Prince Harry Wants Big Tech to Stop Hacking Our Kids’ Brains

Summary

Podcast Summary

Podcast: Hasan Minhaj Doesn't Know
Host: Hasan Minhaj (with Scott Rogowsky)
Guest: Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex
Episode: Prince Harry Wants Big Tech to Stop Hacking Our Kids’ Brains
Date: October 29, 2025

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Overview

This episode brings together Hasan Minhaj and Prince Harry for a candid, spirited, and thought-provoking discussion about the impact of social media and technology on children’s mental health. Prince Harry, now a resident of California and father of two, speaks passionately about the urgent need for tech companies to prioritize child safety and shares insights from his work with the Archewell Foundation, The Parents Network, and the Responsible Technology Youth Power Fund. The conversation weaves humor and vulnerability with serious calls to action around digital rights, mental health, and the ethical responsibilities of Big Tech.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Prince Harry’s Life in America and Cultural Adaptation

• Light-hearted banter about settling in the U.S., American habits, and attempts at an “American accent” (04:00).
• Prince Harry jokes about surfing as “the most American thing” he does and not having “legs for shorts” (04:35).
• Fun exchange about ordering breadsticks with ranch at Applebee’s (05:24).

2. Male Vulnerability & Mental Health Stigma

• Both Minhaj and Prince Harry reflect on how culture encourages men, especially British and Indian men, to hide feelings (08:23).
  • Quote (Prince Harry 08:33):
    “I think we’ve made huge progress globally over the last 10, 20 years, especially around stigma around mental health and giving individuals, especially young men, the opportunity to come forward… But I think social media is hampering a lot of the progress.”
• Discussion on how “Men’s Health” magazine focuses on abs, not real mental health (09:05).

3. Social Media’s Impact on Kids' Mental Health

• Prince Harry outlines why his foundation focuses on tech:
  Quote (10:17):
  “This is an industry that’s been going for 20-plus years, and if, as they claim, the last 10 years’ suicide deaths and harms to young people are ‘unintended consequences’ … where are we at now?”
• Hasan and Scott, both parents, discuss the modern dilemma of giving kids phones for safety but being concerned about opening the gateway to social media (12:13–14:15).
  • Quote (Prince Harry 14:28):
    “It's hard enough in today's world being a parent and keeping kids safe. Gone are the days of having your kid under your roof and knowing they’re safe — now, they can be in the next room but lost in the deepest, darkest thoughts via a screen.”
• Collective responsibility of parents and the need for awareness; analogy of children being physically near–but digitally vulnerable (14:28).

4. Tech Industry Accountability and Systemic Issues

• Searing criticism of tech companies for prioritizing engagement and profit over safety (15:35–17:35).
  • Quote (Prince Harry 15:35):
    “The incentives are all to keep kids online for as long as possible, farm and process your thinking, your thoughts… They don’t actually care. What is the future that we want built for us? Or the one we will build for ourselves?”
• Analogy to tobacco industry: social media is similarly engineered for addiction, with children as “collateral damage” (32:45–33:19).

5. Parental Strategies and Dilemmas

• Bribery, lying, and “hostage negotiation” style parenting in the digital age; struggles with opting out of technology (12:46–13:21).
• Even parents who restrict their kids’ access risk their children being outcast or bullied at school for not being on certain platforms (13:58).
• Discussion of “dumb phones” — limiting devices to basic call/text functions (13:39).
• Both hosts and Prince Harry agree: more friction should be introduced into tech experiences, not less.
  Quote (Scott Rogowsky 27:02):
  “The opt-in is so easy. It’s so lubricated for you to access everything… I wish there was more friction. Keep the candy on a higher shelf, for both children and adults.”

6. The Parents Network & Responsible Technology Youth Power Fund

• Prince Harry describes the Parents Network, formed of parents who lost children due to social media harm/suicide, as both a tragedy and a source of activism (17:49–19:15).
  • Quote (Prince Harry 18:30):
    “We created this space...to give parents the collective power and courage to stand up against these systems—to right the wrongs of the past.”
• Youth Power Fund: Funding youth-led tech accountability initiatives, giving young people a voice in decisions that will define their future (41:54–43:14).

7. Digital Rights, Childhood Privacy & The Challenge of AI

• Deep concerns about digital rights for children, the risks of sharing kid photos online, and the specter of AI manipulation (23:06–24:45).
• Prince Harry’s recommended minimum age for social media: “21 is a sensible age, but the companies will never allow it” (26:34).
• New “AI chatbots flirting with children” scandal at major tech companies is cited as an emblem of failed safeguards and misplaced incentives (28:07).
  • Quote (Prince Harry 28:07):
    “We should really...acknowledge the reality that there’s some really evil, wicked people at the heart of this who want to farm our children’s mindset.”
• Echoes of prior failures with social media are likely to repeat with AI unless urgent action is taken (30:25).

8. Societal Solutions and Public Goods

• Vision for a “digital public good”—nonprofit, accessible digital spaces (like public libraries) not subject to the profit motive (37:00).
  • Shout out to Khan Academy and similar educational tools (37:58).

9. Regulation, Hope, and Inspiration

• Prince Harry’s optimism and hope are based on grassroots parent/child organizing, not institutions (47:30).
• Jane Goodall remembered as a beacon of moral clarity; her final message about hope is shared in the closing minutes (53:18–55:51).
  • Quote (Jane Goodall, 53:18):
    “Without hope, we fall into apathy and do nothing… in the dark times that we are living in now, if people don't have hope, we're doomed… so even if this is the end of humanity as we know it, let's fight to the very end. Let’s let the children know that there is hope if they get together.”

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Prince Harry, on Tech’s Addiction Design (15:35):
  "The incentives are all to keep kids online... They don’t actually care."
• Prince Harry, on Collective Action (33:41):
  “The good thing is that we are the vast majority. They [Big Tech] are the minority. They have the power and desire — but we feel it, everyone feels it. We have to take control of our device and control of our algorithm.”
• Prince Harry, on AI & Mental Ability (34:38):
  “The more you use ChatGPT, the more you use these AI platforms… you completely lose your ability to think, especially critical think.”
• Prince Harry, on Industry Responsibility (46:48):
  "How could you possibly serve something up for our children that you deem unsafe for your own children?"
• Prince Harry, on Steve Jobs and Tech Founders (46:07):
  "The same across the board. It's not just him, it's all of these men, dads, families [limiting tech for their own kids]."
• Jane Goodall, on Hope (53:18):
  “Without hope, we fall into apathy... even if this is the end of humanity as we know it, let's fight to the very end.”

