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- [00:02]
Ben Garrett
This episode of Haunted Cosmos is brought to you by Indigo Sundry Soap Backwards Planning Financial New Dominion Design Company Rooted Pines Homestead Gray Toad Tallow, the Kingsridge Elderberries Reformation Heritage Books Squirrelly Joe's Coffee Stonecrop Wealth Advisors and our supporters@patreon.com.
- [00:28]
Pastor Brian
Sa what is time? Perhaps it's a question not worth asking for fear of the answer. Even the first forays into the question opens up labyrinthine corridors of convoluted paradox, difficulty, and strangeness. What is time, after all? Is it merely a construct of the mind, in effect of the interplay of consciousness and matter? Is it a thing in nature itself, however ethereal that thing might be? And if it is a thing that is somehow in nature in the same way gravity or mass or distance or electricity is in nature, just how ethereal is it? Where does it fall? Under man's dominion mandate, man has turned electricity into a tool in his hand, conquering the electromagnetic spectrum at least to some degree. In the process, man has learned how to use wind and differential pressures to make planes fly. Man has even used the correlationship of mass and gravity and heat to make all sorts of things that we use in everyday life. Man has dug deep into hills and mountains and mined metals for manufacturing, turning mountains on the lathe of his intellect into cars and cathedrals and computers and more. Could it be that man is to see time as a material to transform in his smithies? Is man to be a time rite, forming time into a servant of his dominion, as a shipwright forms wood hulls from forests? Could it be that man is supposed to see time as a mountain to be climbed, a peak on which to plant the flag of his conquest? Of course, the philosophers have offered us more answers to this question than there are seconds in the day. Plato equated time with motion, but motion is only possible and necessary with space or distance between things. Therefore, for Plato, time is a necessary byproduct of nature's failure to achieve omnipresence. Aristotle focused more on the three different modes of time, past, present, and future, and defined it as a number of movement in respect of the before and after. For all of pagan history, time was really only ever seen as an enemy to be fought against, or at best as a force of life that must just be tolerated. The Buddhist, who sees existence itself as the greatest sin might classify time as the greatest sinner. After all, what is more evil than the thing that gives the evil of life its room to breathe? To the Hindu, time is nothing more than the whims of Vishnu's thought or the churning of the cosmic ocean. Time for them takes the place of the Greco Roman chaos that sprouted the celestials and by them the world itself. The poetical Greeks and Romans had perhaps the most visceral image of man's relation to time ingrained in their religion from the earliest days. When Hesiod wrote of Cronos, the Titan, killer of the sky and the personification of time, eating all of his children, Father Time, Kronos. Saturn was the great consumer, the great devourer, the enemy of all of the world, who stands in the breach between death and the golden age that Zeus eventually ushered in. The only exception to this largely negative and black view of time has been the Abrahamic religions, especially, of course, Christianity. From the beginning, which was a thing God made, time has been a mechanism used in the hand of God's providence, through which his eternal counsels and glory and goodness are revealed, unfolding as chapters in a great divine story. For the Christian, time is a gift, one that was only ever meant to lead him to greater and greater degrees of glory and joy in his Maker. Of course, man fell and the world was cursed. One must ask, did time feel the force of this curse too? Perhaps. But that question extends beyond the scope of this episode and may as well leave it for another day. What was to the Greeks the great consumer is to the Christian a glorious pathway, one that, though it must be trod, must not always be lined with sorrow and dread. Time is a revelation of God to man. It is a canvas on which he paints a thing whose edges only fall away into the true ocean of eternity, the one filled with glorious light, the one whose pages are endless, where each chapter is better than the one before. Time is a crucible for creation, preparing it for the weight of glory it is to hold. By it we gained our incarnate Lord. By it we measure the reality of his death upon the cross. By it we recall the glorious morning of his resurrection. By it we walk along the road of God's will for our lives. By it we look forward to the day, the eternal sunrise that will begin our immortality and jocund revelry and holiness. After all, were all things to happen at once. Who could see the wonder of it all? We were made to live in a place where days pass, at least for a while, because we were made to be reminded of just how wonderful a thing it is for night to pass into the warmth of the sunlight. By time we press on toward the prize with a song of praise on our lips. It is by time that we are even able to sing. And only at the end of time will we be raised again to the marriage of Christ and his perfected church. With something so great on the horizon, who could do anything but patiently give time his due, looking with eager anticipation at all of the lesser glories it reveals along the way to that final and chief glory? Time is the blank sheet on which the music of providence is written. And providence is perfect music played out in imperfect time. But we could ask again, what is man's relationship to time in full? Can he take hold of time and twist it in his hands to make it his tool? Can he write his own notes on the music? Or is this tool a tool reserved only for the hands that holds all things together? In short, and finally, to the point of this episode, is time a road that man can travel on with freedom? Or is he bound to his lane and prescribed pace? Can a man travel into the past? Can a man skip ahead into the future? Is time a stream he can step out of and walk the bank as he will? These questions have haunted man for as long as he has been a sinner. What other thing could make man want to go back, save some kind of regret? What could make man want to go forward, save some kind of agony? This strange curiosity of ours with time, in our apparent eagerness to twist its arm for our own benefit, when viewed properly, seems to be a very macabre business. Back to the philosophers. They have come to different conclusions about this particular question. Of course, no surprises there. But they generally split the myriad answers into two broad categories. The first category inevitably saw time as a fundamental structure of the universe, something that was created, and therefore something that is a natural dimension unaffected by events and constant. The first category of answers depended upon a view of time in the abstract as a conceptualization of the human brain, as opposed to a natural sort of container that events flow through. Given this position, held by men like Leibniz and Kant, time cannot be manipulated, since time is not a thing. Rather, time here is, like the concept of numbers, useful but immaterial. The second category, though, inevitably saw time as a fundamental structure of the universe, something that was created, and therefore something that is a natural dimension normally unaffected by events and constant. But this view proved to hold a tighter grip on the imagination, since, being a fundamental part of nature, it meant that time could perhaps be molded. All of it eventually leaves one with the inevitable question, who's right? And if it is the second group that is right, what does it mean? Sometime in the 1950s or 60s. The records are dim. A Spanish TV personality named Jose Inigo was invited into the home of one of contemporary media's most attractive targets, a French magician named Richard Chanfre. Stepping out of the car and onto the crunchy surface of the pea gravel that was Chamfer's driveway, Inigo was struck by the beauty of his home. Surely this man was famous all over much of Europe, but he was still just a magician. Inigo wondered how he was able to afford such a massive and immaculately sustained palace. While he gawked, Sinfre himself opened the solid wooden double doors and stepped down the stairway to greet his guest with warmth and a smile. His smile had won him awards before, awards hardly anybody else could imagine, and Inigo understood why. Chauffre's subtle confidence and friendly swagger had a way of totally disarming whoever it was that it was directed towards. Once pleasantries had been exchanged, the duo proceeded back into the home for the show. Inigo had been promised something truly astonishing by the showman, and he was desperately trying to maintain the balance between skepticism and excitement. They passed through the marble tile kitchen via a wide hallway with all the bells and whistles one would expect in a grand hall. Busts of famous figures from history, oil paintings, chandeliers, wainscoting and molding. Overhead, the quiet halls echoed with the clacking of Chauffrey's leather stack heel boots. The small talk had ended in the kitchen, and now for the length of the hallway and into the small descending staircase at its end. The two didn't say a word. Down the narrow spiraling stairs they went until the world around Inigo had turned from luxury to dinge and dinginess. Concrete walls and the smell of old water in a sump dominated the senses in this seemingly ill lit dungeon. Chamfer led his guests through an archway in the wall before finally passing through a final door. The sight that greeted Inigo across the threshold was one he had trouble forgetting. Afterwards, the few days old corpse of a dog lay sprawled out on a metal table. An iron crucible was propped beside the table and a scorching pillar of flame blazed up beneath it. Wires crossed here and there across the ceiling, but Inigo could not determine what they were connected to. Finally, Sianfre broke the silence by asking if he would like to confirm that the dog was indeed truly dead. Inigo felt no need. This had clearly not been a peaceful death. In the midst of sleep, the dog was a mess of matted fur stained crimson with blood, and eyes that were glazed and sightless it was, was dead. There was, of course, also the smell. Jean Fre nodded, and the silence recommenced. An ego's temptation to horror was overcome by interest and curiosity as the man moved all around the room, making preparations and doing little tasks with grace and clear familiarity with his surroundings. He moved so quickly that the dangling wires on the ceiling began to sway. A vial of something here, a dust of powder there, a stir and a shake. A bit of this and a bit more of that. Inigo felt like he was on the scene of a cheesy movie, but it was all real. Suddenly Sianfre pulled his work away from the crucible and poured it into a tube set into water. Presumably this was to cool whatever solution was there. After a few seconds, the magician carefully walked the elixir over to the table and poured a drop of it into the dog's mouth in a rush of motion and disgusting noise. Inigo watched as the dog kicked and scrambled to get on its feet. Only two of the feet seemed to work, but the dog tried anyways. One eye stayed open while the other squinted shut from some discomfort. A hopeless yelp kept escaping the mouth. It was seconds before the two working legs began to shake with some new pain all of their own. The undead dog collapsed back down onto the cold mouth metal table, but its chest still heaved with what sounded like wet sand and gravel blocking its way. A few more seconds and all was back to silence. Nigo was horrified, but he was also completely amazed. The man had really done it. Chamfer, for all of his blustering and ego, had brought that dog back to life, though it had been dead for days. Inigo began to wonder if maybe he had been telling the truth. For you see, the reason Inigo had come here in the first place was to give Sienfrey the opportunity to privately back up a plane that he had publicly made, one that Inigo had scoffed at. John Frey, you see, had said that he was the Count of Saint Germain. As Europe erode the affluence of 1700s high society, a mysterious figure emerged in the royal courts of France who would soon come to be known as the Count of Saint Germain, though he would allegedly go on to outlive every person who took an interest in him, which was a great many people. His travels and accomplishments have been documented well enough to know that he was a very interesting man, though not well documented enough to remove the man's intrigue down to the present today claiming some level of royal descent, though the exact lineage seemed always to Change. The Count's rise to the upper echelon of the European social ladder was, he claimed, preceded by a five year long tenure of study in jewelcraft among the royal courts of the Persians and other more remote sects of the Eastern mystics. This rich education pulled people in right away wherever he went. And in 1742, he stood in the grand hall of Versailles, holding the attention of everyone present in the palm of his hand. He spoke of history, natural science, philosophy, religion and alchemy as one who had dedicated the entirety of their much longer adult life solely to each individual subject. When anyone was lucid enough to wonder if this man was actually just a charlatan speaking with certainty, that was actually just blowing smoke. Smoke. Their suspicions were immediately extinguished by some other expert in each field corroborating the Count's claims and even admitting that the Count seemed to be far more knowledgeable and talented even than they were. Apart from mastery over this vast field of knowledge, reports claim that the Count was also a prodigious artist of many different mediums. The truest Renaissance man the world had ever seen, more so even than Da Vinci. He was an accomplished oil painter. He could play the violin with enough skill to warrant a close correspondence with classical masters like Mozart and Salieri. He could write poetic verse with enough pathos to cause even the most callous hearts to melt away. Before the fire of his words. The man seemed incapable of doing anything poorly. But though we all know people in our lives who seem good at everything they touch, The Count of St. Germain's skills seemed to go way beyond what anyone could ever imagine. Yet in all of this, the thing the Count seemed best at was making friends. He remained simply the most charming man any of his contemporaries had ever met. His charm was not bound by cultural boundaries either. The Count was a polyglot, totally fluent in nearly every major European language, and even some non European languages like English, Russian, Chinese, Arabic, ancient languages like Greek and Sanskrit and more. Everyone marveled at how a single individual could do and know so much in such a short time. After all, the Count was witnessed by all to be about 45 years of age. But it's precisely here in the question of his age where things begin to take a genuinely strange turn when it comes to the Count of Saint Germain. For it seems his charm was not only strong enough to cross the borders of culture, but also of time. In Paris in 1760, an elderly aristocrat named Countess von Jorgi was told by a younger friend of hers that the spellbinding count would be at an exclusive soiree the two women would both be attending later that week. The party was to take place at the estate of Madame de Pompadour, the mistress to the reigning monarch of France, King Louis xvon. Georgy was taken aback and extremely interested at this news, for the name reminded her of another Count of Saint Germain she had become close with while staying at the Royal Court of Venice in the year 1710. Fifty years prior, in fact, von Jorgy claimed she and The Count of St. Germain had not only known each other, but loved each other, and even had it officially courted for some of her time before things eventually broke off. When the now aged Countess met with this new Count of Saint Germain at de Pompadour soiree, she could hardly hold back her shock at the resemblance this man held to her previous suitor. It was as if the two were identical twins. The voice, the hair, the eyes, the figure and face, everything was exactly as she remembered her former love to be. He seemed completely frozen in time. Of course, she couldn't totally hide her surprise from him, and so she finally asked whether or not he had a father or who had lived in Venice back in 1710. The Count smiled a knowing smile and replied, no, Madame, but I was living in Venice during that time and had the pleasure of serving your court. Then her shock took on a new flavor, one with horror at least serving as a garnish. She stated that such a thing could not be possible, as the Count she Knew then was 45 years old and that he, this doppelganger count, looked no older at all. But it was so the same count in 1760s Paris had also been atop the elite class in 1710's Venice, and in both places and times he was the same age. Records from Venice proved that more than one countess was very close with the Countess St. Germain then, and all of them corroborated what she had heard about him and said about him after the encounter at the soiree. At any rate, the Count that Von Georgy met in Paris ended their brief conversation with a winking smile in the words, madame, I am very old. Throughout the remaining decades of the 18th century, the Count of St. Germain's fame would only only spread further. In 1763, he became a trusted advisor to the Royal Court in the Netherlands. While sojourning there, he became friends with the infamous Giacomo Casanova. Commenting on his friendship, Casanova would say, this extraordinary man would say in an easy, assured manner that he was 300 years old, that he knew the secret of Universal medicine, that he possessed a mastery over nature. Nature that he could melt diamonds. All this, he said, was a mere trifle to him. Two years later, in 1765, the Count traveled to Russia to assist in a political conspiracy that resulted in Catherine the Great ascending to the throne. In 1774, he returned to France and became close to the new royal family led by Louis XVI and Marie Antoinette. The Count is said to have gained the royal trust so much that he was eventually made Marie Antoinette's chief advisor. There's one legend written by one of the Queen's head maidens, which tells of the Count prophesying the decapitation of the Queen that would occur via Revolution 15 years in the future. It's by the testimony of this woman named Countess d'adhemar that we know for certain a man named Count de Saint Germain was in the royal court of France at that time, without, without any doubt, as she wrote the memoir of her queen in her book Souvenirs of Marie Antoinette in 1821. In the late 1700s, the count supposedly traveled to Hamburg, Germany, where he practiced deep alchemy in service of the throne there. In fact, it's here where a death certificate does exist for the Count of Saint Germain, dated February 27, 1784. But that, of course, is not the end of the story. Instead, many believe this death to have been faked to keep up appearances for the Count and afford him a sort of fresh start. Records naming him stretch on into the 19th and 20th centuries. But instead of the high class royalty he was known by in earlier times, his correspondence began to take on an even more esoteric flavor. The Count was also known as a master alchemist, capable of using his philosopher's stone to turn base metals into gold. But after 1784, the Count really leaned into the mystical practices that had made him rich. For proof, we need look no further than a German magazine from 1785, one year after the Count's documented death, that names him as the chief representative of the Freemasons in the country. And Countess Dadimar, that woman who wrote of the Count's advisory role to Marie Antoinette, well, she writes of seeing him at the Queen's execution in 1793. She goes on to claim encounters with the completely unaged Count up to the year 1820. Perhaps the most compelling and dark myth of St. Germain comes in the form of a picture taken from the 1880s that was taken in India. The picture seems innocent enough at first glance. An elderly woman sitting sits in a chair with three men standing behind and Beside her, the caption names the men as Lord Cthumi, Lord Mororia and Lord St. Germain. But it's when one notices the name of the woman that he begins to realize just how strange this photograph is. Apart from the obvious presence of the possibly immortal man, the woman in the chair is named Helena Blavatsky, the founder of Theosophy. Theosophy is a syncretistic and esoteric religion that combines Gnosticism and Neoplatonism with Eastern mysticism and Oriental religions. And it's occultic to the hilt, focused completely on the ascension of the individual to the realm and rank of deity. Indeed, it is a religion whose incompatibility with Christian teaching cannot be overstated. It's a pernicious evil, even up to this day, though few know what it is. But one of its core beliefs, one that potentially sheds new light on why a man named Lord Saint Germain was present in that photograph so long after his alleged death, is the idea of ancient beings called ascended masters. These beings, who were formerly humans, around during the time of the ancient days, when man enjoyed a golden age of perfect communion with one another in creation. Creation, among other things, they were preserved and given a sort of supernatural ability to transcend time. The use of this gift was to preserve the one true religious doctrine from complete annihilation from the world. Their gift was given them so that they could be a gift to mankind, a vessel of esoteric truth that would save everyone. The point is, Helena Blavatsky, along with many other prominent Theosophies, with this, were confident that The Count of St. Germain was one of these ascended masters. They claimed to know him personally and to have been instructed by him in the ways of truth. Blavatsky went so far as to say that she herself was merely a vessel used to distribute the Count's message of truth to mankind. The picture is not just a woman in front of some young noblemen. It is, they claimed, a teacher flanked by her teachers, three of the ascended masters, one of whom is the old Count of Saint Germain. Of course, the truth of this strange man is up for endless debate and can't be fully known. But that doesn't totally matter in this context. Let me explain why. Whether the son of a Transylvanian Prince born in 1690, or the Pastoral Hesiod from the slopes of helicon in the 9th century BC, the effect of the Count's myth remains the the same. Thousands of people believe that St. Germain is far older than whatever he says. They believe he's an esoteric magician who found the secret to the philosopher's stone and immortality. They believe he is an ancient Roman blasphemer, cursed to roam the earth in search of a peaceful death he will never find. They believe he's somehow special, somehow set apart as one who can bend the fabric of reality in space as he pleases in order to arrive at and thrive in whatever place and time he deems fit for himself. The Count of Saint Germain, many are convinced was or maybe is some sort of demigod time traveler. But what should we think about all of that? Saint Germain is a man who never dies and who knows everything. Voltaire. Welcome to another episode of Haunted Cosmos. This week, we'll be talking about the man mysteries of time.
