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- [00:00]
Nicole Lapin
I think we all have that one friend who is obsessed with research. They can't buy a Toaster without reading 26 reviews on Reddit and watching hours of video. I have a friend like that and she needs to book tickets to see her in laws this summer, but instead she's spiraling over getting the best deal. Meanwhile, the longer she waits the more prices go up. I have one recommendation for her or anyone else who just can't seem to click buy on that flight for whatever reason. The Chime Card with Chime prime status they have a 24 hour travel concierge service with a real human on the other side of the phone to help you book flights, make hotel reservations and even score the perfect pair of concert tickets. This is a luxury level perk at affordable prices. This is banking built for you, not the 1%. Chime is not just smarter banking. It is the most rewarding way to bank. Join the millions who are already banking fee free today. Head to chime.comhelpwanded that is chime.com helpwanted it only takes a few minutes to sign up.
- [01:03]
Chime Legal/Disclaimer Voice
Chime is a fintech, not a bank. Banking services for MyPay and Chime card provided by Chime's bank partners. Optional products and services may have fees or charges, stated annual percentage yield and cash back for Chime prime only. No minimum balance required. Checking account ranking based on the JD Power survey published October 20, 2025. For more information on APY rates, MyPay Spot Me and travel perks go to Chime.com disclosures so now that I'm a
- [01:19]
Nicole Lapin
mom, I find myself wanting to be much more intentional about the way I live, about the way I. E. The way I take care of my body. But because I am constantly moving around, I am always looking for an on the go protein plant based snack that satisfies me. And now I have found the exact one that helps me live intentionally too. Mosh Protein Bars Mosh, which you might have heard about on Shark Tank or on Oprah's Favorite Things, was founded by Maria Shriver and her son Patrick Schwarzenegger with a mission to spark a conversation about brain health through food, education and research. As After Maria's father was diagnosed with Alzheimer's, they set out to create something bigger than just a protein bar. Mosh protein bars are made with ingredients that support your brain and your body. Like Ashwagandha, Lion's Mane and Omega 3s Plus. Mosh is the first and only food brand boosted with Cognizant. It's a premium form of City choline that helps support focus, memory and mental clarity. And they taste amazing with nine delicious flavors. My personal favorite is the peanut butter chocolate chip. There is no better combo, I think, in the world than peanut butter and chocolate. I dare you to tell me I'm wrong. And now you can save on Mosh while making your wellness routine effortless. Get 25% off and free shipping on your first 15 count variety pack and then 20% for life on your monthly subscription. Head to mosh life.com/help wanted. That's Mosh Life M O S H L I F E.com/help wanted and subscribe today to get 25% off your first variety pack and 20% off your monthly subscription with the code half help wanted. That's 25% off your first pack and 20% off your subscription of brain boosting
- [03:03]
Uticol
bars delivered straight to your door.
- [03:05]
Nicole Lapin
Start building brain health into your everyday with Mosh bars. Thanks to Mosh for sponsoring this episode.
- [03:16]
Jason Pfeiffer
This is Help Wanted, the show that makes your work work for you. I'm Jason Pfeiffer, editor in chief of
- [03:22]
Nicole Lapin
Entrepreneur magazine, and I'm money expert Nicole Lapin. On Tuesdays, Jason and I answer the
- [03:27]
Morgan Lavoy
helpline and help callers solve their work problems.
- [03:30]
Jason Pfeiffer
And on Thursdays, I give you one way to improve your work and build a career or company you love.
- [03:35]
Uticol
And it starts now.
- [03:38]
Jason Pfeiffer
Morgan, welcome to Help Wanted.
- [03:41]
Morgan Lavoy
Thank you. Thank you so much for having me again. I'm back.
- [03:46]
Jason Pfeiffer
You're back. We never want you to leave. So, Morgan, you never will you come onto this show that you also produce because you have a question for us from deep into the business bowels of Money News Network, but relevant to us all. What is that question?
- [04:04]
Morgan Lavoy
Yes, help. This is something that I'm really struggling with. I have been having some partnership conversations on behalf of mnn, and it's something that I'm.
