History Extra Podcast: "WW2's Tunisian Campaign: the Stalingrad of Africa"

Date: December 3, 2025
Host: Rob Attar
Guest: Military Historian Saul David

Episode Overview

In this episode, Rob Attar speaks with renowned military historian Saul David about the often-overlooked Tunisian campaign during World War II. Drawing from research in his new book, "Tunisgrad," Saul David explores why this critical North African campaign was, in his view, one of the three major turning points of the entire war—comparable in significance to Stalingrad. The conversation highlights strategic decisions, battlefield realities, collaboration between Allied forces, and why the campaign's legacy remains eclipsed by more famous confrontations in Europe and the Pacific.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Why is the Tunisian Campaign Underappreciated?

[02:49]

• Despite being contemporaneous with Stalingrad, the Tunisian campaign remains in the shadows.
• Saul David: "American historians still to this day argue that the North African campaign wasn't as necessary and as effective as the British promised it would be. My research and my belief is that actually it was much more effective."
  — [04:48]
• The campaign was seen as peripheral because it delayed the cross-Channel invasion, leading some to argue this prolonged Soviet dominance in post-war Europe—a view David disputes.

2. Origins and Geography of North African Combat

[05:46]

• The context reaches back to 1940 with Mussolini’s ambitions in North Africa.
• Saul David: "It's an opportunity for him to get some territorial additions to Italy. He's particularly keen on creating...a new Roman Empire in North Africa."
  — [06:08]
• Initial British victories (Operation Compass) almost forced Italy out but British overextension (supporting Greece) allowed the Axis, led by Rommel, to regain ground.

3. Strategic Importance of Tunisia

[10:22]

• Tunisia’s proximity to Sicily rendered it vital for Mediterranean control. Rather than risking direct landings in Tunisia, the Allies landed further west (Operation Torch) and anticipated a "race for Tunis" against the Axis.
• Saul David: "The thinking is if we land on French North Africa and we can persuade the French not to fight us, we can then get to Tunisia as quickly as possible..."
  — [10:44]

4. Operation Torch and Vichy France’s Role

[14:32]

• The Torch landings (November 8, 1942) were the largest amphibious assault so far, complicated by uncertainty about Vichy French resistance.
• Most Vichy troops initially fought the Allies; only after realizing their precarious position did Admiral Darlan agree to stop fighting—too late to prevent German reinforcements in Tunisia.
• Saul David: "There's a lot of fighting on the 8th and 9th, and then finally on the 10th... But by that point it's already too late because...the Germans...have already allowed Axis forces in."
  — [15:08]

5. Race to Tunis: Numbers and Initial Battles

[17:04]

• Both sides quickly funneled troops into Tunisia; initial Allied advances nearly reached Tunis but were checked by German counterattacks.
• The Axis held advantages in air superiority, elite units, and strategic high ground.
• Quote: "We took the hill three times, but the Germans took it four."—American infantryman on the battle for Longstop Hill [21:22]

6. Difficult Allied Cooperation: British, Americans & French

[23:34]

• Early U.S. and British collaboration was fraught with cultural and doctrinal friction.
• Saul David: "Eisenhower...is brilliant at handling people... if I hear any of you criticizing the British for being British, you're out of here immediately."
  — [24:20]
• Misgivings and inexperience led to missteps, but the joint command grew more cohesive over time, learning painful lessons through defeat and adaptation.

7. Axis Counteroffensives and the Battle for Kasserine Pass

[28:09]

• By early 1943, Axis (now under Kesselring, von Arnim, and Rommel) attempted to defeat Allied armies in detail. Coordination failures (notably, Rommel not given command over all armored forces) blunted Axis ambitions.
• The Kasserine Pass saw considerable Allied defeat—"the last great victory won by Rommel"—but lack of German coordination prevented a decisive Axis breakthrough.
• Rommel's final counterattack at Medenine in March 1943 was repulsed by Montgomery, effectively signaling the Axis’ doom in Tunisia.

