← Herm & Schrader
Herm & Schrader
Carson Hocevar: Why My On-Track Style Is Stronger Than A Hurricane
01:01:18
Kenny Wallace talks it over with the guy dominating the NASCAR world --- 23-year-old phenom, Carson Hocevar
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- [00:00]
Kenny Wallace
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- [01:32]
Carson Hocevar
Everyone deserves to be connected.
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Carson Hocevar
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- [02:02]
Kenny Wallace
Hello everyone and welcome back to Kenny Conversation brought to you by i55 Federated Auto Parts Raceway park right here in Pele, Missouri. And remember March 19, 2020 first, it's $5,000 to win for Mods Gone Wild. Well we're both racers. Carson, Josevar, there you are, the man of the hour. Everybody's talking about you. How you doing, buddy?
- [02:33]
Carson Hocevar
I'm good, Kenny. How are you?
- [02:36]
Kenny Wallace
I'm doing better now that I get a chance to sit down and talk with you. I'm either passing you at the Dome for the dirt race in St. Louis, I'm either passing you at the Chili Bowl. What is it with you and I and dirt racing?
- [02:52]
Carson Hocevar
I mean, I think we both enjoy it. I mean, you didn't run the. The Dome this year, which I was shocked by. But after, after I ran my feature, though, I didn't understand why, because I was. I was shaking up for the holes and then the. The chival. I enjoy having a good time. I was. I was getting FOMO the whole time not racing, but I was enjoying it a lot.
- [03:16]
Kenny Wallace
Yeah, it's really good to see you and we're going to celebrate your career and I want to thank your friend Jeff Dickerson, who basically runs and owns Spire right there. Jeff is a dirt racer and he's your boss. He runs it all. But Jeff Dickerson and myself, we get along because he was a. What was Jeff? A sprint or midget racer?
- [03:40]
Carson Hocevar
He was a midget racer, mainly.
- [03:42]
Kenny Wallace
Yeah. Is it, is it fun? Do you ever talk to him about, you know, just driving those cars?
- [03:49]
Carson Hocevar
Yeah, I mean, I, he. He reminds me all the time that he didn't have, you know, he would have maybe actually been something if he had a little bit of like video to know that you can't just run wide open in the slick, that everybody's just, you know, he's just making noise. But I. Last year I got him. I tracked down Ty Carlson and everything, his car owner back in the day. And there's Clay Kemp, I believe is his name. He. He does these insane diecast. Well, first I wanted to find the actual. And Ty texted me right away and said that thing has probably been flipped about a hundred times and the chassis is probably in some graveyard somewhere. So then I got a diecast and we made it exactly, you know, like everything to the T, you know, just to. To remember that. So, yeah, I, I enjoy it. We laugh. I mean, that's why I feel like, you know, between me and him, he's doing all these dirt stuff because we just sit there and text at 2am or 3am about dirt races and rather than just try and find someone to root for, we might as well have a car in it. Or he might as well have a car in it to. To root for between the dirt late model and the dirt sprint car and then the silver crown car, and then me trying to convince him around a midget. You know, I don't. I don't know what's left other than maybe texted Hoffman around his modified a time or two. You know, then we'll have everything.
- [05:12]
Kenny Wallace
Yeah. How about our friend Nick Hoffman? I mean, he. This is the year of Nick Hoffman in dirt super late models. I think he's 1, like 4 or 7. He's leading the points in the world of outlaw late miles. Congratulations, Nick. And hey, just real quick, you know, you talked about Jeff Dickerson running wide open through the slick. We know that doesn't work. And when I first started dirt racing, I was in Farmer City, Illinois, and like my second dirt race ever, when it was all over, I said, schrader. Talking to Kenny Schrader. I said, how do you know how to let off early? You know, when those features start? He says, herman, when you go on the track, lift your shield up and look at the track. So, yeah, so Dickerson. I wish he would have had a Schrader around when he first started.
- [06:06]
Carson Hocevar
Well, that was similar to my. My story when I. I first started. So nice came to me. And they're like, you know, Cody Fall was like, hey, I gotta, you know, I'm gonna build a dirt late mall. We're gonna, you know, we're gonna take you to Eldora. And I was like, well, that's. That's cool. I was like, I hope, you know, I've never ran a Dirleema ever in my life. And he's just like, yeah, I don't care. And that was my first truck start was Eldora. And he's like, that's where he found you. He's like, you'll be fine. You know, I was like, okay, whatever. And we. We show up. We, you know, we don't have any. We only have any extra tires. We only have one tire. And all right, if you're gonna hit. If you're gonna. If you're gonna get a flat, get the right rear. And so they wrecked right in front of me. I backed into them and got a flat right rear. Lap zero. We've changed it. Did everything. But I. I went out there, Eldora, cold turkey. Never tested, never anything. Three seconds off in hot laps, like. Cause I didn't tighten my belts hard enough. And I'm just like falling out of the car. But we were really fast once we got going, and I got a little bit comfortable. And I was running second to Brandon overton in the B main.
- [07:15]
Kenny Wallace
That's big.
- [07:16]
Carson Hocevar
And the caution came out. It was at the world and everything, and the caution came out. Or I think it was at the dream, but caution came out. And I didn't realize it was because I knocked my spoiler off. And so I fired off and, you know, had no spoiler, bled spots and everything. And so the next night, you know, Mike Marler kind of hits me and starts talking me his stuff and, you know, about saving tires in the right rear. You don't need to be as wide open and everything. Well, then, like, I get like, you know, to the driver's meeting for night two for our prelim night, and I get like wrapped around and I was like, who the. And It's Jonathan Davenport, 80. Like, he's like, man, I don't even want to tell you this because he's gonna, he's like, I'm gonna kill my entertainment value. But he's like, you are the most fun to ever watch drive a dirt late model of all time. If you ran about half the throttle you did, you might actually be decent at this. And so he qualified fourth that night. And I ran the bottom for, you know, it was 30 lap feature. I ran the bottom for 18 laps and fell to like 14th, 15th, and then ran wide open on the top. The last, like nine passed Hoff in the last corner or last lap or a few laps to go and finish six of my prelim night. But it just, it makes, it reminds me of that story that night one they told me, ah, if you're just tight, just more throttle wide open, and you know, you can't be in the throttle hard enough. And then, you know, I have like two of the best, you know, between Marler and Davenport. Just being like, you're an idiot, you know, like just, you do not need to be just running wide open, making noise and then wondering why your tires are completely blistered out of the thing.
