Hard Fork Live, Part 2: Patrick Collison of Stripe + Kathryn Zealand of Skip + Listener Questions

Release Date: July 4, 2025

Podcast Information:

• Title: Hard Fork
• Host/Author: The New York Times
• Hosts: Kevin Roose and Casey Newton
• Description: “Hard Fork” explores the future that’s already here, delving into the latest developments in the rapidly evolving tech landscape.

1. Introduction and Event Highlights [00:35 – 02:13]

Kevin Roos and Casey Noon kick off the episode by sharing their favorite moments from the inaugural "Hard Fork Live" event. Casey recounts a humorous incident where she was initially denied entry until she proved her identity, while Kevin reminisces about a backstage mishap involving mechanical robot exoskeleton pants and an unexpected encounter with Patrick Collison.

Notable Interaction:

• [00:47 - 01:36] Casey Noon: "I went right up to the security, I said, hi, I'm Casey. I'm here to co-host the show."
• [01:07 - 01:36] Kevin Roos: "We had this bit where we're changing out of our regular pants into some mechanical robot exoskeleton pants for a demo."

2. Interview with Patrick Collison of Stripe [03:27 – 24:46]

Background on Patrick Collison: Casey Noon introduces Patrick Collison, CEO of Stripe, highlighting his influence in tech, his collaboration with economist Tyler Cowen on a piece about the "need for a new science of progress," his co-founding of the Ark Institute focused on biomedical research, and his recent appointment to Meta's board amid its AI team restructuring.

Discussion Points:

• Abundance Agenda:

  • [04:09] Patrick Collison: "The rate of improvement of life expectancies has really diminished. We haven't cured even the common cold."
  • [07:52] Patrick Collison: "If you could spend those dollars however you want, how much would your research agenda change? 79% would change their research agenda a lot."

• Agentic Commerce and Stripe’s Role:

  • [10:09] Kevin Roos: "You are on the board of Meta, which is currently reshuffling its AI teams, building a superintelligence team and reportedly offering people $100 million to come work for them. Have you been helping with that?"
  • [11:10] Patrick Collison: "Stripe enables the transactions and the money movement beneath the surface. We're enthusiastic about reinvention here."

• Cryptocurrency and Stablecoins:

  • [12:53] Patrick Collison: "Stablecoins might enable people outside the US to access the dollar in ways they couldn’t previously."
  • [14:32] Casey Noon: "Coles cash comes to mind."
  • [14:37] Patrick Collison: Discusses the impact of stablecoins on global currencies and their potential to support the dollar’s dominance.

• Ark Institute and Biomedical Research:

  • [15:09] Patrick Collison: "Humanity has never cured a complex disease... We set up the Ark Institute to try a different strategy for tackling these diseases."
  • [17:21] Patrick Collison: Introduces the concept of a "virtual cell" to accelerate biological experiments using AI.

• Book Recommendations and Perspectives:

  • [23:37] Patrick Collison: Recommends "The Dream Machine" for understanding the history of the Internet and "The Demon Under the Microscope" for insights into antibiotic development.

• Lightning Round:

  • [21:31 - 24:46] Short, rapid-fire questions covering topics like longevity predictions, desired AI capabilities, hiring traits at Stripe, and book recommendations.

Notable Quotes:

• [04:09] Patrick Collison: "The rate of improvement of life expectancies has really diminished."
• [12:57] Patrick Collison: "The promise for these agents sounds very promising... it’s going to be better for everyone."
• [15:11] Patrick Collison: "Humanity has never cured a complex disease... We set up the Ark Institute to try a different strategy."
• [17:21] Patrick Collison: "The idea behind a virtual cell is to enable accurate computational predictions very quickly, very cheaply."

3. Demonstration with Kathryn Zealand of Skip [26:35 – 36:15]

Introduction to Kathryn Zealand: Kathryn Zealand, founder and CEO of Skip, showcases her company's innovative exoskeleton movewear designed to assist individuals with mobility impairments.

Product Features:

• The Mogo:
  • [27:10] Kathryn Zealand: "Our first product, the Mogo, is aimed at people who want to go hiking but may be struggling with knee pain or reduced mobility."
  • [27:58] Kathryn Zealand: Explains the lightweight motors in the pants that provide up to 40% of a healthy person's muscle force, assisting with movements like standing up and climbing stairs.

Live Demonstration:

• [32:02 – 36:15] Kevin and Casey try on the robot pants, experiencing enhanced mobility. The demonstration includes climbing a StairMaster with the assistance of the exoskeleton pants, showcasing both the benefits and challenges of integrating such technology.

