← Herm & Schrader
Herm & Schrader
The Rodney Childers Playbook: Winning in NASCAR and Life
01:03:09
Rodney Childers started as a successful driver but found his true calling on top of the pit box as a championship-winning crew chief. The journey wasn’t easy—tragedies in the sport played a pivotal role in steering him from the driver’s seat to leading some of NASCAR’s biggest teams. Rodney dives deep into his time working with Kevin Harvick, overcoming challenges like constant ownership changes, and navigating his way through multiple NASCAR organizations. Here’s a fun fact: Rodney and Dale Jr. went to high school together! Plus, he shares why family is everything—both at home and at the racetrack. Don’t miss this powerful conversation with a future NASCAR Hall of Famer!
Loading summary
Transcript123 lines
- [00:00]
A
Where'd you get those shoes? Easy. They're from dsw. Because DSW has the exact right shoes for whatever you're into right now. You know, like the sneakers that make office hours feel like happy hour, the boots that turn grocery aisles into runways, and all the styles that show off the many sides of you, from daydreamer to multitasker and everything in between. Because you do it all in really great shoes. Find a shoe for every you at your DSW store or dsw.com hello everyone.
- [00:33]
B
And welcome back to Kenny Conversation, brought to you by jegs, the leader in high performance aftermarket car parts. Remember to go to JEGS.com for everything you need to fix your hot rod up or your everyday vehicle. You are looking at one of the greatest crew chiefs of our era, Rodney Childers. Rodney, how are you doing?
- [01:00]
C
I'm doing good, man. How about you, man?
- [01:02]
B
I'm doing good. And the first thing I notice when I see you is we have a Chevrolet logo now.
- [01:11]
C
Yeah, that's nice to be back with Chevrolet. Win a lot of races with them, you know, with Kevin and to win a championship with them was, was really cool back in 2014 and be back with the Hendrick engine shop and all the guys over there. It's has been pretty special so far.
- [01:28]
B
Yeah, there is a, there's a lot to talk about and you know, let's, let's start right there. You kind of glossed over it. And Rodney, anytime we do a Kenny Conversation, it's a celebration of that person. And I always want to say that first and foremost, this is a celebration of you. You've done a lot. So let's, let's start right there. Rodney Childers, 2014 championship crew chief for Kevin Harvick. Now, the next, the next stats are pretty eye opening. And these are your NASCAR cup stats. 676 cup races, 40 cup wins, 34 cup polls. And I, I always think these are important. 178 top fives. But this is amazing too. 298 top tens. You know, when you look at seven, when you look at 676 cup races and basically 300 top tens, but half the time you're up there doing it. That, that, that's pretty big. When I say all that, and I say this to everybody when I tell you all that, what do you, what are you thinking about?
- [02:53]
C
I mean, honestly, just thinking about how many good people I've been around and in all these years, you know, to be able to work with such great people, you know, teammates, drivers, Owners, engine builders, all those things. You know, every bit of it matters and I've been really fortunate. You know, through every piece and part of it, it's been pretty special. And you know, definitely not a one man band by any means. It takes all of us to make it happen.
- [03:23]
B
Yeah. Let's talk about right now. We're gonna do like a movie. Let's talk about right now. Then we're gonna go back and then we're gonna come back. I think that's just the way to do it. So right now you are at Spire Motorsports and you're going to be the crew chief for Justin Haley, is that correct?
- [03:43]
C
Yeah, this is my first time working here at Spire. You know, everything's been really, really good so far for a, for a small team that has changed so much in, you know, a couple years. But really, if you look at how much they've changed in the last 12 months, um, you know, at the, at the end of Kevin's career, I ended up losing probably five guys off the four team that came to Spire and worked here last year and really kept up with those guys and, you know, everything. Every time I talked to one of those guys, they loved working here and they loved the atmosphere. So throughout the year I just kind of, you know, paid a lot of attention to what they were doing as a company and where they were going. And you know, of course when I got looking, you know, I had a few phone calls here and there and, and us really liked what they had to say and you know, where they were headed. The biggest thing is they had a plan. Not many people had a plan that I talked to and they had a plan and you know, it's been a lot of fun. You know, we've only been here since like the second week in November, but you're talking about a lot of change. If you would have saw the shop and the cars and all three months ago compared to where it is now, it's, it's pretty incredible.
- [05:03]
B
Spire Motorsports is interesting to me. I, I bragged on them last year. They reached out to me to, you know, thank me, but I was just honest. I just saw that they were coming. Like, you know, those, those executives there, they have a lot of history in racing. Is this third time right now? I mean, you're telling me that you see them going hard? I guess part of that was coming to get you. Looks to me like they're getting aggressive in NASCAR ownership right now.
- [05:38]
C
Yeah, for sure. Like when you stand, you know, a weekday morning out here in the shop, and you, we get ready to have our team meeting and you look around at the amount of talent that is in this building. It's absolutely insane. And, you know, there's a lot of places that you have A people and B people and C people and D people or whatever. And you look around right now and it's like all A plus people standing around in a circle. And, you know, normally when you get that many good people together, you can make good things happen.
- [06:11]
B
How many, you know, if we were to go from, say, you know, 1 to 100, let's say that would be the graph. 1 to 100. How many people are there from Stewart Haas Racing? How many people followed you over?
- [06:28]
C
I think there ended up being maybe 18 or 20 people total that came from Stewart Haas, and some of them, you know, came from the 4 car to the 7. But there's also a lot of designers, QC guys, fabricators, shop guys, all kinds of. All kinds of different people. So, you know, that's not something that was in my plan to begin with. Somebody asked me that yesterday if that was kind of, you know, how I sat down with Spire to begin with. It's like, I'll come if I can take 20 people with me. It was never that way. You know, I decided to come and then we kind of worked on it from there, but know they were trying to build and bring new people in. And like I said, A plus talent is hard to get right now. So, you know, we, we just worked on it over time and, man, we've got a great group of people here and, you know, it's exciting to look around and realize what you have.