- [08:53]
Kenny Wallace
Well, that is your nature. You're fast, you're wide open. I will say this. I started dirt racing at 44 years old, and I wanted to learn how to race dirt because, you know, A.J. foy, my hero, he would be on the pole for the Indianapolis 500, and then he'd be over at Indiana Fairgrounds, you know, on the fence, ripping it, you know, I mean, cheating death. And I'm like, I cannot run my whole asphalt career being one dimensional. And so at 44, I'm like, I want to learn the dirt race. And thanks to Kenny Schrader, Schrader Said to me one night, he goes, herman, he said, try letting off the gas. Well, because, you know, I saw the cars all jacked up, and that's just the new suspension nowadays, you know, I would watch from a distance, and I'm like, oh, my God, their cars are all twisted. Well, that's. They're that way if you're quarter throttle. So I. I agree with you. Okay, my friend. Are you ready to go NASCAR with me for Kenny Conversation?
- [10:03]
Carson Hocevar
Yeah, absolutely.
- [10:05]
Kenny Wallace
I think we laid a lot of groundwork there, everybody. Why Jeff Dickerson allowed me to talk to Carson. Carson and myself. We talk in passing. Here we go. 23 years old from Portage, Michigan, Graduated from Cole Lake. Is that Gull Gul Lake High School? Yeah, man, you're young. 23, Go Lake High School. Mom and dad Scott and Amy. Touch on your childhood for a minute. What was that. What was that area like growing up in that time?
- [10:42]
Carson Hocevar
Yeah, well, so, you know, I loved watching cars go around in circles and everything. I think my mom sat me down and just enjoyed watching the colors and everything. And my, My. My dad owns a little coin and jewelry store, you know, about the size of, you know, just a, you know, regular house. Like, nothing crazy, nothing big. You know, just little coin and jewelry store. And I was used to, you know, running around the counter. Me and my dad would. We. We'd race each other. We'd run, and then I would. I didn't understand customers because I would make these diecast and I'd have. I'd have it on the showcase in the back, and then customers would want to, like, look in and, like, want to buy something. And I was like, you know, this is my racetrack. Like, you know, screw off. Like, I don't. I don't need that. But, you know, this is my racetrack. I don't care. You want to buy something. So they were super supportive and knew that this. This racing thing was super important to me. And dad worked, you know, 247 to, you know, afford the tires, basically when I started quarter midget racing and mom drove. Drove me around, drove me around the country, but it was perfect timing from that stance from, like, basically, you know, mom and dad really did. Did a good job of, you know, kind of when I was born, because I remember when I was super young, it was always, you know, going to fast food places at 1am the dirt racing way. Yeah. You know, 1am because they had, you know, it was just those two in the store. You know, it was just kind of like if they can sort coins and jewelry and Gold and silver. They know they actually will, you know, do well like you know, when customers are in there, they can't actually do what makes the, the money for the store, you know, and they had to, you know, they had to really scrap for it before I was born and you know, was, was nervous about everything. And then the economy started to do something that it did well, that gold and silver were doing well and was able to, you know, go from eating fast food every night and figuring out how we're going to, you know, go to school because we were up till 3am you know, doing my homework and stuff to you know, being able just afford tires and then afford race cars. And you know, basically I think my dad only went to like two to you know, two to five quarter midget races maybe a year just because he could only ever afford to do that. So it was always a big deal when dad came to race. So you know, if they weren't so dedicated to that, you know, it would have been really easy to, you know, I think it was the only reason my dad worked so hard was to afford the tires or Ford racing and you know, not everybody's parents would ever even consider, I don't know if I would, you know, could do that, you know, to, you know, whatever is next for me. Everyone deserves to be connected.
- [13:41]
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- [13:47]
Carson Hocevar
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- [13:59]
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- [14:08]
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- [14:41]
Kenny Wallace
It's really interesting, you know, I know of you. I don't know everything about you. And that's why on any conversation we like to do, you know, a little backstory. Something I found that really interested me and I want you to straighten me out on it. Your dad, Scott, he helped the great, the late great Brian Claussen, one of the Greatest dirt racers of all time. We lost Brian Claussen at Belleville, Kansas. Tell me about this. Did Brian mentor you?
- [15:14]
Carson Hocevar
A little bit.
- [15:15]
Kenny Wallace
What was your dad's relationship with Brian Claussen?
- [15:18]
Carson Hocevar
So. So my dad never really had. My dad never really had a real, like a relationship. Like, my dad always laughed that he, you know, it's my favorite line. I say it every time I bring him up. You know, he always tells everybody because they always ask you, were you in racing? He's like, no, no. I was built for comfort, not speed. So. But, you know, Brian was always around the, you know, the quarter midget track, obviously with USAC and Tim. So I was racing USEC quarter midgets and they had their driven development program. And my first ever time I went dirt racing or dirt testing was with a micro sprint with Tim and Brian. We went to US 24 and went tested it. I had no, I had no understanding of you had to flick the car. I just thought you naturally get loose
- [16:01]
Kenny Wallace
and we call it shaken shaking.
- [16:04]
Carson Hocevar
Yeah, I had no idea. So I'm just going in there like as straight as possible and just like, why am I not. Like, I was just like, man, like, I don't know why everybody says this is so hard.
- [16:16]
Kenny Wallace
How do I get sideways? How do I get sideways?
- [16:19]
Carson Hocevar
Yeah, like, I got a wing and I got a micro. Like, I'm just running it wide open and like, run. Running it as straight as I could get it. So. So yeah, so my, my dad developed a relationship with like, Tim and Brian just because they would watch me. And when it was time to race, you know, Tim reminds me all the time I made the right call, but it was, you know, when it was time to, like, you know, I think it was 11 or 12. And I wanted to look at something different than quarter midgets, you know. My dad had a relationship with Johnny Benson through sponsoring a car at Kalamazoo Speedway just to learn the sport that happened to be built by Johnny. So my dad was kind of to Johnny Benson. I was just like, hey, I think my kid's pretty good at this, or we don't know if he's any good. Can you help us out? So, you know, it was one of those things of like, I had. I could either go the dirt route with Tim and Brian and they were like, okay, we're going to run micro sprints and then we're going to run you midgets. You know, because it had all these teams and then, you know, hopefully become, you know, world outlaws at the time. And I was like, well, that's great, but like, I'd love to go nascar. So you know, Johnny's like, ah, do both. And you know, Tim was like, no, no, you gotta, you know, we're doing all this, you know, we're getting money for you, we're doing like you gotta be locked in on, on one here. And I was like, well, I think it's easier to go the pavement route, so I'll, I'll just go raise pavement late miles with Johnny and everything. You know, Tim reminds me this day that, you know, I made the right call. But, you know, the next in line there was, was Zeb Wise. So that's where his progression with them came in. Like it was, you know, I kind of always looked at that, thought it was cool to kind of follow that because I raced with Zeb in quarter midgets. And so when I didn't take that deal per se, you know, then he was right next in line and did really well in the midgets and everything. But that's where our relationship came. But I, you know, it's funny you mentioned about, you know, qualify the poll Indy 500 and then go race sprint car, go put on the fence. You know, Brian was my idol, you know, because he would go run the Indy 500 and then go win wingless sprint cars. Like that was my double that I thought was Kalamazoo.
