GRACE BEVERLEY: What I’ve Learnt From Building TALA & Overcoming Burnout

Summary

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Podcast Summary

Great Company with Jamie Laing

Episode: GRACE BEVERLEY: What I’ve Learnt From Building TALA & Overcoming Burnout
Date: June 23, 2026
Host: Jamie Laing (Jampot Productions)
Guest: Grace Beverley

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Episode Overview

This rich, candid episode centers on Grace Beverley—entrepreneur, author, and founder of TALA—exploring her journey through personal and professional highs and lows. Jamie Laing guides a conversation that covers building businesses under pressure, resilience in the face of burnout, the importance of female friendships and support networks, miscarriage and invisible grief, leadership as a female founder, the gender funding gap, and navigating vulnerability in both work and relationships.

Grace’s signature honesty and thoughtful reflection provide vital insights for aspiring entrepreneurs and anyone struggling to balance ambition, wellbeing, and authenticity.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Surviving Burnout & Business Challenges

• Near Bankruptcy at TALA
  Grace shares the reality of TALA being close to bankruptcy, recounting the stress of facing payroll concerns weekly for months.

  “There was about three months where every single week I was wondering if we'd make payroll.” (00:00, Grace)

• The True Experience of Burnout
  Grace describes a period of sustained, debilitating burnout culminating in both mental and physical shutdown, including a loss of ovulation due to stress.

  “I spent a good few years, like, on the path to like, full burnout. Like, full cannot get out of bed...my whole body had gone into like, shutdown.” (00:00, Grace; 52:51, Grace)

• Reclaiming Autonomy
  She details her journey to restructure work, step away from micromanagement, and redefine her founder role to regain health and happiness:

  “If this was all engineered to build you the life you want, this is clearly not the life you want.” (55:54, Grace)

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2. Early Life, Self-Perception & Motivation

• Underdog Narrative & Academic Setbacks
  Grace recounts how teachers doubted her abilities throughout school, failing to predict her future successes. This drove her to develop her own learning methods and build internal trust.

  "Every single thing I have that's impressive that I've done was not achieved the first time." (12:45, Grace)

• Control as Freedom
  Her need for control—rooted in OCD and a desire for preparation—became both a coping mechanism and a source of anxiety. She identifies a tension between risk-taking entrepreneurship and a mind busy with worst-case scenarios and intrusive thoughts.

  "My freedom sits within a certain level of control..." (08:37, Grace)
  "I constantly think that the worst is gonna happen in every single scenario." (08:58, Grace)

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3. The Value of Female Friendships & Building a “Village”

• Intentional Relationship-Building
  Grace prioritizes friendships, especially with women, emphasizing their unique fulfillment and ability to anchor life through change and challenge.

  “The most important things to me in my life are my relationships outside of work and particularly female friendships… The fulfillment you can give to and get out of female friendships is unlike so many other things.” (20:26, Grace)

• Creating Systems for Connection
  She describes instituting weekly, low-pressure “no-judgment” friend dinners as integral to maintaining intimacy despite busy schedules.

  “It is however, on a Monday night, at a friend's house. And the rule is we all look like shit...It's just on repeat. Because if we all have to go to the additional mental load of booking something in the diary, we're...not going to do it.” (25:49, Grace)

• Being (and Finding) a “High-Effort” Friend
  Grace credits her support network with helping her through a miscarriage, describing how her friends organized daily rotations to keep her company and cared for her when she was most vulnerable.

  “Every single day, one of my friends got permission to work from home to work from mine...They had rotors set up with each other in order to make sure that I wouldn't be alone.” (29:30, Grace)

  She highlights the importance of showing up for others first:

  “…It’s been a real concentration of mine...to be the friend that I always wanted to have." (30:03, Grace)

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4. Motherhood, Miscarriage & Leading with Empathy

• Navigating Grief and Taboo
  Grace openly discusses her miscarriage and the “invisible grief” of loss, where outward life continues but internal devastation is private.

  "No one knows that you were pregnant. And it's just you have to continue." (33:10, Host referencing Grace)
  "It should be better understood in order to be better supported." (33:08, Grace)

• Policy Change as Leadership
  She implemented a policy at TALA for full maternity leave after pregnancy loss, aiming to set a new standard.

  “If you lose your pregnancy at TALA, you can take a full maternity leave.” (01:06 & 34:08, Grace)

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5. Gender Gaps in Entrepreneurship & Funding

• Systemic Barriers
  Grace lays out the stark statistic: women receive less than 2% of venture capital funding, impacting everything from product development to leadership representation.

  "Female founders statistically receive less than 2% of venture capital funding. Mad, it's just..." (34:31, Grace)

• Being Taken Seriously
  She reflects on being underestimated and mistaken for “the face” rather than the founder of her companies, and the societal double standards faced by pregnant entrepreneurs.

  “The assumption is that women make things for women, men make things for everyone.” (40:25, Grace)

• Advice for Female Founders
  Clear, practical guidance on seeking investment:

  "The first thing I would always recommend is getting really, really clear on why you need investment, what for, what it will ideally do for the company. If you can't write those three things up, you're not ready to raise." (40:44, Grace)

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6. Vulnerability and Authenticity in Love

• Finding a True Partnership
  Grace shares the evolution of her relationship, the importance of vulnerability, high effort, and authenticity with her now-husband.

  “In order to get connection, you have to have vulnerability.” (65:10, Grace)

• The “High-Effort” Relationship
  She describes their dynamic—both eager to go above and beyond—which allows their partnership to weather stress and life’s uncertainty.

  “If you're both trying to be the 60, then it mitigates for times where actually one of you needs to be 10 because you're going through something…” (68:41, Grace)
  “What I want in my ideal relationship… I like to do the types of things that will make him that happy and all of that.” (67:12–68:02, Grace)

• Memorable Proposal Story
  Her husband meticulously planned a fake Armani brand trip and an elaborate, surprise proposal, with everyone involved playing their part:

  “He'd flown out an Armani makeup artist to do my makeup… Everyone is in on this.” (00:40 & 73:01, Grace)

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7. Money, Prenups, and Taboo

• Designing One's Own Contract
  Grace encourages open conversations about money, especially for women, and discusses why she sees prenups as healthy, proactive planning.

  “You might as well design your own contract… particularly women need to be comfortable having conversations about finances…” (76:19–78:03, Grace)

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• On Burnout:
  “I literally have notes in my phone of being like, I don't know... I'm never going to be able to have babies because I'm never going to be able to even spend a week out of the business... That was a real wake up call.” (53:32, Grace)

• On Female Friendships:
  “What you can get out of female friendships is... fulfillment unlike so many other things... Female friendships aren't said to be a priority in the way that I absolutely think they are.” (20:26–21:34, Grace)

• On Grief & Workplace Policy:
  “It’s entirely unfair that you wouldn't get your baby and then also you're expected to, ‘Well, you didn’t have that, so guess you’re back to work.’” (01:00, 34:11, Grace)

• On Entrepreneurship Motivation:
  “If you spoke to any single entrepreneur ever, they've got a chip on their shoulder... I was really quite an insecure teenager... but I could make money... I could do that really well.” (18:34, Grace)

• On Control:
  “My freedom sits within a certain level of control... That’s where I feel, I guess, safest and happiest.” (08:35–08:37, Grace)

• On Advice for Women Raising Capital:
  “Be clear on why you need investment, what for, what it will ideally do for the company. If you can't write those three things up, you're not ready to raise.” (41:09, Grace)

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Important Timestamps

• Surviving Burnout & TALA Crisis: 00:00, 52:51–55:54
• Academic Setbacks / Drive: 11:45–16:14
• Control, OCD, & Anxiety: 07:00–09:07, 08:37
• Building Female Friendships / Village: 20:25–27:13, 29:30–31:09
• Miscarriage Experience & Policy: 29:30–34:11
• Female Founders & Gender Equity: 34:31–40:44
• Funding Advice for Women: 40:44–42:25
• Romantic Partnership / The Proposal: 59:48–74:46
• Prenup Discussion: 76:05–78:03
• Quickfire Questions: 80:20–82:16

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Conclusion

Grace Beverley’s candor about entrepreneurship, adversity, and personal growth is both motivating and practical—offering listeners real strategies for resilience and self-advocacy, both in business and life. Listeners are left with a grounded sense that ambition is best served alongside compassion, vulnerability, and a supportive “village”—and that redesigning your life on your own terms is as much about letting go as taking charge.

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Transcript

[Grace Beverley]

Tala nearly went bankrupt. There was about three months where every single week I was wondering if we'd make payroll. I spent a good few years, like, on the path to like, full burnout. Like, full cannot get out of bed. I wasn't even ovulating. Like, my whole body had gone into like, shutdown.

[Podcast Host]

If someone's listening right now, a female founder or someone who is starting a business, what advice would you give that person?

[Grace Beverley]

Okay, big question.

[Podcast Host]

That is great advice.

[Grace Beverley]

I'm Grace Beverley and I'm in great company.

[Narrator/Advertiser]

Entrepreneur Grace Beverly.

[Podcast Host]

Grace Beverly, your husband, when he proposed to you, it was, I think, some of the world's greatest propos. Like, he organized a fake trip for you?