- [26:32]
Ben Garrett
Welcome, everybody, to this episode of Haunted Cosmos. I'm here with my normal co host, Pastor Brian, Sa good friend of mine, by the way, and we're glad to be here with all of you. So, Brian, how about you say hey to the people.
- [26:46]
Pastor Brian
It is good to be here haunting the cosmos with my guy, Ben Garrett.
- [26:50]
Ben Garrett
We just threw a time travelers party a few hours ago. No one showed up, so.
- [26:55]
Pastor Brian
So basically this episode's pointless.
- [26:57]
Ben Garrett
Exactly. This episode is just now. I mean, can it, though.
- [27:01]
Pastor Brian
What is a time traveler party? Because they don't have to come. I guess that assumes.
- [27:04]
Ben Garrett
That's the thing.
- [27:05]
Pastor Brian
Like, our parties are so good that no one would like. It's a impossibility for someone not to show up to a party we invite them to.
- [27:11]
Ben Garrett
I mean, isn't that true?
- [27:13]
Pastor Brian
No, that's good. That's legit. That's a fair assumption.
- [27:14]
Ben Garrett
That's a good.
- [27:15]
Pastor Brian
What's the time travelers party?
- [27:17]
Ben Garrett
So Stephen Hawking did this before he died. He did a time travelers party where he, like, he decked out this whole place that he rented. It was really nice, banners and everything. He didn't allow any pictures or any publicity of the party until after it happened. And then he put it online to say, like, I had a time travel and no one showed up. So he was trying to debunk time travel into the past.
- [27:39]
Pastor Brian
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [27:41]
Ben Garrett
Because they would have seen it on Twitter. Yeah, that's assuming that they saw it on Twitter.
- [27:44]
Pastor Brian
Well, is Twitter even around? Time travel is.
- [27:47]
Ben Garrett
Who would you rather go to a party with, Stephen Hawking or us?
- [27:51]
Pastor Brian
Oh, us. Easy.
- [27:52]
Ben Garrett
Us. Easily.
- [27:54]
Pastor Brian
Not even close. Like, I could beat Stephen Hawking in an arm wrestle. I could be Stephen Hawking in almost any competition of physical strength.
- [28:01]
Ben Garrett
I think the almost. Guys, my voice is messed up, so I'm gonna crack. I'M gonna sound like a, like a pubescent teen. I think the reason to go to a Stephen Hawking party, and I don't mean to sound insensitive, is to see if he thinks the jokes are funny or if he thinks they're also offensive.
- [28:18]
Pastor Brian
And there's only one way to find out. And comedy's all about taking risks.
- [28:22]
Ben Garrett
Exactly.
- [28:23]
Pastor Brian
And that is telling a Stephen Hawking joke to Stephen Hawking.
- [28:26]
Ben Garrett
It'd be like telling him. He responds, ha ha ha ha ha. Tell me another. Tell me another one.
- [28:34]
Pastor Brian
May I have another?
- [28:35]
Ben Garrett
Tell me another.
- [28:37]
Pastor Brian
Is he typing it?
- [28:38]
Ben Garrett
Take me to the future. Yeah. No, it's like a finger trackpad thing.
- [28:42]
Pastor Brian
That's crazy.
- [28:42]
Ben Garrett
It is crazy. By the way, Theory of Everything, pretty fascinating movie.
- [28:46]
Pastor Brian
I haven't seen it.
- [28:47]
Ben Garrett
I mean I don't think it's don't stop everything, but if someone puts it on, you'll be like, oh, this is interesting.
- [28:53]
Pastor Brian
Hey guys, quick reminder here at the beginning of this episode. Before we get in all the time. Woo. Time travel. Before we put on our like debunking hat or our make sure you check out. I know like we're always an audio forward. Like this is an audio experience. Sound design, rich theater of the mind. But we've really upped our YouTube game.
- [29:13]
Ben Garrett
Yep.
- [29:14]
Pastor Brian
Our video game. You can watch full episodes now. Multiple angles, lots of cool editing, things like that on Twitter or X.com and on YouTube on our channel. So you should go, go subscribe on YouTube if you haven't already. And our goal is to beat Dude Perfect by the end of the year.
- [29:34]
Ben Garrett
That is a goal that we could.
- [29:36]
Pastor Brian
Have like 100 million subscribers. We have 38,000.
- [29:40]
Ben Garrett
Like a soft pitch goal that we have talked about is trying to get 100,000 subs on YouTube before the end of the season. Right.
- [29:45]
Pastor Brian
Which forces Alphabet Corporation to send us a silver play button.
- [29:49]
Ben Garrett
Exactly. Which, which we want by law. I want a silver play button so that I can hold it actually just over my face for the entire episode.
- [29:56]
Pastor Brian
You won't know if we get a silver play button, but there will be signs because we'll talk about it constantly.
- [30:01]
Ben Garrett
Yes, exactly.
- [30:02]
Pastor Brian
So in a very real sense.
- [30:03]
Ben Garrett
And we'll show it to you constantly so you will actually see.
- [30:05]
Pastor Brian
So go subscribe there. Check it out. We, because of the support of all of our great patrons, we've been able to hire a full time video audio.
- [30:13]
Ben Garrett
His name Producer Martin.
- [30:15]
Pastor Brian
Martin.
- [30:16]
Ben Garrett
I call him Martina McBride. First time I've ever called him.
- [30:20]
Pastor Brian
He doesn't call him that. Praise the Lord. But we're thankful to have him on board and he's doing a great job, so check it out there. And speaking of supporting the show, guys, if you. If you sign up for Patreon today, we're. We're known. We're well known for our wild Patreon giveaways.
- [30:37]
Ben Garrett
Yeah, we're giveaway enjoyers. Okay.
- [30:39]
Pastor Brian
We love giveaways.
- [30:40]
Ben Garrett
So if you want episodes of the Dusty Tome, there's literally over 80 episodes.
- [30:46]
Pastor Brian
Yeah, by the time this comes out, it's gonna be like 85. Actually.
- [30:48]
Ben Garrett
It'll probably. Yeah, yeah, it'll be around 86.
- [30:51]
Pastor Brian
That's right.
- [30:51]
Ben Garrett
Yeah. Yeah, we're nearing 100. Gonna do something big for that. Or. Or we won't.
- [30:56]
Pastor Brian
No, we will, though. Probably.
- [30:57]
Ben Garrett
We probably might.
- [30:58]
Pastor Brian
So we probably maybe will.
- [31:00]
Ben Garrett
But anyway, if you're into that kind of thing, consider becoming a patron. The top two tiers actually get early access to the main show, which is really cool. They get video and audio access and it's ad free, so I think that's a pretty big perk. But definitely to further incentivize you, Brian, what are we going to be offering as a giveaway today?
- [31:19]
Pastor Brian
If you sign up today for Patreon, we are going to be giving a handful for people who sign up just the day this episode releases that Wednesday. If you sign up any tier, we'll put you in a drawing for a brand new T shirt design that we just came out with. It looks like this. Using the power of video editing.
- [31:38]
Ben Garrett
Wow.
- [31:39]
Pastor Brian
Maybe I'm wearing it. Maybe Ben is. Maybe it's just in front of Ben's face. I don't know.
- [31:43]
Ben Garrett
Could be.
- [31:43]
Pastor Brian
But a T shirt. And we're gonna also for our existing patrons, we do another giveaway. So there'll be a giveaway for our existing patrons as well. So they're not left out. And guys, it's. But it's worth it even without the giveaway.
- [31:55]
Ben Garrett
Honestly, I mean, it is like giveaway. It's like a carrot. You know, it's a carrot, though. That is a gateway to like a cupcake. Yeah, you know something better.
- [32:05]
Pastor Brian
You get a carrot, but then you're like a cupcake.
- [32:07]
Ben Garrett
It's like when your mom's like, if you eat that carrot, I'll give you this cookie. If you eat the carrot of the shirt, I will give you the cookie of the Patreon experience. Wow.
- [32:16]
Pastor Brian
Super clear. The other thing is that. And we'll jump in after this, but we do have a book now. Almost definitely at. We're in the past, right? Now. So we're time traveling to you from the past. That's right in this episode. But it's almost definitely shipping by the time you. It's. The pre order's been open since like October 1st, but the it's going to be shipping and in our hands like in mid November, so probably around then. So we'll be sending it copies the same like day or day after you order. Go check it out. It's called Haunted Cosmos. Doing your duty in a world that's not just stuff. It is 75,000 words, over 200 pages. All original content, by the way. It's not like a rehashing of shows or like a repackaging of something we already did.
- [33:01]
Ben Garrett
You know, we're like in some of the chapters I'll throw in something from the dusty tome that I wrote. But it relates to the larger point and the larger point is always original. So we're trying to go OC here, not Orange county, but original content.
- [33:14]
Pastor Brian
OC Choppers. I don't know how to make it more clear than that.
- [33:17]
Ben Garrett
Occ West Coast Choppers, Discovery Channel. Go check that out. You all know exactly what I'm talking about.
- [33:21]
Pastor Brian
Newchristianimpress.com Cosmos is where you can pick that book up. And if you are in Canada, we also have a supplier in Canada that there should be a link there on the page that you can get it. Yes, as well. So just go pick it up guys. It'll be to you. Well in time for Christmas, get a couple for gifts for your friends and family and we hope you enjoy it. We really put our backs into this book trying to make it as good as we possibly could. So hope you enjoy. It's a hardcover premium edition that's out right now and honestly it's great.
- [33:53]
Ben Garrett
Now speaking of premium. Premium.
- [33:55]
Pastor Brian
Yeah.
- [33:55]
Ben Garrett
Okay, let's talk about time travel.
- [33:57]
Pastor Brian
Yeah, Good transition.
- [33:58]
Ben Garrett
And I think you understand what I mean by that. So I hope somebody does because I don't.
- [34:01]
Pastor Brian
Yeah, I don't like.
- [34:04]
Ben Garrett
Well, me neither. So I guess here we are. I guess one of the things to clarify right away before I jump into asking you questions and just start. Start going off is we're using the the term time travel pretty generally here.
- [34:18]
Pastor Brian
Sure.
- [34:18]
Ben Garrett
Really this episode is about anomalies in time.
- [34:22]
Pastor Brian
Just timey wimey stuff.
- [34:23]
Ben Garrett
Exactly. Timey wimey histor anomalies.
- [34:27]
Pastor Brian
Yeah.
- [34:27]
Ben Garrett
So time slippage, you know, the Count of Saint Germain, pseudo immortality stuff showing.
- [34:33]
Pastor Brian
Up across a vast period of time. Either time traveling or is semi immortal of some sort.
- [34:41]
Ben Garrett
Or maybe he's like a transcendent theosophic being, which I doubt.
- [34:47]
Pastor Brian
If that's the case. Let's just agree right now. Demons.
- [34:50]
Ben Garrett
You want to know what's actually really on brand is that that's the theory that I'm like. Yeah, that's what it is.
- [34:55]
Pastor Brian
Oh, I think so too. Because of the theosophy.
- [34:58]
Ben Garrett
Yeah, I think that he was legit. I think that theosophy is actually a really dangerous doctrine even in our modern day. A lot of people don't realize how theosophic a lot of mega evangelicalism can get. And I think that because of that I actually do think that The Count of St. Germain was a demon. So take your drink. You know, we already blamed it on the demons and it's early in the episode.
- [35:19]
Pastor Brian
Yeah, what is it? The drinking game where someone takes a shot every time we, every time we blame someone. Something on the demons.
- [35:25]
Ben Garrett
Yes, yes.
- [35:26]
Pastor Brian
The reason that blame things on the demons is, is that it's actually the demon's fault that we do that. So there you go. I just blame the demons on us blaming the demons for things. So take another one.
- [35:38]
Ben Garrett
Don't shoot.
- [35:38]
Pastor Brian
Actually don't do that. I don't want you to. Drunkenness is bad.
- [35:41]
Ben Garrett
No, I said Capri Sun.
- [35:42]
Pastor Brian
Oh, we say drinking. Yeah, we're talking about Capri the whole time. That's what I thought he was talking about too.
- [35:45]
Ben Garrett
100%. 100%.
- [35:47]
Pastor Brian
So let's, let's talk a little bit about the, the Count of Saint Germain because it's just seriously fascinating. We, we could do like a whole whole multi part episode series on this guy.
- [35:55]
Ben Garrett
And a lot of people have.
- [35:56]
Pastor Brian
And people have. Because there's. You can go deep. He has, he shows up across countries, across centuries and he is just some of the characteristics that make it really difficult to completely ignore. Like to, to the point about where there's genuinely. It's not unreasonable to conclude that there's actually something crazy and supernatural going on is that he shows up in lots of reliable records. He definitely existed. First of all, this wasn't a totally fake, like made up hoaxy kind of thing. We'll get into some of that later in the episode. But he shows up. He is by multiple credible accounts of eyewitnesses able to speak fluently in more than 10 languages.
- [36:42]
Ben Garrett
And like Eastern and Western languages, Sanskrit, Chinese, like it's a very wide swath of languages.
- [36:49]
Pastor Brian
And apart from one of the accounts talking about his French which said that he had a very specific French accent from a particular region, it's like he's speaking fairly perfectly. It sounds like a local. Not only that, he's a master in just vast number of disciplines from oil painting to violin and composing. He composed more than 50 violin pieces to poetry to. He was well known in making dyes.
- [37:19]
Ben Garrett
Yeah.
