good friend who pulled me to the side at one point and was like, what are you doing? Like, you came out here, you're beautiful. You came out here to. To model, to do all these things. And I see you off, like auditions and you're missing jobs and you're not, you're not. You don't have your together anymore. And I was like, what a hypocrite. Because this person was partying like, right alongside with me. But that's all it took. And I moved out and I, like, cleaned up my. I went to a hotel, checked myself into a hotel, like a seedy hotel. And I dropped to my knees and prayed out loud for like, it could have been five minutes, it could have been an hour. I don't remember. I just remember sobbing and falling to my knees and begging, God, please just help me not go back to what I was doing. And like, I never went to rehab. Nothing. It just changed. And shortly after that, like, I came clean to all my friends, told them, like, what I'd, you know, what I'd been doing. I had been dating this guy, like off and on for like a few years, like the whole time, basically. But he was like traveling a lot. And so he's like, I always knew there was something with you, but I couldn't put my finger on it because I was very good at hiding it. And that person helped me. He, like, got me a computer. He helped me get into my own apartment. From the computer I was able to get a job, like at a doctor's office. I was like a secretary. And I just normalized my life so I never had to go back. It would have been very easy to go back. Moving in with the roommates that I had, partying all the time, had this person not like stuck by my side and helped me, like, kind of get on my feet. And then about two years after that life change, that's when I met my ex husband. And that's when. So I was already, you know, I was clean and sober and everything before I got into a relationship, before I got pregnant with my daughter. But she definitely. She definitely has changed. You know, if had I never gotten therapy or started therapy for all the things, I maybe would still be suppressing it. Maybe this stepdad would still be in my life. Maybe I still would be thinking it was O. You know, it was okay. I wanted a dad so bad that I just sort of. Not sort of completely blocked it and just pretended like it never happened.

[Ryan Reynolds]

It's easier to do that than.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah. Than to deal with it.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Deal with it. The fact that you managed to get sober by yourself is insanely strong.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah.

[Ryan Reynolds]

That is insane.

[Jamie Laing]

There was a time, I mean, right when I had stopped partying, I, you know, I went to the emergency room at one point because I wanted to get information about rehabs. But, like, it's so hard to get into a rehab. They were like, there was like a month waiting list. And I know myself, I was like, if I've been clean and sober for a month, I'm not gonna need it. Like, wow. I just knew. I'm, I'm. I knew that I wanted to stop. I'd been shamed by my best friend. He was like, you're a loser. And I couldn't believe it. I couldn't believe. And then a year later, he came and he said to me, I had to. I had to do that. I wasn't like, I didn't mean it. He's like, but I had to do it. I couldn't watch you, like, throw your life away like that.

[Ryan Reynolds]

The only reason I'm, you know, I'm very close to people who have, who have dealt with addiction and things like that. And I like. It is. It's a disease. This totally is. And if you've seen it and been around it and know it, it is a disease. It really gets inside the brain of the individual and it makes them. That life decision and choices completely go off killed. And especially if you're trying to cover up because of emotions and things that it's very hard to get out of it without help.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah.

[Ryan Reynolds]

And I know a couple of people who've done it by themselves and they are strong. So I really realize you're strong, but you are off the chart, truly. Because you need, you need to have that brain and that willpower to go. This is where I don't want to do that. I want to do this. Especially with all that memory and all the hurts and all the trauma you're dealing with as well. Because the easiest thing is to go back.

[Jamie Laing]

At that point, I hadn't even thought about what I was doing. Like, at that point, I still hadn't.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Because it's nothing to pull you out.

[Jamie Laing]

Put two and two together. Like, oh, I'm self medicating because I'm still. Because I was still two years away from even admitting that, you know, I'd had this terrible past in my childhood for Me, it was like I was just having fun and I was shutting off the world. But at the time, I wasn't thinking. I thought I was just having fun. But when my friend was like, you're a loser. I guess I'm stubborn, I was like, no, I'm not.

[Ryan Reynolds]

No, I'm not.

[Jamie Laing]

No, watch me.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Watch me.

