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You're listening ad free on Amazon Music. Here I stay with my loneliness.
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Hey everybody, this is Chris Mullanfi, host of Hit Parade, Slate's podcast of pop chart history. Welcome to the Bridge.
A
And in a while I will see my true love smile she may come.
B
I know not when the that's the bridge of the song A World Without Love by Peter and Gordon, a number one hit from the summer of 1964 and the first of three hits written by John Lennon or Paul McCartney that topped Billboard's Hot 100 and were not Beatles recordings. As we told you in last month's hit parade, Paul McCartney had to write this bridge to finish A World Without Love, which he then bequeathed to his 19 year old housemate, Peter Asher of Peter and Gordon. As Paul knew, a well structured pop hit needs a bridge. And these mini episodes Bridge are full length monthly episodes. Give us a chance to catch up with listeners and enjoy some Hit Parade trivia. This month I'm delighted to welcome a special guest to help me take it to the Bridge. Tom Bryan is a senior editor at Stereogum who has also written for the A.V. club and the Ringer, among many places. For the last year and a half, Tom has been in the middle of an enormous stereo gum blogging project that is near and dear to my heart. The number ones, a column reviewing every number one single on the Hot 100 starting in 1958 and working its way up to the present day. We'll talk about a couple of those chart toppers today. First, Tom, welcome to the Bridge.
C
Hey Chris, thanks so much for having me.
B
Thank you for joining us.
A
Thanks.
B
When I meet a fellow chart fan, I often start at the beginning and ask what got you into Billboard chart following? When did it start for you?
C
Well, when I was 9 or about to turn 9. My family moved to London for a year. We were in Baltimore. My dad's a history professor and he took a sabbatical. But in England they had Top of the Pops.
A
Hello.
C
Hi.
A
Welcome to Top of the Pops.
B
Sure.
C
Which made chart following extremely fun and extremely EAS and kind of became baseball to me when I couldn't watch baseball anymore. But the whole idea to write this column that I'm writing, it comes from a guy named Tom Ewing who has been in England writing a similar column for years, more than a decade, I think. And you know, it's not his job the way it is mine, so he does it slowly. But Tom writes popular, which is what he calls his column, and it's every British number one single reviewed and that's just been awesome. It's been a really fun project to follow. And reading that column and also reading your column and thinking about the sort of like the romance of the number one single. You know, what it takes to be the number one song in America at any one given moment. The sort of weird confluence of fortunes and accidents that has to happen. It's fun to think about. I think I really started thinking seriously about it when Cardi B's Bodak Yellow hit number one. And what a cool, fun story that was.
A
You can f with me if you wanted to.
B
These expensive.
A
These is red bottoms, these is bloody shoes.
C
But it turns out they're all cool, fun stories.
B
They really are. I mean, it's always so serendipitous. And it gives me plenty of fodder for Hit parade and Cardi B's Bodak Yellow, her first number one hit that went to number one in late 2017. And you started the number ones in early 2018. Right. And kicked it right off in 1958. What was the first one that you wrote about?
C
The first? Well, it was the first Billboard number one singles when they started the Hot 100. That was poor Little fool by Ricky Nelson.
B
Sure.
A
I used to play around with parts hasten at my call.
C
I didn't give it a good review. I probably would have gone higher on it now.
B
Really? Okay, so that's interesting to know that you actually change your opinion. And I know my opinion on several songs has changed over the years, so I completely respect that. So let's talk about two that are kind of up the middle. And this will be my way of recapping our July full length episode of Hit Parade, which was about these three John Lennon, Paul McCartney written, but not Beatles number one hits. Now you're up to 1975, which means you've actually gotten through two of the three songs I covered in that episode. You got through Peter and Gordon's A World Without Love. And you've gotten through because you're now up to 1975. You've just gotten through Elton John's cover, Lucy in the Sky With Diamonds. And I think your ratings pretty much matched my own. But maybe you could tell me what you thought of each of those songs.
C
Sure. Peter and Gordon's World Without Love. Pretty nice little song. I gave it a six out of ten. It's John Lennon's assessment that it was not fit to be a Beatles song. Not wrong, you know. Yeah, it's definitely one of the lesser Beatles related number ones that the came up in 1964, but it's not bad. It's a solid jam.