- [37:20]
Pastor Brian
So there was. And at that time that was very difficult art and science to make dyes to dye clothing or to dye pieces of fabric or to dye makeup, which they would call paint at that time to put on like women's faces. So he was a known master or.
- [37:32]
Ben Garrett
Guys faces at that time.
- [37:34]
Pastor Brian
That's true of making dyes and makeup. He was widely known for his jewelry lore. Like he would come. He was.
- [37:44]
Ben Garrett
He was like Feanor, bro was blinged.
- [37:46]
Pastor Brian
Out wherever he went.
- [37:47]
Ben Garrett
Bro was literally Feanor.
- [37:49]
Pastor Brian
Yeah. Like the smithy. Like the rite.
- [37:51]
Ben Garrett
Yes, yes.
- [37:52]
Pastor Brian
The jewelry gem.
- [37:53]
Ben Garrett
Right. Of the North Lord. Yeah. It's really interesting. And he was an alchemist. So that's kind of the through thread of this is he was an expert alchemist who is said to have created the philosopher's stone. And he could actually change it kind of transcended just the philosopher's stone, though. Because it wasn't just that he could change different elements into metal. It was that he could change whatever element into whatever.
- [38:17]
Pastor Brian
Yeah. And it was like. So the philosopher's stone, in case no one's tracking with us. Alchemy is like a mystical process. It was long sought after in medieval through Renaissance. Like people were obsessed with this idea that you could come up with these processes that would transmutate one material into another material.
- [38:36]
Ben Garrett
And.
- [38:36]
Pastor Brian
And though it's often trying to transmutate common materials like lead into something valuable like gold, it's about more than that.
- [38:44]
Ben Garrett
Yeah.
- [38:45]
Pastor Brian
Ultimately about the quest to make this substance known as the philosopher's stone, which the original Harry Potter book is about this. The American edition is named Harry Potter and the Sorcerer's Stone cause they thought Americans were dumb. But the real British title is Harry Potter and the Philosopher's Stone.
- [39:03]
Ben Garrett
Harry Potter end up.
- [39:06]
Pastor Brian
It would not only produce endless gold. Thank you for that.
- [39:09]
Ben Garrett
You're welcome. That's how they pronounce it.
- [39:10]
Pastor Brian
It would not only produce endless gold, but it would make you either immortal or so close to immortal that it was indistinguishable.
- [39:18]
Ben Garrett
Yeah.
- [39:18]
Pastor Brian
So they said he did this.
- [39:19]
Ben Garrett
And what's funny, like they say it's a stone. In the Count of St. Germain's case, it was a powder. It's like the special powder. And he could recreate it endless amount of times because you can transmutate it from any material once you get the. And it's very esoteric. Like, the Freemasons and the Rosicrucians were very into it, apart from just the medieval age. And of course, it is the precursor to modern chemistry, which is very fascinating as well. The other really cool thing about the Saint Germain. Dude, my voice crack is I love it.
- [39:49]
Pastor Brian
That's good.
- [39:50]
Ben Garrett
Yeah, it's charming. Not only could he write verse and compose music and paint masterfully on a canvas, but he could do it all ambidextrous. This is just a fun little detail. So he was supposed to be able to, like, start on opposite ends of the page, a line of verse, and write in the opposite direction and then meet in the middle. And it, like, makes total sense, and it's really good. And he was supposed to do the same thing with painting. He could paint with both hands, and it would be this, like, flawless, you know, genre piece or something like that.
- [40:23]
Pastor Brian
Can you imagine being his friend?
- [40:25]
Ben Garrett
No.
- [40:25]
Pastor Brian
Constantly overshadowed. Like, no matter how good you are at something, he's like, oh, I. You know, hey, I'm really good at darts. He's like, oh, he's the one ups. I actually played on the Z Italian, the darts team. Which ones are the Olympics. But it's like going to a dinner.
- [40:43]
Ben Garrett
Party with Neil Armstrong.
- [40:44]
Pastor Brian
I've been at the moon.
- [40:46]
Ben Garrett
Yeah, you're telling, like, the best fishing story anyone's ever heard. And he's like, cool. I went to the moon.
- [40:52]
Pastor Brian
I went to the moon.
- [40:52]
Ben Garrett
Or did I? We'll let you guys decide until later, and then we'll decide for you.
- [41:03]
Pastor Brian
Hey, Ben, I just read that our great grandparents probably experimented with butter on their dry skin as a moisturizer. Is that why you look so radiant?
- [41:12]
Ben Garrett
Maybe it's Grandma's butter recipe. Or maybe it's Grandma Gray Toe Tallow.
- [41:16]
Pastor Brian
Their tallow products are 100 organic and naturally contain the good stuff your skin craves. No mystery there.
- [41:24]
Ben Garrett
So say sayonara, Sammy to kitchen experiments. And say hello to healthier skin Gray Totalo. Trusted by Skin Envied by Great Grandma's Butter Recipe.
- [41:36]
Pastor Brian
For more information and to get a sample pack, check out graytoedtalo.com. don't forget to use the code COSMOS15. That's all caps COSMOS15 for 15 off your order. Ben, do you know what's weird? The fact that Gobekli Tepe contains advanced.
- [42:01]
Ben Garrett
Technology far beyond the time period in which it was made.
- [42:04]
Pastor Brian
Okay, nerd. I was thinking more in the vein of health and wellness in this cold and flu season.
- [42:09]
Ben Garrett
Oh, well, were you actually thinking about how God gave us amazing small native berries called elderberries that actually carry all kinds of vitamins and minerals and antioxidants and antiviral compounds that our bodies crave.
- [42:25]
Pastor Brian
And that Trevor and Autumn at the King's Ridge grow and produce the freshest elderberries and elderberry syrup known to mankind.
- [42:32]
Ben Garrett
Okay, so I'm guessing you were talking about that, but did you also know that they're running a special for haunted cosmonauts? That's right. If you use code Haunted all capshaunted, you can get 10% off your first order@tkrfarm.com dude, absolutely the best news I've heard today.
- [42:59]
Pastor Brian
Want to start reading the Puritans but don't know where to begin? Puritan Treasures for Today from Reformation Heritage Books makes the riches of these godly writers of old accessible for the modern reader.
- [43:10]
Ben Garrett
With updated language and helpful introductions, these classic works from John Owen, Jeremiah Burroughs and more are the perfect starting point for the curious reader.
- [43:20]
Pastor Brian
Learn more about the Puritan Treasures for today@HeritageBooks.org Puritan treasures that's in title case Puritan Treasures and make sure you use the code haunted for 10% off your order.
- [43:37]
Ben Garrett
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- [44:39]
Pastor Brian
Stonecrop Wealth Advisors is here to help. Stonecrop offers faith based portfolios to help you direct your hard earned investment dollars away from those kinds of companies and toward companies that are having a positive impact on society. They also offer comprehensive financial planning to help give you peace of mind about your future that these investment dollars support.
- [44:58]
Ben Garrett
Get the demons out of your portfolio and instead invest in God's kingdom while you grow your Wealth. Contact Stonecrop Wealth Advisors today by visiting StoneCropAdvisors.com Haunted Cosmos. That's StoneCropAdvisors.com haunted cosmos. Or just click the link in the description below.
- [45:19]
Pastor Brian
Investment advisory services offered through Stonecrop Wealth Advisors, LLC, a registered investment advisor with the U.S. securities and Exchange Commission. So what? There's one story even related to alchemy because people said that he could melt diamonds.
- [45:33]
Ben Garrett
Yeah.
- [45:33]
Pastor Brian
Which is.
- [45:34]
Ben Garrett
Which is insane.
- [45:34]
Pastor Brian
Come on. Yeah, they brought him. I think it was the King Louis xvi, I think it was. Who was the son of the. The Sun King of France.
- [45:43]
Ben Garrett
I could be honest. No, the 15th was the Sun King.
- [45:45]
Pastor Brian
Yeah. So he was the 16th because the.
- [45:47]
Ben Garrett
16Th was the one that got the beloved. The boot. Yeah.
- [45:50]
Pastor Brian
But he was he. The son of the Sun King started reigning when he was five.
- [45:54]
Ben Garrett
Yes.
- [45:55]
Pastor Brian
This was the one who gave St. Germain a diamond that had a flaw in it. It was like a large diamond and it was worth, like, 6,000 livres. And it was like, leave and leave.
- [46:08]
Ben Garrett
Hey, please do it again, dude.
- [46:10]
Pastor Brian
You're welcome. And he was like, yeah, this would be worth 10,000 if it didn't have this flaw. Can you fix it? And the Count takes it and looks at it, and he's like, yes, I'll return it in a month. And so a month later, he returns the diamond. Allegedly. And it's nearly identical, but the flaw is gone. The only change is that it's ever so slightly smaller.
- [46:35]
Ben Garrett
Huh.
- [46:36]
Pastor Brian
The idea being that he was able to somehow melt and reconstitute this diamond, and it would. To fill the volume slightly smaller.
- [46:44]
Ben Garrett
Wow.
- [46:45]
Pastor Brian
So, like, okay, that's hoaxable. Like, you could just replace it.
- [46:48]
Ben Garrett
I just leave it with a smaller.
- [46:50]
Pastor Brian
Diamond, you know, and he just takes the. He eats the cost. And he's like, this is worth 4,000. Whatever. Because the thing is about Livre. Livre.
- [46:57]
Ben Garrett
Yeah, Livre.
- [46:58]
Pastor Brian
He was always so. So wealthy.
- [47:02]
Ben Garrett
Yeah.
- [47:02]
Pastor Brian
That there was one time he was at a party. I think it was in France, because they're always blinged out.
- [47:07]
Ben Garrett
Yeah. Dude, France was crazy.
- [47:09]
Pastor Brian
He's wearing shoes that are so encrusted with diamonds. Shoes that a jeweler who saw them estimated their value at 200,000. Leave. Which is like, an insane amount of money.
- [47:22]
Ben Garrett
Yeah. Because that was, you know, inflation. So that's a lot. I mean, pre.
- [47:25]
Pastor Brian
Inflate. Can you imagine?
- [47:27]
Ben Garrett
200,000 livre.
- [47:30]
Pastor Brian
Wow.
- [47:30]
Ben Garrett
I mean, sign me up.
- [47:32]
Pastor Brian
Did you know that you got a lot of leaf when you are, like, wearing shoes that are encrusted in diamonds?
- [47:38]
Ben Garrett
The origin. My goodness. The origin story of Saint Germain is also definitely really interesting, because first of all, we shouldn't pretend to think that he would tell everyone his origin story.
- [47:53]
Pastor Brian
Yeah, like the true one.
- [47:54]
Ben Garrett
Right. So he said, you know, I was born to a Romanian prince or something like that, undocumented. No one could ever figure it out. He was like, it's supposed to be an illegitimate son or something like that. Who then just comes to France. The crazy thing about the St. Germain story to me is that there's this high concentration of activity around the 18th century and things like that. And even then, he was supposed to be very old, 150, 160 years old. And that's really strange in itself. But then, of course, we have records of his death.
- [48:27]
Pastor Brian
1785.
- [48:28]
Ben Garrett
Right. He died, or that iteration of The Count of St. Germain. Died, died. And then the big mic drop of the cold open, in case y'all missed it, is that. Then he shows up in this image with Maria. Whatever.
- [48:41]
Pastor Brian
Blavatsky. Helen.
- [48:44]
Ben Garrett
Helen.
- [48:44]
Pastor Brian
Thank you. Maria Antoinette was another one in his story.
- [48:48]
Ben Garrett
But, yeah, no, I'm not thinking. Like, I was about to call her Aniston. Ludmila, of course, because every Russian woman is. Yeah. So Helena Blavatsky. Yeah, right. She was the founder of Theosophy. And she has this picture when she's in Delhi in India surrounded by three men, and one of them is the Count of St. Germain. And that is crazy to me.
- [49:10]
Pastor Brian
Yeah.
- [49:11]
Ben Garrett
That is so cool. And so it does make you wonder, like, if that is true. And it could, you know, it could all be a hoax, but if that is true, where might that kind of character be today? Have they left?
- [49:24]
Pastor Brian
That's the crazy thing.
- [49:25]
Ben Garrett
Are they part of the government macro system?
- [49:27]
Pastor Brian
So, because he was.
- [49:27]
Ben Garrett
Is it Justin Trudeau?
- [49:29]
Pastor Brian
Not only a little bit of. There's some cross threads here that I think we will, in later episodes do whole episodes on things like the Freemasons and the Rosicrucians. But he also claimed to be a part of the Rosicrucians. And then. Which is like the Rosy Cross, the.
- [49:43]
Ben Garrett
Order of the Rosy Cross, founded by a fellow named Kristen Rosenkreuz, by the.
- [49:48]
Pastor Brian
Way, and they were related to the Freemasons as well. Then later. So at first, if I'm not mistaken, the Rosac Crucian Order was. And I might be off on this. This is from memory. But the beginning of their order, there were, like, a very fixed small number of them, and they were so secretive that they didn't even all supposedly know who all the other ones were or something like that. But their purpose was allegedly that they would have this secret knowledge that they would give to humanity through these sort of subtle means to try and actually lift humanity up from the oppression of elites and the powers that be that we're trying to keep men down. So there's even one theory like this is wild, but that, like, Francis Bacon is related to the Rosicrucians and Shakespeare, and that Francis Bacon actually was the one who really wrote Shakespeare, and that he did this in order to subtly shed light on the way that the government was actually operating. Because Shakespeare's plays, one of the things that's controversial about them at the time was that they were critical of or they made light of or sport of the courts and the royal court and, like, how the nobles and the elites were functioning. So the theory is like, the Rosicrucians were secretly giving knowledge that humanity wasn't quite ready for, but they would sprinkle it into their popular culture to, like, lift them up so they would learn how to take governance of themselves and things like that. I don't believe any of this just adds up. But this is like one of the theories that the Count of Saint Germain, as an ascended master, is one of these Gnostic Gnosis givers. He gives knowledge to mankind. Which takes us back to Quetzalcoatl and the post deluge.
- [51:36]
Ben Garrett
Yes, all of these sages. Okay, so this actually connects really well. There's the theme of the seven sages that come after the deluge in mythologies all over the world. In fact, in Greek antiquity, Solon, the guy who apparently told Plato about Atlantis or Plato's ancestor, was one of the Greek seven sages. So he was a Macedonian sage who went to the Egyptian sage and they conglomerated and stuff. Quetzalcoatl is one of them. And then a lot of the other pantheon in north and South America, that time in Latin America, were also one of the seven sages. The Hindus have this tradition. The Chinese have this tradition. The Japanese have this tradition. The Babylonians have this tradition with the Enki. So Oannes was the primary Enki who became the Apkallu. And they're the seven sages that came after the flood and apparently saved man's civilization from complete destruction. Now, the idea is, with Rosicrucianism and Theosophy and other esoteric religions as well, the idea is that that really did happen. But they were all the same seven. So they weren't different seven sages that went to all these different Coastlines, but they were all the same seven, which I think if you read a book like the East Face of Helicon, the author's name escapes me right now, but it can help you see how that could be legit with a Babylonian religion that then spread out. But the idea kind of coming now is that they were all the same seven sages, and they reincarnate. So they actually do kind of embody the. Well, or they ensoul, I guess, the body of different people. When that body is worn out, or when it becomes unreasonable to keep it alive, like a St. Germain kind of thing, they actually do die, and they get a record of death, and then they reincarnate in someone else. And so with the Rosicrucians, the interesting connection is you're exactly right at the beginning. It was founded by this pseudo mythical figure named Christian Rosenkreuz, who is supposed to be the new Christ, who introduced the completed doctrine of the Christ. Since the world in his time was finally ready for it. That was his grand revelation. And so it was a syncretism of Western and Eastern mystic thinking. We've seen this tale told a number of times, but there were seven other members. And so they were like the new seven sages of man. And one of them is like. One idea is that one of them was or became the Count of Charmaine.
- [54:11]
Pastor Brian
Yeah.
