Episode 6 - The Trial

Summary

Podcast Summary: Hands Tied – Episode 6: "The Trial"

Podcast: Hands Tied (iHeartPodcasts & BBC Studios)
Host: Maggie Robinson Katz
Date: September 10, 2025
Duration: ~41 min content

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Overview

This episode, "The Trial," immerses listeners in the dramatic courtroom proceedings surrounding the 2012 murder of Jim Melgar and the subsequent trial of his wife, Sandra "Sandy" Melgar. Host Maggie Robinson Katz unpacks both the prosecution’s and defense’s narratives through court transcripts, journalist commentary, and the unique reflections of a juror who served on the case. The story explores issues of motive, evidence, character, and investigative competency, ultimately zeroing in on the fundamental question: did Sandy Melgar murder her husband, or is she wrongfully accused?

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Juror Aaron Day’s Perspective

• Jury Selection & Impressions of Houston

  • Aaron Day, a juror, discusses Houston's diversity and his first exposure to the Melgar case.
  • He was intrigued by the prosecutor’s initial question:

  "Can you convict a person of murder with no motive?"
  (Juror Aaron Day, 04:59)

• Initial Impressions of Sandra Melgar

  • Saw Sandy as frail and ill, wondering, "How can this poor little sick lady commit murder?"
    (Juror Aaron Day, 19:09)
  • Noted his own struggle to reconcile Sandy’s physical limitations with the brutality of the crime.

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2. Courtroom Drama – The Prosecution’s Story

• Opening Statements (08:28 – 11:28)

  • Prosecutor Colleen Barnett (voice actor) lays out the state’s theory: Sandy murdered Jim by luring him into a vulnerable position, stabbing him, and staging the scene to look like a break-in.
  • She argues Sandy’s medical claims (about not hearing the attack due to a noisy Jacuzzi and her seizure disorder) are not credible.

• Reconstruction of the Crime Scene (15:01 – 17:34)

  • The prosecution uses video evidence to show how Sandy could have trapped herself in a closet and staged the chair against the door.
  • Demonstrates in court how someone could tie their own hands behind their back and slip free easily, suggesting Sandy could have faked being restrained.

  “The prosecution was able to demonstrate to the jury that you can bind your hands behind your back and make it look convincingly real…”
  (Juror Aaron Day, 17:34)

• Motive Speculations (23:12 – 24:15)

  • Financial: Jim's life insurance ($500,000)
  • Religious: Sandy (a devout Jehovah’s Witness) couldn’t divorce without social ostracization, but might benefit from becoming a widow.

  “If I kill him and nobody finds out, I'm not ostracized and nobody finds out and I still get the money.”
  (Prosecutor Colleen Barnett [actor], 24:00)

• Physical Feasibility

  • Sandy’s alleged ill health is challenged: medical records suggest her conditions (epilepsy, lupus) were stable.
  • Stab wounds were not particularly deep, making it plausible for Sandy to have committed the act, per the prosecution.

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3. Defense Strategy – Raising Doubt

• Critique of Police Investigation (28:10 – 31:37)

  • Defense attorney Max Seacrest calls it “the worst investigated case I’ve ever seen” (28:10), emphasizing mishandled evidence and police tunnel vision.
  • Bloody thumbprint on the safe wasn't analyzed. Police assumed it was Sandy’s, never tested for DNA (29:06).
  • Emails and search histories showed no evidence of premeditation or signs of a troubled marriage.

  “What’s startling is when you examine Sandy’s hands, there was no trauma to her hands... she had 10 beautiful fingernails. No breaks, no chips, no cracks.”
  (Max Seacrest, 30:15)

• Physical & Forensic Evidence

  • No blood, injuries, or signs of struggle on Sandy.
  • Crime scene showed no forced entry, but Sandy said the garage door might have been left open (33:07).
  • The defense argues police failed to investigate the possibility of an outside intruder.
  • Juror Aaron Day remained unconvinced:

  "If you go to somebody's house to rob them, why would you murder one and leave another tied up in a closet?"
  (Juror Aaron Day, 33:27)

• Sandy’s Police Interrogation (34:14 – 37:12)

  • The prosecution argued Sandy was evasive and unemotional; the defense countered she was traumatized and not misleading.
  • Notable exchange when Sandy ultimately asks for a lawyer after repeated, emotional questioning.

