JAMIE LAING: I HAVE A FEAR OF BEING FORGOTTEN

Summary

Great Company with Jamie Laing: Episode Summary — "I Have a Fear of Being Forgotten"

In this poignant episode of "Great Company with Jamie Laing," released on January 1, 2025, Jamie delves deep into his personal journey, exploring themes of fame, mental health, and the pervasive fear of being forgotten. Hosted by Jampot Productions, the episode offers listeners an intimate look into Jamie's struggles and triumphs beyond the public eye.

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1. Introduction to a Special Episode

The episode begins uniquely as Jamie's longtime producer, Jemima, takes the reins to interview him—a departure from the usual guest-centric format. This role reversal sets the tone for a candid and vulnerable conversation.

Jamie Laing [02:13]: "This is a very special episode because this is the first time that you have been seen on camera."

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2. Jamie’s Journey into Reality TV

Jamie recounts how he became part of the reality show "Made in Chelsea." Initially hesitant, he discusses the allure of the entertainment industry and the influence of friends who were already part of the first series.

Jamie Laing [07:42]: "I didn't reach out to them. It was a TV show called Smokers to begin with... I chose to go into it because everyone was saying don't do it."

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3. The Blurring Lines Between Reality and Entertainment

As the show progressed, Jamie realized that "Made in Chelsea" was more scripted entertainment than a genuine reality documentary. This revelation came during a pivotal moment when producers encouraged him to kiss a co-star, signaling the show's direction toward dramatized content.

Jamie Laing [12:01]: "That's when I realized this is an entertainment show. So then what would happen is it was real... Everything that we dated was real."

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4. The Toll on Personal Relationships and Mental Health

Jamie opens up about the significant impact the show had on his mental health and personal relationships. The constant evaluation of his actions for entertainment value led to social anxiety and a detachment from authentic interactions.

Jamie Laing [14:04]: "Because you're judging yourself, every single scene you're doing into, was I funny there? Was I entertaining there?"

He describes a period from ages 22 to 27—referred to by his mother as his "lost years"—where he became estranged from his family and close friends, turning to alcohol as a coping mechanism.

Jamie Laing [15:05]: "Yeah. I didn't turn up to... Christmas one time. I was drinking. It was bad."

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5. Overcoming Anxiety and Depersonalization

A critical turning point in Jamie's narrative is his battle with severe anxiety, culminating in a panic attack at 23. This incident led him to seek therapy, where he was diagnosed with depersonalization—a state where he felt detached from his own body, watching himself from outside.

Jamie Laing [43:17]: "It was like watching yourself above your body. Your body feels like a robot."

Through therapy and personal reflection, Jamie learned to manage his anxiety by accepting its presence rather than fighting it, drawing parallels with managing tinnitus.

Jamie Laing [40:23]: "You have to learn to accept it. And that's the road to freedom."

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6. The Fear of Being Forgotten

Central to the episode is Jamie's fear of being forgotten, which he identifies as his primary motivator. This fear propels him to continuously seek validation and success in his endeavors, despite the personal costs.

Jamie Laing [58:53]: "What's forgotten like to who? I think I have a real fear of being forgotten... That's my real drive."

He expresses concern over his legacy and how not growing his business or maintaining his public presence would lead to obscurity.

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7. Reflections on Relationships and Parenthood

Jamie discusses his complex feelings about commitment and parenthood. Despite his fears, he acknowledges his desire to become a father, driven by his partner Sophie's wishes and his own aspirations to experience all facets of life.

Jamie Laing [24:18]: "Having a child is one of those corners of life I want to achieve."

He candidly addresses his anxieties about fatherhood, such as fearing he might not love his child or that his mental health could hinder his ability to be a good parent.

Jamie Laing [25:07]: "What if I'm a shit dad? What if I don't love the kid?"

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8. The Final Eight Questions Segment

The episode concludes with the traditional eight questions, providing further personal insights into Jamie's character and mindset.

• What's a saying or phrase that always makes you smile?

  Jamie Laing [60:50]: "Shall we have shots? So great, isn't it?"

• What's the best compliment you've received?

  Jamie Laing [61:17]: "Probably it's saying that I'm kind."

• What scares you most about yourself?

  Jamie Laing [61:25]: "My brain. That it would overpower me."

• When was the last time you cried and why?

  Jamie Laing [62:50]: "When I think about my parents not being around, that can make me quite sad."

• What's something you can't let go of?

  Jamie Laing [63:29]: "Probably the desire to entertain and to be loved."

• What's your guilty pleasure?

  Jamie Laing [63:37]: "Chick flicks."

• What turns you off/on?

  Jamie Laing [63:58]: "Rudeness. And passionate about anything."

• What do you like most about yourself?

  Jamie Laing [64:14]: "I like the way that I can make people feel comfortable in situations."

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9. Conclusion

Throughout the episode, Jamie Laing offers a raw and unfiltered glimpse into his vulnerabilities and the psychological ramifications of fame and reality television. His reflections underscore the importance of mental health awareness and the personal costs of public life. The conversation serves as a testament to Jamie's resilience and his ongoing journey toward self-acceptance and fulfillment.

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Notable Quotes:

• “Silence is good. So I now listen much more than I used to.” — Jamie Laing [04:22]

• “Having a child is one of those corners of life I want to achieve.” — Jamie Laing [24:18]

• “What if I'm a shit dad? What if I don't love the kid?” — Jamie Laing [25:07]

• “You have to learn to accept it. And that's the road to freedom.” — Jamie Laing [40:23]

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This episode of "Great Company with Jamie Laing" not only highlights Jamie's personal struggles but also serves as a broader commentary on the effects of reality TV fame on individual mental health. Listeners gain valuable insights into the human side of celebrity life, emphasizing the universal fears and challenges that transcend public personas.

Transcript

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[Jamie Laing]

Hello, everyone. My name is Jamie Laing and this is great company. Well, hello. Whoa.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Wow. Wow.

[Jamie Laing]

That was a good start.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Impressive.

[Jamie Laing]

Okay, so this is an interesting one today.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Hello.

[Jamie Laing]

Hello.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Let's start there.

[Jamie Laing]

Well, we should start. We should start there. Hello. We should also start because this is an interesting one.

[Blue Nile Ad]

End of series. This is 40 plus one. This is 40 episodes plus one. This is 41st episode.

[Jamie Laing]

Are you serious?

[Blue Nile Ad]

No. Yes. Such a simple question. I failed. No. Yes. Yes. The answer is yes.

[Jamie Laing]

Okay, well, before we kick off, we should probably say a couple things. This is a very special episode because this is the first time that you have been seen on camera.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yes. So, hello, YouTube. If you don't. If you only watch on YouTube, you won't know who I am. So I'm the producer of so. Hello. Hello, YouTube.

[Jamie Laing]

Would you. You have a nickname for yourself as well?

[Blue Nile Ad]

I'm trying PJ producer Jemima. But we're yet to see if that one's floated.

[Jamie Laing]

And, Jemima, you have been with me from the very pretty much birth of Jampot Productions. You've helped with lots of shows, and you and I started this show together. You were the producer, and we've built it together.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah, my idea to put him on naked on a horse.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah, that was your idea for our little promo for the show. And today we thought we'd do. Because instead of having a guest, you're gonna interview me.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Well, you're the guest because we figured people who listen to the show love you.

[Jamie Laing]

Okay?

[Blue Nile Ad]

And we. There's a lot of things we want.

[Jamie Laing]

To know, and I'm gonna put it out there. You can go as deep as you want. You can ask any question you want.

[Blue Nile Ad]

I have some.

[Jamie Laing]

Okay, you've got some. You can really ask anything.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Okay, I will. I will.

[Jamie Laing]

If it's. If it's too deep. Well, nothing's too deep. First, you can't offend me. And you could never offend me.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Imagine if you walked out. Be quite good, actually.

[Jamie Laing]

Really good. But you can ask anything you want. I'll be as honest as I possibly can. If you want to go deeper on any question, you can. You know me pretty well anyway. Already you're gagging for it. Yeah. But a little bit nervous. Yeah. I don't know what it may be. A little bit nervous. I don't know.

[Blue Nile Ad]

I'm nervous.

[Jamie Laing]

Why are you nervous?

[Blue Nile Ad]

I just think. I think what you do every week is actually. You make it look easy, but it's hard.

