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Zoot suits, mashers & New Romantics: the evolution of the dandy
00:29:08
Peter Andersson delves into various dandy subcultures that saw men dressing immaculately, from the early 19th century to the 1980s
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- [00:04]
Ellie Cawthorne
Welcome to the History Extra podcast. Fascinating historical conversations from the makers of BBC History Magazine. Zoot suiters, mods, mashers and sappers. Since the early 19th century, fashionable male subcultures have popped up across the globe. And in his new book, the Dandy A People's History of Sartorial Splendour, Peter Anderson examines how the idea of the dandy has evolved over time. Arguing that the idea of dressing well was not limited to the elites, I spoke to him to find out more about Britain's first male fashion icon and why wearing a baggy suit in the 1940s could have you mistaken for a rioter. Thank you so much for joining me on the podcast, Peter, to talk all about the history of dandyism. So for anyone who's not familiar with that term or maybe has heard it, but doesn't really know what we're talking about, what's your definition of a dandy?
- [01:07]
Peter Anderson
There is a common definition of the dandy, but I think I should say that in my book I have sort of my own definition of it because I write not about the type of dandies that most scholars have written about before. I write about ordinary men from the lower stratas of society who try to be dandies. They have been called different things in different decades, in different periods, but I think there is a running thread going through from the early 19th century up until at least the late 20th century. One of the things that I have as a sort of running thread is that they all wore suits, they all wore a sort of tie and so on. That's the sort of basic uniform of it. But then there are variations, of course, and these subcultures have been called dandies, but they had other terms applied to them which were more commonly used.
- [01:59]
Ellie Cawthorne
I think your point about this not just being an elite thing is really, really interesting. And you look at how ordinary men really put an effort into their appearance. Are there certain types of ordinary men that we see particularly interested in dandy subcultures? For example, you know, certain professions or age groups?
- [02:18]
Peter Anderson
The men that really, this book is about, the men that try to be dandies, they came from what you might sort of sloppily called the lower middle classes. They were a new group of society that emerged mainly in the 19th century that hadn't really existed before. Shop assistants, office clerks, apprentices, domestic servants. When we come into the 20th century, other conditions contribute. So a lot of younger people, they become more prosperous, and so they have a. Another possibility of acquiring clothes and so on. And of course, a new sort of media landscape also makes it possible for young people to know about trends in other countries or in other parts of the country and so on. So as we go further into the 20th century, the spread of trends and the spread of subcultures more over a wider area becomes more common.
- [03:15]
Ellie Cawthorne
And that spread of these ideas and these trends, are we talking just about Britain and Europe here or does it go beyond that?
- [03:23]
Peter Anderson
It is mainly focused on Western Europe and America because the type of men's fashion that have been connected to dandyism are of course Western male fashion. So the suit and tie and so on, and it originated in the Western world, so that's natural. But then of course, as you know, in an era of globalism and colonialism and so on, this Western male fashion has spread. So I mean, in the 19th century you can find portraits of New Zealand chiefs dressed in a black tie. So of course it becomes a global issue. But what I'm writing about are dandy subcultures. And I don't think you can find them completely all over the globe until maybe the late 20th century when it really is a global issue. But before that, it crops up here and there outside of the western world. But it starts as something quite westernized. Yeah.
- [04:20]
Ellie Cawthorne
And from the time of Beau Brummell, right until the 1960s, obviously those who took part in dandyism, they loved it. But what about everyone else? Was there much opposition to dandyism? What did people say about dandies?
- [04:34]
Peter Anderson
There was a lot of opposition to dandyism. And I think the main source material that I've used in this book is the criticism that was directed at these different dandy subcultures. And of course, I think a lot of the reasons why there was oppos towards them is because the members of these subcultures were men from the lower stratas of society. They were upstarts, lower middle class men who sort of created a certain social anxiety. Their sort of political orientation was unaccounted for. They were a bit sort of disreputable and also quite sort of rebellious and rioters and so on. So there was of course a lot of even criminality connected to these subcultures. So naturally there was a lot of opposition based on that.
- [05:24]
Ellie Cawthorne
And what about on gender terms as well? Did people think that this was, you know, unmanly to take such an interest in fashion? Or was that not part of the discourse?