- [18:26]
Kenny Wallace
Yeah, yeah, yeah. He, he, Brian Clawson, gotta love that guy. His mother in law was crazy. So Kim, and she was a lot like me and Brian and myself got along very well because he called her little Kenny. Of course he had his girlfriend. But yeah, you're right, Brian Claussen made the Indianapolis 500 and they were all waiting for him. He drives 50, 60 miles up the road and races, you know.
- [19:00]
Carson Hocevar
Yeah.
- [19:01]
Kenny Wallace
Kokomo Coco. Thank you.
- [19:03]
Carson Hocevar
Said.
- [19:03]
Kenny Wallace
I think I said Kalamazoo.
- [19:05]
Carson Hocevar
Yeah, yeah. No, you're good.
- [19:06]
Kenny Wallace
Yeah, Kokomo. So that's awesome. Thanks for bringing that up. I, I want to say this to you. You did make a great decision because I grew up in St. Louis and I'm seven years younger than brother Rusty. I'm four years younger than brother Mike. And you know, I, I grew up a crew member, fabricator, mechanic, and then I started racing much later in life. I started at 22, so I immediately went to asphalt. And I love my brother Mike with everything I have, but Mike roughed me up a little bit. Why are you going running asa? And I looked at Mike and I said, Mike, you'll still be running dirt for $1,000 to win. And by me going asphalt, I'll be in the Daytona 500, and I'll be damned if it didn't come true. So, you know, it's sad to say we have a lot of fun running dirt, but everybody wants to be nascar. Jonathan Davenport, Christopher Bell, Kyle Larson, Kenny schrader, Tony Stewart, A.J. foyt, Mariel Andretti. I mean, we love dirt, but it just cannot get to where asphalt is so dirty and the sponsors won't sponsor it. But. But we do love it, don't we?
- [20:28]
Carson Hocevar
Yeah, I mean, it's just. It's. You know, we laugh about it. Like, especially if you're a wingless guy, you're doing it for just the passion of it, you know, you're not doing it for the money. So, you know, all of us, we just. We just all love it, and then we're trying to give it to the people that pay for it to the. How much we love it. Right. Like, I mean, a lot of times, the dirt sponsors aren't doing it for anything other than just. They want to. They want to be a part of it. They want. You know, they're doing it just because of our passion or they love it just as much as us, you know?
- [20:56]
Kenny Wallace
Yeah. One more thing, and then we're going to go on. I was playing blackjack with Kyle Larson at the Dover, Delaware, the hotel casino, and myself and Kyle, about five years ago, we were talking about this very subject, and I looked at him, and I said, kyle, focus on nascar. Your friends and fans, they love you in dirt racing. They'll be waiting for you. And, hell, he's doing it both.
- [21:24]
Carson Hocevar
Yeah.
- [21:26]
Kenny Wallace
So, yeah. Okay, here we go, everybody. This is where we get into it. All right? Everybody has been saying, you are the next Dale Earnhardt Senior, and I don't agree with that. I don't think you are the next Dale Earnhardt Senior. And here's why. Tell me. I'm gonna. I'm gonna say this quote, and you tell me who said it. If you no longer go for a gap that exists, you are no longer a race driver.
- [22:00]
Carson Hocevar
Aaron Senna.
- [22:02]
Kenny Wallace
You look like Ayrton Senna. You are Ayrton Senna. They just forgot Ayrton. I've watched all his documentaries. He went for gaps, and they roughed him up, mercifully. I've seen an interview where Jackie Stewart, you know, he became like, I'm no Jackie Stewart, but, you know, like. Like a Kevin Harvick or a Dale Jr. Or a Benny Parson or a Neil Bonnet. We race. We Love the sport. Well, Jackie Stewart was a great race car driver, but while he's interviewing Ayrton's son, he's roughing him up. You know, you're. You're winning races, but you're running into everybody. And of course, Ayrton humiliates Jackie during the interview. I'm surprised you talk like that. What do you know about Ayrton Senna?
- [22:52]
Carson Hocevar
Yeah, I mean, I've watched. I mean, I'm just a fan of everybody. Like, I love the. I love the old school F1 stuff. Like, you know, I've watched a lot of the Aon Senna documentaries, like, documentary Senna. And, you know, I was a big James Hunt fan and a fan of when Rush came out. Like, you know, I just, I love, you know, those, those stories and, and racing and everything. So. Yeah, I don't know. I mean, for, for me, like, I, you know, it's always, you know, I get texts all the time of like, oh, Richard Petty said this. Or, you know, it's not even like, race fans. It's like, you know, oh, you know, Kyle Petty said this, Dale Jr. Said this. Or, you know, they're making all these comparisons. And, you know, number one, I like, you know, I take it as, like, the biggest compliment ever. I mean, how can you not? But for me, like, I, you know, I'm not, I'm not out there driving and going, all right, who am I going to be today to sell some T shirts? You know, you know, who am I? Whose lines can I steal today? Whose moves can I steal? Like, I, I don't know, like, I'm just doing what I want to do, and, you know, I'm just racing for my guys. And, you know, I think, you know, our cars are getting really, really fast, you know, and I have, you know, I feel like I have the responsibility of the 200 people in that building to, you know, make go as fast as possible. Like, I think as a leader, you, you, you, you take charge, but you also take the beatings, right? Like, you're, you're willing to, you know, fight for them and then willing to, you know, get backlash or get it back or whatever. So, you know, I, I don't know. I'm just, I'm just racing. I'm just driving. You know, I'm just, I'm just me. Like, I'm just in doing the best possible thing I could do. I'm, you know, I'm not out there. You know, I said minute ago, like, you know, thinking of, all right, how am I gonna you know, if this is a documentary, what would I say right now? Or what move would work? You know, what moves gonna be in my 30 for 30, you know, I'm not thinking that.
- [25:00]
Kenny Wallace
Let's look at these names for a minute sometimes, you know. Well, I'm very off centered and we all know that, but the name Earnhardt is German. Dale Earnhardt Jr. Went to Germany, you know, to the, you know, he went through his family history. He, he's German. Senna, I guess. Italy.
- [25:22]
Carson Hocevar
What is Jose Slovenian? Oh, yeah, it's Slovenian. I don't know a lot about it other than just. I, My grandma told me one time it was Slovenia, so that's all I know about it. Like, I didn't, I haven't gone to anywhere. And, and really I, I feel like I've been told at a time or two, but I was probably watching race cars when I was a kid, you know, I was, you know, as I was getting told, I'm trying to watch behind them, you know, look through them to look to the TV, you know, all the family gatherings or whatever. But, yeah, Slovenia.
