A 12 Out of 10: Trump and Xi’s Big Meeting; A New Nuclear Arms Race?

Summary

Here's the Scoop – Episode Summary

Podcast: Here’s the Scoop (NBC News)
Host: Yasmin Vossoughian
Date: October 30, 2025
Episode Title: “A 12 Out of 10: Trump and Xi’s Big Meeting; A New Nuclear Arms Race?”

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Episode Overview

This episode covers two main stories: President Trump’s high-profile meeting with Chinese President Xi Jinping during his Asia tour—touted by Trump as a "12 out of 10" success—and Trump's surprising announcement on restarting U.S. nuclear testing in response to developments in Russia and China. NBC News correspondents on the ground deliver insights and context for both issues, exploring the broader implications for U.S. foreign policy, trade, and global security.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Trump-Xi Jinping Summit: “A 12 out of 10” Meeting

• Atmosphere and Outcomes ([01:02]–[02:30])

  • Trump met Xi in South Korea for the first time in six years, marking a crucial diplomatic engagement amid ongoing trade tensions.
  • Trump described the 1hr 40min face-to-face as “a 12 out of 10” encounter.
  • Despite the effusive praise, no major breakthrough or signed deals emerged; only incremental progress was achieved.

• Perspectives from Beijing ([02:30]–[03:23])

  • Chinese officials were positive but muted, emphasizing gains without major concessions.
  • Janice McIfor (NBC Asia Correspondent):

    “For the Chinese side, it seems like they didn’t need to give up that much. ... If you fight back, occasionally, you can score a win.” ([02:30])

  • The Chinese view: Strategic resistance to U.S. tariffs can pay off without giving ground on core interests.

• Fentanyl Agreements ([03:46]–[06:24])

  • The fentanyl crisis was a notable agenda item. Janice McIfor visited a licensed Chinese fentanyl facility:
    • “It’s impossible that even a single dose of fentanyl that’s produced in that factory has ever leaked into the United States.”
      – Factory President, paraphrased by McIfor ([04:55])
  • The summit resulted in the U.S. reducing tariffs on fentanyl by 10%, effective immediately, in exchange for stronger Chinese commitments to curb precursor exports.
  • McIfor: “Both sides feel like they’ve walked away with a win.” ([06:24])

• Rare Earths Pause ([07:20]–[09:36])

  • Rare earth minerals, essential for technology manufacturing, have been weaponized in the trade war.
  • China holds a monopoly on processing, not on the minerals themselves.
  • After months of tension and prior export controls, China agreed to pause new export restrictions for one year. The arrangement will be revisited annually.
  • McIfor highlights that for China, rare earths are still “a negotiating point,” not a concession. ([09:36])

• Unanswered Issues and the Taiwan Topic ([09:46]–[11:14])

  • Several issues remain unresolved: port fees, energy, semiconductor chips.
  • Notably, Taiwan was not discussed—deliberately avoided amid White House concerns over possible shifts in U.S. policy language under Chinese pressure.
  • President Trump: “It never came up. Taiwan never came up, was not discussed, actually.” ([11:08])

• Russia’s Role and Next Steps ([11:40])

  • Continued Chinese purchase of Russian oil and Xi’s relationship with Putin remain complicating factors.
  • The next significant U.S.-China meeting is scheduled for April.

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2. U.S. and Global Nuclear Testing: Are We Entering a New Arms Race?

• Trump’s Announcement ([13:37]–[14:42])

  • On the eve of the Trump-Xi meeting, Trump posted on social media:
    • “Because of other countries’ testing programs, I’ve instructed the Department of War to start testing our nuclear weapons on an equal basis.”
  • The U.S. has observed a self-imposed moratorium on nuclear testing since 1992.

• What’s Being Tested? ([14:52]–[18:57])

  • Trump's post conflated two separate things: missile (delivery system) tests versus nuclear bomb tests.
  • Andrea Mitchell (NBC Chief Washington & Foreign Affairs Correspondent):

    “It was a very confusing post because it did not distinguish between a weapons test and a bomb test.” ([16:02])

  • She clarified:
    • Weapons (missile) tests: common, typically not provocative unless involving new technology.
    • Bomb (nuclear explosion) tests: banned, dangerous, and politically inflammatory.

