Churchill’s My Early Life, Part One

Summary

Hillsdale Dialogues — Churchill’s My Early Life, Part One

Date: March 10, 2025
Host: Hugh Hewitt
Guest: Dr. Larry P. Arnn, President of Hillsdale College

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Overview

This episode launches a multi-part discussion series on My Early Life, Winston Churchill’s memoir recounting his first thirty years. Hugh Hewitt and Dr. Larry Arnn analyze the formative influences in Churchill’s upbringing, the political and familial context of his youth, and the early character traits and experiences that would later shape one of history’s most significant leaders. Central themes include Churchill’s family background, education, early military adventures, and the Victorian values and political world in which he came of age.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Context and Background of Churchill’s Early Life (01:12 – 04:29)

• Churchill’s Career Overview: Before delving into the book, Hewitt summarizes Churchill’s rapid ascent through various political and military roles — from a string of government ministerships to a wide-ranging military record.
• Churchill’s Versatility: Dr. Arnn notes the singularity of Churchill’s career path:

  “Churchill, we will learn in this book, had the gift of doing about what he wanted to, about all the time. … he went where there was action and advancement and he went fast.” (03:15)

2. Family Background: Lord Randolph and Jenny Churchill (03:56 – 06:02)

• Lord Randolph Churchill: A brilliant, ambitious Tory Democrat with a meteoric (but ultimately self-sabotaged) political career; architect of new Tory policies in the tradition of Disraeli; known for wit and an acerbic tongue.

• Jenny Churchill: From a wealthy American family, daughter of Leonard Jerome, known for beauty and social dynamism.

• Impact on Winston: Dr. Arnn clarifies both parents’ influences and explores their limitations in nurturing their son, including Lord Randolph’s neglectful tendencies.

  “The worst thing Lord Randolph did to Winston Churchill… Churchill writes him two plaintive letters saying, please, can you come and see me? And Churchill never got an answer to those letters, nor saw him, and that was not good.” (23:27)

3. Political Backdrop: Salisbury, Chamberlain, and Trade Politics (05:28 – 09:58)

• Lord Salisbury: The last real aristocrat to be Prime Minister, described as “stolid, implacable, large, and brooding over all of British politics for 25 years.” (05:28)
• Trade Debates: Discussion of free trade vs. protectionism (imperial free trade), and how these shaped party alliances and splits, including Joseph Chamberlain’s industrial union vision for the British Empire — “It actually was like the European Union… free trade among the members, tariffs on everybody else.” (08:44)
• Churchill’s Political Breaks: Churchill’s eventual split and realignment from Conservative to Liberal, then back again, reflect both inherited and opposed positions from his father’s generation.

4. Parliamentary Culture: Courtesy and Conflict (09:58 – 11:19)

• Parliamentary Decorum: Examples of mutual respect between political opponents (Gladstone’s compliment to Chamberlain), contrasted with contemporary politics’ loss of such traditions.
• On Churchill’s Career Risks:

  “Churchill, when Churchill left the conservatives in 1904, and then he did come back in 1924, there are conservatives who never lived to forgive him for that. But they were by and large courteous to him.” (10:46)

5. Churchill’s School Days and Reputation as a “Dunce” (14:25 – 16:55)

• Academic Struggles: Churchill’s own depiction (possibly overstated) of his poor performance at Harrow as part of his self-mythology — “He actually calls himself a dunce in this book, but he was not a dunce.” (15:08)
• Exceptional Memory: His feats in recitation at school, particularly of Macaulay’s “Horatius,” reveal extraordinary memory and mental discipline.

6. Early Military Ambitions and Training at Sandhurst (18:04 – 21:46)

• Military Training: Churchill’s lack of affinity for conventional education gave way to passion for the more physical and “real world” challenges at Sandhurst.
• Punctuality and Social Life: Amusing anecdote about Churchill’s lateness to a dinner with the Prince of Wales, and lessons in royal etiquette.
• Adventuresome Spirit:

  “[Churchill] rode horses and he shot stuff and wielded a saber and that's just the coolest thing in the world.” (21:08)

7. Churchill as Journalist and Subaltern (18:57 – 20:35)

• Simultaneous Careers: Churchill cultivated a public reputation by writing about wars he fought in — “He would resign his commission and then write a bunch of articles and then join back up. So you couldn't stop him.” (19:49)

8. Parental Shadows and Social Class Complexities (23:27 – 26:18)

• Lord Randolph’s Fallibility: Emphasized the “shadow” cast by a difficult, distant father, whose political stature didn’t translate to good parenting.
• Marlborough Lineage: Churchill’s noble ancestry, his lack of inheritance, and the economic realities of his upbringing.

