← HerMoney with Jean Chatzky
HerMoney with Jean Chatzky
Ep 505: From Financially In the Dark to Fully In Control: Jen Hatmaker’s Wake-Up Call
00:40:14
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A
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C
And then there was this sense of, oh my gosh, not only am I pretty good at this and I'm pretty responsible and I'm diligent, but now I had this sense of safety like, oh, I'm in charge now of my financial future and I will never lie to me, I will never steal from me, I will never waste my own money, I will never have illicit spending. And I just felt that was one of my first moments of safety.
- [02:03]
D
Hey everyone. Welcome to Her Money. I'm Jean Chatzky and today we are going to talk about those big moments. The ones in life that just wake us up. You all know what I'm talking about. They are those points in life where everything changes. A job loss or becoming a parent or maybe it's the end of a marriage. For me, those of you who are regular listeners. You know, it was my 40th birthday, my 40th year, I lost my dad, I got divorced, I got fired and I turned 40. It was devastating. But I did eventually come out stronger and thankfully I knew a lot about my family's finances before going into this period. But a lot of women just don't. And in the midst of all that upheaval, they realize, oh my gosh, I still have to support my family. That's exactly where today's guest found herself. You all know Jen Hatmaker. She is a best selling author, a speaker, a podcast host. She is one of the most trusted, beloved voices in this country. When it comes to faith, reinvention, and women's lives. She's written four New York Times bestsellers, built a huge following, and now she is sharing her most personal story yet. Her new memoir, Awake, chronicles how she rebuilt her life after divorce and how, even as a successful independent woman, she realized she'd completely outsourced her finances. Back in just a second Feeling stuck with a bloated wireless bill? Then it's time to look at Mint Mobile and right now it is their best deal of the year. Year For a limited time, you can get three, six, or even 12 months of Mint's Unlimited Premium Wireless for just $15 a month. That's 50% off, and it's a really smart move if you're looking to cut back before the holidays. No contracts, no nonsense, just high speed data, unlimited talk and text, all on the nation's largest 5G network. Shop Mint Unlimited plans@mintmobile.com hermoney that's mintmobile.com hermoney Limited time offer Upfront payment of $45 for 3 months, $90 for 6 months, or $180 for 12 months Plan required equivalent to $15 a month Taxes and fees Extra initial plan Term only over 35 gigabytes May slow when network is busy. Capable device required Availability speed and coverage varies see mintmobile.com okay, I have to share this because when I find something that truly changes how I feel every day, I don't like keeping it to myself. I've been wearing skims for months now and their Fits Everybody collection. It's pretty life changing bras and underwear for me at least. They're usually about tolerating things more than enjoying them. I've spent years dealing with straps that dig, bands that roll, underwear that just doesn't stay put. But the Fits Everybody Collection feels like it was made for me. The full briefs are a game changer. Shop Skims Fits everybody collection@skims.com and after you place your order, be sure to let them know we sent you. Select podcast in the survey and select our show in the dropdown menu that follows. And if you're looking for the perfect gifts for everyone on your list, the Skims Holiday Shop is now open@skims.com Jen thank you so much for being here and having this conversation with me.
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C
I'm really so glad to be here. Jean. I have loved you and listened to you and learned from you as long as I can remember. I just you've been a real trusted voice in my ear and a lot of that instruction came to roost in my kind of the recent iteration of my life. So first of all, thank you for being such a wonderful guide to so many of us so consistently for so long. It has really mattered.
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D
Well, I so appreciate you saying that and I really appreciate the fact that you were out there and honest with this portion of your life because you didn't have to be. Well, I don't know. I think that so many of us who have been there, it takes some courage, especially when you're public, to talk about this. But also.
- [06:57]
Knowing how much you're helping other women get through it I think is really, really something. You found out, it's the beginning of the book, that your husband, who was also the pastor of the church that you started together, was cheating on you. And you, your first instinct was to go straight to an attorney, the first attorney that you'd ever talk to in your life. Take me back. Tell me, Tell us what happened.