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4. Credibility of Lead Detective

• Detective Carrizel’s Conduct & Firing (38:04 – 38:48)

  • Revealed in court that Detective Sean Carrizel, who led the investigation, had been fired for forging a search warrant and dishonesty in another case.
  • Journalist Amanda Orr reacts:

  “Everything about this investigation is called into question.”
  (Amanda Orr, 38:28)

• Juror Aaron Day reflects compassionately:

  “Yeah, nobody’s perfect, Maggie.”
  (Juror Aaron Day, 38:56)

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5. Closing Arguments & Jury Deliberations

• Both sides reiterate their stories, and the ultimate question of guilt or innocence is left for the jury—who are left deep in debate over the complexity and ambiguities of the case.
• Host Maggie Robinson Katz sharpens the tension:

  “Sandra Melgar’s fate lies in their hands.”
  (Narrator, 39:48)

• Juror Aaron Day:

  “I want to believe somebody’s innocent until the state can prove them guilty. And then we all went back in the room, kind of like, okay, where do we start?”
  (Juror Aaron Day, 39:52)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Motive:

  “Can you convict a person of murder with no motive?”
  (Prosecutor’s voir dire, 04:59)

• On Crime Scene Demo:

  “She could have shut herself in the closet, put the chair on a piece of fabric… then crouch down and pull… locking herself in.”
  (Narrator, 16:01)

• On Defense’s Core Argument:

  “It’s the worst investigated case I’ve ever seen.”
  (Max Seacrest, 28:10)

• On Forensic Oversights:

  “There was actually a bloody thumbprint on a safe in the closet... they didn’t bother to analyze it.”
  (Max Seacrest, 28:45)

• On the Prosecution’s Challenge with Motive:

  “I don’t know that I have motive here, but there’s no other way... other than she just brutally murdered her husband.”
  (Prosecutor Colleen Barnett [actor], 10:54)

• On Sandy’s Interrogation:

  “That’s it. I need a lawyer. I’m not talking anymore because you guys are just trying to torture me here.”
  (Sandy Melgar, 36:50)

• Juror’s Final Reflection:

  “I want to believe somebody’s innocent until the state can prove them guilty...”
  (Juror Aaron Day, 39:52)

---

Timestamps for Important Segments

| Time | Segment | |----------|-------------| | 04:11 | Introduction to Juror Aaron Day | | 06:16 | Journalist Amanda Orr’s first impression of Sandy | | 08:20 | Prosecution opening statement | | 15:01 | Presentation of crime scene video | | 16:36 | Prosecution’s demo on self-binding | | 18:09 | Defense counters self-binding demonstration | | 19:09 | Juror’s doubts about Sandy’s physical ability | | 21:16 | Discussion of Sandy’s medical history & defense argument | | 23:12 | Prosecution outlines possible motives | | 28:10 | Defense: critique of police investigation | | 29:06 | Bloody thumbprint and forensic failures | | 30:15 | Lack of physical evidence on Sandy | | 33:07 | Sandy’s statement about the open garage door | | 34:14 | Sandy’s police interview reviewed | | 38:04 | Lead detective’s credibility questioned | | 39:52 | Start of jury deliberations |

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Final Thoughts

Episode 6 draws listeners directly into the tension and ambiguities of the Melgar trial. The clash between the state’s circumstantial narrative, the frailty and trauma claimed by the defendant, the questionable thoroughness of police work, and ultimately, the enigma of motive set the stage for a jury’s agonizing responsibility. Through juror interviews, court transcript performances, and expert analysis, the episode lays bare the gray areas and lingering doubts that come to define cases like this—leaving the audience, and the jury, with haunting questions about guilt, evidence, and justice.