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Key Timestamps for Important Segments

• Intro & Prince Harry’s Life in America (02:18–05:54)
• Male Vulnerability & Mental Health Culture (08:23–09:44)
• Social Media & Tech Impact on Kids (10:17–15:06; 17:49–19:15)
• Parental Dilemmas/Strategies (12:08–14:45)
• Tech Industry Accountability (15:35–17:35; 32:45–33:19)
• Regulation/Future Warnings on AI (28:07–30:25; 34:38–36:00)
• Digital Rights & Childhood Privacy (23:06–24:45)
• Youth Power Fund and Parent-Driven Reform (41:54–44:10)
• Hope and Legacy of Jane Goodall (53:18–55:51)

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Tone & Style

The episode maintains a witty, conversational style, with Prince Harry gamely participating in humor (attempted American accents, jokes about knighthood), balanced by earnest, sometimes somber discussions around children’s mental health, tech’s outsized influence, and the responsibilities of the powerful. The hosts gently nudge the conversation between levity and gravity, and Prince Harry’s tone is open, sincere, and passionate about safeguarding children and reshaping the digital future.

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Summary Takeaways

• Big Tech urgently needs to “bake in” child safety and ethical design, rather than externalize the consequences.
• Parents are on the front lines, but real solutions require collective action, regulation, and fundamental shifts in tech company incentives.
• AI poses even greater risks of manipulation if similar mistakes are allowed as with social media.
• Young people and parents must have a seat at the table to shape the digital landscape.
• Hope—grounded in organizing and mutual care—remains essential for motivating change, as reflected in the tributes to Jane Goodall.

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If you care about kids, technology, privacy, or simply want to hear two very public figures get real about modern parenthood and the digital world, this episode is required listening.

Transcript

[Hasan Minhaj]

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[Scott Rogowsky]

Let's be real.

[Hasan Minhaj]

I have been very upfront with all of you guys. I cannot cook for shit.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Normally around the house I'm the trash.

[Hasan Minhaj]

Guy or the dishes guy or the let's just order takeout guy. But lately I've been the Whole Foods guy. They have amazing baked goods, pre made meals and the highest quality ingredients. Plus I get my Halloween candy there and it will never have red dyes, high fructose corn syrup or artificial sweeteners. But the best news of all this month at Whole Foods Market you can save 50% off select frozen pizzas with prime through October 28th. That's half off. That's on brands like Rao's, Caulipower and Daiya. So I will be skipping the takeout and chefing up frozen pizzas this month. How hard can it possibly be? That is 50% off select frozen pizzas with prime at Whole Foods Market.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Terms apply.

[Hasan Minhaj]

Visit your local Whole Foods Market today in store or online.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Lemonade.

[Hasan Minhaj]

Prince Harry, the Duke of Sussex is one of the most famous people on Planet Earth. Two billion people watched his wedding and my mom was one of them. Every word he says in public is either turned into a tabloid headline, a Meme or a stylized quote that your.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Aunt posts on her Facebook.

[Hasan Minhaj]

And while that experience of being constantly watched but never really seen can be a burden, a royal best selling burden, Prince Harry has tried to leverage all that attention for good.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Prince Harry and Meghan Markle have officially.

[Archewell Foundation Representative]

Launched the Parents Network in coordination with their philanthropic organization, Archewell Foundation.

[Hasan Minhaj]

Through the Archewell foundation, he has targeted funding towards helping refugees and workers in conflict zones and. And supporting racial and gender justice. And he has spent years trying to raise the alarm about social media's impact on mental health, especially on kids. So that's what we wanted to chat about. I sat down with the Duke to talk about how he's settling into life in America.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

No, I don't drink. Or slowly.

[Hasan Minhaj]

The danger of repeating the same mistakes with AI that we did with social media.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

It's hard enough in today's world being a parent, looking after your kids and keeping them safe.

[Hasan Minhaj]

And I ask him, what does a guy gotta do around here to get knighted?

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

If you have a sword, we can do it afterwards.

[Scott Rogowsky]

I got over 2 million subscribers on YouTube.

[Hasan Minhaj]

Come on, give me my sword. And chain mail already.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Hurry. Right away, please.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Have a seat.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

All right. Oh, we got. We got water and a shot of coffee.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Got some chai. Have you had this is. This is my check effort, if you want.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Is it?

[Scott Rogowsky]

Cheers, man. Yeah, cheers.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Very nice. Spit it all over me before we start.

[Scott Rogowsky]

If you're into it.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

I am now.

[Scott Rogowsky]

All right. There we go.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

That's great.

[Hasan Minhaj]

What do I call you?

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Sir Harry? You can call me sir if you want. That would be quite fun.

[Scott Rogowsky]

My Lord.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

My lord. You can call me Harry.

[Scott Rogowsky]

I just watch a lot of Game of Thrones. Okay.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Harry, are you a Game of Thrones fan?

[Scott Rogowsky]

I watched everything up until the last season, and then people told me, they were like, just don't even bother.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Will I be judged for admitting that I've never. I've never actually got into it.

[Scott Rogowsky]

What do you binge watch?

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

That's classified. I can't possibly share that with you. It's still classified.

[Scott Rogowsky]

All right, all right, just for context, how long have you lived in the United States of America?

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

We got here in March of 2020. So we've been here for the last five years.

[Scott Rogowsky]

What's the most American thing that you do now?

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

What's the most American thing that I do now? Surf. Is that American or is that California?

[Scott Rogowsky]

I mean, people could also say that's Australian as well. I mean, drink Coors Light.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

No, I don't drink Coors Light.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Do you wear shorts inside of restaurants?

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

I. Some, no, but I don't really have legs for shorts.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Okay.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

So that's.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Oh, got it.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

You mean.

[Scott Rogowsky]

You mean from this region down? It's.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Yeah.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Not ideal.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

I got chicken legs. I don't really. You know, no one should see my legs in a restaurant.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Can you do an American accent?

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Which part of America? Anywhere.

[Scott Rogowsky]

I'll give you a sentence here. I'll give you a sentence.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Are you gonna ask me? You've got a sentence there.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Yeah.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Okay. Well, it depends on what it says. Here we go.

[Scott Rogowsky]

This is the most American sentence I could think of.

[Hasan Minhaj]

I ordered breadsticks with ranch dressing at Applebee's.

[Scott Rogowsky]

I always say it again, the ranch. You gotta eat fish. And then on Applebee's, really emphasize the A. Applebee's.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

A Applebee's.

[Hasan Minhaj]

I love Applebee's.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

I love Applebee's. Now I'm. Now I'm just sitting here sweating.

[Scott Rogowsky]

I ordered breadsticks with ranch dressing.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

I ordered breadsticks with ranch dressing at Applebee's.

[Scott Rogowsky]

That was decent.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

They enjoyed laughing.

[Hasan Minhaj]

Hey, do you like my cybertruck?

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Hey, do you like my cybertruck?

[Scott Rogowsky]

You guys out there, you cannot laugh like this. We're having a real thing.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

No, but by the way, the laughter, it's encouraging. Is it encouraging or is it mocking me?