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C
Isn't that so interesting? Especially since I kind of came out of a sort of a faith environment that would absolutely say, well, let's fix it, let's redeem it, let's, let's sort it out. And I would have said the same thing, to be honest, up until it happened to me. And then it's so interesting, it's so funny that you asked that particular question. Just this morning I was talking to my business team about some other stuff and I told them that they were saying something that was going on with Awake. And I was like that. If you remember, I told you guys that I had a knowing in my heart about some stuff that was going to go on with Awake. And I'm like, that's only really happened to me a few times in my life. And as I said that, I typed that this morning into my phone. I was thinking, what were the others? And one of them was the moment that you just described. And it's hard for me to explain what it was that I deeply knew in my body. I woke up and heard my husband at the time, voice texting his girlfriend in our bed. And we'd been married for 26 years. We had five kids. We have been sort of in public facing work our whole adult lives. And it was so strange. And I even write this in Awake. I instinctively knew.
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We cannot, will not and should not redeem this relationship. I just knew, I knew it. I knew that that was a dead end road. I knew that there was only misery along and at the end of it and for. I just trusted my own instincts. And the very next day I was sitting in an attorney's office. And of course, now, five years later, I can look back and go, that is literally, like, the best, worst thing that ever happened to me. Kind of like you mentioned in the Intro and your 40th where everything crumbled, and there's a moment where you're just like, everything's ruined. Like, it's just like scorched earth. And then we rebuild. It's like a miracle every time it happens. But it does happen.
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D
Part of the rebuilding process for you was rebuilding financially. You described this moment sitting down with a financial planner, realizing you don't know where things are or how much you're making or what your bills were or credit card balances were. How did you get there?
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C
Oh, my God. This is just so. This is one of the more humiliating inclusions in this memoir because not only is that foolish and irresponsible and even in my case, lazy and unfair, that's too much of a burden to put on one partner. But I have been leading women for 20 years. I have been out on Front street saying, this is how we have autonomy. This is how we are an empowered genre. This is sort of the way that we take back the story and reform the narrative. I mean, that's all been my deal for all these years. And then to have to go, I don't know how much money I make in a year. I don't know our passwords. And it's not because any of that was ever withheld from me. It wasn't like that sort of abusive situation. It was more like me going. Phoned it in.
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D
Well, to be. I mean, I. I honestly think that you're giving yourself a little bit of too hard of a time, honestly. I mean, you had five kids.
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C
Yeah.
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D
And you were working full time. Sure. And you. I mean, look, we all. We all make deals in our relationships where we divide and conquer on certain things and we abdicate on certain things. And I. I don't like people that have no information. But I also don't feel like. I think you're being a little bit rough on yourself. And you did take it back.
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C
There is a division of labor financially in most partnerships that can be, and often is appropriate, where one just is sort of the lead horse on that particular race and we sort of divvy out. And that. That is true and not entirely unreasonable. I found myself in a place, though, where I was so outside the conversation, having taken no interest in it, no responsibility for it that I had. I really did sit in front of a financial Planner for the first time in my life, going, I cannot answer any of your questions. I don't even know where to find the information.
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D
Were you afraid of it? The financial conversation? Were you bored by it? Was it just something that you felt like, it'll take care of itself? Like, why do you think you gave that over?
- [12:23]
C
Let's see. Let me try to give an honest answer. I think the truth of that is that my life in those family years was so overwhelming. Five kids, a million moving parts, a really big career that was demanding and taxing. It required travel, it required deadlines. And then I was running a household. And I honestly just think I was so stretched thin that this one category that I could hand to my partner was a relief, that I just. Because I was doing so much of the rest of the labor, the family labor, the invisible labor, the home labor, plus my job, which had kind of taken over in terms of, like, how much time and capacity it took in our partnership. And I was super trusting. So I was just like, there's no way that you would ever be irresponsible with this. There is no way that you would be careless or that you would be deceitful. And so I think I was just so glad to have something off my plate that we just sort of. We just divvied out this road and then just drove on it forever.