[Grace Beverley]

Yeah. We'd arrived at the hotel, they'd had briefing calls. So, like they arrived, they go, are you here for the Armani event? He'd flown out an Armani makeup artist to do my makeup. Everyone is in on this.

[Podcast Host]

Oh, my God. This is insane. You said your miscarriage was like invisible grief. No one knows that you were pregnant. And it's just you have to continue.

[Grace Beverley]

It's entirely unfair that you wouldn't get your baby. And then also you're expected to. Well, you didn't have that, so.

[Podcast Host]

So here we go.

[Grace Beverley]

Guess you're back to work. If you lose your pregnancy at Tala, you can take a full maternity leave.

[Audi Q3 Advertiser]

Wow.

[Podcast Host]

Leading from the front like that is so important.

[Grace Beverley]

Women are expected to do so many different things to such a high standard. I think that if you can have solid female friendships alongside whatever else you're doing, I completely agree. You will always be in an okay place. We have so much onus put on finding a relationship, on settling down, on getting married, on all of these different things. I mean, female friendships aren't said to be a priority in the world.

[Audi Q3 Advertiser]

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[Babbel Advertiser]

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[Grace Beverley]

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[Monday.com and Experian Advertiser]

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[Grace Beverley]

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[Monday.com and Experian Advertiser]

easy and intuitive setup.

[Grace Beverley]

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[Podcast Host]

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[Sarah Gibson Tuttle]

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[Grace Beverley]

that I absolutely think they are.

[Podcast Host]

Hey, guys. Welcome back to Great Company. Really excited because we have Grace Beverly on the show. We go all over the place with it. It's incredible. Get ready for it. Now. Before we start, if I can ask one quick thing, that is if you can press that subscribe button, it notifies when you have another episode, you join the amazing community that already subscribed. Thank you. Okay, enjoy this incredible episode of Great Company with Grace Beverly. What scares you about motherhood?

[Grace Beverley]

Oh, there's so much.

[Podcast Host]

Really?

[Grace Beverley]

Yeah, yeah, there's a lot. Like, I have always known that I've wanted to be a mother. I used to. I actually used to say so much as a child, like, I really want to be a really good mum. That my sister told me, the more you say that, the worse mum you become. Because I was pissing her off so much. So perfect. Yeah, exactly. So clearly the aspiration was there from the beginning. I just, I think like I've. I've built my career in like a very specific way, right. Like over the past I've been doing this for 10 plus years and every few years I've added on what feels like a really good add on for where I am at in my career and the teams I've been able to build and all of that to be able to facilitate me to do more and more of what I feel my skillset is.

[Podcast Host]

And that's conscious choice, you and that's conscious.

[Grace Beverley]

Like pretty much everything I've done is quite specifically reverse engineered for the type of life I want to live and the type of businesses I want to build and the type of work I want to have. Like, even when I essentially kind of fell into, I guess, being a content creator, when I came out of uni immediately I was like, this is not what I want to do. So deleted all my YouTube videos overnight, like went like, stopped posting for two years, focused on building the businesses because I was like, that's what I actually want to do. So what scares me about motherhood is that what you can imagine from all of that is like a complete. Well, it's complete control. Like it's complete control over. And don't get me wrong, every part of the business is a certain amount out of your control. And I deal with that every day as well. But I'm so trained to deal with that and I've done that for so long that I feel like that is really what I'm good at. And I.

[Podcast Host]

This is really unknown.

[Grace Beverley]

It's so unknown and it's so many variables and so much, so many unconventions, uncontrollable aspects and I just. And so far from what I feel like my day to day is like great.

[Podcast Host]

Do you know what, by the way, you are going to relate to so many people who feel the same way. And I think that especially when you're a bit of a control freak, like I am as well, I need to be in control of different things. When you are having a baby, it feels like something you can't control. And a baby is baby and it's there and it has needs and desires and wants and it's human and everything. And so you have to let go

[Grace Beverley]

of that control 100%. I think two parts of that. A, I literally have OCD, like diagnosed OCD. So there's an element of that that I'm kind of like, I've been trying to, I don't know, I've been trying to work around that, but also almost like, use the parts of that that I feel like are my superpower. Not to. I mean, everyone will have a different experience who's been diagnosed with ocd. Like, I'm not talking for anyone else, but for me, I have tried to mitigate the bad sides of things whilst also being able to use the sides of things where I'm like, well, this actually means that I'm amazing at this, this, this and this. I think that that is so far from, like, you have to let go of control so much when it comes to motherhood and parenting and all of that. That is probably like, I feel like I'm being thrown so in the deep end from where I am now.

[Podcast Host]

How does your OCD manifest before the point too? How does that.

[Grace Beverley]

Lots of different ways as you can pro. Like, I'm very intentional around how I've done everything. Then that's like my happy place. And that's where I feel. It's weird. Like, I feel most free in an environment where I can control a certain amount of. Like, my recurring dreams are about being unprepared for exams, for example. Like, every single night I'll have a fucking dream about the fact that I'm sitting my finals the next day and I've not done the work for it. And like, that's my version of like, a true nightmare. Because, like, my freedom sits within a certain level of control and a certain, certain amount of that is unhealthy.

[Podcast Host]

That's such a juxtaposition though.

[Grace Beverley]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

Your freedom sits in the place where you control it.

[Sarah Gibson Tuttle]

Right?

[Grace Beverley]

Yeah. But to me, that's where I feel, I guess, like, safest and happiest and all of that. I think that the. Well, another big way it manifests is that, like, there's the less nice sides of things. Like, I get really strong, intrusive thoughts. Like, I struggle a lot with, like, the. I think the reason I try and be prepared for every single outcome, which is impossible when you have businesses and impossible when you're juggling so many different things, but is because I constantly think that the worst is gonna happen in every single scenario.

[Podcast Host]

Do you?

[Grace Beverley]

Yeah. It's exhausting. Really busy up here.

[Podcast Host]

Wow. Whoa. I didn't. But you're. You're a risk taker and you have pushed boundaries like, way before so many people's times at such a young age and done so many things that no one would do. And the reason why a lot of people wouldn't do that is because they would be afraid of the outcome. But so that feels like a. I didn't realize that it was so busy in your mind.

[Grace Beverley]

Yeah, well, I think that's fair to say mine was almost the opposite in that when I started the businesses and generally in the first few years of, I guess, entrepreneurship, although I didn't necessarily see it that way at the time, I was not very happy in a number of different ways. So it felt like actually the risk was staying where I was rather than doing the big leap things of kind of like getting out of there. So I think when a lot of people think of like, oh, is it really cringe if I do all of this or if I start this or if I start posting about this, then they naturally. It naturally feels like the safest version is not to do that. I always try and encourage people to flip that on its head where it's kind of like, okay, well, what's worse, Living a life that's designed for someone else because you're so worried about what everyone else is going to think or like that to me is a bigger risk than actually just makes sense trying to go for these, I don't know, bigger things.

[Podcast Host]

But when you get those intrusive thoughts right, and you think the worst is going to happen, right. When it, when something does go wrong, do you then say to yourself, I told you I knew this was going to happen, or do you look at it more logically than that?

[Grace Beverley]

I think I'm. I think I'm relatively logical. I think that I. One of the things that it means is that I'm very prepared for most outcomes because I think, well, yeah, 100%. And I try and I'm not very good at being, but I try and of what's actually helpful and what's unhelpful in terms of that internal monologue. But it does mean that a lot of the time I'm. I guess, you know, if the worst that's gonna happen is this, what three things can we do that mean that we're prepared in that scenario? Not in a kind of like truly exaggerated sense, but actually some places that's a helpful exercise. Some places it's not a helpful exercise. And I guess the battle for me has been differentiating, which is which not needing to approach everything in my personal life, for example, with the same rigour that I would try and approach it to, you know, run a business and manage millions of investors, money and all of those different things.

[Podcast Host]

Do you remember the first time when you felt out of control?

[Grace Beverley]

Yeah, I think that from relatively early on I definitely realised that I preferred situations that I was able to control the outcome more. Like, I really liked going into an exam, for example, feeling very prepared for it and feeling like I truly understood things and whatever it might be. And I think that one thing that's probably maybe a misconception about me, maybe, maybe not, but is that I. Because I had quite a, I guess, textbook, high achieving kind of beginning. I don't know. But I think that the. Actually I was told throughout school that I wasn't like, as in that. And I don't say this is a soft story at all. I genuinely think this is what's motivated me to get to where I am now. And to get to that point is like I was told over and over, like in primary school, my parents were told, like, she's not an academic candidate for anything. She's unlikely to, you know, be able to go to any of the kind of more competitive schools. So I would just like, don't stick her through the 11 plus. Like just, you know, like, this is not. That's not the direction for her. And that definitely like continued in a narrative. Like, every single thing that I achieved that was impressive, I never got the first time. Like, it was never a. So you see Oxford, I didn't get in the first time. Like, I tried twice. Same with many different. Like literally every single thing I have that's impressive that I've done was not achieved the first time. I was never particularly good at things and so was constantly told that over and over. It was kind of like, yeah, yeah, yeah, like fine. And so like for my GCSEs, for example, I was predicted, like, I was predicted like, I don't know, like in some of the subjects I really loved and thought, you know, I would do well at. I remember coming home with my predicted grades, which were like very different from what my older sisters had got. And it was kind of a handful of Cs and some Bs here and there and like all of that. And I just remember being like, oh, like, I.