- [54:12]
Ben Garrett
And the thing like, I don't know where I stand with all that at all. It's crazy.
- [54:17]
Pastor Brian
I think you look at that and one explanation. There's two explanations that make sense to me. One is, of course, a garbled Noahic figure and his sons, and they're going forth and it gets garbled until it's this. But the other one would be an intentional twisting of the story mythologically by demonic and evil people and Satanic religion to give a counter narrative to the deluge and say, it wasn't that. It was this, in fact. Now, what you need is listen to these people, and they'll lead you on the path to enlightenment and knowledge, and they'll lead you into the higher echelons of being human. And this all. All the way to today with what we talked about, even in season one, with the evangelistic alien phenomenon. It's the same kind of thing that you hear from these extraterrestrial beings that come and say, we're here to give knowledge to man. We sprinkle it out because he wasn't ready. But you have now been elected and chosen to become one that would receive this knowledge, to ascend to A new plane of evolution or human enlightenment. You see physicalist versions of this, spiritualist versions of this. But that to me is compelling, that there's reality to some of this, but it is demonic and it is.
- [55:32]
Ben Garrett
And I think that it's also like if there is any physical reality to it, I think there's a big spiritual reality to it. If there's any historical reality to it, I think that it's been overplayed. One of the things that I always want to avoid when talking about things like this is getting into this idea that there's been a shadowy like Illuminati type organization for all of human history that's basically led man down a path of pure deception always and only with the exception of a small bastion of Christian truth. Because I'm a post millennial, I think that that can't be the case. I think that it could have been before Christ. Much more so. And so I think that like the Greek pantheon, the Babylonian pantheon, the Hindu gods, I think that there is truth to that physical truth.
- [56:22]
Pastor Brian
There were nations that were under deception.
- [56:25]
Ben Garrett
Egypt, we know that the Egyptian gods existed. God actually recognizes them in the Exodus and then judges them. But I think that they were judged. I think that Christ actually did cut the head off the serpent. And so now the nations are no longer deceived. And so I do want to avoid that. Part of the problem with the St. Germain Rosicrucian Seven Sage connection is that it would make it more of a novelty and like an accessory to history instead of a grand deception that we're all enslaved to. I don't think that's true. I do think that it could be an attempt at demonic deception, but one that ultimately serves to actually just fuel more like conversations like this that are more just. Wow, that's really interesting. I wonder what that is.
- [57:11]
Pastor Brian
Yeah, and we know that these like Theosophy itself and known, non spooky, non just these false religions and cultic ideas that all arise out of enlightenment thinking and dominate. Coming Even into the 19th and 20th century in America, you see a lot of rise of these kind of mystic cults that offshoot. They try to blend and syncretize Christianity with other thoughts and claim divine revelation or revelation from spiritual beings that give them like ascended masters, that give them special knowledge tale as old as time. But you're right that people who like this show, even like one of the ditches they can fall in is thinking there's like 10 people in the world who are not deceived.
- [57:55]
Ben Garrett
Right.
- [57:55]
Pastor Brian
And the reality is, no, no, When Christ judged the ruler of this world on the cross, like go read John 12. When Christ now is the ruler of this world cast out, now is he judged. He bound the strong man so that he could plunder his house of the nations. The strong man, Satan the accuser, the one who could offer to Christ all of the kingdoms of the world and their glory. And it's not that Christ didn't want them, it's just that he didn't want them by being subservient to Satan. He wrested them back from Satan by binding him, casting him out on the cross, judging him. And so he can no longer deceive the nations at scale. And so now instead of Israel being this one people, they're a national people and one nation in the Middle East. Now who's their God is the true God. Now the true God goes to the nations and he frees them from the chains of demonic deception and false gods. And the light of Christ is suffusing creation. Even. You look at the prophecy in Isaiah 9 about the coming of Christ. It says that the government will be upon his shoulders, this Messiah, and of the increase of his government and of peace, there will be no end. Meaning it's like a seed or a mountain to Daniel or to Paul's language. It's like this little tree or Jesus in the kingdom, parables that grows and covers the whole world. So I do want to reject out of hand that idea that there's this cabal of demonic leaders who have like totally dominated everything they're trying. There's lots of demonic influence and lots of people are deceived. And sure there's lots of sin and things like that, but the story of history that unfolds after the cross is a story of Christ conquering the nations.
- [59:43]
Ben Garrett
There's actually, there's a really, I think, profound point to be made here. When you go back to Genesis 3 and you look at God's pronunciation of the curse and the punishment for sin, and he says, you know, the seed of the woman will crush your head. You will bruise his heel. So what, what Adam did when he sinned is he broke his covenant with God. But man is a covenant being. He has to be in covenant. This is something that you pick up in Bob Inch a lot in his reformed dogmatics. In breaking the covenant with God, man made a covenant with the serpent. He recovenanted himself to evil and sin. Now when God pronounced his curse and said, the seed of the woman will crush your head, a lot of the ways that reformed thought has wrapped their head around, that is by saying that's God annulling the covenant that man made with the serpent and reforming the covenant of grace that he had with him in the beginning. And then the fulfillment of that, of course, is Christian and not only him crucified, but Christ exalted and now ruling at the right hand of God. What that means and sort of a big picture thing is that Christ accomplished salvation on the cross for the elect, but in Christ's death, burial, resurrection and ascension, he actually won things that all of the world really does benefit from. And one of those things is the fulfillment of the. Of the covenant broken corporately between man and the serpent. What I mean by that is that I think Lewis is really onto something in. In the last battle when he says, you've summoned Tash. To Tash, you shall go. Yeah, it's like God. Christ judged Thor on the cross. Thor is dead. He judged Odin. Odin is dead. Odin will not summon me. But if I summon Odin to Odin, I shall go, so to speak. Like you can act. It's not like these spiritual things no longer have any power whatsoever. Otherwise this podcast would be a little bit superfluous from jump street. It's instead that there's no national corporate deception that takes place. Haven't totally worked that out. But I do think it's a really profound point when you think about all of history, the benefits of Christ extending even in some measure, beyond just the elect and covering the whole world with a form of recreation that will be solidified with the eschatological church.
- [62:14]
Pastor Brian
And he's doing this through his. It's really important to see that the mechanism God does is through the new Adam, the second Adam, Christ, who is the God man. But he's also reconstituting a new humanity in the image of Christ as his body. And so this is like to Psalm 8 and other passages in scripture where the idea is that in the old order, man was under the dominion of angels. He was put lower, but now, and in a demonic sense, under wicked, fallen spiritual beings. But now under Christ, a man. Christ has reclaimed the Adamic position of human headship over creation, human dominion over creation. And now he's actually reestablishing the proper order, which is man having dominion over these things and even ruling over and judging the angels.
- [63:04]
Ben Garrett
Exactly, yeah.
- [63:05]
Pastor Brian
So that now even the angels and spiritual things are put under our feet. Which is why passages like Romans says that, that the God of peace will soon crush Satan under your feet to.
- [63:15]
Ben Garrett
The saints, or even he will put.
- [63:17]
Pastor Brian
Serpents under your feet.
- [63:18]
Ben Garrett
What is it, 1 Corinthians 5 or 6 where Paul is talking about believers going to civil court together and he's.
- [63:26]
Pastor Brian
Yeah, you're.
- [63:27]
Ben Garrett
Do you not know that you will judge angels? Can you not judge these disputes with it? Anyway, we could go on.
- [63:32]
Pastor Brian
One could continue, but perhaps we should. Yeah, let's talk about. We don't have time to. Okay, so what we're going to do is I think we should tell this next story and then we will go into a discussion about different theories of time travel.
- [63:52]
Ben Garrett
Yes, indeed.
- [63:52]
Pastor Brian
And. And then we'll talk a little bit about what we think is possible and not possible as we get into even. We have a couple more stories, obviously, as we go through the episode, but let's start there. Let's, let's. This is one of my favorite time slip stories.
- [64:06]
Ben Garrett
Oh, yeah, It's a classic.
- [64:08]
Pastor Brian
It's an absolute classic. And it also involves the French. So naturally Ben is going to read.
- [64:13]
Ben Garrett
It, of course, so I will take us away.
- [64:17]
Pastor Brian
Take us into that story.
- [64:34]
Ben Garrett
In 1901, two women walked together through Paris on a sunny and breeze swept day. Though the two did not know each other the way very close friends or sisters do, they were nonetheless getting along well now as new friends. The first woman, one Charlotte Moberly, was the principal of a new hall of residence in Oxford called St Hugh's College. In fact, she was the college's first principal as it was a brand new residence for their higher education of women, which had only opened up its doors in 1886. While certainly a competent person for this role, after 15 or so years at the helm, everyone agreed that she needed some help. So it was that the university sent her to Paris in the summer of 1901 to become acquainted with the woman who would serve under Moberly as the vice president of St Hugh's Eleanor Jourdaan. And so it was that the two women were found arm in arm, traipsing through the cobbled streets of Paris at the turn of the century. Like kindred spirits, this pair enjoyed getting to know one another in such a beautiful setting. But they soon exhausted the usual tourist byways and sought for something new to continue the adventure. To that end, Jourdan recommended that they explore the great palace grounds of Versailles. They took the train to the palace and once there, dove into the flowing crowds touring the great exhibits inside. They did their part and showed their interest in all the things that normally make people gawk. But they both agreed that the whole ordeal felt rather forced. They actually weren't that interested, they couldn't say why. The palace was doubtless breathtaking, but it just wasn't doing it for them. So they decided to do a less structured walk through the many gardens of the grounds, aiming foreshadowing chateau that had been built by Louis XV in 1768 for his mistress, Madame de Pompadour. The house was called Le Petit Trianon, and it sat in a larger array of gardens and parks called the Grand Trianon. Its separation from the main grounds of the palace and the crowds that gathered there meant that the smaller house could be enjoyed with much less bustle. They wouldn't have the place to themselves by any means, but even so, the smaller crowds were appealing. All that remained was the small matter of finding their way from the main palace to Petit Trianon. And this is where their story takes a wild turn. The guidebook the women carried with them was of little help. They soon confirmed that they had gone off the marked path to their destination at some point, but couldn't use the map to determine where. They therefore thought it best to continue on until they found the Trionon on their own. Both of them agreed it would be more fun that way. But soon after they made this decision, the whole world around them appeared to turn ever so slightly, shifting from normal to something else. It was imperceptible at first, like the slightest drafts pouring in through a hairline crack in an old window, but grew until it became difficult to ignore. Just after, as the uncanniness of things fully set in, Moberly looked over to see a very odd looking woman dressed in all white and shaking a white cloth out of a window of a small garden house, as if to clean it, as if the house was in use and this was a maid keeping it for its master. While Moberly noticed this, Jordan glanced in the opposite direction, towards the trees, and observed an old ramshackle farmhouse that had an equally old plow sitting in front of it. It was the darkly magical turn of the air that caused them to remember these otherwise trivial things in the first place. Where the breeze had been, the air was now totally still. Where the afternoon sun had just been casting charming shadows of evergreens across their path, there was now only sun and no shade. It was like an image of a tree in high noon, overlaid on their mid to late afternoon wind world. Where birds had been singing, they could have sworn there was now an unnerving blanket of quiet. The sound of their footsteps seemed deafening, and they both instinctually tried to quiet them. Both women remember these moments and the following few as being hammered by heavy waves of depression and anxiety. Somewhere deep in their souls, they felt that the day had shifted from pleasant to disquieting and totally without warning. Having reclaimed their wits, but still feeling fuzzy about it all, the pair were aware of two men dressed in long gray and green robes with very old looking three cornered hats. Standing before them. In robotic voices and with an air of pomp, they bid the women continue straight on. The women obeyed. Presently, Jourdan caught glimpses of another garden house with open front doors. In the stillness and quiet, she watched as wax like figures that were meant to look like 17th century people interacted with one another. An older woman poured liquid from a vase into the cup of the younger. She later described the scene as a living picture. Soon the path the women walked led to a dead end that would force them to continue either to the right or to the left. As they studied this leftward way, they saw a gazebo in the garden across the path from them. It sat just in front of a wood that looked as strange as everything else did. In the shade of the gazebo sat a man dressed in the garb of a nobleman from the days when Versailles had just been completed. His face, they claimed, was repulsive and malignant. He appeared to sneer at them or in their general direction with hateful eyes. They, of course, looked the other way to see where the rightward path led. As they looked, footsteps like running came up behind behind them. They turned slowly, like one in a dream wading through syrupy air, and saw a different man from the mean looking one, greeting them with a smiling red face. He was younger and looked like another palace servant. He greeted them at attention with his robe and wig and shoes that were completely out of time, and told them the way to the Petit Trianon away, which thankfully took them to the right, away from the evil man. On this final approach to the chateau, Moberly noticed a very refined woman sitting in a grassy knoll beside a stream. Dressed in a light summer dress and shade hat, she seemed to be sketching something. Her hair flowed like coils of gold down her shoulders and almost touched the grass of the small of her back. At first assuming her to be a tourist, Moberly changed her mind when she realized just how old the dress looked. You just couldn't buy stuff like that anymore, and even if you could, you certainly wouldn't wear it in the grass. Finally they arrived at Petit Trianon and, seeing a group of contemporary tourists coming up beside them, snapped out of their days and joined in the rear of that group. The uncanny feeling faded and all returned to normal. They finished their walk and went back to Jourdan's apartment. They didn't speak of the experience to each other for another week. But finally Moberly shared her apprehensions with Jordan. When she couldn't shake the memories and the unsettled feeling it all produced, she was half relieved and half horrified to hear Jordan confirm the whole thing. They had seen some different things, but they had also seen many of the same things. They knew they had to return. When they did, they were shocked to find that there was no old farmhouse and no plow in front of it. When they had seen seen the lady drawing, she had been next to a bridge of the stream that the friends had then crossed. But no such bridge existed. There was no gazebo at the end of the path, and the forest across from the same path looked nothing at all like how they remembered it. No palace guards or tour guides or employees wore anything that came anywhere close to resembling the clothing they had seen that day. Their curiosity now fully engaged, the pair researched the palace's history. No matter how insane it seemed, they kept returning to the seemingly impossible conclusion. They had somehow seen Versailles as it had been in the late 18th century, just before the uprising of the Bastille and the slaughter of Louis XVI's royal family. They found a picture of the great queen Marie Antoinette with her children. In their studies, both agreed that this was the woman they had seen sketch munching on the grass that fateful day. Despite many attempts to explain away their experience, neither woman ever wavered from their conclusions. Somehow the gears of the universe had slipped and they had glitched backwards in time to a day long past foreign.
- [73:15]
Pastor Brian
Easily one of my favorite stories of French women slipping back in time to a long past era.
- [73:21]
Ben Garrett
Of the many that I know well.
- [73:23]
Pastor Brian
Of the many, the many that we.
- [73:24]
Ben Garrett
Know, that is one of my favorites, I think.
- [73:25]
Pastor Brian
Before we get into some analysis of this story, Ben, let's just give a quick like here's the time travel theories because we this is a time slip we haven't categorized. There's a few different types of basically time travel ideas and phenomena. So we talked about like immortality, people living through vast periods of time. This is a time slip sort of.
- [73:45]
Ben Garrett
Story where someone it's like a glitch in the Matrix.
- [73:48]
Pastor Brian
They seem to go back in time. There's another story of a guy in a plane who's flying over an island and he sees what seems to be World War II stuff happening below him, I think, is what it is. That's a time slip story, just like. And then he comes back to his own day, sometimes accompanied by strange, like, filmy effects, or it's almost like they're in an unreality kind of thing.
- [74:08]
Ben Garrett
Right. Which is kind of like what was happening in Versailles.
- [74:11]
Pastor Brian
Versailles.
- [74:12]
Ben Garrett
It's the glitch in the Matrix thing.
- [74:13]
Pastor Brian
Yeah. There's also then, like your classic time machine, someone has figured out the physics of time travel, whether like wormholes or something, and they've built a machine that can let them travel along the corridor of time in the past or the future.