- [25:54]
Kenny Wallace
Okay, let's start this year. You, you said something that I really liked. You said, okay, in the last couple years, we don't even make it to the end of the race. You said the first two races of the year. This year, 20, 26, you've been leading or running top three, coming for a chance to win the first two races of the year. So right now you're, you know, we are two races in the year, but you are fourth in NASCAR points. You got six stage points at Atlanta, so that means you're digging. You, you finished 18th at Daytona, but you were winning. Yeah, you know you were winning.
- [26:40]
Carson Hocevar
Yeah. What's not bad for getting spun and still saving it somehow, you know, and get back to the line.
- [26:47]
Kenny Wallace
And you got four stage points. So the reason you're fourth in the points is you've got 10 stage points. I like this. Do you enjoy the stage points? Because. Makes you drive hard, you're gaining points and you're fourth in the points even though you're on 18th at Daytona.
- [27:07]
Carson Hocevar
I do. I mean, I think that's, you know, it, it closes it out, right, like, because it, it allows you to, if you know you have stage points, be aggressive and, you know, willing to risk the, the ending. Right. You know, for me, I would have been like 39th in points last year, you know, for all these races, like, you know, Charlotte or Michigan, you know, we're literally up front leading, get like 18 stage points in the bank, you know, blow a tire or blow a motor or, you know, whatever happens. And, you know, I would have only had. I would have walked out of that place with one point and been like, oh, I could have saved us a lot of heartache and not even shown up.
- [27:47]
Kenny Wallace
And really not even stage points really keep people in the game. Does they keep them.
- [27:53]
Carson Hocevar
They keep them in the game. Like, you know, like, if we're. It keeps it tight. It keeps the field tight. You know, like if, you know, if a guy's a little inconsistent but he's hauling ass, it's, you know, it. It actually evens out to the guy that, you know, didn't run great all day, but got a really good finish. And all of a sudden now the point points are really tight at the end, you know, when you look at the scorecard. So I think it's. I think it just. I think it just adds so much more intensity to everything.
- [28:20]
Kenny Wallace
So we started right there with a little bit of numbers, and we got a lot to talk about, everybody. So hang in there with me some. I told, you know, I've been promoting the last two days. I'm gonna. You know, everybody's talking about Carson Ozovar. Well, I'm going to talk to him, and somebody says, asking the hard questions, I'm like, so simmer down. Okay? We're going to celebrate you right now. You'll know what that means in a minute. Johnny Benson, I guess his sister or relative, she shows these young pictures of you working on Johnny Benson's car. I want to say that because when I rattle off these stats, man, they're really good. You are a winner. So Carson Hosavar, 2020 Winchester 400 winner. That's hard, man. That's a badass track. You got to go fast, but you got to do it for 400 laps. And you did. 2020 Red Bud 400 winner. These are long races, so you got what it takes to run 400 laps and win. Now, this is where the Benson's come in. 20, 20, 20, 21, 20, 25, money in the bank. 150 winner. That's at Berlin.
- [29:44]
Carson Hocevar
Oh, yeah.
- [29:44]
Kenny Wallace
That's your wheelhouse, ain't it, buddy?
- [29:46]
Carson Hocevar
Yeah, it's. It's. I know that place like the back of my hand. So it's. Yeah, you just like riding a bike to that place. It took me a while to figure it out, but know Johnny was. That was his number one deal when we started running. He's like, if you can. If you can figure out Berlin you'll figure out any place in the country.
- [30:04]
Kenny Wallace
2024 NASCAR Cup Rookie of the year. Now listen, when I go deep, 90 quarter midget wins. You've been winning your whole life. Now the next one is not tongue and cheek. You know, everybody acts like it's funny, but, you know, the two and a quarter hour of LA mullets, you know, in Bradenton at Cletus McFarland's track.
- [30:32]
Carson Hocevar
Haha.
- [30:32]
Kenny Wallace
Right. However, if things. Paying a lot of money to win. But when I talk to you, you know, some 90, 100 quarter wins, 400, you know, the winch. Listen, anybody that races knows how hard it is to, to, to win Winchester. And you, you put it all together, you know, what do you think when I give you those stats?
- [31:00]
Carson Hocevar
Yeah, I mean, it, it just, it reminds you like when I, when I was going to Winchester 400 the first time. I remember watching it and you know, it had live pit stops and everything. You know, I remember I was there when I think Eric Jones won it. And I was watching it, knowing how difficult. But you, you get the T shirt going home, you know, first time going to. And you just see all the names from 10 years ago, then, you know, of all these really, really good guys or legends of it. So, you know, it was cool when I won it and, you know, it was really fun. And you know, the Van Dorens and TK racing, the guy I was racing for and you know, Team Tom Kmac, he. They'd been trying it for 20 years with different drivers. You know, Johnny Van Doren, you know, all these guys. And we, we led, you know, first race with them, basically led 380 of 400. Just killed them. And it was really, really big for them. But for me, I didn't know how big it really was until the next year when I went and my, you know, my mom bought the T shirt and I didn't understand. I was like, we already have witches for teachers T shirts. Like. And she's like, yeah, but like on the back they have all the winners and you know, she wanted it to. Where it had my name on it. And you know, when you see all the names on the list, you realize, you know, it's like, okay, like now you're in, you know, the company of, you know, the, the best guys that had ever even thought about running that race.
- [32:31]
Kenny Wallace
So it's a little stuff, ain't it?
- [32:33]
Carson Hocevar
Yeah, it's that. It's that stuff to realize, you know, all these cup guys or these legends or short track aces or just heroes. You know, had won this race, had done the same thing that we were doing just, you know, years earlier,
- [32:50]
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- [33:52]
Kenny Wallace
I am strategizing, everybody. I'm letting you know that he's a winner. He goes 400 laps where he came from. He's a person. He's only 23 years old. So let's get to some of the fun stuff. Mike Joy, he's trying. You know, we had the Intimidator, you know, Dale Earnhardt. We had Rubberhead, Dale Senior, nicknamed Rusty. That because Rusty flipped end over end and Rusty's head was in there doing this. So Mike Joy is trying to get your nickname Hurricane, Host of our to stick. I'm watching Dirty Mo Media door bumper clear Monday morning. I'm seeing the highlights. You know, they put these little. They call them shorts. Yeah, And I laughed. I. I kind of thought it was a. I thought it was a compliment. Tommy Baldwin said, nobody will fight Carson Hosovar because he stands 6 foot 4. Then Ryan Blaney is so damn funny, he says, well, you need a trampoline to jump up and hit him. So here's the point. And then we're going to get into Cal Petty and Dale Earnhardt Jr. But you got all these people, and you've kind of already talked about it.