[Podcast Host]

This is so refreshing to hear. No, I'm so. This is so refreshing to hear.

[Grace Beverley]

Well, for some people, like as in, I don't know, I don't know. I always resistant to say these things because I think everything's so relative. Because obviously for some people that would be like, you know, as in, like, that wouldn't be something that they'd be upset about or whatever. But I just remember, like that was constantly the narrative that was around me. I was just like, that's not her lane. And so I remember, for example, when I came home with those predicted grades, I doubled down and wrote myself this insane revision schedule and realized that I didn't learn very well from the tuition method I was receiving. Like, I just didn't learn by rote. I just wasn't good at that. So got all the textbooks set myself different. Like, literally had it all on a calendar on my wall of, like, this day we're going through this chapter, this day we're going through this chapter, this day we're going through this chapter. Printed off all the past exams. Like, all of this went through that. That was my first example after GCSE is like, I remember coming out of that and I remember getting the results and I got, like, an award for getting the highest in my school. And I just remember being like, what the fuck? Like, I was like, explicitly, like, they called my parents into meeting and were just like, this is not this. You know, like, this is not where we'd expect it to maybe be, but this is what we're expecting for her. And I think from that point, I started to, like, really put two and two together of, like, okay, that makes sense. When you're stressed about things and when things feel that far out of your control, you are only a certain level of preparation away from making that reality different. And I think that's.

[Podcast Host]

That is great advice.

[Grace Beverley]

Yes. I think I may have taken it too far at some point, but I agree. I think that that became, like, almost like a drug for me. My whole narrative has been if you take things into your own hands and if you do xyz, to be able to put yourself there. There have still been examples where I've fallen short, but it was like that element of control was actually, as I said, what brought me that freedom of being able to achieve what I wanted to achieve.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah, because it's so true. Cause what you found at a young age is you found that awareness that you can actually do it yourself.

[Grace Beverley]

And I think I also learned in a way that, like, I was always very. I think I always wanted to do the right thing. Like, I wanted to. I don't mean that from a moral sense, although, like, as much as we'd hope that, like, as in genuinely, I wanted the acceptance and validation and, yes, that was the right thing to do or whatever. So even prior to that point, it'd be like, well, surely the way everyone else is doing things is the right way to do things, because everyone else knows better. And so that's what kind of enabled that change. Is that that those early times were some of the first times where I was like, actually, sometimes different things work for different people, and this clearly isn't working for me. And therefore, what if I do all of this myself and I kind of. I don't know. I've built up a real trust in myself to always get myself through these situations.

[Podcast Host]

Does that make you stubborn?

[Grace Beverley]

Probably. I don't know. My husband's more stab on the knee, so it can't be that bad. But, yeah, I mean. I mean, do you still feel you

[Podcast Host]

have something to prove to the teachers? Was it to your parents? Was it to your family? Where was that drive coming from to be to break down those barriers and say, well, if someone's telling me no, I know I can do it and I want to do it. Because a lot of people would just go, I can't get into Oxford. I've been told I'm not going to Oxford. I'm not going to that school or this school. Okay, fine, I'll just accept that. You didn't want to accept that, but that needs to come from somewhere.

[Grace Beverley]

Yeah. I don't think if I'd. If someone had talked to me at the time, for example, around the Oxford thing, if someone had talked to me and said, you're not gonna get in, I probably still would have bought that whilst trying to do the opposite, if that makes sense. It's not that I had this fierce conviction in myself that was just like, well, no, you're completely wrong. I was kind of like, well, yeah, but I might as well give it a go. And, like, these are the things that I'm gonna do. And, like, if I don't get there, at least I know I gave it a good try. I think that, like. Of, like, what's the motivation? What's the drive? I think if you spoke to. And I'll be interested to hear if you agree. I personally think if you spoke to any single entrepreneur ever, they've all got a chip on their shoulder, genuine, like, sorry. I think it's the case because it is an insane thing to do, and I think go deeper.

[Podcast Host]

I want to get. What is your chip? What do you mean by this?

[Grace Beverley]

I think there can be different things for different people. Like, for some things, it's proving something to someone. For something, like, I think. Think I was really quite. Quite an insecure teenager. And I. Yeah. And I think that I. I started my first business, what, at 18, and I started suddenly being able to prove to myself that actually, like, maybe not that I was like, the most fun person or the prettiest or the like this, that and the other. But I could make money. I could do that really well. And so I think that that like, you know, it's not that that that became everything, but I started to realise that I was quite good at various of these different things, particularly without needing other people's buy in. It wasn't necessarily that I needed you to find it cool that I was selling ebooks online. I found it cool that I was seeing the fruits of that.

[Podcast Host]

But Chris, I just want to understand this because I think this chip on the shoulder idea is really interesting, right? Because being in being an entrepreneur, you have to, there has to be something driving you. And there's that whole saying, which is, are you being dragged? Are you driving? And typically we're being dragged by something like the idea to be seen or to make someone proud or whatever.

[Grace Beverley]

I think with so much entrepreneurship as well, it like goes beyond the threshold of like, what would make sense in terms of like, okay, well, if you were just doing it to succeed in this area, which I see some people do.

[Monday.com and Experian Advertiser]

Yeah.

[Grace Beverley]

And then they're great and they're happy. I also see lots of people who have, you know, the like serial entrepreneurship, the exit after exit, the complete obsession with like constantly hitting new heights. And I think that has to, and I say this from my perspective, so perhaps I am projecting, but I think that to a certain extent has to come from an underlying search for validation that's not being found elsewhere.

[Podcast Host]

How important are friendships to you?

[Grace Beverley]

Very, very important. I think one thing that I like try and make really clear even across socials now, for example, is yes, I would love you to take me seriously as a very important businesswoman. But the most important things to me in my life are my relationships outside of work and particularly female friendships. Explain why I, I believe that what you can get out of female friendships is. And what you can, the fulfillment you can both like give to and get out of female friendships is unlike so many other things. And I think that particularly for young women, we have so much onus put on finding a relationship, on settling down, on getting married, on all of these different things. I mean, women are expected to do so many different things to such a high standard and to never look like it's hard. And all of this all comes from the like having it all aspect. But I think that actually for so long that's meant that female friendships aren't said to be a priority in the way that I absolutely think they are. Like, I think that you know, I'd like to think that my marriage will last forever. I'd like to think that every relationship I've been in will last forever. And all of these different, you know, that my businesses will last forever and all of these different things. I think that if you can have solid female friendships alongside whatever else you're doing.

[Podcast Host]

I completely agree.

[Grace Beverley]

You will always be in an okay place.

[Podcast Host]

I think that friendship's the most important thing. And actually there's that great analogy. We had a guy called Bob Wallinger on who's part of the happiness test, which is basically saying that connections with family and friends are the most important things to make you happy in life. And actually, when we go through life, we forget that. But you haven't. You've realized how important friendship is.

[Grace Beverley]

Yeah, and I definitely think there have been, like, look, there have absolutely been times where I haven't prioritised it anywhere near as much as I should. Like, I'm clearly a workaholic. But I think that where you can. It can look at different things to different people. And I have no doubt certain things will change as I go into motherhood and have less time in that respect. Certain things change. Like two of my closest friends moved to Australia. That was like a. I was like, oh, you know, how am I going to deal with this? I talk to you about everything all the time. Like various different things. There are always gonna be changes. But I think having a. It's just like knowing your life pillars, like knowing what your pillars are, your core pillars are, and how to uphold them. Because I think that that really has been over the past few years. Why I've not just. I think prior to the past few years, I'd been at a point where I'd been like, yes, happy with my life, happy with my career, still striving for more, but like, happy with where I am. I think that over the past few years I've really focused on, okay, what genuinely would make you happy outside of thinking that your career is ticking. Lots of boxes, like genuinely in the day to day, in your soul, like in what you are getting from all of that. And I think that absolutely that comes from friendships and just knowing what you're knowing as you say, how you water that, knowing you don't need to have 10 really close friends.

[Podcast Host]

How many close friends do you have?

[Grace Beverley]

I don't know. You wouldn't want to say a number. And people cut themselves out.

[Podcast Host]

No, because the reason why I said. The reason why I said is that I heard that firstly that you have A fixed date that you'll see your friends every week, which is amazing. And I remember looking on social media, seeing one of the greatest things I've ever seen is when your friend had just given birth, you and your friends get on the train dressed as cleaners, turn up her house and help her with her cleaning the house. The greatest video ever.

[Grace Beverley]

Thank you.

[Podcast Host]

It's fantastic. And amongst everything else, amongst working as hard as you're working, you're still creating time for others, for your community, for your village.