- [05:35]
Peter Anderson
Yes, that's definitely part of the discourse because, I mean, a lot of these different dandy cultures were accused of feminacy and that's maybe one of the most sort of common things connected to dandyism across the ages. But strangely, when you look at these popular dandyisms that I focus on, you can see that they're also often very much very heterosexual subcultures. So a lot of these have a reputation as womanizers, like the mashers, for instance, who was a type of dandy in London in the 1880s. And they were known because they were connected to special types of theaters around London where there was a lot of ballet girls, so scantily clad women who were sort of dancing on the stage. And that was a new phenomenon. And these mashers, as they were called, they emerged as a sort of reaction to this. They were young men who couldn't really handle the fact that these women were there on the stage. These mashers, of course, had a very sort of scandalous reputation as womanizers. So there was a strange sort of contradiction which has been continuous in dandyism, really. I mean, a lot of dandyisms have been connected to homosexuality, of course, as well. So it is quite complicated.
- [06:57]
Ellie Cawthorne
I wonder if you could tell us a bit more about that.
- [07:00]
Peter Anderson
The first sort of dandy subculture that I write about, when the word dandy becomes common in 1818, really, in that year, there is at least one story about a sort of club of homosexual men, or a male brothel, really, that is being sort of exposed and raided by the police. And the men, the members of that are sort of described as dandies. So from the beginning, the connection with homosexuality and of course, the hostility towards homosexuality gets some of its sort of fuel from the hostility towards dandyism. But then, as we go on, I have a chapter about the transcendence transgender dandy in the interwar period in Paris and Berlin, especially, where it became common among trans men and lesbian women to dress in tuxedos or in other male accessories. So there was a sort of dandyism going on there that actually contributed to the history of popular dandyism. So it's not all about men in this book. We find women as well in this.
- [08:09]
Ellie Cawthorne
Yeah. Are there any other forgotten dandy subcultures that you recovered that you would mention?
- [08:16]
Peter Anderson
There are loads, really. And of course, there are the English ones, the British ones, that were very known to people at the time. And some of these terms that were applied to them maybe are used now and then still, like swell, for instance. The word dude was also used of a certain type of dandy on both sides of the Atlantic, really. But now, of course, that has different connotations. And it's interesting to note that even though many people say that dandyism and the dandy originated in British culture, quite soon or almost simultaneously, it starts to crop up on the continent, at least in Paris, where you have the so called calicos. So they're really all over Europe from the early parts of the 19th century onwards.
- [09:07]
Ellie Cawthorne
And is the idea that if you were part of this subculture, you were part of a lifestyle and maybe a social group as well? Or would you get kind of individuals who just decided that's the way they wanted to dress, but they just lived their lives as normal?
- [09:22]
Peter Anderson
The thing about these subcultures, and I mean I call them subcultures, all of these were collective phenomena. So it's not really about one man in a town dressing distinctively or dressing uniquely. It's about a trend that seems to sort of become common among young men at a certain time. And then it becomes the terms that applied to these men, like masher or swell or gent and so on. I don't think the members of these subcultures use them of themselves really. It's always the terms that are applied to them by their critics. And we don't know what they call them themselves, if they ever call them anything specific.
- [10:05]
Ellie Cawthorne
How did people who wanted to become a dandy Lear, what to wear, what was cool? How are these trends spread?
- [10:14]
Peter Anderson
The answer would be different depending on what decade you're in. I mean, if you're in the. In the 19th century, a young man moving to London to become a shop assistant or a draper's assistant or something like that, he would be joining various sort of social circles and attending the entertainment venues around his local area. And he would, he would start to see what men were wearing. I mean, it's basically similar today in a way, going to school or where you work and so on. You see what's the current trend and people start to follow that. But I suppose the development going on here is that as you move further and further into the modern era, you see the new media that exists. You know, eventually of course, film and radio and television and so on become more cooperative in this process. And Even in the 19th century you had popular prints and magazines and everything. So there were media in that era as well that could spread these trends outside of the sort of particular locality where they originated. But most definitely they are all collective phenomena and these cultures are all of them very much youth cultures.
- [11:33]
Ellie Cawthorne
That's interesting because there is a widespread myth or idea. I don't know what you want to call it that youth and the idea of being a teenager was invented in the 1960s, but you're saying that you can find youth trends a lot earlier than that?
- [11:48]
Peter Anderson
Oh, yes, absolutely. This is a common thing that even scholars still claim. I mean, in some ways, of course, the 1950s and 60s is an era where subcultures and youth cultures can become more globalized. There are new media that can spread trends in a way that couldn't be before. But most definitely there were youth cultures before that. Not least in the 19th century when you have urban culture and street life and entertainments and so on. And of course ready made clothing that made it possible to follow different trends and fashions. And I think, I mean this book is about the modern era, but I think you can find youth cultures further back than that in, you know, Shakespeare's London or medieval towns and so on. I think youth culture and subculture is often an urban phenomenon, but as long as there have been towns and cities, of course, I think, I think you can find these different types of collective youth cultures.