- [07:31]
B
All right, we've established your stats. You are a great. You are a hall of fame, NASCAR cup crew chief. You've won a lot. You're inspire. I want to go back and talk about you. Totally. You, you amaze me. You, you fall underneath this, this Paul Wolf and maybe even a Cole Pern. It's like you all are blood, blood brothers. You, you were a great. And I mean great. You were good. You were a good race car driver. And I want, I want to read some of these stats to a lot of people out there. When you were 12 years old, you were, you were running the WKA World Carding association at 12 years old. The man you're looking at right now won seven championships in South Carolina and five national championships. Then you, you, you, you got going. And then in 2000, you made a start at Myrtle beach in the NASCAR Xfinity series. So I guess my question to you is this, at what point? And I'm not really grouping you in, but I know Paul Wolf's story, and I've heard these stories about these great race car drivers like yourself at one moment. Tell me about that whole time. And when did you decide to go, hey, I'm. I'm gonna be a mechanic and I'm gonna go into this crew chief. Real. Just that. That whole storyline right there.
- [09:01]
C
Yeah, you know, I had an interesting start. You know, my parents really weren't in racing at all. You know, for me, it really came down to one of my best friends. His dad had a racing go kart. I went with them to Lincoln. Lincolnton one night and watched his dad race. And, you know, it come Christmas time, and I was like begging my parents for a racing go kart and kind of just got into it with just me and my mom. My dad was always working on Fridays and Saturdays and. And even some Sundays. And my mom would take me to the racetrack in the back of a S10 truck, just me and her. And all the men around the racetrack would always hate that she was down there trying to crank old Briggs motor.
- [09:48]
B
I love it.
- [09:49]
C
But that's how it was in the beginning, you know, and. And then I was. I got picked up by a factory cart team only about a year into my go kart racing. And that was. That's really what turned everything around. You know, we had. We had the best motors, we had the best go karts, We. We worked hard, we had the biggest trailer every time we pulled in, and we had the most tires in the trailer, and you know how important that is in dirt racing. So, you know, I think that was key right there to start what. What ended up happening later on, you know, building a new go kart every week. And, you know, this one had this kingpin inclination, and this one had this caster, and this one had this tubing, and this one was this thick and this stiff and this wheelbase. And, you know, we were, you know, at 12 years old, 13 years old, we were messing with all that. And I was like a sponge at the time and just learning all that stuff and, you know, scaling five go karts a week and just learning all that stuff. And, you know, not many 13 year olds know what tubing is in their go kart and how it was welded and how much wedge is in it, how much nose weight's in it, how much casters in it. You know, like being a racer, you understand that. And that was so important to kick me off, you know, to get me going, you know. Later I started racing on my own and it was kind of refreshing, honestly, because, you know, before that it was kind of always a group decision of, all right, we're going to put these tires on it for the main with this stagger and this air pressure, whatever. And for me, I needed to kind of do it on my own. I needed to make my own decisions. At one point I kind of got to that age and man, we, we won everything you could win that year. It was ridiculous. And then like you said, I went from go kart racing to running a little bit of legend cars, just kind of part time. Then got into the late model stock cars and same thing I was saying earlier, I've been really fortunate through all this. I bought one of Greg Marlowe's old cars and Greg would come to the shop and you know, he would hint around of, you need these springs in it or you need this sway bar, you need this much wedge and all that. And I was smart enough to know how to scale it and to do all that stuff. And I went to the first late model race at Tri county in 98 and it was 150 lap, big money race. And I sat on the pole and led every lap. And everybody's like, who in the world is this? Where did he come from?
- [12:33]
B
I love this. I love it.
- [12:36]
C
You know, I had a lot of great runs in that, in that late model stock car series. Went to a lot of big races at the end of 98 and ran really, really well. Me and Philip Morris kind of beat each other's doors. Now there's a name, money races.
- [12:52]
B
There's the name Philip Morris.
- [12:53]
C
He was good against somebody like him. Yeah, when you race against somebody like him, you know you're doing it. So, yeah, I mean, did a lot of late model stuff. Moved up and run the Slim Jim all pro series for a year. Ran really well in. That only lasted for a year. But that was interesting because that was the first time I was traveling full time in a race car and going to a lot of big tracks I'd never been to. You know, taking a, taking a super late model to St. Louis is the gateway. I mean, you're getting on with it down into turn one. So. Yeah, yeah, especially when your radio don't work in the race. So, uh, had no spotter for the whole race. But yeah, just, you know, a lot of, a lot of things like that propelled me into a position to where we got to run one bush race at Myrtle beach. And you know, that didn't go the way we wanted to. But, like, when you're at that age and you have that many bushcars showing up every week, you have to take every opportunity you can get to get any seat time, you know, on radial tires and do all that stuff. And little did we know, we bought a car at an auction that had intermediate brakes on it, and we took it to Myrtle beach, and that didn't quite work out, but. And then we got caught up in somebody else's wreck. But it. It's hard to miss a wreck when you don't have any breaks. So what was the.
- [14:10]
B
What was the moment? You know, you're doing a fantastic job, and, gosh, you're giving me so much information when you're saying all this talking about go karts, you know, caster camber, you know, king pin inclination. A lot of people don't know about this tubing thickness, the way you weld it, you know, how's the welder heat? How's it gonna flex? I can hear my brother Rusty saying, herman, the difference between good race car drivers and bad ones is he. Rusty always said, you got to get your head in the carburetor. And every once in a while, you have a Kyle Larson or Jeff Gordon come along that don't even know how to weld. But that's pretty rare in your mindset. You know, you had a lot of success with Harvick. He was a racer. Was that important for you to go that route to know everything about your cars?
- [15:07]
C
Yeah, it really was. And it's funny you say that about Rusty, because I always felt like I was like that. You know, I would watch him and the way that he talked to his crew and stuff, and, like, I go build the shocks myself and put them on myself, you know, And I know how Rusty was with his Martinsville shocks, keeping them under his bed, but true.
- [15:26]
B
Yep. Dolphin. It was a dolphin nosed. He loved that dolphin nose on the graph, you know, Squat. Yeah, just. Yeah, he loved. Go ahead. Now you got me. Now you got me going.
