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Where was she? The disappearance of Carrie Farmer was quite unlike any other because Carrie hadn't exactly vanished, but retreated beyond the shadows to release rage in torrents of text messages.
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And it just went on and on.
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And on, beyond diabolical, beyond the macabre to murder a story straight out of left field.
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You're on edge as to what's going to happen next.
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I'm Keith Morrison and this is Something About Carrie, an all new podcast from dateline.
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Listen to all episodes now, wherever you get your podcasts.
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Hey, guys, I'm Hoda Kotb. Look, I know how busy life can get and sometimes we all just need a moment to pause and connect. Well, that's what my podcast Making Space is all about. Real conversations with people who've learned how to live with purpose and heart. Think authors, thought leaders, actors, performers. And every time I walk away with something that changes how I see the world. I'm and I think you will, too. Join me for Making Space every week wherever you get your podcasts.
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Welcome to here's this group from NBC News. I'm Yasmin Bissoukim. Today on the show, there's infighting in the Trump administration. We're talking about how to negotiate the end of the Russia, Ukraine war and the top two U.S. officials that are trying to master the art of the deal. Plus Paramount, they're beefing up their bid for Warner Brothers discovery. Could it deliver a Hollywood ending? And Mariah Carey, the Queen of Christmas, has been dethroned, the holiday song that is topping her on the charts. Up first, though, the continued fallout over the Epstein files. The Department of Justice turned over thousands of heavily redacted pages related to the late sex offender Jeffrey Epstein on Friday. But not everything that they have. Lawmakers, Epstein survivors and their families are calling for accountability. We begin with the latest from NBC News's chief Capitol Hill correspondent, Ryan Nobles. Hey, Ryan.
C
Hi, Yaz.
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What did we learn from this release?
C
Not a whole lot, to be honest with you. The deputy attorney general, Todd Blanch had teased the morning of that the initial release was going to be hundreds and thousands of documents, terabytes of information, and it's fallen well short of that. We had a just for context, we had a reading team here in our Washington, D.C. bureau of like 20 people, many of them scheduled to read through it as late as midnight on Friday. And we were done with it by about 6 o'.
E
Clock.
C
So it just shows what a meager initial disclosure this was. There just isn't a lot there yet. Much of it is redacted I mean, there was one document that initially was 100 and some odd pages that was completely redacted, just black page after black page. They've since gone back and revealed some of that. But I think there's pretty widespread agreement amongst the people that were most interested in this information getting out. And by that I mean, you know, Tom Massie and Ro Khanna, the two members of Congress that drove this, and then survivors and victims, that this is not at all what they're looking for as a result of this law that was passed demanding the Department of Justice release all the Epstein files.
B
So you mentioned Massie, you mentioned Ro Khanna, Senator Schumer as well, speaking out. So what is next? Because of the fact that all of these documents haven't been released, so they.
C
Don'T have a ton of ability to enforce the Department of Justice to do something in the short term. There are some options at their disposal, but those options are all going to be limited by what Congressional Republicans are willing to do. And when I say Congressional Republicans, I mean Congressional Republicans in leadership. And so what are those options? Well, one of them is that they could hold the Department of Justice in inherent contempt, which would mean that the Department of Justice is not following a law, and that would force and compel them to do so, and there could be consequences associated with that. That's kind of the initial mechanism that Ro Khanna and Massie have floated as a possibility. Whether or not they can get that to the floor is an open question. But the important thing to keep in mind about this, Yasmin, that's definitely not gonna happen until after the holidays. They don't return until January 5th. I think the Congress and the Department of Justice has said they're gonna take at least two weeks to get all the material that they have uploaded to this website that they've created. So there's a lot that could happen between now and when Congress returns to session. And the Department of Justice still has quite a bit of time to actually fully comply with Ryan Nobles.
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Thank you.
C
Thank you.
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Lawmakers aren't the only ones who have been critical of the Epstein files release. We are joined now by Charlene Rochard, who is a survivor of Jeffrey Epstein's abuse. Hi, Charlene.