- [12:54]
C
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- [13:30]
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- [13:48]
Peter Anderson
Death is coming for our family.
- [13:50]
D
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- [14:00]
Ellie Cawthorne
I know you focus in your book not on kind of elite individuals, but ordinary people. But were there any characters that you uncovered that were particularly interesting or colorful or captured your imagination?
- [14:12]
Peter Anderson
I mean, quite often these men, as is most often about men, but they're often quite anonymous. But you can find them in little newspaper items about incidents that have happened. What is really interesting is when you can find letters to the editors of newspapers that have been written by members of these subcultures. So there is, for instance, a letter writer that I found that was a sort of self confessed masher. And he tries to defend this culture in a way that is very. It's very interesting to see how he phrases his defense and what he accuses the critics of and so on. So when you find that, it's like, ah, wow, for once we can hear them, hear them speak. But otherwise they're unfortunately very quiet, these men. So you can really, really only find them in texts that have been written about them, often quite mockingly, of course. But what stands out in the book are these different stories about various incidents that have occurred involving dandies in the sort of first throes of dandy culture in the 1810s, in the late 1810s, you can find a lot of stories about dandies who have really been sort of manhandled in the street and have been mocked and so on. Maybe they've been in a crowd and people have started to follow them and mock them and even sort of abuse them. There's one story about two dandies in Dublin who encounter what is called stout females. And these stout females, females proceed to tie their cravats together and then they throw snuff at their faces. To see them sort of bob their heads together as they sneeze, it's an amusing image. But of course, if this really happened, I mean, it's really cruel and it's horrible, of course, and it's strange to see this type of behavior continuing. Actually, you can find stories about zoot suiters in the 1940s who were also subjected to abuse and were followed around and so on. So the sort of provocations that dressing differently have created, that's really something that continues. And I suppose dressing extravagantly or differently today would also cause some reaction.
- [16:44]
Ellie Cawthorne
I wonder if I could take us to the 20th century to talk about one of these fashion trends, the zoot suit. Can you describe a zoot suit for us and what it meant in society to wear a zoot suit?
- [16:56]
Peter Anderson
The zoot suit was mainly defined by the jacket or the blazer, which was very large, it had wide shoulders and it was very long. It was supposed to reach to the knees. And there were other things as well. You could have a hat with a broad brim, special types of shoes and so on. But the jacket is the thing that sort of stands out and seems to have been the thing that was derided at the time as well. The zoot suits were connected to what was called the zoot suit riots, which happened across America in the 1940s during the war. And that was several clashes between these so called zoot suitors and American servicemen, American soldiers who were sort of provoked by the zoot suitors because they were seen as people who didn't want to join the war effort. They wore clothes that were waist full of fabric, which was something that you shouldn't be during the war. And of course there was also underlying racism behind this because the zoot sutters were connected to different minorities in America, particularly black Americans and Mexican Americans. But that's not really true. I mean, there were a lot of white zoot suitors as well. So. But, but when these riots occurred and, and became big news, that's the sort of story that was told about them.
- [18:24]
Ellie Cawthorne
And something else you look at in the book is black dandyism. Can us more about that?
- [18:28]
Peter Anderson
Absolutely. Black dandyism has a long history as other historians have also recorded. And I try to find these black dandies among the populace. And especially in america in the 19th century, you can find all sorts of stories about freed slaves who were described as dandies and who were sort of joined in this quite large subculture of dandyism among African Americans. So, and that's of course a very important part of the history of dandyism because it contributed very much to the history of the black population both in America and in Africa. And there are even stories from the United States in the middle of the 19th century where you have these black dandies, they take a seat in a streetcar or in a train compartment and they're told to move and they refuse to move and cause a sensation and so on. So this is 100 years before Rosa Parks on the bus. But it's still the same behavior, even though it's not as, perhaps as consciously riotous behavior at that. But still it is a form of opposition which is very important to research.
- [19:49]
Ellie Cawthorne
Does it point to something that dandyism has often been seen as countercultural and alternative? Is that a fair characterization of it?