[Grace Beverley]

Yeah, I mean, I think. And as are they. For me. I think the main thing is, as with anything that you believe is a priority, it has to be a priority in your schedule. Like, I really love the saying, if someone follows you around for a week, would they believe you're serious about your goals? And I think we often focus on that in terms of career and in terms of lifestyle. I don't think we necessarily focus on that in terms of, like, okay, well, if one of your goals is to build connection and feel fulfilled and have great friendships, where are they in your week? Like, and I'm not saying I know that people have, you know, particularly people with dependents, particularly people who are working alongside that, particularly people who have moved across the world. All of this, it doesn't need to be sitting down and having dinner. It can be the phone call. Like, you phone them while you're walking to the gym or you. Or in your lunch break, or like, whatever it might be, it is facilitating connection in a way that matches your schedule and matches the way you live. And I think that that's one thing I got wrong for a while and I just couldn't work it out. And I was just like, I guess I'm just having to prioritize career. And actually there are various different things that I've done a lot of content on, like how to make a village, how to be a part of a village. Like that cleaning thing. As I was saying, everyone wants to have a village. No one necessarily wants to do the getting on the train and doing a full, deep house clean for you when you haven't even cleaned your own house for your friend. But, like, that is, you've got to be the village in order to have a village and all of that. And I think that, again, it's just tailored to me and what my life looks like. So, for example, with the weekly friends dinners, that's like, if it was on a Friday night and it was always at a nice restaurant, there's no way it's happening. It is however, on a Monday night, which I know sounds insane. And at the beginning, I was very anti. It was on a Monday night at a friend's house. And the rule is we all look like shit. Like, as in, you actually can't compromise on that rule. So people come with wet hair, in pajamas, or, you know, like, as in it's. And sometimes someone will have cooked, sometimes it will be a takeout situation. It's like, there's no way I can cook this week. I can't even make it to the shops, like, whatever it might be. And again, it's just like a standing thing. It's just on repeat. Because if we all have to go to the additional mental load of booking something in the diary, we're. And actually, at the moment, I'm renovating my place before we have the baby Jesus. And so Jesus wise. And so we should be moving in in three weeks.

[Podcast Host]

Stress level's pretty good. Oh, yeah. Feeling strong.

[Grace Beverley]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Grace Beverley]

But, like, so all of that's fallen out the window at the moment because I'm living in a temporary place. I'm not kind of like, as in, like, everything's kind of all over the place. But it's about. And so it's about knowing that not all of your pillars are gonna be completely upright the whole time, but you

[Podcast Host]

can still show up and be that any version of yourself. And it doesn't matter.

[Grace Beverley]

Exactly. And you can still pick that back up. You can still. You just need to. When you say something's a priority, it needs to be a priority in the actual realization of what that looks like in your schedule.

[Podcast Host]

Do your friends show up for you as well?

[Grace Beverley]

Yeah. So before this pregnancy, I had a miscarriage in, like, October of last year. And obviously that was really difficult. And at the same time, we had our Westfield Tala store opening, like, literally the next week. And so I had to, like. I mean, I had to have an operation. I had to get the operation moved forward, but in order to be able to do the recovery in time to be able to make it to the store opening, because I was just like, on top of everything. I really don't want to miss this thing that we've worked so hard for. And literally, like, been. I'd done the whole prep for the store also in first trimester, because I had a whole first trimester, so I'd be kind of violently nauseous all over the place, trying to, like, build the store, get it into place the week before we actually open. I end up having a miscarriage. So I'm Obviously like a mood, emotionally completely thrown, grieving massively, going through an operation. The hormonal like cliff of that is massive. Like I don't think that was ever even talked about to me from doctors or whatever it might be. Like it is a huge crash. And every single day that week. And my, my husband, he's self employed, so I mean, he's there for me through absolutely everything. And of course he was there for me throughout all of that. There was no way he could not be at work. He had contracted work. It's not like a kind of, you know, talk to your boss and say, you know, this is going on or whatever. And so every day I would have been alone at home. And every single day one of my friends got permission to work from home to work from mine. And like they cleaned my house, they cooked my food. They did. They brought me like packs of like sudokus and crosswords and like foot masks and we watched full seasons of things and they were fully still needing to do their jobs and sitting there and still doing their jobs. They had rotors set up with each other in order to make sure that I wouldn't be alone at home and in order to make sure that I would be recovered in time to be able to do the thing that I had said fully. Like, everyone was like, you don't have to. And I was like, 100%, I'm going to be at the store opening. Like, I'm not missing this. Like, this is, this is, you know, I've worked so hard for this. And so, yeah, you are a village to other people.

[Podcast Host]

And it doesn't always go, that is a credit to your friends, but also a credit to you. Because when people show up for you, that means you've shown up for them.

[Grace Beverley]

And what I've talked about before as well is like, it's not always been like that at all. Like as in that's been a very conscious effort on a number of different people's things. And don't get me wrong, you're gonna have different tiers of friendships. There are gonna be some people who would do that for you and some people who never would and you still have a great time with and you just don't ask it of them. And you wouldn't do that for them either. Like, it's just a kind, you know, it's not who they are. But finding high effort friends when you are also high effort and being able to kind of maintain that through doing the thing first rather than expecting the thing first, I think is so important. And it's been a real concentration of mine over the past few years to, like, I don't want to say be a village in order to get a village, because that sounds like it's, like, entirely selfish and just, like, buying it, but, like, as in genuinely, like, be the friend that I always wanted to have. Because I think for a very long time I was like, God, why does everyone else have these massive friend groups that they just came from school with and they're, you know, so close and they get on so well and they do all these things together and, like, these friendships didn't start till my mid-20s.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah. And I think that's really important for people to realize that. If you haven't found your village, that doesn't mean your villagers are not going to come. They're going to be there, you know. By the way, thank you for sharing that grace, because I saw your post when you spoke about your miscarriage and it's very brave to talk about it, especially so openly. Why did you decide that you wanted

[Grace Beverley]

to talk about it? I think it's probably one of those selfish things where shook me so much that I maybe, like, couldn't believe that it was such a taboo subject elsewhere when it is such a mass disruption in your life. And so many. I mean, I think. I don't know the stats off the top of my head. I think it's like one in four pregnancies end in miscarriage. It's a huge stat. And I mean, before November of last year, I think it was. There wasn't even statutory miscarriage leave. Like, unless you lost a baby after 24 weeks, which is considered like, essentially you've gone into labor past that point. Like, it's not even considered a so much a miscarriage as a stillbirth past that point. At that point, you get two weeks, as in statutory, and prior to that, you don't technically get any. It's kind of up to your employer to truly understand and all of that. Add into that the complication around even telling your employer you were thinking about having a baby in the first place. And all of these different things. It's. There's. It means that so many women are going through this amount of pain and obviously the dads as well, but kind of going through this amount of pain. And on top of that, because it's so taboo. Like, when something's taboo, it carries shame. So what, like, why, like, why is there all this shame around the fact that you had a pregnancy and it didn't work out? It should be better understood in order to be able to be better supported.

[Podcast Host]

And you described it so beautifully. You said, you said your miscarriage was like invisible grief because you're still showing up, you're still functioning, you're still doing all the things that you know, but no one knows that you were pregnant. And it's just, you have to continue.

[Grace Beverley]

Yeah. And I didn't talk about it until over a month later as well. Like I did, you know, for a while people didn't know. Like it was, it wasn't a. It wasn't an open thing that I went back in, kind of told everyone about. I tried to get out of my grief before I actually felt like I could even speak about it. But it also just like, I don't know, I think, you know, even since that point we've made changes, for example at Tala to actually introduce a miscarriage policy. Like to introduce the fact that you can have prolonged leave, obviously including prior to 24 weeks. But after 24 weeks, if you have a, if you lose your pregnancy at Tala, you can take a full maternity leave leave.

[Babbel Advertiser]

Wow.

[Grace Beverley]

And same with full paternity leave.

[Monday.com and Experian Advertiser]

Wow.

[Grace Beverley]

Because that's amazing. It's entirely unfair that you wouldn't get your baby and then also you're expected to. Well, you didn't have that.

[Podcast Host]

So here we go.

[Grace Beverley]

Guess you're back to work.

[Podcast Host]

Leading from the front, like that is so important. That's why it's so important to look to female founders, see what they're doing. So then you can incorporate it and borrow that and use it within your own businesses.

[Grace Beverley]

Well, thank you. I think that's really important to say because obviously we also know that that female founders statistically receive less than 2% of venture capital funding. Mad it's just. But also like as in. So I think that people often think of that as a specifically entrepreneur specific problem. It feels like, you know, when you talk about, okay, well there are less women in this field or there are less women. This when we look at the amount entrepreneurship affects the whole rest of the world, like the tech you are using, the products you are using, the science that's being done, the studies that are being done, all of this comes from the large majority comes from privately owned companies. So if that's the case, or privately or obviously IPO'd as well, but that have been founded in some what way that means it's all built in the vision of a male world because founders build things to solve their own problems. We also know that women hire more women they put more women into positions of power. Like we, God forbid, we promote women just before their maternity leave, if that is the right thing for the company. Like, same with, you know, hiring. Like, as in, people are terrified of putting women in positions of power within companies when they are at childbearing age, which is most of their working life, and they then, you know, there aren't policies around, like, a number of these different things in order to actually facilitate women being able to work in the way we expect them to. We expect women to be mothers as if they don't have a job and work as if they're not mothers. And all of these different things. And it kind of, all of it creates this massively uneven world where I don't think we can even start to talk about gender equality or gender equity when actually it is so far skewed from the reality. Because if 98% of the funding is going into companies where that's not being reflected, then think about, even if you don't care about entrepreneurship, you don't care about the products, you don't care about the data, you don't care about the tech you're using every day, all of these things. Even if you don't even think about that, look at the, you know, the fact that, like, how few women are in those positions of power, how much they're actually getting paid, whether they're getting promoted, all of these different things. Like, I am so proud of working within companies where I can look at the leadership team. The large majority are women with children. And that means that we are able to not only cater for our customer better and truly understand the life that they're living, but also we're able to build something where, yeah, we have to understand what flexibility we need then in certain environments and how we actually build a company that facilitates those things, rather than just assuming that every single woman who goes on maternity leave is never going to come back to work, not through their own choice, but because your workplace doesn't have things to support it. Like, it just, it doesn't. Doesn't make any sense.