[Jamie Laing]

Well, explain that to me.

[Blue Nile Ad]

I think interviewing is. Is like, you have to be listening and thinking ahead. It's like really, really active listening and trying to see what route you could go down. But also, I don't know. I think there's just. There's a lot going on in your head. And I think it is a hard skill that people underestimate how difficult that is. So. But you know.

[Jamie Laing]

But you know what you've told me.

[Blue Nile Ad]

What have I told you?

[Jamie Laing]

Jemima's taught me that silence is good.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yes.

[Jamie Laing]

So I now listen much more than I used to. Silence is fine. So I'm comfortable in silence. And the second thing is that as a sort of entertainer, which I suppose I am, you kind of slip into the area of wanting to be the star of the show. And when it's an interview show, you're not the star, the guest is. And so it's very hard to remember that. So you have to step away and be the guide for the guest, whoever it is, to be the star of the show. And if you are someone like me who wants to be center attention all the time, that was quite tricky to step back.

[Blue Nile Ad]

But today's your day. You're going to resend her attention.

[Jamie Laing]

I can't wait. Well, actually, now I feel a bit weird because I really want to be center attention.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Well, you are. So I thought we should probably swap sides because that's the interview side and this is the guest side. So should we swap?

[Jamie Laing]

We're going to swap sides.

[Blue Nile Ad]

We're going to swap sides.

[Jamie Laing]

All right, let's do it.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Take.

[Jamie Laing]

Okay. Oh, it feels different this side. Yeah, it feels different this side. Okay, this is a little bit awkward. Hello, my name is Jamie Lang and I'm great company.

[Blue Nile Ad]

I want to know. Yeah, obviously people know you from a little show called Made in Chelsea.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah.

[Blue Nile Ad]

So, I mean, first of all, I want to know, were you ever asked to do series one? Because you were series two, right?

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah, I was series two. So my friends Spencer and Kagi and Millie McIntosh and like Hugo Taylor, they were all asked to do series one. And it was kind of floated around that, like, oh, there's Jamie here, and things like that, because they basically went to a nightclub and they saw who was on tables and nightclubs and a table and nightclub was basically. You'd buy a table and dance around a bucket of ice and you'd pay money for it and you'd think you were the coolest cats in town. And actually, you were probably the biggest losers in town.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Bucket of ice.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah. And the producers went to. They went to find those type of people. And Spencer was a promoter for a club, so he was great. And I think he's still, to this day, the best cast at reality star ever.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Oh, yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

Like. Like in any part of the world, anywhere. Spencer Matthews is the best reality star because he got it straight away.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

And most people didn't get it straight away. I didn't get it for, like, three years.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Really. What did you think was going on when you first started?

[Jamie Laing]

Thought there's following you with cameras and just like following your lives, which they are, but they're also not. And Spencer knew straight away that it was like a dramatic entertainment show. Yeah, he knew it straight away. So it was kind of floated around. And to be honest, when they first started, I remember sitting with Rosie Fortescue in a nightclub and I said to her, why are you doing that show? And she said, well, I'm doing it because this reason, this reason and this reason, I went, such a bad decision, bad decision. And then when I was at Leeds University. We all sat down and watched the first ever episode.

[Blue Nile Ad]

You still at uni?

[Jamie Laing]

I was still at uni at the time and we watched the first ever episode and in my head I went, that looks like a lot of fun.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

And then when I left or when I was leaving university, they got in contact and said, we really want you to do series two now. And I secretly went for meetings and secretly started like considering it. And that's what happened.

[Blue Nile Ad]

How did they find. Did someone recommend. Had they. Had you met them?

[Jamie Laing]

Well, it was a TV show. It was going to be cool.

[Blue Nile Ad]

You didn't reach out to them?

[Jamie Laing]

I didn't reach out to them. It was a TV show called Smokers to begin with because it was like people who smoked in a smoking section. And then it became Chelsea Girls because that's why Kagi was the voice of it. They wanted to replicate the Hills but in. But in London. So it was. For anyone who doesn't know what Made in Chelsea is, it's like a TV show around the sort of privileged young kids of London, typically living in west London area called Chelsea. I mean, vomit into a bucket. I loved it. It was very amazing. It was. It was amazing. And they reached out to me and said, oh, hi. Because I had dated Kagi and Millie and I were friends and I was great friends with Spencer. So they were like, we want you to come and do series two. And I ummed an art for ages. Typical me. Not me. On a Make a decision. And then I went on holiday with my great friend Cozy who actually is in the office.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Oh yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

And his mom is a person called Sophie Turner Lang. Sophie Turner Lang was probably one of the most powerful people in television. She helped run sky, she helped run Endermol Shine. And I was on holiday with her in France and she said, don't do that show.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Really?

[Jamie Laing]

And I went, why? And she said, because you'll be hated. It's a TV show about being posh. Do not do it. And so I did it because everyone was saying don't do it. And I also thought that, like, if everyone's saying don't do something, that must be an opportunity to do something.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

So I did it. And it was a lot of fun for the first few years. It was the best.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Was there ever anything that was not able to be aired?

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Can you remember any of them?

[Jamie Laing]

Okay. From like one thing where it was like the end of season. Do you know when. Do you remember that very famous scene where Millie McIntosh said thank you to my Friend Rosie Fortescue, for that moment. For cheating on my boyfriend. That. What that?

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

We all go outside to a firework display.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah, Right.

[Jamie Laing]

We were having loads of accidents that a firework fired into the crowd of all of us and blew up around us. And everyone was like screaming and running around. Oh, my God, what the hell? That was like quite a. Like. So something like humorous. No one's hurt, but humorous. Something to that. To like, things like. There was a very huge scene. I think a cast member sued Made in Chelsea. So can I say. I probably can. There was a person called. Maybe I shouldn't name them just cause it's unfair. There was a new girl who came onto the show who was quite religious. And she said she sort of claimed she was a virgin and all these things and that she was dedicated to God and great. It was amazing. And she flirted with the guys and everyone tried to take her on dates. Turns out she had a boyfriend the entire, entire time who she'd been with for a long time, had been. She wasn't a virgin and all these things. And there was a scene when she was chatting to a guy and her boyfriend then walks in. She didn't even realize he was. And she walked in, and he walked in and said, you've been lying. I'm your boyfriend. You've been living with me. I've seen on this television show that you're doing that you're saying all of these lies. You're living a double life.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

She screamed, walked out, and she was never aired because she threatened to sue because it was slander. So even to extremes like that, that was wild, that moment. Some of the scenes that happened were absolutely wild.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Really?

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah, like, it was crazy. There were no rules. We're just kids getting drunk. And like, it was a wild time.

[Blue Nile Ad]

But how much did it, like, infiltrate to your real cause? You're filming a lot.

[Jamie Laing]

Right.

[Blue Nile Ad]

So in the gaps in between, you know, like arguments that you have kind of on camera, do those. Like Filter. Did that. Like, did it. Did it ruin relationships?

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah. I mean, what happened was, is that we were all great friends, but then we became like a family together. And I didn't realize at the beginning that it was an entertainment show. So you. You would have, like, usually there's a.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Fly on the wall documentary, right.

[Jamie Laing]

Oh, we was having a fun time, like, whatever. And then I. I slowly started to realize it's entertainment. When I was taking. I was. I would took Louise Thompson on a date, and I think that was the.

[Blue Nile Ad]

First episode I ever watched.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah. I took her on a date. Golf. Took her golfing. But then we were sitting on the edge of a cricket field, and the producers came up to me and said, oh, you should kiss her. And I went, huh? They went, you should kiss her. You should definitely kiss her. And I was like, what? And, like, hit now.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

They're like, yeah, yeah, yeah. And I was like, why don't. She doesn't want to kiss me. And she's like, no, no, she'll want to kiss you. We know she wants you to kiss you. You should kiss her. And in my head, I was like, oh, I get it. We're making a show. Of course they want me to kiss her. Because then that creates all different things. And so it was a real sort of moment that clicked within me that suddenly I was like, ah, okay, so this is an entertainment show. So then what would happen is it was real. Like, it was real. Everything that we dated was real. And we weren't given scripts and all that kind of stuff. But I would. For example, Spencer and I were sort of champions at it because I would go into a scene with Spencer and I would. Something would have happened. Right. That wasn't good.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

And I would look at him before four cameras, 30 people, lights, everything. And I would say, you're not gonna like this. And he would go, oh, really? And I go, you're not gonna like this one. And he went, okay, let's do it. And then we'd go, start talking. We're going to the scene. Or we then have arguments with each other that actually we did care about, but not hugely care, but we did care about. And afterwards we go, oh, that was a good scene.