9. Early Travel and Military Intelligence: Cuba Adventure (30:29 – 33:28)

• Cuban Campaign: Churchill’s resourcefulness and connections let him arrange to observe combat in Cuba at 21 — reportedly gathering intelligence for the British War Office, though this episode isn’t described in his memoir.
• Nontraditional Military Life: The flexibility and privilege of aristocratic military service — repeatedly obtaining permission for overseas adventure, which would be inconceivable in today’s armed forces.
• Humor and Humility:

  “I have never had a prejudice against fat men.” — Churchill’s quip about hiding behind a corpulent comrade during an attack (33:28)

10. Themes of Luck, Destiny, and Belief (37:56 – 39:02)

• Luck as a Motif: Churchill refers often to luck, viewing good and bad fortune as cyclical — “He believes in luck and he also believes it evens out.”
• Glimpses of Faith: Dr. Arnn asserts Churchill also believed in destiny and, particularly later, in God — “He did believe in God, too. … It’s not an orthodox account of God, but… he did believe in God very much.” (38:18, 38:54)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “Churchill, we will learn in this book, had the gift of doing about what he wanted to, about all the time.” — Dr. Arnn (03:15)
• “It actually was like the European Union... free trade among the members, tariffs on everybody else.” — Dr. Arnn on Chamberlain’s imperial policy (08:44)
• “Churchill called himself a dunce in this book, but he was not a dunce.” — Dr. Arnn (15:08)
• “Churchill had a tremendous memory.” — Dr. Arnn describing reciting Macaulay’s lines (16:55)
• “He would resign his commission and then write a bunch of articles and then join back up. So you couldn't stop him.” — Dr. Arnn (19:49)
• “One of the things that comes out in this book is that Churchill, in his military career up until 1900, is also a journalist. And he becomes the leading journalist and then best-selling authority on three wars.” — Dr. Arnn (18:57)
• “I have never had a prejudice against fat men.” — Quoting Churchill retelling a firefight in Cuba (33:28)
• “[Churchill] did believe in his destiny. He did believe in God, too.” — Dr. Arnn (38:18)

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Timestamps for Core Segments

• Churchill’s Career Overview: 01:12 – 04:29
• Family Background: 04:29 – 06:02
• Political Backdrop: 05:28 – 09:58
• Parliamentary Culture: 09:58 – 11:19
• School Days & “Dunce” Myth: 14:25 – 16:55
• Sandhurst & Military Training: 18:04 – 21:46
• Journalism and Subaltern: 18:57 – 20:35
• Parental Shadows & Social Class: 23:27 – 26:18
• Cuba and Early Intelligence Work: 30:29 – 33:28
• Themes of Luck and Destiny: 37:56 – 39:02

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Closing Thoughts

Churchill’s My Early Life emerges in this dialogue as a book of youthful adventure, familial tension, and self-mythology—but also as an inspiration for spirited young people. Hewitt and Arnn repeatedly urge listeners to read, not just listen to, the book, emphasizing that its humor, insight, and candor are best experienced firsthand. Dr. Arnn closes with Churchill’s advice that it’s never too early to seek greatness—urging young people to read Churchill’s memoir for both its wisdom and its exhilarating sense of possibility.

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Transcript

[Hillsdale College Announcer]

Read along with Hugh and Dr. Arne and enjoy Winston Churchill's My Early Life on a deeper level. Purchase your very own copy of My Early Life at the Hillsdale College Bookstore. Just visit Hillsdale. Edu Radio. Learn about the fascinating first 30 years in the life of one of the most provocative and compelling leaders of the 20th century, Winston Churchill, in My Early Life. Hillsdale Hillsdale. Edu Radio. That's Hillsdale. Edu Radio to buy your copy of My Early Life.

[Scott Bertram]

Every week, Hillsdale College President Larry Arne joins Hugh Hewitt to discuss great books, great men and great ideas. This is Hillsdale Dialogues, part of the Hillsdale College Podcast Network. More episodes at podcast hillsdale. Edu or wherever you find your audio.

[Hugh Hewitt]

Morning Glory and Evening Grace, America. I'm Hugh Hewitt and music means the Hilldale Dialogue is upon us. And finally, after many promises, Dr. Larry Arn is back and we're going to talk about a particular book, my Early Life by Winston Churchill. Now, I've been telling you to get it and read it, not to listen to it. It's a book to be read, not listened to. And Dr. Ahn, if you will indulge me, a quick recap for the listeners who came to us in the afternoons after I moved from the morning to the afternoon. Dr. Ahn and I have been covering the literary output of Winston Churchill, which is too much actually to cover. But we began with the River War, then we went to the World Crisis. We've done great contemporaries. Now we're at My Early Life, My Early Life, Winston Churchill, published in 1930. He was 54 years old at the time. He had just finished being Chancellor of the Exchequer. And before that, and I want to list this in reverse order, Churchill had already served in 1930 as Secretary of State for the Colony, Secretary of State for Air, Secretary of State for War, the Minister of Munitions, the Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster, which I'll leave to Dr. Arne to tell you what that is. First Lord of the Admiralty, Home Secretary, President of the Board of Trade, all those between 1908 and 1929. He was born in 1874. He was first elected to parliament in 1900. He served in the British army off and on from 1893 to 1924. His military units included the Force Queen's own Hussars, the 21st Lancers, something called the Malacan Field Force, which I'm not sure if that was just the Hussars or mixture, the South African Light Horse, the Queen's Own Oxfordshire Hussars, the Grenadier Guards, and The Royal Scots Fusiliers. Did I do that justice, Dr. Arn? In a minute.