[Podcast Host]

Let's fucking go, Grace. Let's fucking go. I can hear everyone internally clapping, like, yeah, let's. You're part of the 2%, though, because your businesses have been funded by venture capital.

[Babbel Advertiser]

Right.

[Podcast Host]

Does that make you proud?

[Grace Beverley]

It makes me proud, but I think I'm so kind of disappointed by the statistic consistently. And by the way, I've been tooting this horn for however many years, too. I first raised funding, what, five years ago. Have the stats changed. No, also before you think it doesn't affect me other ways. This is literally coming from your national insurance money because it's coming from the British business bank. So there should be disclosure around what's being invested in. Like this 98% discrepancy wouldn't happen in any other industry.

[Podcast Host]

What was your experience like as a female founder going into those meetings, asking for money, trying to raise capital for a business? Because you've mentioned that, that they almost didn't believe that you were the CEO, you were the founder they thought you were. Oh, you're just going to be the face of the company.

[Grace Beverley]

Yeah, it's always been a mixed bag. I think, you know, I've. We've been very fortunate to be in the position each time we. We've raised money to be able to be quite selective about who we've ended up going with because we don't want to compromise the key values of the company or who we are or like, whatever it might be. And we generally go for your portfolios that have already invested in lots of other female founder teams as well, so. Because also, particularly if you're doing it to get your stats up, which I do think people like, the stats should be up, so we got to do that somehow. But. And then we get into the room and you don't believe I can genuinely run this company or whatever it might be. And that's also going to be difficult. No, because we've chosen well with our investors. But, like, that would all. I've seen that happening all over the place. Particularly, you know, I was shit scared to tell our investors that I was pregnant. And even that, like, that's not a reflection on them. That's just because I'm society.

[Podcast Host]

That's society.

[Grace Beverley]

I know the industry, I know society, I know the expectation. I wrote in my email telling them about it, essentially, like, obviously I still want to work here, whereas the amount of times I've heard from investors, oh, by the way, my wife's having a baby next week. And you go, oh, okay, well, thank you for letting me know. I'm glad that's disrupted your life. Life so much. Like, as in. And obviously like a big equal part, like a big part of improving a lot of these things is things like Shed, Matt and Pat leave and like all of these different things. So of course it should be, you know, that. I'm not saying that that's necessarily like their fault either, but yeah, I think that, you know, I've had a. I've had so many different Responses because I've raised three different rounds, different types of investors for tech and for consumer. So I've kind of seen. Seen the, the whole. No, not the whole space. I've seen a big chunk of the space. There's a lot of. I wonder what it would be like were I not like when I've raised for Tala. I've always wondered if I wasn't raising for a product that they would assume they didn't understand because it's so. Because it's for women.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Grace Beverley]

Would I even be allowed in this room, like genuinely. Because the assumption is that women, women make things for women, men make things for everyone.

[Podcast Host]

If someone's listening right now, a female funder or someone who is starting a business, what advice would you give that person? What would you give them? If they're going to look for funding, what should they do? Where should they go? How should they start?

[Grace Beverley]

Okay, big question. Kind of totally depends. Sorry, not very helpful. But there are many different types of funding and venture capital funding is not right for everyone. I think I would get. The first thing I would always recommend is getting really, really clear on why you need investment, what for what it will ideally do for the company. If you can't write those three things up, you're not ready to raise.

[Podcast Host]

Correct.

[Grace Beverley]

And I think once you've written those three things down, I think that you can then become quite clear on, okay, what does this investment need to look like? Would it ideally be one high net worth individual who can give us a little bit of advice sometimes, but they're really just writing a cheque and we're then growing the company and we'll see where we are in a few years. Or do you want to be on essentially a jetpack growth situation, which can be very exciting, also comes with just as much chaos as you'd imagine from being in jetpack growth and also a huge amount of paperwork, like all of these different things and pressure all of these different things. So I think it's like really about working that out and then I would say it's about really refining your pitch deck and actually your ask overall and like who you are. You would not believe the amount of pitch decks I receive because I do personal investing as well, that I cannot tell from the first five slides of your deck what you are like, who you are, what you're doing and what this money is, is even doing. Like the. I should not be having to dig through this. I should not be having to essentially try and summarize elsewhere. It should be very, very clear should

[Podcast Host]

be there simple straight away.

[Grace Beverley]

And so I think that that is another thing and often the best way to do that is in the form of a pitch check.

[Podcast Host]

It's great advice.

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[Monday.com and Experian Advertiser]

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[Podcast Host]

I want to go back to that that moment like when you're talking about you're at university, you're posting. You know you're posting on social media and it most people wouldn't be doing that because it was embarrassing and it was, you're being judged. But you went against that. I know that full well because I did. Made in Chelsea. Don't know if you very reputable. Oh yeah. But when I got asked to be blamed Chelsea, it was like everyone was saying, this is lame. Don't do it. Why are you doing that? It was just not cool in any way. But I saw it as an avenue to achieve something else. Sort of cheat code my way in. Right. And I didn't care what other people thought. Weirdly, I didn't really care. And with you, it feels like the same. You care a lot what people think, but you also don't care what people think because you went and started posting stuff on social media.

[Grace Beverley]

I think I did care. I think I really did care. I think I, you know, still wanted to belong and to make friends and for people to not think I was a massive loser. But I think simultaneously I didn't care enough for it to stop me doing something that was quite clearly getting me things that I wasn't getting from elsewhere. So. So, for example, you know, I started this account when I was 18. I sold my first products within the first six months.

[Podcast Host]

But break that down for me. The account was called.

[Grace Beverley]

Oh, the account was. I didn't post my face and it didn't have my name. So that was just maybe a visualization of how embarrassed I was. I think it was called Kayla G Bug because I was doing the Kayla Itzinas workout plans.

[Podcast Host]

Okay.

[Grace Beverley]

Naturally. And so I kind of posted that, as I said, didn't post my face, didn't post my name was just kind of posting of my journey of trying to be. Trying to stick to the gym as someone who really was very bad at doing so. So I just always like fall off to. Yeah, I, I guess I would just try and stick to something for a few weeks and then I wouldn't be able to do all of that. So I started it as a kind of accountability page. Then within my first six months I was like posting. I started working at IBM, which was where I worked for a year after school, just in their kind of school leavers slash placement year program. And so I'd started working there. I was essentially working very long days there trying to prove that the corporate life was for me, which obviously went really well. But I was also then posting on Instagram in a way that started to grow. So I think I started. Started to get a few thousand followers and that was really, really exciting. And I exciting because it was feeding your.

[Podcast Host]

That niggle. That chip as well, as everything. It was feeding everything, wasn't it?

[Grace Beverley]

Yeah, yeah, just. Just, you know, numbers.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah, yeah, this is great.

[Grace Beverley]

Exactly.

[Podcast Host]

I don't even know them.

[Grace Beverley]

I don't know why. I don't know why it's great, but I know that it's great.

[Podcast Host]

It was making you feel good.

[Grace Beverley]

Yeah, it was making me feel good, definitely. And so I was like posting all of these recipes of like, I have a massive sweet tooth, so like healthier versions of brownies or banana breads or like, whatever it might be. And I was posting these all the time. But because I was working the kind of classic corporate hours I was every weekend, I was having to spend like hours and hours a day basically making all these recipes and photographing them. Because in the. Because in the winter, which is obviously most of the year in the uk, there was no daylight. So. And it was very important at that time to have a very bright, gorgeous Instagram. I even bought myself like a little food light box to be able to, you know, take good photos.

[Podcast Host]

What year is this?

[Grace Beverley]

2015.

[Podcast Host]

So this is way ahead of its time. You were ahead of your time already.

[Grace Beverley]

My little food.

[Podcast Host]

I was posting pictures of my foot like, I was really not.

[Grace Beverley]

I was in a niche for sure.

[Podcast Host]

You were in that beginning stage.

[Grace Beverley]

Yeah, very, very early on. But so because I was spending so much time every weekend making these recipes and churning them out, I kind of thought, well, what if I could sell them? Because. Because this has taken me a huge amount of time and it was taking up all my weekends and I was working at IBM in the week and I was just like, this is so much work. And so I basically made two different ebooks called Eat My Instagram. Almost definitely not allowed, trademark wise, but there was a sweet one and there was a savory one and essentially they were five pounds each, or you could pay eight pounds for two. So I did that. And then I remember over the next year, year, I made a few hundred quid off that because I set up a Shopify, I got their digital download thing. So essentially anyone who purchased it just got emailed to them directly. And I was like, oh, my God, this is the greatest thing ever. I don't even need to manually email everyone who's purchased. And so set that up. And then started like that year where I started really seeing differences was like when I'd put on like a 20% off flash sale or when I'd say, this is only available for the next 24 hours.