[Jamie Laing]

I'll show you not. I'll show you. It's not gonna be a crackhead anymore. About that. Showed him. I didn't smoke crack. Just. I don't know why I feel like I. Not that meth is any better. It definitely was not. Cr. Don't call me a cracker.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Just saying. I did math, but I didn't do grad.

[Jamie Laing]

Did not do gr. Well, maybe once, but it wasn't on purpose. I thought it was math. Seems like a lifetime ago.

[Ryan Reynolds]

I can imagine. Yeah. I heard that you were. You were working, like, three jobs or just working. You were cleaner. You were doing all these different things. And then this opportunity came around to go on this TV show selling Sunset. Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

So. Well, not in that exact total order, but after my divorce, yes. I had only been a cocktail waitress and a model, and I had gone to school for a handful of years for interior design.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

But when I moved to la, there was a few years of my life that I was a little blurry. And then I got married and then had kids, and then, you know, I got a divorce. So I hadn't had a lot of work experience, like, other than cocktail waitressing and modeling. So I hadn't done anything with my interior design. And then my dear friend Jason Oppenheim had started this brokerage, the Oppenheim Group. And he, you know, selling Sunset wasn't even on the radar at the time. And so I was. I was walking dogs. I was trying to nanny other people's kids. Nobody would hire me as a nanny. And I was like. I was like, maybe I'll find, like, a cool lesbian couple and they'll hire me. Or, like, a cool single dad. Because, like, nobody that was married was hiring, like, the hot nanny. I got it because when I was looking for a nanny when I was married, I was like, if she doesn't weigh 500 pounds and she's not at least, like, 50. Like, that seems so old at the time. 50. Jesus Christ. @ the time, it seemed, like, anxious. Damn.

[Ryan Reynolds]

It's actually young. I think it's young.

[Jamie Laing]

I think it's so young. I hope so, because I'm almost 50. But so then. So I got it. But So I was trying to nanny. I was trying. I was walking dogs, I was working retail and I was the house cleaner. And I think I made the most money cleaning houses. But it made me feel worse about myself. Why? Because I hadn't cleaned my own house in like eight years and I was like suddenly scrubbing toilets and I was like, fuck, this just makes me. My mental health. I was aware that my mental health was, was the most important.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

And I was like, I don't care if they're going to pay me 500 today to clean this house. Like I. I would rather be broke today.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

And so, so Jason, it took a minute before he gave me my first opportunity as a stager. He finally gave me. I started an LLC called Kid terrioriorior Design at one point. Because I thought, well, if I do kid rooms, it'll separate me from like all the big interior designers.

[Ryan Reynolds]

That's smart. It's very good.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah. Because people, like a lot of people don't like to work with kids, which is freaking bizarre to me. I love kids. So I would. So I started doing kid rooms. I did like maybe three nurseries. It was like I charged like 400. It was costing me more to like decorate the house. But I started an llc and I thought I was a businesswoman. I got business cards made and I like spelled everything wrong. And Mary was like, you suck. I had to like send them back and get the. Get them. She's like, you have to put a comma between the city and the state. I'm like, I'm an artist.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Hey, whatever.

[Jamie Laing]

Doesn't matter. Nobody cares. I spelled my address wrong. So I did like three kid rooms. And then Jason gave me the opportunity to stage one of his listings at his new brokerage. And it was like a 5,000 square foot house. And I think they had like a ten thousand dollar budget and I had to stage this whole thing. So they had some furniture. I went to Ikea and got like sofa. And like these people didn't even know the house sold fully furnished.

[Ryan Reynolds]

I used to wait, hang. So it was a 5,000 square foot house. They had a 10,000 pound budget.

[Jamie Laing]

Yes. Which is nothing.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Nothing, nothing.

[Jamie Laing]

And they had little sprinkles of like they had like some lamps and a couple rugs and like some of the bedrooms had beds. But I mean I had like, I'd made connections with my friends like at different furniture stores and things like that because I just loved to go and like look at furniture and chandeliers and like lighting and rugs all the time. When I was supposed to be doing other things, that's what I would want to do. So, long story long, Jason gave me the opportunity to stage this house. It's. And it sold fully furnished. So then he brought me on to the Oppenheim Group as the interior design specialist. So I started staging a lot of their listings. And then fast forward. I mean, there was a few years. Many years went by before selling Sunset. So it wasn't exactly like that. But I had just gone through a breakup. I was with somebody for five years, and I had broken up. We had broken up. And so I kind of felt like I was starting over, you know, And I did. Deal or no Deal. I know you guys have it here. It's a little different than. Than it was in the States because.

