The Night of May 19th, 1983

Summary

Happy Face Podcast Summary: "The Night of May 19th, 1983"

Podcast Information:

• Title: Happy Face
• Host/Author: iHeartPodcasts
• Episode: The Night of May 19th, 1983
• Release Date: September 8, 2020
• Description: Happy Face delves into the harrowing true story of Melissa Moore and her father, Keith Hunter Jesperson, a notorious serial killer. This episode focuses on the tragic events of May 19, 1983, exploring the brutal crimes, the ensuing investigation, and the lasting impact on Diane Downs and her children.

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1. Introduction to the Crime ([04:05] - [06:10])

The episode begins by recounting the tragic events of the evening of May 19, 1983, when Diane Downs and her three children were involved in a harrowing incident on Mohawk Road.

• Melissa Jeltson ([04:05]): "The story of the crime begins on the evening of May 19, 1983. Diane Downs and her three children are riding along Mohawk Road."

Diane recounts her version of events, asserting that she was stopped by a stranger who then violently attacked her family in a failed carjacking attempt.

• Diane Downs ([04:54] - [05:14]): "Diane was on the road at 10pm on a school night with her three young children. According to Diane, her kids liked to sightsee, and they would just drive for enjoyment. She stands by her story even now, after several decades in jail."

2. Initial Assault and Immediate Aftermath ([05:14] - [07:30])

Diane describes the assault, where she claims the attacker fired multiple shots at her sleeping children.

• Diane Downs ([05:50] - [06:10]): "In her telling, this guy wants the car. So what does he do? It's dark out, headlights are shining forward. He walks up to the car, leans in and fires five to seven bullets at sleeping kids."

Despite being wounded, Diane managed to drive to a nearby hospital, albeit at a notably slow pace, raising suspicions among investigators.

• Unknown Speaker ([06:10] - [07:30]): "One thing that has struck me then and has always struck me was the testimony of somebody who was driving behind her on Old Mohawk Road... she was going five to seven miles an hour... it's less than two miles to the hospital."

3. Investigation and Growing Suspicion ([07:30] - [12:05])

As police delve into the case, various inconsistencies emerge. Diane's slow driving to the hospital, despite her injuries, becomes a critical point of contention.

• Unknown Speaker ([07:30] - [10:22]): "James recalls the moment he heard about the shootings. 'I didn't think anybody. I really just, I stayed in the moment and I said what? And my dad said yes, your sister has been shot.'"

Diane's brother, James, staunchly defends her innocence, pointing out flaws in the prosecution's case.

• James Downs ([15:23] - [20:06]): "Despite this, James stands by his theory that Diane was not the shooter that night."

4. Forensic Evidence and Policing the Narrative ([18:23] - [22:42])

Forensic scientist Jim Pex provides insights into the gunshot residue (GSR) tests conducted on Diane, explaining limitations due to the type of weapon involved.

• Jim Pex ([18:23] - [19:30]): "There is no barium and antimony in a rimfire cartridge, so there is nothing to find... if you have ever broken your arm, you would know it would be impossible to move your arm."

The discovery of a .22 caliber rifle in Diane's apartment initially points suspicion toward her, but forensic analysis disproves it as the murder weapon.

• Jim Pex ([22:59] - [23:56]): "The rifle was determined not to be the same weapon that fired the bullets at the crime scene... the bullets had markings as if they had been ejected from another weapon, possibly a pistol."

5. Life Before and After the Incident ([24:05] - [26:18])

Investigators found Diane's apartment sparse, which the police interpreted as indicative of a troubled personal life. However, her brother James offers explanations attributing the minimalism to practical circumstances.

• James Downs ([24:40] - [25:46]): "My mom and dad drove to Arizona with a pickup truck... her house was very sparse."

Diane's journals and letters to a man named Robert Nick Knickerbocker are scrutinized for motives, but James counters that these were merely personal outlets.

6. Custody Battle and Psychological Impact ([34:11] - [37:59])

Following the incident, custody of Diane’s children was revoked amid concerns about her mental state and potential threats to the children’s well-being in her presence.

• Narrator ([34:23] - [36:00]): "While Diane's children were hospitalized for their injuries, Diane herself was also undergoing surgery for the injuries to her arm."

The traumatic impact on the surviving child, Christy, is highlighted, emphasizing the complex dynamics of the case.

7. Legal Proceedings and Public Perception ([37:59] - [41:37])

The lack of physical evidence leads the prosecution to rely heavily on circumstantial evidence and witness testimonies. Diane maintains her innocence throughout the trial, a stance supported by her family.

• Diane Downs' Family ([39:07] - [37:59]): "James stands by his theory that Diane was not the shooter that night... if you have ever broken your arm, you would know it would be impossible to move your arm."

8. Conclusion and Continuing Impact ([40:16] - [43:01])

The episode concludes by reflecting on the enduring mysteries of the case and the quest for truth by Diane’s family. As authorities struggled to piece together the events of that night, the pain and uncertainty lingered, affecting those left behind.