- [04:16]
Jason Pfeiffer
Let's just translate that. In other words, you're talking to brands who might want to pay. Money News Network, the network that this wonderful show is on to. To. For advertising or other kind of partnership value.
- [04:31]
Morgan Lavoy
Yes, exactly. Exactly. And so that is not that. Not my background. This is a new world for me and I've been navigating and trying to figure it out. And one part of it that I'm really stuck on is when to bring up money, when to. When to make the conversation about money. And I'll give you two examples. One where I had a conversation with a publisher who posts content and branded content, and we were talking about having one of our M and N personalities write some of their branded content, and they. They met the personality. They really liked them. Everything was driving. We came up with some good concepts. And then when it came time to talk about the money, when I brought it up, their figure was very, very, very, very low. And they tried to make all of this argument about how it was such great exposure for the personality because their audience is so big and so, like, what a great value we're getting from them. And in that case, I just felt like I had waited way too long to start talking about the money, because at that point, we had already started making plans. And then it felt like we were very much not aligned on where the value was. And I was like, do I just move forward? Because now it feels like an opportunity cost. I just wasted so much time in talking to these people that actually aren't going to give us a lot of money. But if I had brought it up earlier, I don't know if I would have felt like I really built a strong relationship. Does it start to feel too transactional too early? And so ever since then, I've kind of had some seeds of doubt around the best way to have this conversation about money and when it's the right time to bring it up.
- [06:31]
Jason Pfeiffer
That's a really great question, because this problem shows up in business in so many different ways. We know what it looks like to start a relationship or a conversation that could drive business, but it's not always clear when it's time to buckle down and talk numbers or talk about when we're gonna make the thing. Things could just kind of become these endless conversations, and it can feel really awkward to just say, all right, it's time to talk dollars.
- [07:03]
Uticol
So that's interesting because, like, they reach out to us. Yeah.
- [07:07]
Morgan Lavoy
Right?
- [07:07]
Uticol
Yeah. So I think there's. There's some differentiation, too, and some hesitation in the dance, depending on who initiates the outreach. Right. Like, Jason, when you get outreached for speaking, you are comfortable right away saying, here's my fee.
- [07:24]
Jason Pfeiffer
But if actually, no, I don't do that. Oh, funny enough, you do. It depends on. It depends on who's reaching out. If somebody reaches out to me about a speaking engagement and it seems like they have money, they're from a large brand, they're from a large trade association, then I will engage with them for some amount of time before we get to money. And the reason for that is because I want to increase perceived value. I want them to feel like I can bring the most value because I know that budgets are. Are Generally flexible they are. I mean, that's not to say that like people can just make money out of nowhere, but they can draw budget away from one thing and towards another. If they think that I have enough value or in the conversations that we have, I, I might discover some other ways for me to create value for them. So it's not just they, they reach out about a keynote, but we were talking and I asked them about what else is going on. I was like, oh, you know, you know, be great is I, I could, I could do a keynote and then from the keynote I could also mention a workshop that I'm doing with you guys an hour later in like a side room. And then I do a workshop and they're like, oh, that would actually be awesome because we're booking the workshops now. I've added perceived value. I've actually discovered maybe some other work that I can do for them. And the number that I can eventually quote them is going to be larger and they're also going to want to pay more for me just because they, because like, oh, you know, this guy's just going to be really easy to work with and you know, like, that's that. So I will go on and on. I'll go down, I'll go. A few, a few interactions. I mean, whereas if somebody reaches out to me and I'm just not sure. Well, just, just to finish, like if somebody, if somebody reaches out to me and I'm just not sure if they have money, if it's a smaller organization, if it's a non profit, then I'm more upfront about my general range fee, like in the first email because I want to, I just want to make sure that we're, we're at least aligned on, on that. So wait, wait, wait.
- [09:17]
Uticol
So what are you, so what does interaction mean?
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Jason Pfeiffer
Interaction means.
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Uticol
Interaction means like an email or like
- [09:23]
Morgan Lavoy
a full zoom with.