[Dr. Larry Arne]

Yeah, that's about right. He skipped all over the place.

[Hugh Hewitt]

I did and.

[Dr. Larry Arne]

Yeah, well, he did too. That's, that's why it's such a miscellaneous Churchill, we will learn in this book, had the gift of doing about what he wanted to, about all the time. And so army regulations, whatever, you know, he just, he went where there was action and advancement and he went fast. And he was like, I, I've always been fond of our friend Tom Cotton because when Tom Cotton, after 9, 11, he decided to go risk his life because that was the honorable thing to do. That's what Churchill did too. And Tom was ambitious beyond that, but he wanted to prove something first, and that's what Churchill did.

[Hugh Hewitt]

Let me. I sent notes to you beforehand, dividing the book, the first two hours into eight segments. But before we even got there, I said, we have to give some background on Lord Randolph Churchill, on Winston Churchill's mother, Jenny, on Lord Salisbury and on Joseph Chamberlain. Four big hoops to jump through Dr. Arne, before we even get to his time as a young boy in school, which is not remarkable. How do you explain Lord Randolph Churchill and Jenny Churchill to people?

[Dr. Larry Arne]

Lord Randolph Churchill was an important man. He was a 19th century Tory Democrat in the tradition of Disraeli. He got himself. He was very, he was a brilliant talker, he was, he was funny, he was acerbic. And he got himself into a very high place at a young age. He did that in part by helping to break the Gladstone government over Irish home rule alongside Joseph Chamberlain, who was the father of the later Neville Chamberlain. And then he. And by his wit and strength in the Parliament, he became Chancellor of the Exchequer in the Conservative government that beat Gladstone. And then he resigned in the name of economy. He thought the budget was too fat and his career was over. He overestimated his strength and it finished him politically.

[Hugh Hewitt]

He went up against this man, Lord Salisbury. Now your good friend and my acquaintance, Lord Andrew Roberts, wrote a book about Lord Salisbury. I think it was his first book, which I just sent him a note two weeks ago. When are you ever going to put this on audio tape so I can listen to it when I'm out trundling and haven't heard back from him yet because I don't think there's much of a market for it. But Lord Salisbury is a formidable person, even in my early life. The book we're talking about, he's there, stolid, implacable, large, and brooding over all of British politics for 25 years.

[Dr. Larry Arne]

Yeah. And he's the last real aristocrat to be Prime Minister of England. And he was. The Salisbury family is very old. They go back to. They were important in Queen Elizabeth the first time. And Salisbury was a heck of a guy and a real live aristocrat. And he out dueled Lord Randolph Churchill extensively, decisively. And that was, you know, things were changing in Britain. There's a reason why, you know, hereditary peers stopped being prime minister of the country. And he, his nephew, Arthur Balfour, also very well born but without a hereditary title, was the last even close to that, right after Lord Salisbury. And Winston Churchill had fights with Arthur Belfer and then had a lifelong friendship with him. And Britain is changing, you know, it has changed, you know, alas, is not changing for the better right now. But. And Lord Randolph Churchill is a figure in that. He believes in free trade, which was a. And that the free trade and tariffs are different in England than here because the way they worked in England, they were much more political than an economic issue. They believed in the economics of free trade. But what happened was, until maybe two thirds of the way through the 19th century, the aristocracy controlled the House of Lords, which had real power and significant parts of the House of Commons. And the tariffs they imposed were on farm goods. And the aristocracy was a landed aristocracy, and that meant they got more money for their crops. And so it was a transfer of wealth from the poor to the rich or the middle class and poor to the rich. And so it was a big thing when Disraeli, a great man, turned the Tory Party against that. And Lord Randolph Churchill was the leader in that. And that's why one of the reasons he was called a Tory Democrat.

[Hugh Hewitt]

And then the last name that comes up in my early life that people won't know anything about, but Churchill assumes facts not in evidence. In the audience is Joe Chamberlain. Joe the older, the father of Joe and Neville Chamberlain the younger. And Joe Chamberlain basically invents the British Empire as a trade unit. It's somewhere between free trade and protectionism. Hard to explain to people. How do you explain it to people?

[Dr. Larry Arne]

Well, it actually was like the European Union.

[Hugh Hewitt]

Yes.

[Dr. Larry Arne]

Free trade.