- [15:40]
C
Yeah, but. But, yeah, that helped a ton, you know, really, with everybody, with Kevin, with Mark Martin, you know, like, to be able to have those conversations about cars and, you know, what we were doing and all those things, and, you know, that was important. Right? I mean, it just helps you have those conversations and make the right decisions and do the right things. And I think it was important no matter who was driving the car, honestly.
- [16:10]
B
Okay, so now let's go to that moment. I started to ask you it earlier, but we got talking race cars. Do you remember the moment? Were you driving in your vehicle? Were you laying in bed? Where were you when you said, I think I'm gonna be some type of crew member? And, you know, when did this moment change where you said, okay, I'm gonna go into being a crew chief?
- [16:34]
C
Well, I have to be honest. We, um. Some of it was when we had some tragedies in our sport, you know, and we went through that spell of boosters falling off and falling in the carburetors and people getting killed. That's when it started to hit me. You know, I grew up racing go karts against Adam Petty, and that one probably hit me the most. And then it just went on and went on. Right? I mean, we went through a spell there that it was pretty scary with Adam and Kenny Irwin and all these different people. I had one of them happen right in front of me at Gateway and all pro car, and that guy never raced again. So some of that was starting to wear on me, whether I really wanted to be in that position and get killed one day or whatever. Right? I mean, that started weighing on me. And then, of course, Earnhardt got killed. I'm telling you, I was a disaster for weeks when Dale got killed. And then it just come down to the opportunities were getting more and more shy, you know, like you. I didn't. I didn't have a family business or money behind me. I didn't have sponsors behind me to, you know, go walk in a door and say, hey, I can bring a million dollars if you let me drive your bus car. So the opportunities just kept getting more and more thin. I was getting older, you know, at that point, I was probably. I don't know. I mean, I was getting. I was 20 years old, 22, 23, something like that. So I was thinking, you know, I don't want to live with my parents my whole life. I want to get a wife and married one day. I want to have my own life and make my own money. So all that stuff just kept adding up more and more, and it really come down to going to lunch with one of my friends. He had got out of Late Model Racing. He worked at AFCO for a long time and then went and started his own shock business. And then he went to work at Jasper motorsports on the 77 car with Blaney, and he was a shot guy. And we went to lunch one day just like we always did. Always did. And he's like, when are you going to quit racing? And I was like, I'm never going to quit racing. He goes, well, when are you going to quit driving? And I was like, I don't know. Why do you say that? And he goes, well, I've been working at this cup team for a year now, and I'm telling you, if you. If you came in, you're smarter than 70 to 80% of people that are on our team right now. And I feel like you're going to move up really quickly and do whatever you want to do, whatever you want to make out of it. So I went back, I went home, and I probably thought about that for two weeks, and I had, you know, Katrina and I had been dating and obviously thinking about getting married one day, and, you know, like I was saying, and finally I called him. I was like, well, can you get me an interview? You know, like, how does this work? I've never had to go interview anywhere before in my life. So he got me an interview, and I went up there and met with them and. And, you know, just took it from there. They offered me a job that day of being on the road crew with. With the 77 team and Blaney and. And, you know, started out as the little interior guy and that would carry his helmet out there and driver fluffer, I guess you could say, and, you know, you know, and just took it from there and. And moved up to be the front mechanic later that year, and then a year later become the car chief. And just. It went fast after that. I mean, the first time I ever flying in a plane was in January of 2003 and. And working on a Cup team. And in, like, June or July 2005, I was the crew chief over at MBV for Scott Riggs. So it was only two and a half years of being in the cup garage, of moving up to be a crew chief.
- [20:46]
B
I listen, although I talk a lot, I listen and I want to talk about something you just talked about. As you know, I'm a little over 61 years old, and I raced a lot of NASCAR. And like you, you know, I was a Cup crew chief in 1984 on the Levi Garrett team with Joe Rutman. I was a tire changer, you know, for Rusty. Then I became a race car driver. But we. We went through an era while I was racing in NASCAR where we, you know, Neil. Neil Vonnett got killed, you know, then Blaze Alexander got killed, then Dale Earnhardt Senior gets killed, Adam Petty gets killed. Everybody's getting killed. Nobody's getting maimed, nobody's getting hurt. Nobody's getting broken legs Everybody's getting killed. Yeah, tell me about that. You know, Rusty even talked about this, Rusty Wallace, when he retired. He says, ah, you know, and you just mentioned it, too, when Earnhardt got killed. It's like, how can Superman get killed? And now. And then it. So my question to you is this. At that point, do you think all your comrades, everybody in the garage area said, holy crap, our sport is really dangerous? What was your thoughts at that time be. Besides saying, you know what? Maybe I don't want to be a race car driver?
- [22:14]
C
Yeah. You know, and it was just one thing after another, Right. I mean, whether it was throttle hanging, throttles hanging up, or, you know, airplane crashes or helicopter crashes or whatever. I mean, gosh, I mean, it just seemed like one after another. And if you're a huge race fan and, you know, and you wanted to be a race car driver and you knew that one day, either you might be in that position where your throttle hangs or your right front tire is going to blow out, or you're going to be on a helicopter, you're going to be on a private jet, or all those different things. You know, you start questioning that. It's like, man, I don't know about that. Because at that point, like I said, I'd never even been on an airplane before. I'm like, I'm gonna go from not ever being on an airplane to flying 247 all over the nation, you know, and. But like you said, I mean, once those things started happening, it just hit you in the gut, you know, like, it was hard to imagine losing all these people that we all looked up to. And like you said, Earnhardt was Superman, you know, and, like, none of us ever expected that to happen.
- [23:26]
A
Where'd you get those shoes? Easy. They're from dsw. Because DSW has the exact right shoes for whatever you're into right now. You know, like the sneakers that make office hours feel like happy hour, the boots that turn grocery aisles into runways, and all the styles that show off the many sides of you, from daydreamer to multitasker and everything in between, because you do it all in really great shoes. Find a shoe for every year at your DSW store or DSW.com and, you.
- [23:59]
C
Know, with me growing up with Dale Jr. And going to high school with him and sitting beside each other at school and.
- [24:06]
B
Hold on. Well, back up, back up, hold. I hardly ever interrupt. I had no idea about that. You and Dale Jr. Went to school together?