- [09:25]
Jason Pfeiffer
No, a full zoom. Full zoom. I'll sometimes I'll take multiple calls and, and, and, and this doesn't always lead to business. Like, I, I just believe when Morgan was telling this story, and the story was basically that you went fairly far down a path. You spent a bunch of time talking to them. The thing I didn't like hearing in this story was that you'd made plans that there was stuff in motion. Right? There's talking and there's acting and I think it's fine to be doing a whole bunch of talking. I really do. You don't act on anything until there's something signed. But honestly, you know, what it made me think of, it made me think of dating. So when I was, I moved to New York, I was single and I went on OkCupid, which was like the hot thing at the time. It wasn't even an app, it was like desktop. I remember one of the first, first like women that I connected with, this was a woman named Sharon. And Sharon was also in media and we had like these long, long email exchanges. You know, it was like a short email turns into a mid sized email turns into a lot. And it would just, it went on for like two weeks before we met and had zero chemistry. And then I felt like, ugh, I wasted a whole bunch of my time. And so like that's what you did in a way, you know. But then I thought, but what am I supposed to do here? Because some amount of investment has to take place in terms of time in order to see if this is a match. So I don't think that I want to do the endless long emails, but I do want to do some amount of interaction and probably have to go out and meet someone to find out if this is like a worthwhile match. And I'm basically going to have to lower my tolerance bar for what is worth my time. And that was fine. That was fine because that's just kind of what it is. Like that's what it is to go out and find the right partner. Whether it's romantic or it's business, you spend a whole bunch of time exploring a relationship and it doesn't all work out. I mean this is what like Entrepreneur magazine, like every media company gets a bunch of RFPs, which means that a brand. I'm just going to make up a just a scenario. Kroger Supermarkets. It's just like a brand that doesn't usually advertise with Entrepreneur. Kroger Supermarket sends us an RFP and, and RFP is request for proposal, which means that they want our plan for how to execute their goals and some numbers around them. Right. You know, Money news network gets RFPs too. So what happens? Well, Entrepreneur spends a whole ton of time. Like there's a whole team, there's a whole bunch of time, lots of different calls. We come up with a whole plan and we present it. And sometimes there's like multiple calls and sometimes that leads to money and sometimes it doesn't. And that's just the game. That's just it. That's just what happens. And, and sometimes doing that doesn't lead to money now, but it leads to a relationship later. That or leads to a relationship, we're like, oh, this doesn't work right now, but like, let's keep in touch and it could turn later. I just think you have to have a high tolerance for going down roads that may not lead to money. But I think that, number one, you just need to know that there's some money there to begin with. So you don't want to do this with like every joker who reaches out. And then number two, you just don't want to make it any actual plans. Like, you don't want to actually, like, spend resources aside from like your own time and mental. And some mental energy, because you don't want to act on anything until there's something signed that's.
- [12:53]
Morgan Lavoy
That's interesting. So, so what you are saying is that this period of time before you actually start talking numbers, I feel like to me sometimes that period of time feels like small talk where it's like we're not really getting into the meat of things yet. We're all going to forget about whatever said before we actually get into the good stuff. But what you're saying is there's some real work to be done there, like you can show your value. It's not necessarily that the brand that you're talking to has a fixed number and you are just taking a lot of time to get them to tell you what that number is. You are actively influencing what that number is going to be in the conversations leading up to that.