B
Yeah, I basically agree. And as I indicated in the episode, there's no way A World Without Love goes to number one unless Peter and Gordon just had not captured that lightning in a bottle of having possession of a Lennon McCartney song at this moment, when the Beatles themselves had no to be crass for a moment product in the pipeline. And so this song just absolutely filled a market gap. But it's a charming record. There's nothing.
C
No, no, nothing wrong. But they really did hit the lottery with it.
B
They really did. And then, of course, Elton's cover. You know, I pulled my punches a little bit when I talked about Lucy and the sky with Diamonds in the episode. I was a little harsher when I originally did this as an article for Slate four years ago. I don't despise the song by any means. I don't even hate it. I just. I think it's easily the least of his number one hits. I think I can say that categorically. I think even Island Girl is a better number one hit by Elton John than this one is. What did you think of Lucy in the sky with Diamonds?
C
I'm not quite sure yet how it holds up against Island Girl. I think I write about that one next week, so I'll have to dig deeper on it, but I don't.
B
Just working your way through it.
C
Yeah, yeah, I'm getting to it. I don't like his version of Lucy and the sky with Diamonds. It's. Obviously the original song itself is great. He had great material to work with, but his cover is kind of everything I. I don't like about Elton John all sort of rolled into one. It's just pure shtick. Doesn't need to exist. It's. It's this big, hammy Vegas performance. And it really adds nothing to it. And as you said in your episode, it kind of exists just as a flex just to say, hey, look, I can do this. So I'm going to do that. Here's John Lennon right here. He's doing it with me. I have his blessing. And yeah, it's just. It takes up space. And it's part of a weird trend that I noticed in reviewing the number one singles of 1975. Because these narratives start to emerge when you start to look at them one by one. There were a lot of covers of 60s songs that went to number one in 1975. There were like five of them.
B
That's a good point. I had not. That had never occurred to Me like, what else? We've got the Carpenter's cover of please Mr. Postman that year. Right.
D
Minute.
A
Mr. Postman.
C
Yeah, that was one of them. There's you're no Good by Linda Rod. That was a trend that was happening. And it was happening at the same time as guys like Frankie Valli and Neil Sadaka were reemerging these sort of pre Beatles figures.
A
My eyes have touched you Though I never laid a hand on you My eyes.
C
So I think that this is a sort of a product of a moment where there was a ton of early 60s and, you know, 50s rock and roll nostalgia happening.
B
Yeah. The only caveat being in Elton's case, he only reached back to 1967, whereas most of that nostalgia in the mid 75 was on the usual 20 year cycle. And it was all reaching back to, you know, like Greece, the 50s, happy days, et cetera.
C
Yeah. No, when I wrote about it, I was like, imagine if someone went to number one now by covering like We Found Love.
B
Right.
A
We found love in a homeless place.
C
Like, what would the point of that be? It's not even old enough to have that sort of warm amber nostalgia feeling about it. It's weird.
B
It is weird. I totally agree. So I know it's going to be some months, realistically, before you get to 1981, but can you give us a preview of what you think of the third number one hit from our last episode, the Stars on 45's medley and 40 other words in the title that I don't have time to rattle off right now.
C
You're not going to say the whole title again? I could, you know, I haven't reviewed it yet and I sort of. I'd only listen to it a few times before hearing your episode, but I like it. I'd probably give it a six or a seven. You know, time will tell what I'll. What I'll end up giving it. But there's a sort of cheerful sacrilege to that song that I find pretty enjoyable. And it's kind of funny too that it's a song that could only exist as a sort of like, if you heard that song for the first time without hearing these Beatles songs that it sweeps up and encompasses, then it. It would mean nothing. It would be absolutely baffling, even more than it already is.
B
Yeah.
C
And so I kind of like the. The way it sort of plays on the collective memory and how it kind of presages a lot of the sort of the sampling and the DJ music that would come afterward. It's sort of like a sort of lo fi, I guess, a hi fi version of like Grandmaster Flash on the Wheels of Seal, which I think was the same year, or like Girl Talk or something like that too, where it, it's just these little bits and bobs of these other songs and it's, it's so cheerful and it's so kind of sacrilegious in the way it just dices up all these beloved Beatles chestnuts that I kind of respond to it. Some of the transitions are a little awkward, but it mostly works. And I also really like that bit at the beginning. That's just the straight up disco song before it gets into all the Beatles pastiches.