• Episode Wrap-Up ([39:07] - [43:01]): "On the next episode of Happy Face Presents Two Face, Diane sticks to her story... Christie, survivor and daughter of Diane, is getting stronger to share in court what really happened that night."

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Notable Quotes:

• Jim Pex ([18:23]): "There's nothing to find... if you have ever broken your arm, you would know it would be impossible to move your arm."

• James Downs ([15:23]): "Despite this, James stands by his theory that Diane was not the shooter that night."

• Diane Downs ([05:50]): "He walks up to the car, leans in and fires five to seven bullets at sleeping kids."

---

Key Takeaways:

• The case centers around Diane Downs' assertion of innocence against accusations of murdering her children.
• Discrepancies in her behavior post-incident, such as her slow driving to the hospital, fueled suspicions.
• Forensic evidence, including GSR tests, played a pivotal role but had limitations due to the type of weapon involved.
• Family members, particularly her brother James, vehemently support Diane's innocence, highlighting potential flaws in the prosecution's narrative.
• The emotional and psychological toll on the surviving child, Christy, underscores the lasting impact of the tragedy.

Happy Face offers a nuanced exploration of a deeply tragic event, highlighting the complexities of truth, memory, and justice in the aftermath of unimaginable loss.

Transcript

[Podcast Announcer]

You're listening to an iHeart podcast.

[Andrea Gunning]

I'm Andrea Gunning, host of the podcast Betrayal. Police Lieutenant Joel Kern used his badge to fool everyone, most of all his wife, Caroline.

[Melissa Jeltson]

He texted, I've ruined our lives. You're going to want to divorce me.

[Andrea Gunning]

How far would he go to cover up what he'd done?

[Unknown Speaker 1]

The fact that you lied is absolutely horrific. And quite frankly, I question how many other women are out there that may bring forward allegations in the future.

[Andrea Gunning]

Listen to betrayal on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Unknown Speaker 1]

Something unexpected happened after Jeremy Scott confessed to killing Michelle Schofield in Bone Valley season one.

[Gilbert King]

Every time I hear about my dad is, oh, he's a killer. He's just straight evil.

[Unknown Speaker 1]

I was becoming the bridge between Jeremy Scott and the son he'd never known.

[Gilbert King]

At the end of the day, I'm literally a son of a killer.

[Unknown Speaker 1]

Listen to new episodes of bone Valley Season 2 on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Holly Fry]

Explore the winding halls of historical true crime with Holly Fry and Maria Tremarchi, hosts of Criminalia, as they uncover curious cases from the past. The legend of the Highwayman suggests men dominated the field, but tell that to Lady Catherine Ferrers, known as the wicked lady who terrorized England in the mid-1600s. Her legend persists nearly 400 years after her death. Highwaymen are in the hot seat this season. Find more crime and cocktails on Criminalia. Listen to criminalia on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Melissa Jeltson]

Hi, listeners. I'm Melissa Jeltson, host of what Happened to Talina Czar? It's the story of a woman who disappears in the early days of COVID lockdowns and the group of online sleuths who try to find her.

[Unknown Speaker 2]

I didn't want to be talked out of this plan. After I post this, I am turning.

[Unknown Speaker 3]

Off my phone for exactly this reason.

[Melissa Jeltson]

I kept just kind of asking everybody.

[Unknown Speaker 2]

Anyone else think this is strange?

[Melissa Jeltson]

You'll notice that about me. I don't lurk. I'm out there. I'm an action kind of girl. You can now get access to episodes of what Happened to Talina Zhar? 100% ad free with an iHeart True Crime plus subscription. I'm a subscriber, and you should be, too. So don't wait. Head to Apple Podcasts. Search I Heart True Crime plus and subscribe today.

[Unknown Speaker 3]

Well, they were just catastrophic injuries, and it's really amazing that all Three didn't die that night. One Cheryl, as far as we know, was dead on arrival at Mackenzie Willamette Hospital. The staff there was clearly not expecting this. They hear a car honking, and somebody runs out, and there's a mom or a woman standing by a car saying, somebody shot my kids. So the doctors are dispatched out there and nurses and sort of horrified to find one, two, and then a third kid, and they had been shot in the chest. Any doctor would tell you that there's just a few more catastrophic injuries, especially for a young child, than to have gunshots to the chest. And I remember Diane at one of her news conferences saying, if I had shot my kids, would I not have done a good job of it? And I remember thinking, not too long after that, you did a tremendous job. If that was what you wanted to do, you did a great job.

[Unknown Speaker 2]

The story of the crime begins on the evening of May 19, 1983. Diane Downs and her three children are riding along Mohawk Road. Dana Timms was a reporter for the Oregonian at the time, a correspondent for Eugene County. He describes the area around the shooting.

[Unknown Speaker 3]

It's a really pretty area. It's kind of a gateway to a couple of different river valleys. The Mackenzie river is really the defining water feature that comes down through there with a couple of other branches going off of it. A lot of farming activity and ranches up there, some cattle, a lot of grass, very green, very emerald. It's very pretty. There were probably homes spaced out maybe every half mile or so, sort of the way that you would have anticipated homesteaders, you know, 150 years before that, everyone having enough land to do whatever they wanted to do.