Transcript

[Podcast Host]

This is an iHeart podcast.

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[Juror Aaron Day]

Are you playing me off?

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

That's what's happening, right?

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[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

Offer first 3 months only, then full price plan options available, taxes and fees extra. C mintmobile.com BBC Studios hey, it's Maggie. Just a quick heads up before we begin. This episode does contain some pretty detailed descriptions of violence and Deals with adult themes. Tell me a little bit about Houston. I've never been there. What's it like?

[Juror Aaron Day]

Houston is the most diverse town in the state of Texas. Very, very ethnic friendly. Lots of culture, lots of restaurants.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

It might not sound like it, but I've been desperate to talk to this guy ever since I started working on this story.

[Juror Aaron Day]

It's a nice little part of southeast Texas that nobody considers to be Texas.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

He has a unique insight.

[Juror Aaron Day]

We like to go out and test different restaurants. Sometimes we have Thai food, and sometimes it's, you know, the steakhouses that serve excellent food.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

And his opinion really counts.

[Juror Aaron Day]

There's plenty of Tex Mex, and there's even variations of Tex Mex. So you can go in one restaurant, ah, have a Tex Mex, and then something. Next week will be a little bit different. I think we have the most cultural influence, but although the country is getting more and more culturally influenced by Hispanic America. So that's always good.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

Totally. I'm with you. It has taken me hours and hours of searching online and dozens of phone calls to find Aaron Day. Tell me why we are talking to you today.

[Juror Aaron Day]

You want to know my take on the Sandra Melgar murder trial?

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

Do you still think about the case?

[Juror Aaron Day]

Oh, yeah. It will never leave me.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

Aaron Day, he was one of the jurors in the State of Texas v. Sandra Jean Melgar.

[Juror Aaron Day]

It's part of my life, part of my history. I got called into something I didn't want, but I was asked to do it. I did it because that's my civil responsibility.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

Starting at the beginning. I'd love to talk a little bit about the jury selection process.

[Juror Aaron Day]

Oh, yeah.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

In the vordi voir dire, which, again, I'm sure Erin and I are pronouncing 100% correctly, is when prospective jurors are assessed on whether they can be truly impartial or not.

[Juror Aaron Day]

I remember this as far as the prosecutor's first words. She said, welcome, ladies and gentlemen, to Vardai. I have one question I want you to think about. Can you convict a person of murder with no motive? I answered that question. Yeah. I think, you know, if there's evidence, we should be able to convict. If we can't and the evidence isn't prevalent enough, then we won't convict. That's what our legal system is all about.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

And what did you think of that question when she asked?

[Juror Aaron Day]

It was really unusual that. Well, I knew it would be an unusual trial.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

A woman found tied up and trapped in a closet, her hands tied, the door jammed shut from the outside. On trial for stabbing her husband to death without a motive. I'm Maggie Robinson Katz and from BBC Studios and I Heart podcasts, this is Hands Tied, Episode six. Six the Trial.

[Journalist Amanda Orr]

When Sandra Melgar walked into the courtroom, she was walking with a cane and I was struck by how petite she is and her delicate features.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

That's Amanda Orr, a journalist covering the case for Reuters.

[Journalist Amanda Orr]

She had a shock of whitish gray hair that was about shoulder length. She was wearing glasses and she didn't seem like a big hulking woman that would have been physically capable of overcoming a grown man.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

Amanda joins her fellow spectators, the media, law students and your casual gawkers, all cramped onto the uncomfortable wooden benches waiting for the show to start.

[Journalist Amanda Orr]

Murder trials are some of the greatest dramas any human can witness. It's really a fascinating thing to behold. The greatest lawyers know that winning a jury over is about presenting the facts in a way that engages them. And so attorneys are tasked with the job of being storytellers. Whoever tells the best story wins.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

One of those storytellers is the silver haired defense attorney Max Seacrest. He's also joined by his niece and protege, Allison Seacrest. Max dressed in a dark somber suit and wears round tortoiseshell glasses while Allison sports an understated linen suit, pearls, her long hair pulled back. Telling another story is prosecutor Colleen Barnett, a confident woman with a shoulder length blonde bob and a sharp suit. We tried to get Colleen for this podcast but we didn't get a response. So what comes next are her words taken from the court transcript spoken by an actor.