- [74:28]
Ben Garrett
This is like interstellar Hot tub time machine.
- [74:31]
Pastor Brian
Hot tub time machine.
- [74:32]
Ben Garrett
The Time Machine, 1980.
- [74:33]
Pastor Brian
What's the. What's the time machine? What's the one with the DeLorean?
- [74:37]
Ben Garrett
Oh, back to the future. Back to the future, of course. So I've never seen any of those movies.
- [74:41]
Pastor Brian
And the last one, and this is actually more of a testable phenomenon that we know about now, is more related to Einstein's theory, and it's time dilation, which would be the predicted effect. This is something Einstein predicted that if you travel fast, like. Like if you. Especially if you travel 90% the speed of light or up to close to the speed of light or even the speed of light, that time you will travel through time faster than the time that you leave behind. So the idea, the classic thought experiment, is like, if you got on a rocket and you left Earth in 2010, and somehow they were able to get this rocket to go 90% the speed of light, which we're not even close to doing, by the way. Not even close. And you traveled for 10 years out and 10 years back, 90% the speed of light, the vast majority of that distance, and you land back on Earth, you will have aged by those 20 years, the 10 years out, 10 years back. So you'd be like, if you were 20, you'd now be 40 in your own time stream. But you'd land back on Earth and it would be like the year 2110 or 22. And there's math you can do to figure out based on your speed, how fast. And we've tested this by putting extremely accurate atomic clocks or clocks in orbit at the fastest speeds that we can go and then bring them back and comparing them to a clock that was perfectly synchronized on Earth and do show that this effect actually does happen.
- [76:10]
Ben Garrett
Which is.
- [76:11]
Pastor Brian
Here's the thing, it's spooky.
- [76:13]
Ben Garrett
Here's the thing that's spooky about that, is like, it's not just a perceived difference, it's actual. It's a mechanical difference. And part of the reason for that is. And this actually gets into something that Plato talked about where time is a requirement of distance. If you don't have omnipresence, you must therefore be bound by time because you have to go places. And you can't go places without leaving a place. So you can't be in two places at once. And our mechanism of travel is, is. And like perceiving, travel is by light, so you see light and your brain translates the light into images that are reliable. So if something is traveling at the speed of light, because that is how, like, that is the max from one place to another of how you can transcend that distance, that person won't age. And again, a lot of people think, oh, that means that it will seem like they don't age. No, that's not what I'm saying. They won't age.
- [77:22]
Pastor Brian
It would actually stop.
- [77:24]
Ben Garrett
Their body's clock will stop, which is part of why.
- [77:27]
Pastor Brian
But then they couldn't even perceive reality.
- [77:30]
Ben Garrett
Exactly. And so these are all thought experiments.
- [77:32]
Pastor Brian
Press pause.
- [77:33]
Ben Garrett
They're legitimate, but it's very, very weird. We have seen this worked out once in reality, when I think it was like in the 2000 and tens, there were identical twin brothers. They were about an hour, not an hour, like a few minutes apart.
- [77:49]
Pastor Brian
Right. In their birth.
- [77:50]
Ben Garrett
A few minutes apart in their birth. And the older one was an astronaut in the iss. If you believe that exists at all, let's just assume that it does. Okay.
- [77:59]
Pastor Brian
For the purposes of this story, it exists.
- [78:01]
Ben Garrett
So he's in the iss, he's orbiting Earth. The point is that he's experiencing less gravity, which means he's experiencing less energy. And energy and light are the same thing. They're separated by mass. And so if you're experiencing less energy, your time should go faster. So you should actually come back and be younger than, or I'm sorry, older than your brother, who is still on the Earth. And they figured that out, and it was true. And so, like, they came back and they were now no longer separated by 12 minutes, but it was by 20 minutes, you know, and it was some measurable. Yeah, he was out there for a full year, nonstop.
- [78:44]
Pastor Brian
And one of the key points about this physical phenomenon is that it only allows, theoretically, travel into the future.
- [78:50]
Ben Garrett
Yeah.
- [78:51]
Pastor Brian
So you could, theoretically, if you did the 90% speed of light thing, if you wanted to jump from the year 2100 to 2200 in five years or 10 years. There's a calculation of how fast you'd have to go, and then you could leave and come back and you would have traversed a hundred years. But you can't do it in the past.
- [79:09]
Ben Garrett
And the other interesting thing is that you can't do it. You can't be stationary. Yeah.
- [79:13]
Pastor Brian
You can't just be in one spot and then.
- [79:15]
Ben Garrett
And this is what like Plato is getting at, is that you have to use motion and distance. You have to move in order to actually move through time. So pure stationary would be you're not only not moving, but you're also not moving in time.
- [79:29]
Pastor Brian
This is actually one of the funny, like, questions about time travel into the past as well, or the future, that if you had a time machine. I can't remember what book I was reading when I was like, 13. And it pointed out that part of the calculation the time machine would have to make is where you would be. The Earth is going around the sun and orbiting, and the sun is moving through the.
- [79:51]
Ben Garrett
The. Through space.
- [79:52]
Pastor Brian
Through space.
- [79:53]
Ben Garrett
So you set it for like 20 years in the future, and you press zap. And you get zapped to the middle of the.
- [79:59]
Pastor Brian
In the middle of space.
- [80:00]
Ben Garrett
You're in the middle of the vacuum.
- [80:01]
Pastor Brian
Stop. That would suck.
- [80:03]
Ben Garrett
So you need, like, spatial coordinates, you know?
- [80:05]
Pastor Brian
Exactly. Anyway, anyway, so my. My, like, cards on the. On the table idea is it. Is that the type of time travel that we think about as like, time traveler stories of people from the future coming back to the past. And maybe I'll tell one here to give an example of what.
- [80:25]
Ben Garrett
Go into emergency story mode.
- [80:26]
Pastor Brian
Yeah, I might need to go into emergency story mode. My thinking is that these are actually impossible, that God wouldn't permit it, and that they actually end up with paradoxes. Like the whole grandfather problem of what if you go back in time, accidentally kill your own grandfather, then you couldn't have existed to go back in time in the future. It's a paradox. So it's like a logical impossibility. But you hear stories like, of time travelers from the past. So let me go into emergency story mode now and I will just go ahead and we'll emergency. Enter into some sound design. This is an unscripted story, so I'm just gonna go for it here. Okay, so here's the story as far as I remember it off the top of my head. I'm not looking at my notes here or anything like that. But there's. In 2006, in Ukraine, this man appeared in the city of Kiev. And he's walking down the street. He appears to be dressed in some kind of garb that's, like, out of place. It's just older. He's, you know, looks like he's not dressed for the time. And he's also confused. So he. He's approached or he approaches. I'm kind of fuzzy on the details of some law enforcement guys and says, basically, hey, can you help me? And they say, yeah, who are you? And he seems confused. And so they're like, do you know where you are? He's like, well, I think I'm in this city of. In Ukraine. Like, do you know when it is? What you know, all this stuff? And they start to realize that this man thinks that he is in the year 1958. Okay? So they say, hold on. Do you have any identification? So he pulls out an ID card and he shows them his ID and his id. The first thing they notice is that it's from a country that no longer is. Exists, the Soviet Union. Because this 2006 Soviet Union's been gone for decades at this point. And so they say, this is really strange, but it looks authentic. It's definitely a picture of him. His name is Sergey. Like Poland, Romanovsky something. Pull it. I can't remember. Sergey. And so Sergey is like, no, that's. They said, when were you born? He says, I was born in 1932. And they go, okay, this is. This is really strange. We are going to take you to a doctor. Because they think this guy's crazy. So they take him to a doctor. He sticks with the whole story. They end up bringing him in front of a psychiatrist. And I can't remember that guy's name, but a psychiatrist. And so he sees the guy, sticks with his story, and he shows him the ID and everything. And they're like, this is really strange. The doctor's curious, and he says, like, is there anything else you can do to show where you're from? He's like, well, I've got my clothes. And he also had a camera with him. And the doctor was actually. He was a photography nurse, so he knew. He was like, this is a really old camera. He looks into a little bit more. Turns out the camera is indeed an antique at this point. It should be, but it seems in perfect condition. He pulls the film out of it, and he actually ends up taking it somewhere special to get it checked. But they. They say this film hasn't been made since the 1970s for this camera. But lo and behold, there's film in the camera. They pull it out and they. They look through the photographs and they see Sergey in Kiev in apparently a time gone past. And so they go back to him and they're like, sergey, what happened? What is this real? Are you, did you fake all this? Like, where, where, how did this happen? And he said, it was 1958, it was April, I was going for a walk. I was. And he was probably saying it more like it was April and I was going for a walk, but I'm not going to do that for you. And he, he said he was taking pictures, he was with his girlfriend. And there, there were pictures of him and his girlfriend on this roll, even that someone else had taken for him. But he says, then I looked up in the sky and I saw this silver bell shaped object in the sky, sky. And it was flying strangely. And he was thinking, is this some kind of plane? What. What is this? So he's, you know, just starts paying attention to this object, raises his camera, takes a picture of it, and the next thing he knows, he was there where they found him in 2006. So they say this, and sure enough, the last picture on the frame, they. It's what he says. It's like a strange, blurry bell shaped object. And so they take Sergei and they say, we, we need to look into this more. And they, they put him in a room. He, he wasn't like, against his will at this point, but he just said, okay, like, put whatever, keep looking at it. He goes in the room and there's only one way into this room. Through the door. There's cameras, and the windows are barred because it's like a mental psychiatric room. And he's, he's not seen again ever in that time. And they, they're frantically looking for him. They look at the tape from this, the camera. They can't find Sergey. Like, his, he left his camera behind. Like all this stuff, there's stuff that he left behind. And they're so intrigued that they start to look into this. Like, this guy must be hoaxing us. They planned this whole thing. They go, they identify the woman from the picture. They find her, she's an old lady. Um, she says, yeah, I knew Sergei. And they actually find records that Sergei existed in Kiev in the 1950s, but that he had been declared missing in 1960. And they, they're going through this. The lady says, yeah, I knew Sergei. He disappeared for a few days, the exact number of days he was in 2006, allegedly. And then he reappeared. He just came back and he said, like, this had happened to him. And then he Ended up going missing again. And she didn't see him again. But she says he gave. He gave me this photograph, right? And so she. She gives him a photo, and it's. He, he says, from year 2050. Right?
- [86:19]
Ben Garrett
So.
- [86:19]
Pastor Brian
So from year 2050, she gives him the photo, and it's like him and Kiev, but it's. There's all these buildings that aren't there now, right? And she says he said he'd come back in the note. She got this in the mail. He did. That was what it was. She sent the photo in the mail with a note, said, this is from 2050 in Kiev. I'll come see you soon. She's. I never see again. She never saw him again. Okay, translating never see again, which translates to she would never see him again. Okay. El Nino. So this is a classic out of emergency story mode. This is a classic time travel story. And you can find these on all over the place.
- [86:52]
Ben Garrett
I had a lot of things I was going to interrupt with, but you were an emergency story. I wanted to, you know, respect.
- [86:57]
Pastor Brian
Respect it.
- [86:58]
Ben Garrett
The first one is this. Sergey. Sarah ghosted those guys. And then the other. And then the last one is you got talking about a photograph. Look at this photograph.
- [87:09]
Pastor Brian
I knew it. I knew it.
- [87:10]
Ben Garrett
Yeah. All right. Anyway, as you said.
- [87:11]
Pastor Brian
And he said. And she said when they found her, look at this. Look at this photograph.
- [87:17]
Ben Garrett
Every time I do I see Sergey, my voice is cracking a lot. Sorry, guys.
- [87:22]
Pastor Brian
So.
- [87:25]
Ben Garrett
Brian, I got bad news the other day. I was using one of the big box soap products to wash myself, and I got this weird urge to go buy a Stanley cup and fill it with iced coffee. And it started to feel a little cold in the house. I just wanted to wrap myself up in, like, a heavy wool blanket. And then also I started googling ticket prices to Taylor Swift concerts.
- [87:47]
Pastor Brian
Ben, what are you doing? Don't you know that these big box soap companies just jam all their soaps full of hormone disrupting chemicals? They're probably turning you into a girl.
- [87:56]
Ben Garrett
Well, I know that now, but what am I supposed to do about it?
- [87:59]
Pastor Brian
Ben, you ignorant normie, all you've needed to do is go to indigosundrysoap.com and support a great Christian family business that's making all sorts of soaps that are completely free of hormone disrupting chemicals and other nasties.
- [88:13]
Ben Garrett
Okay, I am literally going to indigo sundrysoap.com right now. Tell me what to buy.
- [88:17]
Pastor Brian
Ben, What I would recommend doing is clicking on bundles and then selecting the best one for you. You could get the men's six pack. You could get my favorite, the Clay bundle.
- [88:26]
Ben Garrett
Ooh, I like the Pipe and Jug bundle. That seems cool. Or a men's six pack because that'll make me feel like I have something that I actually don't.
- [88:33]
Pastor Brian
So true, King. And you know what else I heard? Because they're such good friends of the show, Indigo Sundry Soap Company is offering 10% off your order if you just use one. All caps, discount code Haunted Cosmos, no spaces.
- [88:45]
Ben Garrett
Wait, Brian, you're going way too fast. I didn't get all that. Is that information in the show description?
- [88:50]
Pastor Brian
Ben, you ignorant normie. It's always in the show description.
- [88:54]
Ben Garrett
Okay, so I'm going to go to indigosundrysoap.com I'm going to pick the men's six pack bundle and I'm going to use code Haunted Cosmos at checkout. All caps, no spaces. And if I forgot all that, it's in the description of the show.
- [89:06]
Pastor Brian
Of course, Ben. And if you just do that, then you will stop wanting to do all of those girly things and maybe you'll, I don't know, maybe want to buy a classic car to restore or something.
- [89:14]
Ben Garrett
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- [89:35]
Pastor Brian
New Dominion Design Company is ready to provide that help. Unashamedly Christian, New Dominion Design Company exists to labor alongside fellow members of the Body of Christ as we engage in this great work of reformation.
- [89:46]
Ben Garrett
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- [90:06]
Pastor Brian
If you're ready to build, new Dominion Design Company is ready to work with you. Visit newdominiondesignco.com that's newdominiondesignco.com and reach out to Jenkins for all your graphic needs. And as always, that link will be in the description.
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Ben Garrett
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- [91:52]
Pastor Brian
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- [92:10]
Ben Garrett
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- [92:22]
Pastor Brian
What?
- [92:23]
Ben Garrett
All you have to do is cover shipping. Are you kidding?
- [92:25]
Pastor Brian
What?
- [92:26]
Ben Garrett
So head over to squirrellyjoes.com haunted cosmos that's squirrelyjoes.com haunted cosmos to claim your free bag of coffee. Let's flip and go link in the description below. I'm a poet, didn't even know it.
- [92:41]
Pastor Brian
This is a story about allegedly time travel across from the future, into the past and back and forth and things like that. Now here's the problem with this story cause you're listening to this listeners and you're probably like this is the flipping most amazing. The first time I heard this story I was like this is the most amazing time.
- [92:58]
Ben Garrett
Why isn't this the problem?
- [92:59]
Pastor Brian
Because it's got all these dates, it's got all these people, the name of the doctor, the town, it happened in the photos. He's got a camera like and you. If you look into the story, you'll see all this photos of the ID card and all this stuff, however, and I don't think this is possible. And this one wouldn't have changed my mind. Even I would have still said it was a hoax. But listen, we know that this. Well, no is a strong word. If you start looking into and trying to dig up the details of this story. And there's a guy, I can't remember the YouTube channel. I think his name's like Joe something, but he does a. Joe Rogan. It's not Joe Rogan. He does a brilliant takedown of this whole story.
- [93:37]
Ben Garrett
Yeah.
- [93:37]
Pastor Brian
It turns out that you'll find that all of the threads of this story converge on this one point on the Internet, which is in 2012, there is a Ukrainian television series called Aliens in Ukrainian, whatever that is. I don't know. If we send them another $400 billion, maybe we'll be able to find out.