- [24:17]
C
Yeah, we went to high school together. And we.
- [24:20]
B
What? High school.
- [24:20]
C
Beside each Other in Mooresville Senior High.
- [24:23]
B
I'll be darn.
- [24:24]
C
Yeah. Yeah, we. We went to Mooresville senior High. We sat right beside each other in drafting class. And that was before he was even racing and I was racing. And it was so cool because he never pictured himself as a race car driver. Like, he went and rode a go kart one time and he flipped it right in front of his dad, and his dad told him he was done. He was never racing again. And so he knew I was winning, like, all the time. So he. Every Monday morning, he's like, you know, where did you go? How many classes did you win? And he would sit there in drafting class and. And draw pictures of bush cars with my name above the door and my number on them. And he's like, yeah, what do you think about this one? This is going to be you one day.
- [25:10]
B
This is amazing.
- [25:12]
C
Yeah, he believed I was the one that was going to be the race car driver, not him. And so, yeah, we ended up being pretty good buddies. I went to his first street stock race over at Concord. We didn't know what we were doing welded up. So his uncle, his uncle Danny had built this big motor for it, and it had all the horsepower in the world, but it only had one wheel drive because we didn't have the gears welded up. So it's fun to write, retire all the way around the racetrack. But, yeah, we had a lot of good times together and. But, yeah, I mean, that's why it hit me the most. I think, you know, it was one thing to lose, you know, like some of those guys that we were talking about. But when Dale senior got killed, man, that was. That was a gut punch. I just. I couldn't picture what it would be like to be Dale Jr. To number one, lose your father, but to. To lose what everybody considered Superman.
- [26:13]
B
This is amazing. All the studying I've done, I. And I, you know, I do a lot of studying, and I surprise people where I know more about them than they think. But it is that hidden. I mean, why have I never heard. I mean, that should be a story. Rodney childers and Dale Jr. Went to high school together. Does everybody know that?
- [26:35]
C
Not many. We never, you know, we don't just put it out there all the time. He. He wanted me to do that Dell Jr. Download one time, and we got to talking all kinds of stories, and I started telling some of them, and he didn't even remember, like, throwing eggs all night one night and doing this and that. Like, he's like, I don't think I remember that, but, you know, not. You know, we've only talked about it, you know, on the air that one time. But, yeah, I mean, we were good friends growing up, and we still are good friends. And it's been really neat to piddle with the late model stuff again. And him being involved in that car store deal with Kevin, it kind of got us communicating a lot again, which I like, and, you know, texting each other a lot, and that's been a lot of fun.
- [27:25]
B
You know, something that I witnessed and I noticed that's a fact in NASCAR that ended up really kind of bothering me a little bit, is when I was in NASCAR my whole life, later on, I would find that a lot of these crew members were incredible short trackers. I mean, that's what they did, and they were at local short tracks, but when they came nascar, they kind of forgot all about it. Do you run into a lot of crew members like that where they. They were race car drivers. They. There were heroes at their local area. But when they come to nascar, I would be with these guys for three years, and I'm like, wait, what? You raced? You know, do you run into more and more people like that or not? Yeah.
- [28:15]
C
I mean, for me, I've always felt like that was kind of key. Right. You wanted somebody to work on your team that grew up racing, whether it was go karts or, you know, little sprint cars or dirt cars, whatever. Because those guys, they. I mean, they just get it, right? I mean, they. They grew up. Yeah. They're just racing.
- [28:35]
B
Melt their own lead.
- [28:37]
C
That's exactly right. And, yeah, you know, like, even Dale Fishline just come to work for us. Oh, my God.
- [28:45]
B
Iowa.
- [28:46]
C
You know what I mean? Like, yeah. And, you know, he was with me at Stuart Haas for the last 11 years, and we all thought he was retiring. He kept telling everybody he's retiring, and then out of the blue, he called us up. It's like, I don't know, maybe I should work a couple more years. And we're like, all right, get over here now. Yeah, you know, so. But, you know, that's the kind of thing you're talking about, is, like, you think about everything that somebody like Dale did growing up racing go karts and racing cars and going to Daytona, doing all these things that some people in the shop have no idea he ever did. Right? So, you know, to me, it's. It's. It's special to have people like that on your team that are racers, and, you know, they just get it. You know, they. They know what's going on and how to work and how to get along and how to communicate and all those things, Rodney.
- [29:38]
B
I look, I'll look at pictures to this day and I'll see Magic Shoes, Mike McLaughlin with a work uniform on, working. And I'm like, what? I'm like, that's a hero. That is one of the greatest modified racers of all the Dale Fishline. And that is the Iowa racer, right?
- [29:58]
C
Yeah.
- [29:59]
B
I mean, one of the great. Yeah, it blows my mind away when I keep seeing these incredible race car drivers. But. But it is that fragile, isn't it, Rodney? I mean, you know, in the end, we all still got to make a living and in, you know, NASCAR jobs, I mean, what's a. I guess to get down to the nitty gritty. I mean, if you're a good crew member, what are you going to make? 80,000 a year?
- [30:28]
C
Yeah, probably. So.
- [30:29]
B
Yeah, you can't go anywhere in the world and make that kind of money. And if you do, you've got to be a major executive. You got to have years of college. And so I. I guess when I'm asking you, NASCAR pays pretty well, I guess.
- [30:45]
C
Yeah, it does. And, you know, I think the thing these days is people just aren't exposed to it as much as they were. Like when we were kids, you know, with me growing up around here, I mean, Lord, there was. There was 10 dirt go kart tracks within an hour drive. And then you had all these, you know, asphalt late model tracks on top of that, and you had Metrolina running dirt cars. And you had. Going down to Cherokee, you had all these places that people were exposed to things. And, you know, as those dirt tracks have went away, all the go kart tracks have went away around here. You know, honestly, the only exposure people get is flipping through a channel one day on a Sunday afternoon and sitting on the couch and they're bored and they're like, oh, what's this? I've never watched a NASCAR race before. Let me see what this is like. And at that point, when it's somebody's first time, they flip that channel on their first race they've ever watched. You're hoping it's an exciting one, right?