[Hasan Minhaj]

No, Come on, y'.

[Archewell Foundation Representative]

All.

[Scott Rogowsky]

We have a. There we go.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

There we go. There it is.

[Hasan Minhaj]

How's your yeehaw?

[Scott Rogowsky]

Let me hear a yeehaw.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Yeehaw.

[Scott Rogowsky]

No, no.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

So.

[Scott Rogowsky]

So you got the beginning part right. So it's the Y.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Is this a warm up or is this part of the thing?

[Scott Rogowsky]

We're warming up. Okay, Harry, we're going to get into some heavy stuff.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Oh, this is like. This is like trying to like.

[Scott Rogowsky]

These are like. If you ever taken an improv class, this is zip, zap, sop. This is just to get warmed up. Scott, shall we do the yeehaw again? We're pretty good on yeehaw. Okay. Let's get serious.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

No, no, we don't have to get serious, but it's a serious subject.

[Scott Rogowsky]

It is a serious subject.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

But I fully appreciate that this podcast of yours sort of dives in and out of the seriousness. Seriousness. You are a humorous man.

[Scott Rogowsky]

I'm a humorous person. Yeah. One of the things I love, actually about your willingness to do the show is your vulnerability. You've always been one to share how you feel, and you were really vulnerable in your memoir, Spare. And I know there was a lot of pain in those pages. There was a moment in the book that really shook me to my core. And it was this quote. Each year I received from PA an official clothing allowance, but that was strictly for formal wear. Suits and ties, ceremonial outfits. For my everyday casual looks, I'd go to TK Maxx, the discount store. I was particularly fond of their once a year sale when they'd be flush with items from Gap or J.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Crew.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Items that I just come out of season or were slightly damaged. Bro, I'm. I'm sorry you had to go through that.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

I know. You know what? It was hard. It was really hard. TK Maxx is. It's now a special place, you know, forms a special place in my memory.

[Scott Rogowsky]

And as I was. I was reading that, I was just like TK Maxx, but it could have been worse. It could have been Ross Dressed for Less.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Do you guys have TK Maxx here?

[Scott Rogowsky]

It's T.J. maxx.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

T.J. maxx.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Slightly different, but I'm just glad to see that you're on the other side of the discount rack.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Thank you. Appreciate that.

[Scott Rogowsky]

You didn't think I was gonna pull up that quote, did you?

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

I had no idea. I didn't. I wasn't. I mean, it could have been any quote, to be honest. I'm glad you pulled that one up. Thank you.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Well, we're talking today because we're talking about male vulnerability. Both as British and Indian men, we were brought up to hide our feelings. Do you think that's changing now?

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

I think we've made huge progress globally over the last 10, 20 years, especially around stigma around mental health and giving individuals, especially young men, the opportunity to come forward and acknowledge their daily struggles. I think that social media, the way that it is now, is hampering a lot of the progress that we've made and taking a lot of young men and young boys into very dark places, which should concern all of us.

[Scott Rogowsky]

The only Men's Health I was aware of was the magazine. Problem is, Men's Health isn't really focused on what's happening up here. It's more abs focused.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Have you ever been on the front cover of that?

[Scott Rogowsky]

Never been on the front cover.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Would you like to be? We could organize that.

[Scott Rogowsky]

I would love to.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Okay.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Uh, but these covers are unique attacks on my mental health, I'll tell you that right now. This much AB coverage, I thought this is what you look like without my shirt. Yeah. Camille Nanjiani. Not me. But yes, one does aspire to have abs like that. Obviously, the Internet has helped normalize conversations around mental Health.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

But it's a double edged sword, right?

[Scott Rogowsky]

Sure.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Yeah. So should the thing that's making mental health worse get the credit for?

[Scott Rogowsky]

I take your point.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Do you see what I mean?

[Scott Rogowsky]

Yeah, yeah, totally. It is making us mentally ill. According to a recent Pew poll, it found that nearly half of teens age 13 to 17 say they're online, quote almost constantly. When I read that I was like, holy. Because we're parents, we have young, young children. So I have two children, seven and five. You have two children, six and four. Correct. That's why I thought it was so interesting that we're meeting at this juncture in our lives like so many of these real existential crossroads.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Well look, first of all I think we should be very grateful that our kids are as young as they are. And this is, but this is, this is a, these are platforms, this is a, an industry that has been going for 20 plus years and if the last 10 years as they claim the suicide deaths harms of social media to, especially to young people, what they describe as unintended consequences.

[Scott Rogowsky]

In a dramatic moment, Zuckerberg turned to face and apologized to dozens of parents holding up photos of their teens whose deaths they blamed on social media. But in a prepared statement he still maintained that his platforms, Facebook and Instagram did not bear any direct responsibility.

[TikTok Representative]

Will you take personal responsibility, Senator? I view my job and the job of our company as building the best tools that we can to keep our community safe. Well, you're failing at that to. Well, Senator, we're doing an industry leading effort. We build AI tools that your product is killing people.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

The last 10 years has been unintended consequences. Where are we at now?

[Scott Rogowsky]

I mean the general consensus is it's too far gone. The genie's out of the bottle. That's how people feel right now.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

My hope is that this is an era, a really bad one that we need to solve and we need to fix. And really the solution is safety by design, which is relatively easy thing to do but it's just being neglected. And what we've learned over the last few years is the exploitation of minds of what effectively destroys kids self esteem Kids kills their sleep, kills their independence. The very thing that supposedly connected people has now created more isolation than ever before.

[Scott Rogowsky]

I don't know if you guys have hit this crossroads yet, but what are you going to do when your kids ask for a cell phone? Are you going to give them a phone? I mean, have you talked to Megan about this? Because I've talked to my wife.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Yeah, we talk about this, we Talk about it a lot. And I think that, you know, because. Because of what we know now.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Yeah.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

We will be way more cautious and hesitant of allowing our kids to have access to social media. But the problem is so many parents don't have that awareness. Because in no logical, fair, ethical, moral world should a parent have to consider that this app that sits on the phone. Which, by the way, having a phone for your kid is a really important thing.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Totally. Yeah.

[Hasan Minhaj]

To know where they are and they.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Can get in touch with you.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

All of that. All of that. But the moment that you give them the gateway to everything else. Kids will be kids.

[Scott Rogowsky]

My eldest is in the second grade, and my overall strategy with parenting at this point, I use bribery and lying. I'm like a hostage negotiator. If they ask for something, I'll be like, let me just. Let me see what I can do for you. They're young enough for me to go, like, I don't have any money.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Mm.

[Scott Rogowsky]

They're gonna hit the point where they can call me on my bullshit.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Well, they probably will after this, but. Yeah.