B
Right?
C
Like, that's catchy. Like they could have done the whole song like that and I would have been fine with it.
B
Out of these three songs, because I first wrote about this in 2015 for the Slate article and now it's a podcast four years later. Stars on 45 is the one I've actually softened on the most. I'm not sure I would rate it much above a 6. That would be sort of like a gentleman's 6 on your 10 scale. But like, as I said in the episode, this was a line that was not in my original article, but I basically called it guileless and tacky. And you're right that the more you study it, as tacky as it is, the more forward thinking it actually surprisingly is. I respect anybody who thinks it's God awful and never wants to hear it again. And I definitely got many tweets. By the way, listeners, I read all of your tweets, including those of you who are saying, dammit, that Stars on 45 song is now stuck in my head. Thanks a lot, Malaya.
C
That means they got like 16 different songs stuck in their head. That's they got a whole album's worth.
B
Exactly. I mean, some of it was Beatles songs, so you're welcome for that. Now comes the time in Hit Parade, the Bridge, where we are joined by a contestant for some trivia. And joining us on the line from Long Beach, California is Leslie. Leslie, are you there?
D
I am. Here I am.
B
Hi, how are you?
D
I'm doing great.
C
Hi, Leslie. I'm Tom. I'm the guest on the thing.
D
Hi, Tom, how are you?
C
I'm doing good. How are you doing?
D
I am having a fantastic morning in beautiful Southern California.
B
Well, we're already very envious, Tom and I, but nonetheless, now is your opportunity to play our trivia game. And I understand that you are a Slate plus member. Is that right, Leslie?
D
I am.
B
How long have you been a Slate plus member?
D
Probably not long enough, but about three months. I've been listening forever and I finally bit the bullet.
B
Fantastic. Well, as we like to remind audience members, while this bridge episode is available to all Hit Parade subscribers, we only open our trivia rounds to Slate plus members. So if you are a member and would like to be a trivia contestant, visit slate.com hitparadesignup that's slate.com hitparadesignUp so, Leslie, I'm sure you've listened to prior episodes of Hit Parade, the Bridge. You know how this works. But just to remind everybody, I'm going to ask you three trivia questions. The first will be a callback to our most recent full length episode of Hit Parade. And the next two will be a preview of the next episode of Hit Parade. Are you ready for some trivia?
D
I am.
B
Fantastic. Here we go. Question 1. Last month's episode climaxed with a dissection of Stars on 45's medley, mostly composed of covers of Beatles songs. Which of these Lennon McCartney songs was not featured in the Stars on 45 single that hit number one in 1981? A, I should have known better. B, tell me why. C, no reply. Or D, you're going to lose that girl.
D
Oh. C, I think.
B
I'm sorry. The correct answer is B.
A
Tell me why, Tell me why you cried.
B
Oddly. Oddly, that song title and twist and shout are mentioned in the song's disco preamble, but that song, Tell Me why is never played in the five minute medley.
C
Chris makes these unnecessarily hard. I've heard that song a lot of times now, and I don't think I would have gotten that.
D
That does make me feel better.
B
Are you ready for question two, Leslie?
D
Yes.
B
All right, here we go. Back in 1969, from August 15th through the 18th, the Woodstock Festival took place in upstate New York. The weekend it happened, several performers on stage were on the Billboard charts. Which of the following Woodstock acts ranked highest on the Hot 100 that week? A, Credence Clearwater Revival, B the who, C Sly and the Family Stone, or D, Blood, Sweat and Tears.
D
Oh, my. Let's say A Credence.
B
I'm sorry. Sorry. The correct answer is D, Blood, Sweat and Tears.
A
Spinning Wheel. Got to go round.
B
All four acts were on the Hot 100 that week, some with multiple hits. But the week ending August 16, 1969, Blood, Sweat and Tears was highest at number 11 with their former number two hit, Spinning Wheel. Interestingly, no Woodstock act that week was in the top 10. That was a tough one because Credence is actually a good guess. They had so many hits in the summer of 1969, they just weren't highest on the charts that week.