[Blue Nile Ad]

What? That's so weird.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah, it was quite weird. So. So then what happens? And I've said this before, but the problem with that is that you're kind of giving yourself like an uber rating every single scene you're doing. And we were filming 150 days a year. That's what we were filming. It's crazy. So half of your life is a reality show. So then, because you're judging yourself, every single scene you're going into, was I funny there? Was I entertaining there? Was I this? Was I that? Was I dramatic enough? You then step outside of that. Every conversation you're having with friends who aren't in the show in normal life, you're thinking, am I fun? Am I entertaining? Am I this? Am I that? And so then you. Your perception of what is reality TV show and what is actual real reality becomes blurred. So you don't really know the difference between the two. So you're constantly thinking you're in a reality show. So then what happens is to me personally is you become socially anxious.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

Because you're constantly thinking, am I being entertaining the whole time in every single situation. So you, you become a recluse. So a one on one lunch date with one of my mates. Impossible. Too intimate. Couldn't do that because I would have to sit across from you and I would have to make you laugh and make you have the best time and make you think. And if I didn't do that, the suffering that would be afterwards for me would be unbearable. So I would just never see any friends unless I was in a situation where I could drink. And then if I could drink at bars or pubs and nightclubs or whatever, absolutely fine. Cause the alcohol would make me less socially anxious and it'd be totally fine and I wouldn't have to worry about it. But the problem is when you start drinking that much, then that becomes an issue as well.

[Blue Nile Ad]

So during that time can you see that you became more distant from people? What was your relationship with your family or your closest friends? Did you kind of.

[Jamie Laing]

Oh, non existent.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Really?

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah. Like from the age of like 22 to 27. My mum calls it the lost years.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Really?

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah. I didn't turn up to. I turn up late to my mum's 60th. I didn't turn up to Christmas one time. I.

[Blue Nile Ad]

What were you doing?

[Jamie Laing]

Drinking. Having. Just better things I thought to do. Yeah, it was bad. Yeah. Really bad. But I was suffering heavily with anxiety.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

And. And so I couldn't, I had to distract myself, which I now realize with a holiday or a party or a date or whatever. It was something to distract myself from my own feelings and thoughts. Whatever that was.

[Blue Nile Ad]

That's so interesting because yesterday we were doing an interview and you said I find it easier to open up to people I don't know.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Which must be from that.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Not, not as much anymore. But I did. So I couldn't open up to friends, I couldn't open up to anyone. But I could open up a stranger because I wasn't going to be judged.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

Because a stranger doesn't know who I am. So I could tell a stranger my deepest secrets.

[Blue Nile Ad]

But people did know who you are because you're. You've got profile.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah. But they didn't know who they thought I was a fun loving individual.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Oh fine.

[Jamie Laing]

My fear was I was going to be caught out for actually who I was. Which I thought was boring and not as funny and not as interesting and not as entertaining. Because if I'm not those things, then I'm not. Then I have no currency on the TV show.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

So I had to be all of those things in order to create this life.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Do you think that show had. Should have had, like, a duty of care to people? Like, what do you think about that? Because you're not alone, I'm sure, in your experience of reality tv and nowadays it is very different. So there's an argument to say it was the first time, so they didn't know that that was gonna happen. But do you think. Are you angry at all at that show? For what kind of those lost years? And.

[Jamie Laing]

No, I'm definitely not angry. And look, in hindsight, probably, yeah, there should have been. But the flip side of it was this, is that I chose to go into it. I had a choice, and I went into this television show and. Because I wanted to be in this world of entertainment, but not with a.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Full awareness of what it would do.

[Jamie Laing]

No, true. And there are those sides of things, but the things I got out of it were amazing. You know, the. Would I be sitting here doing this with you without it? Maybe not. So there's all of those sides of things. And I think that television show, they were trying to. They were making an entertainment show. And, yeah, there may be things that were done wrong and badly, and you. Maybe we were mistreated in certain ways, but also, I probably could have left at any point, and I didn't. And, yeah, I think now there's a duty of care, which is amazing. There should be 100. But when it first started, no one knew the repercussions of what reality TV did.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

And reality TV is very heavy on the soul, and it caused. And I just think that kind of fame, and if you're a certain individual like me, like, it's going to cause all of that crap. Do I regret it? No, not at all. Do I wish I handled things differently? Yes, for sure. I wish I hadn't drunk as much. I wish I had paid more attention to my family and to my mental health because, you know, I got to, like, 27 years old and everything just collapsed. But I also had the best time. And I don't think. I truly think I'm unemployable 100%. And so at least I was employed by something that my brain worked with. So it's a blessing and a curse in lots of ways.

[Blue Nile Ad]

What do you think that show did to, like, to people's perception of you? Oh, actually more, what do you think people really think of you?

[Jamie Laing]

Oh my God, I would probably have to ask you that. What do I think people.

[Blue Nile Ad]

No, what do you think people really think of you?

[Jamie Laing]

The wider public think of me or my friends or.

[Blue Nile Ad]

What public? Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

I. God, I don't know. There's probably a huge number of individuals who probably think it's that posh bloke from Made in Chelsea who's lived off his parents money and is just inherited all this stuff and is a rich posh wanker, which I totally understand and fair dues because I probably think the same. I think there's then a closer group of people who probably know that's not true and are probably thinking now maybe that guy's done okay. Like I think they think, oh, he's actually done okay here. So I think it's. I think it's a. It's a sort of two things. I think people think people probably. I don't know if you have two things.

[Blue Nile Ad]

What about people closer to you who maybe said, don't do this. You did do it. They've watched you kind of do it. Lost you for a bit. How'd you come back? Like, what do you think?

[Jamie Laing]

Well, I think now they're probably with Truth. I probably think they're proud. Yeah, they're probably like. Well, I think most people, my close friends look at me and go, oh, well done. Because what happens when you do a television show like that is you take a shortcut into this amazing industry.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

Which is the entertainment industry, which I love more than anything. But when you take a shortcut into something.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

It is a long road run. Whenever you shortcut anything, there's always a long road round. So I shortcut in the industry, but it's taken me 14 years to get to a place where people kind of go, oh, okay, yeah, we can give you Radio 1 or we can get guests on her. Amazing, right?

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

Before the likes of getting some of the guests. Not a freaking chance. Because they see you as a reality star and they don't want to associate with you. I don't know. Does that make sense?

[Blue Nile Ad]

That does make sense. Okay, well, what I think of you.

[Jamie Laing]

Oh, here we go. Okay.

[Blue Nile Ad]

I. Well, no, you just kind of. You kind of touched on it. But I think, I think my favorite thing about you is that you. I find you really surprising.

[Jamie Laing]

Really?

[Blue Nile Ad]

I think you're really surprising. I think you are way smarter than you give off.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah, that's true.

[Blue Nile Ad]

And I think you're I think you're really, really talented. And I really like when I meet. When people are like, what's he like? I'm like, he. Like, he's what you see on tv. But like, he's also like, there's a lot of smarts. And I love that you're so. You are so happy and confident to be the butt of the joke. And I think so few people are. And that's why people love you, because you.

[Jamie Laing]

You've got.

[Blue Nile Ad]

You've got a very generous soul.

[Jamie Laing]

Oh, my God. That's very kind, Jemima.

[Blue Nile Ad]

So that's bad. Bye.

[Jamie Laing]

Do I give. Do I say what you're like?

[Blue Nile Ad]

No.

[Jamie Laing]

Okay. Scorpio in you wants that, though.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Can I ask you a very personal question?

[Jamie Laing]

Ask anything.

[Blue Nile Ad]

You want babies?

[Jamie Laing]

Oh, yeah.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Are you gonna have one in the next year?

[Jamie Laing]

I would really like to have one, yeah.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Really?

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah. It's been. But it's been a real long road.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Go on.

[Jamie Laing]

It's been a real long road because I. I was really scared of, like, babies. Why really scared of babies? Because I was really scared of commitment.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

So I never thought I'd really get married.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Why scared of commitment? Because you just never want to be held.