- [19:59]
Peter Anderson
I think that's fair because at least the cultures that I write about in this book are countercultural. They are sort of provocative, disruptive, they try to deviate from the norms of the older generations and so on. Sometimes these dandy cultures were accused of sort of trying to ape the aristocracy, trying to imitate the style of people higher up the social scale. But I'm not sure that's the case. I mean, it might be true in some cases, but most often these young men, they knew that they were dressing differently from lords and other aristocratic men. I mean, some of these fashions are quite extreme. There were Masher cultures in the 1890s whose fashion was defined by a very small bowler hat, wide plaid trousers, pointed yellow shoes, a short, thick walking stick. I mean, these are very extreme things. And quite naturally they weren't trying to imitate the aristocracy or anything like that. They had their own subculture and their own fashions that they liked.
- [21:12]
Ellie Cawthorne
Those extreme fashions are really interesting. Are there any others that you'd highlight as particularly striking or unusual that we haven't mentioned yet?
- [21:21]
Peter Anderson
Well, I mean, the zoot suits are of course very extreme. And what I didn't see is that the zoot suit fashion did spread almost globally. I mean, there were a lot of zoot suit similar subcultures across Europe and even in Africa and so on. I follow these cultures all the way up until the 1980s when I write about the New Romantics. And that's also of course, a subculture that was extreme in a way. It wasn't a subculture that was as tied to the suit as these previous forms. You could dress up like a pirate or whatever really in that subculture. But still there was a certain connection going even far back to the early 19th century. But of course that's also a subculture that could be very extreme in a.
- [22:10]
Ellie Cawthorne
Way, and I'm sure some listeners will remember that. Or we might have some former New Romantics listening now. But if we are to map these changing fashion Trends from the 19th century right through to the New Romantics, what do you think it can tell us about masculinity over that time and changing ideas about masculinity?
- [22:30]
Peter Anderson
Well, that's a good question. I think what I touched on earlier, the sort of contradiction between womanizing being a very sort of heterosexual dandy, and the connection of dandyism to effeminacy or even homosexuality, that's something that is still around, I think. But also this is connected to the old sort of view that, you know, men are not supposed to be interested in how they dress, they're not supposed to be interested in fashion. And if they are, they're a bit effeminate and suspicious and so on. And that's very strange that this thing has stuck because even as far back as the 19th century, there were dandy cultures connected to gangsters and criminality. So quite obviously there was a lot of masculinity in these cultures as well. So it's strange really that this contradiction is still around. But I think that something has happened. And I think what has happened really, when you look at the long time perspective here, is that in the 19th century, the sort of male ideal was something quite high up on the social scale. You looked upwards to the elite. And then slowly, as we go into the 20th century, this starts to change. And popular culture and other things contribute to establishing an ideal that comes very much from the working class, from the lower class. So, I mean, in the late 20th century or even today, the trends are not made really by aristocrats or royalty or whatever, but they're made by celebrities who have a sort of assumed working class style, really. So I think that's a big change that has occurred during this time period.
- [24:16]
Ellie Cawthorne
And if we think about today, do you think that there are any inheritors of dandyism today?
- [24:24]
Peter Anderson
Well, I have a sort of thesis in the book that this type of dandyism that I write about, popular dandyism, it really reaches a sort of end at the. At the end of the 20th century, because I couldn't really find any subcultures in the 1990s or early 20th, 1st century that that corresponded to, say, the New Romantics or the Teddy Boys or the zoot suits. But I think what's happened is that there has been some sort of globalization, so there isn't really a sort of local subculture in London or anything like that. And then, of course, I have a theory in the end of the book that maybe the hipster is the new dandy, and maybe hipsterism is in some ways the heir of what was called dandyism earlier.
- [25:11]
Ellie Cawthorne
Finally, Peter, if we throw, you know, all the societal stuff out the window for a moment and just focus on personal taste and fashion taste, who do you think of all these subcultures looked amazing? Who do you think? Yeah, they really nailed it with the fashion there.
- [25:28]
Peter Anderson
Oh, that's a very good question. I'm very fond of the Congolese Sapper culture, which I have a chapter about, and they become quite famous, even though they had their sort of heyday in the 1980s and 90s. And these were men in both Congos, both Brazzaville and Kinshasa, who had a very distinct dandy fashion. And what I like about them is that they're so colorful. They can wear pink suits, very colorful ties, bow ties, hats, buttonholes, anything like that. And I like a bit of color, so that's probably the one I would choose.
- [26:10]
Ellie Cawthorne
That was historian and writer Peter Anderson speaking to me. Ellie Cawthorne. Peter's book is called the Dandy A People's History of Sartorial Splendor.