[Scott Rogowsky]

What are you guys gonna do when you hit that 8, 9, 10 place? I don't know what to do because I feel like I'm being opted in. Like, I have no choice. The QR code, the Chromebook over the textbook. Like, I feel like my hand is reinforced.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

You're right. A lot of. A lot of parents don't, I think, feel as though they don't have a choice. And a lot of kids don't have a choice. Right. Because the reality is that if you just having a phone, a smartphone and a sort of an old school phone, two very different things. If you want to be able to contact your kid, maybe we should just be giving them the old school phone.

[Scott Rogowsky]

AKA they call it dumb phones now. Right?

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Dumb phones, yeah.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Which is basically just like call and text.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Funny that, because the smartphone seems to be making us dumber anyway. But I think that, you know, our goal has to be to make sure that when our children get to that age, that the situation now is not the situation then.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Right.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

There's no reason why it should be. Yes, I have. We have to accept that the world is changing. But for these kids who are on smartphones at the moment, even if you're a parent who says, you know what? I'm not going to allow you to be on Instagram, I'm not going to allow you to be on Snapchat, guess what happens? They go to school, they get bullied because of the person that's not on the, on that platform.

[Scott Rogowsky]

So I got, I got, I got called on that with, hey, she has a Apple Watch. Can I get an Apple Watch? You know? And yeah, jokes aside, that's when I was like, I can't write. But that's not gonna work by the time she gets to third or fourth grade.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

So there's a collective here, right? There's a collective piece to this where the awareness of this situation, the more parents that know what is happening, the more parents can protect their kids. And, but it shouldn't, I say it shouldn't be down to us to have to do that. It's, it's hard enough in today's world being a parent, looking after your kids and keeping them safe. And I've used this analogy many times before, but, you know, gone are the days of having your kid under your roof, knowing that they're safe because they can be in the next door room now on a tablet, on an iPad, on an iPhone, or any kind of smartphone and be in the deepest, darkest thoughts.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Did you watch Adolescence on Netflix?

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

I did.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Did it scare the out of you?

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

No, because I already knew it. How many political figures and governments around the world started to engage in this conversation as if they didn't know. This is one of the biggest problems that we, that we face, which is adolescence is created. Fantastic film, great messaging, really important subject. But social media has been going the way that it has for at least 10 years, right?

[Scott Rogowsky]

The algorithm, the rabbit holes, the dark place.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

People look to governments to protect them. And yet we have this, this lawlessness within this particular industry where as far as they're concerned, accountability slows down. Innovation. The power in the decision making rests with the few rather than the many. And the incentives are all wrong. The incentives are all to keep kids online for as long as possible, to farm and process your thinking, your thoughts and just keep you, literally keep you there for as long as possible. So they can make as much money as possible. They don't actually care. And I think the real question we need to be asking ourselves is what is the, what is the future that we want built for us? Or what is the future that we will build for ourselves? What does the future look like?

[Scott Rogowsky]

And what does this, what does our culture look like? You know, the cultural norms of do we do this?

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

But that's the piece of, that's the piece to it. Like, how do we, how do we mobilize to be able to ensure that the future of our digital space isn't created by a small group of elite Powerful people, tech oligarchs. Sure. You said it in a boardroom, as opposed to, for, For. For. For the people that are using it. And there's. There's a moral. There's a moral, and there's an ethical argument which I think is very clear. What's. What is clearly what still astounds me is the lack of legal protections. Again, like, as a company, if you're working in that company, sure. You would want accountability.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Yeah. I mean, there is this culture of build fast and break things, and that's totally fine with binary code. When our kids or teenagers are the collateral damage, that's the terrifying part. And I hope, man, this becomes a bipartisan thing. It's not about Democrat or Republican. It's not about what country you're from. This is a thing that it affects every single person. Every single person.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

And it's not. And when it comes to the. When it comes to the kids literally killing themselves because of social media, it's still very easy for the companies to turn around. Say, well, if you don't like it, don't use it.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Yeah.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Say, well, you go. You're the ones that made it super, super addictive in the first place. And now you've got the kids hooked on it.

[Scott Rogowsky]

So you're now working with parents who have suffered a tremendous loss. The Parents Network. Tell us more about what that is and what you guys are working on.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

The Parents Network was really formed out of the conversations and the meetings that we had with parents who had lost their kids to social media through severe harm and, in the worst case, suicide. And the Parents Network is growing every single day, which is a good thing and a bad thing. It's a good thing because it's reaching parents who need it, but it's a bad thing. The fact that it's needed in the first place and the fact that it's growing. My lock screen is a picture of my kids. What's yours? These children and thousands more meant the world to their families. The beautiful faces you see before you, their smiles, their dreams, all lost all too soon. And all because of social media. We created this space to be able to give them the opportunity and the space to heal, to be able to share their own stories, to realize that they're not alone in this experience, this horrendous, devastating experience. And that has given them the collective power and courage and confidence to stand up against these systems, to right the wrongs of the past, to change the system so that other parents don't face the same devastating consequences.

[Scott Rogowsky]

There's so many things you could do with your time, your platform. Was there a particular moment that made you go, this is something that I want to focus on? Was it something that you experienced in your life that made you want to focus on?

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Yeah, yeah, no, for sure. Like my, myself, my wife, we've talked about this quite a lot. You know, we've had our own, our fair share of beatings on social media. And I guess when we moved to the U.S. one of the things that we both agreed on was, yes, we could focus on the things that really, that are very clearly, obviously aligned to our passions and causes.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Yeah.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Social media, the tech industry was not one of those things.

[Scott Rogowsky]

It wasn't something you were clocking at the time.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

No.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Yeah, yeah.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

But what we agreed and what we were in search of, search of, was what is the root cause of so much suffering and pain around the world? And, and if that, what if, if, if we can identify that, how can we shine a light on that and support the people trying to change the industry? And then it was the tech industry and it was social media, and we're like, well, that's not very sexy. There's no real, how do you tell this story? And then we saw the experts at Stanford and we realized there had been a growing group of experts and researchers who had been raising the alarm for so many years and weren't being listened to. And you can make your own assessment as to why that may have been, but people were raising the alarm for a long time. And after we met these experts and researchers at Stanford, we were like, this is something that we should put our weight behind.

[Hasan Minhaj]

AI seems to be popping up everywhere lately.

[Scott Rogowsky]

It's answering my Google searches, it's operating.

[Hasan Minhaj]

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[Scott Rogowsky]

Have you guys thought about and I've been thinking about this deeply. The speed of digital media is moving so much faster than the analog nature of law and regulation. We haven't even come up with an idea of what is a child's digital rights. Simple example, I don't know if you have this with Archie and Lily. Say they have a recital or a soccer practice. I'll look to the stands and I will see a dozen or so parents. Everybody has their phone out, capturing a really cute, genuine moment. But it's also a surreal thing to know that, oh wow, I have videos of someone else's child and someone has.