- [31:54]
B
Yeah.
- [31:55]
C
I mean, if it's a snooze fest of a race and it's the first one they've ever watched, you're like, crap, I'm not ever watching that again.
- [32:00]
B
Yeah.
- [32:01]
C
So getting that exposure, you know, getting people out to the races, I mean, that, that. That's probably the biggest key right now. Is getting somebody to erase. Let them feel the excitement, the sounds, the wind. Like all those things are sitting in the stands, getting into turn one in Michigan, like, they're going pretty fast. And, you know, somebody does that one time, they kind of get hooked. But, you know, most people just don't grow up with that exposure anymore. So, you know what we were talking about of hiring a racer? There's not a lot of them out there anymore, so you kind of have to. To, you know, find a needle in a haystack every now and then and. And. And pick out a good one.
- [32:45]
B
So you are that needle in the haystack. You are incredibly rare. And this is one reason I wanted to talk to you. I admire you immensely because I know your story. I feel like you and I are brothers because I built my own race cars. You know, I did everything myself. So with that being said, when you work with these drivers, you know, now, I'm going to go back in a minute, but I want to talk about this. When you work with these drivers, because you were a race car driver and you understand the chassis setup, do you ever feel like, especially let's take Harvick, Were you ever, like, in the car with him, like, mentally, like, you know, you're talking about Gateway. When you went to Gateway with Harvick, or maybe you didn't, but could you feel the car loose is what I'm saying.
- [33:36]
C
But it's fun. It's funny you say that, because Cheddar, my car chief, he was just telling my new engineer that our. Our pit box used to have sticker gas pedal, brake pedal, clutch pedal in front of me, like, where I sit as a crew, if it had these little sticker pedals, and my feet always stayed up there. And Cheddar told Johnny, he's like, there's going to be times when you look over and his feet are moving, especially if we have a. If we have an in car camera and it's a roof camera to where he can see exactly what, you know, what the car is doing and all that stuff. And it was real early in 2014, or even maybe before the season started. I told Kevin. I was like, look, I said, the in car camera thing is super important to me. I was like, you know, I. I take a lot from that. Where we're at, what we're doing, who we're around. I mean, I can see if the car's loose or tight. I can see if you're running the bottom, the top. I can kind of sense if you're pushing it too hard or burning the tires up or whatever. And I said we need to do anything and everything we can to. To keep an in car camera. I was like, you know, normally that's a sponsor deal. So he actually went to all of our sponsors throughout our whole career together 10 years, and told them what the in car camera meant to me, how I thought it made our racing better, how I could adjust the car better, make better decisions when I was pitting all those things. And he would sell the sponsors on buying as many in car cameras as as they could. And you know, for, for us, it just ended up being every week, you know, like, I mean, we would go the whole season, have an in car camera for 38 weeks. And so, you know, I was always like that. You know, I like to be able to see what we're doing and, and you know, I would start making adjustments to the car. Like even before we had smt, you know, like now smt, you can see if it's loose or tight.
- [35:46]
B
What is smt?
- [35:47]
C
I use it. The car basically has data on it now. So we can see steering wheel angles and traces. We can see the throttle, the brake, all those things. Rpm so I mean, you can see wheel spin. You can see if he's just got a ton of wheel cranked in it in the middle of the corner or whatever. But, you know, before that, I use that in car camera for that. You know, I could tell how comfortable he was. You know, it switched from the roof camera to the in car and he'd go down the straightaway and take his hand off the steering wheel and lay it over on the leg brace. And I knew the car is pretty good at that point.
- [36:28]
B
Oh, my God.
- [36:29]
C
Just playing with them here.
- [36:31]
B
I saw Bill Elliot do that one year when I was a kid. And you go back, if you go back and find a. A Phoenix, the old Phoenix, you will see Bill Elliott coming off a turn four and take his right hand and put it over on one of the row bars. And I'm like, wait, what? Yeah, that's amazing.
- [36:52]
C
Kevin. Kevin did that a lot, honestly. And I was like, what are you doing when you put your arm over like that? He's. I don't know. My shoulder gets to hurting, so I just like stretch it out every now and then. Hey, okay.
- [37:03]
B
Speaking of Kevin Harvick. Kevin Harvick, along with Josh Jones, we call him Mother Function on X. They're a little powerhouse, aren't they? I mean, they go get their own money, actually. I think they could have been a Cup team, those two together.
- [37:19]
C
Oh, for sure.
- [37:20]
B
What is your thoughts on Josh Jones and Kevin and that? My gosh, they created an empire on their own, didn't they?
- [37:29]
C
They really did. And, like, when they came to Stewart Haas, I mean, almost every sponsor that was on our car was through them. It wasn't like Stuart Haas wasn't going and finding them. It was Kevin and Josh finding them. And, you know, I think the thing about that is Josh has been around Kevin for a long, long time. And, you know, for anybody that has spent a lot of time around Kevin, you learn really what your expectations are, right? Like, every day there's a goal. Every day there's a schedule. Every day there's expectations, and it changes your life. Honestly, like, I mean, I wish like crazy, you know, instead of kids sitting in school learning how to use a calculator, you put them with Kevin Harvick for a year and learn how to live life and how to work every day and how to have mental toughness and all those things. But, you know, I think that's what it has turned into with Josh is Josh has been around Kevin long enough, and he's turned into a little Kevin to where he's just out fighting every day. You know, he's finding sponsors. He's signing these young guys to Kevin Harvick, Inc. And doing whatever he can to do things the right way. And, you know, like you said, those two are a powerhouse together. And I don't think we can forget about Delana. That keeps them both straight.
- [39:03]
B
Yeah.
- [39:03]
C
So she keeps the boat going in the right direction.
- [39:06]
B
She's always been nice to me. I like Delano. This is a perfect segue. Let's. Let's go back now. We've celebrated you. We've talked about how good of a race car driver you are. We talked about the moment you decided to go back into being a crew chief. It. It appeared to me in my. My heart hurt a little bit, and maybe it shouldn't. But this is a perfect time to ask you, because you just said that Kevin brought you into his positive mental attitude world, and if people talked about you, you. You just said, you know, ignore the negativity. Everybody's mean to everybody. It seemed like you were emotionally sad when you lost Harvick, and then when, you know, just up until a couple months ago, I follow you religiously, and it's okay. Were you. And I've been bummed out. Were you. Were you bummed out during this loss of Harvick? Going to tv. And then finally, the dagger is when what you built. Stewart house racing shutting down. Tell me about this. This time. That looked hard from my standpoint.