[Jamie Laing]

Like, the idea of not being able to escape something, there's always a window to get out of. So boarding school, there's always a window. You know, you do a job, there's always a way to get out of it.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Starting with business.

[Jamie Laing]

You can always quit.

[Blue Nile Ad]

You can always get divorced.

[Jamie Laing]

You can always get divorced. Yeah. But sort of that was almost bit much of a commitment. So. So, you know. Yeah, you can. You can get divorced. There's always a way out. With a baby, there's no way out. When you have a kid, there is no way out. You are committed to that little human forever. And that for me is really quite scary.

[Blue Nile Ad]

But not scary anymore.

[Jamie Laing]

No, still really scary.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Okay.

[Jamie Laing]

The baby is still a real fear. My God. And to the point where Sophie at one point, beginning of this year said, oh, she thinks she's pregnant. And I had to leave the restaurant because I thought I was so. I was so stressed. I just was so stressed. Firstly, that's not a good partner.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah, that's not a good move.

[Jamie Laing]

That's a terrible move.

[Blue Nile Ad]

I hope you've learned from that.

[Jamie Laing]

It's a terrible move. It made not only me just really nervous. It made Sophie really scared because she. As a partner, you want someone secure and calm and relaxed and, you know, I'm hectic more than anything. And then that made her feel really uneasy.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

Hang on a second. We're married and do not want kids and all these different things. So that was really scary. And then I sat down with someone and I asked them about their kid. I said, do you have kids? And she said, yes. I said, is it? How shortly. My question always is, how is it? Oh, my God, is it? Is it right? And she went, it's awful. And I went, huh?

[Blue Nile Ad]

I went, what?

[Jamie Laing]

I wasn't expecting that. It's awful. Yeah, it's really bad. But she said to me, which was really quite clear, she said, if you want to experience every corner of life, yeah, you got to experience sadness, happiness, all these different things. I think for me personally, she said, having a child is one of those corners of life. So I want to experience every corner of life. And for me, there's a corner there that you want to achieve. And that really resonated with me that actually I want to do the same. Secondly, Sophie wants to be a mum more than anything. And I adore Sophie.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

More not even just like, on a level of just being like a husband and wife or like a friend, Like a soul. I love her soul. And so to deny her that because of my own selfish reasons would be unfair. So as much as I have a fear for it, and I'm sure she does as well, I have to be strong for her. And I'm in a stage of accepting it and actually now a bit more excited about it. And so I think next year, yeah, we would go for it.

[Blue Nile Ad]

That's very exciting.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah, it is exciting, but it's very scary at the same time.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Do you think a part of you is a bit nervous about not being the center of attention when a baby comes?

[Jamie Laing]

I don't. Not so much that. It's more like. It's more like, what is if I'm a shit dad.

[Blue Nile Ad]

You'll be fine.

[Jamie Laing]

I don't know what is. I'm a shit. What if I don't love the kid? What is it? The kid comes out and I don't love the baby. What happens if that happens?

[Blue Nile Ad]

Whole lifetime.

[Jamie Laing]

I know what happens if. Do you know my other big fear? Okay. My other big fear is that, like, my brain is, like, crazy. So I think most brains don't think as much as I think.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah, that's, I think, quite clear.

[Jamie Laing]

It really thinks and it really moves fast and it really is up all the time. And so. Which also means then I can lean into anxiety a lot because it's a constant all the time. And throughout my 20s and 30s. I've had periods where the anxiety's been quite a lot and I've had moments of burnout and things like that. And that's quite scary because I also think my brain is my best asset because it's quite creative and those kind of things. So my really big fear is that we have a kid and my brain goes into that space which is like, so anxious or so burnt out or. And I can't get out of it.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

And I'm so worried that it was. If a baby does that to my brain, that's what I'm really scared of. Really? Yeah. Because if I lose. If I. If I lose my brain, then I won't be able to do the things that I do because I'm not smart enough. I'm not a mechanic, I'm not artistic in terms of things. My brain is like my conv. My conversation is what I'm really good at. And if that goes, then I'm kind of depleted of anything.

[Blue Nile Ad]

That's like when we were talking about when we had Harley from Brazil kicks on, and he was talking about when your brain becomes your.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah. Your worst enemy.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Your enemy against this. The thing that brings you joy is kind of stripped from you because your brain's turned against you.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah. And I'm just worried that my brain could do that to me at any point.

[Blue Nile Ad]

I do think it is. I mean, it's definitely a tough job for the person growing the baby. Let's just acknowledge that. That however, for the partner, your body doesn't change at all for those nine months. So you don't have any of those hormones or like, for all you know, you could impregnate someone and then nine months later have like, literally no awareness. And then baby. So it's. I do think it is hard and like, you don't have, like, the hormones and like, the connection to this. This little baby in the same way that the woman or whoever's had the baby. So, like, I do think there is a. That it is difficult. Like, I think your fears are, like, valid in terms of being really nervous of the whole. And like, what if I don't love you? Because you don't have the. I mean, everyone's experience is really different. And I do think it is very normal to have a baby and be a bit like, ah, ah. For everyone.

[Jamie Laing]

Because I'm just not good at sitting still.

[Blue Nile Ad]

I know you're.

[Jamie Laing]

But holding a baby and just sitting still, Are you kidding me? I'm never still. Like, I, like, I have to go on Walks the whole time. I have to. I have to, like. Yeah, I've bought, like a LEGO set because I just.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Oh, yeah, I remember when you bought that LEGO set.

[Jamie Laing]

I built that one. I built another. I'm gonna build another one because I have to be doing something all the time. It's so mad. So just sitting there holding a baby.

[Blue Nile Ad]

I know, but they're not a baby forever. They're very soon gonna be building Lego sets with you.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah, but I worry about. You know, I just worry. I really worry about. That's what I worry about.

[Blue Nile Ad]

But that's a way to not be forgotten.

[Jamie Laing]

But I also. Joe, I used to worry about. I mean, I used to catastrophize about everything.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Are you catastrophizer?

[Jamie Laing]

You kidding me? Oh, my God. Like, I'm much better now.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

But at school, right? So I know gcses. My thing always ended up with me. Homeless. Yeah. Yeah. So, okay, gcse. I never revised. I literally never revised.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Right.

[Jamie Laing]

My revising for an exam was to wake up at 2am the morning of the exam, take loads of those caffeine pills to keep you awake.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

And revise the entire time until my exam and then do the exam. That was my technique because it turns out I have, obviously adhd and there are so many dopamine things around me that sitting and revising was impossible to do. And so what did you think would happen?

[Blue Nile Ad]

How are you ending up homeless from your. From not revising. Take me through this. Catastrophizing.

[Jamie Laing]

So I would. Would fail my exams.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Fine.

[Jamie Laing]

That's what would happen.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

I'd be kicked out of school.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yep.

[Jamie Laing]

I'd be kicked out of school. Means I wouldn't get a job.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Right.

[Jamie Laing]

Because I'd failed all my exams. So I couldn't get a job.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yep.

[Jamie Laing]

I wouldn't get a job. So I'd have to go onto the streets and I would have to beg for money because I wouldn't be making any money anywhere else and I would then be homeless.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Wow. There is so. So many enormous leaps going on there.

[Jamie Laing]

That's how the brain works.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Like, you've got no fat. No. No one in your family would have said, said, hey, John, I've got a spare room.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah, no, none of that. I would just be. I. I wouldn't. I would be. Yeah, it would. It would. I'd always end up.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Catastrophizing is always. Just goes step, step, enormous leap to everyone's. Like, the world's exploded.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah. But I had that. I had that with everything. You Know, I, the, the, the prime example is, right, is when I, you know this, when I had a dead leg. I woke up in the morning, had a dead leg, and it was like, dead. And I was like, oh, God, it's really annoying. Why is my leg dead? I went throughout the day having a dead leg. And at the end of the day I went, my leg's still dead. What is that? So I googled it and it came up as Ms. So I thought, well, that's not gonna be good. So I phoned up a doctor. Cause I couldn't go to the hospital. Got a 24 hour doctor come around to the house. And the doctor came around to the house. I said, I'm, I'm really sorry to call you here, but I, I think I have Ms. And he went, you don't. It doesn't show up this way. And I said, no, no, I, I think you're wrong. I've got Ms. And the doctor did tests and all these different things, said, no, you have a dead leg. And I went, no, no, it's not a dead leg, it's Ms. And I did that repeatedly for about six times to the point where the doctor went, you don't have Ms. Really? He swore at me. And I went, okay, are you sure? And he went, you don't. It's a dead leg. It's a dead leg. And then he left. Cost me £600 to get the doctor over. Woke up the next day, dead leg, gone. So I catastrophize everything and I now.