[Hasan Minhaj]

Videos of my child.

[Scott Rogowsky]

And now with Generative, AI and Sora, the speed and rate at which these images and faces in your name and likeness can get manipulated. I mean, it's a really terrifying thing. What do we do to save and protect the anonymity and the digital safety of all children so that they get to engage with the digital world on their terms? Should parents post photos of their children online? This has also been a very Parents.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Can do whatever they want. The reality is, from what I've learned, what I've seen, what I've heard and experience through, especially through the parents network is you should be really, really worried, concerned and cautious about putting photographs of your kids online, especially now.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Yeah.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

With this surge of unregulated AI, you just don't know where it's going to go. You don't know how it's going to be used.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Yeah.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

But that's also really sad. And now there's parents watching this, going, well, how am I supposed to share photographs of my kids with so and so on the other side of the world?

[Scott Rogowsky]

I'd love a Rubber meets the Road question with you because every parent navigates this differently. What age do you think kids should be allowed to join social media? For me it's 35.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

For me it's 35. Allowed by parents or allowed by the companies.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Because at the moment, I mean at the moment, now they have it for kids, they have Facebook for kids, they have these social media platforms for kids.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Yes. And as a dad, do you think that is acceptable?

[Scott Rogowsky]

Not at all. Like I said, my position on it is 35. You'd be 35 years old. Please. I just don't want them to have that much access to things that would destroy their own self esteem.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Yeah, I think, you know, once you, once you're, once your brain is properly formed, once you are starting to learn.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Who you are, I mean, that's a sliding scale, man.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Yeah, that is a sliding scale. So what is the. Let's just be realistic for a moment. What is the youngest that you will allow your kids to be on social media or to be using AI?

[Scott Rogowsky]

So AI has already been merged with the traditional technology company. So Google already has Gemini preloaded into it. So there's all these things where I feel angry that I've. You're opting me in. It's like when you go to a restaurant and you go, can I have a physical menu? And they go, you got to scan the QR code. And you're like, please, for the love of God, it's date night, let me get a physical menu. Like I'm trying to avoid the phone but for me, ideally, I hope until university, like they're still innocent and that's a really beautiful thing. And I want their life to be determined on their terms and for them to make memories on, on their terms in the physical world before it's litigated and dissected in the digital world.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

I think 21 is a sensible age, but this, but the companies don't, they won't ever allow that. They will throw tens of millions of, of dollars to lobby against that you.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Could think of even just tactically as just. I call it strategic friction. Like even for me, even before you came here, just taking a moment to sit down with the things. I wanted to talk to you about us having a chat.

[Hasan Minhaj]

This idea of add a little bit.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Of friction between you and the technology. The. The opt in is so easy. It's so lubricated for you to access everything and anything through the rectangle of sadness. I wish there was a little bit more friction. I don't know if you feel that way of, hey, keep the candy on a higher shelf for both children and adults. I'm not saying you shouldn't have it, but.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Well, I don't think anybody would disagree with that. The only people that are disagreeing with it and refusing to implement the change.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Are the tech companies.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Yeah. Are the people that are incentivized to keep the candy on the bottom shelf.

[Scott Rogowsky]

I want to talk to you about children, AI in these chatbots. I don't know if you saw the recent story in the New York Times about children interacting with AI chatbots, and this is not a Black Mirror episode, and it led to actual fatalities. Reading that big New York Times piece made me feel like the parents and adolescents specifically, I didn't even know what. I didn't even know. We don't know what your child is accessing. In your kind of research around this topic and the people that you've met and the experts you've talked to, do we even have a sense of how big this problem is?

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

No, we don't. And when you have AI experts coming forward, raising the alarm bells and they're being ignored, then we should be doubly concerned. In August, Reuters put out a story as well. Whistleblower came forward from Meta, exposing the written policies. Right, the written policies that were acceptable within Meta regarding their chatbots. Not someone else's content, not someone else's creation, their own internal chatbots. They had. Meta had written a policy that basically allowed these chatbots to flirt with children, Right? And then when they were exposed in the Reuters story, they turned around and said, oh, that was a mist, that was a mistake. We've now removed that wording. How could that possibly be a mistake? It went all the way up to your legal team. So I think we should really, like, sort of like snap out of it and just acknowledge the reality of the fact that there's some really evil, wicked people at the heart of this who want to farm our children's mindset and market it for themselves. There is no free will on social media as it stands. And people turn around to me, these parents turn around and say, people, surely we, surely we can learn from the mistakes of the past. I said mistakes to who? Because to the social media companies it wasn't mistakes. What they've learned and what these AI companies have now learned is the amount that you can get away with.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Right.

[TikTok Representative]

We apply our content rules consistently and fairly across all accounts. We run samples of our enforcement actions through quality assurance to verify that we are getting it right. We also proactively scan for known child sexual abuse material, drug related content, other types of harmful content. I'm proud of the work that our teams do to improve online child safety on our services and across the entire Internet. We have many teams dedicated to child safety and teen well being and we lead the industry in a lot of the areas that we're discussing today.

[Archewell Foundation Representative]

So you think that there is a.

[Hasan Minhaj]

Sufficient safety Mechanism for an 8 year.

[Archewell Foundation Representative]

Old to be able to access TikTok?

[TikTok Representative]

An 8 year old's experience on TikTok will be so highly restricted that every single piece of content he or she will see will be vetted by common sense, our third party child safety expert. So I believe, yes, it is the appropriate experience for an adl.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

So the biggest concern that we have or should have is the wrongs of those last 10 years. Are we going to repeat them again with AI? And it looks like at the moment we are. And yet it's entirely preventable with this sort of this, this precipice point where social media got us hooked first and then in came the ad companies and now AI is about to do exactly the same. Once we're all hooked on AI, the ad companies are going to come in.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Do you remember years ago we had this conversation and you and I met up to potentially talk about doing a podcast like this. And I remember talking with you about your unique place in history because we're having this web 1.0, 2.0 and 3.0 moment now with AI, you know when they say take something to its logical conclusion, you've seen where something can go, how bad something can go. If a story or something misinformation spins out of control, what is a warning cry you could give the rest of the world to someone who's seen that even as far back as the late 90s and early 2000s.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

I am definitely sitting here raising the alarm bell. I'm not a social media expert, I'm not an AI expert, but I would definitely add my voice and my wife's voice and our whole team's voice to the chorus of experts raising the alarm bells that unregulated AI is going to cause more harm than good. I don't want to be all doom and gloom, but I do think that it's going to get to a stage where parents will just not let their kids on social media at all. So it's a kind of self defeating thing from as far as the social media companies are concerned, which is you need and want as many users as possible. But there comes a point where it's like, you know, some parents are like, okay, I'll let you on this app, but you can't be on this app. I'll let you be on this app for this amount of time.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Right.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