• Local and Legal Obstacles ([18:40]–[18:57])

  • Underground nuclear testing remains banned; the only possible test site is in Nevada, which recently reaffirmed its opposition.
  • Testing is under jurisdiction of the Department of Energy, not the Pentagon.
  • Mitchell: “Not necessarily. … [Bomb testing] is not done by the Pentagon, it’s done by the Energy Department.” ([18:57])

• Russia and China’s Status ([19:46]–[20:22])

  • Russia recently tested a nuclear-powered missile, but not a nuclear weapon.
  • China’s last known nuclear bomb test was in 1996.
  • Both countries are advancing delivery technologies but not actively detonating weapons.

• Are We Heading for a New Arms Race? ([20:22]–[21:14])

  • Mitchell downplayed the risk of intentional escalation but warned of increased confusion and risk due to loose talk.
  • Mitchell:

    “I don’t think we’re heading to that [a nuclear arms race]. But accidents can happen, and someone should probably advise not to talk so loosely about nuclear weapons on social media.” ([20:31], [21:14])

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Trump’s self-graded summit:
  Trump: “I guess on the scale from 0 to 10, with 10 being the best, I would say the meeting was a 12.” ([01:26])
• On Taiwan being ignored:
  Trump: “It never came up. Taiwan never came up, was not discussed, actually.” ([11:08])
• McIfor’s rare earths caution:
  Janice McIfor: “For now, they are going to put this pause in place. But it seems from the Chinese perspective, rare earths are still going to be a negotiating point.” ([09:36])
• On nuclear weapons testing confusion:
  Andrea Mitchell: “Someone should probably advise not to talk so loosely about nuclear weapons on social media.” ([21:14])

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Important Timestamps

• [01:26] — Trump rates the meeting with Xi “a 12”
• [03:46] — Janice McIfor’s report from a Chinese fentanyl factory
• [06:24] — Details on fentanyl tariff and diplomacy
• [07:20] — Rare earths truce overview
• [09:46] — Unanswered issues and Taiwan omission
• [11:08] — Trump confirms Taiwan was not discussed
• [13:37] — Trump’s nuclear testing announcement context
• [16:02] — Andrea Mitchell explains test types and confusion
• [20:31] — Are we in a new arms race?
• [21:14] — Major recommendations and conclusion

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Tone & Style

• Direct and newsy: The hosts and correspondents stick to factual reporting and clear explanations, using precise language and occasional direct quotes from key figures.
• Balanced skepticism: Analysis is provided with context, nuance, and without hyperbole, especially on complex geopolitical issues.

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Brief Bulletin Headlines

([21:14]–end: Not covered in-depth, but below is a quick bullet point recap of notable headlines included after the two lead stories.)

• General Motors cuts 1,700+ jobs due to slow EV sales and tax credit expiration.
• Surgeon General nominee Dr. Casey Means’ confirmation hearing postponed—she went into labor.
• Updates on jewel heists in Paris and New York, including partial confessions in the Louvre case.
• Times of London mistakenly quotes a wine importer named Bill de Blasio, thinking he was the former NYC mayor.

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Summary

This episode is a deep dive into the delicate state of U.S.-China relations and a look at the escalating rhetoric on nuclear weapons. The show moves from the granular details of diplomatic negotiations and trade wrangling (with a human perspective from the ground in China), to the global risks of a new arms race, always keeping complex issues both approachable and accurate. The hosts stress that while small wins were achieved, big issues like the future of Taiwan and the true depth of nuclear brinkmanship remain unresolved.

Transcript

[A]

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[B]

Hey, everybody, and welcome to here's the Scoop from NBC News. I'm Yasmin Vasugian. Our shutdown counter is ticking up to 30. It is day 30 of the government shutdown, everybody, and as it drags on, millions of Americans are set to lose access to SNAP benefits in the coming days. Meanwhile, the President has made it to the final stop of his Asia tour, South Korea, where he says he had a great meeting with Chinese President Xi Jinping.