[Prosecutor Colleen Barnett (actor)]

You're going to hear testimony that Jaime's brother knocked on the front door and didn't get an answer.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

This is Colleen's opening statement.

[Prosecutor Colleen Barnett (actor)]

You're going to hear testimony that when he went into the house, he found his brother's body in his brother's closet brutally stabbed to death. Multiple stab wounds on his chest and his neck. He went into another part of the house where he found Sandra Melgar in her closet with her hands tied behind her back and her ankles wrapped. She was in her closet in the bathroom and there was a chair on the outside of the bathroom door wedged up against the door. The police were called immediately.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

Colleen tells the jury how she thinks Jim died.

[Prosecutor Colleen Barnett (actor)]

We're going to show you that what we believe happened is that she enticed Jaime into some type of maybe some sexual liaison or something that she was going to do, made him sit in.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

The chair, then Sandy stabbed him to death. She says she warns the jury not to believe the story. The Defense is going to tell that.

[Prosecutor Colleen Barnett (actor)]

There was a burglar there. What we're going to be able to show you is that there was no way for any burglar to enter that house. There was no reason for anybody to have anything to do against Jaime. He was a loved person at his work and in the neighborhood. There was no vendetta from anybody.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

Colleen thinks Sandy could have made it to look like a break in to cover her tracks. She tells the jury to not trust Sandy about her health, about her relationship with Jim, and about her version of events the night Jim died.

[Prosecutor Colleen Barnett (actor)]

And I didn't hear anything because the Jacuzzi was going. And that's broken, by the way. And I can't turn it off if I wanted to because it's broken. And the noise was so loud from the Jacuzzi that I couldn't hear my husband getting stabbed. Couldn't hear it.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

So if this were a courtroom TV drama, we could maybe see Colleen make her way to the jury, looking each of them intently in the eye. Maybe she'd rest her hand on the wooden divider separating the jury from the rest of the court because this is her moment, the crescendo of her opening argument.

[Prosecutor Colleen Barnett (actor)]

We believe that we're going to be able to prove this case to you beyond a reasonable doubt. Don't know that I have motive here, but there's no other way any other thing could have happened other than she just brutally murdered her husband.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

Again, continuing my imagined version of what she did. Colleen pauses, ensuring that the jury heard those last words that she, Sandy, brutally murdered her husband.

[Prosecutor Colleen Barnett (actor)]

Thank you.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

She thanks the jury and takes her seat. But even if they accept that Sandy enticed her husband into a sexual liaison before murdering him, how is that possible when Sandy was found trapped in a closet, her hands and feet tied?

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[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

A video is played in court. The shaky handheld camera pans across the disheveled bedroom belonging to Jim and Sandy Melgar. This is the video the police took the night of Jim's murder, capturing the scene of the crime. The room is a mess, the bed sheets, rumpled, clothes everywhere. The camera moves into the bathroom, where we see the remnants of their celebratory evening drinks set on the edge of the Jacuzzi. A tub of cream with the strawberry perched on top. Then we see a gloved hand pull a white satin chair in front of the closet door.

[Prosecutor Colleen Barnett (actor)]

The sheriff's department did a video showing you can be on the inside of the bathroom and pull the rug so the chair wedges up against the door. They can show you that that can happen, that she could have done that, and that is what she did to Colleen.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

This video is proof that Sandy could have shut herself in the closet, put the chair on a piece of fabric, making sure that half of it was outside and the other half inside. Cindy could have cracked the door slightly, just enough to place her hand on the top of the chair, making sure it hooks underneath the door handle, close the door, then crouch down and pull the part of the chair that is inside of the closet towards her, causing the chair to be set in place. Locking herself in. This theory clicked for juror Aaron Day.