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Hi. Thank you for having me.
B
It's great to have you in. How are you doing amidst all this?
E
I'm doing okay. Some days I'm up, some days I'm down. It's just depends on what comes out.
B
What has been your reaction so far to the release of the documents? By the Department of Justice and how they haven't all come out yet.
E
I'm very upset with the justice system because there's full pages that are totally blacked out. And I know. I don't know about you, but my name is not a full page. We only ask that our names be redacted. That's all we asked for. So pages and pages and pages of black on black on black is just unacceptable. There are so many things that also have not been released. This was a law. This law said that everything must be released in 30 days. I don't understand why it's taking longer than 30 days.
B
So you support lawmakers on both sides of the aisle making sure that everything gets released?
E
I do. With our names redacted, with the names redacted. And there is absolutely no care towards survivors in this. They haven't asked us anything. They haven't come to our lawyers and said anything. We ask that we know before things come out.
B
When you say they, who do you mean?
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The doj.
B
Okay.
E
They have not taken care with us survivors in blocking out our names. Some of our names have been released. A lot of our names have been released.
B
So the DOJ has said that the redactions are meant to protect the victims and their families, right?
E
They are.
B
Do you buy that?
E
They're not redacting all of our names. So, no, I don't buy that at all.
B
And you think the redactions are too extensive?
E
Absolutely.
B
I want to take a step back because we're talking a lot about the laws and what has happened in the public sector, and you've shared a little bit about your story. But I want folks and listeners to understand why it is you are wanting to make sure that there is accountability. You met Jeffrey Epstein when you were a teenager. How did you meet him?
E
So I was working as a model in New York, and. And a friend of mine had said, you could meet this guy. He's gonna maybe help your career in some way or shape or form. And to me, that was kind of a normal thing, because there are a lot of people that you meet, and in the entertainment business, a lot of it is who you know.
B
Right.
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So of course I'm gonna go be like, oh, okay, I'm gonna go meet this guy.
F
You were young.
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You thought, great, I'm gonna meet this guy. He'll get me connected. I'll make money.
E
Yeah. And so I met him, and he gave me a massage book, and he told me I had a job. I thought I was his massage therapist.
B
So you Were gonna be his massage therapist? Yeah. And was there gonna be. Were you gonna get paid for that? Did he say he would pay you to be a massage therapist for him?
E
Yeah. So every time you went, you would get paid for doing a massage therapy? It sounds so silly now. It's honestly ridiculous. Like, I was so young, I had no idea what was actually going on.
B
I mean, I know you're laughing and you say it sounds silly, but, I mean, you're an impressionable teenager. I think a lot of young women would fall for a similar thing, especially when you're in the entertainment industry in New York.
E
Yeah. And he was really charismatic. And so you genuinely liked him and thought that he was going to help you. But now that I look back, the manipulation of everything that happened was just so. So.
B
Would there be people at his home when you would go to his home?
E
Well, there'd be the doorman and the maid or whomever was at the house.
B
And did you interact with Ghislaine Maxwell as well?
E
I did.
B
You did? Mm.
E
She was always kind of around.
B
When did other people become part of the picture?
E
It took a little while, but. Cause he had to get to know you first. So he got to know me. He got to know what I wanted to do. And then other things started happening. You'd be introduced to other people.
B
And it wasn't just Epstein's home in New York that you went to?
E
No, I was in New York, Miami, and the Island.
B
And you went to Mar A Lago as well. What did you do at Mar A Lago? You were going to parties there?
E
Yeah, I was going to model parties.
B
I know that you don't want to name names. Why is that?
E
Well, we can't name names because there's a lot of things. These are really powerful people, and we could be putting our lives at risk. We could also be sued. There's a lot of reasons why we don't just come out and say the names.
B
What do you and other survivors want people to know as to why you're still fighting?