But then not. That's the way that parents are trying to sort of find a happy medium to. I know, I know there are some concerns about these apps, but I also know that in part of your childhood and growing up, you need to be connecting with your friends and you need to be part of that conversation, otherwise you're going to get bullied for not being part of that conversation. So I appreciate that. So I'm going to give you little bits here and there, but it's going to turn into a point where parents will be like, absolutely not. You're not allowed anywhere near those apps.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Social media cigarettes, essentially. Exactly like pay.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Well, look what we learned. We learn a lot from the tobacco industry and.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Totally. And the addictive nature of it.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Exactly. And I don't, and I don't see the difference here, here. And I don't see how these, this industry can get away with what they're getting away with. And my hope is that again, as you quite rightly point out, it's not a, it's not a partisan issue, it's a bipartisan issue. And everybody can agree that the safety of our children is absolutely paramount. The question then becomes, well, you know, X percentage or number of children dying is somehow collateral.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Yeah.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

I think with the level of intelligence and the technology available, there is no excuse for creating something so vast, so successful and just. And accepting that people are going to die in the process. That does not. It just doesn't make sense to me.

[Scott Rogowsky]

May the next 10 years and beyond be a decade defined by collective action and hopefully regulation.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Yeah. But we can do it and we will do it. The good thing is that we are the vast majority. They are the minority. They have the power and the desire.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Yeah. We feel it. Everyone feels it. There is this existential kind of, we have to take. We have to take feeling in our.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

We have to take control of our device and control of our algorithm. There's a lot of studies out there, and I encourage parents and anyone that's, that's watching this or listening to it to, to look for these studies. MIT came out with a study recently that proved that those using ChatGPT and those that weren't were having their intelligence sucked out of them, basically. Right. What. Their. What was termed as cognitive depth, which essentially says that the more you use ChatGPT, the more you use these AI platforms which you believe or led to believe or told that this will help you create a good speech, a good dissertation or whatever, you completely lose your ability to think, especially critical think.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Right.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Yeah, yeah.

[Scott Rogowsky]

You're cheating on the test. You're cheating on the test.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

You're cheating on the test. But also in the long term, medium and long term, it's making you dumber.

[Scott Rogowsky]

You can say it dumber, but you.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Said it, not me. But that's what it's doing. So, so that, so if we want to know where we're headed.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Yeah.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

More and more people are becoming slaves to this very system that is. Is just sort of manufacturing us in the way that.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Well, you know, one of the parallels that I found is every new technology seems to find a new way for girls to hate their own bodies and for boys to hate girls. Like, this just keeps happening over and over and over again. And so for me, I become a bit of an AI doomer. Like I am. Like, this is scary. I don't know where this is going, but I've seen this happen before, from the early chat rooms with Web 1.0 to what became Web 2.0 on social media. I don't want to know where this is going to go with generative AI.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

But AI has, AI has a role. And even if you don't want it to have a role, I don't think there's any turning back. So, you know, the question is, do we embrace it as it is? No, I think we embrace the idea that I could and hopefully will save lives and make lives easier and better. But the way that it's being done at the moment is exploitative, massively so.

[Scott Rogowsky]

It's. It's disturbing, man. It's disturbing and dystopian that people are going to these chatbots instead of seeing licensed professionals.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Well, can I, can I challenge you on that? Sure. When, when people are desperate. Yeah. They will go to whatever they have greatest access to. Sure. Especially if it's free.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Yeah.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

So I think it's less about. This is the optim piece. It's less about questioning why people would go to and rely on a chat bot to give them psychological advice.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Yeah.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

I can completely understand why you would do that if you're in a dire situation. Sure. The issue that I have is that these. These companies are creating these chat bots. Pretending.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Yeah.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Claiming that this chat bot is as good as a mental health doctor. There's a word for that, isn't there? When you're. When you, as a company, you've created something, pretending that it can provide this kind of a service when actually it can't. What's it called, Scott?

[Scott Rogowsky]

What's that called?

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

What's the word? Fraud.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Fraud.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

That's the one.

[Hasan Minhaj]

That's fraud.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Bingo.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

There we go. Thank you. You said.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Look, look. You know, in my dream, as we have this conversation, we're a few blocks away from the New York Public Library, which is one of the most beautiful libraries, I think, in the world. I would argue what public libraries represented was a. Was a physical public good. There is no. They don't give earnings. Like, it is not a profitable business to be like. Anybody in the city of New York can get books and check them out for as long as you like. I think some of the public libraries here in New York City, they also lifted the late fees. So you can just straight up steal books. You do theft. The point of it was, hey, knowledge is a right for the public. And so that is considered a public good, the same way public education is considered a public good. How do we in the future create a digital public good where there are services that are provided that are good for our children and everybody that aren't incentivized by the stock market? You could never take a public library private. There's no business model there. We were saying people are turning to this because it's accessible and free. What are those digital public goods that we can create that give people and humanity the vegetables they need? Shout out to Khan Academy. Khan Academy was one of those things, too, that provided educational access to children all over the world. That's what I want for my children and all children around the world. Seriously.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

And look, we're still part of this giant experiment, right?

[Scott Rogowsky]

Yeah.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Where these companies, again, have the financial capability, the resources, the willpower, the intelligence to be able to create the very things that you're talking about. But they're not doing it.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Yeah.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

They're using us, manipulating us, exploiting us for their own personal gain. It's almost like Just all we care about is just making money. You know, you're not making the world a better place. You're telling us that, you know, we can't live without tech, we can't live without social media purely to keep us engaged for as long as possible. But there is no free will in the current state of affairs. Yeah, because you can argue again. As I said earlier, it's a very easy argument for them to turn around. Say, if you don't like it, don't be on it. It's like, right? But you've already hooked us. Just like a drug user would. You've already hooked us. Why not just make it safe? Why? Like, how many whistleblowers have come out and been ignored or forgotten about?

[Scott Rogowsky]

Yeah, totally.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Like, how many whistleblowers does it take before someone somewhere actually does something at the heart of this? Otherwise, what we're doing is running upstairs and finding the bath overflowing. Quick, grab a mop.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Yeah, right.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

No, just turn the tap off. Mm.

[Hasan Minhaj]

As a comedian dad and a method actor in the newest Disney blockbuster, I wear a lot of hats. But thanks to JLab headphones and speakers, I've got listening options for every move in every mood. When I am home with the kids, we break out the JBuds party speaker. It's got customizable LED lights and 12 hours of playtime. Perfect for distracting them from the fact that I am not cooking them dinner or taking care of them. I am reheating leftovers on the power of 600 watts and Celine Dion baby. But when I'm flying to Tour stops, the JBuds Lux headphones make a little bit more sense. They're super lightweight and comfy. Plus they have 70 plus hours of playtime, which is great because I'm too busy to charge them. They also have active noise canceling. Perfect for napping in semi public spaces. Finally, I wore JBuds pods when I was learning how to code for my.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Role in Tron Ares jk. I can't code, but I put them on and I imagined I was coding.

