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- [00:01]
Narrator
Great books, great people, great ideas. Learning about these things is critical to being a well educated human being and we can help with the Hillsdale Dialogues. Each week Hillsdale College President Larry Arne joins radio veteran Hugh Hewitt to discuss topics of enduring relevance. And from time to time they also talk about current events, but always with an eye toward more fundamental truths. And they want you to tune in to a conversation like no other. The Hillsdale Dialogues are posted every Monday on the Hillsdale College Podcast Network at Paw podcast hillsdale.edu. that's podcast hillsdale edu or listen via Apple Podcasts, Spotify, YouTube or wherever you find your audio.
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Gwen Yarbrough
Welcome to The Hillsdale College K12 classical education podcast, bringing you insight into classical education and its unique emphasis on human
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Narrator
virtue and moral character, responsible citizenship, content,
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Gwen Yarbrough
rich curricula and teacher led classrooms.
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Narrator
Now your host, Scott Bertram.
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Scott Bertram
Thanks for listening. The Hillsdale College K12 Classical Education Podcast is part of the Hillsdale College Podcast Network. More episodes at podcast hillsdale.edu or wherever you get your audio. You also can find more information on topics and ideas discussed on this show and at our website, k12 hillsdale.edu.
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Interviewer
we're joined by Gwen Yarbrough. She is part of Hillsdale College's K12 education office and a former member of the Teacher Support Team. Gwen, thanks so much for joining us.
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Gwen Yarbrough
Thanks for having me.
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Interviewer
Talking today about the history of physical education in America. Why do we have this chat? Why is it important, worthwhile for educators to understand the history of physical education in America?
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Gwen Yarbrough
Well, there are a lot of traditions outside of just the American tradition of physical education. But it's our 250th anniversary of the signing of the Declaration, so it's great for us to think about what does this mean in our country? How far have we come? Where did we start in every aspect of K12 education. And this of course includes physical education, which is a co curricular class.
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Interviewer
What places, what people, what events would you highlight in an overview of Physical education in America?
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Gwen Yarbrough
If we were to keep it brief, I think we of course have to talk about the United States Military Academy at West Point. They obviously have a rich tradition of training cadets in physical activity, physical combat. So we think of Herman Kohler who established a system for physical training of cadets. So not just we think about the tradition of armies in general, the idea of a standing national army is actually not that old at this time. And so we're looking at how are they formalizing a means of training them and whether that's in engineering or mathematics. Additionally, Somebody had to start thinking about how do we train these people as a group. And then we can think about Charles Beck, who was the first physical education teacher here in America. Charles Foley founded the first college gymnasium at Harvard. And John Neal founded the first public gymnasium. These are all, what they have in common is they're all German Americans who immigrated and were all influenced by sort of the same school philosophy founded by Friedrich Ludwig, excuse me, Johann, of the German turn in movement. We can talk a little bit more about them. And then of course, after a time, we start to kind of professionalize being a physical education teacher. And so this starts with the North American Gymnastics Union and then also the foundation of the American association of the Advancement of Physical Education. And this all happens in the late 19th century. And then more recently, we think about the President's Council on Physical Fitness and the President's Fitness Test. All of this is like kind of in the front of our minds. President Trump just brought it back, had a big event at the White House and then just some of the more modern research based programs that a lot of teachers are probably familiar with. The Fitness Gram is one and Spark is another.
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Interviewer
We'll talk more specifically about, I think all of those things as we continue in the conversation. Let's start with West Point, though. Why is West Point important in the history of American physical education?
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Gwen Yarbrough
We get a lot of traditions from them. They have a long standing tradition of this indoor obstacle course. And it's in like the grotiest gymnasium in the oldest part of their campus. And it's this big 11 event test that cadets take at different times during the year. It's been featured on espn famously, you know, they're, they're going through this course with one of their correspondents and then the running back from the football team shows up and she says, like, oh, surely they don't make you do this. And he's like, no, I have to do this. You know, I have to do this every year and pass it like anybody else. And it's very physically intense. And they all come out and celebrate every cadet as they're accomplishing it. And it's this big rite of passage. And I think that the idea of having something physical that everyone has to do in a learning environment is definitely something that contributed to our current thought of what physical education should be or is in schools.