8. Final Allied Victories and Tunisgrad

[34:00]

• After the link-up of British Eighth Army and Allied forces advancing from the west in April 1943, unified actions broke Axis resistance.
• The swift Allied advance (Operation Strike) led to the fall of Tunis (May 7, 1943) and surrender of over 250,000 Axis troops—surpassing Stalingrad in POWs.
• Saul David: "It's not just the number...it's the quality of those troops. These are veteran Panzer formations...These are really excellent troops. And they all go into the bag mainly because Hitler is too stubborn to get them out while he still has an opportunity."
  — [36:00]
• Losses forced Germany to draw air resources from elsewhere, helping set up D-Day’s eventual Allied air superiority.

9. Allied Commanders and Psychological Impact

[38:15]

• Tunisian campaign forged the Allied command structure critical for Sicily, Italy, and Normandy. Poor commanders (e.g., Fredendall) were replaced by more effective leaders (e.g., Patton).
• Saul David: "By the end of the Tunisian campaign, you've got together a team that is going to be the Western Allies' go-to group for the rest of the war."
  — [39:22]
• Morale soared for Allies, while Axis soldiers and leaders (notably Goebbels) compared the collapse to Stalingrad.

10. The Human and Tactical Experience

[39:47]

• Fighting in Tunisia was brutal: mountainous terrain, dreadful winter conditions, supply difficulties.
• Saul David: "For ordinary infantrymen and armor to fight in those conditions was a great proving ground for what they're going to have to do in northwest Europe."
  — [40:56]

11. Conduct on the Battlefield

[41:36]

• Combat was intense but generally more humane between the Western Allies and Germans than on the Eastern Front, with relatively few atrocities or mistreatment of POWs.
• Saul David: "Rommel and von Arnim...fought a much cleaner war...prisoners, they did treat their prisoners reasonably well..."
  — [42:49]

12. Reframing the Campaign in Historical Memory

[43:38]

• David argues the Tunisian campaign deserves recognition as the Western Front's true turning point—on par with Stalingrad in the east and Guadalcanal in the Pacific.
• Saul David: "What is the big turning point in Western Europe? In my view, it's the capture of North Africa. It's Tunisgrad...the beginning of the end for the Germans in Western Europe."
  — [45:02]

Notable Quotes

• "American historians still...argue that the North African campaign wasn't as necessary...In my belief, it was probably the most effective thing they could have done in 1942. It destroyed an awful lot of Axis power..." — Saul David [04:30]
• "We took the hill three times, but the Germans took it four." — American infantryman on Longstop Hill [21:22]
• "Eisenhower...is brilliant at handling people...If I hear any of you criticizing the British...you're out." — Saul David [24:20]
• "By the end of the Tunisian campaign, you've got together a team that is going to be the Western Allies' go-to group for the rest of the war..." — Saul David [39:22]
• "What is the big turning point in Western Europe? In my view, it's...Tunisgrad...the beginning of the end for the Germans in Western Europe." — Saul David [45:02]

Timestamps for Key Segments

• [02:49] Why the campaign is underappreciated
• [05:46] Background of North African fighting
• [10:22] Why Tunisia was strategically vital
• [14:32] Torch landings and Vichy France’s role
• [17:04] Early forces and Axis advantages
• [23:34] Allied command and cultural challenges
• [28:09] Axis counteroffensives & Kasserine Pass
• [34:00] Final Allied offensives and endgame
• [39:47] Life for ordinary soldiers
• [41:36] Conduct and treatment of POWs
• [43:38] Tunisian campaign’s place in history

Memorable Moments

• The vivid description of the chaotic "race for Tunis" and the knife-edge nature of early fighting.
• The honest acknowledgment of both Allied friction and learning curves—Patton's criticisms and Eisenhower's demand for unity.
• Comparison of the final Axis surrender in Tunisia to Stalingrad—not just in numbers, but in strategic impact and psychological blow.
• The assertion that Tunisgrad should be recognized as the Western theater's true turning point.

Conclusion

This episode delivers a comprehensive account of the Tunisian campaign's military, political, and human dimensions, challenging listeners to reconsider its significance in WWII history. Saul David advocates for its recognition as a key hinge moment—a "Stalingrad of Africa"—whose consequences rippled through the remainder of the conflict and shaped the future Allied victory in Europe.