[Ryan Reynolds]

You would just open. You just open up the box.

[Jamie Laing]

Amanda, open your case. Yeah, it was like this. And I don't know why, but if you watch. If there was a montage of every time I opened my case, my mouth opened with it. It's so ridiculous.

[Ryan Reynolds]

I can announce it. I can announce it. Okay, so, Amanda, open your case.

[Jamie Laing]

So cheesy. It was just like, because you can't talk if you don't have a microphone and that you don't always get miked. Like, you're lucky if you get Mike. Wow.

[Ryan Reynolds]

It's a big deal.

[Jamie Laing]

Mike, you better be ready too, because you got to pay attention and like, say this guy's the. The. You're the contestant and you, like, you're saving up all your money for a sweet factory.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

Because you want to start Vegan Kitten.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah, yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

Snacks. And I'm like, well, it's your lucky day. And I hope that. I hope that you get to, you know, start your vegan. Let's see if you can start your vegan kitten snack company. Because you gotta peek. You gotta peek. You peek because you need to know, like, what reactions. My reaction was the same, no matter what. Terrible. Now somebody's going to make a montage and it's just going to be like, ah. You go to PE no matter what. The million $500,075 a dollar. My mouth is open, like, awful.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Can you just change your reaction?

[Jamie Laing]

I don't know. It was just so automatic. I still. I can't change it now. It's almost like.

[Ryan Reynolds]

It's like you're stuck.

[Jamie Laing]

Anytime I open anything, my mouth just opens.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Even letters.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah. Opening green beans.

[Ryan Reynolds]

I did. When you opened the door.

[Jamie Laing]

So it came around twice. I did Deal or no Deal the first time. When it Was, I couldn't believe your luck. When it came. I had Botox the second time, I was like, this is harder. My facial expressions. Ten years later, I'm like, so the girls and Jason and Brett, they had started this brokerage, and they. Everybody was. I was there all the time because I would just go like, I was staging houses, didn't have a real estate license. I would just go, like, plop down on the couch around lunchtime when Jason was taking everybody to lunch, and I would go hang out. And then they. They said that they were, you know, going to do this reality show. And I was like, I'm gonna let you guys test that out.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Said no. Right.

[Jamie Laing]

Well, I didn't have a real. I wasn't a real estate agent yet, and I was doing Deal or no Deal, like, at the same time. So I kind of like, I would have probably done it had.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Why were you nervous about it?

[Jamie Laing]

Because it was a reality show. You never know, like, how it's going to go, you know, it was their first season, but I was filming, so I came back and this. Their season aired and it did really well, and they got picked up for another season. And so Jason's like, you need to get your real estate license so that you can. Well, first he was like, you need to get your real estate license so you can just start making more money so you don't have to borrow money from me all the time, basically. So I did, and then. Then they put me on the second season because they got picked up for the second season, and now we've just finished season nine.

[Ryan Reynolds]

It's crazy.

[Jamie Laing]

We just finished filming season nine. Yeah.

[Ryan Reynolds]

If anyone. I mean, if you haven't heard of it or seen it, it's crazy. But it's like this. It's a global success. People are obsessed with you guys. Like, like in the. You know, everyone in the office was, like, couldn't be more excited that you were, like, arriving. People were, like, waiting outside the window for you to arrive. It's crazy, but you're right. It's one of those things with reality TV where it's. It's. It's daunting to do, but then you kind of have to give over quite a lot to it and.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah.

[Ryan Reynolds]

And it becomes competitive.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah, I guess. I mean, within the show.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah, within the show. Does it happen like that or.

[Jamie Laing]

No, I'm not. I feel like I'm a little bit different. I mean, I'm definitely not, like, knocking down any of the other girls to sell most houses. I think you've seen me sell two houses. Killing it. I've definitely been about the aesthetic. I enjoyed the fact that I was able to be the stager and the interior decorator and now the artist. So this season it'll be interesting.