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Interviewer
Yeah. How did the military training influence the educational approaches to physical fitness?
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Gwen Yarbrough
We see it, it has a lot of influence up until like the late 19th century, traditionally that, I mean, they're doing combat here at the military academy and things like that. But even as we get into the German turn movement, their big emphasis is on gymnastics and fencing and combat in some form. And so it's always been part of it. And then over the years we've had sort of a softening, like maybe that's too strict an approach. Maybe we need the kids to just be having fun and then they'll wanna be physically fit. And so I think we could debate whether that's the right direction or not. But it is very much part of the tradition and it definitely bleeds into why we have it and in. In schools today.
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Interviewer
Let's talk about the German turn in movement. How or I guess, what is it? How did it help to shape American physical education? And why did those ideas begin to gain traction in the United States?
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Gwen Yarbrough
Sure. So the turn in movement, like I said, was started by a gentleman by the last name Johan. And he's actually responsible for all of the traditional events that we see in gymnastics now. So think of parallel bars, balance being the vaulting horse. And he kind of came up with this idea that really is rooted in Greek or ancient Athenian tradition that we need some sort of training in the gymnastics. So they. I don't for the audience, like, Germany does not become a unified country until, like 1871. And so in the 1840s, there were a lot of failed attempts at unifying, and they were fighting battles against the aristocracy. And his philosophy was just that the German people are too weak. They're not unified, but we're too weak. And so we need to strengthen their spirits, their souls, their bodies, and we'll be able to come together as a nation. But when many of these attempts failed, this group, the German turn ins in particular, were persecuted or kicked out of Germany. And they had to go somewhere. And so they all came, they immigrated to America. And so they started founding their gyms all over the country. The first turn in gymnasium was actually founded in Cincinnati, Ohio, which is relevant because the Cincinnati school district is actually the first school district in the country that mandates physical education in a school. And so they're definitely related to one another. And again, they start forming gyms and colleges. And like I mentioned at the beginning, sort of all of the firsts of American physical education. They're all related in that they're. They have descended from this line of thought. And these German Americans, all right, the
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Interviewer
association for the Advancement of Physical Education, the aape, how did that organization help then to change physical education?
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Gwen Yarbrough
So this organization did a lot to professionalize physical Education in schools. And at the same time we had the turn in college, the normal college of physical education. A lot of those graduates who were bought into this sort of militaristic style of physical education, they join this association for networking and all the same reasons people do today. But after a while as part of this association, different influences on the association kind of start to soften things like I mentioned. And I feel like he's, he's the boogeyman of classical education. But I tried so hard to find some other reason and it just kept cropping up that we can like directly relate this to John Dewey, his influence on education in general. Just this idea that it should be student centered, student focused. We should be, you know, we want them to be pursuing their interests and just kind of robs the, the spirit of physical education. This idea that a teacher would know how to train a child so that they can be physically fit and reap all the benefits of that. It just shifts and it becomes games and sports. And I mean, there's practical things too. Like there's a lot of injury associated with just doing the vault over and over again. Right. Parallel bars. Think of all the famous gymnasts that we know, they retire when they're like 20, you know, so it's not all bad, it's not all good. But it's just a fact that some of this idea of it being related to military training is removed. And it does happen as these turn ins start joining this association.
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Interviewer
So how did physical education then become a matter of public policy? When do government leaders begin viewing student fitness as some kind of national concern?
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Gwen Yarbrough
Right. It's actually very similar to why Mr. Johan started his program. It's. We had just a very high rate of draft rejections in World War II, and there were trends coming out of Europe that their children were more fit than ours. And, and so I suppose blanketed or couched on, you know, as national security, the presidents got involved and so they started a nationwide pilot of the presidential fit test and the program. So the program was started under Eisenhower and the test was started under President Johnson. And it was motivated. They, they wanted to just improve PE with hopes of improving national defense or just like the general organ, you know, the general improvement of youth in our country in general as compared to other countries. So again, a very nationalist idea.
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Interviewer
And then the President's council and you mentioned earlier there's some discussion about this recently because it's been returned. I recall when I was young President's counsel and it was President George H.W. bush that we all were trying to impress back then. So where does the President's Council start? And how does it evolve over time?