[Hugh Hewitt]

Oh, that's brilliant.

[Dr. Larry Arne]

Among the members, tariffs on everybody else. And he believed that would unite the empire. And just as Joe Chamberlain left the Liberal Party of Gladstone in a protest against Irish Home rule, Winston Churchill left the Conservative Party to the Liberals over a protest about what they called imperial free trade, which was tariffs on everybody except the empire. And it's amazing because Churchill's father is the man who negotiated Joe Chamberlain and his friends coming over to the Conservatives. And then Churchill is the man who broke the Conservatives going to the Liberals in 1904.

[Hugh Hewitt]

But we do have to know Winston Churchill would re rat down the road.

[Dr. Larry Arne]

He did. Yeah. And also to add to the irony, Churchill's father and Joe Chamberlain were the key guys preventing Irish home rule. And later Churchill would negotiate Irish home rule.

[Hugh Hewitt]

So there is a passage, there's a passage in my early life where the old Gladstone listens to the young Chamberlain give his maiden speech and makes remarks which are unique to British politics on the floor of the House saying, that is a speech of which any father would be proud. I think I've got this right. Does he reduce Joe Chamberlain to cheers at that point, to tears?

[Dr. Larry Arne]

Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah, yeah. And that was, you know, Gladstone would also say, it seems in politics, as in horse racing, there's something to be.

[Hugh Hewitt]

Said for breeding, but it's so intimate. And it comes through again and again. People are ferocious enemy of each other on the floor of the House. And then they go out to dinner. We do not have that anymore.

[Dr. Larry Arne]

And they do the grand courtesies on the floor, like that one. There are many instances of that. Churchill, you know, Churchill, when Churchill left the conservatives in 1904, and then he did come back in 1924, there are conservatives who never lived to forgive him for that. But they were by and large courteous to him. I mean, they did try to destroy his career and did hamper it very much in 1915 when the Dardanelles broke and he lost his job.

[Hugh Hewitt]

But it stopped right there. He lost a job and a lot more. I'll be right back. The Hillsdale dialogue continues. All things Hillsdale at Hillsdale. Edu. I'm Hugh Hewitt. Come right back.

[Scott Bertram]

Hey there. It's Scott Bertram, host of the Radio Free Hillsdale Hour. Anniversaries play a key role in this week's episode. We start with Mark Moyer, William P. Harris, chair of military history at Hillsdale College.

[Dr. Larry Arne]

Football.

[Scott Bertram]

We discuss the legacy and the lessons learned from the Vietnam War 50 years after the fall of Saigon. Meanwhile, the Great Gatsby turns 100 this year. Benedict Whelan from our English department joins us to discuss the themes in that book. And Julianne Hillock, founding principal at Hojo Academy in New Mexico, talks to us about the unique challenges of running a school in a remote part of the country, plus being honored by the Hillsdale College Alumni Association. All that this week on the Radio Free Hillsdale Hour. Find it at Podcast Hillsdale. Edu or wherever you get your audio. On the new episode of the Larry Arn Show, Hillsdale College president Larry P. Arn sits down with pastor, professor and author Kevin DeYoung for a one on one conversation. When Jesus is ascending, about to ascend in Acts chapter one and the disciples ask him, is now now are you going to set up your kingdom? It's amazing. They are still confused. They still are thinking, might this be an earthly kingdom? In John's gospel, they want, they try to make him king by force. Some of his followers, they just can't get out of their head that when he talks about the kingdom, the only way they can conceive of power and true influence and might in the world is there's a king on a throne, in a palace, in a castle, in a temple somewhere. Listen to this exclusive interview with Kevin DeYoung right now, only available on the Larry Arn Show. Find it on the Hillsdale College Podcast Network at Podcast Hillsdale. Edu also at Apple podcasts Spotify and YouTube and subscribe to receive new episodes delivered right to your device. That's Podcast Hillsdale Edu.

[Hugh Hewitt]

Welcome back America. I'm Hugh Hewitt with Dr. Larry R. And all things Hillsdale at Hillsdale. Edu. You were saying, Dr. Arne, you know.

[Dr. Larry Arne]

We were talking last week about what changes might come in the Congress. They might become a legislative body again. And if they do, one sign of it, and it would be glorious, would be if the debates on the floor became interesting, meaningful and well attended.

[Hugh Hewitt]

Yeah. Okay, let me move on now. Dr. Arne, we could spend hours moving around, but I want to make sure people get my early life because I especially want, I don't know, it should have been read by young people forever. I'm reading it 69. I've never read it before and I wish it had said this before because I wouldn't felt so bad about my poor performance in physics. I got a Mercy D as a senior in high school. Winston Churchill was an awful student until he got to Sandhurst, which is the equivalent of college. It's West Point. I mean truly awful. As in his first school, second school, okay, Harrow, he never got out of the lowest form. I mean, he was bad.

