Grits and Eggs Podcast – Episode 96: Conversation with Kristian A. Smith

Host: Deante' Kyle
Guest: Kristian A. Smith (Public Theologian & Digital Pastor)
Release Date: October 28, 2025

Episode Overview

This episode brings Deante’ Kyle and the “public theologian and digital pastor” Kristian A. Smith together for an uninhibited conversation about religion, Black church culture, self-love, community, politics, and what it means to live with purpose beyond dogmatic boundaries. Both men draw from personal experience and scholarly backgrounds to analyze modern faith, community, and Black liberation—often with unfiltered, humorous, and strikingly honest takes.

Key Themes and Discussion Points

1. Upbringing, Black Church, and Street Realities

Timestamps: 00:36–03:38

• Conversation about growing up in Oakland, moving to San Diego, and dealing with gang culture—even in the church.
• Deante’ recalls how his first Bible study teacher was an ex-dealer and how “Bible talk” mixed with street wisdom pulled him into church.
• Memorable quote:
  • “The Baptist brims and the Christ Crips. Why is she gang banging in the church, bro?” – Deante’ (01:36)

Smith’s Reflection:

• Remembers being physically healed as a child after family prayed.
• “Those moments are powerful, man.” – Smith (03:38)

2. Church as Performance, Redemption, and the Reality Behind It

Timestamps: 04:41–08:34

• Both reflect on Black preaching as performance art and the emotional experience in church—how “redemption highs” from beating a charge last, but that feeling fades, and then things get “studious.”
• Importance of making deals with God: “Look, you get me out of this, I’m out the streets and in the church, and should I beat the charge? So I was like, okay, I gotta stay true to my word.” – Deante’ (07:00)
• The rare shared experience: “It’s a rare circumstance, I got two co-defendants. Nobody snitched, nobody went to prison.” – Deante’ (07:32)

3. Curiosity, Questioning, and Outgrowing Dogma

Timestamps: 09:09–11:37

• True curiosity is often unwelcome.
• Smith explains, “As long as you regurgitate what we told you to say and believe, and do it in a creative way...we gonna rock with you. You start pushing back...now we got a problem.” (10:34)
• Deante’ notes questioning is stifled, especially in spaces built around certainty.

4. Theology Beyond Borders and the Power of Openness

Timestamps: 11:38–15:25

• Smith clarifies: “My openness is to anything divine...For me, it’s just about what kind of person are you? ...Are you more committed to your doctrine? Which is where a lot of people, I believe, fall short.” (11:38)
• Life as a preacher’s kid:
  • “My dad was my pastor...he was like, yo, if you can avoid preaching, avoid it. This is thankless work a whole lot of times.” – Smith (12:24)
  • Experiences “the call” to preach in grad school, and the challenge to not just accept inherited theology, but to think critically about it (16:31).
• “Take those critical thinking skills and now apply them to your theology. And that was all she wrote.” – Smith (16:39)

5. Rejection of Conformity and Church Hurt

Timestamps: 17:06–21:04

• Deante' explains leaving church wasn’t about being “church hurt,” but realizing the “copy and paste” nature of most churches he visited.
• Recalls being thrust into preaching unexpectedly and being told by a Barnes & Noble stranger he’d be a pastor one day.

6. Ministry Outside the Pulpit & Reimagining the Black Church

Timestamps: 18:55–21:41

• Smith encourages Deante’, affirming that platforms like his podcast are ministry:
  • “You preaching every time you get on the mic. You’re just not doing it in a pulpit.” (19:00)
• Importance of reimagining church as a space of true communion, not dogma:
  • “We shouldn’t be gathered in dogmatic thought. We should be gathered in diversity of thought.” – Deante’ (20:10)

7. The Greatest Commandment & Radical Self-Love

Timestamps: 21:41–27:06

• Smith’s core theology is “love your neighbor as yourself”—and self-love is the assumed starting point:
  • “Love God and love your neighbor. That’s the greatest commandment. Love yourself is the greatest assumption.” – Smith (25:47)
• Discussion of RuPaul:
  • “RuPaul knows more about the gospel than most Christians, because...‘How the hell you gonna love somebody else if you don’t love yourself?’ That’s the gospel.” – Smith (25:45)
• Dogmatic churches demonize self-love, seeing it as pride, but Smith and Kyle unpack how that mindset keeps congregants “in check.”

8. Christian Identity, Jesus as Mascot, and Exploiting the Name

Timestamps: 27:06–31:53

• Smith rejects the Christian label:
  • “I’m a pastor who does not identify as a Christian. I identify as a spiritual humanist...Not because of Jesus, but more so because of his fan base.” (28:41)
• Critical distinction between the “name of Jesus” and the “way of Jesus”:
  • “Jesus is not a messiah for most Christians, he’s a mascot.” – Smith (29:34)
  • Discussion shifts to how institutions manipulate Christ’s name to justify bigotry and violence.

