Podcast Summary: Higher Learning with Van Lathan and Rachel Lindsay

Episode: Dr. Ilyasah Shabazz and the Legacy of Malcolm X
Release Date: December 26, 2025

Overview

In this special episode, hosts Van Lathan and Rachel Lindsay sit down with Dr. Ilyasah Shabazz—author, academic, and third daughter of Malcolm X and Betty Shabazz—to discuss the enduring legacy of Malcolm X, the significance of his autobiography (marking its 60th anniversary), and the personal and cultural forces that shaped both his activism and her own life. The discussion explores notions of Black identity, family, intergenerational trauma and resilience, historical misconceptions, the shaping of young minds, and the responsibility of preserving history and truth.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

The Enduring Importance of "The Autobiography of Malcolm X"

Timestamps: 01:29 – 02:48

• Van Lathan introduces Dr. Ilyasah Shabazz and stresses the lasting influence of The Autobiography of Malcolm X, asking why the book remains relevant today.
• Dr. Ilyasah Shabazz emphasizes that her father's legacy "helps to shape human possibility."

  “Every time I read [the autobiography], seems to highlight something that’s even more important than the last time… It’s important to know [our history] so that we know how to move forward with human possibility.” [02:48]

Understanding Malcolm X's Foundations and Misconceptions

Timestamps: 03:38 – 07:15

• Rachel Lindsay reflects on how the education system often pits Malcolm X and MLK Jr. against each other, and asks which parts of Malcolm X’s legacy endure and which are overlooked.
• Dr. Shabazz highlights the strong foundation Malcolm X received from his family and community, noting the influence of his parents and the Garvey movement:

  “There’s this misnomer that you go to jail, you miraculously walk out as Malcolm X, the icon, when the fact is that it’s the foundation... It negates the importance of family...the village that’s necessary to raise a child.” [06:57]

• She challenges the oversimplification of Malcolm’s transformation and stresses the role of upbringing and community in his development.

The Role of Betty Shabazz and the Strength of Black Women

Timestamps: 07:15 – 09:14

• Van and Rachel inquire about misconceptions surrounding Malcolm X’s family. Dr. Shabazz foregrounds her mother’s strength, resilience, and the values she imparted:

  “…She lived through her husband being surveilled, … witnessed the assassination … as a mother of four little girls and pregnant with twins … she never accepted ‘no’ or ‘I can’t’ as an answer for herself.” [07:25]

• She describes Betty Shabazz’s approach to motherhood and life as rooted in love and respect, never succumbing to victimhood.

On Anger, Loss, and Living in Love

Timestamps: 09:14 – 10:30

• The hosts ask whether Betty Shabazz was angry with America.
• Dr. Shabazz refutes the idea of anger as a driving force, instead sharing that her mother raised her daughters “in a bubble of love,” and framed the world as something both harsh and broader than the loving environment she created:

  “If anything, when you realize that the world is not like this bubble of love... that can be a bit challenging if you can’t put it in perspective.” [09:14]

Black Identity, Power, and Unity in 2025

Timestamps: 10:30 – 11:39

• Dr. Shabazz discusses shifts in Black self-concept, referencing recent events and evolving pride in Blackness:

  “Now that we are more enlightened... we make sure everyone understands that Black power is not exclusionary... It simply means we want to resume our place in the human family.” [10:48]

Living with Public Tragedy & the Meaning of Legacy

Timestamps: 11:39 – 14:35

• Van asks about the personal toll of Malcolm X’s assassination—how it feels for their family to have their tragedy become a public and political matter.
• Dr. Shabazz reflects on accepting history and choosing to focus on healing and correcting misinformation:

  “…You have to find a way to accept whatever has happened in history, right? … For me, it’s always been to address the inaccuracies, accuracies of my father’s life…” [12:48]

• She stresses the importance of preserving and documenting Malcolm X’s body of work for the benefit of future generations.

Carving Her Own Path While Guarding Her Father’s Legacy

Timestamps: 14:27 – 16:49

• Rachel asks how Dr. Shabazz balances honoring her father with forging her own identity.
• Dr. Shabazz highlights the role of self-love and empathy in her activism:

  “If I love me, it’s very easy for me to sit here and look at you two and love you. If I didn’t love me, I would have no desire to identify with you…” [14:35]

• She credits her upbringing for fostering knowledge about Black women, Islam, and the African diaspora.