E
I'm still fighting because justice has not been served. There's a lot of people out there that have harmed us. There's a lot of institutions that have done wrong. Everybody who harmed us, we are hoping to hold accountable in this. Jeffrey's not the only person. And what's so odd about this is the only one person in jail is a woman. And we as women, have been constantly fighting for our own rights. And that woman in jail has a puppy, a nice bed. She's able to use a cell phone. I mean, I feel like that's a vacation for the harm that she caused. She should never be allowed out again.
B
You're talking about Ghislaine Maxwell.
E
Correct.
B
And she's asking for a pardon.
E
Correct. She should never be pardoned. She should stay there for the rest of her life. There are so many girls, hundreds of us, if not a thousand, that she was directly involved with. Why is she the only one that's accountable? But yet she's not really even being held accountable.
B
Charlene, I certainly applaud your courage in speaking out. I cannot imagine how difficult it must be. But we are thankful that you're using your voice to help yourself and other women as well and to hold people to account. Thank you, Charlene.
E
Thank you.
B
All right. We are going to take a very quick break. And when we are back, the diplomatic rift in Washington that could make it harder to end the war in Ukraine.
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10, 9, 8.
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The countdown to midnight has begun, but there's still time for one more party. And the stars are coming out for 2025's last holiday special. The Old Year's. Gotta go before we ring the new one in. Share the fun when Hoda and Jenna reunite.
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All season, the Today show takes you inside the game.
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Once upon a time in an icy winter world, a wicked woman stole a child. Only the power of love can save him and defeat her. The Snow Queen, new to Morrison mysteries. Listen now, wherever you get your podcasts.
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And we're back with here's the Superman BC News. I'm Yasmin Vestugian. A Russian general was killed in Moscow on Monday after a bomb exploded under his car. Now Russian investigators are looking into whether Ukrainian intelligence services might have been behind the attack. The Ukrainian government has not responded to a request for comment. The news comes after new rounds of talks over the weekend in Miami as President Trump pushes for an end to the war in Ukraine. Now, NBC News reports exclusively that there is a growing rift within the Trump administration on how to approach peace talks between Russia and Ukraine and that two senior Officials, Secretary of State Marco Rubio and special envoy Steve Witkoff have repeatedly been going head to head. Our reporter, Dan Delouse has been all over this, speaking to more than a dozen current and former officials from the US And Europe to better understand this rift. They spoke to him on the condition of anonymity to describe sensitive events. Hi, Dan.
F
Hi.
B
So you wrote about this beef between Rubio and Wyckoff. Can you give me an example of, of how these clashes are manifesting?
F
Yeah. So our story opens at a wedding in North Carolina where Secretary Rubio is there with his family in Winston Salem. And he's learning from his staff that his colleague Steve Witkoff, the envoy, is already on his way to Geneva. And there were supposed to be talks with the Ukrainians about a new peace proposal, that which had crafted. And Rubio had not been aware of Witkoff's travel plan. So he manages to get there and they both meet with the Ukrainians. So he manages to avert a situation where Wycoff is taking over the talks. By the way, I should mention to set the scene during that day at the wedding and beforehand, Secretary Rubio had a headache on his hands because The Peace Plana U.S. peace Plan had leaked a few days earlier. And Wytkoff basically had spearheaded that peace plan. And it was widely viewed both in Europe and Ukraine, in Congress, as a kind of pro Russian, heavily lopsided deal that asked almost nothing of Russia and everything of Ukraine. So he's on the phone to senators trying to talk about it, trying to figure it out. So he goes to Geneva, they have these talks. And in the talks with the Ukrainians, Rubio then pushes for changes to the plan to take away some of the most alarming provisions that the Ukrainians and the Europeans were so concerned about.
B
The administration is denying that these two, though, are at odds. But I know the officials that you've been speaking to say that this example specifically is indicative of this rift. Do we know how long this rift has been going on?