[Unknown Speaker 2]

Diane was on the road at 10pm on a school night with her three young children. According to Diane, her kids liked to sightsee, and they would just drive for enjoyment. She stands by her story even now, after several decades in jail. She claims she saw a stranger in the road who flagged her down, and she stopped to help.

[Unknown Speaker 3]

She was, you know, portraying herself as a good Samaritan. But even if you're going to do that, my sense would be maybe you just stay on the road and you roll your window down a little bit and say, what's the problem? But she pulled off the road, turned off the car, had the keys in her hand, and gets out of the car to go talk to this guy. It just seemed like a natural thing to do.

[Unknown Speaker 2]

According to Diane, the man then attacked her and her family in an attempt to steal a car, a quote unquote, carjacking gone wrong.

[Unknown Speaker 3]

In her telling, this guy wants the car. So what does he do? It's dark out, headlights are shining forward. He walks up to the car, leans in and fires five to seven bullets at sleeping kids.

[Unknown Speaker 2]

The man then apparently fled, and Diane, having sustained a gunshot wound to her forearm, wrapped the arm in a towel and drove to a nearby hospital. But according to a witness, she wasn't exactly driving with a sense of urgency.

[Unknown Speaker 3]

One thing that has struck me then and has always struck me was the testimony of somebody who was driving behind her on Old Mohawk Road as she was heading toward the hospital. And she claimed she had driven as fast as she could, and yet her arm was wrapped in a towel, in a perfectly folded towel that had been placed, obviously, in her car for some reason. So she was, as a clinical narcissist, which is one of the three personality disorders that was diagnosed for her. The driver of that car said we were going five to seven miles an hour. I would have passed, but there was a double yellow line, and it was just pretty dark and curvy out there. So he didn't feel safe doing that, but identified the Arizona plate that hadn't been changed yet. And again, that's not enough on its own, but it was just a very, very telling point to me in terms of just the logic of the situation. It's not that far from where the shooting occurred to Mackenzie Willamette Hospital, where she ended up with the kids.

[Unknown Speaker 2]

What is the distance from the location of the shooting to the hospital?

[Unknown Speaker 3]

Oh, it's. It's. I'm sure it's less than two miles. And a lot of that's rural, so you can. You can move along at a pretty good clip if you need to get there.

[Unknown Speaker 2]

Diane's brother James maintains that Diane had an excuse for driving slowly and that she still made it as quickly as possible. When I spoke to him about it, he was quick to point out that the witness who saw her driving wasn't behind her the entire way to the hospital.

[Podcast Announcer]

So one question I did have is why was she driving her vehicle very.

[Melissa Jeltson]

Slowly on the way to the hospital after the incident?

[Podcast Announcer]

Real hard to describe that one. Basically, I think Inman was his name, said he was following her on Old Mohawk Road. The following period took place for about two, maybe three miles. Right. So the shooting was two miles away from where. And he followed her on curvy roads for two miles. You must remember, really, truly must remember. She was just shot. She just had her child in the back seat, was gurgling with blood because she Got shot in the lung, right? Her lung had collapsed and she couldn't breathe and she had to maybe tend with the child in the backseat and get her to roll over so she would stop gurgling. Her other boy in the back seat had been shot in the chest and he was also in the midst of dying. She was maybe reaching over to the child that was laying on the floor and saying, cheryl, Cheryl, Cheryl, Cheryl. I wasn't there, right? But I mean, it's like maybe she was obviously wrapping her arm with the towel, you know, I don't know. I can't really talk about the towel. I don't have any idea. But I don't know why she was driving slow. But if you can imagine, put yourself in that situation being shot. And he only followed her for about, I don't really know, be honest with you, two or three miles. But I know it wasn't a long way. And yes, indeed, she was going slow and she almost drove off the road and things like that. But then what's important from my point of view is that when she got to that stop sign where she went right and he went left, that it's a 15 minute drive to the hospital from that point, Right. She did it in 10 minutes. So yes, on the windy road, she was driving slow, right. Tending to her that had just been murdered and shot, right. But once she got to the open road and where all the kids were, I'm going to use the word stabilize in her mind, then she went to the right and she drove to the hospital and she got there and faster than the police could get there. The next day.

[Unknown Speaker 3]

I think she was saying it took something like 20 minutes and her telling to get there. It just wouldn't have taken that long, especially if you were hurrying along with your shot. Kids.

[Bom Han]

Yo, Kiba fans, it's your boy, Bom Han, and I'm bringing you something epic. Introducing the K Fact, the podcast that takes you straight into the heart of K pop. We're talking music reviews, exclusive interviews, and deep dives into the industry like never before. From producers and choreographers to idols and trainees. We're bringing you the real stories behind the music that you love. And yeah, we're keeping it 100, discussing everything from comebacks and concepts to the mental health side of the business. Because K pop isn't just a genre, it's a whole world. And we're exploring every corner of it. And here's the best part. Fans get to call in, drop opinions, and even join us live at events you never Know where we might pop up next? So listen to the K factor on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. This isn't just a podcast. It's a movement. Are you ready? Let's.