- [13:43]
D
Yeah, and you were earning like you were the breadwinner. But one of the things I thought was really interesting is that you wrote about how this was a symptom of purity culture, that it. It was a little bit rooted in. In submission. Religion. Yeah, this. It was a pattern of. Of learned helplessness. Do you see it associated with the culture of religion or the culture of the church?
- [14:13]
C
It's hard for me to make a giant, sweeping statement about that, since I have plenty of friends that came out of a similar environment who are very financially aware, involved, and responsible. But I can tell you, in my world, 100%. I grew up in a worldview that essentially said the men are in charge. They're in charge of the church, they're in charge of community. They're certainly in charge of the family head of the household, literally. And the wife was the support network. You know, we had our tasks. And so part and parcel of that division of labor that I absorbed in the atmosphere was that the men are in charge of the money, and they're the responsible ones. And that is such a big piece of the puzzle that we handed over to the guys. And so I don't know if it says black and white. As someone told me, this is not your business. Give it to your husband. But it was in the atmosphere of this sort of patriarchal system that I had opted into, in which I think I sort of did a little cutesy shoulder shrug. I don't know. I don't know what our electric bill is. I'm not sure where our retirements are.
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D
Boop.
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C
And actually, that's not funny at all. And it's not. That's not cute. And I learned the hard way in 90 days.
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D
I mean, because suddenly you were on this post divorce crash course with your planner. Walk us through what happened to you. I mean, what was it like diving in? Because I think that there are. I know that I have listeners who have not dived in, who have not really participated. And I don't think it's just the church. I mean, I'm Jewish and I have cousins whose mother said to them when they got marri, there is only one boss in this family and it is not you. Right, so. Which my mother fortunately never said. But I do think it's much more widespread than we thought. So what was it like to tackle it all having never done it before?
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C
It's so true. And by the way, I tell my community that too. I'm like, if you are even the happiest married girl that ever lived on earth, you should also be involved in your money, in your decisions, in your financial future. You should have every password, you should have every account. That's. This is not just a function of divorce, because also, as you, well, counsel us, disease, death, it happens indiscriminately. And so there are a million reasons why every single person should be just as involved in their money as their partner. But for me at the time, so all of a sudden, I am literally on my own. And listen, I got married when I was 19. Can you imagine? 19, like a teenage bride. So I had never spent even one adult minute independently, not one. And I was 46 years old. And so it was a crash course. And to your point, as you mentioned, I called a friend of mine who is a financial advisor, and I said, I know zero things. Tell me the first thing to do. And she was like, wow, you're a hard case. Why don't you come in? And to my boss, who's the lead of that financial firm, he's trustworthy. His name is Steve. He is good as gold. You can trust him with every penny you have ever made and will ever make. And so it was to Steve's office, I Drove my car, sat there without a clue, cried through the entire meeting, couldn't answer three straight questions. And he just sort of quietly shuts his laptop, realizing, oh, we're not going to get near as far as I thought I was going to. We were going to get here. And he said, all right, I'm going to give you a list. He's like, there's. Here's a list of things to do. Take the next 90 days and do all of this. And it was all discovery. Make a list of everything you owe, every account you have. Change your bank account to your. All that stuff that seems very obvious to you, but at the time it might as well have been.
- [18:31]
D
It's a really good list. Go through every bill, write down each one. Put every bill you're responsible for in your name. Open a new bank account. Set up auto bill drafts. Close every shared credit card. Refinance your home. That's a big one. That's a. That's like, not a step. That's like a month. Meet with your accountant on your tax history. Cancel frivolous subscriptions. Clean up your spending. Go on a spending cleanse. No unnecessary purchases for 3 whole months. I mean, that's. That is. Everybody should do that, whether or not you're divorced or what. Everybody should. Not the refinancing of the house, but besides that, everybody should do that 100%.