- [13:36]
Jason Pfeiffer
That's exactly right. There is work to be done there. It's not small talk. It is two things. It is you understanding their needs, and then it is you showing them your value. I, I am in the process of this right now with a very large tech company that reached out to me about an event. And I got on the phone with them and I wanted to understand the needs. And they were like a little abstract about what they wanted to do. But, you know, it's like, it's not just a regular keynote. We had all these ideas, I don't know, and, you know, wondering what you think. So I, I got on the phone, I asked them a bunch of questions. They told me a bunch of things that were happening. And then, you know what I did? I, I went into basically, I'm in authority mode, where I was like, okay, well, that sounds really interesting. You know, I find that those things work best when this and this happens. And I, you know, I don't think that it works as well there. So you might want to consider. I basically start treating myself like a uninvited consultant for their program. But in the process of doing that, I say things and I see what they react to and, and, and, and I'm like, oh, you know, and I could do that. You know, maybe. Do you guys need some workshops? Because actually, I bet that I would do a great workshop on storytelling that your audience would really love. And they're like, oh, yeah, actually, you know what? We are. And suddenly, suddenly I understand their needs better and they see me as having more value than they originally reached out. Now, as we speak right now, we have not gotten to numbers phase yet. I sent them a bunch of stuff. They also were, like, looking for celebrity keynotes and I was like, why don't I send you a couple ideas? I got some ideas. They didn't ask for that, but I did. I sent them a whole bunch of ideas and they were like, oh, this is great. We're going to sit on this and think on it. Are they going to pick any of those people? Is it going to be useful? I have no idea, but it took me 15 minutes, so why not? And we'll see. My gut is that I'm going to get a nice amount of money for this. And if I don't, it's not, not time blown. It is a relationship that was built. Maybe I'll get money from the next year. Um, it also just helped me refine, like, my own pitch and get a better sense of what the marketplace is. You just have to be doing work during this time. Never small talk. Always work.
- [15:39]
Morgan Lavoy
And Uticol seemed surprised when Jason said that he will get on zooms with people multiple times before talking about money. Is that not what you would do?
- [15:49]
Uticol
I think the learning moment from that scenario was, you know, maybe waiting too many calls. I think that there is a cap to the zooms. We've done zooms. You and I have done, like, multiple zooms. Another example that I was going to give after we finished with this one was where this can go so long and drawn out to a one year courtship process that he's never going to give us money. Too personal. And like, and it just, you know, anyway, that we'll put a bit at that. But, like, there's, there's. I'm surprised. I'm. I'm surprised that you've done multiple zooms. I think that multiple zooms, like, we should be really clear, I think. Morgan, how many, how many calls did you have on this particular thing? More than two.
- [16:51]
Morgan Lavoy
I would say three. And then on the fourth, we talked about money.
- [16:56]
Uticol
Okay. I think one to Two, like, I think we, I think capping it there because there is that opportunity cost. Like, you're spending 30 minutes, you're spending prep time. Maybe it's just 15 minutes. But those 15 minutes, Jason could have been doing something else. I don't know. So I think just be really clear about what the cadence is and, like, where the cutoff is. And, and I do think in negotiating, throwing out the first number sets the sets, the comp of like, what we're.
- [17:32]
Nicole Lapin
Where we're going.
- [17:33]
Uticol
If, if. I don't, I don't remember what this offer was, but, like, let's say you were expecting 50 grand and they were like 500, right? There's totally different stratosphere, totally different universe. And so I think, like, some earlier on, we need to get in the same stratosphere, right? Like, I, I also, I did some of these, Jason. And I'm not poo pooing this because I haven't done it because I have. Like, I've tried to work with Walmart for, you know, one of my book tours, had a bunch of calls, all the things, and, you know, was going to set up a thing and thought they were going to buy all the books and give me all the money. And they were like, we have no budget. And I was like, what do you mean? That's actual lie. So it's. Sometimes it gets hard to. I'm like, you're fudging Walmart. You're, you're, you are the money.
- [18:19]
Jason Pfeiffer
Like, what do you definitely have? You literally are budget.
- [18:24]
Uticol
And so sometimes it's, it becomes weird like that. And I think when you give too, it's like just a balance of, like, not giving too much for free and getting to the same ballpark. Like, I'm thinking I'm making a million dollars and they want to pay me $0. Like, that. That's way too far apart, right? Like, what's, what's different than dating on OkCupid is that you can set your filters, right? Like, you're not just doing, like, dating roulette where you're like, cool.
- [18:56]
Morgan Lavoy
I don't know.
- [18:56]
Uticol
Like, maybe we're on the same stratosphere, maybe we're not. Like, maybe we want the theme things. Maybe we don't. Like, you set those filters and those parameters sometimes on these calls, like, it's so far apart that it's something that could be set. And those business filters or parameters can be set early enough. Doesn't have to be in the response back of what's your budget in an email But I think earlier than not, here's the general comp of what we're doing these types of gigs for. So how, with what you guys are thinking.