[Podcast Host]

So you were learning, you were just

[Grace Beverley]

learning the whole time, just Learning by actually doing it and seeing what other people were doing.

[Podcast Host]

Best way to learn.

[Grace Beverley]

Yeah. And so I did that for the next year. And so I think by the point of even going to university, which was in October that following year, having made a few hundred extra quid, I was like, that's a solid amount of money. Like, I was earning 18k a year because I was an intern at IBM and it was a paid internship in London and it was great. I felt like. Like the richest person in the world.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah, 100%.

[Grace Beverley]

And I. To earn like a month's extra salary probably from the whole year. On top of that, I just, I felt like I was printing money. Like, I felt like it was amazing. So I think that by the time I got to the question of like, is this too embarrassing to continue? I was kind of like, well, essentially I am printing money when I do this because I am not. Like, there's no marginal cost, there's no cost for each extra product you're producing. So I could sell to you and every single other person in this room and it costs me the same amount, but I get obviously multiples on the profit. And so I was just kind of like at that point I was like, well, I'm not really gonna give up my money, so I guess all of you are just gonna have to think I'm a loser. That's just like how it's gonna work. And so I think that by that point I'd kind of. The trade off just didn't add up for it to be too embarrassing to not continue. I wouldn't give myself the credit of being like, oh, I just don't care what other people think. I absolutely did. And I continued to care for what other people think for a very long time and still do.

[Podcast Host]

But you were earning too much money to stop what you were doing because you didn't care enough what other people thought to stop doing that.

[Grace Beverley]

I think realistically, yeah, that was my thought process being totally transparent. I think it was kind of like, well, yeah, you can think I'm weird doing this, but at the same time, I got 500 extra pounds in the past six months. And that's.

[Podcast Host]

Is that what you would say to people?

[Grace Beverley]

No, absolutely not.

[Podcast Host]

You wouldn't say that you're really making

[Grace Beverley]

me out to be a lot stronger than I am? No. That's what would go on inside my internal world. Yeah, 24 hours a day. Exactly. I'm having the invisible argument in my head.

[Podcast Host]

That's amazing what you're achieving and what you're doing. And what you're building is phenomenal. Like, truly is in that space. And I'm incredibly inspired by you. And I'm not just saying. And you keep turning up in a relentless way. And I love that.

[Sarah Gibson Tuttle]

Right?

[Podcast Host]

I'm relentless. And sometimes when you have relentless people, other people are looking, going, they're doing it again, like, sit down, like, relax. But that does lead to burnout. And that does lead to those moments, which are tricky. And, you know, how do you balance that? And when burnout hits, how do you get past? And what does it feel like?

[Grace Beverley]

Like, I think I spent a good few years, like, on the path to, like, full burnout. Like, full. Cannot get out of bed. Like, once locked myself in a room for a day without my phone and just did a jigsaw for the entire day. Because I was like, that is how on zero my, like, brain is at the moment. That is real burnt out, fully burnt out. And I've had other times where it's kind of been similar. And I've literally just been like, I. Well, I've had two other times where I've literally woken up and been like, I physically can't do this. And the last time that happened was January last year. And I think that that really started from when in, like 2021, I restructured the whole of Tala and had like, a huge legal battle to get out of the licensing agreement we were previously in. Restructured the entire business. TALA nearly went. There was about probably three months where every single week I was wondering if we'd make payroll and just like, shilling things to be able to get that to happen all at that point. I think at that point, that was where things never really got out of that burnout zone from then. So I think from I had then five years after that point or four years after that point where I was kind of teetering on the edge of burnout, but at the same time believed that in order to do my job, I needed to keep operating to the same capacity. And actually, actually I used to cry pretty regularly about the fact that I thought I would never be able to start my own family or take maternity leave to any extent because I would not be able to spend a single day out of the businesses. Like, I just, like, I literally have notes in my phone of being like, I don't know, like, I'm never going to be able to do that. I'm never going to be able to have babies because I'm never going to be able to. To even spend a week out of the business. Like, I can't even be ill. And so I think that was a real wake up call for me. When in the space of two months I had like two moments where I physically was like, I'm on zero. Like I'm worried that I'm like physically ill. That's how drained I am. Like, I feel like I, you know, and I'd actually given myself adrenal fatigue or adrenal dysfunction, I think it was, I can't remember, but essentially where my cortisol had actually just like stopped working in the way that it should work because I was so.

[Podcast Host]

Because it'd been driving at such a

[Grace Beverley]

rapid pace for so long. And so I think that like since that point, that was a real wake up call to kind of be like, okay, well if this was all engineered to build you the life you want, this is clearly not the life you want. Like, yes, it might be some of the things you want down on paper, but it's clearly not the life you want. Because if you can't think about starting a family, if you can't think about taking your wedding offline, if you can't like as in taking the day or a few days around that, if you can't think like all of these different things, things, and that is not the life you actually want, that's the life that you thought you wanted.

[Podcast Host]

Correct.

[Grace Beverley]

And so since that point in the last year and nearly a half now, I have tried to change every single thing about how I work with the businesses to be able to give them the maximum efficacy and kind of help from. I don't want to say help because they're very capable of, everyone's very capable of doing their own jobs. But like the founder vision, like what you need from a founder and what you need from the operator job, job I was providing whilst also stepping away to a helpful extent to be able to maintain everyone's autonomy, to be able to not be micromanaging like I was micromanaging for years because I was just trying to essentially make sure that I, you know, I didn't want to do things wrong. I didn't want to have a massive cancellation for the business on socials. I didn't want to a single social post to go out without me seeing it or you know, an event or a product or like, whatever it. So across absolutely everything, which is also not helpful to everyone within the business because no one could do their job without having you over their shoulder. So I essentially a piece of advice someone had given me about six months before which I completely ignored, was one of the best things you can do in this scenario is remove all of your approvals and see what breaks and pick them up. And I said, well, I don't have the luxury of doing that, because if something breaks, it's going to break on a big enough scale that I'm going to need to take responsibility for it and get the shit for it, as I should as the founder and the owner and the public face and all of this. And I can't deal with that mentally right now because I'm so on the edge of burnout all the time. Like, I'm so on the edge. And so I felt like I was, like, trapped in this need to see absolutely everything and also that not being right for the business also not being right for me. But if I didn't see absolutely everything, then how could I make sure that things weren't going to explode? But that's what I ended up doing in the end. I ended up removing all of my approvals and picking back up the things that were genuinely helpful to the business and the people within the businesses. And I've actually started to be able to live my life. Like, even at that point, I wasn't even. I wasn't even ovulating. Like, my whole body had gone into, like, shutdown. Like, I wouldn't have been able to even. Like, I tried to change absolutely everything because I was just at the point where I. It's like my body is shutting down from the amount I'm working and the amount of stress I'm under, and this is clearly not conducive, as I said, to the type of life I want to live.

[Podcast Host]

And then you're living your choosing because your podcast, working hard, hardly working.

[Babbel Advertiser]

Right.

[Podcast Host]

Which is just amazing. Go and listen to it. Honestly, we're going to leave a link in the show description. Go and check it out. It's fantastic, right? And that. That sort of mantra is how we should really be living life. Right? And you sort of weren't living true

[Grace Beverley]

to that 100%, I think I thought that as long as you do the work side of things, like, everything else falls into place because you are able to get yourself into situations where, I don't know, at least you can take an Uber home or like, whatever it might be. And actually, just when you. When I built this, I built this massive cage around me and my body was literally rebelling and I was miserable and I couldn't even do it. Like, I couldn't come and do something like this, for example. In the middle of the day and ever. Because I was like, well, that's not gonna work. And also, if I did do anything, like I would go and speak at a conference and then work till 3am just getting through specific approvals that I never needed to be on every single day. Like there was every single Friday. I'd keep meeting free and I'd sit down at my desk at like 7:00am and I would not stand up until like 10:00pm and I wouldn't have even made the dent. And that. It just felt like this. Yeah, I was on this massive path to burnout. Slash already there. But over the past year and a half, I've made significant changes and now I'm in a very different place.

[Podcast Host]

Your husband, he has a lot of fans online, does he?

[Grace Beverley]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

Where?

[Grace Beverley]

Wait a second, what's he been doing?

[Podcast Host]

You. You posted, and apparently everyone's like, who is this HUD stuff? You guys met on a dating app?

[Grace Beverley]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

The moment that you guys started messaging.

[Sarah Gibson Tuttle]

Right.

[Podcast Host]

And you started messaging and the first time you met, you flew to New York, wasn't it?

[Grace Beverley]

No, that was. Not that. Not that on the terms.

[Podcast Host]

Okay, well, explain what happened. How did you guys.

[Grace Beverley]

I didn't have control issues. You think I'm flying to New York? No, we met in a July years ago and went on a first date then. And then we. He was living in New York at the time, so he was in London for work. And he was in London approximately 1. Once a month for work. So we'd finally found a date kind of in the July. We'd matched a few months earlier. But just like our dates where he was in London, all of that kind of hadn't worked. And then, yeah, went on a really nice date. I thought, what a nice date. Then went away, kind of just.

[Podcast Host]

You didn't think anything else? You weren't just like.