[Podcast Announcer]

Foreign.

[Andrea Gunning]

I'm Andrea Gunning, host of the podcast Betrayal. Police Lieutenant Joel Kern used his badge to fool everyone, most of all, his wife, Caroline.

[Melissa Jeltson]

He texted, I've ruined our lives. You're going to want to divorce me.

[Andrea Gunning]

Caroline's husband was living another life behind the scenes. He betrayed his oath to his family and to his community.

[Unknown Speaker 1]

She said you left bruises, pulled her hair, that type of thing.

[Unknown Speaker 3]

No.

[Andrea Gunning]

How far would Joel go to cover up what he'd done?

[Unknown Speaker 1]

You're unable to keep track of all your lies, and quite frankly, I question how many other women may bring forward allegations in the future.

[Andrea Gunning]

This season of Betrayal investigates one officer's decades of deception. Lies that left the those closest to him questioning everything they thought they knew. Listen to betrayal on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Unknown Speaker 1]

Something unexpected happened after Jeremy Scott confessed to killing Michelle Schofield in Bone Valley season one.

[Podcast Announcer]

I just knew him as a kid.

[Unknown Speaker 1]

Long, silent voices from his past came.

[Gilbert King]

Forward, and he was just staring at me.

[Unknown Speaker 1]

And they had secrets of their own to share.

[Gilbert King]

Gilbert King. I'm the son of Jeremy Lynn Scott.

[Unknown Speaker 1]

I was no longer just telling the story. I was part of it.

[Gilbert King]

Every time I hear about my dad, it's, oh, he's a killer. He's just straight evil.

[Unknown Speaker 1]

I was becoming the bridge between a killer and the son he'd never known.

[Gilbert King]

If the cops and everything would have done their job properly, my dad would have been in jail. I would have never existed.

[Unknown Speaker 1]

I never expected to find myself in this place. Now I need to tell you how I got here.

[Gilbert King]

At the end of the day, I'm literally a son of a killer.

[Unknown Speaker 1]

Bone Valley Season 2 Jeremy.

[Gilbert King]

Jeremy, I want to tell you something.

[Unknown Speaker 1]

Listen to new episodes of bone Valley Season 2 on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. And to hear the entire new season ad free with exclusive content. Subscribe to Lava for Good plus on Apple Podcasts.

[Melissa Jeltson]

Hi, listeners. I'm Melissa Jeltson, host of what Happened to Talina Czar? It's the story of a woman who disappears in the early days of COVID lockdowns and the group of online sleuths who try to find her.

[Unknown Speaker 2]

I didn't want to be talked out of this plan. After I post this, I Am turning off my phone for exactly this reason.

[Melissa Jeltson]

I kept just kind of asking everybody.

[Unknown Speaker 2]

Anyone else think this is strange?

[Melissa Jeltson]

You'll notice that about me. I don't lurk. I'm out there. I'm an action kind of girl. You can now get access to episodes of what Happened to Talina Zar? 100% ad free with an I Heart True Cross Crime plus subscription. I'm a subscriber and you should be too, so don't wait. Head to Apple Podcasts, search I Heart True Crime plus and subscribe today.

[Unknown Speaker 2]

No matter which version you believe in the end. When Diane arrived at the hospital, the injuries to her children were catastrophic. Cheryl, her 7 year old daughter, was dead on arrival. Danny, 3 was paralyzed and Christy, 8, has suffered a stroke due to massive blood loss and was unable to speak. James recalls the moment he heard about the shootings. Let's go back to the night of the shooting. How did you hear the news? You're in California, I want to know your experience. What happened that night?

[Podcast Announcer]

I was sleeping. My dad called me at 2:30 in the morning and said your sister has been attacked. She's been shot.

[Unknown Speaker 2]

I wondered whether or not James believed her ex husband had anything to do with it. Even when talking about this, James can't resist starting to put the pieces into place to demonstrate his sister's innocence. What did your mind go to? Did you think? Steve, what did you think?

[Podcast Announcer]

I didn't think any of that. I really just, I stayed in the moment and I said what? And my dad said yes, your sister has been shot. No, I did not think anybody. The state actually thought. Steve, that is a really valid question. Diane says that the state, Doug Welch actually came to her and he said that we know you did not do this. And Steve has given us three alibis and none of those three alibis turned out to be any good. So we really want to look at him, but we need you to testify against him. We need you to say it was him so we can do that. She says it wasn't him. If it was him I would be telling you. But it wasn't him. It was 2:30 in the morning and somebody just attacked, attacked my sister. So it's like I just started thinking about getting up there to be with family and that's about all, that's all my mind was just, you know, I need to go, I need to leave.

[Unknown Speaker 2]

James also states that Diane was tested for gunpowder residue and none was found, which he also attempts to explain. James has spent years trying to prove Diane's innocence. And has a counter argument for nearly everything that might potentially point to Diane's guilt.