- [40:24]
C
Yeah, for me, Kenny, it was one of those things that, you know, the old car, I was extremely good at. Like, I wanted to spend time in the body shop. I wanted to, you know, put the bodies on a certain way. I wanted to have a better front clip than everybody else, a better rear clip than everybody else. Like, I felt like I could do it, you know, with. With the people around me. Good body hangers, good chassis guys, good designers, good engineers. Like, I could keep that ball rolling as long as we wanted to keep it rolling. For years and years and years, we could have kept it rolling. And so the start of that was really when they come out with a new car, and, you know, the first one rolled in the shop, and I'm like, what am I going to work on?
- [41:09]
B
What is this thing?
- [41:10]
C
Like, what am. What am I going to do every day? And that's really what it turned into. Two for me is like, on my way to work every morning with the old car, I had a list, you know, 20 things that I thought we could do that day or that week that we could get by with or we could do this, we could do that, and make our cars better. Well, when the new car came, I would stop at a stoplight on the way to work, and I'm like, what am I going to work on today? Like, there's nothing that I feel like I can do to make this thing better. So then that got compiled with Kevin saying he's going to retire, and I knew that was coming. So, you know, already I'm struggling with working on the new car. The guy that I've won 37 races with in a championship is going to retire, and then you go. Then you start last year, and we're going to shut the place down. And, man, it was. I'm not going to lie to you. For three years, it was rough. Like, I didn't know what I wanted to do. You know, am I going to keep crew chief, and am I not? Am I still having fun or am I not? Do I still want to travel or not? Just so much of that, you know, that stuff was running through my head all the time. And honestly, it was good for Josh to come over and drive the 4 car. I admired Josh, you know, a ton. From what he had done in late model stock cars. He made me think of me in that time period. You know, he was a guy that had Won a lot of late model races and deserved to be in the big shows on Sunday. I felt like he did anyway. And it become a goal of mine to make sure this guy makes it through this first year. Because to me, that's really where it's at right now. The rookies. If you can make it through the first year and still have a ride after that or still have sponsorship, then you can continue. But it is so hard for these young guys to come in and to prove themselves with no practice anymore, no testing anymore. Like, they have no opportunity to get better. So for me to work with Josh, it became fun again, you know, like those last two years of Kevin's career. I dreaded the car. I dreaded him retiring. Josh comes in, and he's excited. He wants to be there. Not saying that Kevin didn't, but I'm just saying, like, you know, here's an opportunity that we can show that this late model racer deserves to be here. And I kept telling everybody, like, Josh isn't going to fail on my watch. Like, no matter if we're shutting down or not, he's not going to fail. And, you know, we went out there and we were really competitive. A lot of the short tracks, we were qualifying up front. We were leading laps, we were contending. And next thing you know, his. You know, his phone is ringing and, you know, has rods going his way for the next year and ends up with the Wood brothers and all that stuff. So really, working with Josh got me going again.
- [44:22]
B
Well, you did your job then. You did your job then.
- [44:26]
C
That's how I felt. You know, all of us did on the whole four car.
- [44:30]
B
Yeah. Josh was a little bird, and now he's flying because of you.
- [44:36]
C
Yeah.
- [44:36]
B
And he's. He's the Wood brothers, probably because of you, because you wanted him as your driver.
- [44:44]
C
Yeah.
- [44:45]
A
Where'd you get those shoes? Easy. They're from dsw. Because DSW has the exact right shoes for whatever you're into right now. You know, like the sneakers that make office hours feel like happy hour, the boots that turn grocery aisles into runways, and all the styles that show off the many sides of you, from daydreamer to multitasker and everything in between, because you do it all in really great shoes. Find a shoe for every you at your DSW store or dsw dot com.
- [45:16]
B
Okay, I. I want to go back to something eraser to racer in me and Rusty Wallace. Sometimes I say my brother's last name so the people listening know who I'm talking about.
- [45:32]
C
Yeah.
- [45:32]
B
Sometimes my Brother Rusty Wallace and myself, you know, we talk racing. It was a disappointing to you and Kevin to lose the advantages. I mean, you know, when I was in the game, you know, you took the nose, you moved it to the right, you know, to keep the car tight. Getting in it would turn better. And it seemed to me back in the, you know, 10 years ago you had a better car than other guys. Then you put Harvick in it, who's already a great driver. Now you're a powerhouse because your car is truly better than theirs because Rodney's so good. You, you are such a good crew chief that you've crafted this car now, now let's put Kevin Harvick in it and you win the 2014 championship. 36 races. Is that era gone now?
- [46:30]
C
I think it is. You know, to have somebody win 10 races a year. I don't know if you'll ever see it again. I really don't. I think in 2014 and in 2015. I might be wrong on this, but I think we led like over 2,000 laps those years. 2,000 each, each year, you know, so we led, you know, over 4,000 laps in a two year span. And you just, you're not going to see that anymore, you know, not with the new car. So, you know, it was huge for the, for the five car to win. I think the five car won what, four or five races this year. And, and I saw something where he led over a thousand laps or maybe 1500 laps or something. And you know, I mean, those days of us doing that are just over.
- [47:18]
B
I feel like I, I, I've never done this before, but I got on Racing Reference for you and I would have never dreamed in a million years you would have brought that up. I would have never dreamed. That tells me how analytical you are. Your earnings as a crew chief. 48 million. $48 million. There he is, ladies and gentlemen. Go kart racer. Okay, laps. Wow. What is that? 8. 183,000, 719 laps led. 1, 2, 4, 5, 3. 12,453 laps. Is that right?
- [48:10]
C
I don't think.