[Grace Beverley]

No, as in I thought he was lovely. Like as in I kind of. I actually said it in my vows. The literal text I said, sent my friend after that was saying, yeah, he's really hot. I love that he lives in New York, so I can't fall in love with him. Which is kind of hilarious given his baby is now growing all up in here. So, yeah. And he then came back to London about a month and a half later, went on another date. Then he was here for about 10 days. So we went on kind of a few dates. And by the end of that, I was like. Like, I have been got. I was really not looking for a relationship at the time, which I think Actually had a big impact on me, asking for enough in that relationship. I think traditionally in the, like in the past, I definitely bent over backwards for people who wouldn't bend over backwards for me. Like, I think that that was. I'm a very high effort person and so I would happily do that. And that was my love language and all of that. And I think that. But because I wasn't necessarily in the place where I was wanting a relationship, I wasn't trying to be the person they liked. That wasn't my mo. In going into a date. It wasn't like authentic self, exactly. I was just being me. And he showed from the beginning that he was also a high effort person and was very happy to show that he was into it and show that he was, you know, enjoyed our dates and all of this with absolutely zero gameplay play, which I, which, yeah, I'm in, exactly. But like, for example, you know, one of our. When he was in London the second time, that kind of a week in, and we'd been on like three dates within that week. So we'd, we'd had a, we'd had like such a lovely time. And I was then moving house and I was, I was moving into a flat and I was, I had to go to work that morning and I remember I was on a date the night before with him and I, I, My dog sitter texted to basically say they'd canceled and said. And I was like, oh, shit. I was like, I've got the movers coming in the morning. I've also got to go to a meeting in the morning. So I'm leaving the movers in the house for me to go to a meeting on Brand, come back and then, and then move into the flat and I wanted the dogs out so that they're not running in and out the door. All of this or the dog. Sorry, there was only one at the time. And he just said, he was just like, he was like, oh, I'm not working tomorrow. He was like, oh, just I'll have him. And I was like, oh, you really don't need to do that. And he was like, no, it's fine. He was like, I'll just, I'll come around to yours in the morning. I'll pick him up and I'll. I'll just take him out for brunch. And so he literally came around and took my dog for brunch while the movers were in the house. I then come back.

[Podcast Host]

As you whisper. You were like, I love you.

[Sarah Gibson Tuttle]

Yeah.

[Grace Beverley]

And so I came Back acts of service. Big on acts of service. And he is big on acts of service. And we got in, like, got in the moving van, went to the flat. He was like. He was like, I'll just help you move stuff. All of this. He helped me, like, set up all my furniture. He helped me, like, there was like a problem with the moving bay, so people were having to like, go up loads of stairs. Like, all of this. There was a number of different things going on. So he was doing like all the runs back and forth, basically doing the removal for everyone. And then, you know, at one point he went down to go get more stuff from the moving bay and there was like a. There was like a small shop, like a kind of express shop, and he did like a full weekly shop for, you know, just like the essentials. Just like, you know, you're washing up liquid, you're all of that. That I'm not going to have just having moved in, like your toilet roll. Just very domesticated stuff. And so he came back and I was like. I was like, what's that? And he'd also bought, like, there was a little dog toy. He brought my dog a little toy. And he was just like. He was like, oh, I just thought you'd need the essentials. Just. Just saves you doing it later. Just like, kind of. Not even. Not like, this was a big thing. And I was like, that's what I would do for my friends, as in, like, that is the approach I have. Like, I like to make people's life easier and show them love by doing that. And I was like, isn't that lovely?

[Audi Q3 Advertiser]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

How attractive is that?

[Grace Beverley]

Yeah, it was so attractive.

[Podcast Host]

And I think this is what men don't realize. Other men are trying to tell other men what is attractive to women. Right? But actually, if you listen to women, this is what is attractive to active.

[Grace Beverley]

Well, that required a lot of vulnerability too, because say he does that. And then I'm like, anyway, I'm not actually that into you, but like, thanks so much for the services today. Like, that it's vulnerable, but like we. You have. In order to get. You have connection, you have to have vulnerability. And so I think it was just like those things at the beginning. And I remember at the end of that day, I was like, oh, God, my friends are coming around for dinner at the new flat. And so I was kind of like, kind of need to kick him out, but he's obviously, obviously helped me move all day. But I was like, I don't really want you at my girl's dinner. So I just said to him, I was like, so tonight I've got some friends coming round. And he was like, oh. He was like. He was like, don't worry about it, I'm going for dinner with my mum. And I was like, great, perfect.

[Podcast Host]

Done with your mum as well. Oh, wonderful, lovely.

[Grace Beverley]

And then just woke up the next morning to these gorgeous flowers outside my apartment. And I just thought, well, that's me done.

[Podcast Host]

When you find a relationship where that happens, it makes you realise that in life that you really should not settle 100%.

[Grace Beverley]

And I think that was the real difference is I kind of. And I think people often say this and it's so infuriating to hear is the kind of, like, when you'll know, you'll know and it will come when you're least expecting it and, like, it will make you realize what shit you've been putting up with in the past. Genuinely, that was fully my experience and it also let my barriers down in a way that he was leading with that kind of vulnerability and just being like, well, this is how I like to act in a relationship relationship, so I'm gonna act that way. If you reject me based on that or anything else, then that's fine because I'm still true to myself. Whereas, like, I definitely, particularly from past relationships, had then got to a point where I was like, well, I'm not gonna do any of this until you're this, this and this. And actually, because he was like that, I was then like, okay, perfect. Well, I can meet you in exactly how I like to be in relationships, which is actually very well matched because we're both very high effort people.

[Podcast Host]

Wow.

[Grace Beverley]

And so I think that. That actually he gets credit for it working at the beginning. Because actually I think that

[Podcast Host]

you're going into the relationship as, hey, this is authentically me, and you're going, by the way, this is me. Here I am.

[Grace Beverley]

And if you think it's too much, that's fine, because this is what I want to be in my ideal relationship. Because I think I'd had a thing before where I'd essentially thought, clearly my effort level doesn't match the type of people I like to go for, and therefore I should bring that down. Which is fair in certain scenarios. But I think in reality what I needed to do was bring the effort level up of the people I was with. Because then how amazing if two of you are like high effort people, both trying to make each other's day great or life great. That is so ideal. Because it Also means I can be like, I do some stupidly over the top stuff sometimes. I really like to do the types of things that will make him that happy and all of that. And I think in every past relationship I just felt like it was too much. And.

[Podcast Host]

Wow, that's, that's such a great example because what you want to do is you want to better each other's lives. So if you're constantly pushing each other's boundaries in like a, like a positive way, that's, that's good. You're kind of moving along life in the best way.

[Grace Beverley]

Yeah, well, they always, I think they, the psychologists always say that like the, the people with the best relationships are the people where they're both trying to be the 60. Or, you know, like when it's like sometimes it's 50, 50, sometimes it's 60, 40, sometimes it's 90, 10. Like if you're both trying to be the 60, then it mitigates for times where actually one of you needs to be 10 because you're going through something or Correct. You're having certain stress or like whatever it might be.

[Podcast Host]

And then you never resent each other because when someone else's battery Life is at 10, you're like, it's okay.

[Grace Beverley]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

Because I know that you know what you do. I know what you do on the other side of it. And so therefore you're okay. Okay with that.

[Grace Beverley]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

And that is. He, when he proposed to you, it was, I think, some of the world's greatest propos. Like, I was sort of seeing that and I was like, that motherfucker. He's really outshone everyone here. He organized a fake trip for you.

[Grace Beverley]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

Explain what happened.

[Grace Beverley]

Well, essentially he wanted to propose somewhere that would be special and exciting and kind of. Of ideally wanted to do it abroad because I think he knew that I wanted it where we were away somewhere and we could just be in a bubble and all of this. But at the same time, he wanted to make sure it's something that he'd fully organized and kind of fully, you know, just like everything had been managed by him. He's fully organized.

[Podcast Host]

He wanted to feel that this was a moment that he. Because the proposal. If you're a guy I'm proposing, in my experience, you want to. This is my moment. This is it.

[Grace Beverley]

Yeah. Like, this is. I'm the one showing all of this. And yeah, he's a big planner. He, believe it or not, which is quite off brand for me. He is the one who kind of like when I go to the Airport with him. I don't even know what airport we're at.

[Podcast Host]

Get out of here. You relinquish control.

[Grace Beverley]

Oh, complete. Complete control. Oh, yeah, yeah. I could be blindfolded. Like, honestly, get out of here. Amazing. That's why I married the man. But essentially he kind of wanted to make it, like, end to end something that he felt like was my perfect proposal, but was also. He also kind of was well aware of the fact that I'm a little bit. How do I say? Nothing gets past me?

[Podcast Host]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You're a hard person to surprise.

[Grace Beverley]

Exactly. And so I think he really wanted to make sure it was a surprise because I am never surprised. And so he'd reached out to my agent a few months before and essentially said, I'm gonna pop the question. Question. I need your help. Essentially being able to make this convincing enough. So they'd had conversations about it. They'd chosen a brand that we'd worked with before, but not so much that I had, like a super close relationship and I would, you know, maybe message them all of this. Got, like, the invitations done, sent a message. But, like, before the even invite was confirmed, there was like a one month before lead of, like, by the way, just to check if this comes through. Would this be something you'd be interested in? Which is quite regular in the.

[Narrator/Advertiser]

Oh, the little.

[Podcast Host]

The little.