[Podcast Announcer]

The shooter that killed Cheryl, the shooter that wounded Christie and wounded Danny and shot my sister when he was killing the family, he got in her car. The inside of that car was covered with blood spatter. Inside of that car had gunpowder residue, and my sister didn't have any on her. The driver's seat was clear or void of any gunpowder residue and blood spouter where the shooter would have been sitting or kneeling when he shot them. And so you come back and you put it all together. It's like, well, she didn't really have the gun, so somebody else did. She didn't have any gunpowder residue on her. Somebody else did. She didn't have any blood spatter on her, even though it was all over the car, so somebody else did.

[Unknown Speaker 2]

It's worth noting that while Diane tested negative for gunshot residue, or GSR, the bullets were from a.22 caliber gun. We spoke to forensic scientist Jim Pex, who worked on the Diane Downs case. He explains more about the residue test.

[Jim Pex]

It's my understanding that the deputy who was took the initial report at the hospital swabbed her for for gsr, and at the time, we would send those to a consulting laboratory for analysis. But in this case, you have to keep in mind that when we talk about swabbing person's hands for gsr, what you're looking for are two rare earth elements that are not common in nature. One is barium and one is anemone. These are intentionally placed in the primers of center fire cartridges. A.22 is a rimfire. There is no barium and antimony in a rimfire cartridge, so there is nothing to find.

[Unknown Speaker 2]

Diane also sustained an injury at close range, so testing her for lead would have been somewhat inconclusive because she was in what's referred to as the lead cloud.

[Jim Pex]

Pex explains no, that's when a weapon is discharged and the bullet exits the barrel. There is a cloud of vaporized gases that contain these trace elements and a little bit of trace element lead. And in center fire casings, you would find your barium and antimony deposited from this cloud. And the fact that she was shot herself, you would have found lead on her hands anyway.

[Unknown Speaker 2]

Despite this, James stands by his theory that Diane was not the shooter that night.

[Podcast Announcer]

Actually, it's a funny thing. There was a picture of her dying at the hospital when she was sitting there. And you notice that it's been destroyed at this point. Actually, they destroyed it. And you can notice that her fingers are not full of dirt where she might have buried something. Her hands are not clean where she might have washed her hands. Because there's been a lot of theories out there that, well, she did this and that she washed up. My sister was shot in the left arm. The common theory out there is that when you get wounded in the left arm, it must be self inflicted. If you self inflict your wound, you have stippling around where the gun was next to your arm. There was no stippling on her arm. And more importantly, when you talk about her left arm being broken, it didn't have a hole in it. She had one inch of bone that was removed from her arm where it shattered her bone. So if you say, well, she did not have any gunpowder residue on her because she washed her hands, she did not have any blood spatter on her because she washed up well, it is impossible. If you have ever broken your arm, you would know it would be impossible to move your arm. It is impossible to lift anything with your arm. It is impossible to do anything with your arm, especially when you have a one inch bone shattering. It was not a flesh wound, it was a traumatic, traumatic injury to her arm.

[Unknown Speaker 2]

Not long after Diane and her children's arrival at the hospital, she became the main suspect. However, no arrests or charges were brought against Diane.

[Unknown Speaker 3]

Right away, I think that the press got the impression after about four or five days that the police were the ones who were perhaps looking at Diane. There hadn't been any other suspects.

[Unknown Speaker 2]

Police began to gather evidence to build their case. Officers were dispatched to search Diane's Springfield home and look for any potential clues or evidence and found some not so subtle clues that might point to Diane.

[Unknown Speaker 3]

They did get a break a little bit when they searched Diane's apartment in Springfield and found bullets that appeared to have very similar markings on them from the extractor mechanism in a gun that moves bullets through the chamber. The rifle they found in her apartment was the.22 caliber rifle, but so the bullets were also.22 caliber, but they would also fit into a handgun.

[Unknown Speaker 2]

After examination, the rifle was determined not to be the same weapon that fired the bullets at the crime scene. The bullets in the rifle, however, had markings as if they had been ejected from another weapon, possibly a pistol, and then loaded into the rifle. Jim Pex explains.

[Jim Pex]

We looked under the bed and There was a rifle,22 rifle under the bed. First thought was, oh, is this a possible murder weapon? And so we seized the rifle and I took it back to the laboratory after we finished processing and the Rifle had cartridges in the tubular magazine, and there were nine of them. That's a significant number because a lot of.22 caliber semiautomatic pistols have nine cartridges in the magazine. And it's not uncommon for people when they're through shooting and they still have ammunition in the weapon to take it out and maybe use it in another weapon, which appeared to be the case here, because there weren't any markings on these cartridges that they had worked through the action of the.22 rifle. There were only markings from some other weapon.

[Unknown Speaker 2]

This wasn't enough to charge Diane with the crime. There was also something else strange about Diane's apartment. It was nearly empty.