- [35:17]
Carson Hocevar
They're.
- [35:18]
Kenny Wallace
They're all just talking about you. All of nascar. They're just. They're talking about you. I mean, Richard Petty and Dale Linman, they're all just talking about you. Just zone in on that. You've already said you're you. You don't go out there. And, I mean, you got to be mentally strong. We know that. What does it feel like to have everybody Talking about how fast you are. But he's, he's got a, he's a diamond in the rough. He's just gotta polish up. What the hell does that feel like?
- [35:55]
Carson Hocevar
It's pretty, it's pretty surreal, honestly. Like, I mean, it's just, yeah, it's just, it's just reassuring that like we're fast enough or doing all the right things or, you know, even doing the wrong things. But we're doing it as, you know, whether you make a good decision or bad decision. If you make a decision up front, you know, they'll talk about you. Right. And, you know, I take it as a massive compliment and you know, I think, I think my race team and my guys take it as a big compliment too, because I feel like they're always, I feel like it's always, you know, Spires still has, and Junior mentioned this, that Spire still has the reputation of. It's the, you know, they still haven't broke out of. It's the little team that was in the shop just trying to, you know, buy tires. You know, it's obviously such a different race team than it was and everything. And you know, it's, you know, they, I think they all take it as compliments. You know, they're just barely trying to get to the racetrack for you.
- [36:54]
Kenny Wallace
You have, you have put Spire on the map. I mean, I say that, you know, I saw this team coming. Jeff Dickerson reached out to me and couple years ago, Herm, thanks for talking good about us. I'm like, well, damn, man, what, what you're doing. Yeah, you put them on the map. There's no doubt.
- [37:12]
Carson Hocevar
Yeah, it's, it's been, it's been fun and, and you know, we want to, to get rolling here. You know, it's, I feel like everybody, I think for, for us, you know, there's always just the, you know, I, I don't, I don't think everybody wants to give us credit yet for like how fast we are because I think we are really, really fast. And you know, it's always like, you know, you know, oh, he's really fast, but there's always, but, you know, oh, he's really fast this week. But, you know, or, yeah, Spire looked pretty good but, you know, host varied into a lot of people to be able to get there, you know, or whatever. Right. So I think we're, we're just, you know, rolling as us as going as fast as possible. Last year, you know, my rookie year was like, let's just finish all the races and build this thing piece by piece. Last year it was, let's make our cars as physically fast as possible. I'm going to go faster than I can handle because, you know, at some point when you figure out what you can't handle, you'll figure out how to handle it. And, you know, I think that's where we're at, hopefully in this, this year is, you know, we have all our reliability issues fixed, and I have all my, you know, feelings of, I could run third place today, but I'm, you know, on the razor edge. And then I step over it, it's like, okay, well, how do we go that fast, but make it more comfortable or how do I get more comfortable with it? So it's, you know, it's all calculated. You know, it's. There's, you know, I said it on series 6M is, you know, you might go out there, you know, to skeet shoot, and you might look like dart with no fetters. But you're. I think everybody holding the gun is going to be like, well, the plan is to shoot the skeet. I just might have accidentally shot over here, you know, here. But, you know, I didn't plan on just, you know, oh, let's see if I could get 17ft away from the ski. The plan is to. To hit the damn ski, you know, so you just might have different philosophies or you might not be capable of doing it yet, but you're. You're trying to figure that out.
- [39:15]
Kenny Wallace
I wished I had the talent you had. You're extremely fast. I. I admire your talent. I want to zone in on. On one race, and then we'll go back to other things. On May 30, 2023, I was there. I was in St. Louis at the Worldwide Technology Raceway. That's my home track. Those are my people over there. Corey Lajoy filled in for Chase Elliott. This is his break. And so he. He's over there in the 9 car because chase Elliott's got the broken leg, I guess, from the ski accent, something like that. So you fill in for Corey Lajoy in the Spire car, and surprisingly, you become the show. You're passing everybody. You're going straight to the front and network tv and everybody's on their feet and they're like, oh, my God, what the hell's going on here? My opinion is you arrived that day on the national scene. Do you feel that that day is what catapulted you to be a NASCAR cup driver?
- [40:29]
Carson Hocevar
Yeah, you know, I was doing sim, so. So really, how that Went was. I was doing sim work for. For track house at the time. So I had year and a half worth of cup sim experience at that point. And, you know, I. I was just always sitting there like, you know, I'm okay. I'm faster than Ross, and I'm faster than Daniel at times. And I'm like, man, I would just. I would just love to see if that's real, you know? Like, I'm like, man, I would love to see if I.
- [40:57]
Kenny Wallace
On the sim, you were fast.
- [40:59]
Carson Hocevar
Yeah, There'd be days where I'd be faster than them. Right.
- [41:01]
Kenny Wallace
Or.
- [41:02]
Carson Hocevar
Or more, you know? You know, and I was like, I don't know if I'm video gaming it. I don't know if this is real. You know, they. They might have their calculations. They might be even going in there, you know, drinking a coffee and not really, you know, caring how fast they are. You know me, I'm like, I'm going to go as fast as possible in the sim. Maybe they'll hire me, you know, obviously. And so I just remember, like, a few weeks prior, I started running the bush car. I started winning truck races. I'm just like, man, like, everything's going good, but I don't see a path to cup. And I was like, man, I just do the sim work. I was just like, man, if I just get in there one time, I think I'd be like, I would at least know, right? Like, I have this idea that I was going to be really, really fast in a cup car. I was like, man, I think I know it. I think I understand it. Like, when I got in the bush car, I didn't do any sim, and it felt super foreign. Like, I felt very confused and lost. And we're still running, like, fifth top five. No problem.
- [41:56]
Kenny Wallace
Those sims amaze me. It's real, ain't it?
- [41:59]
Carson Hocevar
Yeah. So. And they have all the data. So for a year and a half, they're teaching me all their tricks, basically. Like, all the throttle, all the steering, everything. Like, they're basically teaching me to be a CUP driver. Match everything.
- [42:10]
Kenny Wallace
Like they want.
- [42:11]
Carson Hocevar
They want me to match their data. They want me to match it because that means the sims is accurate as possible. So anyway, so, you know, I get the call to run St. Louis and everything, and I get in practice and. And we do it. We qualify. And I was. I looked at Ryan Sparks, who's a crew chief, and I was just like, man, this thing is not right. And he's like, what are you talking about? I was like, you know, I was like, well, you need to, you know, you need to do all these things to the car. I don't want to say exactly what they. They are, but I was like, you need to do all this stuff. And he's like, well, the data says. Says this and this says that. And I was like, well, I've drove winning cars and I've drove not winning cars, and I know what the winning cars feel like.