[Grace Beverley]

Oh, just had a meeting with Armani. Just wanted to double check if this is something you can do.

[Podcast Host]

Armani as well. He went for it. Lovely.

[Grace Beverley]

And so, yeah, so that came through. And so I was like, yep, no, would love to do that. And then the actual invite came through and everything was done so perfectly to the point that I actually went kind of insane in the lead up because I had this. I just had these spidey senses essentially telling me that this was going to be the proposal. Through no fault of his own, the poor man. I'd just woken up one morning at like 5am and be like, it's on that trip. Like, he's gonna propose on that trip. And I don't know what I'd picked up on because it was so. It was so well thought out. And then I was like checking back on all the details and everything was so perfectly done that I was like, there's no way that. That this is not the trip because we've got all of the different assets, we've got the contract come through, we've got all of. Just. All of it was so watertight. Anyway. Then the real kind of final thing that made me think no, this is definitely a brand trip. Was that the night before we were leaving? I was trying on all these different outfits because there was this big garlic dinner. And I essentially said, you know, I've got nothing to wear, and, like, I don't like anything and all of this. And he was literally. He was like, you're never like this about brand events. It was. It was just like. It was like. He was like, it's. It's just a brand dinner. You can go. You don't even need to take pictures if you don't like it. Like, you don't look me dead in the eyes. Great cow. And he literally, like, was just like, there's just, you know, I don't like you.

[Podcast Host]

The acting on the man.

[Grace Beverley]

Act like this. And so I was like, yeah, no fucking. And I was like, okay, well, it's definitely not a proposal then, because he just lied to my very face.

[Podcast Host]

Slightly disappointed.

[Grace Beverley]

Yeah, exactly.

[Podcast Host]

Did you feel slightly. You were like, yeah.

[Grace Beverley]

Oh, well, that's a lot of adrenaline for nothing. I've just got my nails done and then flew out. He'd done everything perfectly. There was full. There was Armani product everywhere in the room. There were these, like, it had been done, like, perfectly. We'd arrived at the hotel, they'd had briefing calls. So, like, they arrived. They go, are you here for the Armani event? All of this. Like, they clearly knew who we were, like, what we looked like. They sat us down in the. Like, when we were checking in. And they go, like, yep. So the event is down there later. All of this. And so I was like, oh, watertight. It flown out an Armani makeup artist to do my makeup in the room. And then, so I was obviously stalking her stories because I was like, well, what's she posting on her stories? There's a video of the hotel going here with Armani for their event. Event. Everyone is in on this. Because I'm then like, oh, well, come on. Like, this is too much. And so I'm then getting ready, and I say to him, I'm like, oh, it doesn't say. Because the itinerary is in the. In the room. Like, beautiful, gorgeous paper. Like, this is obviously branded, and it says all of the different things, but it didn't say the location for the drinks that we were going to. And I said, can you phone down and ask where the drinks are? Because it's not on the thing. And he goes, yeah, no worries. He goes into the bathroom, uses that silly little bathroom phone. Who uses the phone when they're taking A shit. Anyway, he literally is like, on the phone and he's like, hi, can you just tell me we're here for the Armani event? Could you just tell me where the drinks are? Has this whole fake phone conversation. Obviously he knows where we're going. And then we take the lift down and I'm like, rubbing up against him. Cause I'm trying to work out if there's a ring in his pocket still

[Podcast Host]

at this point, I'm like, not dropping. The OCD's are really coming out.

[Grace Beverley]

Literally, I'm like shimmying against him. And then we. Yeah, then we get down there and then he. We're like down in the front of the hotel. This beautiful setup in the background. And then he. He's like, oh, would you like a few photos here? And takes a few photos. And then he hands me back the phone. I'm like, that's not usually the amount of photos you'd give me. Usually I'm getting at least 60 more. I'm like, this is far too few. And then he, like, comes and stands by me. And there was a hat on the floor with. Which was obviously the place that the photographer had put. Like, this is where you should stand because the photographer was hidden in the bushes. And so I was like, standing there and I kind of like gave him back my phone to be like, more please. I was like, that was three photos. You think I'm gonna get my photo from that? Absolutely not. And handed it back to him. And then he just. He literally started his proposal speech with. Don't be mad. It's like. But he was like, I'd really like to marry you. And then, yeah, proposed. And it was so watertight. Everything was so good. And he'd, like, talked to the hotel. They'd stopped anyone else walking outside in that moment. So it's literally like completely clear in the background. Just like every single detail. It's very much who he is.

[Podcast Host]

One thing I did see, which is. Can I ask is. Which I think is a great thing to talk about, which is prenups.

[Grace Beverley]

Oh, yeah.

[Podcast Host]

It seems like a taboo term that we don't talk about in America. Very open about it.

[Grace Beverley]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

And I saw you speak about it very openly, which I thought was a great thing to chat about. Where are you at with that? What do you think about prenups?

[Grace Beverley]

Well, I'm in the same place, thankfully. Nothing's being used, essentially. I just. We actually did an in depth podcast on it with Vivian too, who's like your rich BFF online.

[Podcast Host]

She's amazing. We love her.

[Grace Beverley]

And one thing she said that's really stuck with me is like you're signing a contract anyway. You might as well like when in any other scenario do you just accept the contract and just go like, okay, well this is the one we're signing. Like, okay, maybe a small little disclaimer to get a facial but like other than that, like not your entire life and like just all of this stuff. So you might as well design your own contract. It doesn't need to. I think people think of prenups and they're like, oh well, it's going to be like this and it's going to be like this. And actually with two people, people who've got to very exciting points in our careers, who've entered a marriage each with assets. Why don't we have a conversation when we're getting on really well as to what this would look like if we were no longer be together and you're signing that contract anyway. So I think it's just a, it's a, a good prenup should protect. Both of you will say they're not well upheld in the UK and you have to refresh that as like when any big change happens. So any asset change, a baby, a house change, all of these different things and still they likely don't stand like fully stand up. But I'm sure that will change at some point soon because it kind of, it's quite antiquated. But essentially I just think that particularly women need to be comfortable having conversations about finances in a way that has often been seen as so taboo and for so long has been seen as so taboo. And I refuse to wear into that.

[Narrator/Advertiser]

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[Monday.com and Experian Advertiser]

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[Babbel Advertiser]

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[Podcast Host]

Grace, listen, thank you so much. You are just amazing. Every single way. We'd like to end the conversation with eight quick fire questions. You ready for this?

[Grace Beverley]

No.

[Podcast Host]

What's the saying or phrase that makes you smile and cheers you up?

[Grace Beverley]

Should we get some food?

[Podcast Host]

Love that. Best compliment anyone's ever given you. We can pass.

[Grace Beverley]

Yeah, pass. Sorry. I'll think about it.

[Podcast Host]

Oh, it's okay.

[Grace Beverley]

I have this thing where I need to think about something. I won't think about anything. That's the only time I think about, like, nothing's going on in my brain.

[Podcast Host]

You can. You can mess with me later.

[Grace Beverley]

Yeah, perfect.

[Podcast Host]

What scares you most about yourself?

[Grace Beverley]

Inability to slow down.

[Podcast Host]

When was the last time you cried?

[Grace Beverley]

Oh, on Sunday, because we were walking outside and it was 35 degrees. And in case it's not very obvious, I'm heavily pregnant and it was too hot and I felt really uncomfortable, so I cried.

[Podcast Host]

So fair. What's something you can't let go of? Coffee. Wine?

[Grace Beverley]

Well, no, I should give up coffee because I still can't stand the taste being pregnant. But actually, no, that is quite a good one because I still try and get a coffee most weeks and I get it and I spend, obviously, a mortgage on it because we're in London, and then I have one sip and I have to throw it away and I'll go to a nice place as well.

[Podcast Host]

I like that. What's your guilty pleasure?

[Grace Beverley]

Oh, I'm big on reality TV.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah, it's the best. 100%. What turns you off?

[Grace Beverley]

I don't like mean people.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah, I'm with you.

[Grace Beverley]

I really like, as in I don't like being mean for no reason. I don't like trying to make other people feel shit, feel small.

[Podcast Host]

Like, I'm with you.

[Grace Beverley]

I just. I don't like it. I don't like seeing it. I don't like seeing it online. I don't like, like for other people. I think that, like, sometimes you go to people's comment sections, you're like, people are so mean.

[Podcast Host]

Oh, have a field day on mine. Go and check out. Mine's on.

[Grace Beverley]

Perfect.

[Babbel Advertiser]

Thank you.

[Podcast Host]

What turns you on? Acts of service.

[Grace Beverley]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

Oh, yeah.

[Grace Beverley]

Big proposal in France.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. What do you like most about yourself?

[Grace Beverley]

I do a lot for the people I love and I'm very thoughtful, so I love that.

[Podcast Host]

Grace. Thank you. You're incredible. You're amazing. You're beautiful in every single way and I really appreciate you spending time with me. You were great kind of company. Thank you so much.

[Grace Beverley]

Thank you so much.

[Podcast Host]

They're going to give you a hug. You are amazing.

[Grace Beverley]

It's going to take me a second. Just get off.

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[Grace Beverley]

Our trip up the coast was perfection. With my Sapphire Preferred card, we earned

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[Narrator/Advertiser]

It was amazing.

[Grace Beverley]

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