- [93:56]
Ben Garrett
Yeah, maybe they'll tell us.
- [93:58]
Pastor Brian
So this series, the best I can figure out about this series is it's like the exact equivalent of one of those history chann series.
- [94:05]
Ben Garrett
Like Ancient Aliens.
- [94:06]
Pastor Brian
Like ancient aliens, there's 10. And it's all about like alleged evidence for alien encounters like levitation and all this stuff. And one of them is time travel. And it. Because he saw this UFO and supposedly.
- [94:16]
Ben Garrett
Right.
- [94:16]
Pastor Brian
People thought, theorized in the episode that like they had flown him so fast and brought him back that it traveled into the future. But then how could he go back? Whatever. So it's this one episode and this episode, without being super clear to the viewers, had reenacted all of this evidence. So like they had pictures of the ID card.
- [94:39]
Ben Garrett
Oh. So like they made it, they made it all as if it's a. It's a refer. It's a. Like a recreation. But they just made it up.
- [94:47]
Pastor Brian
But they just. Because they show like CCTV footage of him walking around of him being interviewed by the Doctor, like all this stuff. And if you watch it and you're not aware of how the world works, you would think, think it's all real because that's what they're trying to present, if it's real. But then this guy, he goes into it and he's like, you know, there's this little disclaimer at the beginning of the series or something that's like it's dramatized and all this stuff and like the source for this. So long story short, the entire story I just told you is a lie.
- [95:19]
Ben Garrett
Wow, thank you.
- [95:20]
Pastor Brian
But I think we could have known it was a lie. Already. Because I do not believe that time travel into the past is possible in the world God made.
- [95:29]
Ben Garrett
I totally agree. I think that time is a restrictive aspect of nature.
- [95:34]
Pastor Brian
Yes.
- [95:35]
Ben Garrett
Like the sun rising. We can't. We don't get to control that. It just is gravity. We can try to work around it. We can try to work with it. Gravity working against me.
- [95:48]
Pastor Brian
It's working against me.
- [95:50]
Ben Garrett
Yeah.
- [95:51]
Pastor Brian
Have you seen the guy who's like, hello, I am Juan Mayor?
- [95:54]
Ben Garrett
No.
- [95:55]
Pastor Brian
And he sings really bad covers of John Mayer songs. I'm sorry, go ahead.
- [95:59]
Ben Garrett
Have you seen the guy that does the. He's like a Indian guy or something. He does Linkin park covers.
- [96:03]
Pastor Brian
Oh, yes.
- [96:04]
Ben Garrett
Dude, with like tiger. So good green screen.
- [96:07]
Pastor Brian
You gotta. Hey, absolutely amazing, Martin. If you edit any of this out, I riot. Yeah, but keep going.
- [96:12]
Ben Garrett
Anyway, so I think that time is an inescapable mechanism of nature and reality that can't be actually overcome with the minor exception of those relativistic differences that we talked about. Where also I really do think that because of man's limitations with technology, we won't be able to achieve light speed. I don't think that's something we'll be able to do.
- [96:35]
Pastor Brian
I mean, doesn't it reduce right now in our current math to a singularity? Like to an impossible infinite density?
- [96:42]
Ben Garrett
Well, not necessarily. It's not an immediate no solution singularity. It could be. I do think that it's not impossible for us to open like a wormhole, for example, with a lot of energy. And the thing is, a wormhole is essentially you've begun making a singularity, but then right before the singularity becomes like a chain reaction, you stop it and it opens this anyway. Even, even that. I'm like, yeah, but why? You know, like what? I guarantee people will only use it.
- [97:18]
Pastor Brian
For bad dude on Skinwalker Ranch.
- [97:20]
Ben Garrett
Skinwalker Ranch over there on the Mason.
- [97:22]
Pastor Brian
There's wormholes everywhere.
- [97:24]
Ben Garrett
So, yeah, I don't think that that that's legit, but something that that story reminded me of was another story that kind of starts to touch on a big theme.
- [97:31]
Pastor Brian
Yeah.
- [97:31]
Ben Garrett
Of all this stuff, which is the multiplicity of worlds and timelines. So that story, because of how he just kind of stumbled into everything, reminds me of the man from Torrid. Do you remember that? You remember this guy shows up in Japan, okay? And he, he shows his passport to try to gain entry, and they, they immediately arrest him. And he's like, what the heck? Like, what is going on? And they're like, who are you? Who are you working for? What is it? You know? And he's like, guys, what is. They're saying it in Japanese. It's like, who are you? Yeah, who. Hey, hey, Seppuko.
- [98:05]
Pastor Brian
You go.
- [98:06]
Ben Garrett
Anyway, go home. I'll kill you.
- [98:09]
Pastor Brian
More like that?
- [98:10]
Ben Garrett
Yeah, more like that.
- [98:11]
Pastor Brian
The men and the women.
- [98:12]
Ben Garrett
Yeah.
- [98:13]
Pastor Brian
So.
- [98:14]
Ben Garrett
So he's really confused. He's like, I don't. I don't get why y'all are so mean, you know?
- [98:19]
Pastor Brian
Crack myself up.
- [98:20]
Ben Garrett
You couldn't. Keep going. You're cracking Martin up, dude.
- [98:22]
Pastor Brian
Keep going.
- [98:24]
Ben Garrett
He's like, I. I don't know why you guys are being so mean to me. I'm just the man trying to. And they're like, look at your passport. It says that you're from Taured. And he's like, yeah, I am from Taured. And they're naturally. They're like, my brother in Christ. That's not a place. Taured doesn't exist. There's no country called Taured.
- [98:43]
Pastor Brian
I was gonna say I went to public school.
- [98:46]
Ben Garrett
There's no country called.
- [98:46]
Pastor Brian
But this whole time I've been going.
- [98:48]
Ben Garrett
Like, what about, where is Taured? Okay. Taured doesn't exist.
- [98:52]
Pastor Brian
Isn't it a store and the mall?
- [98:54]
Ben Garrett
I don't know. Maybe Taured spelled different. So that's the big bomb drop, is he's like, wait, y'all, what are you talking about? Taured is a nation that's in the south of the Sahara Desert. By the way, the Sahara in this timeline that he's from is a fertile place. So it's the Sahara, not the Sahara desert.
- [99:11]
Pastor Brian
Yeah, it's more like during the Atlantean phase.
- [99:12]
Ben Garrett
Yeah. And he's like, I'm a political diplomat working for Colonel Nasser and some naturalized Ethiopian that is his assistant or whatever, his left tenant. And so this guy who. The name escapes me, is saying, I'm from Taured. And they eventually determined that it's an alternate reality because he finally just disappears and goes back to Taured. Now, here's.
- [99:39]
Pastor Brian
There's no way this happened.
- [99:40]
Ben Garrett
Well, here's the thing. It was all fake.
- [99:42]
Pastor Brian
Okay? It was all made up.
- [99:45]
Ben Garrett
And what it actually was was a guy in the 1960s who tried to gain a legal entry into Japan by pretending he was from the alternate reality.
- [99:52]
Pastor Brian
That's really funny. What a.
- [99:54]
Ben Garrett
Frankly, that's a genius.
- [99:55]
Pastor Brian
Frankly, genius. Genius move, honestly.
- [99:57]
Ben Garrett
I mean, worst case scenario, you become an Internet hero. Yeah.
- [100:00]
Pastor Brian
You become like a Reddit folk phenomenon.
- [100:03]
Ben Garrett
Yeah. But it does get into this idea of the multiplicity of worlds, and whether or not that's possible.
- [100:09]
Pastor Brian
Every act opens a new time. Exactly.
- [100:11]
Ben Garrett
Different timelines.
- [100:12]
Pastor Brian
Listen or zoom in. I mean, enhance.
- [100:15]
Ben Garrett
Enhance.
- [100:16]
Pastor Brian
Okay, I don't think that's how it works. I'm not a multiple, multiple worlds guy. And I want you to know you don't have to be scared of the alternate world version of yourself who is going to sneak into your world and take your life over, but he just has one differently colored eyebrow than you.
- [100:34]
Ben Garrett
Look. Having said that. Having said that. And I agree. Now enhance on me. If anyone comes to you that looks like you. Oh, dude, they are from another world. The doppelganger immediately glocky glock them in the face.
- [100:49]
Pastor Brian
What is. Dude, what if it's you from the future?
- [100:52]
Ben Garrett
Impossible. Ah, that's because you can't go to the past.
- [100:55]
Pastor Brian
Ah. We already established that doppelgangers are evil.
- [100:57]
Ben Garrett
That's a fact.
- [100:58]
Pastor Brian
Back to this time slip story in France, in Versailles. I just. The thing about this. These stories is that they're really fascinating. They're. You know, it kind of reminds me of the electronic fog story. I can't remember what.
- [101:12]
Ben Garrett
When we told that one from Flight 19. Flight 19, Season 2, Episode 2, Bermuda Bermuda Triangle.
- [101:16]
Pastor Brian
Yeah. So this story of the guy who's flying his beachcraft Bonanza and not Flight 19. It was in. It was in Bermuda.
- [101:23]
Ben Garrett
It was in the same episode of Flight 19.
- [101:25]
Pastor Brian
You're right, because that's all Bermuda Triangle stuff.
- [101:27]
Ben Garrett
But my bad.
- [101:28]
Pastor Brian
And he travels from this island in Bimini all the way to Florida in an impossibly short time, right? And he experienced this strange weather phenomenon that he. Swirling fog, and he called it electronic fog. And it either like time transportation or increased his speed so much that he would have been traveling like 500 miles way past his plane's capability or somehow.
- [101:49]
Ben Garrett
Like folded the paper of space time until he made the distance like a.
- [101:54]
Pastor Brian
Wormhole from one side or the other, which.
- [101:56]
Ben Garrett
That's my theory.
- [101:57]
Pastor Brian
Of course, when I hear this Versailles time slip thing, I don't have a reason to listen to these ladies and say, you're crazy. And there's no way you saw any of that, because there's multiple time slip stories like this. They all, though, come down to whether or not you believe the person who sees them, because by their nature, they're not empiric. There's no. It also, like, play it back.
- [102:18]
Ben Garrett
It's really important that there's so many variables. So there's the trustworthiness of the women, which, all things considered, yeah, I think they're trustworthy.
- [102:26]
Pastor Brian
They were principles.
- [102:27]
Ben Garrett
They were older women. They were established in their families and careers, like. And they were, they were, they were also esteemed in society. Like they didn't have any reason to look for attention or anything like that. Having said that, like they could have.
- [102:41]
Pastor Brian
Just made it up or misunderstood. Lots of people have tried to explain it. Like you saw an actor, but then there were all the places they saw.
- [102:48]
Ben Garrett
And then it's like, oh, well, you thought you went back to the same place, but it wasn't.
- [102:52]
Pastor Brian
Yeah.
- [102:53]
Ben Garrett
Look, I don't know.
- [102:54]
Pastor Brian
Yeah.
- [102:54]
Ben Garrett
It also could be, and it really can just be this. That there are things that take place in the world that we don't fully understand and that when we encounter them are incredibly strange to us. What I don't think is feasible is this idea of an eternal becoming where we experience time as passing, but in reality it's just one big block of thing. And so therefore the past is still there and you can reach back into it.
- [103:21]
Pastor Brian
Yeah. And consciousness gives the illusion of the passage of time.
- [103:24]
Ben Garrett
Exactly.
- [103:25]
Pastor Brian
This is called, I think, a B theory of time. And a theory is that time is really something we're traversing. It's a. It's a feature. But then B theory of time is more that time is like there's a front edge and a back edge to it and it's just. Is an object.
- [103:36]
Ben Garrett
Right.
- [103:37]
Pastor Brian
That consciousness gives an illusion to. Or.
- [103:39]
Ben Garrett
I don't, I don't think that's legit.
- [103:41]
Pastor Brian
I'm not, I'm not into that. I'm more of an atheist.
- [103:46]
Ben Garrett
How about we just. We leave that where it is.
- [103:48]
Pastor Brian
Yeah.
- [103:48]
Ben Garrett
And we go into the next story.
- [103:50]
Pastor Brian
This one's pretty wild.
- [103:51]
Ben Garrett
Yeah.
- [103:51]
Pastor Brian
And.
- [103:52]
Ben Garrett
And then after that, maybe I can go into emergency story mode. Okay. And talk about a story that's also totally fake.
- [104:00]
Pastor Brian
I cannot wait. I cannot wait.
- [104:02]
Ben Garrett
All right. Take us away, Brian.
- [104:04]
Pastor Brian
Let's do it. In the early morning hours of April 25, 1977, a six man patrol from the Chilean army was camped out in the high desert regions of the Andes in northern Chile. It's a hard and cold country. There's little life besides that which you bring with you. And what few natural resources there are seem eager to kill you. The patrol was there as a training exercise. Their task was simple enough. Guard the small outpost that they had been told to build. They didn't know what exactly this meant. Maybe they would be randomly attacked during their sojourn by another group undergoing an offensive training at exercise. But they didn't really need to know. They were content to do as they were told. And Follow the leadership of one Corporal Armando Valdes, the patrol's point man, as they took turns keeping watch over their patch of mountain. The initial hours of the training passed with little to notice or document. Though the terrain was hard, it was not unfamiliar to them. The first daylight hours saw the men building up their outpost, joking with one another, making a small, small fire they could use to heat up their food. They had plenty of water and not quite enough food for everyone to stay satisfied. But as soldiers, a small bite of hunger was not an unfamiliar sensation. Day passed into sunset, one of those epic desert sunsets with a technicolor sky passing from blood red to orange to gold to blue and lilac and deep royal purple. While some of the men turned in for their few hours hours of sleep, the first pair of watchmen readied themselves for a probably quiet and boring first watch. So the night passed from one pair of watchmen to the next without any incident to report and without any of the soldiers falling asleep while on duty. But as morning started to creep up, staying awake became harder and harder. By 4:00am Corporal Valdez and the other men on watch with him for that shift began to silently dance around the fire to imagine songs in order to stay awake. But suddenly the corporal's partner jolted to a stop. He stared out into the rolling ridges and foothills of the Andes, totally motionless. Valdez went to follow his gaze and try to figure out just what he was seeing. The younger man pointed to a small ravine about 500 yards away, whose bottom was blocked by the gently rising slope. Hope they themselves were on. Valdez had just looked right into the fire, and so his eyes needed a few seconds to adjust. But once they did, he quickly sprang into action. He shook the rest of the men awake and told them to get to their arms and station themselves in defensive positions. He informed them that the mock attack was coming. They needed to be ready. They needed to make themselves look good for the higher ups. Once all six men were awake and in position, the they saw what had caused Valdez to rouse them. Deep in that ravine, a slowly pulsating purple light could be seen reflecting off of the opposite hillside and even up into the dusty desert air. On and off and on again the light went, never changing its pace or strength. But that was only the second thing they saw. What gave them more urgency was the other bright purple light hovering just above the ground on the very top of their ridge, whose other side led into the ravine. It was unlike any light they had seen before. The first soldier to see it all, the one who stopped to get Valdez's attention, said that the pulsing light down below had fallen from the sky, and this other one, much nearer to them and in full view, had followed it down before stopping. It just hovered there, this gigantic orbit orb of richly colored light, dark purple, yet not dark. Somehow it seemed thick, like syrup compared to water, like it was somehow more than just light, but not different from it entirely so as to be something else, but just different. Valdez, wondering what new technology the army was testing on them, figured them to be flares or some experimental aircraft. So he bit his men standing, stay tight in their defense with weapons ready, before he himself walked stealthily and alone towards the glowing orb. According to the men, he made it probably halfway between their position and the mysterious object before he simply vanished into thin air. There was no loud sound, no flashing of light. There was no scream from their leader. He simply dissolved away into the morning breeze without time to even notice what was happening. In clear view of the five remaining soldiers, Valdez was gone without a trace. They squinted their eyes, thinking surely it was some trick of the light. But it wasn't. He was gone. And this made the men begin to panic. They couldn't go after him. After all, how could they expect to receive any different treatment from the orb than he did? But this must be some training exercise. He couldn't really be hurt, right? Maybe it was some macabre test meant to give the other men an opportunity to show their courage and commitment to leave no man behind. Maybe he was hidden. Maybe he was in on it. Maybe they were supposed to throw caution to the wind and go for him. All of these thoughts raced laps through each of the men's minds, but none of them had time to reach a satisfying conclusion. Because after, after just 15 minutes of anxiety and murmuring and questioning, at 4:30am on April 25, the men turned back towards the orb to see Valdez suddenly reappear again. But something was wrong. Where he had been alert and confident, now he was stumbling and haggard. His eyes seemed to look through things instead of at them, like there wasn't any life in them at all. He was a lonely figure trudging through the high desert in the purple light of that thing, barely keeping his balance and shaking from cold or some other unpleasantness. As he approached, the men ran to him and barely caught him as he seemed to lose his final strength and fall. It was in this position that he lifted his head and, looking back at the glowing orb, uttered the mysterious sentence, you don't know who we are or where we come from. But we will be back soon. This done, Coral, Corporal Valdez fell out of consciousness. While he was out, his men became increasingly confused. The first thing they noticed was his face. Just 15 minutes before, his face had been clean shaven except for a mustache. But now his beard was thick, far more than a shadow around the chin, and covered his neck and cheeks all over. It looked like a week's worth of unkempt beard growth, at least. After discussing this, one of the men noticed something odd as well about Walter. The time was right at 4.30am but the date was all wrong. It was 25 April, but the watch now claimed the date to be 30 April. Five days had gone missing. What's more, the watch didn't move again from the 4:30am mark. It was totally stopped and frozen in that moment, five days from then, that these men would have to wait for. Two hours passed, and Valdez suddenly shot up, awake and alert. At the same moment, both lights, the pulsing one deep in the ravine and the ominous one shining down from just above them, disappeared. Valdez's first words upon waking were, what happened? How long have I been asleep? I don't remember anything from the moment I left you. As they got the story out, Chile's government did all they could to censor it.