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[Ryan Reynolds]

In this conversation. Right? Like you can ask me anything and. And likewise other Brandon, if I step over the mark you can just tell me to off. Yeah, all right.

[Jamie Laing]

There's no mark.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Okay, fine.

[Jamie Laing]

There's no mark. I'm an open book.

[Ryan Reynolds]

I'm an open book as well. Like. Like totally open. Can you. Why did you stop talking to your mum?

[Jamie Laing]

Huh? It just was. It never ended well. It's like I never got maybe what I was looking for. It was just always a negative experience.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Really.

[Jamie Laing]

And it's been that way. Like we've never had a great relationship. My, you know, from my childhood. Like she was very. And she's still alive. I don't know that she'll watch this but she's a very like and only to me she's like miserably angry. It's like she was very hostile. She was very physically and emotionally abusive. Like, growing up, she's just mean. Like, she was just mean to me. And so it just never changed. Like, it never changed when I got older. Every experience on the telephone, even living in Los Angeles, it just would always be devastating. And so a friend of mine, a really close friend of mine, pointed out a few years ago, she's like, you know, I'm in. In my 40s, and she's like, you. Every time you speak to your mom, it, like, guts you. Like, it literally just would, like, put me in this mood no matter what. It's like we never had a positive experience. Like, she's just bitter. And so I just decided at one point, after, like, a really negative phone call, like, interaction, I was like, I'm just not going to talk to her anymore. Like, I'm a mom. I'm a. She's a mom. I feel like we're, like, equal at this point. I never felt like really her daughter. And I know, you know, I'm doing a really good job raising my kids, and I want to be positive. And this is never a positive experience. And I just decided to cut her off. And it was. She was not like, she was pinging my phone and trying to, you know, ringing my phone. I was having to ignore it. I just didn't speak to her for. It was like, yeah, a couple of years.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Wow. Then just days goes into weeks and then weeks into months.

[Jamie Laing]

And yeah, it was like, right before a friend's, actually, Heather, when she used to be on our show. It was right before her and Tarek's wedding. And this was. It was. So I was having some, like, emotional, like, anxiety, some depression problems at the time anyway. And I don't remember the exact conversation, kind of remember the exact conversation, but it floored me. Like, I literally fell to the floor sobbing when I got off the phone with her. And I didn't go to their wedding. Like, I was really in a dark place for, like, a couple of days. And so I remembered that when it was their year anniversary, like, they were posting about it, and I was like, damn, it's been a year since I talked to my mom. And then it was two years. Like, the year after they got married was then another anniversary that they had, like, posted about. I was like. So that's how I, like, could gauge because it was right before their wedding how long it had been. And it had been a couple years.

[Ryan Reynolds]

God, that it's tough. It doesn't. Whatever. I think whatever relationship, good, bad, ugly, whatever is you have with Your parents, they sort of still remain, like. They still remain like a mom or a dad or something. And so it's kind of hard to get past that sometimes, isn't it?

[Jamie Laing]

It's a tough one.

[Ryan Reynolds]

It's a tough one. Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

You know, my kids now don't have their dad, and so. And I was talking to my son recently about, you know, growing up. He's a. He's about to be 14, so raising a teenage boy, or trying to raise a teenage boy as a single mom.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

With a dad that just left, like, out of the blue. It's been crazy. Pretty shitty, you know, and so there. One of the things that we. My son and I kind of. I. And I don't know what took me so long to kind of put this into perspective, but I was like, wait, I don't have a mom. Like, I know what that feels like to want to have a parent who, you know is alive and you know is somewhere and you don't. And I was like, it doesn't really get easier. And I. So I kind of have that. Not that it's the greatest thing to relate to with my son, but I was like, I, you know, at 48 years old, know what it feels like to not have a parent. Like, I want a mommy. You want a daddy. Like, we had this over the summer, like, a lot of conversations, and I often have to remind him that, you know, he's not alone in, like, the way he feels. Like, I understand it.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Man, you're like a superhero. You are. Because it's, like, so much to go through and then also be a single parent. How do you. How do you process emotions? Do you. In terms of, like, do you. Do you hold on to. Do you never forget? Or do you forget? Can you forgive? Do you not forgive? How do you work it?