F
For some time, for many months. By the way, we should mention that, of course, Steve Witkoff is a very successful real estate tycoon. Right. And that's how he met Donald Trump. They're friends, they golfed together, but was not in government, was not a diplomat, was not traveling around the world negotiating ceasefire deals in Gaza or Russia. So he is not experienced. And so when he started out, he would go to the Kremlin, meet with Putin or other senior officials, and he would not bring his own translator. He would use the Kremlin interpreter Which is a big no, no. That's not how the US Usually rolls, or any government, really. Right. So you always translator to make sure you are getting an accurate picture of what is being said to you. So that was the first thing that happened. And then there were concerns about his communications on his plane. He would fly in a private plane. He didn't go in a US Government plane. US Government planes for diplomats, right, are always outfitted with secure communication systems so they cannot be hacked into and eavesdropped on. And Russia is very famous for its hacking activities. And it rose to the level in May where it went all the way up to Rubio. And they decided, okay, we've got to help him improve his security protocols and communications. And so they give him a mobile secure communication system. This is something that can be installed in a plane or even in a car. It's obviously more cumbersome than you and I talking on Signal or WhatsApp, but it's more secure. And you can imagine how many governments would like to hear what caused conversations with the Saudis or the Russians or whoever.
B
So what I'm hearing from you essentially, is this rift is twofold. It is Marco Rubio wanting more military pressure, more economic sanctions on Russia, wanting Russia to make more concessions than is being negotiated right now, wanting to be harder on Russia. But he feels as if Wyckoff, in fact, is in a way bowing to the pressure that's coming from the Kremlin, from Russian President Vladimir Putin, and is kind of this freewheeling diplomat with really no diplomatic experience.
F
That's exactly right. So it's a power struggle, and it's also a kind of policy struggle divide. Right. There's arguments inside the administration about how to handle Ukraine. Right. And the president, as we know from his public statements, has flip flopped back and forth. Right. We've seen him oftentimes push Ukraine very hard in a famous or infamous meeting in the Oval Office where the president scolds and rebukes Zelensky, the president of Ukraine. But then also in more recent months, right. He's expressed all this frustration with Putin and Russia at times and threatened to take actions. He did, finally, after a lot of threats, did take action and impose sanctions on two state oil companies. So it's also a struggle to try to influence the president's thinking. And he doesn't have a fixed view of this other than he wants a deal. And Rubio's on this one side, as you say, which says, listen, Russia is the obstacle here. They're the aggressor. Wyckoff, and I would say Vice President Vance, we've all seen what he's had to say. And others in the administration, they're pushing and pushing, and the focus has really been on getting Ukraine to compromise.
B
Look, Dan, people could be listening to this and saying, this is what happens in Washington. There are always, you know, rifts. There's always infighting within administrations. This, though, is a little different.
F
That's right. Wherever there's power, there's always going to be struggles to, you know, to obtain the most power as possible. Right. Henry Kissinger famously outmaneuvered the secretary of state in the Nixon administration. But the difference is that people like Henry Kissinger were not diplomatic neophytes. Amateurs. Right. They were very experienced. So I think what is unusual is to have so much influence in the hands of someone who came in with absolutely no government or diplomatic experience and also someone who, in his public statements has often accepted at face value a lot of Russia's positions. Now, President Trump has portrayed this as simply good negotiating. He's just kind of buttering up the Russians, trying to ingratiate himself to get a deal. But there is concern in Kyiv and across Europe that Wyckoff doesn't quite understand what he's up against and how deceptive and nefarious Russia can be. Because, of course, Russia said they had no designs on Ukraine, and look what happened.
B
Dan Delous, thank you.
F
Thank you.