- [42:51]
Kenny Wallace
And.
- [42:52]
Carson Hocevar
And, you know, there were a few times where I, you know, track house would ask me what they think. And I was like, well, if that's real, I think you're going to win the race. And I think it was like, auto club, they fished second and Nashville, they won. And Chicago, I ran SVG's car. And I was like, he's going to win the race. I think he's the best car.
- [43:08]
Kenny Wallace
Wow.
- [43:08]
Carson Hocevar
And so he won the race. And I was like, man, I think you need to do this and change this. And he's like, well, the data doesn't say. And I was like, well, yeah, but you can't drive it. And there's certain tricks to that I think would work. And I was like, I'll be able to drive it way more. I was like, you know, I'll be way better in dirty air. I'll do all this stuff. I'll be way faster. And, you know, you know, I've never drove a cup car and. And, you know, they kind of was, you know, Sparks is just kind of like, well, shoot, he's drove track house, cup cars that have won and everything, so like, hell, maybe he knows more than us, you know, on what. What we need. Right? Like, you know, Spire's not really getting any info of anything. And so I had them change it, and they changed it, and we got in the race and I was kind of, you know, taking my time a little bit and started passing 1, 2, 3. And, you know, there was one restart where I passed like, six. And all of a sudden I got. The second that happened, it was like, okay, you know, I'm. I have the biggest confidence ever, and so I'm gonna just go haul ass. I started passing them all. We started rolling really good, and, you know, we broke a brake pedal and everything. And but what really kind of clicked in my head that we were going to be really good that day was before the race, I had a. I did a cup driver, ran a truck race, and me and him got into it the very next week, and about, you know, like, hand gestures out the car and everything. And. And, you Know, funny enough, then he goes in the cup race, he has an argument on pit road because of the same deal. So he calls me, you know, and then the very next week, I'm driving a cup car, so he calls me to his bus and he's like, hey, man, like, you know, I, I, I just want to apologize for how I acted or, you know, everything because, you know, I've kind of became hypocrite. And it came back around and everything. And now you're driving a cup car, so I just want to give you some advice. And, you know, then he says, you know, he gives me the advice of what to do when I'm a lap car. And I was like, that pissed you off? I was like, bro, what like is this? I was like, okay, so my expectations going in this race is spires nuts. I'm gonna wreck this thing or I'm gonna be the slowest guy there. Okay, well, like, I'm just gonna go drive the hell out of this thing. And if, you know, the only worries, worried and scared thing I had of that race, I was more nervous driving a bush car than I was the cup car because the bush. I felt like I had expectations. I needed to win, I needed to get, get myself. I was like, this cup car, I was like, I am not going to be nervous, I'm not going to be anxious. I'm going to enjoy this. I might never get this before. And I just want to be as present as possible. Like, I do not want to sit and say my career, you know, this was my one opportunity and I was too nervous and I messed it up. I was just like, I'm just going to drive the hell out of it. And if something good comes of it, great. And if nothing came of it, it wasn't the opportunity. And so I just drove it as hard as physically possible. And we drove to 14th. And that guy that told me that I was going to be a lap down and where to move and how to get out of the way, he was like, right in front of me right when it broke. I was like, oh, I wanted to pass him so bad. I wanted to drive around him. But no, it was, I mean, that, I mean, Sparks says the story all the time. Like, you know, Jeff Dickerson was like, man, we're a real race team. And this and that. During, like texting Sparks the whole time, and text just kept saying, sending the pen emoji the whole race. During the race under green, he's just sending the Sign him, sign him, sign him.
- [46:43]
Kenny Wallace
This is good. Stuff.
- [46:45]
Carson Hocevar
So yeah, I mean that, that was, that was the difference maker. And then we ran good enough that then when the 42 car opened later in the year, I got in that car and that's how I got to working with Luke Lambert. And we ran fifth at Bristol, my third ever cup race. We qualified top 15 for the Southern 500. Ran top 15 all day, my second cup start. So, you know, when I got in a Cup car, there was no struggle. You know, it was, there was just the confidence, you know, was just, just there right away to, to be really fast, basically.
- [47:22]
Kenny Wallace
So Jeff Dickerson's going to watch this or he's going to hear about this part. You know, the joke always is Rick Hendrick is letting Carson, host of our learn at Spire and then you are going to be, you know, the main cup driver over at Hendrick. What's your thoughts on that?
- [47:48]
Carson Hocevar
I mean there's, I mean I signed a very long term paper at Spire.
- [47:51]
Kenny Wallace
Like that's what I needed to know.
- [47:53]
Carson Hocevar
Yay. Yeah, no, I am, I am there for the next decade. You know, I, I asked in the contract negotiation.
- [48:01]
Kenny Wallace
Hold on. You heard it there, everybody. Decade.
- [48:04]
Carson Hocevar
I, I, I think I asked her in the, the negotiations basically if I could, you know, if it could just not even say year and just be like, oh, if I have a pulse, I'll, I'll race for Jeff. You know, Dickerson. I mean they're growing, man. Like it's, it. They, they have, you know, with Dan Towers and Jeff Dickerson, I have two of the, I think the best owners. You know, Dan Towers is awesome and obviously really has a lot of things great going, great for other realms of racing. But he has so much trust in, in Jeff Dickerson to, to run the show and run the NASCAR program and run Spire exactly how he wants to do it and get the best people and the best cars and you know, just keep rolling. And you know, I, everybody's bought into his vision. There's no, there's nothing else. You know, everybody's there because of, of Dickerson and you know, he's, you know, I think every person that's worked there has came from other organizations and all of them say it's, it's the best working conditions, it's the best owner. Like, you know, I feel like at a Cup side you're always looking over your shoulder or looking ahead to the next deal. You know, if you run 22nd or 25th, he doesn't come in and ask why we ran 25th. He goes, you know, he'll Just go, what do you need? What do you need? You know, it's not like, damn, what happened? I got you all this stuff and you didn't get. He's just like, what more do we need? What's next?
- [49:33]
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Day or night? VRBoCare is here 247 to help make everybody part of your stay seamless. If anything comes up or you simply need a little guidance, support is ready whenever you reach out. From the moment you book to the moment you head home. We're here to help things run smoothly because a great trip starts with the right support. And, hey, a good playlist doesn't hurt either.
- [50:03]
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- [50:35]
Kenny Wallace
You know, I didn't have this on my list, and I've got three pages. What do you say to the dads that always say, well, my kids, great, but we don't have any money? I mean, you made it to where you're at. As far as I can tell, with no money, you didn't buy your ride.