[Blue Nile Ad]

But you're better now.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah, because being 36, I've experienced so many things that haven't come true.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Right.

[Jamie Laing]

That actually you can train your brain to go, well, maybe this time again, my brain is overacting.

[Blue Nile Ad]

It is just a dead leg and.

[Jamie Laing]

It'S just a dead leg. Or maybe this time it's not where you go. It could be. This one could be.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

And also, life is life, right? Like, what will be is what will be. You have to accept that. And life is beautiful and wonderful and amazing and life happens. It's gonna be ups, it's gonna be downs. You know, I always got told that thing, life is like a heart monitor, right? Goes up and down. It has to do that in order to survive. If you're flatlining, you're dead. So you have to have those peaks and troughs in order to continue in this world.

[Blue Nile Ad]

I was talking to someone about this yesterday and I was saying, I quite like when something goes a bit wrong. Because I'm like, oh, thank God, Lisa. Because if things are going really well, I'm nervous, really. I need something to be going wrong.

[Jamie Laing]

Like what?

[Blue Nile Ad]

So, like, when I first started here, I was like, great. I've got this great job, but my love life was just atrocious. And I was like, fantastic. And then, I don't know. And then, you know, you go on a good date or you. You have a good. You know, you meet someone that you're like, oh, maybe this is something exciting. And then work would be a bit shit and I'd be like, great. The equilibrium is back. I can't have them both going good at the same time.

[Jamie Laing]

Oh, I want everything to be good all the time.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Really?

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah. I really like when things are good.

[Blue Nile Ad]

If things are good, I'm terrified. I'm like, if things are really good, I'm like, I'm gonna. Like, if I have, like, a phone, a missed call from Mum, I'm like, that's dead. Because they can't. Like, it's not. It's not fair because, you know. Do you not have that? I also. Mum's texts. She'll just say my name. It's just one text, Jemima. And I'm like, oh, my God.

[Jamie Laing]

Exactly.

[Blue Nile Ad]

And then she's like, oh, are you coming over? And I'm like, can you just start? Hello?

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah. I lean much more into. I love it when things are going well like that. When everyone's happy and everything's doing well. That, like, feeds my soul, like, you cannot believe. Oh, it's like the waking up and getting a message saying something like, we've booked a guest or we've sold some sweets into a. That is, like. That will fill my cup for, like, an hour and then for, like, a while. But, like, it's the best. Like, I love Good news for me is, like, the best. Oh, no, I'm not a sufferer. I don't like suffering.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Fair. Fair. I don't mind. I just don't mind because I'm like, that's where the creativeness starts. Starts, you know? And you're like, once I wrote a to do list on, like, a Saturday, and one of the things on the to do list was write a song. Because I was like, I've just got a lot of feelings going on. And I just feel like today I remember sitting down and being like, I don't know how to write a song.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah, but that's good because you're challenging yourself. That's amazing.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah. I think I wrote maybe a line. It's somewhere in my. My Notes somewhere.

[Jamie Laing]

That's my big thing for 2025, is to really challenge myself.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah, like you've got to start suffering them.

[Jamie Laing]

Totally.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah. Yeah, sure thing. Hey, you sold that car yet?

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah, sold it to Carvana.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Oh, I thought you were selling to that guy.

[Jamie Laing]

The guy who wanted to pay me in foreign currency, no interest over 36 months. Yeah, no. Carvana gave me an offer in minutes, picked it up and paid me on the spot. It was so convenient.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Just like that?

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah.

[Blue Nile Ad]

No hassle?

[Jamie Laing]

None.

[Blue Nile Ad]

That is super convenient. Sell your car to Carvana and swap Hassle for convenience.

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[Blue Nile Ad]

So Made in Chelsea. We were talking about duty of care. Yeah. But it did make you very, very anxious. And I. So for I think anxiety is a thing that everyone feels at one point or another. We'll have moments of low and moments of high. And anxiety is like a very common thing. And I, for me, I've had moments where I felt really anxious and I felt like panicky. However, recently I've also had times where my stomach's really hurt and I'm like, why have I got tummy ache? And I'm like, oh, that's anxiety. And, you know, it like it can manifest itself in so many different ways. So I'm really intrigued to like, what does it look like for you?

[Jamie Laing]

Really good question. It really is. It's like. So my anxiety, the only way I can describe was like, it was like living in fear all the time.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Like, heart beating fast or it wasn't physical.

[Jamie Laing]

It's like the most uncomfortable feeling of adrenaline running through your body, but a negative adrenaline. Not like you're about to jump off out of a plane, which is, like, quite exciting, and. Oh, my God. It's more like a feeling of, like, dread and horribleness and something is around the corner and it's gonna be bad. That's what it feels like. And it was constant. I mean, all day, every day. Every day for how long? Oh, my God. Well, I had a panic attack. I've said this before. I had a panic attack. And when I was 23.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Was that the kind of kickstarter of it?

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah. I nearly had a panic attack before that, which I now realize when I was in Starbucks and I thought someone was looking at me weirdly, and I started to get panicky, and I was like, oh, what the hell? That's a bit weird. Whatever. But it didn't turn into one. I had a panic attack that I didn't know what the hell it was. It was awful. And I. And because it was such high adrenaline for so long, this panic attack, that when it dropped, I felt so low because everything dropped. And this was, like, by myself. And I remember going to bed and going like, there's no way I could live like this. Are you kidding me? Like, what is this? And I woke up the next day, and it had relieved a little bit. And I was like, oh, my God, what was that? And then that way, it was like a light switch. It was like. It was. My life changed from that moment because I then understood what anxiety was without knowing what anxiety is. And it was just, like, awful. It was awful. So I had it from 23 until, like, maybe 10 years.

[Blue Nile Ad]

I think it definitely. In my experience, anxiety is a lot of kind of those feelings, but basically, it's like there's some sort of hurt. But you don't. You haven't worked out. So, like, for me, whenever I felt anxious, I'm like, why do I feel this way? I feel these kind of nervous feelings, and it's because I don't. Anxiety is not knowing what's upsetting you.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah.

[Blue Nile Ad]

And it's that hunt.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah. And also the problem with anxiety is, is the more you fight it, which I always did. I don't want this. I don't want this. I don't want this. This can't be me. I don't want this. I don't want this. Holder. Oh, God. I need this for me to go. What do I do? Maybe I eat chocolate at, like, 6pm at night. Maybe if I sleep on my left shoulder at night, it will go. Maybe If I meditate three minutes a day on the dot at 6am it will go like I was always trying to find a cure for it. Oh, I've been eating too much ice cream. That's because my, my body's now cold. That's obviously anxiety because what it is, if I stop eating ice cream, it better. Oh, it must be because I'm drinking tea at night. 100. That's what it is. I was always trying to find an.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Answer, but you weren't looking. You didn't think, oh, it's probably maybe something I'm. No, like it was always an external thing.

[Jamie Laing]

Always external. Oh, it's because I'm drinking too much. Oh, it's because of this. Oh, it was never internal because it can't be me. Because if it's me, then I'm. I'm not good enough. Because it's a weakness. I thought, yeah, so it can't be me. It has to be other things causing it. And it took me, me ages. Beyond ages.

[Blue Nile Ad]

There's. There's a real arrogance to that in.