[Dr. Larry Arne]

Well, we have to adjust a little about that because Churchill was actually a pretty good student. He wasn't a great student, but he exaggerates one of Churchill's arts. Churchill's telling a story about his life and some of the stories that he tells in this are brave things that left all the soldiers who saw them, just. Just breathless. Wow, look at that guy, you know? But he doesn't tell it like that. And it was a great thing. You know, Churchill is, you know, going into a House of Commons all his life, where just about everybody in the government has a degree from Oxford or Cambridge, and most of them Eden or Harrow. Churchill went to Harrow. He never went to college. And so it's part of the way he pictures himself that he was a dunce. He actually calls himself a dunce in this book, but he was not a dunce. That shining story that comes out in the book that one day it came to recitation of McCauley, and they have an arrestation contest, and you got rewards in the school, and lots of boys competed, and it was a great honor to do well. And Churchill upset the room by, I think it was 10,000 lines of Macaulay. And he started reciting, and it's that famous thing where Horatio at the gate, really beautiful thing. And he kept going. And people started. They became silent and started paying attention. And then one of the dons went over and picked up the book and started following along. And people looked at him and he nodded his head, yes, this is accurate. Churchill had a tremendous memory.

[Hugh Hewitt]

There's also. There's a sly little aside about how he would line up his toy soldiers. So I think it was Colonel Brabazon. Maybe it was Benden Blood, one of the guys who shows up later in his life as a real officer in his career, who surveys the young child. Churchill's array of his soldiers and pronounces them correct. Has to adjust the cavalry a little bit, but he must have had hundreds of them, right in the Napoleonic war formation.

[Dr. Larry Arne]

There's a kind of kid like this, and Churchill was extremely good at everything that captured his interest and nodded other things. And he didn't like school. The first school he went to was very bad, a boarding school, and they beat the boys, and it was boring and hard. And, you know, you have to learn. There's a school of thought in education that you. You're teaching them drudgery. And our way is different at Hillsdale. We think you have to suffer, but also you have to enjoy it.

[Hugh Hewitt]

And you have to read, read, read, read. That's what comes through here. The alarming thing about our National Report Card is that by the fourth grade, half of the kids can't read, and by the eighth grade, three quarters can't. And so we're not. You can't learn, teacher. We'll come back to that. I wanted to go to Sandhurst, which is a military academy, it's not a college, and this is high Victorian society. He's invited to dinner with the Prince of Wales, for goodness sake, and he's late. And I gather he has a lifetime punctuality problem of which I was not aware until I read this book. And I didn't know. The prejudice of the royal family in those days against sitting down 13 is well known. Well, no, it's not to us. But the Prince of Wales scolds him. Don't they teach you punctuality? My God, I was shriveled up and died, I think. Can you imagine anything that'd be like Trump singling you out at dinner?

[Dr. Larry Arne]

Yeah, well. Or it would be like Trump singled out. There'd be two Trumps in conversation. He was not, you know, Churchill was. One of the things that comes out in this book is that Churchill, in his military career up until 1900, is also a journalist. And he becomes the leading journalist and then best selling authority on three wars. And he's the second lieutenant and he's writing commentaries on the supreme commanders. And they don't like it.

[Hugh Hewitt]

You know, I finally looked up Subaltern because I've read Subaltern forever. It's any rank below captain, but usually meaning a second lieutenant. So it could include ensigns in the navy and first lieutenants to the extent they had them, but it's generally second lieutenant.

[Dr. Larry Arne]

Yeah. Not, you know, not enough to matter. And he kept writing anyway. He would resign his commission and then write a bunch of articles and then join back up. So you couldn't stop him, you know, when he was very young. You know, it might be true that Churchill is one of those boys that grew up a little slower than others. He lived in his own world. He had intense powers of concentration. He liked what he liked and not other stuff. And he was stubborn. But it's. He began to flourish. Oh, obviously flourish. When he got to Sandhurst, what were they doing?

[Hugh Hewitt]

I gotta tell you, Sandhurst chapter, when he. When he's in the recruits, the cavalry after you get out of Sandhurst, has to train with the recruits. And he strains his sartorius muscle, which I had to look up. It's the longest muscle, I think, in the NFL when you pull your groin, you pulled your sartorius. And he has to grip the horse with an injured muscle because he's with the recruits. And he falls off his horse again and again and the crews kind of laugh, but he gets back up. It is. It's a difficult Bit of training that.

[Dr. Larry Arne]

He goes through and he loved every minute of it. He, he, he, you know, because what's he doing? Churchill had a very high tolerance for pain. You know, he, he did brave things on the battlefield and wonders on the polo field when his shoulder was dislocated. But he, so he just. What did he do? He rode horses and he shot stuff and wielded a saber and that's just the coolest thing in the world. And he gives a lovely description of it in one of the most important chapters ever wrote is the one about his education in India after he's a soldier. But maybe we'll get to that.