- [48:11]
B
Hold on, one more thing. Miles as a crew chief, okay, you, you've sat on the pit box and you've watched your car miles. 245,000 miles and it's got each race. So like, like here, listen to this. This is great. Hold on. Okay. In 2024, with Josh Barry as you, the crew chief, you watch Josh run 11,659 miles. So you've been in the sport. 20 years. You've been a crew chief 20 years. Exactly. And every year your drivers ran so many miles. Now, let's, let's see this. This is really good. It looks to me like the most mile. Wow. The most miles you ever ran was way back in as a crew Chief. David Rudman, 2010. Were the races longer back then? You ran third?
- [49:16]
C
I think they were, yeah.
- [49:17]
B
13,844 miles. A racing reference is pretty cool, isn't it?
- [49:23]
C
Yeah, it really is. For sure.
- [49:26]
B
The only reason I bring it up is because you're. You're an analyzer. Are. Are you an. Are you an. Are you an analyzer? And, and who did you get that from?
- [49:36]
C
I don't know. I've just kind of always been that way. I like keeping up with those things. You know, I like, you know, really, it's just being a racer. Like you want to lead the most laps of anybody in the series every year. You want to have the most polls of anybody. Any cup. Any, Any cup. Crew chief. You want to have the most polls. Yes. Wins. But Paul passed me, almost wins for active crew chief this year. Yeah, so he's got a couple on me now. But, you know. Yeah, you want to be in good company and to be right there with Paul Wolf is pretty freaking awesome. So, you know, it's, but it really is just being competitive, I think. You know, I keep up with those numbers because I'm competitive. I want to be the best.
- [50:22]
B
Yeah, I like that because I didn't think the racing reference, but I. Why am I saying this? Because I paid attention. I mean, I, I go around my whole Life. I've run 905 races. You know, I'm really proud of that, you know, because how many, you know, I do the same thing. I mean, I, I go. How many drivers have ran? 905. You know, I still hold the most starts in the Xfinity series. So I guess as I'm listening to you, I'm thinking, yeah, I'm the same way. But that racing reference is incredible. It's like a bible.
- [50:53]
C
It really is. For sure.
- [50:54]
B
Okay. So I'm not going to be a Debbie Downer. We're going to use this moment to tell people to keep digging. And, and you and I kind of talked about this because I called you and we talked. So for anybody out there that thinks they got it rough, I'm gonna say this. And then, and then you add on to it. Okay. Rodney Childers. We've already talked about how great I think you Are, but you were really roughed up and you, you've stayed digging. For example, you went to Ray Evernham Racing and that ended. Everybody followed the Michael Walter debacle and it ended Stewart Haas Racing. It ended. Explain to me. And I know, because we're both badasses. That's how we're wired different and everybody. But coming out of you, all those teams shut down. Did you ever think, what the hell, what's going on around here? You know, where's the camera at? What, how did you keep going?
- [52:09]
C
Yeah, that part was tough. And you hate to be associated with that too in a way, right? Like you don't want it to be like everywhere you ever went ended up shutting down because we were also successful at the same time. Right?
- [52:24]
B
You won. You're winning, you're winning.
- [52:26]
C
I saw, I saw Frankie Stoddard yesterday at lunch and that's one of the things he said. He's like, lord, I hope you don't shut down a fifth one. And I was like, I'm gonna put you in the stomach. But you know what I mean? Like, what in the world?
- [52:42]
B
Same thing happened to me everywhere I went. I, I took a brand new crew chief, started a team and then it shut down. I'm like, damn, I'm good at that.
- [52:51]
C
I don't know. I mean, you hate to see that, right? But, you know, but, but also, I think I was just in that spot at the right time, you know, like, I mean, every, every place goes through rough times or spells or whatever, and it just kind of happened all at the, at that time and, but you.
- [53:13]
B
Started those teams pretty, I mean, when you were at Michael Waltrip, that's when your legend started. Because here's Mark Martin just, I mean, Mark Martin made you famous. I mean, my God, he talked about you all the time.
- [53:27]
C
He really did. Yeah. Yeah, I love the Mark for sure.
- [53:33]
B
He's a badass. Okay, so here we are already an hour. But I, I, I, look at that, Rodney. I kind of went through the same thing. I look at that as when one shut down, they, they wanted you because you were winning. And the re, they didn't shut down because of the way the cars ran. They were really weird deals, you know?
- [53:57]
C
Yeah, for sure.
- [53:58]
B
Okay, let, let's have fun here. I'm, like I said, I'm a big fan of yours on Instagram and, and, and you have a wonderful family. It appears to me we share something in common. We are going to make sure we love our wives and we love our children and I see the effort that you put in to loving your wife and loving your children. My kids are copying you. They got every app at Disney World.
- [54:31]
C
Yeah.
- [54:32]
B
Tell me about the love for your wife and two boys. Yeah.
- [54:37]
C
I mean, when I met Katrina, that's really what got my mind going. Like I said, you know, like, you know, I want to get married. I want to do this, I want to do that. And, like, I've been so fortunate from that standpoint. You know, people. People don't believe me when I say we've been together for 23 and a half years and we've never had an argument. They're like, that's. There's no way that's even possible. And. But it's true. And, you know, they have supported me through thick and thin, and then obviously, my kids. I think when the boys were born, I just kind of assumed that when they got to four years old, we were buying go karts, and we were go kart racing, and we were going to travel all over the place and race go karts and we were going to do this and that. And, you know, I kind of pushed that in a way, but I never pushed it to the point to where I was making the decision. I wanted them to make the decision like I did. So I bought them a little kid car. They didn't care much for it. I bought them a little UTV. They didn't care much for it. A little PW50 dirt bike. They didn't care much for it. So all those things, you know, that kind of changed, like, where we have headed on a path as a family. They absolutely love going to the racetrack with.
- [55:56]
B
They're proud of.