[Jamie Laing]

I forget everything.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Do you?

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah. I mean, I remember. Obviously, I'm able to tell the story, but I. I think deep down it's there, but I can't, like, ponder on. There's been so many crazy things that have happened to me. I would be a miserable stump if I sat and just, like, remembered everything. I let go. I do forgive. That took me a long time. It took me a long time to understand what forgiveness meant. Like, how I would always hear, you know, forgiveness is for you. It's not for them. And I did not understand that for the longest time. I actually went to trauma camp. Like, it's probably been, like, eight years ago.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Wow.

[Jamie Laing]

It's not called trauma camp, but that's what I Did. It's kind of like rehab for people with trauma.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

And it was this week. Long experience in Nashville, Tennessee.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

Where you, like, surrender your iPad, your phones. Like, there's no communication to the outside world. And they put you in these groups and you have intense trauma therapy every day to the point that, like, two days before they release you back into the world, they sort of, like, help you understand what it's going to be like now that you're so open.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Wow.

[Jamie Laing]

It was beautiful. It was called on site. I would go again. I mean, they have many different programs, and it was. So I called it trauma camp. But at trauma camp is when I really finally understood forgiveness. It's confusing.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

To be like, oh. Because it feels like, oh, if I forgive, then that means it was okay. But that. That's not it. And once I learned what that meant and I really understood it, it's so freeing. I've forgiven pretty much everybody at this point. I think there's maybe one thing that I might still kind of be hanging on to, but it's. We're almost there.

[Ryan Reynolds]

If someone's listening now and you know they're going through stuff or have been through stuff. Right. Because there's always that. There's amazing saying, which saying, which is from Nelson Mandela, which he said, seeking revenge is like drinking poison and wanting the other person to die.

[Jamie Laing]

Oh, yeah, yeah, I've heard that. I didn't know who said it.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah. It only hurts yourself, and that's why you need to try and learn to forgive. Otherwise, it just eats you up the whole time. So for someone listening, what would you say to someone who is finding it hard to forgive?

[Jamie Laing]

I mean, look, it's. It's really hard to understand. I don't even really know how to explain it, but once you can get it, it is. It. It literally is like a weight. Like the people that I've forgiven, I recently forgave. I mean, this is like a kind of a new thing. Like, within the past two years, like, I forgave my mom. We have. We don't have a relationship, but we had a very tumultuous relationship. And still to this day, if I tried, it just would always end up in heartbreak. And so forgiving her, and it was as simple as literally sending her a message out of the blue after not speaking for a couple of years and just saying, I don't need to have a conversation about this, but I forgive you and I love you. And it was like one simple text, and it felt like my world opened up like Literally good things started happening almost immediately.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Wow.

[Jamie Laing]

It just feels. And I mean it. Like, you have to mean it. You know, I've said it. I've tried it before. Like, oh, I forgive. And it wasn't quite, like, in there, but, like, I really, really, truly mean it. I just forgive. And I don't. Like I said, I don't know how to explain it, but if somebody can really, like, maybe look into it, read about it and try to understand what it means to forgive for yourself, not for the other person. It is life changing.

[Ryan Reynolds]

There is. I mean, you've had some really big moments with, like, filming, right? Like, there's so many big things. And I suppose, like, the biggest one that. That I sort of thought it was, like, was wild, was your illness that you had. What happened? It was. It was your. Something in your spine.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah. So the craziest thing, it was like, I was at Mary's house one night, completely fine.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Totally fine.

[Jamie Laing]

Totally fine. They had just moved into their new house, actually, she and Romaine, and we were like. I was walking around. I was, like, showing her how I would decorate. I was giving her, like, tips. Walking around completely fine, totally mobile. I wake up the next day, I go to step out of bed, and I can't hardly. I can't step. Like, my back is in so much pain, I can't move. And so I get back into the bed. I called off work. Like, we were still filming, and so we were. There was, like, some interviews that I had missed. I had to get a doctor to come over to the house to, like, because it was. We were wrapping up the season and they were like, you. We have to get you in to film. And I was like, I. You don't understand. Like, I. I literally can't sit up. And it was weird. This went on for, like, a few weeks.

[Ryan Reynolds]

What.