B
A spokesman from the State Department said in a statement that there is no rift between Rubio and Witkoff and that they're fully aligned on the president's goals. And a White House spokesperson said that Witkoff, quote, follows all guidelines provided by diplomatic security and White House information technology. All right, let's get to some headlines. President Trump is ratcheting up his pressure campaign on Venezuela. On Saturday, the Defense Department interdicted a second tanker which the White House says was carrying sanctioned oil. Now, the US Coast Guard is chasing down a third oil tanker off the Venezuelan coast. That is, according to two US Officials with knowledge of the matter, who told NBC News. Last week, Trump told NBC's Kristen Welker that he's not ruling out war with Venezuela. Paramount is beefing up its hostile bid for Warner Brothers discovery billionaire Larry Ellison, the father of Paramount CEO David Ellison, is now personally guaranteeing $40.4 billion of the $108 billion takeover offer. The move could address Warner Brothers board concerns about whether the deal would actually close. Paramount is offering $30 a share for the entire company, including CNN. Netflix's lower bid of $27.75 per share would only include Warner Brothers streaming and studio assets. Meanwhile, Paramount owned CBS News polled a 60 Minutes report last night about the Trump administration sending detainees to a maximum security prison in El Salvador. Correspondent Sharon Alfonsi said in an internal memo obtained by the New York Times that CBS News Editor in Chief Bari Weiss's decision to kill the story last minute was, quote, political, not editorial. In a statement, Weiss said, quote, my job is to make sure that all stories we publish are the best they can be, adding, I look forward to airing this important piece when it's ready. An investigation by NBC News correspondent Raf Sanchez has revealed that Israel's military has been systemically demolishing Palestinian homes in parts of Gaza even after the ceasefire. The UN estimates over 80% of buildings there have been damaged or destroyed. Embedded with the Israeli Defense Force in Gaza and using satellite data, NBC News tracked how entire neighborhoods were erased in days. The work is being done by special military units and contractors, often Israeli settlers. The IDF calls it a military necessity to destroy terrorist infrastructure. A soldier who spoke to us on a condition of anonymity disagreed. He said it was obvious what they were doing was wrong. San Francisco had a rough weekend after a fire at a PGE substation knocked out power for about 130,000 homes and businesses. The outage hit about a third of the city's customers in areas like the Richmond District and around Golden Gate park, leaving restaurants dark and transit systems disrupted. A number of Waymo's driverless cars were left stranded in intersections. In a statement, the company said the sheer scale of the outage was the problem, and they plan to integrate the lessons from the event going forward. The Queen of Christmas has been overthrown. For the first time since 2020. Mariah Carey's All I Want for Christmas is you has lost the top secret spot on the Billboard Global 200, dethroned by Wham's 1984 classic Last Christmas.
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Last Christmas.
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On Instagram, George Michaels bandmate Andrew Ridgeley called it a quote, remarkable moment. But don't feel too bad for Mariah. She's still sitting pretty at number two. She'll be back. She always comes back. Like at the opening ceremony for the Olympics in just a couple of weeks. All right, that is going to do it for us at here's the scoop from NBC News. I'm Yasmin Vesugin. We'll be back tomorrow with whatever the day may bring. And if you love what you heard, subscribe. Wherever you get your podcasts. We'll see you tomorrow.
Episode Title: Victims and Lawmakers Criticize Redacted Epstein Docs, and Power Struggles Inside Trump’s Russia-Ukraine Peace Push
Date: December 22, 2025
Host: Yasmin Vossoughian
In this episode, Yasmin Vossoughian delves into two major stories:
Additional headlines include: a developing Hollywood merger, a Trump administration foreign policy move on Venezuela, new reporting from Gaza, and a Christmas music chart shakeup.
[01:12 – 11:23]
Heavily Redacted Documents:
Lawmakers Weigh In:
Survivors Speak Out:
[13:00 – 20:41]
Recent Developments:
Exclusive Reporting:
Examples of Conflict:
Policy Differences Repercussions:
Nature of the Rift:
[20:44 – 24:12]
Venezuela Sanctions:
Hollywood Merger:
CBS News Editorial Controversy:
Destruction in Gaza:
San Francisco Blackout:
Christmas Music Chart Update:
The episode maintains a brisk, clear, and news-focused tone. Yasmin Vossoughian’s style is empathetic in interviews (especially with survivors) and matter-of-fact in reporting, with expertise and urgency in political analysis. The episode strongly emphasizes accountability, both in the US government’s handling of the Epstein files and in its foreign policy conduct.
For anyone who missed the episode:
This summary captures the urgency, emotion, and complexity of the two main stories, as well as the fast-paced overview of headline events that shape the daily news cycle.