[Hasan Minhaj]

I look sleek as hell. And look for the blue box at retailers everywhere. Or shop jlab.com and use code Hasan H A S A N for 15% off your order today. That's code H a S a n for 15% off. I, Hasan Minhaj, am a sucker for fall food. I am craving pumpkin muffins, fresh apples and a warm bowl of chili. It just hits different with a slight chill in the air.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Let's be real.

[Hasan Minhaj]

I have been very upfront with all of you guys. I cannot cook for shit.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Normally around the house I'm the trash guy or the dishes guy or that.

[Hasan Minhaj]

Let'S just order takeout guy. But lately I've been the Whole Foods guy. They have amazing baked goods, pre made meals and the highest quality ingredients. Plus I get my Halloween candy there and it will never have red dyes, high fructose corn syrup or artificial sweeteners. But the best news of all this month at Whole Foods Market, you can save 50% off select frozen pizzas with prime through October 28th. That's half off. That's on brands like Rao's, Kali Power and Daiya. So I will be skipping the takeout and chefing up frozen pizzas this month. How hard can it possibly be? That is 50% off select frozen pizzas with prime at Whole Foods Market.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Terms apply.

[Hasan Minhaj]

Visit your local Whole Foods Market today in store or online.

[Scott Rogowsky]

One of the things you worked on is technology being used responsibly. Can you talk about some of the projects that you funded through your responsible technology Youth Power Fund?

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Well, those, those kids are, those kids are awesome. And I think this touches.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Well, first of all, establish what it is. Because it sounds like it's like a superhero group.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

It's what, it's what the world needs, right? Which is young people who have the knowledge and the experience and whose future is currently isn't in their hands, but they want it to be in their hands. And it's a group of young people who are coming up with some incredible solutions for the problems that they see. And they're the ones who are leaning into this going, no, you can't just make these decisions that are setting our future in a certain course. We want to be part of these decisions. We want a seat at the table and everything that you've just described there, they have solutions for. And it would be unthinkable from a business standpoint not to have young people as part of your, as part of your decision making group, as part of your board. But the more that they continue to push kids, young people to one side shouldn't use kids. We should really use young people because, you know, a lot of these guys, guys and girls are, you know, 18, 21, 26, etc.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Young adults.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

But the companies keep pushing them to one side. No one's really, but. And then the question is why? Why would you not want the opinions, the solutions, the expertise of the very people who literally keep your, keep your platforms going?

[Scott Rogowsky]

I mean, well, the incentive structure is the last thing and the last domain to be conquered is our minds and our time.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

You know, and on the. Sorry. On the. On the. On the other. On the AI piece as well, it's the Parents. The Parents Network. We've now joined forces with Parents Together. The exciting thing about that is a joint or a concerted, bigger, more powerful effort on the national. On the national level. What Parents Together did recently was they put a group of researchers for 50 hours on AI platforms posing as children, and every single five minutes, there was a harmful interaction. Now, if you are someone who works within those companies, surely that would concern you, especially if you have children. And yet here we are after 20 years of social media where the same crazy stuff happened.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Sure.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

And the same kind of people. And I think at the core of this. You haven't asked this, but the core of this is a breakdown of trust. Because from where I sit, how can we trust the people behind social media when we see the harm that it's created?

[Scott Rogowsky]

Totally. I mean, did you.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

And now look at the. And now look at this. It's the same kind of people.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Yeah.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

And I don't want to be sitting here being super critical of the characters or the personalities of the people that are making the decisions, but one thing that is seriously lacking is eq, emotional intelligence. This is probably, arguably quite a lot of IQ there, but there's not enough eq. And I think there's a tendency to. To. To. To create platforms and habits which the creators themselves were comfortable being in that environment. The individual that can sit in their bedroom behind their computer, coding, doing all this kind of stuff, who was comfortable.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Yeah.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Being lonely. Okay. Now these platforms are doing or forcing children in a way to become more isolated while they're telling us that it's connecting them.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Right, right. To incentivize this kind of lonely slash dark behavior. Essentially, yes.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

But it feels. Does it. Does it feel normal to them? Does it feel normal to the creators, the founders, the coders? Does it feel normal to them? Are they turning around and going to the kids? What could this. What could possibly be wrong? I feel comfortable in that situation. I feel comfortable being in my room.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Did you ever read the Walter Isaacson book about Steve Jobs?

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

No.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Okay. The moment of distrust that I got after reading the Isaacson book on Jobs was when he talked about Steve Jobs saying that his own kids don't have iPads or iPhones. And when he said, I don't let my kids use the technology, I was like, you got a drug dealer selling stuff and he won't let his kids Touch the Heisenberg blue. Clearly there's something here. Again, like I said, it goes that's.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

The same across the board.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Yeah.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

It's not just him, it's all of these men, dads, families.

[Hasan Minhaj]

So you have two kids?

[TikTok Representative]

I do.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Do they use TikTok?

[TikTok Representative]

No, they're too young for that.

[Hasan Minhaj]

So what ages are they?

[TikTok Representative]

Eight and six.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Okay.

[Scott Rogowsky]

There's two paths, I think, which is to the benefit of humanity, to make our lives healthier, more robust, and to help humanity at large. But I feel like the stock market and the privatization of these companies wants the casino effication of these platforms and everything you're talking about is a, is essentially just a dopamine casino.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Yeah. And, and in short bursts it makes you feel better, but the long term harm and damage is, is immense. And, and the question really again posed to them is how could you possibly serve something up for our children that you deem unsafe for your own children?

[Scott Rogowsky]

Yeah, they wouldn't have an answer. You know, it would be this, it would be the same way they would describe a Big Mac, a Whopper Candy of like, hey, I make those things. I don't necessarily eat them all the time. Proceed with caution. Are you optimistic about the next 10.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Years regarding tech or just in general?

[Hasan Minhaj]

Well, let's, let's answer both.

[TikTok Representative]

Yeah.

[Hasan Minhaj]

How you feeling about both?

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

I'm optimistic because, and I'm hopeful because of the parents that we work with, because of the people that are determined for change. I think that over the years, collectively the distrust of institutions, whether it's government, media, I just don't think. Well, it's not that I don't think we now know that they haven't been equipped enough to be able to protect us, the people from these companies. And I really hope that that will change because that is ultimately what they are in power to do. And this sort of rolling over for self, not preservation, self interest, I think is incredibly worrying and should concern every single one of us.

[Scott Rogowsky]

We're ramp it down.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

We're going to ramp it down or ramp it up.

[Scott Rogowsky]

This is a royal rapid fire. A royal between a Brit and an American.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

It's a rapid fire.