[Jamie Laing]

It was like, I would be. I kind of could tiptoe to the back.

[Ryan Reynolds]

It's just painful, so pain.

[Jamie Laing]

Really, really painful. And it would kind of come and go, not go, but it would. It would ease up and it would get worse for a few weeks, until finally I went to the emergency room. Like, a month now. So I go to the emergency room the first time, and they did an MRI. I was there 12 hours. Like, they couldn't even hardly get me to lay on the MRI machine because it was so painful. But after finally 12 hours and they did an MRI. They told me I was having a back spasm. So they showed me the mri. They said, you're having a back spasm. It Looks like you have some lower back arthritis. They sent me home with muscle relaxers, steroids, and like very strong ibuprofen. A month later, it had gotten so increasingly worse. I couldn't. Like, I literally was screaming in pain. Like biting the pillow on the sofa, crying in pain. Like, my kids would go to bed. I would hold it like all day because I didn't. I didn't want them to see how much pain I was in because it was terrifying. And one of my best friends, her name's Diane, she came over one day and she was like, I don't. Like, this isn't right. Like you. She's the one that took me to the emergency room. But she was like, this isn't right. Like, this is. I've never seen somebody in so much pain. If you're not ready to go by 9:30 tomorrow morning, I'm calling the ambulance. Like, you've got to go to the hospital. Hospital. She took me to the hospital the next day. And thank God, because they told me 24 to 48 more hours at home and I would have been dead. I had a blood infection that was going all through my body. It was very close to my heart. It was. It had turned into what's called osteomyelitis. And it was. That's when it attacks bone. And it was sitting on my vertebrae and in my hip joint and it was deteriorating my vertebrae. So that was the pain. My bones was just being deteriorated. Like a penny in acid.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

And so they admitted me immediately. I was in the hospital for 31 days.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Get out of here.

[Jamie Laing]

I had two major spine surgeries. I had blood transfusions. I had like a severe allergic reaction to one of the medications. At one point, my fever went to 105, my blood pressure dropped, my heart skyrocketed. Like I almost didn't make it. And I just thought I was having a back spasm. So now I have. Now I am a superhero. I literally have a titanium vertebrae and I have two rods and like seven or eight screws in my back.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Where does it come from? This?

[Jamie Laing]

No clue. They said a lot of times it's from people, like, older. You're older people that have dialysis, like deep, deep intravenous, like medication. And no, I'm not a drug user. Like, yeah, because there's Reddit, like, reports like, oh, she was just doing like intravenous drugs. No, it's like something usually deep, like needles, like you can get. It's not like you, you know, drink bad water in another country or you Step up. Because I was like, I've gotten tattoos. Could it be that I've had like IV drips?

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

Vitamin drips?

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

No, no, no. Like they. Honestly, I was like one of two patients that were as young as me at Cedar Sinai Hospital that had had anything close to this, like on the spine, that severe. So that is why. It's just a mystery to me. It was like. Sounds really fucked up, but it was like I came out of that hospital and I was with a new view on life.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Like, what? Give it to me.

[Jamie Laing]

Just like whatever it is that I want to do, I'm going to try. Because I'm supposed to be here. I didn't fucking die and I've got shit to do. And I came out and I. When I came out of the hospital 31 days, I still had a PICC line in my arm of IV drugs that went. It went through like a main vein and then it dropped right into my heart. An IV bag that they came and they changed every 24 hours for three weeks. And then I was on an oral antibiotics for six months still after that. So my body was like shot. I mean, I had so much medicine at, you know, one point going through me. But I started painting.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

Again, because that was like something that I could do with my right hand as I was healing at home. And that's when, yeah, all the art stuff started.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Do you think there. Because do you think there's a weird way that life works where everything kind of happens for a reason?

[Jamie Laing]

Yes, you do. So much so that I feel like this is gonna sound really up too, but I feel like my kid's father had to disappear for me to realize my full potential and to really go for it and try my best at everything that I do. Because I feel like if he had stayed or if he, if he were still here every other week I had a break. And I wasn't like going and pounding the pavement and like doing the most. On the week that he had the kids. I was like relaxing. I would go out with my friends. I took that as like my break as like I deserved this, like week long break. And when he disappeared, I don't have a choice. Like, I can't fail. I'm all they have. Like, I have to succeed because I'm it. Like we don't have family. I don't, you know, I've spoken about my mom. I don't have like a close relationship with. I have sisters. But you know, even them I met later in life, like I don't have. There's no legacy around me. It's me.