[Unknown Speaker 3]

She had just moved there. But it was very spare, very spartan inside, beds for the kids. But when police, who went there as soon as they could, looked at the refrigerator, there was nothing there, Nothing to eat. A real shortage of comfortable and warm suitable clothes for the kids. I think Diane's closet was probably the best stocked thing in the house. And beside that, no books, nowhere to really sit. There was a tv, because she liked to watch tv. So she was taking care of her own needs there. But apparently nobody else's were being thought about.

[Unknown Speaker 2]

Diane's brother, James, offers his own explanation. He believes the lack of possessions was a product of circumstance and not a sign of a bad mother.

[Podcast Announcer]

My mom and dad drove to Arizona with a pickup truck that's sort of, you know, as part of the state's theory that her house was. She was a bad mother. She had a house in Oregon, and there was no furniture in it. There was no food in the refrigerator. Well, my mom and dad lived about, you know, four blocks away, and the kids were always over there because my sister was always working. There was no furniture because they just got there six weeks previous with a pickup truck. They didn't. Her house just burned down four months before that.

[Unknown Speaker 2]

Do you remember what she packed up in that pickup?

[Podcast Announcer]

Just personal items. I was not there. My mom and dad drove down there and did that. I was in California working, but, yeah, I was not there. I just thought it was just a pickup, so you can't have too much. But, yeah, her house was very sparse.

[Unknown Speaker 2]

They did, however, find Diane's journals and letters to a lover in Arizona, which helped paint a picture of who she was and what investigators would later argue could serve as a motive.

[Unknown Speaker 3]

One thing she had kind of pointed them out, like, hey, I've got all these diaries. The writings in the first diary were all about this guy in Arizona. Long poems. She wrote voluminously.

[Unknown Speaker 2]

The guy in Arizona was Robert Nick Knickerbocker.

[Podcast Announcer]

I did not know Nick existed until the state went to her house the night of the shooting and collected her diary letters. She gave them permission to go to her apartment and get the letters or, I'm sorry, to go get evidence that might help. I don't know why they'd want to go to her house to get evidence, but they went to her house to get evidence. And some of that evidence was, I'll call them diary letters. They weren't really in a diary. They were just handwritten letters.

[Unknown Speaker 2]

The letters were unmailed, James claims, but there were, according to law enforcement accounts, tons of journals where Diane had written nearly every day about Nick.

[Podcast Announcer]

Basically told Nick, you know, it's like, you know, I wish that you were here. I wish that I was with you. I wish things were different. I want you. You know, I remember, you know, I never read the letters, but they were just love letters, you know, I mean, there's no doubt that they were love letters and that was their motive.

[Unknown Speaker 2]

James theory is that the letters were just a way for Diane to vent privately. And the fact that they were never mailed, he believes, shows that they weren't an act of a woman obsessed with a man, despite the claims to the contrary.

[Podcast Announcer]

Well, I mean, it's really just a think about it situation. It had been six weeks since she left Arizona. She hadn't called him, she hadn't emailed him, There was no email. She hadn't written him. You know, there was letters written to him but never mailed.

[Unknown Speaker 2]

It also came out that Nick may have half heartedly proposed to her at some point.

[Unknown Speaker 3]

It seemed to go back and forth a little bit. He did, I think, propose, but maybe kind of a backhanded kind of way. And like, well, yeah, sure, that might be interesting, but nothing that would last for more than a day, perhaps. But when Diane heard that, she was just convinced that, well, he wants to be with me and if I just kind of hang in there, I think I can make this work.

[Unknown Speaker 2]

As for the question of why the relationship with Nick ended a person she clearly cared for, the belief is that Diane's promiscuity led to her contracting an STD that she later gave to Nick, who subsequently gave it to his wife.

[Unknown Speaker 3]

He basically had to tell her, I think that I have this and you probably have it now. You better get tested. And here's where I got it. And so he had to sort of admit that. And I think his wife ultimately forgave him. And I think that was kind of a turning point where it's not that he never saw Diane again or wasn't physical with her again, perhaps, but it did seem to mark something of a break in their relationship.

[Unknown Speaker 2]

Even with Diane supposedly over the relationship with Nick, the police still believed he was the motive behind the killing and would eventually push that narrative. During Diane's trial, a phone call that apparently took place between Nick and the police didn't help to dissuade them.

[Podcast Announcer]

The motive? Yes, I read a police report, and on the police report, it shows a conversation between. When the police called him to tell him what had happened, Nick, they said, basically, diane and the kids have been shot. His first words were, I cannot believe she did this for me. I cannot believe she did this for me.

[Bom Han]

Yo, K Pop fans. It's your boy, Bom Han, and I'm bringing you something epic. Introducing the K Factor, the podcast that takes you straight into the heart of K Pop. We're talking music reviews, exclusive interviews, and deep dives into the industry like never before. From producers and choreographers to idols and trainees, we're bringing you the real stories behind the music that you love. And, yeah, we're keeping it 100, discussing everything from comebacks and. And concepts to the mental health side of the business. Because K Pop isn't just a genre, it's a whole world, and we're exploring every corner of it. And here's the best part. Fans get to call in, drop opinions, and even join us live at events. You never know where we might pop up next. So listen to the K factor on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. This isn't just a podcast. It's a movement. Are you ready? Let's go. Let's go.