- [111:49]
Ben Garrett
Well, well, well. Brian is so real. I think we can all agree Brian is so real for telling a story that is 100% true.
- [111:58]
Pastor Brian
One sec, Ben. I'm actually.
- [111:59]
Ben Garrett
It is really, really cool.
- [112:00]
Pastor Brian
I'm just tweeting my apologies to the Japanese.
- [112:05]
Ben Garrett
We do have a lot of apologies.
- [112:07]
Pastor Brian
To me, like, legitimately. You can go my timeline and find that tweet and you'll know exactly when we recorded this episode. Just. I'm sorry for saying that your men and women both sound like a probably.
- [112:15]
Ben Garrett
Racist fake Japanese accent, and also that your men. That your women sound like beasts.
- [112:21]
Pastor Brian
Like, domo arigato.
- [112:22]
Ben Garrett
Oh, go back to a.
- [112:25]
Pastor Brian
What? I said, oh, no. I said no.
- [112:27]
Ben Garrett
Welcome back.
- [112:28]
Pastor Brian
Go back to your fake country.
- [112:29]
Ben Garrett
Go back to Japan.
- [112:31]
Pastor Brian
Okay, we're done. I swear.
- [112:33]
Ben Garrett
We're actually. Our apologies for stuff.
- [112:35]
Pastor Brian
No, but let's. But back to the real story that I just told.
- [112:38]
Ben Garrett
That's real.
- [112:39]
Pastor Brian
There's no way that didn't happen.
- [112:41]
Ben Garrett
I think that it. Like, I think it happened. Brian is. We don't right now.
- [112:45]
Pastor Brian
Listen.
- [112:46]
Ben Garrett
And he's trying to tell me that there's no way it happened.
- [112:48]
Pastor Brian
There's. There are reports from witnesses that this happens. People say, like, I talked to A guy or like these guys went and made a report to some UFO people and said, hey, this happened. Corporal Valdez, et cetera, et cetera, such as the purple globe. And here's the thing though. When you go to try to verify it. I can't verify it.
- [113:10]
Ben Garrett
Dude. You verify it by reading the story again and realizing how much it checks out.
- [113:15]
Pastor Brian
Wow.
- [113:15]
Ben Garrett
Valdez.
- [113:16]
Pastor Brian
Val.
- [113:18]
Ben Garrett
Corporate Valdez.
- [113:19]
Pastor Brian
This one though, to be fair, doesn't violate our time travel into the past. It doesn't even necessarily have. Well, it does.
- [113:24]
Ben Garrett
It does have time travel, dude. Because his hair grew.
- [113:27]
Pastor Brian
He comes back back in 15 minutes and it's been five days.
- [113:30]
Ben Garrett
That's the crazy thing to me.
- [113:31]
Pastor Brian
Oh, dude.
- [113:31]
Ben Garrett
Like the.
- [113:32]
Pastor Brian
We've got to. Did we tell the missing 411 story about the lady hiker who was walking down the trail? Crunch, crunch, crunch. Martin, emergency. She's well, emergency sound design. Crunch, crunch, crunch. She's walking down the trail and she's with a friend. Well traveled trail. Picture like the east bench in Ogden. Right. I can't remember what state it is. And she vanishes. It's like a hundred yards away from her friend or something. They're separated, barely.
- [113:59]
Ben Garrett
Oh my goodness.
- [113:59]
Pastor Brian
Can't find her. They send search parties out and you know like a well traveled trail.
- [114:02]
Ben Garrett
Oh my.
- [114:04]
Pastor Brian
Right by a parking lot. What? They go and they try to find her. They can't find her anywhere.
- [114:09]
Ben Garrett
No.
- [114:09]
Pastor Brian
Yes. And then a week later, she stumbles back down the trail and she's like, it's only been not that long.
- [114:20]
Ben Garrett
And then it's like insert the titanic. It's been 83 years.
- [114:24]
Pastor Brian
No, and she just been. But she like hadn't eaten or drunk and had been like a week.
- [114:28]
Ben Garrett
That's crazy.
- [114:29]
Pastor Brian
So there are missing 411 stories. Like that reminds us really weird of.
- [114:32]
Ben Garrett
This one story about a guy named Valdez who actually was abducted by aliens. Most likely for like six days. Probably five days. Hey, it could be six.
- [114:42]
Pastor Brian
Literally just told it. I know you left the room while I read those.
- [114:45]
Ben Garrett
Could be six days, could be five.
- [114:47]
Pastor Brian
It was April 25th to April 30th, 1977. Down with the 4:30am to 4:30am here's.
- [114:53]
Ben Garrett
What I do know is that his hair grew. And that's crazy.
- [114:56]
Pastor Brian
If it happened. That is crazy.
- [114:58]
Ben Garrett
Thank you for admitting if it does actually. Oh my goodness.
- [115:02]
Pastor Brian
Wow.
- [115:02]
Ben Garrett
It does.
- [115:03]
Pastor Brian
That was wild. Dude, Guys seriously sound like a 13 year old boy.
- [115:07]
Ben Garrett
I may. I think the people deserve an explanation.
- [115:09]
Pastor Brian
Yeah. Okay.
- [115:10]
Ben Garrett
The other night at Psalm Single, I already had kind of a head Cold.
- [115:13]
Pastor Brian
Yeah.
- [115:13]
Ben Garrett
And then I. I picked that night to try and sing as loud as I could.
- [115:19]
Pastor Brian
As you should.
- [115:20]
Ben Garrett
In the bass section, which. Yeah, as you should. But my throat was already a little scratchy. I woke up the next morning and I. I sounded like this. I mean, this, like really handsome. Well, like bluesy, kind of like mysterious. Yeah.
- [115:32]
Pastor Brian
You know, gravelly.
- [115:33]
Ben Garrett
Kind of like. Could be a time traveler. Maybe not.
- [115:36]
Pastor Brian
You just could have been a time traveler.
- [115:37]
Ben Garrett
Yeah, could. Could be Saint Germain.
- [115:39]
Pastor Brian
Could be Saint Germain.
- [115:39]
Ben Garrett
But a good version.
- [115:40]
Pastor Brian
True. That's a good point.
- [115:41]
Ben Garrett
If St. Germain repented, that's more or less me.
- [115:44]
Pastor Brian
So this story, though, I'm just going to say the Providence is a little bit.
- [115:48]
Ben Garrett
Yeah, it's a little bit.
- [115:49]
Pastor Brian
We've never told a story like that before on the show. Like the one about Aaron Rodgers. That turned out to be like.
- [115:55]
Ben Garrett
It turned out to be not true.
- [115:56]
Pastor Brian
Hey, by the way, we retract that now. It's only been like three seasons.
- [116:00]
Ben Garrett
It was legit. It was legit.
- [116:01]
Pastor Brian
Like, it was the hat man story.
- [116:03]
Ben Garrett
It was legit in the locker room.
- [116:04]
Pastor Brian
That. That didn't happen.
- [116:06]
Ben Garrett
Here's the thing, though. It actually does remind me, and this gets back into the multiplicity of worlds thing. Have you ever heard of John Titor?
- [116:14]
Pastor Brian
Yes, I have.
- [116:15]
Ben Garrett
Have you? Okay, so he was. He's this Internet phenomenon where he came on the scene in forums with Art Bells. From coast to Coast.
- [116:24]
Pastor Brian
Yeah.
- [116:25]
Ben Garrett
His online forum. Best name for an online forum ever, by the way, post to post. Great.
- [116:30]
Pastor Brian
Because the show is Coast To Coast.
- [116:32]
Ben Garrett
Exactly. Good old Art. So this guy comes on, he says his name is John Titor and he's from the year. This is 2000. He's from the year 2036. Wow. He said that he was sent by the government. I love how it's just the government. The government back from 2036 to 1975 to find an IBM 5100 computer, which can be used, by the way, in future computers to retroactively track code and stuff like that. I don't understand it. Yeah.
- [117:04]
Pastor Brian
Wow.
- [117:04]
Ben Garrett
Cool story. He then said that he. He was traveling back into the 2036 future.
- [117:11]
Pastor Brian
Wow.
- [117:13]
Ben Garrett
But he stopped in the year 2000 for quote, unquote. And I love this. Personal reasons.
- [117:18]
Pastor Brian
Personal reasons.
- [117:20]
Ben Garrett
And to warn people of the destruction to come.
- [117:22]
Pastor Brian
Dude, the one that got away because.
- [117:24]
Ben Garrett
He came from a place.
- [117:24]
Pastor Brian
There's a Hallmark movie about this, I'm sure, where John Titor. The personal reasons was to win back his high school sweetheart that had married the, like, white collar guy.
- [117:33]
Ben Garrett
Isn't that a whole. Isn't that the Time Traveler's Wife? Isn't that the whole premise of that movie? I've never seen it. I don't know.
- [117:39]
Pastor Brian
Well, I read the book when I was, like, 12, but other than that.
- [117:42]
Ben Garrett
You read that? They have a book, The Time Traveler's.
- [117:44]
Pastor Brian
Wife, before the movie? Yeah.
- [117:46]
Ben Garrett
Wow.
- [117:46]
Pastor Brian
In fact, the movie's based on a book. Well, wouldn't recommend it.
- [117:49]
Ben Garrett
Sounds like it's really memorable.
- [117:51]
Pastor Brian
Wouldn't recommend it.
- [117:52]
Ben Garrett
Anyway, so John Titor is telling people about how pretty soon they're gonna enter World War three with China and Russia. There's gonna be civil war in America starting in 2005. And the thing is, like. It's like all those Nostradamus things, They're vague enough to where you're like, yeah, I can see some of that. Is the US In a civil war? Well, kind of a cold civil war, sure. Is the US at war with China and Russia? No, but it's all, like, economic war, stuff like that.
- [118:21]
Pastor Brian
Like frenemies.
- [118:22]
Ben Garrett
But then, yeah, exactly. They're like frenemies. Well, then Teeter was like, hey, I gotta go. I got to go back to 20. By the way, if anything that I said doesn't come to pass, you should know that by coming back here, I have not affected my future. I've only affected your future because I've created, by coming back, a new timeline that will not allow me to affect my future. Now, here's the crazy things. There's two crazy things. The first is that our brightest minds in theoretical physics cannot come up with anything better than that for an explanation of how time travel could happen into the past. Yeah, it's that we do branch off alternate timelines. So, I mean, I guess that's something. He was like, basically as smart as Neil DeGrasse Tyson. The other thing, which is not saying much, the other thing, and this is actually crazier, is that the IBM 5100 actually can do exactly what he said. And they. And IBM didn't disclose it until after all of these blog posts got really popular on the Internet. IBM came out and was like, yeah, that actually is something our computer can do. But that's definitely fake. Now, it is definitely fake that John Titor came back from 2036. But it's crazy that he knew something about this old 1975 IBM computer that they had not released to the public.
- [119:49]
Pastor Brian
This. All this reminds me of Mel's Hole. It's a Mel's Hole situation.
- [119:52]
Ben Garrett
Dude, tell us about Mel's Hole.
- [119:54]
Pastor Brian
Well, Because Mel's hole is the whole thing where it wasn't Art Bell as well.
- [119:58]
Ben Garrett
Yeah, it was Art Bell. Hart Bell.
- [119:59]
Pastor Brian
This guy calls in like, he'll. He'll. He'll do these call ins, separated by years, tells this crazy story about this land he bought with his seemingly bottomless hole and all this weird woo woo magicy stuff that happens around it and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And then he got his kidney stolen and, like, he did, like. Yeah, he got kidnapped in Australia because, remember, the government was paying him like a million dollars a month to let them use his hole.
- [120:21]
Ben Garrett
$125,000 a month to use his.
- [120:24]
Pastor Brian
To use his hole.
- [120:24]
Ben Garrett
While he lives in Australia, he goes.
- [120:26]
Pastor Brian
Australian to like, literally. His story was that he was starting a charity to save koalas.
- [120:31]
Ben Garrett
Yes, yes.
- [120:32]
Pastor Brian
Which from chlamydia or something.
- [120:33]
Ben Garrett
Every. Enhance. They desperately need it.
- [120:37]
Pastor Brian
Yeah, okay. Wow. Enhance. Now, the thing is, we claimed that before this episode we were going to say enhance a lot and make Martin zoom in on us because we don't have the maturity to handle having a video editor.
- [120:50]
Ben Garrett
Exactly. We're very obnoxious people.
- [120:52]
Pastor Brian
The key point is that they're both stories where they're really fascinating, like, really cool stories.
- [120:57]
Ben Garrett
Yeah.
- [120:57]
Pastor Brian
Crazy, super fun. But there's absolutely no way of knowing that there's just a guy on the Internet or on the phone who just said no, dude, I have this whole.
- [121:07]
Ben Garrett
But these stories, the Valdez one and John Titor. Yeah. Have become very popular on. Popular. Excuse me, on the Internet for popular. I know. Dude, seriously, I sound like I have knobby joints and acne all over my face.
- [121:26]
Pastor Brian
You do, but you. But you don't.
- [121:28]
Ben Garrett
Hey, go to YouTube. Killing it. Anyway, I lost my train. Yeah.
- [121:33]
Pastor Brian
Were you gonna tell a fake story? That's totally true.
- [121:36]
Ben Garrett
That was the John Titor story.
- [121:37]
Pastor Brian
Oh, John Titor.
- [121:38]
Ben Garrett
I forgot that was my emergency story.
- [121:40]
Pastor Brian
That's right. John Titor. Yeah, John titor. Definitely real. 100%. I take it all back Travel through.
- [121:46]
Ben Garrett
Time I want to take it all back Take it all back Take it all back dude, with the voice thing.
- [121:52]
Pastor Brian
You sound so good.
- [121:53]
Ben Garrett
That's a really stupid song and I hate it.
- [121:55]
Pastor Brian
Here's the thing, Ben. That's all I have in terms of thoughts about time travel. Yeah.