Notable Interaction:

• [34:03] Patrick Collison (Kathryn Zealand): "Now you can try standing up and sitting back down. It’s like having a spotter at the gym."
• [34:18] Katherine Zeland: "Have you talked to anyone who has a realistic timeline and roadmap for personal assistant robots?"

Product Availability:

• [35:27] Kathryn Zealand: "You can find us at skipwithjoy.com. The pants are available for pre-order at $5,000, with plans to reduce the price through improved supply chains."

4. Listener Questions and Discussions [25:25 – 57:15]

After the main interviews and demonstration, the hosts engage with live audience members and address listener-submitted questions.

Key Topics Addressed:

• AI in Education:

  • Listener Question [42:07] by a 13-year-old student: "How much AI should be integrated into classrooms?"
  • [42:55] Kevin Roos: Advocates for AI literacy, emphasizing the need for schools to teach critical thinking alongside AI usage.
  • Casey Noon: "Real friends over AI friends is what I would say."

• Technological Impact on Society:

  • [39:31] Listener Question: Concerns about the rapid pace of technological change and its societal impacts.
  • [43:58] Casey Noon: Highlights the necessity for public participation in regulating AI, expressing skepticism about industry-led regulation.

• Regulation and Ethical Concerns:

  • [48:51] Kevin Roos: Discusses the ethical implications of AI in military applications and the challenges of ensuring responsible AI development.
  • Casey Noon: "We cannot trust the industry to lead this; regulation must come from public and governmental bottom-up initiatives."

• Artificial General Intelligence (AGI):

  • [54:32] Listener Question: Definition and implications of AGI.
  • [55:59] Casey Noon: Views AGI as AI that can handle routine tasks, allowing humans to focus on creative and critical thinking.

• Wealth Distribution and Tech Optimism:

  • [52:15] Listener Question: Concerns about the redistribution of wealth generated by AI advancements.
  • [53:37] Kevin Roos: Criticizes the assumption that technological wealth will naturally "trickle down" without deliberate policy interventions.

Notable Quotes:

• [42:55] Kevin Roos: "AI literacy is a really important thing for schools to be teaching."
• [48:04] Casey Noon: "Facial recognition technology is already basically perfect. You combine that with AI systems, things get dark in a hurry."
• [53:33] Casey Noon: "Preach it."
• [54:02] Kevin Roos: "During the Industrial Revolution... workers did not see the benefits for 50 years."

5. Conclusion and Final Interactions [57:15 – End]

The episode wraps up with final listener interactions and acknowledgments. Kathryn Zealand expresses her gratitude for the opportunity to present Skip's exoskeleton pants. The hosts emphasize the importance of community engagement and feedback in shaping the future of technology.

Final Remarks:

• [57:57] Acey Noon: "Hard Fork is produced by Rachel Cohn and Whitney Jones. We're edited by Jen Poyant... You can watch this whole episode on YouTube and subscribe at YouTube.com/hardfork."

Closing Quotes:

• [50:04] Katherine Zeland: "Have you thought about regulation and safety in AI?"

Key Takeaways:

1. Abundance Agenda: Patrick Collison emphasizes the urgent need for accelerated progress in various scientific and technological domains to improve life expectancies and address complex diseases.

2. Agentic Commerce: Stripe's role in facilitating diverse transaction modalities ensures adaptability to future commerce models, including AI-driven agents.

3. Exoskeleton Technology: Kathryn Zealand showcases how wearable robotics can significantly aid individuals with mobility challenges, demonstrating both the potential and current limitations of the technology.

4. AI in Society: The discussion highlights critical concerns about AI's rapid advancement, its integration into education, ethical implications, and the necessity for robust regulatory frameworks to mitigate unintended consequences.

5. Wealth Redistribution: There is a pressing need to address how the financial benefits of technological advancements, especially AI, can be equitably distributed to prevent societal disparities.

6. Public Engagement: The episode underscores the importance of public participation and informed discourse in shaping the responsible development and deployment of emerging technologies.

This episode of "Hard Fork" provides an insightful exploration into the intersecting realms of fintech innovation with Stripe, wearable robotics with Skip, and the broader societal implications of AI and technological progress. Through engaging interviews, live demonstrations, and thoughtful audience interactions, hosts Kevin Roos and Casey Noon facilitate a comprehensive dialogue on navigating the future of technology responsibly.