[Scott Rogowsky]

This is a rapid fire. But you can, you can wax poetic.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

As long as it's not general knowledge.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Are you going to become a US citizen?

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Am I going to become a US Citizen? There are no plans to be at this point.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Nicely done. Are there things that used to confuse you about America that you now understand now that you've lived here for five years?

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

No, it's Become more confusing. It's become way more confusing.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Okay. What do your kids think you do?

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

That's a good question. What do they think that I do?

[Scott Rogowsky]

What do they think dad does?

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

They know that we help other people, but they don't know the work.

[Scott Rogowsky]

What do they think you do? So, like, my daughter comes over. So she came to the office yesterday. We were lighting and setting this up, right?

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

And she.

[Scott Rogowsky]

She thinks I does. She thinks I do that. She goes. She comes over, she goes, hello. Hi.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Hey.

[Scott Rogowsky]

She thinks I do this.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Yeah.

[Scott Rogowsky]

When you're like, daddy's on a call.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

No, all they're interested in is saying hi to the people on the call. Okay. It's like, you know, all they. All they. They're fascinated to see other people. They love seeing familiar faces. But they will run in and this. The occasional. The moment where there's a hand on the forehead. So not.

[Scott Rogowsky]

No, got it.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

But then they just barge in. They jump on the lap, say, hi, guys.

[Scott Rogowsky]

You know, not to brag, but I was a political science major at UC Davis.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

You should brag about that.

[Scott Rogowsky]

That's 60 units. It's pretty good.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

That's great.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Thank you so much.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

And now look at you.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Look at me now.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Yeah. We're on YouTube casting with me.

[Scott Rogowsky]

What do I need to do to get knighted?

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

What do you need to do to get knighted? We can have. I mean, we can probably discuss this offline.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Sure. No, because, you know, my daughter, she'll do this thing where she.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

If you have a sword, we can do it afterwards.

[Scott Rogowsky]

So she has kind of like a fairy wand. And she'll do this on the right shoulder and the left shoulder.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Where does she learn that from? Or are you teaching her to do it?

[Scott Rogowsky]

She just does it, I'm sure. Yeah, you are a knight. And I go, okay, okay, well, there you go. But we can talk about it.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

It sounds like it's already been done.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Who do you want to play the.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Next James Bond at this point? You. I think that could be quite fun. Who do you want?

[Scott Rogowsky]

I think you said it.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

It's decided then. I can certainly put in a good word for you.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Please do. Any questions for me?

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

I feel like I fired quite a few questions back at you.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Talk to me.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Talk to me.

[Scott Rogowsky]

What do you want to know?

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Why did you do. Why did you start this podcast?

[Scott Rogowsky]

One of the worst sentences a heterosexual man can say is, I heard this on a podcast. I like to lead with. What this is, I do not know. And so I sit down with industry experts and world leaders and people with deep domain knowledge to talk about the work that they're doing. It is a podcast where a dumb person asks interesting people important questions. And I think, hopefully, I mean this sincerely. This can be the beginning of a way in which people can engage deeper with someone's work.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

So you're connecting people with stories, with facts and information that they otherwise wouldn't find.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Yeah. Art and culture is a conduit. It's not the answer in and of itself. It's the beginning of something. So, yeah, that's really the point of the podcast, to have these really beautiful conversations. And, you know, I have been given the unique opportunity to meet people like yourself. Maybe I can use these platforms and the devices the same way in which Reading Rainbow and other programs like, impacted me in a really positive way. So keeping it silly, keeping it sincere.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

And how do you keep it entertaining, humorous. This was a very dark subject matter that we. I mean, so I apologize for people.

[Scott Rogowsky]

No, no, no.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Look, it's. But it's. But it's. It's really. It's. It's.

[Scott Rogowsky]

It's important, but like having a conversation, you vacillate between the two. You know, you make people do silly things like say yeehaw. Or you ask to be knighted arbitrarily.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

When you're already knighted.

[Scott Rogowsky]

I mean, that was about my daughter.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Well, it doesn't matter. All you need is a sword.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Maybe that is the highest of titles, to be knighted by one's daughter. And by the way, she is a queen. You know, damn right. Indians. We've been looking to stick it to the monarchy, but my daughter is an Indian queen and she knighted me.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

It's very cool.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Isn't that beautiful?

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

It's a very, very beautiful thing.

[Scott Rogowsky]

We're talking one week after one of your childhood heroes passed away, Jane Goodall. I want to show you a clip from her final interview that she asked to be released after she passed away. Let's take a look.

[Archewell Foundation Representative]

Without hope, we fall into apathy and do nothing. And in the dark times that we are living in now, if people don't have hope, we're doomed. And how can we bring little children into this dark world we've created and let them be surrounded by people who've given up? So even if this is the end of humanity as we know it, let's fight to the very end. Let's let the children know that there is hope if they get together.

[Scott Rogowsky]

What did Jane Goodall's work mean to you and for the world?

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Jane was one of the last remaining individuals with A true moral compass. She traveled more than anybody else I know, all the way up until when she died, constantly on planes, constantly working, constantly going to communities, especially of young people through her roots and shoots program and mobilizing the youth and giving them the confidence and the power to speak up for themselves. I echo exactly what she said there. All of it, every single word.

[Scott Rogowsky]

It's very rare, man, that in the world there's people like that that are the real deal. They're really living it, and they live it till their dying day. And the moments where I go to a place of nihilism, I remember, there are people like her that exist. Was there a particular moment where you were. You were like, I have to meet this person. This person is a. She's amazing sage.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Yeah. She's a. She's a compassionate leader. And she's more. She's. She is exactly what we need more of today. And the world is worse off without her, for sure. I think that her commitment, her love, her passion, her authenticity to the work, especially to wildlife, to our planet, she knew what she was talking about. She had a connection to. She had a connection to Mother Nature that so many of us would. Would long for. So there's a lot that we can learn from what Jane has done, what she said, how she lived her life, and hopefully we can, you know, take her words and use them wisely for ourselves and rise up peacefully and to create the future that we. That we all collectively deserve.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Cool.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Cool.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Thanks for being a part of this, man.

[Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex]

Cool.

[Scott Rogowsky]

This was really, really fun. This is a great conversation.

[Hasan Minhaj]

If you haven't subscribed to Lemonada Premium yet, now's the perfect time, because guess what? You can listen completely ad free. Plus you'll unlock exclusive bonus content like Halle Berry on how to be a good partner during menopause or Mehdi Husson on the dumbing down of media clips.

[Scott Rogowsky]

You won't hear anywhere else, just tap.

[Hasan Minhaj]

That subscribe button on Apple Podcasts or head to lemonadapremium.com to subscribe on any other app. That's lemonadapremium.com.

[Scott Rogowsky]

Don'T miss out.