[Jamie Laing]

No, a real. I think more fear. Wasn't arrogant, it was more fear because if I had accepted it was me, yeah, then it's going to be with me forever and I can't have that. The doctor. When I finally went to the doctor after six months of feeling like on the verge of panic attacks every single day, and I said, something's wrong with me. They said, you have anxiety. And I went, well, what's that? And they said, it's this, like, adrenaline and you're fight or flight. And I went, well, how do I get rid of it? And they said, you can't. And I went, no, no, come on, what do I do to get rid of it when you can't? And I said, well, what do I do? And he said, well, you have to learn to accept it. And I went, what? Yeah, I can't learn to accept this. Are you kidding me? Like, no, it needs to go right now. Like it needs to go. And they said, no, you have to learn to accept it. And it's the worst piece of advice when someone starts to get anxiety because you're like, well, hang on, this is forever. But it's the best piece of advice when you actually do learn to accept it, then it's the road to freedom. And actually what taught me to accept my anxiety is when I got tinnitus. Yeah. So I got tinnitus about eight years ago, which is basically a constant ringing in your head. And it's your noise. In your head it's ringing. And for me it was like the worst noise and feeling in the world. But after someone said to me, you're gonna have to learn to accept it. Treat it like an aircon in the room or a fan in the room. If you're thinking about hearing the fan, then you'll know it's there. But actually you block it out. Your brain just blocks out. And after about six months, I learned to block it out and I went, oh, maybe if I do that with anxiety, maybe if I just accept that I'm actually anxious and that that's my makeup and that's okay, and actually figure out what has made me anxious in my life, then maybe that will be a better thing. And so that was around 28, 27. And then I started to do therapy and all those things. But for six years I just. No ways.

[Blue Nile Ad]

That's mad to me that you didn't think to look for no ways. All external.

[Jamie Laing]

Oh, it's because I had a beer last night. That's what it was. 100%. Oh, it's because, I don't know, I didn't get enough sleep last night. Yeah.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Is anyone or either of your parents anxious?

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah, my mum gets anxiety or has had anxiety, but she's very tough. Like she's like a bull.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Different generation.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah, she's just. But she definitely has it. And. And it also comes hand in hand with, I think ADHD and hyper focusing. So I hyper focus on stuff. So if I have anxiety, imagine the hyper focus that you have on anxiety. It's like that engulfs everything. So a lot of people who feel anxious just go, oh, I feel a bit anxious. Oh, whatever. Or whatever. I go, yeah. And I lock onto it. It will not go.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Hence why a doctor saying, you've got to learn to live with this is just.

[Jamie Laing]

Then I focus on that.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

I got something called depersonalization. Yeah.

[Blue Nile Ad]

What is that?

[Jamie Laing]

It basically, when your body has had so much stress and anxiety for so long, it can come from lots of different things. Your body goes on autopilot, so you basically feel like you're floating above your own body. So I woke up one day, I didn't. I had an argument. It was like the straw that broke the candlestick had another argument with a girlfriend at the time. And basically a fog like thing came over my eyes. You know, if you're like really tired or really you've been really hungover, you feel a bit blurry. Yeah, it was like that constantly. And you basically are watching yourself. It sounds really weird. You're basically watching yourself above your body. Your body feels like a robot, and you're watching yourself from outside of it because your brain is protecting you.

[Blue Nile Ad]

And for how long?

[Jamie Laing]

Oh, that was six months. Constant.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Sorry, what?

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah, while I was filming the TV show and pretending to. So I would go into scenes and not really know what I was saying. It was like my body was saying it and my brain was watching me say it. Yeah.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Have you watched those scenes back?

[Jamie Laing]

No, I haven't seen any of it back. I never watched anything back. But that was quite bad for a bit. And then I went on holiday and I rested, and it just. Like a light switch, it, like, lifted. I was playing backgammon and suddenly the fog just disappeared from my eyes.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Did you tell anyone? Like, how did you know that that was. What was depersonalization?

[Jamie Laing]

Well, I. I had it for air for, like, a month, and I wouldn't want to wait. I wouldn't want to open my eyes in the morning because I'd see this fog. So I just. I'd keep them shut. Yeah, it was awful. And I finally went to psychotherapist, and he says, you have something called depersonalization, again, latching onto something. And I said, what's that? And he said, well, anxious, all those things he said. But also, people who have psychosis get it. So I went, well, I've got psychosis. So I thought I was going mad for six months. Yeah, it was not good. Yeah. So that was quite bad.

[Blue Nile Ad]

And did you, like. Did you do anything? And so one month in, you go see a psychotherapist and you get that diagnosis, and then five months later, you go on a holiday and it switches in those five intervening months. Nothing.

[Jamie Laing]

Nothing.

[Blue Nile Ad]

You just.

[Jamie Laing]

Just had it all day, every day, all day, every day, every single day. Boom, was there. Boom, is there.

[Blue Nile Ad]

And were you in a relationship at the time?

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah, I was in a relationship with a girl called Frankie. And didn't tell her about it. Like, I didn't tell her. I never spoke about this stuff ever. I always just kept it in. Never told anyone. Yeah. So I just dealt with it and then had to film scenes and just. Yeah. Cause I thought if I. If I admitted what was going on. Oh, you can't do this. You can't. You're sick. You can't do this. I was like, okay, so I never told anyone. And then it lifted. And then for about two years after that, I was just always afraid it was going to come back. So then I was so fearful the whole time. But it also led me down the road of therapy. Yeah, and therapy is the greatest thing, I think, because you then become self aware and all these different things. Yeah, it was full on. Yeah, it was.

[Blue Nile Ad]

I didn't realize, I thought when you explained it to me and the idea of in my head I'm imagining you're like. You're like a ghost, like following it is.

[Jamie Laing]

It's like that. That's exactly what it's like.

[Blue Nile Ad]

So that's my image of what. When you've talked about it. And I just thought a day, a day or two or a few weeks, six months.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah, not my experience. My experience was like real bad, but. But I. But mine was like leading towards it. But also I was like drinking a lot, right? And like, like I was drinking and not looking after my body and like so many things. And I would go on like nights out and drink a lot and wake up in the middle of the night and not really know where I was because my brain was. So. Yeah, it was just. It was just bad. It was bad. It was a bad. It was just not a healthy, fun time.

[Blue Nile Ad]

You know, when you sit down, do you always have a first question in mind? Because sometimes I give you them and sometimes you don't.

[Jamie Laing]

Well, okay. So the first. The first question of an interview is really important, I think, because it sets the tone of how the interview is going to feel for the guest. So I think always about something that makes someone feel comfortable. Because everyone's expecting to go, tell me about your childhood, or tell me about this, or tell me about your music. And so they're expecting that. So if you say something like, go, what are you eating? Do you have eggs in the morning? They're taken off guard. And as soon as you take someone off guard, then you can see in their eyes and their whole body just relax. Cause they're like, oh, I have scrambled eggs actually. And you go, God, I love scrambled eggs. Do you know I cook the best scrambled eggs ever? And then the really important thing with an interview, right, I think this is all a personal take, is if you ask someone about eggs and then they say scrambled, you straight away give an example of how you like scrambled. So they feel, because you're already sharing with them. So it's about doing something. It's taking someone off guard at the top, but then also sharing a story that relates to that as well. So you feel that you're in a shared space.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Where did you learn that though? Have you Learned that. Is that your own intuition or is that you. Have you done it wrong?

[Jamie Laing]

Oh, okay. So I learned that probably. Okay. So I grew up in a big family, so I had five brothers and sisters. Two were half sisters, Tash and Gems, who were older than me for my dad's first marriage. And then I had my older brother who was called Alexander. The perfect child. Calm, relaxed, never cried. Smart bar. Then there was me, hectic as shit as you can imagine. And then I had my little sister, so. And I, and I wanted attention all the time and so I found out ways to get attention, which was interesting. And then when you go to boarding school, you're thrown into an environment of people who are strangers. So what you have to kind of do is you have to, it's survival. You have to make friends and everyone's different. So subconsciously you're working out how to connect with people. Oh, that person over there likes Pokemon, so I'm going to talk to them about Pokemon. That person over there is quieter, so maybe I approach it a different way. That person's sporty, so maybe I talk to them about sport. So straight away, without realizing you're learning individuals because you're with strangers all the time. And so I think boarding school for me was a place to learn. And then reality tv, when I did reality tv, you're thrown into a scene where you have to make it entertaining. And so your straight away learning how to make things entertaining because talking about the weather is boring, so you have to talk with people to make it entertaining. So I think that's where I learned it.

[Blue Nile Ad]

But I think what's interesting is lots of people go to boarding school. Yeah, well, not a lot. I didn't actually. You're the only person I know who went to boarding school. However, some people go to boarding school and. But I don't think everyone who does has that same mentality of like, you have to get people on side. Like there's, there's like, like a, like a really strong desire to be liked.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah. So I think the question is, right, like is, but do I have a real desire to be liked? Yeah, I have a real.

