We've built an economy that rewards destroying value. Eric Ries wants to know how we got here, and whether we can build our way out.

Eric wrote The Lean Startup in 2011 and helped define a generation of entrepreneurs. Since then, he's watched promising, mission-driven companies get hollowed out, and he thinks he knows exactly why. His new book, Incorruptible: How Good Companies Go Bad and How Great Companies Stay Great, is his attempt to name what's happening, explain how we got here, and lay out a blueprint for building something better.

In this episode, Jessi and Eric discuss:

What Eric calls "financial gravity": the systemic force that pulls organizations away from their mission and toward extraction
Why shareholder primacy isn't ancient law; it's a 1980s invention that was never voted on by anyone
The private equity problem: how you can taste the cost-cutting in your food when private equity buys your favorite restaurant
Why today's best practices are actually value-destroying, and what the data says about the alternative
The Public Benefit Corporation filing: a two-page form that could change what your company is legally obligated to do
Why "it's always too early until it's too late," and how founders miss their window to protect their mission
The AI layoff glee: why Eric thinks companies racing to replace people with robots is slow-motion suicide
How to find opportunity in this moment, even if you've been laid off, and why trust is the most underrated asset in business today

Follow Eric Ries and Jessi Hempel on LinkedIn.