[Hugh Hewitt]

That's in week three. That's in week three.

[Dr. Larry Arne]

That the way they looked on scholars, the soldiers, right, Was that, you know, in prosperous and highly educated and well born people is that we're out here doing stuff and it's the best thing in the world and we pity those poor people.

[Hugh Hewitt]

That's it. And he says he is for a hard life for a boy and he is for a rough life as a young man and he's for riding horses. My goodness. I've never been on a horse. I guess I've been on a horse once but it wasn't a real horse and I just. His life is remarkable. We'll come back to that. I'll tell you about the non real horse some other time. Don't go anywhere except to Hillsdale. Edu or hugh for hilltail.com I'll be right back with Dr. Arn on the Hugh Hewitt Show Show. Welcome back America. I'm Hugh Hewitt. The Hillsdale dialogue is underway. Hugh for hillsdale.com for all prior dialogues we're talking about Winston Churchill's My Early Life. That's the book you ought to be reading. I got to bring up his father if I could. Dr. Arn, I want to return to Lord Randolph Churchill and the shadow in this book. Now because of you, 30 years ago I read Churchill's book about Lord Randolph Churchill. So I've got a wrong view of Lord Randolph Churchill. He was a womanizer. I think he died of syphilis if I'm not mistaken. And erratic as could be. And his wife isn't exactly a saint either. It's not the greatest home life for Winston Churchill.

[Dr. Larry Arne]

Yeah, Churchill loved his parents. He writes in this book from afar. You know, I have harder views about that than some people like Martin Gilbert. The worst thing Lord Randolph did to Winston Churchill, of which I know is he's a famous man. It's in his prime. And Churchill is in school down in the south of England and dad comes to town and it's all over the place, the press, everybody, the school's talking about it. Lord Randolph's coming to town and Churchill writes him two plaintive letters saying, please, can you come and see me? And Churchill never got an answer to those letters, nor saw him, and that was not good. And Churchill's mother, after Randolph did die early perhaps of syphilis. Churchill's mother was. She's the daughter of a man named Leonard Jerome, who was one of the owners of the New York Times horse racing guy too. A rich man in New York. And she was a very beautiful woman and she got around some. And in her, after Lord Randolph died, they weren't rich, the Marlborough, so we didn't mention it, but Lord Randolph Churchill has that title because he's the younger son of the fifth, I think it was Duke of Marlborough, that means the great, great, great, great grandson of the first great Duke of Marlborough who won all those battles. And the Duke of Marlborough was not a rich duchy. They survived today, by the way, because the house that Queen Anne gave the first duke is one of the great houses in the world.

[Hugh Hewitt]

I love the fact my grandchildren, when they were stationed there, would go almost every week to Blenheim and we play at Blenheim every weekend. It's open to the public.

[Dr. Larry Arne]

I courted a young woman named Penelope.

[Hugh Hewitt]

In the grounds palace successfully, I should add.

[Dr. Larry Arne]

I did, yeah. And Churchill courted Clementine in the same place. Ah, I didn't know that at the time, but. And I didn't do it because Churchill did it. I did it because of Penny. But yeah, it, it's, you know, it's. First of all, it's, it's just outside Oxford and it's a magisterial place. Churchill happened to be born there. He never lived there. But his parents, his father was the son of the duke and because his father was the second son, he got a courtesy title. And then Churchill was his eldest son. But those courtesy titles don't pass. So Churchill never had a title. But although it's worth mentioning, at the end of his life, he was the first person outside the Royal family in 150 years to be offered a dukedom.

[Hugh Hewitt]

Can I ask you something? This is apropos.

[Dr. Larry Arne]

Yeah.

[Hugh Hewitt]

Keir Starmer is taking down his portrait and I'm just genuinely outraged at this because there's a slab in the floor of Westminster ordered by the Queen to be installed on the 25th anniversary of the Battle of Britain that simply says, remember Winston Churchill. And Keir Starmer is about not remembering Winston Churchill. I just view it as ungrateful to everything.

[Dr. Larry Arne]

Yeah. And, you know, one fears that they have lost themselves and it's, it's very bad. You know, they don't have any money. They keep expanding government expenditure. They're up against debt limits, as one day we may be, which heaven forfend if we don't get the expenses under control and they can't defend themselves and they beat their chest and talk about beating Russia in a war. And they're not serious. Bill Mayer said that, had a wonderful rant a few years ago where he said we're not a serious country. Well, they don't seem so to me.

[Hugh Hewitt]

And pause right there. They don't seem so to me either.