[Juror Aaron Day]

And they showed how you could pull that chair with a rug underneath it to make it look like the door was actually blocked so a person couldn't get out. So that was like, oh, okay, that makes sense.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

But how could she have done all of that when she was found with her hands tied behind her back? Well, Colleen has an answer for that, too. Sandy tied herself up. Colleen stands before the jury and takes out a piece of fabric, its ends tied together. She methodically loops it around one of her wrists in a figure 8 pattern. Then, with both hands behind her back, she twists the material around the other wrist, holding her forearms parallel with each other, each hand gripping the opposite elbow. The binding looks tight around her wrists, but Colleen shows she can easily slip her hands free. So Sandy could have tied her own hands behind her back.

[Juror Aaron Day]

The prosecution was able to demonstrate to the jury that you can bind your hands behind your back and make it look convincingly real and not have anybody actually tie you up. So that was the big thing for me, is like, well, okay, yeah, I guess you can bite yourself.

[Defense Attorney Max Seacrest]

Only problem was, that wasn't the way that Sandy was tied up. That was not at all consistent with the testimony of the only two witnesses who saw her tied up.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

To Mac, Sandy's defense attorney. Colleen's demo doesn't match with what actually happened.

[Defense Attorney Max Seacrest]

She wasn't tied at the wrist. She was tied with her arms behind her back. The ligatures ran from her wrist up, basically to below her elbow. And when you look at the crime scene unit photographs of Sandy's arms, guess what? She has red Marks consistent with that on her arms.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

So if you remember, Sandy was cut free by her brother in law, Herman, and his wife before the police arrived. Herman gives evidence in court to say her arms were bound so tightly behind her back that he couldn't untie the knots and. And needed scissors to cut her free. While Erin may be convinced of Colleen's arguments, there's another question that looms across the entire trial.

[Juror Aaron Day]

How can this poor little sick lady commit murder? When I saw Sandra, I was surprised by the picture she portrayed of her physical being.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

And can you say a little bit more about that? What does that mean?

[Juror Aaron Day]

She walked with a cane. When she walked into the courtroom, I immediately questioned that she couldn't have done it because she looked so frail and unhealthy the way she presented herself.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

But prosecutor Colleen Barnett argues that it didn't matter how strong or how frail Sandy might have been because she believes Sandy planned the whole thing and took Jim completely by surprise.

[Prosecutor Colleen Barnett (actor)]

So she gets Jaime to sit down in the chair, and maybe she's massaging his neck or whatever, I don't know what. And then she pulls it out. And then while he isn't looking, she makes a strike straight up all the way to his neck. That's what the first strike is. Jaime, of course, gets up to try to defend himself, turns around, and that's when she gets him on the thumb, and that's when the blood starts spurting out onto the chair. This was the first strike. And then she had him. There was no place for him to go. As you saw, there's only two feet wide and not that deep. He was just stabbed to death. She had the knife.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

Colleen points out that Jim wasn't a big guy. At 5 foot 7, he was a bit taller than Sandy, but she's heavier than his, 125 pounds. And the stab wounds weren't particularly deep, three inches at most. Which gets juror Arenday thinking it made.

[Juror Aaron Day]

Sense that she didn't have to be superwoman or strong or any of those other things you would think a murderer would have to do to murder somebody.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

But there's also the matter of Sandy's health. She's had her hips replaced, has epilepsy and lupus. And ever since her police interview, she has pointed to her health as a possible explanation for not knowing what happened the night Jim was killed. Sandy suspects she had a seizure and blacked out.

[Prosecutor Colleen Barnett (actor)]

I want to go into that.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

Colleen has her medical records from Sandy's primary care doctor and asks a witness to read them to the court.

[Prosecutor Colleen Barnett (actor)]

Under seizure disorder, what does it say?