[Blue Nile Ad]

But what? Like as in the. To go into a room and be like, I need to get people on side. I need to like get, you know, and I need to entertain people. That is not a normal thing. Like it makes complete sense that you're like, oh, this is how I learned to interview people. This is how I learned to get people on side because of the XY experiences. But I think some People have those same experiences and don't view them in the same way.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah, I had, like, weird things. Like, I remember when I was five, six years old, and I. I. I went to school called Hather, at Castle School, which was outside of London.

[Blue Nile Ad]

And how old were you then?

[Jamie Laing]

I must have been so, 4, 5, 6, 7. I left at 8. And it was when we. Before my parents got divorced when I was 8, so we lived in this sort of in. In the Cotswolds. And I still remember there that I had my friends there. A guy called John, a guy called Two Toms, a guy called Harry, and a guy called Josh. We were like the friends together. And out of a year of, what, 30, I don't know. I used to do things where in the lunch time, you could go to the hot food, or you could go to the cold food and you could pick what you wanted. You could go for the hot, or you could go for the salads. I used to go to a certain. I used to go to the salad kitchen queue, even though I didn't eat salads.

[Blue Nile Ad]

And you're like, four.

[Jamie Laing]

I was like, five, right? Six, maybe. To see who followed me to the salad queue. To. Just to understand where I was in, like, a pecking order in terms of, like, okay, who was following me, who was. I was so conscious of, like, people almost, like, being, I suppose, the. The leader. Yeah, I was so conscious of that. And I think it was because I was such a people person, like, people, please. That I wanted everyone to like me.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

So I would do things like that the whole time. It was very. It was quite a strange thing from such a young age to have that sort of consciousness of, like, awareness of who people are.

[Blue Nile Ad]

That's mad.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah, it was really mad. Yeah. But I think that came from having two older sisters. And I had two older sisters. Tash, who would have been about 18 at the time, and Gems, who was 16, like 4.

[Blue Nile Ad]

They're, like, over 10 years older than you.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah. And. And they. But they were in the stage where they were obsessed with boys. They were obsessed with, like, movies. It was a time of, like, Tom Cruise and Brad Pitt and these insane actors, and they had posters on their walls. You know, that's what it was like back in whatever, like the 90s.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

And so I knew that. I thought they were so cool. So they just talked about being cool all the time. Cause that's what you do as a teenager. So I was like, okay, what is cool? Trying to understand what that is. Oh, being cool must be mean. Being popular. Because these movie stars are all pop. And so not only did you have to be popular, you had to be like, attractive. Cause all they talked about was how hot Brad Pitt was and how hot Tom Cruise was. So I was like, well, what does this hot thing mean? So then you were conscious of like how you looked and things like that from a very young age. Because I had these older sisters to the point where when I went to boarding school at 8 years old, I sat in the room of my first class. Mrs. Logan was my teacher. I still remember, I'm eight. And I looked around to all the boys and there must be about 15 boys in here. And I thought, well, who's cool in the room? Who's cool? Who's cool? Who's cool? So I was so conscious the whole time of like, awareness and things like that and being perceived as popular. I suppose how that's odd a bit.

[Blue Nile Ad]

But also I can. I definitely have done things where I've like, done like a course or something and I've gone into a room full of new people and I've just thought, does everyone fancy me? I hope they do. Is there anyone else who's competition for the.

[Jamie Laing]

So maybe it's a human thing that we actually do.

[Blue Nile Ad]

I think it's a Scorpio thing.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah.

[Blue Nile Ad]

But the thing I was going to ask you is.

[Jamie Laing]

That's so interesting you had that though. Yeah.

[Blue Nile Ad]

But I sometimes think I'm maybe a psychopath. No, not really. But just like. Because everything you're saying about wanting to be popular, wanting to be liked, I'm like, yeah. Which is why half of me is a bit like. I don't even know what to ask because that makes complete sense.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah, but it's a complete curse.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

Constantly analyzing individuals and people and whereabouts and whether people like you or not. It's a curse because you're constantly thinking that some people just go into situations and don't even think that. They just accept it for what it is. And oh, that person's playing with me. That's great. And that person's handing me a sticker or that person's eating their food in that way. Whatever. They don't care where. Maybe you and I were just constantly analyzing things. Yeah.

[Blue Nile Ad]

And it's definitely held me back from doing things, I think, you know, like wanting to be. I'll want to be the best or some. So say, for instance, I'm a producer. I probably would have very happily gone down a path to present. But I was like, I don't know if that's kind of. It's the showy side of things. It's in front of camera. And I don't know whether I will be the best at it or I'm gonna have to, like, really, really, like, push myself. I think there are a lot of people in the industry who are producers who are like. Like, who probably have that same thing of wanting to be. I think loads of people want to be the best. Yeah, whatever. But the popularity thing, it's definitely, like, held me back from.

[Jamie Laing]

From. So you were. You were nervous to do it because you were the fear of failure.

[Blue Nile Ad]

I guess so, yeah. But, you know, like, whereas I think also there's a level of, like, for you, you know, like kind of oblivion as well, of being like, I get.

[Jamie Laing]

Well, I don't have that fear.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Jamie Laing]

I'm lucky in that sense where fear. So I definitely think that fear holds us back from doing so much stuff. And I'm quite lucky where I never really had that. So, for example, when I was offered the Made in Chelsea show, right? Reality show, and I was like, 2122 at the time, every single person was like, don't do it. Oh, my God, you're this, you'll be that. It'll be a loser. All that kind of stuff. And I went, I don't really care what everyone thinks there really about it, but I care so much what people think. But actually, in that sense, I don't care because I think I'll be really good at that. So I always had a sense of, like, not being. Not doing stuff because I was scared to do it. And I think so many people do have that. That they won't do something because they're scared of failure or scared of not achieving something or scared that they're going to be judged.

[Blue Nile Ad]

It's a real barrier. But also when you just said that, you were like, I didn't care what people think, but I cared what people think. Like, you didn't care what your family thought, but you also. Cause you wanted. Do you see?

[Jamie Laing]

I care. I care what my friends and family think. I don't care what other people think so much.

[Blue Nile Ad]

But you didn't care what they thought of you doing Made in Chelsea?

[Jamie Laing]

No, I didn't care what my family thought.

[Blue Nile Ad]

It's interesting, like, there's a level of I really care what people think, but also throwing it in, like, the bin and being like, fuck it, I'm just gonna post this thing and I'm just gonna. I'm gonna take the opportunity.

[Jamie Laing]

Well, I think the worst Thing is, with, like, I've said this before, but I, I, I never forgot it. When I was 14 years old, I really fancied this girl. I fancied her so much. I've said this before, but I have to repeat it. I really fancy this girl. And we were sitting on the rocks and we were like chatting so much with each other and it was like the best night ever. And I'd fancied her for so long. And we then had this moment where we sat in silence and I didn't kiss her. Cause I was too nervous. And then three weeks later, I was like, why the hell didn't I just kiss her? That rejection I would have got or may not have got would have passed by now. I'd have been embarrassed for that moment, but it would have gone. And I had that moment to try it and I didn't do it. And I went. And honestly, in my head I went, well, I'm never gonna let that happen again. So I think, yeah, there's a real fear with, like, doing things like, I don't know, posting on social media or taking the job opportunity or asking for a pay rise or asking the person on a date. There's a fear of rejection there, for sure. That's only a fleeting moment. If you never actually do the sort of regret is worse 100%. And so what you should do is you should throw yourselves into situations. Because, yeah, it's scary within that moment, but actually that moment then passes. But the regret of not doing it, I think is a little bit worse. That's what I think.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Do you still get fear of. Is there anything that you're still fear of being rejected for?

[Jamie Laing]

My not so much rejected. I don't mind rejection because I've been rejected like a hell of a lot. Like, so much. I don't mind rejection. I mind. I have a real fear of being forgotten.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Okay, so what, what does forgotten like to, to who?

[Jamie Laing]

Well, yeah, I think I have a real fear of being forgotten. So. And forgotten means like, so that's what really drives me.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Okay.