[Scott Bertram]

Hey there, it's Scott Bertram, host of the Radio Free Hillsdale Hour. Anniversary bursaries play a key role in this week's episode. We start with Mark Moyer, William P. Harris, chair of military history at Hillsdale College. We discuss the legacy and the lessons learned from the Vietnam War 50 years after the fall of Saigon. Meanwhile, the Great Gatsby turns 100 this year. Benedict Whelan from our English department joins us to discuss the themes in that book. And Julianne Hillock, founding principal at Hojo Academy in New Mexico, talks to us about the unique challenges of running a school in a remote part of the country, plus being honored by the Hillsdale College Alumni Association. All that this week on the Radio Free Hillsdale Hour. Find it at Podcast Hillsdale. Edu or wherever you get your audio. This show is a part of the Hillsdale College Podcast Network. If you like what you hear, please subscribe to your favorite. You'll get brand new episodes of all your favorite shows sent right to your device, and you'll help us know that you're out there listening. Never miss another episode by going to podcast.hillsdale.com edu subscribe. That's podcast Hillsdale. Edu subscribe or click the Follow or subscribe button on Apple podcasts, Spotify or YouTube.

[Hugh Hewitt]

Welcome back, America. I'm Hugh Hewitt with Dr. Larry Ahn, President of Hilltail College. All things Hillsdalesdale Edu. Just go check out the website or go to hugh4hillsdale.com you'll find lots of serious conversations with a lot of serious people. And now about serious people. They have serious people like Andrew Roberts and Douglas Murray and a lot of members of the house, but they are not serious right now. Keir Starmer was beating his Chest about getting up to 2.5% GDP. I don't know what they spent in World War II, but it was closer to 100% GDP, plus loans from America to beat Germany. I find historical disfigurement to be appalling when done from the front bench.

[Dr. Larry Arne]

Yeah, yeah, that's. You know, one should have, you know, like tearing down all these statues of Confederates in America. One should have respect. And we could take our cue about that. And Keir Starmer could take his cue. Hugh, about that. From the way the Civil War veterans were treated in the immediate aftermath of the Civil War by the Union and in Lincoln's second inaugural address and as.

[Hugh Hewitt]

Grant treated Lee at Appomattox. Dr. Oren, let's talk about Cuba. This young hussar gets some leave and jumps on a boat, goes to New York, and from New York goes off to Cuba. And I'm amazed by this because, A, he had arranged with the ambassador to do this, and the ambassador in Spain had given him a bunch of letters, and he's accepted by the generalissimo of the Spanish troops in Cuba. And he goes all over the island and he gets shot at repeatedly. And he's sleeping in hammocks, and it's just an amazing adventure. And he's 21.

[Dr. Larry Arne]

Yeah, yeah. There's an interesting story about that. I checked this morning. It's not in the official biography, but on a tour of people in London that I organized, and Martin Gilbert spoke at it. He told a story about that. That Churchill was actually deputed by the War Office to go gather intelligence and came back and gave him a report.

[Hugh Hewitt]

That's not in the book.

[Dr. Larry Arne]

Yeah, no, it's not. And Martin Gilbert had learned it later. And so I was. I was reminded that I need to write that up. And I looked this morning and couldn't find evidence of it. But I do have Martin Gilbert saying it, so it's very likely true.

[Hugh Hewitt]

And, well, they treated him as though he was that. I mean, they. They gave him the front row seat.

[Dr. Larry Arne]

Yeah. Want to get a sense of, you know, how the Spanish and the Cubans are fighting. And it's a little bit reminiscent of that scene in the Godfather where the Godfather, the. The Michael Cordoni decides the Cubans are going to win because they're prepared to die.

[Hugh Hewitt]

And it's reminiscent of the Guerreros against Wellington. And it's a little bit reminiscent of the Americans in Afghanistan because they'd send flying columns all over the place, but they never find the enemy because the enemy wasn't in the business. Of getting killed.

[Dr. Larry Arne]

Yeah, yeah. Well, they, it was, you know, that was. I think it's true. If you read that Sebastian Younger book called War, it's probable that we fought better in Afghanistan than anybody did, but we didn't win because it's a hard place to win. And that, no, if they had read Churchill's early book, the Malachan Field Force, which there's stuff in this book we're talking about, about that, you'd see that that's not an easy thing up there. And because the people, you know, live in these villages and make war on each other all the time and the villages are divided in these long valleys, you can't get over the mountains to the next one. And they're very insular people and they're very warlike people. And so how are you going to, you know, domesticate them?

[Hugh Hewitt]

There are many funny things in this book. I think the funniest is when they start shooting at the sleeping Spaniards of whom Churchill is canvassed and hammocked. And he's sleeping next to a fat man. And he pauses in an aside. I have never had a prejudice against fat man. I laugh because of course he was not gonna get shot if the fat man got shot. Right. He wanted to get down on the floor. So he admits to cowardice, but he also asserts his bravery, but then qualifies as braver because he's sitting next to the sergeant from Zorro.