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Gwen Yarbrough
I think the simplest way to sort of paint a picture without too much editorializing is if you just look at the actual name of the council and how it evolved over time. So in 1956, it's the President's Council on Youth Fitness. 63, Council on Physical Fit, or so Physical Fitness. So, like, for everybody, 68, it's physical fitness and sports. 2010, fitness, sports and nutrition. And then in 2015, there's a collaboration between the President's Council and the Aspen Institute to come up with this big study pulling kids from every school, urban, rural, big, small, charter, private, religious. And ask them, why do you play sports? Right. If we're gonna have this emphasis on sports, why do you play them? And every kid, top category, top reason for every kid in any kind of school is that they wanna have fun.
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Interviewer
Fun.
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Gwen Yarbrough
So then we're like, oh, how do we make sports and all this more fun? Right. And then in 2018, they rename it Council on Sports, Fitness and Nutrition. So we just see a differing in the emphasis. You know, like, it's great that nutrition's involved. I mean, of course. Right. Like, anybody who's an athlete knows you can't outrun a bad diet. Right. But it's also interesting to note that they just keep taking on more and more.
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Interviewer
Right.
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Gwen Yarbrough
Aspects. And how many things can you. Can you do well? Right. I guess is the question.
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Interviewer
Yeah. What about, let's say, Fitness Gram Spark. These are things out there. What do they measure or promote?
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Gwen Yarbrough
Yeah. I think these are two great resources for all PE teachers. They're scientifically based, researched. They're communicating things about students, students, general fitness. And so that's related to the President's Fitness Test. I'm trying to think. As I was kind of researching this topic, I found a great article. The first time they were sort of launching the test, and they had pictures of all the kids doing the different movements or tests, and it says, join the President's Team. And there's this funny little blurb about, you know, this. This doesn't. This test equalizes everybody. It could be the. The shrimps and the runts beating the football hero and that kind of thing. But there's some truth to it that, like these tests. And I think that that is true of the test in the Fitness Gram, which is why we see it as a great test that good PE teachers are using in their classrooms. It's. It's just testing Functional fitness, things that kids need to be able to do. So it's just six tests. There's something testing their aerobic capacity. They're doing push ups, curl ups, different flexibility things, trunk lift. And they also measure bmi, which I know people have a lot of feelings about that, but if you're trying to just give a big, large group of kids very general idea of are you proportional? It's not the worst way to do it, but the test is great. And. And it does kind of remove this factor of athlete versus non athlete, if you will, if you believe there's such a thing, which I'm not sure I do, because everybody has a body. But then spark is just again, another. It's researched by the National Institute of Health. It is very much based in sound kinesiology. And it's just they have a lot of resources out there, too, and so they measure and promote. I think the best of what we're finding is, is a real indicator of whether a student is healthy in a good structured way to help train students to be physically fit.
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Interviewer
Talking with Gwen Yarbrough from the Hillsdale College K12 education office about the history of physical education in America. What does the classical tradition say about physical education? How should the schools think about this relationship between physical formation along with intellectual and moral formation?
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Gwen Yarbrough
Yeah, I. I just. Full disclosure, you're listening to Hillsville College podcast, and so we have to talk about Plato.
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Narrator
Sorry.