C
Yeah, Credence were running wild that year. That would have been my guess for sure.
B
Yeah, yeah. No, they really were. In any case, are you ready for question three? Redemption may be at hand on question three.
D
Let's hope for it.
B
All right, fingers crossed. Here we go. So another question about Woodstock. What about on the album chart that weekend in 1969 when Woodstock took place, which act ranked highest on the Billboard chart that was then called top LPs? A, the Jimi Hendrix Experience, B Joe Cocker, C Canned Heat or D Crosby, Stills and Nash?
D
I don't think it was Crosby, Stills and Nash. Let's go with Joe Cocker.
B
I'm sorry, the correct answer was D, Crosby, Stills and Nash.
D
It was Crosby, Stills and Nash.
A
It's getting to the.
B
It was. Their self titled debut album was at number seven that week, one position away from its eventual peak of number six. The other three performers were all at much lower positions that week. From Hendrix, whose Smash Hits was at number 14, Joe Cocker, whose With A Little Help From My Friends was at number 49. And Canned Heat, whose Hallelujah was at number 59. Oh, man, that was a tough, tough trivia round, Leslie.
D
Big sweep.
B
I know, I know. You know, Tom had a point. I do ask tough trivia questions and now's your chance to ask me a tough trivia question and turn the tables on me. So I understand you have a question for me.
D
I do.
B
All right. I'm ready for it.
D
Okay. Though festival organizers have officially called off plans for the Woodstock 50 revival, its lineup was announced in March of this year. While a wide variety of newer acts were planned, Woodstock50 shared quite a few artists with the lineup of Woodstock 69. The ax in this question would have been on both the original and the revamped lineup. By the time they performed at Woodstock In August of 69, none had enjoyed a top 10 spot in the Billboard Hot 100. Which of their songs got the closest, peaking at number 11 in January of 1969? Is it a John Sebastian, She's a Lady, B Canned Heat Going up the Country, C Canned Heat on the Road Again, or D Melanie Beautiful People.
B
Wow. Okay, that is a good, tough. Yeah, that is a good, tough Woodstock trivia question. I'm going to eliminate Melanie because I'm pretty sure I know her two biggest Hits, and I don't think that was one of them. And I don't think it got to number 11. Although I could be wrong. I'm going to guess with two Canned Heat hits that it must be one of them. Can you tell me again, the two were Going up the country and on the Road Again? I'll just go with the counterintuitive example and go with on the Road Again.
D
C. Oh, so close. It was. It was B. Going up the Country.
B
I should have gone with that.
D
Canned heat had three Hot 100 hits before Woodstock, while their songs on song on the Road Again peaked at number 16 in September 1968. Going up the country was their biggest hit before Woodstock, peaking at number 11. When that happened in January of 1969, it shared the charts with John Sebastian's first Hot 100 hit, She's a Lady, peaking at 84.
B
Wow, that is an excellent question. And, you know, I feel good that I was right about the Canned Heat guess. And I just wish that I'd gone with my gut and gone with the more obvious hit. I mean, Going up the country is basically their most famous song, so I don't know why I didn't just go with that. But at least what this meant, Leslie, is that it was a true clean sweep. We all missed our trivia questions. Nobody got anything right. And, you know, we can both either commiserate together or hang our head in shame, whatever we're feeling.
D
I'm hanging my head in shame.
B
You really shouldn't, actually. It was truly a delight to have you in this trivia round. Thank you for being such a good sport. And thank you for being on Hit Parade, the Bridge.
D
Thank you for having me.
B
So, Tom, I have to ask, when you got that final trivia question, the one that stumped me, did you know it was the Canned Heat song? The other Canned Heat song?
C
No, I don't know anything about Canned Heat. They didn't have a number one single. I've had no reason to delve into the history of Canned Heat.
B
That's a good point. Everything I know about Canned Heat I've learned from watching the Woodstock documentary and reading about Woodstock. They are this funny, liminal, late 60s band. I believe they were also at Monterey Pop. So they were at Monterey Pop and Woodstock, the two most vital concerts of the late 60s. But their legacy was really quite limited. The number of hits they had and. And the way they're spoken about in decades subsequent to that, I don't think they've ever been on the Rock and Roll hall of Fame ballot, despite all of the 60s boomer acts that have been on the Rock and Roll hall of Fame ballot. So yeah, Canned Heat are a funny band.