[C]

I guess on the scale from 0 to 10, with 10 being the best, I would say the meeting was a 12.

[B]

So over this one hour and 40 minute meeting, the two leaders, they tried bringing the temperature down on their bubbling trade war. Fentanyl, rare earths in Ukraine were all on the agenda. And Trump said the meeting brought a lot of, quote, finalization. However, they didn't actually sign any final agreement. So for more on what did and did not happen, I want to bring in Janice mcufrer, our correspondent on the ground in Asia. Hi, Janice. Welcome back to the show.

[D]

I'm glad to be here. Thanks for having me. Yasmin.

[B]

12 out of 10. Quite a review of that meeting. Are we hearing the same from the other side?

[D]

Well, there is an air of positivity around Chinese officials. But during the briefing with reporters on Air Force One, President Trump was excited. He said it was amazing. He said it was outstanding.

[C]

I thought it was a great meeting. I think it was a very friendly meeting. It was a good meeting for two very large, powerful countries.

[D]

It was an important meeting time. The two leaders had been face to face in six years. The first time they had come together since the trade war really ramped up. And while it didn't yield the major Trade deal announcements that I think nobody was expecting, they did emerge with these smaller agreements on some fairly significant issues. But for the Chinese side, it seems like they didn't need to give up that much. The impression that they've come out of this meeting with President Trump showing that if you fight back against some of these trade and tariff initiatives that the White House has been tossing around the world over the past several months, if you fight back, occasionally, you can score a win.

[B]

So you said, we don't have kind of this whole deal quite yet, but we kind of know that they've made smaller deals. Amongst some of the things that are most concerning, it seems, one of which is the distribution of fentanyl. And before we get to what seems to be an agreement on the fentanyl coming from China, I know that you visited a fentanyl facility there. What did you learn?

[D]

This was a visit that was quite literally years in the making. Fentanyl has long been this intensely personal and political issue between China and the United States. The U.S. government has accused China and Chinese companies of not being complicit, but not doing enough to stop the flow of fentanyl precursors, those ingredients that are used to make illicit fentanyl, not doing enough to stop the flow of those to Mexico and then across the border into the United States. This is something that China has always denied. So as part of that, we had asked to visit a place that is allowed to produce fentanyl. We went to one of only five factories in the whole country that has a government license to produce fentanyl. It's the largest producer of fentanyl, not only in China, but in Asia. They put out about 100 million doses a year of fentanyl and its variants. And the security that was in place was notable. I mean, beyond, you know, all of the registration and facial recognition and that sort of thing, beyond the concertina wire that was on the fence around the factory compound and the electric sensors that were everywhere. The president of the. Of the pharmaceutical company wanted to make the point that it's impossible, and those are his words. It's impossible that even a single dose of fentanyl that's produced in that factory has ever leaked into the United States. So we came away from that trying to balance that against these accusations from the US Government. And it's that complexity that even President Trump acknowledged when he said that China's President Xi had agreed to do more to try to stop the flow of illicit fentanyl.

[B]

The United States, though, I mean, the president specifically, has gone after drug cartels in the Pacific, in the Caribbean, this has become a big part of his presidency. And yet he walked away from this meeting saying that they agreed to a reduction to a 10% tariff on fentanyl, effective immediately. What happened in this meeting to get him to that?

[D]

If you look at the fentanyl issue in the context of the other issues that they were being discussed, it was the one point where the US could give up a bit and China could score a win. This reduction in tariffs in return for saying, yeah, we'll do more, we'll do what we can. But if you look at what it was that the US Was looking to gain from this meeting, it wanted the shift in position on rare earths. They wanted concessions on port fees. So if you look at fentanyl, realizing how important it was to the US Side and how easy it was for the Chinese side to say that they would agree to do more, both sides feel like they've walked away with the.

[B]

Win because of also rare earth. So explain to us what happened with the rare earth minerals. And just to explain to folks exactly what those things are used for. They make magnets, essentially, that go into everything from turbines to electric vehicles.

[D]

And rare earths are not that rare. They're mined all over the world, but.