- [122:02]
Ben Garrett
I think, like to sum up.
- [122:03]
Pastor Brian
Wibbly wobbly timey wimey.
- [122:05]
Ben Garrett
Yeah. Like into the past, in the future. 100% possible. And man can and should do it. No, it's opposite day. Kids, don't try to time travel when your parents tell you not to. Go into the past and kill your great, great, great, great, great grand granddad who was supposedly a bad guy. Don't do it. Okay.
- [122:22]
Pastor Brian
Yeah. Instead, use Indigo Sundry soap for all of your household soap needs.
- [122:27]
Ben Garrett
That's right. And if you really want to mount up extra stockade defenses against the demons of time traveling by Hana Cosmos. Doing your duty in a world is not just stuff.
- [122:39]
Pastor Brian
Yes.
- [122:39]
Ben Garrett
Join us on Patreon. We promise to equip you with the. The full armor of tattoo Ding in your voice is.
- [122:48]
Pastor Brian
So we need like a.
- [122:50]
Ben Garrett
Okay. I think that we should close out the episode. This has been a fun episode.
- [122:53]
Pastor Brian
Hey, it's been fun. We've been a little bit more. What's the word that you could use? Ridiculous in this episode?
- [122:59]
Ben Garrett
Yeah, it's.
- [123:00]
Pastor Brian
Cause some of these are just fun.
- [123:02]
Ben Garrett
Well, it's also because the first two episodes of the season have been a little bit heavier.
- [123:05]
Pastor Brian
We're like, okay. Also just enhance again. I do want to apologize to everybody after the first episode of MK Ultra where you guys were like, could you use slightly fewer horrifying sound effects of people being eviscerated by various knives and things? And like, I apologize. It was all Martin's idea. And Ben, I take full responsibility for their decision to do that and we toned them down after that. We'll make sure that our sound effects are, as usual, pleasant, pleasing, glorious, amazing, helpful.
- [123:40]
Ben Garrett
I'd like to apologize to absolutely nobody. You should know that most of the stabby sounds are just clementine oranges getting crushed.
- [123:49]
Pastor Brian
Yeah, that's all they are. Anyway, so we're gonna go ahead, we're gonna take us out with the Montauk.
- [123:54]
Ben Garrett
Stories from this is Crazy Montauk Project.
- [123:57]
Pastor Brian
Seriously, some of my favorite stories on this.
- [123:59]
Ben Garrett
If this is like big if true, if this is true, it's one of the craziest things you'll ever hear.
- [124:05]
Pastor Brian
All right, guys, well, thanks for listening. Enjoy this hot close and we'll see you next time on Haunted Cosmos.
- [124:17]
Ben Garrett
When I was young, I used to watch a show on the Discoveroo channel called Conspiracy Theory with Jesse Ventura. If you don't know who Jesse Ventura is, you should talk about a character. He was a Navy SEAL turned professional wrestler turned actor turned governor of the state of Minnesota. Obviously, he was the perfect man to serve as the no nonsense hero ready to bust down every door and cut through every piece of red tape to get to the truth of the Internet's most wild conspiracy theories at the time. Many of which, by the way, ended up being true. After all, you know what they Say about conspiracy theories. Anyways, around the time this show was popular in my home and among my friends at school, something else was also making the rounds. It was a picture, a fairly gruesome one, if I'm honest, depicting some kind of weird carcass that had washed up on the beaches of New York. The creature did not look to be very large at all, but in every other way it was unlike anything I had ever seen. The skin was thin and almost marbled. White legs gave way to a ruddy lower back and a bluish purple upper back. The tracks of veins and arteries could be seen beneath the hairless and almost non existent hide. A stubby tail that resembled that of a pig lay between two short legs. The front two legs seemed longer than the rear two and they were bent at the elbow and so closely resembled the mechanical mechanics of human arms that if cropped well, one might mistake this creature for a young human burn victim. What appeared to be thin sheets of burlap fabric wrapped around one of the wrists and unnaturally long and skinny fingers crowned the stumpy hands. But the face was what really sent me into a spiral of curiosity. A few tufts of hair from what might have been a kind of mane gave way to a blood red temple. The eyes were shut and so nothing could be gleaned from them. But the mouth was a horror. Jagged teeth with sharp points formed a line that bent inwards until the whole jaw met in a single point, like a beak. One very long and especially sharp point came up from the chin and down from the nose to complete the uncanny and yet totally alien face. The crazy thing was that it was true. This weird thing really had washed up on the beach. There was no hiding from it. Right away, rumors started to swirl about how this was some sort of grotesque animal hybrid that a dark government shadow organization had made to their own nefarious ends. My friends and I all hoped that somehow, someway, Jesse Ventura would study this creature and get to the bottom of whatever it was. Of course, for all the bluster of the show, he had failed to create produce any real results before. But we didn't care. We also certainly did not understand how film schedules work back then. It was foolish of us to think that the show we liked would actually address this pet obsession we all had. But it was because of the show that we cared about it at all. All of this makes it all the more wild to discover that Jesse Ventura actually did do a show on something called Montauk. And I vividly remember loving it at the time of writing this, it is the only episode of that show that I distinctly remembered by name and by outcome. And I know why I remembered all of that, too. It seemed the closest Jesse ever got to really figuring out what was going on. I have this image burned in my head of Jesse Ventura standing like a tired hero outside of a closed glass door to a government building on Montauk island in New York. He was yelling inside and yanking on the handle, but it wouldn't budge and he walked away looking, though he was almost certainly acting sincerely dejected and even a little bit worried. Of course, as I got older, I matured and understood that the whole show had been made up. It was just pure entertainment. Jesse was a wrestler, not an investigative journalist. What was I thinking? Thinking as a kid. But the look on his face at the end of that episode never left me. And neither did the very brute fact that some totally unknown creature whose identity remains highly debated to this day had appeared one day on the sand of New York's Montauk business district. As it turns out, I think I was right to never let it leave me. Because I think it's safe to say that strange animals, animal hybrids, and basic government cover ups are some of the least interesting things to come out of the checkered history of Montauk Island. This is the story of the highly disputed claims passed to us from a select few men, a story by the name of the Montauk Project. Could it all be real? Could some of it? If so, how much? Well, we will leave that for you to decide. If you fly into New York's MacArthur Airport, right in the middle of Long island, you will no doubt be in the thick of one of the most populous and urbanized sections of the world. Buildings and concrete will stretch out like an ocean in every direction, but perhaps it will comfort you to know that the gray and cold brutalism of man's infrastructure does not go on forever. Of course, being an island, any direction will eventually land you in the sea, but only one direction will yield fields of green and charming small towns on Long island before the endless ocean that is the direction east. If you go east, endless gray will eventually start to yield to the earth's green until the parking lots and high rises and housing developments vanish completely, and a fertile Eden of manors and well manicured cobblestone townships greet you with smiles. And if you keep going this way, past the Hamptons and past the Peconic Bays and past Shelter island, you'll finally find the sign welcoming you to the charming little haven of Montauk and if you even pass the old fisherman's village turned modern tourist location and dwelling of the rich, right before your car touches the waves of the Atlantic, you'll find a parking space that looks out over said Atlantic, with only one thing between you and it. The lighthouse of Montauk Point that also serves as the welcome center to a state park called Camp Hero. It is here where our story begins. In 1942, an array of concrete bunkers and brutalish style buildings began to pepper the landscape of Martin Montauk and took the name Camp Hero. Initially, this camp, which featured a particularly striking building shaped like a cube and fitted with a massive antenna that looked like some kind of massively awkward crown on top of it, was used to surveil the North Atlantic for U boats. Once the Second Great War was over and the Allies had won, the camp was decommissioned and renamed the Montauk Naval Air Station. Under this moniker, it continued to monitor America's coastline throughout the Cold War, once the enemy of our previous enemy had proven itself to also be our enemy. But in the 1980s, Montauk Naval Air Station was fully decommissioned from all service as part of a wider military base reduction project. The buildings remained, along with the 90 foot tall radar antenna that sat atop the weird cubic building. And the whole area slowly started to be reclaimed by the nature surrounding it. In the midst of the building's slow degradation, the park authorities erected fences around each structure to avoid the potential harm they might cause to curious explorers in the area. Thus, Camp Hero was forgotten by the broader public for quite some time. But one day, that all started to change. In the 1990s, a man named Preston Nichols came forward with the clinic claim that that camp and those buildings had been anything but decommissioned. Instead, they had been used to carry out some of the most cutting edge and evil operations in American history. Experimental things, nameless things that took place with the stated goal of gaining an untouchable domination for America over the rest of the world. But just what type of experiments were these? In? In short, the aim of Montauk's airbase became finding a way to time travel, or to control the mind, or even to enter the hyperspace betwixt known spatial dimensions so as to unlock the, for lack of a better phrase, cheat codes of the universe. They got these ideas, of course, from the beneficiaries of Operation Paperclip, the project that allowed Nazi scientists to come work for for the US government under assumed identities. All of this means that even before Project Montauk, the Nazi regime was deep into the occult. Research of time travel and teleportation. Nichols alleges that there were many underground levels of the old Montauk Air Base, underground levels where some of these former Nazi scientists were stationed to work in the years after World War II. Within this literal deep state, their attempts at learning these practices continued on human test subjects. Drugs and experimental interrogation techniques were used on subjects to determine how one might best suppress the human will and create a perfect servant with inculcated amnesia. While these might sound like a mere continuation of MKUltra, the truth of Montauk extends far further than that. One day, Sometime in the 80s, Nichols was walking down the street where two men approached him that he had never met before. They gave him a knowing look, which seemed odd from him to a couple of strangers before stopping him and asking how he had been when Nichols responded with the predictable I'm sorry, do I know you guys? They replied by stating that the pair had worked for him on classified work in the old base at Montauk. Nichols had no recollection of any of which what they were saying and attempted to brush the whole thing off. Then, however, things got stranger. More and more people came into Nichols life claiming to know him and to have worked for him or with him in the same setting. What's more, they all told the same exact story. Sure, the details were always told from each person's perspective, but everything added up and Nichols couldn't notice anyone contradicting anyone else. He learned from these random encounters that apparently he had been the deputy director of something called the Montauk Project. Eventually he grew so unsettled by the uncanniness of it and so curious as to what it all could mean, he took a trip to Montauk and bribed a park employee well enough to be led into the gated abandoned area. As he took exaggerated steps through the tall grass and cracked sidewalks, nothing seemed familiar to him. But once he was inside, where things were less changed by the wild, he began to experience a strange sensation while walking through a line of cubicles in the upper floor. The dark and mildewy room started to change before his eyes. The stains on the carpet disappeared, and it seemed as though the fluorescent lights just before they had hung broken above him seemed to turn on. It was like he walked through a well functioning government office. It felt familiar to him, even though he had no concrete memories of being in such a place ever before. He watched as forms, like people, started to form in and out of thin air. In the chairs, phones rang and keyboards sang beneath the typing of men in lab coats sitting all around him. It all looked so real. Eventually he saw some gas ghastly copy of himself walking quickly toward him, staring at a clipboard held out in front of him by some man walking just as quickly beside. Once Nichols saw himself, all the other faces grew sharper and he started to remember their names. It was like he had stepped into a movie of his life, only the scene was of a part of his life he had never known. Steadily, though, memories did trickle in. He could recall the layout of the building, the dearest subordinates under him, the director that acted above him. He could remember where he liked to take his smoke breaks outside, who he would get dinner with in off hours, and which floor his own office was on. But just as these more innocent memories came to him, more nefarious ones came alongside in a rush and still to him. Running through a ghastly copy of what the building had been, he sprinted toward the stairwells and elevators. He remembered, remembered the lower floors. He remembered what happened down there. As he ran, sweat started to pool on his forehead, but not from exertion. The sweat came from the stress of remembering the horrible barbarity of those lower levels all at once in this forgotten life, he had been exposed to it little by little. It was always to take just one smaller step forward. Now, though, when the fullness of the program's wickedness hit him at once, it was too much to bear. He reached the door to the stairs in a panic and swung it open. But where stairs going downward were supposed to be, there was only a concrete slab. He could see the cracking seam and the off texture and off color that showed where they had paved over the once open space. And the elevators were no different. The door pried open easily enough to find an empty elevator shaft with a paved floor inside. Gone was any excitement at the strangeness of it all. The memories of his old life that came back to him were certainly filled with good things, but the bad far outpaced them. He was stuck, trying not to collapse onto the ground. Fresh air. He needed fresh air. This place grown dead and cold and dark again after the revelation of the underground, being paved over was like a prison with stale and poisonous air. He hobbled outside, bent further underneath the hot sun, and half walked, half stumbled over to a shade tree a few yards out. Once there, he leaned against the tree and held back being sick. He heaved for air there for multiple minutes before being able to stand up straight. Once he did, he saw that massive antenna still standing atop the building he had just been in it the memories of how he had used it came back again and again, all at once. They would tuck themselves away safe inside the concrete buildings before blasting all of Montauk and the surrounding townships with high frequency electromagnetic waves without any of their knowledge or consent. Afterward, they would go and interview people to see what kind of effects, if any, they had noticed or suffered. Police reports in Montgomery, Montauk, even confirmed that these things happened. The reports talked about observing the rotation of the antenna on base before patrolling officers, seeing entire groups of people stuck in motion as if in a frozen and trance like state. In the streets, dogs and cats would die. In yards across town, birds would fall from the sky. Dead citizens would flood the local emergency room with nosebleeds and headaches and bleeding, bleeding from the ears. Some of the even seedier memories, the ones that nearly made Nichols sick, involved a more direct hand in the community. Though. Teens and young adults would be coerced or blackmailed into joining some of the experimental groups. They would be physically beaten and deprived of nourishment in the basement levels of the base. They would undergo psychological reprogramming by the doctors that left them in near vegetables of states. It would then be forced to undergo psychic testing to see whether the blank slate human brain could project itself to another location. Given enough access, these projections even included going to different time periods in history, extending the consciousness of the subject through the years in the past and future. Once in these projected states of the psyche, the subject subjects were told to try and affect things in these other places. Mindless drones turned to obedience, all in the hopes of proving the psychic powers of man. This practice of remote viewing was known by Nichols and by the other doctors and victims who came forward to testify to the truth of his claims, to have been widespread and common in the facility. They apparently proved that the mind is far more than synapses and electrical currents. Passing here and there, they saw more of its power and it horrified them. Two of the former scientists who came forward claimed to work closely on the opening up of wormholes and other portals through space and time. Using a high energy reactor. Kept far deeper beneath the base, they could harness massive amounts of power to bend space and time to what was almost their liking. They claimed to have opened multiple wormholes to various locations around the world. The problem, of course, was that they had little control over where the other side of the portal would open. They saw windows into different worlds and different dimensions unfold before their eyes. One of these windows let something slip in that they would quickly regret. A monster of demonic proportion and lust for blood. Some Lovecraftian horror that makes one wonder whether or no the horror author knew more of our history than we normally think he did. It killed dozens of scientists and subjects before finally being locked deep in the belly of the facility. After that, the basement levels were evacuated, all entrances to them were concreted over, and everyone involved had their memory wiped. They were they were given new lives and taken to all different places, but it seems the amnesia was only ever doomed to wear off. Since Nichols came forward, among others who share his memory, countless people have attempted to break into the gated area of Montauk. Reports tell of stairways that lead to nowhere and elevators that show buttons leading deep under the earth. Geological surveys have yielded evidence of extensive underground tunnels all around the area. And of course it is worth noting that the contract between the military and Park Service of Montauk only specify park authorities to have dominion over everything above the ground. MK Ultra type mind control, time travel, remote viewing, portals to different dimensions, entities from dark regions of the unknown and unseen world coming to destroy it all. Region reads like the plot of some movie. In fact, it is the plot of some popular show, Stranger Things that came as a result of Montauk's hidden past. One is left asking again, should man simply be content with his place and pace through time? I think the answer is yes, but there remains much to discover as to why SA.