[Ryan Reynolds]

It's you.

[Jamie Laing]

And so I feel like, like that was one thing. And then I almost died in the hospital and I didn't. And I think that it's just. Talk about stubborn, like that's what has to happen for me to. But yeah, I just feel like, yeah, I think that everything happens for a reason.

[Ryan Reynolds]

And do you know why your partner just left?

[Jamie Laing]

I don't. We were divorced since the kids were one and two. But for seven years we did co parenting perfectly. I mean, he was a great dad. He went to all of their sporting events. He was great with their academics. They were always on time. Something that I'm not so great at, you know, he kept them well fed, well dressed, like he was a very hands on, really good dad. I have no idea. I mean, he filed a paper to the courts explaining that he had some mental health issues from football, like concussions and stuff, but it wasn't that bad. So I don't know. I really don't know. But it's been five years. August 26, 2019 was a Monday. He dropped him off at school and we haven't seen him since.

[Ryan Reynolds]

I'm so sorry, man. Like, like, I'm sorry that you like it. Like, that's really hard because also, how do you communicate that to the kids?

[Jamie Laing]

You know, the only thing that I could think to do was to tell them that sometimes your brain gets sick. Also is like your body gets sick sometimes your brain gets sick. I mean, they were, they were 9 and 7 at the time.

[Ryan Reynolds]

That's a great way to do it.

[Jamie Laing]

And so I bought a book called when the Brain Breaks and explained to them that I think daddy's brain is sick and maybe he's taking time to heal his brain so that he can come back and be the daddy that we've always known and loved. That's. That was the hope at first. But then months turned into years and then, you know, the next thing you know, it's been five years. So those questions stopped. Like they, they're smart and then they're very resilient. To be honest with you, I think that sometimes it affects me more than them.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Sure.

[Jamie Laing]

Because as a parent, you take on like, I, they must be feeling this. They must be feeling it.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Especially when you feel everything. Right. Which you do.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah.

[Ryan Reynolds]

If you feel it like so much, you feel everything.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah.

[Ryan Reynolds]

I've said it to a lot of people and your life is unique in kind of an amazing way.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah. Thank you. It does Sound like a lot when, you know, I don't often talk about it all together, but yeah, it's. I'll write a book one day. Maybe there'll be a movie.

[Ryan Reynolds]

You need to do that. I'm not even kidding. You need to do that. And if someone's listening now and they're thinking they adore you and they. How can people. How can people buy your art or be a part of that journey?

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah. So right now I have an entire collection at Grove Gallery in Fitzrovia and then in Los Angeles at MASH Gallery in West Hollywood. I think there's still a couple pieces and I'll still be. I'll be funneling pieces through both of those galleries. Well, hopefully the one here. More. Yeah, this was my first exhibit here. And then I'm also going to Spain. I leave for Spain tomorrow. I'm going to Mallorca, and in Parma, there's an opening of Grove Gallery there.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Wow.

[Jamie Laing]

And so there's. I don't know how many pieces they have there, but there's. We're doing an exhibit with two other artists that are represented by Grove gallery on the 30th.

[Ryan Reynolds]

It's amazing because I know people listening to this. They're going to hear your story and want to even connect even more. And then when you. And with artists as well, when you can connect with that even more, you. You know, you don't just buy the. The art, you buy everything. The journey, the history, the story, you buy everything behind it. That's what's so beautiful about it.

[Jamie Laing]

It's really cool. This art thing is, like, so cool. And it feels like the dream that I never knew that I had. And now I can't. Now I just want to keep, like, going and see, like, where it takes me. I'm an artist.

[Ryan Reynolds]

I'm an artist.

[Jamie Laing]

I'm an artist.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Just gonna float around, let it take me wherever. I've enjoyed literally every single bit about it. This has been amazing.

[Jamie Laing]

Thank you.