[B]

China has the monopoly on them, right?

[D]

China has the monopoly on processing. It's dirty work to get these minerals out of the ground. And there's different processes that are harder on the environment. And this. It's not an industry that's born overnight, but this is an industry that China chose strategically to build decades ago and are now realizing the value of this monopoly. And what has happened over the past several months, as China has dug in with its positions in the trade war and fighting back against US Tariffs, and announcing export controls of their own using the monopoly that they had on the refining. The fact that the US Wants them, the rest of the world wants them. And in October, they announced that they were imposing export controls on another seven rare earth minerals, critical minerals. The deal that they arrived at was that there would be a pause, like a truce on. On rare earths, where for one year, China would not put the export controls on this latest batch of rare earths. Hasn't said anything about the export controls on the rare earths that they've done in the past, but for this latest batch, they said that they would not have the export controls, at least for a year. President Trump told reporters that it was going to be extended and reviewed every year. That's not what the Chinese side is saying, they're saying that for now, they are going to put this pause in place. But it seems from the Chinese perspective, where earths are still going to be a negotiating point.

[B]

So what's left unanswered now because the next time they're going to meet is in April, they may talk before then. What is left unanswered when it comes to this ongoing trade war?

[D]

Well, there's still issues like port fees. There are still issues around energy, around chips. There's a host of issues. They didn't talk about Taiwan. They didn't even mention Taiwan, which was actually a concern for some officials around President Trump, that Taiwan would creep into the conversation because there was the concern, according to NBC reporting, that there was concern that if the conversation had shifted to Taiwan, that perhaps President Trump would be convinced by the Chinese delegation and President Xi to alter the language to say that the US Opposes Taiwan independence, which is a more politically charged version of the current US Position, which is the US does not support Taiwan independence. And they sound the same, but they are incredibly different in terms of the implications, especially from China's perspective. So when President Trump was asked on Air Force One what happened with Taiwan, he said bluntly, we didn't talk about Taiwan at all, and then moved on to the next question.

[B]

What about the Taiwan issue, sir?

[C]

It never came up. Taiwan never came up, was not discussed, actually.

[D]

So Taiwan is likely to creep back into the conversation in the coming months. So there's still a long way from having this major trade deal. They claim that there are no major stumbling blocks that exist right now between the two sides, but there's still a lot of days and weeks before that April visit where things can turn again.

[B]

Well, and by the way, we haven't even talked about China continuing to buy Russian oil and his relationship with Russian President Vladimir Putin, all things that could feasibly muck things up between now and the next visit in April. For now, Janice McIfor, it's about one o' clock in the morning for you, so thank you. Exactly. On a day, during a week, on.

[D]

A day that isn't quite the weekend. But I'm not sure how far I.

[B]

Am, how much Runway there is, but you're almost there. So we thank you for giving us some time.

[D]

And I thank you for having me.

[B]

All right, coming up, are we on the way to a new nuclear era? That's after a quick break.

[A]

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[B]

I'm Angie Hicks, co founder of Angie. When you use Angie for your home projects, you know all your jobs will be done well. Roof repair done well. Kitchen sink install done well. Deck upgrades done well. Electrical upgrade done well. Angie's been connecting homeowners with skilled pros for nearly 30 years. Years. So we know the difference between done and done well. Hire high quality [e-mail] welcome back to Here's a scoop from NBC News. So right before the meeting between President Trump and President Xi that we just talked about, the president posted on True Social quote because of other countries testing programs, I've instructed the Department of War to start testing our nuclear weapons on an equal basis. It's been over three decades since the U.S. s last confirmed nuclear test. When President George H.W. bush announced a moratorium on underground nuclear testing back in 1992, President Trump said the decision was about matching, quote, other countries, telling this to reporters on Air Force One.

[C]

We don't do testing. We've halted it years, many years ago. But with others doing testing, I think it's appropriate that we do also.