- [19:15]
C
This is why I went out to his parking lot and cried in my car when he gave me that list. I just thought I was so overwhelmed, and so I chipped away at it. That's how you do it. I chipped away at it one thing at a time. I called my bank, I made appointments, I went in and just. I made a long list and just started, like, pecking away bit by bit by bit. And it's so funny, Jean, because when I look back on that first year after divorce and I lost my marriage in July of 2020, so it was already the shittiest year that could have ever existed. We were already so just isolated and disconnected and afraid communally. And so that whole first year, until that next summer, which was so much rebuilding and recovery, this piece, this money piece is the piece I'm most proud of for sure. And I realize none of this is too hard for anyone, none of it. Even if it's overwhelming at first, we are absolutely smart and capable and able to. To get out in front of our own financial life, to be responsible and to plan for our future. I mean, so empowering.
- [20:34]
D
I'm so glad to hear you Say it wasn't so hard, because I totally agree with you. It's tedious. Like, there is. It is. It is. It is undoubtedly tedious. But. But there's nothing really all that. There's nothing really all that hard about it. Was there one point where you just felt like, okay, now I got this.
- [20:56]
C
Oh, my gosh, that's a great question. I do remember a real sense of triumph, of just absolute triumph when I got to the end of my house refi. And of course, you know this as well as anybody, but this was 2020/early 2021. So, of course, I lock in at 2.1 interest rate. It was the time, unbeknownst to me. I didn't do that on purpose, but I accidentally got to refinance my house when rates were at a historic low.
- [21:30]
D
Yeah.
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C
So I've got this 2.1% refinance at that point. I had also just handled so much of it. All my accounts were open, my taxes were caught up. I had my quarterly taxes on lock all the things that I didn't know before. And I just remember thinking, holy shit, I've done it. I've done it. And then there was this sense of, oh, my gosh, not only am I pretty good at this, and I'm pretty responsible and I'm diligent, but now I had this sense of safety, like, oh, I'm in charge now of my financial future, and I will never lie to me. I will never steal from me. I will never waste my own money. I will never have illicit spending. And I just felt that was one of my first moments of safety.
- [22:24]
D
It's so interesting that you glom onto that word, because for me, after my divorce, it was all about the safety. Right? It was all about. Because I'm like you. I'm a pretty good earner. But I was starting.
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Way back from where I thought I was gonna be because of all the expenses of the divorce and everything that had to be split. And I. But just seeing money flow into savings, visiting those savings, seeing that money add up, was just like, oh, my God, okay, I'm gonna be fine. What do you say to women who are not especially good earners at the point that they wake up?
- [23:08]
C
Mm. You're right. Because there was a privilege sort of baked into my story in that I had a career, and it was, by whatever measure, successful. And while my income is certainly fickle because it's tied to public opinion of me. If you want to read what I write, if you want to listen to my podcast, it's not like I'm providing incredible services that matter to like actual like nuts and bolts of living. But I can understand how the fear is more concrete if you have been a stay at home mom or if you've been a part time worker or you've earned differently or you've built into the family in different ways besides just financially. And so for that I say thank goodness for most states having decent divorce laws that women are entitled to 50% of everything they have helped create, whether they were the actual earners or not. But even then, what I have learned is that to whatever scale earning is possible. And I have seen too many women at this point in my community go back to work, go back to school, finish a degree, start something new. It's so possible for women to be reliable earners no matter what their work history is. I see it literally every day. And so there's so many ways to shore up your career path even here in the middle of life. And that to scale, women can do this. And women are highly responsible financially. I mean, of course the data supports this. If you look even globally at communities where women are empowered and educated and protected and particularly financially empowered, hell, the whole GDP of the country rises. Women are good with money. We are responsible. We are responsible leaders of our households. We have our eye on the future. We are careful. And so at this point, I have so much confidence in women in their capacity to earn, to save, and to be like fiscally responsible. There's nobody that could sit in front of me with any amount of tears and say they can't do it and I would not believe them. So it's just that first, oh boy, that first hump is so overwhelming. I have so much compassion for it. I laid awake many, many, many, many nights in my bed back here fretting and freaking out and afraid. I'm sure you did too. That feeling is so relatable.