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

That she was stable, reads the witness. Sandy's medical records show that despite fairly regular checkups, she hasn't reported having a single seizure in the four years before Jim's murder. According to Colleen, yes, Sandy had a condition that could cause seizures, but it was stable, controlled by medication. Sandy hadn't felt good. She had been resting a lot. She had been experiencing auras, which are mini seizures. Defense attorney Allison Seacrest argues that those medical records don't tell the full story or reflect Sandy's health in the months before Jim's death.

[Juror Aaron Day]

If she's using her illnesses and she's saying she conveniently had a seizure and then a blackout for 12 hours when her drugs were supposedly controlling these things and she was not complaining to her doctors, maybe she did blackout, but I can't find any evidence that she did.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

Over 10 days. Colleen tears into Sandy's claim of innocence. Colleen tells the court that she was unhappy, plotted the whole thing, and locked herself in the closet and tied her own hands. The only thing that is missing is why? Why would Sandy do this?

[Prosecutor Colleen Barnett (actor)]

When I vore dyered you guys, one of the things that I was a little worried about was motive, because I showed you the things we have to prove, and we've proven all of them. We've proven all of them, but motive is not one of them. And one of the things that I worried about was being able to establish that.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

She offers the jury a theory or two. The first is the classic. Jim had life insurance policies worth some half a million dollars.

[Prosecutor Colleen Barnett (actor)]

She'd be getting a lot of of money.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

The second is religion. Colleen argues that as a devout Jehovah's Witness, Sandy couldn't divorce Jim without being ostracized.

[Prosecutor Colleen Barnett (actor)]

But if I kill him and nobody finds out, I'm not ostracized and nobody finds out and I still get the money.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

I can imagine Colleen locking eyes with the jury, ensuring that her last words are heard clearly.

[Prosecutor Colleen Barnett (actor)]

Clearly, there's zero evidence. Zero evidence. Zero evidence that somebody else did this. No evidence that anybody else did this. She's guilty, ladies and gentlemen. She's guilty. Please find her.

[Podcast Host]

So.

[Prosecutor Colleen Barnett (actor)]

Thank you.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

Now it's the defense's turn to take the stage to try and convince the jury that the prosecution has got it all wrong and Sandy is innocent.

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[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

When it's the defense's turn to address the jury and defend Sandy, Max Seacrest makes a big decision. He doesn't call Sandy to the stand. Instead, he relies on a very simple but powerful argument.

[Defense Attorney Max Seacrest]

It's the worst investigated case I've ever seen, he says.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

The only reason Sandy is on trial is because the police failed to do their job properly.

[Defense Attorney Max Seacrest]

They had an agenda, they weren't objective and they jumped to conclusions and they were sloppy. They assumed. It's the old rubric that if two people are married and one of them's dead, then the other one must have done it. And that pretty much what propelled the entire investigation from the get go.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

He claims potentially crucial evidence slipped through the cracks.

[Defense Attorney Max Seacrest]

There was actually a bloody thumbprint on a safe in the closet where Jaime was found.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

Mack tells the jury that this is the bloody smear that Liz noticed when she was packing up her old house. When she's called as a witness, Liz tells the court she sent a photo of the bloody mark to the police and they told her it had already been processed.

[Defense Attorney Max Seacrest]

And guess what? They didn't bother to analyze it. In fact, one of the detectives said that it had been analyzed when in fact, it never had been.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

The crime scene investigator tells the court that his team had spotted the blood, but they didn't swab it for DNA or dust the safe for prints. When asked on the stand why, he says, because we assume assumed it was Sandy's blood.

[Defense Attorney Max Seacrest]

So, I mean, again, this is indicative of what we're dealing with.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

According to Mac and his fellow defense attorney, Allison Seacrest, the police cherry picked evidence that suited their case and ignored anything that didn't like the fact that forensic analysis of the Melgar's phones and computers and a keyword search for rope, knot, stab, crime scene and murder revealed nothing. And according to friends, family and neighbors, the Melgars had a healthy relationship. There was no evidence of any kind of infidelity or animosity between the pair. Sandra and Jim had a really loving relationship. Then there's the lack of physical evidence linking Sandy to the murder.