9. Liberation, Oppression, and Biblical Contradiction

Timestamps: 31:53–36:12

• Kyle challenges listeners: “If you treating your neighbor poorly, then you treating God poorly.” (23:50)
• Smith: “The entire theology revolves around your love for God is expressed in how you love your neighbor. Your love for your neighbor is a reflection of how you love yourself.” (26:33)
• Biblical stories provide both justifications for liberation and for genocide, depending on what you look for (36:12).
  • “If you looking for a message of liberation, you’ll find it...You looking for a message of genocide, it’s real easy to justify genocide in the Bible.” – Smith (36:12)

10. Dissonance, Nihilism, and Self-Purpose

Timestamps: 39:13–44:02

• Both men share experiences of leaving church and finding themselves confronted by fear, nihilism, and the struggle to reclaim purpose.
• Deante’: “Leaving the church for me...I started to realize I wasn’t living in so much fear.” (39:42)

11. Material Struggle, Finding the Faith Community

Timestamps: 43:15–47:12

• Smith: “You don't get the life you deserve. You get the life you demand.” (43:15)
• Story of founding the digital “faith community” from what started as a Bible study in Smith’s apartment.
• Deante’ expresses appreciation for Smith’s unique, nontraditional approach and the importance of community and representation.

12. Ancestor Veneration and Black Spiritual Practice

Timestamps: 47:12–52:48

• Powerful discussion of how Black Americans already practice ancestor veneration through family photos, chain pendants, and other rituals, even though the language scares many due to white supremacist demonization of African roots.
• Smith: “We’ve been doing ancestor veneration in so many different ways...” (49:06)
• Deante’ calls out how Black churches often “demonize” these ancestral connections out of fear of death and the afterlife.

13. Fear, Fundamentalism, and the Politics of Faith

Timestamps: 52:49–56:54

• Discussion on how Christianity, especially for Black people introduced via enslavement, weaponizes fear (51:20) and keeps believers in a mentality of bondage—spiritually and psychologically.

14. Liberation, Revolution, and Class Struggle

Timestamps: 61:07–74:40

• Nuanced conversation on capitalism, labor, strikes, and coordinated resistance.
• Importance of collective action over individualism: “Coordinated labor strikes would change everything.” – Smith (67:26)

15. Community, Digital Life vs Real Life, and Black Joy

Timestamps: 75:54–83:12

• Both men highlight how Black community and joy is inherently political and a form of resistance.
• The need to gather in real life and the limitations of digital-only community: “You can’t organize online. We live in...constant surveillance.” – Smith (78:39)

16. Radical Inclusion & Reimagining the Black Church

Timestamps: 83:12–113:25

• Smith’s ministry centers LGBTQ affirmation, women’s equity, and “disruptive, authentic, inclusive” values.
• Both agree: “If you were truly following the way of Jesus, you a revolutionary.” – Deante’ (100:43)
• On confronting sexual violence and reframing sexual ethics: “Consent, honesty, and mutuality. I don’t care who you have sex with as long as you’re consenting adults...” – Smith (88:23)
• Both express commitment to making church a space where no one has to leave parts of themselves outside, especially queer Black people and critical thinkers.

Notable Quotes & Moments

• On Black Preaching and Performance:

  • “Black preaching, this performance art, bruh.” – Kristian Smith (06:50)
  • “You coked out your mind. It’s like, yeah, yeah. And mon dudes hit you with the annoying oil. Oh, yeah. This is a real revelation, baby.” – Deante’ (03:11)

• On Liberation Theology:

  • “You can't do liberation theology and still be committed to that level of control.” – Smith (61:07)

• On the Greatest Commandment:

  • “Love your neighbor as yourself. We completely leave out self-love.” – Smith (24:03)

• On Ancestor Veneration:

  • “Anytime you go in your granny house and see all her relatives that have passed on sitting up...that’s an altar, bruh.” – Deante’ (48:51)

• On Black Joy:

  • “Joy is an act of resistance.” – Smith (103:17)

• On Disruptive Ministry:

  • “Part of our identity as a ministry: we are disruptive, authentic, inclusive.” – Smith (96:15)

• On Radical Self-Love:

  • “If you don’t love me, I’m gonna assume you don’t love yourself...and I don’t want to be around nobody don’t love theyself.” – Deante’ (24:12)

Additional Highlights

• Church Trauma & Transparency: Both are open about the prevalence of sexual abuse in Black churches and families, challenging the silence and demanding accountability.

• Digital vs Physical Community: Both advocate for real-world interactions as crucial for liberation and community-building.

• On Clergy & Capitalism: Discussion on the tension Black preachers face between pursuing financial stability and serving the community.

Timestamps for Key Segments

• Church and Streets Overlap – 00:36–03:38
• Performance & Redemption – 04:41–08:34
• Questioning Doctrine – 09:09–11:37
• Call to Ministry & Critical Thinking – 11:38–16:39
• Reimagining Church & Community – 18:55–21:41
• Self-Love Theology – 21:41–27:06
• Christianity & Jesus as Mascot – 27:06–31:53
• Liberation & Biblical Contradictions – 31:53–36:12
• Nihilism to Purpose – 39:13–44:02
• Ancestor Veneration Practices – 47:12–52:48
• Fear & Fundamentalism – 52:49–56:54
• Resistance & Labor Strikes – 61:07–74:40
• Community & Joy as Resistance – 75:54–83:12
• Radical Inclusion & Affirmation in Church – 83:12–113:25
• Sexual Ethics & Consent Talk – 87:44–93:59

Conclusion

The episode is a wide-ranging, deeply personal dialogue about the intersections of Blackness, faith, resistance, community, love, trauma, and liberation. Both men challenge listeners to love fearlessly, question boldly, build authentic community, and reclaim the radical, liberating roots of Black spirituality and Jesus’ example. For anyone grappling with religion, identity, or collective struggle, this conversation offers wisdom, levity, and hope.