- [25:49]
D
Oh, it's, it's overwhelming. But you're through it. And I, I want to learn more about the other aspects of your life that helped you get back on track. We're going to talk about your friends when we come back in just a second. The holidays are pretty wonderful, but they can also bring financial chaos. Between travel, gifts, hosting, and everything in between, it's way too easy to overspend without even realizing it. That's why my producer, Hailey has been loving Monarch. She's using it to track every gift, every dinner out, every flight. And seeing it all laid out in real time helped her pump the brakes before the Credit card bill hit if you want to keep your finances under control this holiday season, you need to be using Monarch, rated Wall Street Journal's Best Budgeting App of 2025. Monarch is the all in one personal finance tool that brings your entire financial life together in one clean interface on your laptop or your phone. And right now, just for our listeners, Monarch is offering 50% off your first year. Don't let financial opportunity slip through the cracks. Use code hermoney@monarch.com in your browser for half off your first year. That's 50% off your first year@monarch.com with code hermoney. You know, every once in a while, something comes along in the money world that really makes you stop and say, why hasn't banking always worked this way? That's how I feel when I look at what Chime is doing. They're changing the way that people bank. Really. This is fee free smarter banking that's actually built for you for what people want. Chime is not just smarter banking. It is the most rewarding way to bank. Join the millions who are already banking fee free today. It takes just a few minutes to sign up. Head to chime.comhermoney that's chime.comhermoney Chime is.
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- [28:13]
D
We are back with Jen Hapmaker, author of Awake. After your divorce, you said that one of the things that helped was your friends not letting you be alone for four solid weeks. You know, we're living through this epidemic of loneliness in this country. How did you rally your friends? Did you have to rally your friends? Did they just circle the wagons? And for people whose friends don't, how do you think we tell others what we need?
- [28:44]
C
My God, I actually have no imagination for where I would be today were it not for my friends. The whole book is actually a love letter to my people and the way that they loved me back to life. Nobody would leave me alone. And I've got I'm here in Austin, Texas and my parents live here, my three siblings and all their families, my five kids, who are mostly all young adults at this point. I have this crew and then it's my best friends that I've had forever, just forever and ever and ever. Long before there was like a ginhatmaker.com like they are unimpressed. Like these are my.
- [29:22]
D
Like those are the best friends.
- [29:24]
C
The best. Or like whatever it is that you're doing with your little life. They are just long time friends. And so I tell women that they're. They do not waste one millisecond when they are investing in their adult friendships. In fact, in my opinion, they are so important not just to our.
- [29:51]
Thriving, but literally our health and longevity. The data around this is unambiguous. I put adult friendships on the same level of priority as marriage and parenting. These are not optional. This is not like if I get the time or once my kids graduate or when my career settles down. Whatever you build in the light of day is what will be there for you in your dark night of the soul. And you will hit a dark night. And if you haven't already, just live longer. I mean, that is how it goes. And so we had spent millions of hours loving each other, investing in each other, taking trips with one another, late nights with one another. We've cried on all each other's laps. And so there it was, rock solid when I needed it. And by the way, you don't need 10 people. Nobody needs 10 people to come in and be their life support. One is enough. If one person loves you so much and you are safe and honest with them, and they with you, they are trustworthy and reliable, which means mostly all of us are gonna fail each other at one point or another. They are mostly trustworthy and reliable. That's enough. That is enough to see you through. And it can't be understated. It really can't.
- [31:15]
D
And yet you also found that you needed some time alone. You tell me about me camp, the time in Bar Harbor, Maine, and how you also found the value in that space.