[Jamie Laing]

That's my real drive, I would say. So doing something like Made in Chelsea is like a drug to someone like me. Because what happens is, is that you get. You're, you're seeking validation your entire life. And where does that come from? I don't know. Divorce or boarding school or whatever it is. But you're seeking validation the entire time. And the validation you think comes from everybody else, like cheering you on. So then doing a television show like Made in Chelsea, which was A reality show around yourself, you gain this sort of small popularity, and you think that's gonna, like, cure everything. And you're gonna be get this validation from so many people out there, and they're all, like, strangers. You don't even know them. But you think it's gonna cure everything, and it doesn't heal you at all. And so now what sort of drives me is the sense of being forgotten in a business sense. So not growing a business and people go, oh, wasn't it that guy who, like, tried to grow that sweet business and it didn't quite work? Or wasn't that guy who used to be on TV and then really didn't do anything? And so for me, it's like that sense of being forgotten by individuals that's still quite scary within me because I'm probably driving towards stuff more. It was for other people rather than myself, I suppose.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Also, that's an example of when fear is probably quite good.

[Jamie Laing]

What do you mean?

[Blue Nile Ad]

Your fear of being forgotten is propelling you to do things that you want to do.

[Jamie Laing]

Totally. Yeah, totally.

[Blue Nile Ad]

So, Jamie, we like to finish every episode with the same eight questions. Are you ready?

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Okay. Have you ever thought about the answers to this?

[Jamie Laing]

No, I'm just File them out.

[Blue Nile Ad]

I think about the answer to this all the time.

[Jamie Laing]

Okay, go for it.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Okay. What's a saying or a phrase that always makes you smile or cheer? Cheers you up?

[Jamie Laing]

Shall we have shots? So great, isn't it?

[Blue Nile Ad]

I love the energy of shots. There's no other drink where you're like.

[Jamie Laing]

And you're just like, look, drinking stuff I totally get is. But when someone says, let's have shots, and they do it in, like, a bit of a whisper, you're just like, let's go.

[Blue Nile Ad]

We're about to have a fun night.

[Jamie Laing]

And I don't think that will ever, ever leave me.

[Blue Nile Ad]

I love that.

[Jamie Laing]

Like, that. That is, like, the best. That's fun, man. It's the greatest.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Okay, what's the best compliment anyone's ever given?

[Jamie Laing]

Probably it's saying that I'm kind. That's probably a good one, isn't it?

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah, you are very kind. That is a good one. What scares you most about yourself?

[Jamie Laing]

My brain. That it would overpower me. It will overpower you. Yeah, it would. Like, it will just one day, just go, see ya. And it will go, yeah, that scares me.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Oh, fair.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah.

[Blue Nile Ad]

I actually think I'll die from madness.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah, that's kind of weird. Yeah, I worry about that.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Bit dark. Sorry. When was the last time you Cried and why? And don't say that bloody scarf commercial.

[Jamie Laing]

Oh, my God. Okay, when was actually the last time I cried and why? I. I don't really cry. Like, I. I hold a lot of emotion in me, I think. So whenever anyone is talking about proud things, that's when I cry. So, like, I watch a lot of things on Tick Tock, which are like military people coming home to their wives. That makes me cry a lot.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Oh, yeah. That's really amazing.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah. Like anything that's like that anywhere where I'm out to release emotion, which is not about me, I can cry. But if I really thought about stuff, I could probably cry.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Oh, really?

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah.

[Blue Nile Ad]

When was the last time you had a personal cry?

[Jamie Laing]

When I think about my parents not being around, that can make me quite sad.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah. You get really emotional when people talk about that.

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah. Yeah, that'd be really bad. That would not be fun. And like, not. Not saying things I want to say. Like, I can even do it now. Not saying the things I want to to my loved ones before they go. That would be awful.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Do you find it difficult to say those things?

[Jamie Laing]

Things, yeah. And so I now make sure that I, like, have sent messages to my parents or written them letters. I'm going to write letters for Christmas.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Really?

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah. Saying to them what I think about them.

[Blue Nile Ad]

I once. Me and my brother once wrote a card to my dad for his birthday and we were like, let's try and make him cry. And we gave him this card and watched him read it and he just, like, wept. And we were like, oh, no, it's actually too much. We were like, oh, God, we've really gone in.

[Jamie Laing]

No, this is not so good, actually.

[Blue Nile Ad]

But I find it. I. I feel exactly the same. And when I'm with my family, you know, just saying something like, this is really lovely to all be. I actually think I'm gonna be sick. I'm like, I can't say that.

[Jamie Laing]

I can't say that. Yeah. So, yeah, it's a lot not saying it, but thinking it. I can cry. Yeah.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah. What's something you can't let go of?

[Jamie Laing]

Probably the desire to entertain and to be loved. Yeah, fine.

[Blue Nile Ad]

That's fair. That's very fair. What's your guilty pleasure?

[Jamie Laing]

Guilty pleasure is bread, man.

[Blue Nile Ad]

That's not a guilty pleasure. It is.

[Jamie Laing]

Okay, Guilty.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Everyone likes bread. And also everyone who likes bread thinks they're unique in liking bread. Guys, Everyone likes bread.

[Jamie Laing]

Chick flicks. I love. Like, like. Yeah, chick flicks.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Which one?

[Jamie Laing]

Oh, like anything. Like, from mean girls to, like, 10 things I hate about you. Like all that vibe. Love it.

[Blue Nile Ad]

I mean, those are both great films. What turns you off?

[Jamie Laing]

Rudeness. Hate it.

[Blue Nile Ad]

And what turns you on?

[Jamie Laing]

Passion. And like, like anything. Passionate about anything. Like it could be about a piece of grass. Like, like passion about anything makes me go, yeah. Yes.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Okay. And what do you like most about yourself?

[Jamie Laing]

I like the, the way that I can make people feel comfortable in situations.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah, that's a great one. And bonus, your favourite swear word.

[Jamie Laing]

Shit.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Really?

[Jamie Laing]

Shit. Yeah, shit, shit, shit.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Very nice. Okay, Jamie Lang. Thank you very much.

[Jamie Laing]

Thank you very much. Bye. Bye.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Great.

[Jamie Laing]

So I ramble too much.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Probably I could talk to you for hours, but.

[Jamie Laing]

But hang on, but tell me, but be honest.

[Blue Nile Ad]

What do you think of interviewing you? Yeah, it's hard. It's really hard interviewing someone because I'm listening and I'm like, oh, interrupt. And I'm like, don't interrupt.

[Jamie Laing]

I mean, there was something that I definitely have not. Have I said stuff like that before?

[Blue Nile Ad]

I feel like I'm gonna need to listen back to it to know if we got.

[Jamie Laing]

I was definitely more honest than I've ever been.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Really?

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah, for sure. I, I. On other things, I hold back. Back.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Really?

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah. I definitely said things that I just haven't really spoken about. Well, like Made in Chelsea stuff and like my feelings and more.

[Blue Nile Ad]

And like, how did you find it?

[Jamie Laing]

So you were great.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Really?

[Jamie Laing]

Yeah. I actually find it really hard to talk about myself now.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah, I find it really hard.

[Jamie Laing]

I find it so hard.

[Blue Nile Ad]

But I'm the same in that I think I'm open, but when someone asks me, you know, I'm like, actually find it really hard to say, well, we.

[Jamie Laing]

Should say that if actually generally people want to hear more, we can maybe do a part two at some point.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Yeah. God, there's so many more questions.

[Jamie Laing]

And then maybe I should do.

[Blue Nile Ad]

And if you guys have more questions, send them in and I'll.

[Jamie Laing]

And maybe I should ask you.

[Blue Nile Ad]

You can do. I mean, I don't know if anyone's interested.

[Jamie Laing]

I think people are interested.

[Blue Nile Ad]

Maybe they are.

[Jamie Laing]

Guys, listen, if you want to get in touch, please do. We want to hear your thoughts. You can send us an email. Great company. @jampilproductions.co.uk or you can send us a DM@greatcompany podcast. We're also on YouTube and TikTok and everywhere as well. And please subscribe to the show because it makes so much difference to the show. I cannot tell you. Are you ready for next week?

[Blue Nile Ad]

I'm very excited for next week, so.

[Jamie Laing]

We'Ll see you next episode. Another episode of Great Company. You can trust podcasts to deliver results for your business. 80% of podcast listeners say they'll consider a brand recommendation by their favorite host. Even more impressive, 88% have taken action because of a podcast ad. If you're looking to connect with highly engaged audiences, now's the time to dive in. Download podcast Pulse 2024 for all the latest insights and see how podcast ads can drive real results for.