[B]

So the president mentioned Russia and China by name in a true social post last night, writing the United States has more nuclear weapons than any other country, adding that Russia second and China is a distant third, but will be even within five years. NBC News has reached out to the White House for clarification on the president's post about whether he means nuclear capable or nuclear weapons. China's last known testing of a nuclear weapon was in 1996. Just yesterday, Russia announced a test of a new long range nuclear powered underwater weapon and they recently also tested a nuclear powered and nuclear capable cruise missile. Russia, however, didn't detonate a nuclear weapon, just the delivery technology. And thus begs the question, are we leveling up in a new nuclear arms race and entering a new cold war? I want to bring in Andrea Mitchell, who is NBC News's chief Washington and foreign affairs correspondent who has covered this topic extensively. She's coming to us from Penn Station, so you're likely going to hear some train noise behind her. Welcome, Andrea.

[E]

Hey, thanks for taking me. I know it's a crowded, crazy day.

[B]

So, Andrea, we heard this announcement from the president overnight about nuclear testing. He mentioned China and Russia. Where do we stand on this?

[E]

We've tested plenty of our delivery systems, but the Russians have new missiles. The Chinese are developing new missiles they would like to test. We're giving their protection a mission to test. They have not tested. What Putin had done in the last 48 hours or so is fire some missiles that are nuclear powered. They're not carrying their weapons and they're not a nuclear weapon per se. So it's a missile test like countries do. But it's not something that is threatening to the United States. What the president did was to post something on Trump Truth Social. He was about to walk into a summit after six years in a very tense moment in trade relations and strategic relations with China. Only minutes before he posts this on Truth Social, which was a very confusing post because it did not distinguish between a weapons test and a bomb test. And he's sending that message moment before meeting with the President of China.

[B]

Can can you tell us the difference between a weapons test and a bomb test?

[E]

If you're firing a missile, you're firing a missile to test something that is, you know, potentially threatening if it's North Korea because it can deliver a payload. But if it's something that is not really threatening to Russia, it's not an intercontinental missile. You're just testing a weapon to make sure it works okay. And that is, is done. Occasionally it's done by the Pentagon. If you're testing a bomb, you're blowing something up which is bad for the atmosphere. It's bad radiation. It's not done in the United States by agreement with our allies and it's threatening to our allies and adversaries. Probably been two nuclear bombs actually ever, you know, launched, and that was Hiroshima and Nagasaki in World War II. And we used to test and it was decided by mutual agreement, we agreed to not do that anymore. It's something that JFK and other presidents have argued successfully against. And there was, in fact, at the last test site in Nevada, there was a vote in the Nevada legislature, the state legislature, unanimously in May never to allow another test because there had been some talk about doing another test. And it's not something that Nevada is permitting on its test site.

[B]

So it's interesting you bring that up because testing, underground testing for nuclear weapons has been officially banned since 1992. The one testing site would in fact be in Nevada, as you just referenced, considering what you just talked about in the local legislation happening there. Is it that easy to just get it back up and running?

[E]

Not necessarily. And it's also done by the Energy Department. It's not done by the Pentagon. So the President was accurate in saying, I'm telling the Pentagon to test. That's a delivery system, that's a missile. But it's not accurate. And he did confuse people. There was some misreporting last night that he was actually talking about blood blowing up, a bump. And it's not done by the Pentagon, it's done by the Energy Department. That's where they're stooling.

[B]

The president's returning from China after this meeting with Xi. All of this coming after him saying.

[C]

When I see them testing, I say, well, they're going to test. I guess we have to test. I'd like to see a denuclearization because we have so many, and Russia has some. Russia second, and China's third, and China will catch up within four or five years.

[B]

What are they doing, Russia and China, when it comes to nuclear testing?

[E]

What we know is that Russia at least has tested some missiles, but they are nuclear powered. They're not nuclear weapons per se. They're delivery systems that could conceivably carry a weapon. But this particular one that was tested is a new cruise missile, and it was not considered and it was weapon. It is nuclear powered. It's got a nuclear engine, as many of our submarines do. It's like a nuclear reactor being part of a missile.

[B]

Put this announcement in context for us. Are we headed towards a new nuclear arms race into a cold world era?