- [31:31]
C
Yeah, I didn't write Awake. It's a memoir. And it's not written in chapters. It's just written in vignettes, like little scenes from my life. So some of them were in the small story of my divorce and recovery. And then some of the scenes were really spanning 45 years. And I wrote it in three sections. The end, the middle, and the beginning. So me camp was the first scene in the third section called the beginning. This was really the uptick in my story. But I literally kind of accidentally found myself in Bar Harbor, Maine for the month of July. So this is exactly one year after I found out that nothing about my life was true. And I was actually up there to be near a kid, one of my kids, who was fragile and at a camp for the summer. And I just felt like I needed to be close in case. And all of a sudden, for the first time in my whole life, I mean, this is. I was a person at the time who had never even been to a movie by myself. So this was a departure. And I'm traveling solo for four weeks, and it was like the light came on in the room and I realized, oh, my God, like, I can do. Not only can I do this, I love this. I am independent. I love my own company. I love being open to whoever I am meeting that day in that charming little Hallmark town that I found myself in on the ocean. It was so life changing. I called it me camp. I didn't mean to brand it. I just did it on the spot one day when I was on social media and it just became a thing. So that was 2021 me camp 2021. I have now done it for five summers. So every single July since, I have traveled solo to a little town somewhere that I've never been and just kept my little heart open to whatever came to me, whatever happened, whoever I met. And it's, it is my favorite thing. And so now it's so fun for me, of course, to watch women all over the United States do their own me camps. Even if it's two days, three days, like whatever version of it works in their life to go. Oh, my God. I, too, can go somewhere by myself and be incredible company and have this independence. It's dreamy, to be honest.
- [33:56]
D
Yeah, no, I totally agree. I get to travel for work. It's one of the things that I love. And I, I, I really value the time when it's just me. If all I want for dinner is a cup of tea and a bath, I can have it. And nobody is there to say no. We're not watching that Hallmark movie.
- [34:20]
C
Oh, my God, it's amazing. Listen, tell me about it. Like this little house. I'm in, my old little house. My house is 1908. It's just this little, tiny, little, adorable farmhouse. Everything in here is mine.
- [34:32]
D
Yeah.
- [34:33]
C
Every. Every wall is painted the color I want it to be painted. All my things are in their place. I do what I want, I cook what I want. I Watch what I want. It is that sense of independence and autonomy is hard to overstate. And I love it. I'm in a, like, deeply committed partnership, which is hilarious. I mean, what do I know? I hadn't had a first date since 1992. And people are always like, are you guys gonna get married? We're long distance. And I'm like, I don't know, maybe. But, like, for right now, this arrangement is so perfect. Like this beautiful reciprocal partnership across states. He's got his stuff, I've got my stuff. He's got his career, I've got my career. For right now, this is working.
- [35:24]
D
I wanted to spend a couple of minutes talking about the public fallout and how it's perhaps changed your relationship with spirituality. You had this loyal Christian following. Word gets out that you're getting divorced, you were attacked. First of all, I'm so sorry that happened. It's not fair. It's not.
- [35:49]
I mean, many days I just wish we could all get off the Internet. But in light of all of that, what is being a spiritual person today look like for you?
- [36:00]
C
Yeah, that's been a really interesting through line in Awake that so many readers are grabbing onto. And I've noticed that a lot of us can relate to that particular narrative, regardless of our. Our version of faith background. Like, you're Jewish. I grew up Southern Baptist, but all my Catholics, too. Like anybody who grew up in a spiritual environment that was somewhat high control, very like, kind of rules based.
- [36:31]
Can understand the evolution of that sort of faith system and environment and community. And so it's been interesting for me because I grew up as an absolute insider. My dad was a pastor. I got married at 19 to the very first ministry major that walked in front of me at my college. We were church planters. I was a pastor. And so, I mean, I was deep in the bag. I wasn't like an ancillary, you know, Christmas and Easter attender. And so it's been really interesting for me at this point. And my faith had already been deeply evolving before my divorce. Those were big seismic changes I had already gone through in the watching eye of the public to both good degree and hard. And I just realized that I was not.