[Defense Attorney Max Seacrest]

Jim died in a brutal, savage attack. At least 51 sharp force and blunt force injuries, 31 what we call sharp force trauma. He had all the hallmarks of someone who'd been beaten to death. What's startling is when you examine Sandy's hands, there was no trauma to her hands. It's very, very common in Stabbing cases that if I'm holding a knife and I start to stab you and I stab you and I stab you, it's going to produce a lot of blood. And it's very typical that that blood will cause your hand to slip and the assailant will likely cut his or her own hand by, you know, repeatedly wielding a bloody instrument. In Sandy's case, the inside of her hands. No cuts at all. And Amazingly, she had 10 beautiful fingernails. No breaks, no chips, no cracks. And yet she supposedly brutally worked him over, including hitting him with her fist.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

Jim's autopsy report details fractured pictures to his skull, bruises on his head, shoulders, torso, arms and legs, and notes that there was internal bleeding linked to some of those bruises.

[Defense Attorney Max Seacrest]

Because of the 51 plus blunt and sharp force injuries, it was agreed to by all sides that the assailant would be covered in blood. There was no blood found on Sandy at all. There was no blood found on any of Sandy's clothing at all. All the examination of her fingernails and the DNA under her fingernails, no blood at all.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

And there was no evidence of a cleanup. To the defense, this proves Sandy didn't kill Jim and makes them quick question why the police so quickly discounted the theory of a robbery gone wrong. They seemed to believe that there was no obvious signs of a break in. No windows broken, no doors knocked in, so no robbery. I think she was the only suspect because these officers rushed to judgment and made up their mind that because there was no forced entry into the house that it had to have been Sandy. But there is 1, 1 key sign the police may have overlooked. Sandy told the detectives in her interrogation that the garage door could have been left open.

[Defense Attorney Max Seacrest]

The garage was open when the family arrived and was able to enter the house through the unlocked interior door. So that's how Herman got into the house. And we believe, of course, that's how the intruders got into the house.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

To juror Aaron Day, though, this argument doesn't add up.

[Juror Aaron Day]

My thought process was, yes, the garage door may have been open, but if you go to somebody's house to rob them, why would you murder one and leave another one tied up in a closet? It just didn't make sense that the defense says this was a robbery gone bad and Parson got killed.

[Podcast Host]

It's Sunday, December 23rd, 2012. This is Sean Kerrizo with Harris County Sheriff's Office, Homicide 60 Henry 42. The current time is 9:42pm okay, ma', am, can you identify yourself for me? Sandra Milgar.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

One part of the story that I Can't quite shake. Is Sandy's interview with the police the night she was found, if you remember. She's distressed. Can't remember details.

[Podcast Host]

We went out to eat. Okay. Where'd Jungle eat at? It's a Mexican restaurant. I think it was Provos or. And what time was that? No, it wasn't Tom Braavos. It was Cuckoos. Cuckoos? I'm gonna say about eight. I mean, I'm just guessing. I don't know. Okay, so approximately 8:00'. Clock. Mm.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

How will this tape play in court? To the prosecution, Sandy's behavior proves she's dodgy. She's evasive, unclear. She seems numb, detached. And when she cries, they don't see tears.

[Defense Attorney Max Seacrest]

Are you covering something up, Sandy?

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

No.

[Podcast Host]

Why would you take a polygraph? Because I'm so stressed right now, I can't even think straight. It's not a good reason. Well, I just don't want it used against me, that's all. I'll take it. But not just. Why would we have to use it against you? Because I'm stressed. And, I mean, I just.

[Defense Attorney Max Seacrest]

Because you're stressed.

[Podcast Host]

Beyond that, she was making them angry.

[Juror Aaron Day]

Because she wouldn't answer questions. You know, she would avoid eye contact. She would avoid. And she would mumble, and she wasn't shedding tears of emotion.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

But the defense call an expert witness, a former police investigator who's reviewed the interview. He tells the court he didn't see any sign that Sandy was trying to mislead the officers or that they ever considered. She was traumatized and the victim of a serious crime.