- [50:57]
Carson Hocevar
Yeah, I mean. I mean, I had some money, you know, but we wouldn't have had any money left if. If I didn't make it. You know what I mean? Like, I mean, I was racing. I remember I was running, so I was running. So how I got going was we were racing trucks, and I had some sponsor, so my late model, I got sponsors because Johnny said he was gonna stop racing.
- [51:21]
Kenny Wallace
83. 83 truck races, five wins in the truck.
- [51:25]
Carson Hocevar
So Johnny Benson. So how I really got my late model deal was Johnny Benson, you know, he had his sponsors every time he came to Michigan and everything, and he's like, I'm all done racing, but I need you to sponsor Carson. So I got to run more late mall races than I probably should have. And then the truck deal, I had some. You know, we kind of just took that and, you know, did two races with Jordan Anderson, real small team, and did everything we could to do that. And, you know, Nice motorsports called and we went and raced for Nice, did six truck races, and they were cheaper than Jordan. Like, you know, way better race team, and they were cheaper somehow, you Know, I remember I walked into, you know, I had meetings with KBM and Thor sport and it was like, you know, you know, every kid, you know, every kid gets it right. I'm sure you got a lot of promise and talent, but expensive sport. And you know, we're gonna need to sponsor, you know, some cash and everything. We'll. We'll line you up. We'll. We'll get you going, man. And you know, I just. We just knocked on every opportunity. Every time a door closed, the next one opened. You know, with nice. I. With nice. They. They wanted me because they, Jordan Anderson was in niece's shop leasing space. I showed up every day, you know, working on it or just looking or watching video footage and asking questions and everything. I showed up there every day, every day for a month before Eldora and a month before Phoenix when I raced those two races. And so they kind of paid attention to me of like, who's this kid running around our shop and talking to all our employees and everything? And we out qualified a lot of their trucks at Phoenix. And so Cody Efaul called and said we're gonna figure it out. And I got phone so excited. But Covid hit the next year and when and I was not going to go full time because I didn't have any. I didn't have any more money. It was those six races that I had and they said I could run the whole year on what would have been six races worth of, you know, for them doing it. And then, you know, we, we made the playoffs that year, ran really good. And so they started covering a lot of the bill. You know, we showed up with the trucks blank or begging for the deal here, deal there. But by my second year, they sold a sponsor and I went from, you know, kind of like helping them out. You know, they really wanted me, but they're like, oh, we can't do it for free. We're not in a spot to. I was hired by my. Halfway through my second year, like bringing nothing to the truck team and they're paying me to race a truck.
- [54:06]
Kenny Wallace
People get so disappointed. You know, I, I talked to JD Jonathan Davenport, one of the great dirt super late model racers of all time. I talked to Ricky Thornton. You know, I try to get Ricky in with Junior Motorsports. I never responded back to Thornton, but I, I texted Junior. I said, junior, got to give this kid a shot. Bobby Pierce was quoted as saying, I. I talked to, you know, Richard Schiller. He said, I need 3.6 million. Here's a story where you Know you got a couple races and you got six races and boy, you. It's. It's sad to say, but they don't give you any time nowadays. You performed?
- [54:52]
Carson Hocevar
No. Well. So my second race with Nice was Dover. My first race was a road course and I was a mess. Like, I. I was decently quick, but I've never ran a road course. I'm like, I don't know. Oh, I just took any race that they had available and they'd put me in, you know, so. And I thought it was perfect looking back on it because there was no expectation. Like, I almost got to do everything. I got to used to pit road. I got used to the how big a truck race is. Got used to the people in an environment where they know I'm probably like, they're not judging me if they're going to hire me off my road course prowess. Right. They're judging me if they're going to hire me because of my oval. So we go to Dover. No practice. Again, Covid, completely zero practice. And with no practice, I didn't have a radio. Like, my radio did not work. So I was completely blind. The whole truck race, the quietest race I've ever. I've ever been. I had no radio, there were no fans, and I'm in this truck all by myself and.
- [55:50]
Kenny Wallace
Eerie sounds.
- [55:51]
Carson Hocevar
Eerie, yeah. I was like, this is so weird. And so I get going and I remember Johnny Sauder was in front of me and he's like, you know, especially at the time, he was like the man at Dover. And I drove around him on the top on like lap four. You know, it felt really good.
- [56:09]
Kenny Wallace
And you didn't know any better.
- [56:11]
Carson Hocevar
Didn't know any better and, you know, learned. But like, you know, I was feeling the air of the right rear and moving around and everything. Like, it was almost a really, really perfect race for me to do because it, you know, they. They really saw if I could sink or swim, right? There was nobody spoon feeding me any information. I was finding it out on the fly and I had to get creative. And they're like, you know, if he. If he had a radio, it probably would have been really good. You know, they. They had time, a jet ski. He was their hired gun and everything. And you know, he was per se the A team. And I had the general manager, Cody IFA on. On the truck as a crew chief. So it was even better because the guy deciding if who gets hired or who's driving the trucks was get front row seat to it, right? Like he's he's in the battle with me. And, you know, we outran Ty all day and ran faster than him, and, you know, they ended up, you know, kind of moving on from. From him later, you know, later in the deal. But, you know, it. You know, I think we ran 10th. I did a green flag stop by myself. I just guessed when we were supposed to pit, I was within one, and they were like, I can't believe you were within one lap of when we wanted you to pit. You were a lap late. And I was like, they're like, how'd you know when to pit? I was like, I don't know. I just saw. I saw people pit, and I was just like, here I come. You know, I knew I had to pit at some point, and, you know, we fished, like, 11th or something. But they were, you know, that. That race was kind of the. Oh, I think, like, you know, there's something. Something here, you know, like, for them, you know, that they would. You know, they got first impressions are really everything in racing, right? And especially, too. They have to. You know, it has to be worth the risk. Like, nobody's getting rich in truck racing. You're losing your ass even if you win everything.
- [58:05]
Kenny Wallace
You know, you even have series, you're losing.
- [58:09]
Carson Hocevar
You know, I mean, Jeff even talked about. He's like, man, we're losing, like, 2 million bucks every time we run a truck. So he's like, oh, we. You know, if we just go run sprint cars or go run a late model instead of running four trucks, you take two of the truck budgets and go build a sprint car and a late model. You know, you're not going to lose 2 million bucks. You're just going to, you know, maybe sell enough t shirts to break even. And, you know, that's money in racing. It's just like, how do you not lose it? And for the truck team, they just. They were at a point where they wanted to perform, and Al Nice was at a point where, you know, he wanted to watch his trucks haul assembly, and it was the right time for me that he was willing to lose money to see performance, you know, and, you know, that's. That's where you're at in races. Like, you just got to be in the right spot that your owner is willing to lose money on you.
- [58:57]
Kenny Wallace
That Ty Majeski deal. You bring up his name, that deal. I don't understand it. Ty Majeski wins every race he's in, and he's not a cup driver. I mean, he wins everything. I won't Ask you to comment on that. That's just my opinion.