[Andrea Gunning]

I'm Andrea Gunning, host of the podcast Betrayal. Police Lieutenant Joel Kern used his badge to fool everyone, most of all, his wife, Caroline.

[Melissa Jeltson]

He texted, I've ruined our lives. You're going to want to divorce me.

[Andrea Gunning]

Caroline's husband was living another life behind the scenes. He betrayed his oath to his family and to his community.

[Unknown Speaker 1]

She said you left bruises, pulled her hair, that type of thing.

[Gilbert King]

No.

[Andrea Gunning]

How far would Joel go to cover up what he'd done?

[Unknown Speaker 1]

You're unable to keep track of all your lies, and quite frankly, I question how many other women may bring forward allegations in the future.

[Andrea Gunning]

This season of Betrayal investigates one officer's decades of deception. Lies that left those closest to him questioning everything they thought they knew. Listen to betrayal on the iHeartRadio app. Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Unknown Speaker 1]

Something unexpected happened after Jeremy Scott confessed to killing Michelle Schofield in Bone Valley Season one.

[Podcast Announcer]

I just knew him as a kid.

[Unknown Speaker 1]

Long, silent voices from his past came.

[Gilbert King]

Forward, and he was just staring at me.

[Unknown Speaker 1]

And they had secrets of their own to share.

[Gilbert King]

Gilbert King I'm the son of Jeremy Lynn Scott.

[Unknown Speaker 1]

I was no longer just telling the story. I was part of it.

[Gilbert King]

Every time I hear about my dad, it's, oh, he's a killer. He's just straight evil.

[Unknown Speaker 1]

I was becoming the bridge between a killer and the son he'd never known.

[Gilbert King]

If the cops and everything would have done their job properly, my dad would have been in jail. I would have never existed.

[Unknown Speaker 1]

I never expected to find myself in this place. Now I need to tell you how I got here.

[Gilbert King]

At the end of the day, I'm literally a son of a killer.

[Unknown Speaker 1]

Bone Valley Season 2 Jeremy, Jeremy, I.

[Jim Pex]

Want to tell you something.

[Unknown Speaker 1]

Listen to new episodes of bone Valley Season 2 on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. And to hear the entire new season ad free with exclusive content. Subscribe to Lava for Good plus on Apple Podcasts.

[Melissa Jeltson]

Hi listeners. I'm Melissa Jeltson, host of what Happened to Talina Czar? It's the story of a woman who disappears in the early days of COVID lockdown and the group of online sleuths who try to find her.

[Unknown Speaker 2]

I didn't want to be talked out of this plan. After I post this, I am turning.

[Unknown Speaker 3]

Off my phone for exactly this reason.

[Melissa Jeltson]

I kept just kind of asking everybody.

[Unknown Speaker 2]

Anyone else think this is strange?

[Melissa Jeltson]

You'll notice that about me. I don't lurk. I'm out there. I'm an action kind of girl. You can now get access to episodes of what happened to Talina Zhar? 100% ad free with an iHeart True Crime plus subscription. I'm a subscriber and you should be too. So don't wait. Head to Apple Podcasts. Search iheartrucrime plus and subscribe today.

[Unknown Speaker 2]

While Diane's children were hospitalized for their injuries, Diane herself was also undergoing surgery for the injuries to her arm. It was during this time that full custody of Diane's children was taken away.

[Unknown Speaker 3]

So she was initially hospitalized herself. Released fairly soon after that. But she still had visitation rights. She was still the mom with 100% right to go see her kids. But we learned at some point that Christy's heart rate was just spiking on the monitor when her mom came into the room. Again, some of this is hindsight, but you now know that she sees the person who killed her sister and shot her and her brother is right in the room with her. That'd be a little scary. Also, the county authorities moved to limit Diane's access to the kids after hospital staff were reporting that Christy appeared to be very traumatized when her mom was in the room. And I think that within four or five days, the police, not having any solid leads on any of their suspects, were feeling that we need to limit access that Diane had to her kids for their safety, for their mental stability and all kinds of things. So they did go ahead and file orders that were approved by a Lane county judge barring Diane from having access to her kids.

[Unknown Speaker 2]

According to James, there's a more complicated story behind why Diane's custody was taken away.

[Podcast Announcer]

I know that they had police sitting outside the hospital room whenever we went to visit. It's like, you know, we were turned away. And so I don't know why. Well, I do know why, because it's real obvious why. Because they had an agenda that they had to fund.

[Unknown Speaker 3]

There were armed police outside the room because if there was a shooter on the loose who had tried to shoot them once, perhaps that could happen again. So they still had to take precautions. It wasn't a situation where they were dismissing any possibility that there was anybody else out there who could have intended this.

[Podcast Announcer]

I mean, you have a little 8 year old girl who was just brutally attacked. She had a stroke, her sister is dead and her brother is not even in the same hospital. There's two hospitals in the Springfield area and her brother's at a different hospital.