- [55:56]
C
Now that we're at Spire. Yeah. And, you know, now that we're at Spire, it has just lit a fire under them. Like, they want to come here to the shop every single day after school. Like, they think it's so cool that the trucks are in here. They see it as a learning curve for them. Like, hey, I could work on one of those trucks at some point and I can learn, and then I can move up to the Cup Series one day. And, you know, they don't really know what they want to do. You know, like, I said that. That whole. All the kids right now, they. They just grew up different than us. Right? So, like, and for me, I stay so busy here at work, even when they come to the shop, I struggle to help them. You know, I don't know where that path is of. All right, go back there and learn that. You know, I stuck Brody with the shot guy one day, I'm like, do not leave this guy's side, no matter what he's doing. Watch what he's doing. And, you know, but we. We have tried to maintain that throughout my whole career. As you know, from having motor homes throughout your career, they're not cheap, and it cost a lot of money to have somebody drive them from race to race. And a lot of the other crew chiefs think I'm crazy because I'm one of the last ones that still have a motorhome going around. It's important I do that because my. I do that because my wife and kids, you know, they. They like to go to the racetrack, they like to be there, they like to be involved. But, you know, those are the things that we have decided to do as a family. We spend a lot of money to. To keep the happiness going. So. And, you know, I met with Everybody on the 17. I had all the pit crew guys come over from Hendrick, and we stood in a room, and I was like, I'm going to start this meeting out with. With one thing. The most important thing in your life is your wife, your kids, your mom and dad, your grandma, your grandpa. And I was like, everything that's inside these walls of this race team comes second. You know, if you have a problem that you need to take care of, if you have an appointment that you need to go to, if you have a family member that's battling cancer going through something bad, we need. We all need to know about it. We all need to go through it together with you. We all need to pray about it every day. We all need to do those things. And, you know, as I've got older, I've realized that more and more, you know, by losing people that you really cared about. So we've tried to keep that going. Everybody on the race team loves my kids. They love my wife, and they treat them just like they're their own kids. And, you know, that's the way we want to keep it as much as we can.
- [58:40]
B
I think that's great advice because I know for a fact when it really is true. It's a silly cliche. They say, happy wife, happy life. But. But really, when the family is happy, crew members come hopping into work. I really believe that when you were talking, it made me think about the boys, you know, whether they were going to race or not. Kenny Schrader's always got a quip. I. I call it a. I call it a joke. But Schrader always ends everything with. With what you what I call a quip. Like there's always some little thing, you know, instead of dun, dun, dun, dun. Schrader's got that very end. And he said, he says his boy Sheldon, you know, Kenny Schrader's thinking, well, maybe my boy's gonna. Wants to be a race car driver. So Kenny says, he tells this story so funny. He says, well, Sheldon, you know, I took you racing with me all week long. You know, you stayed in the motorhome with dad. Do you think you want to be a race car driver? Schrader tells me that Sheldon looked at him and Schrader, you know, Sheldon's very smart. Sheldon says, I don't think so, dad. This racing looks really dangerous. You see. But you know what? As silly as it sounds, we, you know, during Sheldon growing up, you know, we lost a lot of drivers, and that sticks in people's heads, and some it doesn't. You're a. You're a great, great person, Rodney. You're.
- [60:15]
C
Thank you.
- [60:16]
B
You're really nice. You're extremely smart. You got it going on. Okay, let's end like this. You're. I guess you're inspired motorsports right now. Give me an update on the team. I mean, right. Right this second, what's. What's around you, how many cars we got? What's. What's the it's clash look like?
- [60:40]
C
It's pretty interesting because I'm sitting in a brand new office with brand new furniture, a brand new chair. I don't know why I need this head.
- [60:47]
B
I got it at Target.
- [60:48]
C
Sleep here. Office X. Yeah, but this office area used to be part of the showroom of kbm. Oh, and now it's. It's all new crew chief offices. All the engineers are down here with us. Competitions down here. We're all right here together. And, you know, they've spent a lot of money to. To make all this happen. We have a brand new hauler out sitting out there, a lot of brand new people, brand new cars, you know, pit box, a generator car. It's brand new. Like, I mean, we have nice stuff and we have good people. And now it's time to start putting them together. You know, like, you know, putting the cars together, building them the right way, making them lighter, making them make the center of gravity lower than the guy next to you. All those things. I mean, that's really what it's down to at this point is I feel like we have all the equipment that we need. You know, we're getting as much information as we can from From General Motors and Chevrolet and Hendrick Motorsports and, you know, hopefully we can go out there and contend. I mean, I feel like we have the people and the equipment to go do that and hopefully we can.
- [62:09]
B
Well, there's no doubt in my mind the reason was that Eddie Dickerson there at Spire, I know the reason they hired you because you elevate the team, you know, any corporation. Hey, Rodney, you know, you are going to make that team better because you've had so much success. And I think it's awesome that Spire hired you because that's the reason I hired you, because you're gonna, you're gonna elevate the team. Not just are you smart, but you know, everybody in the industry. And like you said, you're now. Did Chevrolet welcome you back with open arms? Do they still love you?
- [62:52]
C
Yeah, it's, it's pretty neat because, you know, Eric Warren pretty much runs everything over at Chevrolet now and he was the technical director at, at Evernham when I was there. So we worked side by side for a long time. A lot of the, the GM folks that are over there, a lot of them are from Waltrip, you know, Kenny Francis is there and we were best buddies. So it's been, it's been great, honestly. Like, I have a ton of people that, that work over there and it's been really good so far.
- [63:23]
B
That's awesome. Well, all right, there he is, everybody. Rodney Childers. He's going to win again. He gonna make. He's going to make Spire Motorsports and his driver, Justin Haley, gonna put him in Victor Lane. Rodney, thank you so much for being on Kenny Conversation.
- [63:43]
C
Yeah, thanks for having me. You know, I've always looked up to you and what you did in your racing career and obviously Rusty and Mike and you know, we get to race against Mike again here in the Daytona 500. So that'll be cool. But I've always loved keeping up with your podcasts and everything that you do, whether it's on TV or all kinds of things, you do a good job at it. So thanks for having me on and invite me to do this. It's been really good.
- [64:11]
B
Thank you, Rodney. And remember, everybody, the Kenny conversations are on YouTube and you can find it now on Dale Jr. S Dirty Mo Media on their podcast. So you can find this two ways right here on YouTube or over there with Dale Jr's Dirty Mo Media. Kenny Conversations now live on their podcast too. So two ways to listen to Rodney Childers until the next Kenny Conversation we'll see all next time.