[Dr. Larry Arne]

Yeah, yeah. That's so good. Yeah. See, Churchill was, for most of his life, Churchill was skinny as a rail. He was a little thing, you know, and he, you know, he bulked up there as he gained stature, but. And he was never a large man. You know, if you see pictures of him and Stalin and all the greats he was around, they're always taller than he was.

[Hugh Hewitt]

And so let me continue on. When he leaves Cuba, he goes back to his regiment and I want to emphasize this is going to happen again. This is not the British army that we are used to now. It's not the American army, it's an aristocrats army. So they let him do this and this will recur again and again and again.

[Dr. Larry Arne]

Yeah, he, he, you know, he, he gets in. His father was disappointed with him because he didn't make a good enough score to get into the infantry, which is cheaper. And you know, they were a family with extensive resources but very high expenses. And so Churchill lived, you know, from hand to mouth most of his life considered got rich after being rich enough after the Second World War, but not before. And so he's piecing it together and he just glories in it, especially at Sandhurst. That's just a hoot to him.

[Hugh Hewitt]

It is a very funny couple of chapters on Sandhurst. The book is great. My Early Life will continue for, I think, five more weeks on this, so go out and get it.

[Hillsdale College Announcer]

Read along with Hugh and Dr. Arne and enjoy Winston Churchill's My Early Life on a deeper level. Purchase your very own copy of My Early Life at the Hillsdale College Bookstore. Just visit Hillsdale. Edu Radio Learn about the fascinating first 30 years in the life of one of the most provocative and compelling leaders of the 20th century, Winston Churchill, in My Early Life, Hillsdale Edu Radio. That's Hillsdale. Edu Radio to buy your copy of My Early Life.

[Hugh Hewitt]

Welcome back, America. Hillsdale dialogue underway, and they're all [e-mail] we're reading my Early Life by Winston Churchill. There's a lot to cover in it. Dr. Ahn oh, the last part of this segment, the Entertainment Society. He and the Sanders boys think that the ladies ought to be able to mix with the bar crowd so they go down and he could have gotten in a lot of trouble. But he's doing hijinks. He's a young man with a uniform. He's doing hijinks.

[Dr. Larry Arne]

So his first political speech is, you know, these ladies were ladies of the evening, and his first political speech was in defense of, of them. And, you know, that's he's a young jock, you know, and he's a very interesting young jock. And he, he is becoming, you know, part of what explains his uneven it wasn't bad, but his uneven performance in school was that he was a very restless man. And when he was a young man, he was too young to really understand that about himself. But it starts coming out now because he loved the military, he loved training, but right away he's looking beyond it, too. His life proceeds from.

[Hugh Hewitt]

Let me spill it now. To luck. Part one, a very short segment here. Dr. He repairs occasionally, repeatedly, to luck. Very little about God, a lot about luck. And he believes in luck and he also believes it evens out. So if you have good luck, appreciate it. And when you have bad luck, remember your good luck. It's kind of a fatalist view of things.

[Dr. Larry Arne]

No, he believed in well, he came to believe he's already beginning to believe, you know, in these years. In this book from Cuba, he writes to his mother that God did not make a force like him merely to stop a bullet. He also writes nothing more exhilarating than to be fired upon without effect. Churchill believed in his destiny. He did believe in God, too. And there's a beautiful discussion of God in education at Bangalore. That chapter that's so important, that's in week three.

[Hugh Hewitt]

Yeah, that's in week three. This is week one.

[Dr. Larry Arne]

But, but he, he, it's not an orthodox account of God, but it's he, he did believe in God very much.

[Hugh Hewitt]

We will come back next week, America, because we got a lot more to cover and we're just getting out of Sandhurst and it's rollicking. Good doctor Arm. What age do you think young people ought to read this book?

[Dr. Larry Arne]

Well, Churchill gave advice about that. I think he was 27. Might not remember that. Right. When, when Napoleon took too long, launched his great career. And so if Churchill met a 25 year old or a 22 year old or a 26 year old, he'd say by, you know, in five years, Napoleon had taken too long. You've got five years. So you should read it early.

[Hugh Hewitt]

All right.

[Dr. Larry Arne]

It's a great guide to have be a spirited young person. We will be back next week and how more serious.

[Hugh Hewitt]

We will be back next week and we all want to be more serious and more spirited. Go get my early life. We got five more weeks of my early life. Don't miss any of it. All Hillsdale Dialogues at Hillsdale Edu or hugh for hillsdale.com thank you, Adam. Thank you, Harley. Thank you, Dwayne. Talk to Monday on the next Hugh Hewitt Show.

[Scott Bertram]

Thanks for listening to the Hillsdale Dialogues, part of the Hillsdale College Podcast Network. More episodes at Podcast Hillsdale Edu or wherever you find your audio. For more information about Hillsdale College, head to Hillsdale.

[Hugh Hewitt]

Eduardo, let.

[Dr. Larry Arne]

Me.