- [19:37]
Morgan Lavoy
So how, how would you do that in the, say, say it's, say it's the second meeting. What would you say?
- [19:43]
Jason Pfeiffer
Stick around. Help Wanted. We'll be right back. Welcome back to Help Wanted. Let's get to it.
- [19:52]
Morgan Lavoy
Say it's the second meeting. What would you say?
- [19:54]
Jason Pfeiffer
So I've taken a couple different approaches to it. Number one is that I have, I have made it less of a pitch and more of just contextual information. So it's like we're talking and I might say, yeah, that's a really interesting idea. I generally have been doing that in the $10,000 range. And then it can go up for this other stuff. You just give them the information instead of you put it to them as a thing. Hey, do you have this? This is what I cost. I could see that working in MNN pitches where you maybe bring up some kind of general price range for a kind of thing that we're talking about. Oh, like, you know. Oh, yeah, that's, you know, we love doing that. Yeah, we, you know, that, that's, that's usually something that we've been doing in the, you know, X range because it takes, the other thing is to just get, get to some point where you say, and, and I, I, I don't know if the correct strategy here would be to be having a conversation about this and try trying to get somebody to commit to a dollar figure, like on the spot. I, I bet that there is like, some sales coaching about that. That has never been how I've operated. Instead, I've always just sent it to them by email. And the reason for that is because I know they may have to think about it. And so wait, that's not true. As I'm thinking about that, sometimes I send it by email afterwards, sometimes we're talking and I say, I'll send you a proposal and why don't I just send you a proposal with, you know, all the fees and information? And they're, they're like, oh, that's great, because then I can show that around. And then sometimes people will flat out ask me, so what are your rates? And at that point I just tell them in person. And, and then I basically tell them. And I feel like what I'm doing is I'm standing on my, I'm standing in like, my best, like, whatever pose you would be in where you want to move and Pivot as fast as possible. Like I'm going to give you a number and then based on however you react, I'm going to shift. Maybe I'm going to, maybe I'm going to say, oh, and I can add more. Or I'm going to say, oh, yeah, you know that that's my. I, you're, you would be so great to work with that. I'm sure I could work something out if you needed to go a little bit low. Right. Because like I'm going to say a number that's higher than the actual number that I will be acceptable. To me, this has been a long, rambly way of saying that there's no one right answer and therefore you shouldn't think that there's only one way to do this. I think that it's worth feeling out with the individual client where their comfort level is, but signaling to them at some point that this is part of the conversation that needs to take place. I think in this particular case, it drained your time and some of your energy and that sucks. But I still maintain that. I don't think that it was a loss. I still think that you gotta do a bunch of those to get some big wins. And also here's another thing to think about. In all those conversations, you develop some ideas that if you don't sell to them, you can just sell to somebody else. Like the work was still done. This happens at Entrepreneur all the time. We develop an idea for one rfp, that brand doesn't bite on it. We hang on to the idea and then we modify it for some other RFP and there's some other brand bites on it. The work was already done. And, and, and that's, that's what you're doing. You're always doing work when you're on these calls. It's not just a, it's not just siloed like that.
- [23:39]
Uticol
Yeah, I think that's right. I think what, that's what we've seen in, in the, in the evolution of these calls. There's now a bank of proposals waiting to be tweaked depending on the category. And I think that your area of selling is a little bit different. Right, Jason? Because it's so personal and it's so like I'm selling me to come to you. And so.
- [24:09]
Jason Pfeiffer
Yeah, but I, but I do, for what it's worth, I do a similar thing when I'm selling like newsletter ads or LinkedIn sponsored posts or whatever. I'll still take calls.
- [24:17]
Uticol
No A calls. Yeah, no, I'm not I'm not anti call. I think, I think that when you have a product too, you can lean on some of the metrics of like here and, and this type of thing. We usually go for, you know, a $70 CPM or I don't know, whatever. I think that you can depersonalize it a little bit more than, you know, where, where you're really like in full, like this is this, this is what you get. Look at this. Put up. How much would you pay for this? Put them. And it's like, you know, all the dollars. That's a little bit more of a personality fit than when you have, when you have a product that's a commodity.
- [24:59]
Jason Pfeiffer
Right.