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Gwen Yarbrough
And we're going to talk about Aristotle, too. But this is. This is really where. Where our approach comes from. I think that this is true. You know, as people are trying to figure out, like, what is classical about, what is K12 doing? What is your curriculum? What's the program guide? It's certainly, we put a lot of effort into the curriculum that we recommend people are using, but it cannot be overstated. It's how you teach it or why you teach it. And so for PE, we are teaching it because Plato asserts beautifully in the Republic that students should first get an education in music. And he means anything inspired by the muses. And so if you know anything about Hillsdale or you've been to the new Core Virtues website, we emphasize a lot that great literature for very small children is forming their moral imagination. It's. It's rooted in this idea. We're helping them to think about the good and the true and to recognize beauty in that way. And then the next thing that he recommends in the Republic is that you're getting an education or formation in the. In the gymnasium. Right. And on Its face, right? If you haven't read it, you're thinking like, oh yes, we need to be physically fit. Our bodies and our souls okay, with music. But even shortly after making this assertion in the dialogue, he says that we're actually doing this for the same reason. It's forming their souls, it's helping them to gain self government. Dr. Leonard Sacks is someone that frequently guest features at different K12 events. And we lean into a lot of the books that he writes. And he has an essay called Evidence Based Parenting. And he asserts that the biggest indication of whether or not a child is going to be successful, it's not who their parents are, it's not their socioeconomic status, it is their ability to self govern that is going to make them successful. And so if we think about that, we want them to be physically trained to form their souls and we know that they need to be self governed. What better way to do that than in a physical setting, right? You're forcing kids to push themselves beyond what they thought they were able to accomplish, to be tired, to really test their virtue when they're exhausted. And Aristotle goes one step further and actually got this quote from an essay written by Veronica brooks for our K12 online courses. It's very beautiful. I just had to steal it. So thank you, Veronica. But she says the great minds of antiquity would have us wonder whether we can truly love what we do not know. Aristotle grounds genuine self love and self knowledge because he tells us to love oneself, to nourish the highest parts of oneself while taming and disciplining the lowest. So if we can present to them challenge, you know, physical challenge in physical education, they will gain a lot of self knowledge, right? Like you might think you're the fastest and you're not. You might think you're the strongest and you're not. And you can choose how you respond to that. Right? And so we're hopeful that in that self knowledge they can learn to train the weaker parts of themselves or at least just have an appreciation for. I think it's a beautiful thing when a kid can walk into a PE class and they don't have an A in math, they don't really know what's going on in physics, but they excel physically. Right? That's a win for that kid. But it's also a beautiful thing for the kid who for seven hours out of the school day is just crushing it in all their classes. They're the smartest, they always have the answer. They might know more than the teacher. It's good for them to go to PE and just appreciate that. Okay. I'm not the best at everything.
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Interviewer
Right.
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Gwen Yarbrough
And that's okay. And I'm okay. Right. So I think we're really training. Yeah. We're training them to have self government, which we all can appreciate helps them to be a more well rounded person. But I just think the challenge in PE is something people want to shy away from. And this doesn't mean we shouldn't play sports. They're fun. There should be sports in pe. American kids should be able to turn on the TV and watch baseball game and know what's going on. Right. That cultural literacy aspect.
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Interviewer
Right.
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Gwen Yarbrough
It's important. It's another way that we're, you know, transponding our culture to kids in a PE K12 setting. But there does need to be rigor. Kids need to feel challenged. Yeah.
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Interviewer
So generally, how are we doing? Are our students healthy and well?
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Gwen Yarbrough
Yeah, I think there's a lot of research out there that says they're not. Right. I mean, if think if you look at childhood obesity, you look at all these mental health things, and everybody's suing the social media companies. And again, without getting too big for my britches, I just think we can kind of step back and assess what's our goal here? I think a great PE program has a pretty clear mission that talks to or sings to their school's mission. And I just think there's no way, especially in a classical school, for your school to have a mission that says you're trying to train hearts and minds for a PE program to say our goal is for the kids to have a bunch of fun. I just, I don't. So. Yeah. So without getting too into the science or the whys or blaming it all on the teachers or, you know, whatever, we tend to see. I just think you can answer that question for yourself. Right. If you have a great mission statement for penalty and you have an understanding in classical education or the purpose of an education, you'll know if you're hitting the mark. Yeah.
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Interviewer
Gwen Yarbrough is with the Hillsdale College K12 Classical Education Office. Also a former teacher support team member as well, talking about the history of physical education in America. Gwen, thanks so much for joining us here on the Hillsdale College K12 Classical Education Podcast.
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Gwen Yarbrough
Thank you, Scott.
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Scott Bertram
I'm Scott Bertram. We invite you to like us on Facebook search for Hillsdale College K12 classical education. You also can follow us on Instagram hillsdalek12. That's hillsdalek12 on Instagram. Thank you for listening. To The Hillsdale College K12 classical education podcast, part of the Hillsdale College Podcast Podcast Network. More at Podcast Hillsdale Edu or wherever you get your audio.