Podcast Episode Summary: "Handsome" - Penn Jillette Asks About the Placebo Effect

Episode Information:

• Title: Penn Jillette asks about the placebo effect
• Host/Author: Headgum
• Release Date: January 14, 2025

Introduction to the Episode

In this engaging episode of Handsome, hosts Mae Martin, Fortune Feimster, and Tig Notaro delve into the intriguing topic of the placebo effect, prompted by a thoughtful question from renowned magician and entertainer Penn Jillette. The conversation seamlessly blends scientific insights with personal anecdotes, humor, and candid discussions about belief and mental well-being.

Penn Jillette's Question: Understanding the Placebo Effect

The episode pivots around a question posed by Penn Jillette, who draws parallels between the placebo effect and magic tricks:

• Penn Jillette [35:14]: "Scientists have shown the placebos work even when the subject knows it's a placebo... What do you have in your life that you know is bullshit, that you know is not true, and yet you believe in it, and it helps you?"

Penn challenges the hosts to reflect on the personal "placebos" they use—beliefs or practices they recognize as non-substantive but find beneficial.

Defining the Placebo Effect

The hosts explore the nuances of the placebo effect, discussing how belief alone can manifest tangible improvements in one's well-being:

• Fortune Feimster [39:15]: "If you mentally feel better, then it can have effects on you physically."

• Mae Martin [39:19]: "I'm staying at the wrong hotels, you know." (Referring to comfort foods and routines as personal placebos)

Hosts' Personal Placebos

Each host shares their unique "placebo," revealing how these beliefs or habits aid their mental and emotional health:

1. Tig Notaro:

   • Health and Diet: Tig discusses his commitment to a nutrient-dense diet, attributing significant improvements in pain management and overall well-being to his dietary changes, even acknowledging that not all benefits may be scientifically verifiable.
     • Tig Notaro [47:02]: "I feel so much better, and I can't say enough about it."
   • Praying During Illness: Reflecting on his experience in 2012, Tig mentions how praying during a critical illness served as a mental placebo that contributed to his recovery.
     • Tig Notaro [47:02]: "I was praying, and I had never done that before, and I felt like it was going to help me."

2. Fortune Feimster:

   • Pet as a Placebo: Fortune credits her pet, Jax, as her primary placebo, highlighting the emotional comfort and stress relief Jax provides.
     • Fortune Feimster [44:54]: "Jax is my placebo."
   • Superstitions and Rituals: While Fortune explores minimal superstitions, she acknowledges the calming effect of certain rituals, like preparing comfort foods.
     • Fortune Feimster [48:52]: "I eat pad Thai. That makes me feel better."

3. Mae Martin:

   • Journaling and Mindfulness: Mae shares her practices of journaling and naming countries as techniques to manage stress and maintain mental clarity.
     • Mae Martin [10:37]: "I like to do that."
   • Comfort Foods: Similar to Fortune, Mae finds solace in familiar and comforting foods, serving as her personal placebo.
     • Mae Martin [48:52]: "I eat pad Thai. That's not a placebo. That's truly comforting."

Belief, Magic, and Placebos

The conversation takes an intriguing turn as the hosts liken the placebo effect to magic tricks, emphasizing the power of belief:

• Mae Martin [38:21]: "Crystals or like... spells... weird shit that I read about just for fun."

• Tig Notaro [36:53]: Reflecting on magic performances, Tig draws parallels between the illusion of magic and the mental constructs of placebos.

  • "It's fascinating... how do they do it?"

This comparison underscores the idea that the efficacy of a placebo may stem from the belief in its power, much like the audience's belief in the magic trick's illusion.

Confronting Skepticism and Embracing Personal Truths

Penn Jillette's question also touches on the balance between skepticism and personal belief. The hosts discuss the importance of finding what resonates personally, regardless of external validation:

• Tig Notaro [52:37]: Emphasizes the need for a "North Star" belief system to sustain a healthy lifestyle.

  • "You have to be really, really sold on what your North Star is."

• Fortune Feimster [50:34]:

  • "I drink my green juice and I'm like, I'm so healthy right now."

This segment highlights how personal beliefs and practices, even if partially unfounded, can lead to positive behavioral changes and self-improvement.

The Intersection of Placebos and Daily Life

The discussion extends to everyday habits and how they serve as modern-day placebos:

• Mae Martin [46:17]: Mentions vitamins as a potential placebo.

  • "Maybe vitamins. Like, you know, they're like vitamins. You just pee them out."

• Fortune Feimster [46:23]: Links comfort foods to genuine emotional support rather than placebo.

  • "That's truly my comfort food."

This exploration differentiates between behaviors that merely provide comfort and those that actively contribute to well-being through belief-driven mechanisms.

Conclusion: Embracing Personal Placebos for Well-being

The episode wraps up with the hosts reflecting on the significance of personal placebos in maintaining mental and emotional health. They acknowledge that while not all placebos are scientifically validated, their subjective benefits play a crucial role in personal well-being.

• Mae Martin [52:31]: Expresses a hopeful outlook towards adopting more structured placebos in the future.

  • "I'm hoping I'll just arrive there and unconnected to anyone of my behavior, I'll just suddenly be like, oh, I'm here now. I'm a vegan."

• Fortune Feimster [54:02]: Reiterates the emotional support received from personal relationships.

  • "He’s my best. Just. I just stare at him. And all that stress goes away."

The conversation concludes on a positive note, emphasizing the importance of intentional belief systems and supportive relationships in fostering a healthier, more balanced life.

Notable Quotes with Timestamps:

• Fortune Feimster [39:15]: "If you mentally feel better, then it can have effects on you physically."
• Tig Notaro [47:28]: "I was praying, and I had never done that before, and I felt like it was going to help me."
• Mae Martin [46:17]: "Maybe vitamins. Like, you know, they're like vitamins. You just pee them out."
• Fortune Feimster [44:54]: "Jax is my placebo."
• Tig Notaro [52:37]: "You have to be really, really sold on what your North Star is."

Final Thoughts

This episode of Handsome offers a comprehensive exploration of the placebo effect, intertwining scientific understanding with personal narratives. The hosts' candid discussions illuminate how belief and intentional practices can shape one's mental and physical health, encouraging listeners to reflect on their own "placebos" and the role of belief in their lives.