- [37:27]
Nurtured spiritually in a church environment. And I never got to just be a person at my church. I was the pastor and the pastor's wife and the spiritual leader. So I didn't ever get the luxury of just going to church and being a person. And so I actually haven't been back to church in about five years. Since I lost my marriage. But for me, I see church and like organized religion as one road, but I see faith as a different road. Sometimes they intersect, but sometimes they don't. And so I feel like my faith story is still really beautiful and really gentle, really meaningful. And I don't know what to make of the organized religion side of it right now. I don't. I'm not there now. I don't find that a nurturing environment or one that I can manage without a lot of cognitive dissonance. I'm not saying that's my forever story. I don't know. I don't know yet. I'll. This is a great example, and I'll land it. Land the plane here. But I included this in a way. I read an interview once with a theologian. His name was Dr. Dallas Willard. Just a really beloved professor and just a gentle soul. And the interviewer asked him, if you could describe Jesus with one word only, what would you say? And he said, relaxed. And I remember thinking, what? Relaxed. I did not grow up with a relaxed God. My God was tight and arbitrary and punitive and watching. And I just had never heard anything so insane in my life. But I can tell you now, at this stage of my life, I feel like my relationship with God is relaxed and it's a nice place to be.
- [39:18]
D
Yeah, 100%. Last question for the woman who's listening right now, who's quietly struggling, who's maybe feeling like she is late to her own financial party. What do you say to her?
- [39:32]
C
Oh, my gosh, first of all, I wish I could just gather her in my arms and pet her hair and give her tea and cover her with a blanket. I know that fear. I know that sense of overwhelm. I can feel it in my bones, even as you ask the question that was recent history for me. And so I want her to know, first of all, she's certainly not alone. And no matter, to whatever degree she is outside of her own narrative, it's not too late. She's not incapable of doing this. She is not. She's absolutely capable of getting in front of this and wrangling it to the ground. And so I would just say, put your chips on you. You are smart. You are so able to do this. You are thoughtful, you're responsible, you're diligent. And this is just what I know of women. Also, there are so many helpers. Oh, my God, my help. My financial helpers came around me in a huddle, and I owe them so much. My banker, my cpa My bookkeeper, my financial planner, even my friends acted as a think tank for me when I would have to be like, can somebody explain to me what I do with property taxes? Like, there's so many people who are so good at this and willing to help and they actually love to do that. And so don't be too prideful. Ask for help onboard your folks, put your head down and do one at a time. You can do it, you can dig out. And then one day you will wake up and realize you know where every penny is, you know where every penny is going, you are safe, you are stable and you've done it.
- [41:17]
D
We will leave it right there. Jen, thank you so much for this whole conversation.
- [41:23]
C
I was so happy to meet you. Me too. Thank you so much for having me. Anytime you're ever in Austin, Texas, give me a call.
- [41:31]
D
I 100% will. Thank you so much. All right, see you soon. Bye. If you love today's episode, please take a moment to leave us a five star review on Apple Podcast. Your feedback means the world to me. And if you're ready to keep the Money conversation going, HerMoney has a three amazing programs designed to help you feel more confident and in control of your money. There's Finance Fix. It's our four week coaching program that helps you rethink your spending, find hidden savings, and make smarter choices for the future. Our pre retirement program runs for six weeks and walks you through building a retirement strategy that's personalized for your next chapter. Finally, there's Investing Fix, our investing club for women. It meets every other week on Zoom. It is a supportive space to learn, ask questions, grow your investing confidence and build your portfolio. And your first month is absolutely free. These programs are truly helping level the playing field for women financially. I'd love for you to join us. Her money is produced by Haley Pascalides and our music is provided by Video Helper. Thanks so much for listening and we'll talk soon.