- [59:13]
Carson Hocevar
He's really good.
- [59:14]
Kenny Wallace
Yeah.
- [59:14]
Carson Hocevar
Especially at Snowball Derby, he's. That thing's unbelievable.
- [59:18]
Kenny Wallace
I mean, it's just. It blows me away. I just. I just don't understand it. But it is what it is. While you bring that. This up on the fly, this is something I noticed. The Kyle Busch truck race win at Atlanta. Obviously, you know, you gave the interview after the race, but I looked at that truck and I said, okay, there's three entities here. You've got this truck owned by Spire. That's Spire. Then you got it sponsored by Rick Hendrick, and it's being driven by Richard Childress. What? Fill me in on that. What the hell was that all about?
- [60:02]
Carson Hocevar
Well, Kyle. Well. Well, I think it's more the relationship with. With Jeff, right? It's all. It all goes back to Dickerson, right?
- [60:10]
Kenny Wallace
He loves it.
- [60:11]
Carson Hocevar
Everybody, like, but Rick Hendrick loves Jeff Dickerson and Kyle. And, you know, Jeff go way back. You know, between. You know, I was watch. I love watching 2000s, you know, bush races, basically, and enjoy it. And I, you know, just watching Kyle run auto club yesterday, last night, you know, late at night, and I. And all of a sudden they do a report, and they. They load up Kyle's radio, and sure enough, it's Jeff Dickerson on the radio. And he goes, you know, Kyle's getting into something with nascar and he got in, you know, or has a bad pit stop. And Jeff's just like, oh, no, it's Bristol. It's Bristol. Jeff, you know, they were struggling. They didn't have good pit stops, everything. And Jeff's just like, you know. You know, Kyle's, you know, complaining about the pit crew, and Jeff's just like, hey, man, it's all good. You know, we drove for the back. And Kyle's like, well, yeah, but they put this damn tapered spacer in. It's got no power. You can't pass. Last sh.
- [61:10]
Kenny Wallace
In the past.
- [61:11]
Carson Hocevar
This thing sucks. And Jeff just goes, yeah, man. Well, they pay me to be positive. And I was just like, that's Jeff. You know, like, that's. That's him. So, yeah, I mean, people just like, you know, everybody just loves racing. They got to put something on the truck. And, you know, obviously Hendrick cars is on, you know, been on Spire trucks a lot. And, you know, Jeff. Jeff and Kyle have a great relationship. Kyle could for sure win a truck race. I wish I had a motor that I could drive around him. I was overheating the whole Time. And it killed all the timing and everything, but it was good to go. One, two. For. For that for our team.
- [61:45]
Kenny Wallace
Were you being a smart ass after the truck race? You're like, oh, they were. Or were you? So your interview, I loved it. You're like, yeah, I was really happy to see Kyle Busch when I'm growing up as a kid. See, I, I, I'm a gangster. Okay, I come across nice, but I'm a gangster. And I'm like, he's being a smart ass because the team wanted him to help Kyle win. Were you being a smart ass?
- [62:12]
Carson Hocevar
I mean, I was. I mean, you were not a tired. I, I had a little bit of my Jeff sarcasm.
- [62:21]
Kenny Wallace
I want to bet. I told Schrader. Schrader's like, oh, I'm like, Kenny, so,
- [62:26]
Carson Hocevar
so, so, so my. So, So I asked my team, I was like, you know, yesterday I was talking to the truck team. I was like, hey, man, like, did you ever figure out, like, was there debris? Was there something? Because it. They kept telling me like, hey, man, like, no worries. It doesn't start killing the timing. It's not. Because I was like, this thing's really hot. And they're like, oh, it only starts killing the timing. At 245 water temp. I was like, cool, it's 250 right now. So we start losing power, losing everything. And, you know, every time I go back and look at that chart, every time, like, I'm barely even keep it up. Like, Kyle's just driving away from me, and I'm trying to keep up, but they just had too much tape on it for how aggressive a pusher I am. And even when I kind of would get clean air, it wouldn't cool off. So I was like, realistically, unless he gives it to me, I'm not going to win the race. And I, I risk, you know, I risk, you know, pulling out, not having any momentum, and then he. And then both of us are vulnerable. So I was just like, you know, I, I think I said it like, if I'm not gonna have a shot, I'm gonna make sure the team has a shot. And, you know, I, I'm. But I was a junior fan. I didn't love watching cowboys win truck races, but I was like, well, with Jeff Dickerson owns. It ain't that bad. It ain't that bad.
- [63:50]
Kenny Wallace
Listen, man, you've been wonderful. I want to thank you so much. But I, I do want to end like this. And for everybody that wanted me to ask him the hard questions, this is why Kenny conversations gets all the superstars throughout all sports is because I celebrate people. I don't, I don't down people. You're looking at a 23 year old young kid and, and I'll leave you like this. Dale Earnhardt Jr says, you remind me my dad, Dale Senior. And then Cal Petty comes along and Cal is really good and he has seen it all. Cal Petty says you have the attitude of Earnhardt, the brashness of Tim Richmond and the desire to win like K. Busch. And I'm not going to ask you how that feels because we've already went over this. You are there, my friend, and they are talking about you. And you remind me of Dale Earnhardt, you remind me of Ayrton Senna, you remind me of Tim Richmond. You remind me of Kyle Busch. So have fun.
- [65:00]
Carson Hocevar
I appreciate it. Thanks. Thanks, Kenny. No, I'm enjoying it. I, I take it as a, I take it as a compliment that a lot of fans or when I see the comments of like, damn, he hasn't won yet. I'm like, you know how hard it is to win these races or you know, you know how, you know how dumb, you know how difficult it's been for Spire to go from, you know, not even in contention for top 20s to like being like, damn, Spire hasn't won a race yet with him. You know, I think it's just, I think we're all taking it in stride and rolling with it. Yeah.
- [65:31]
Kenny Wallace
Well, congratulations. I think we said it all and I appreciate you very much. And as I say at the end of these, always remember everybody, you can see Carson hos pretty little face on the Kenny Wallace YouTube show. And as you drive down the road, if you want to listen to Carson, he's over there on Dirty Mo Media podcast. Until the next Kenny conversation. Hey, is there anything else you want to say?
- [66:01]
Carson Hocevar
Well, I don't know. Should there be?
- [66:03]
Kenny Wallace
I don't know. I think we're done.
- [66:05]
Carson Hocevar
Perfect.
- [66:07]
Kenny Wallace
Goodbye everybody.
- [66:15]
Carson Hocevar
Check out Dirty Mo Media on Twitter, Facebook, Tick Tock and Instagram.
- [66:21]
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