[Unknown Speaker 2]

Diane was apparently upset that the siblings were separated and felt that they should be in the same hospital.

[Podcast Announcer]

And that was one of Diane's major contentions, is to put them together so they can be a family together.

[Unknown Speaker 2]

One of the doctors had been given temporary guardianship over the children and according to James, believed that Diane's custody should be taken away because she was trying to take Christy out of the hospital.

[Podcast Announcer]

And she was trying to take Christie out of the hospital, but she was trying to get her to the other hospital or vice versa, get Danny to come to Christy's hospital so they could be in the same room and they could get better together. And that is, that's what I was trying to get at is the fact that they said that she's trying to get Chris, take Christie out of the hospital before it's time. Well, she was trying to take Christie out of the hospital to get her with her brother. So it was the day when she was due to have surgery that they ended up taking her rights away because she can't be at court on that day as her feelings to defend herself, basically. And if you're not there to defend yourself, then you lose.

[Unknown Speaker 2]

But one has to wonder what the real motivation was behind keeping the children protected from Diane, especially Christy. Christy suffered a stroke from blood loss and was unable to speak for months following the shooting. But aside from Diane herself, Christie was the only other probable witness to whom ever actually did the shooting.

[Unknown Speaker 3]

It took a long time for charges to finally be leveled against Diane. And I think that everyone knew that her older daughter Christie, who had survived her, I think Christy was eight when she was shot. Her younger sister Cheryl, who died, was 7, and their brother Danny was 3. The police were very clear in saying, we haven't found a murder weapon yet. So the search went on for that. And they spent hundreds of hours with divers deployed in the local rivers where Diane said that the shooting had occurred. She had pulled over right next to the little Mohawk river. And so the assumption was, well, she tossed the gun in there. Nothing was ever found. So it became really clear that if anything was going to develop, it's probably going to be short of any other kind of physical evidence. It's going to be on Christy getting well enough that she could tell what happened that night.

[Unknown Speaker 2]

On the next episode of Happy Face Presents two Face, Diane sticks to her story that a bushy hair stranger is the shooter, going as far as to record a play by play reenactment video for police. But a surprise past encounter with her ex husband before the shooting could hold the evidence detectives need to charge Diane. Meanwhile, month by month, Christie, survivor and daughter of Diane, is getting stronger to share in court what really happened the night of May 19, 1983. Our executive producer is Ben Bolen. Melissa Moore is our co executive producer, Maya Cole is our primary producer, and Paul Decant is our supervising producer. Our story editor is Matt Riddle. Research assistants from Sam Teagarden. Featured music by Dream Tent Happy Vase presents Two Face is a production of I Heart Me Media.

[Andrea Gunning]

I'm Andrea Gunning, host of the podcast Betrayal Police Lieutenant Joel Kern used his badge to fool everyone, most of all his wife Caroline.

[Melissa Jeltson]

He texted, I've ruined our lives. You're going to want to divorce me.

[Andrea Gunning]

How far would he go to cover up what he'd done?

[Unknown Speaker 1]

The fact that you lied is absolutely horrific. And quite frankly, I question how many other women are out there that may bring forward allegations in the future.

[Andrea Gunning]

Listen to betrayal on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Unknown Speaker 1]

Something unexpected happened after Jeremy Scott confessed to killing Michelle Schofield in Bone Valley season one.

[Gilbert King]

Every time I hear about my dad is, oh, he's a killer. He's just straight evil.

[Unknown Speaker 1]

I was becoming the bridge between Jeremy Scott and the son he'd never known.

[Gilbert King]

At the end of the day, I'm literally a son of a killer.

[Unknown Speaker 1]

Listen to new episodes of bone Valley Season 2 on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Holly Fry]

Explore the winding halls of historical true crime with Holly Fry and Maria Tremerki, hosts of Criminalia, as they uncover curious cases from the past. The legend of the Highwayman suggests men dominated the field, but tell that to Lady Catherine Ferrers. Known as the wicked lady who terrorized England in the mid-1600s, her legend persists nearly 400 years after her death. Highwaymen are in the hot seat this season. Find more crime and cocktails on Criminalia. Listen to criminalia on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Melissa Jeltson]

Hi listeners. I'm Melissa Jeltson, host of what Happened to Talina Czar? It's the story of a woman who disappears in the early days of COVID lockdowns and the grand group of online sleuths who try to find her.

[Unknown Speaker 2]

I didn't want to be talked out of this plan. After I post this, I am turning off my phone for exactly this reason.

[Melissa Jeltson]

I kept just kind of asking everybody.

[Unknown Speaker 2]

Anyone else think this is strange?

[Melissa Jeltson]

You'll notice that about me. I don't lurk. I. I'm out there. I'm an action kind of girl. You can now get access to episodes of what happened to Taliinazhar? 100% ad free with an iHeart True Crime plus subscription. I'm a subscriber, and you should be too. So don't wait. Head to Apple Podcasts, search iheartruecrime plus and subscribe today.

[Podcast Announcer]

You're listening to an iheart podcast.