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Uticol
And that's what impressions are.
- [25:01]
Chime Legal/Disclaimer Voice
Right.
- [25:01]
Uticol
Or that's what these, these types of units that we're selling are. But yeah, I think that, you know, the sweet spot is probably around one to two to two times and having some sort of, hey, I'll send you a rate card or like, hey, here's a proposal which I think you've done so successfully.
- [25:20]
Morgan Lavoy
Thank you.
- [25:21]
Uticol
And then we have a danger of becoming too chubby chummy to do. Another example. Morgan, is that the second example you were going to bring up?
- [25:30]
Morgan Lavoy
You know, it wasn't, but I think that that's a, I think it's, I think it's a good one. So, Jason, we reached out to this guy who is sort of like a. Could be a great intermediary between us and brands that we could work with. He is in a. I'm keeping this vague, so sounds weird, but he, I
- [25:59]
Jason Pfeiffer
love how carefully you're like, we reached out to this guy. Yeah.
- [26:07]
Morgan Lavoy
And he, he, he is connected to many brands and could be a very good sort of like introducer to us and potential advertisers and.
- [26:17]
Uticol
But also has an organization that has budget potentially themselves to do some of the things that we do very, you know, aligned on brand.
- [26:27]
Jason Pfeiffer
Great.
- [26:27]
Morgan Lavoy
Yes. And so.
- [26:29]
Jason Pfeiffer
Interesting and vague. Yes.
- [26:30]
Morgan Lavoy
Yeah. And so we met with him. Nicole met with him first and met with him for two hours.
- [26:39]
Uticol
I think it was longer. I think it was like three hours. A three hour. Like, oh my God, let's take over the world. It was like no talk of money. It was exactly this. It was like, rah, rah. Yeah, look at this big ass shaded part of our Venn diagram. Like, let's get him. And so it was like, then what happened? This is so long ago.
- [26:59]
Morgan Lavoy
So then he said as a next step, we should all talk together. So then when Nicole's in New York, we all Go to lunch and stay there until the restaurant closes for their dinner service. We were there for four hours. This was a year ago. We have done everything for this man. We have written him out, the sample emails that he should send to introduce us to other people. Like we have spoon fed how he can help us. And he has agreed to help us. He thinks that the, he actually, this is a little bit different because he thinks that the pricing, we did have a conversation with him about pricing and he's good with the pricing. It's just in this case, instead of us being really misaligned on pricing and value, we're really misaligned on action in that he's not taking any. And we're at a point where we're like, we can't keep talking to this man. And it's been, we've had so many of these just lunches, meetings where we're, we come prepped with a deck and then nothing ever happens after it. That he just thinks that we're friends now. He thinks that these are just like catch up calls to hang out and he's going through a lot personally and he just called Nicole to talk about it.
- [28:16]
Jason Pfeiffer
So this is funny because I had made this dating metaphor in the beginning and you just got friend zoned. You went, you got friend zoned trying to make a business deal. That's what happened.
- [28:27]
Morgan Lavoy
It's exactly what happened. Well, exactly what happened.
- [28:30]
Jason Pfeiffer
I think that just like in dating, you have to recognize that and at some point you have to say, I do. I actually just want to be friends with this person. Or am I only interested in this person's money? And if you're only interested in this person's money, that at some point you have to recognize this, this doesn't work. And so again, I think that this one sounds like this one went on too long. Like the thing with Sharon. Sharon, the woman who I emailed a lot with, spent a whole bunch of time emailing, email, email, email. But you know what? It took one date and it was pretty clear that this wasn't going anywhere. You know what the counter to that was? Actually, interestingly, after my whole talk about how you just got to take the meeting is, you know how I met Jen, my wife? So also I met her on OkCupid. I sent her a, sent her a note and, and what she replied with was she said, apparently I used a semicolon in my, in my outreach.
- [29:23]
Uticol
I don't remember every time.
- [29:25]
Jason Pfeiffer
Yeah, women love a semicolon. And so she wrote, she wrote me back. And she said, she said, hey, like, nice to meet you. You used a semicolon correctly, which shows me something positive about you.