[Ryan Reynolds]

You're a complete rock star, honestly, in every way. I have. We have a quick fire question. How we like to end the interview. You ready for this? Okay. Okay, here we go. What's a saying or phrase that makes you smile or cheers you up?

[Jamie Laing]

Wait, see? Okay, I'm a little bit, like, slow.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Sorry about that.

[Jamie Laing]

What's the saying or phrase that makes me smile?

[Ryan Reynolds]

That makes you smile or cheers you up? Can be anything.

[Jamie Laing]

Fuck off to the top of fuck off mountain. I love it. Fuck right off.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Best compliment anyone's ever given you.

[Jamie Laing]

That I'm A good mother.

[Ryan Reynolds]

What scares you most about yourself?

[Jamie Laing]

Well, I don't want to say it out loud because then I feel. But. But you asked me, so I have to.

[Ryan Reynolds]

You don't have to.

[Jamie Laing]

No. My extreme ability to self sabotage.

[Ryan Reynolds]

When was the last time you cried?

[Jamie Laing]

Two days ago.

[Ryan Reynolds]

What was it about?

[Jamie Laing]

But it was happy.

[Ryan Reynolds]

That's a good one.

[Jamie Laing]

Oh, and then there was a sad. I cried because my. My son and I had like a negative interaction and I'm so far away.

[Ryan Reynolds]

What's something you can't let go of?

[Jamie Laing]

Hmm.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Or maybe you can let go of everything.

[Jamie Laing]

I don't. So far, nothing. Really?

[Ryan Reynolds]

Nothing? That's a good answer.

[Jamie Laing]

Hold on. The fact that my kid's dad bounced. I haven't let go of that yet. I just kind of like shoved it over there for a second, but it's still there. Yeah.

[Ryan Reynolds]

What's your guilty pleasure?

[Jamie Laing]

Sweets. Not vegan cat treats.

[Ryan Reynolds]

You're gonna like those. Trust me.

[Jamie Laing]

Oreo cookies.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Oh, yeah, they're good.

[Jamie Laing]

I'll eat the whole bag.

[Ryan Reynolds]

What turns you off?

[Jamie Laing]

Bad fashion.

[Ryan Reynolds]

What turns you on?

[Jamie Laing]

Good fashion. Like, you could be ugly as a toe, but if you dress right.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Okay, what do you like most about yourself?

[Jamie Laing]

My sense of humor.

[Ryan Reynolds]

Yeah, it's great. And final one. Your favorite swear word.

[Jamie Laing]

Fuck.

[Ryan Reynolds]

There we go. Hanza. You've been. This has been the joy. Your energy is amazing. You're a complete rock star. This has been great. Thank you so much for coming. You're insane, Honestly.

[Jamie Laing]

Thank you for having me now.

[Ryan Reynolds]

You were the greatest. Wow. What a story. Yeah, that's amazing.

[Jemima]

But what a hoot.

[Ryan Reynolds]

What a hoot to the house. That was a mate. That was. Yeah, Very good. I mean, her story is insane. Jemima.

[Jemima]

But her energy is impeccable. She's so, like warm, fun. You would.

[Ryan Reynolds]

She's so funny.

[Jemima]

She's hilarious. Jamie.

[Ryan Reynolds]

I was dying with that, that, that, that.

[Jemima]

Deal or no deal? Also, if you. Again, if you. If you're listening. Well, if you're listening to this, you're listening to the show, but go and look on YouTube at that section of the show, because Jamie's face goes the same color as the wall behind. It's a real sight to see. But so funny.

[Ryan Reynolds]

So funny. Amanza, if you're listening, you're an absolute superstar. That was really incredible. What a story of resilience. What a story of heartbreak and trauma. But also, you can really achieve amazing things if you put your mind to it. Yeah, it was really incredible, guys. I said it before, but if you haven't subscribed to the show. Please do. That would really help us. And also please get in touch. We want to hear from you what guests you want us to get. Maybe what you like or don't like about the episode. Send us a message @GreatCompany podcast on Instagram. Or you can send us an email greatcompanyjamperproductions.co.uk. everything is in the show description.

[Jemima]

It is Indeed.

[Ryan Reynolds]

And listen, we're gonna see you next Wednesday for another episode of Great Company.

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[Amanza Smith]

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