[E]

Once again, we're not intentionally heading for a nuclear war or a nuclear arms race to. There are other countries, the Saudi Arabians potentially, who want nuclear weapons. They want nuclear defensive weapons. Turkey has wanted that. Pakistan already has it. India has it. There are too many countries that actually have nuclear weapons, according to most theories and certainly according to the Nuclear Threat Initiative. So I don't think we're heading to that. But accidents can happen, and someone should probably advise not to talk so loosely about nuclear weapons on social media.

[B]

Andrew Mitchell, as always, thank you. You bet. Get that train. Don't miss that train, Andrea. All right, let's get to some headlines. General Motors is cutting more than 1700 jobs across Michigan and Ohio as demand for electric vehicles sputters. The automaker is blaming, quote, slower near term EV adoption and shifting regulations. Corporates speak for people are just not buying enough of them. The cuts are hitting about 1200 workers at GM's Factory Zero plant in Detroit and another 550 at its Ultium Cells battery site in Ohio. Battery production in Ohio and Tennessee will also pause in January for upgrades. Also known as a timeout. The move comes just after the federal $7,500 EV tax credit expired, a key spark plug for sales. Without it, the electric buzz has dimmed and GMs hitting the brakes. The Senate's highly anticipated confirmation hearing for Surgeon General nominee Dr. Casey means hit an unexpected pause Thursday morning because she went into labor just hours before her scheduled virtual appearance before the Senate Health, Education, labor and Pensions Committee. The Stanford trained doctor turned wellness influencer had a different kind of delivery to focus on. Means nomination has started some controversy. A close ally of Health and Human Services Secretary Robert F. Kennedy, Jr. She has voiced skepticism of traditional medicine and promoted wellness products. She also doesn't hold an active medical license. Means did not respond to a request for comment ahead of today's anticipated hearing. A new date for the hearing will be announced soon. In the meantime, Dr. Means has quite literally got her hands full. We are following up on this fall's hottest trend thievery, with updates on the Paris heist and a new brand of thieves in the Big Apple. Five new suspects were arrested in connection with the Louvre heist in Paris, according to an update given by a Paris prosecutor today. The identities of the suspects have not been revealed, but prosecutors say they were located via DNA evidence found at the scene of the crime. While the jewels have not been recovered just yet, two of the suspects have, quote, partially confessed their roles in the crime. And then in New York, three men broke into a queen's home and drove off with a safe and jewelry worth roughly $3.2 million. At least two of the men were dressed in construction chic, wearing similar utility vests seen in the Louvre heist. No one was injured during the heist and the men are still on the loose, last seen fleeing the scene in a blue Hyundai Elantra. This week, the Times of London published an article centered around an exchange with former Mayor of New York, Bill de Blasio. So back in September, de Blasio endorsed Zohra Mandani, the Democratic candidate for mayor. The quotes from the article were scathing, though it seemed like de Blasio was no longer a Mandani fan, a lot of people were left scratching their heads. So it turns out the Times of London did talk to de Blasio, but not the de Blasio. Instead of emailing the former mayor, they got a 59 year old long island wine importer who also happened to be named, yeah, you guessed it, Bill de Blasio Wine. De Blasio claims he never said he was Mayor de Blasio and was never addressed that way. So he just, quote, gave his opinion and used ChatGPT to craft his emailed responses to critique Mandani's vision for the city. In a statement to the New York Times, the Times of London claimed their reporter was misled by, quote, an individual falsely claiming to be the former New York mayor. The article has since been deleted from the Times of London site and former Mayor de Blasio took to X reiterating his support for Mandani. All right, that is going to do it for us. Thanks for listening to. Here's a scoop from NBC News. I'm Yasmin Bisugin. I'll be back tomorrow with whatever the day may bring. And if you like what you heard, then like us, back wherever you get your podcasts.

[A]

What are you doing in a meeting? That could have been an email. That's right, you're losing interest. Don't let it happen to your money too. Vanguard's Cash plus account can't help you at work, but we can help with your savings because Vanguard believes in giving you more. So how much interest could you earn? Find [e-mail] cashplus offered by Vanguard Marketing Corporation member FINRA and SIPC.