[Podcast Host]

Could you hear him screaming? I didn't hear anything. I mean, he was in pain. We know that he suffered a lot. I need you to help me. I need you to help me. I need you to help me on this. Help me, Sandra. Help me. Tell me. Your husband's a nice guy. He went through a lot of pain. Help me. Did you hear anything? Stop already. I need help. Santa. I need help. Help me. That's it. That's it. I need a lawyer. I'm not talking anymore because you guys are just trying to torture me here.

[Defense Attorney Max Seacrest]

We wanted the jury to hear her suggesting that maybe she ought to get a lawyer, because obviously, the tenor of the questioning was absolutely unfair.

[Juror Aaron Day]

So the minute you said, I want to stop and see a lawyer, they should have stopped. So that's really where I blame the investigators, the interrogators.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

Immediately after that police interview, Detective Carousel contacts the district Attorney's office to try and charge Sandy. However, the DA Refuses, saying they need more evidence.

[Defense Attorney Max Seacrest]

Here's a guy that even before they know the analysis of what the DNA may show, hours before the crime scene people had left the scene, he's trying to get murder charges filed.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

Mack wants the jury to see this as yet another example of a biased and narrow approach by the police. But Detective Sean Carrizel says he was just keeping the DA Informed.

[Juror Aaron Day]

No wonder why they were suspicious at the onset. And that's what I give the police credit for being suspicious that they had their murderer and they didn't need to do more investigations.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

Mac then reveals his trump card. Detective Sean Kelly Carrizel has been fired. Two of Sean Carrizel's former colleagues tell the court that his work on a previous case was sloppy and that he's not truthful. For journalist Amanda Orr listening to this in court, it's a slam dunk.

[Journalist Amanda Orr]

The fact that the lead detective had been fired and the fact that there were testimonies that the lead detective had been untruthful and other investigations would have been enough for me as a juror to say that everything about this investigation is called into question.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

But she's not on the jury. Aaron is, and he's more, well, forgiving.

[Juror Aaron Day]

Yeah, nobody's perfect, Maggie.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

The jury aren't told the full story about why Shawn was Carrizel was fired, only that there was an issue over a search warrant. But the truth is he forged a search warrant in another case and lied about it. We reached out to Sean Carrizel for the story, but he didn't respond to our questions. Closing arguments have just wrapped up in the case against a woman accused of.

[Juror Aaron Day]

Murdering her husband and then trying to cover it up.

[Journalist Amanda Orr]

I told Colleen Barnahan that she did the best she could.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

Sandy couldn't have done it, and the evidence is so clear. But members of the media watching in court didn't seem so sure. Yes, Bill. Well, the prosecutor arguing very strongly that Sandra Melgar did murder her husband.

[Journalist Amanda Orr]

Now it's up to the jury.

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

Sandra Melgar's fate lies in their hands.

[Juror Aaron Day]

Well, I tried to keep her open. I want to believe somebody's innocent until the state can prove them guilty. And then we all went back in the room, kind of like, okay, where do we start?

[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

You've been listening to Hands Tied, a new eight part true crime series from BBC Studios and I Heart podcast. New episodes will be released weekly, so subscribe or follow on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts so you don't miss out. If you like the show, please help us by spreading the word or giving us a five star review. I'm Maggie Robinson Katz and the producer is Maggie Latham. Sound design and mix is by Tom Brignell. Our score script consultant is Emma Weatherall. Production support is from Dan Marchini, Elena Boateng and Mabel Finnegan Wright and our production executive is Laura Jordan Rowell. The series was developed by Anya Saunders and emma Shaw. At iHeart, the managing executive producer is Christina Everett and for BBC Studios the executive Producer is Joe Kent. James James Cook is the Creative Director of Factual for BBC Studios Audio and the Director of Audio at BBC Studios is Richard Knight.

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[Defense Attorney Max Seacrest]

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[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

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[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

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[Narrator / Maggie Robinson Katz]

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[Podcast Host]

This is an iHeart podcast.