- [29:39]
Morgan Lavoy
Let's get married.
- [29:40]
Jason Pfeiffer
Let's just, let's get married. And that's how I know. She said, but she said, but she was like, she was like, you know, let's not waste a bunch of time with emails. Let's just meet. And. And so that's what we did. We basically went from an initial DM exchange on OkCupid to meeting a bar for a drink the next week. And we talked about that and we talked about how both of us had done a lot of online dating and had a lot of like, back and forth with people who ultimately didn't work out. And she wanted to cut all that crap out and just get to the point where you actually figure out if there's any compatibility. And that was really smart because in dating, the way that you find out if you're compatible is that you meet in person, not through the. And so, so maybe the, the business version of this is you need to figure out what is the thing that ultimately proves the compatibility. And that's going to be some form of. If not talking about direct numbers, at least talking about like numbers and then seeing action on both sides. And in this case it sounds like there was just not. Not action. There's not compatibility. Whatever business compatibility is, you need to sniff it out. And if it's there, amazing you can get married. And if not, then thanks for the Sharon and well, I hope I wish you well.
- [30:59]
Uticol
There's other fish in the sea. It reminded me of the Big Short, the movie with, with investing legend Michael Burry. And it talks about how he met his wife on a dating website too. In the movie they say that his profile read, I am a medical student with only one eye, an awkward social matter, and $145,000 in student loans. And then his now wife wrote back, you're just what I'm look, you're just what I've been looking for. In other words, honest.
- [31:32]
Jason Pfeiffer
Ah.
- [31:33]
Uticol
And you know what? Like, I think that sometimes you have to be really honest about what you're looking for closer out of the gate because there are other, other people out there and damn it, not only other people, but other brands that are looking for what you're looking for. You know, whatever. Not to get you woo woo. But like, yeah, the roomy thing of like, what you're seeking is seeking you. And I think that you can be really clear about what your intentions are sooner because there are People that have the same intentions or the same values. And going on a one year professional courtship.
- [32:13]
Jason Pfeiffer
Yeah.
- [32:15]
Uticol
Is.
- [32:15]
Jason Pfeiffer
Yeah. You don't want to do that. Is not, you know, you don't date someone for a year if you haven't at least gotten something good out of it. I'd say dump that guy. Dump that guy.
- [32:27]
Morgan Lavoy
It's time to dump him.
- [32:28]
Jason Pfeiffer
All right, have we resolved it?
- [32:30]
Morgan Lavoy
I'll keep you guys posted. How's that? I have a. I have a couple conversations coming up and I'll let you know how they go. But I think in general, what's been very helpful is just thinking about this time before we start talking about numbers as being really valuable in and of itself.
- [32:51]
Jason Pfeiffer
It's all about, you know, the numbers game. It all, it goes, it, it always goes back to. It goes back to that. It goes back to that old sales thing. ABC always be closing. Like that's. It's kind of what you're always doing. Like, you have to be moving towards that. Right. Like even that chit chat at the beginning. What I'm moving towards is like, is closing a sale. And so you just have to think about it. Everything that you're doing is. Is towards that.
- [33:20]
Uticol
A very important question. Clarifying question. Have any of your emails included a semicolon?
- [33:33]
Morgan Lavoy
Yes. And an M dash and you still. And a million exclamation points.
- [33:40]
Jason Pfeiffer
No. No. Help Wanted is a production of Money News Network. Help Wanted is hosted by me, Jason
- [33:47]
Nicole Lapin
Pfeiffer and me, Nicole Lapin. Our executive producer is Morgan Lavoy. Do you want some help? Email our helpline@helpwantedoneynewsnetwork.com for the chance to
- [33:57]
Uticol
have some of your questions answered on the show. And follow us us on Instagram Money
- [34:01]
Nicole Lapin
News and Tik Tok MoneyNews Network for
- [34:04]
Uticol
exclusive content and to see our beautiful faces. Maybe a little dance.
- [34:08]
Jason Pfeiffer
Oh, I didn't sign up for that.
- [34:09]
Uticol
All right, well, talk to you soon,
- [34:27]
Jason Pfeiffer
Sam.