Islam, Global Citizenship, and Cultural Fractures

Timestamps: 17:39 – 21:07

• Van shares how he learned about Islam through Malcolm X, and asks Dr. Shabazz to reflect on her family’s faith and its global implications, especially amidst Islamophobia.
• Dr. Shabazz links her father’s faith to a broader sense of human unity:

  “We believe in the oneness of God. Right. Hence, the oneness of man... it’s not this fractured kind of identity...” [19:33]

• She cautions against internal division, referencing the current debates between “Foundational Black Americans” and other diasporic groups, emphasizing unity over fragmentation.

Reclaiming Pre-Colonial Histories and Black Excellence

Timestamps: 21:07 – 23:12

• Dr. Shabazz discusses the untold histories of Black Americans before Columbus, noting her father’s scholarship and his emphasis on universal culture rooted in spirit, intellect, and scholarship:

  “We did have it in this country before Christopher Columbus...our culture was universal spirit and intellect. It’s worshiping a God and scholarship. Right. And so it’s a matter of reclaiming that kind of legacy…” [21:07]

The Power of Education and Shaping the Next Generation

Timestamps: 23:12 – 24:37

• The hosts note the continued relevance—and frustration—of reading “The Autobiography of Malcolm X” in 2025, affirming its vital importance for new generations.
• Dr. Shabazz closes by quoting Carter G. Woodson and the urgent need for young people to control their own narratives:

  “It was in the 1950s that Carter G. Woodson…said the biggest race is to see who will control the minds of young people. And so it is so important that young people are able to read this book and let it educate them…” [24:06]

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• "My father's legacy helps to shape human possibility." — Dr. Ilyasah Shabazz [02:48]
• “If we think that you can go to jail and miraculously walk out as an icon, then it negates the importance of family.” — Dr. Ilyasah Shabazz [06:57]
• “She [Betty Shabazz] never accepted ‘no’ or ‘I can’t’ as an answer for herself.” — Dr. Ilyasah Shabazz [07:25]
• “There’s plenty of land. There’s plenty of wealth. So to think that my mother was angry. I wouldn’t say she was angry at all, because she raised her six girls in a bubble of love…” — Dr. Ilyasah Shabazz [09:14]
• “Black power is not exclusionary. It simply means that we want to resume our place in the human family.” — Dr. Ilyasah Shabazz [10:48]
• “If I love me, it’s very easy for me to sit here and look at you two and love you. If I didn’t love me, I would have no desire to identify with you.” — Dr. Ilyasah Shabazz [14:35]
• “We believe in the oneness of God. Right. Hence, the oneness of man.” — Dr. Ilyasah Shabazz [19:33]
• “It’s so important that young people are able to read this book and let it educate them and give them a sense of a better sense of themselves and purpose…” — Dr. Ilyasah Shabazz [24:06]

Key Segments (with Timestamps)

• Importance of Malcolm X’s Autobiography – 01:29–02:48
• Enduring Legacy and Misconceptions – 03:38–07:15
• Strength of Betty Shabazz & Family – 07:15–09:14
• Notions of Anger and Living in Love – 09:14–10:30
• Black Identity and Unity – 10:30–11:39
• Public Grief & Safeguarding Legacy – 11:39–14:35
• Self-Love, Empathy, and Activism – 14:35–16:49
• Islam and Global Perspective – 17:39–21:07
• Reclaiming Pre-Colonial History – 21:07–23:12
• Controlling the Narrative for the Youth – 24:06

Conclusion

This episode is a rich reflection on the legacy of Malcolm X—not only as an icon of resistance and intellectual rigor but also as a product of strong family and community, and as a symbol of possibility for generations to come. Dr. Ilyasah Shabazz adds nuance and dimension to the well-known narrative, underscoring the importance of history, unity, spiritual foundation, and the urgent responsibility of empowering young people to author their own destinies. The conversation is filled with wisdom, candor, and hope, making it an essential listen for anyone interested in Black history, identity, and the ongoing fight for justice.