C
Well, they could have played at Woodstock 50, the least relevant festival of this particular year.
B
Yeah, yeah. I mean, that's been just like watching a slow death, watching that thing go down. And I guess I'm just thankful that it didn't turn into this year's Fyre fe. I'm not that sorry that it didn't come together. But are you really grateful?
C
Didn't we all enjoy the fyre festival? Wasn't that just a blessed moment on the Internet?
B
In other words, you wanted the documentary that would have Resulted from woodstock50 actually happening.
C
I would have loved it.
B
I would have loved it. Yeah, I'm sure we would have eaten that up with a spoon. So Even though Woodstock 50 isn't happening, obviously this month, August of 2019, many are commemorating the 50th anniversary of the 1969 original Woodstock. And you know, it has been argued that the original Woodstock made several performers careers or did it? And I'd like to explore that specific question in our August full length episode of Hit Parade. That's what's coming up at the end of this month. You know, there are so many commemorations, podcasts, New York Times articles, all sorts of wonderful commemorations happening this month. And I'm not going to go down the rabbit hole too deeply on the minutiae of how the concert happened or so much the live experience really. Although we'll play some live clips. What I'm interested in is speaking as a chart analyst and somebody who hosts a podcast called Hit Parade, what did Woodstock do on the charts? Both as an entity unto itself. It was a hit album, it was a hit movie as well. But also as an instigator and a burnisher of various artists careers. It has been argued that several careers were made at Woodstock. And I'd like to talk about how the charts ratified or confirmed this in the months and years after Woodstock. So that's what we'll be talking about in the late August episode of Hit Parade. So before we close, I'd just like to thank Tom for joining me. And Tom, where can we look out for you on the Internet or social media?
C
Well, I'm the senior editor at Stereogum. I write a ton of stuff there every day, including the number ones. I write a column for the A.V. club, you can find me there. And I'm on Twitter, Ombrian B R E I H A N Fantastic well.
B
Thanks to Tom for joining me. And thanks also to my new producer, Asha Soludja, for putting this episode of Hit Parade the Bridge together. I'm Chris Melanfy. Keep on marching on the one.
A
I'm going where the water tastes like mine we can jump in the water, stay drunk.
Podcast Theme:
Host: Chris Molanphy
Guest: Tom Breihan (Senior Editor at Stereogum)
Date: August 16, 2019
This episode of "Hit Parade: The Bridge" explores the peculiar alchemy that transforms songs into chart-topping smash hits, mixing talent, timing, and serendipity. Host Chris Molanphy brings on Tom Breihan (author of Stereogum’s “The Number Ones” column, reviewing every Billboard Hot 100 number one single) to discuss music nostalgia, the history and quirks of number ones, and the unpredictable paths that lead to the top of the charts. The episode also includes a Beatles-related music trivia round, playful banter, and a preview of the upcoming full-length episode about the legacy of Woodstock on the pop charts.
(02:05) – (03:28)
Notable Quote:
“It's fun to think about. I think I really started thinking seriously about it when Cardi B's Bodak Yellow hit number one. And what a cool, fun story that was. But it turns out they're all cool, fun stories.”
— Tom Breihan (03:20)
(04:15) – (11:54)
Notable Quotes:
“It's kind of everything I don't like about Elton John all sort of rolled into one. It's just pure shtick… a big, hammy Vegas performance. And it really adds nothing to it.”
— Tom Breihan (06:32)
“There's no way 'A World Without Love' goes to number one unless Peter and Gordon just had not captured that lightning in a bottle of having possession of a Lennon–McCartney song at this moment…”
— Chris Molanphy (05:26)
(07:39) – (08:52)
Memorable Moment:
“Imagine if someone went to number one now by covering like 'We Found Love.' What would the point of that be?”
— Tom Breihan (08:58)
(09:09) – (11:58)
Notable Quote:
“There's a sort of cheerful sacrilege to that song that I find pretty enjoyable... it sort of presages a lot of the sampling and DJ music that would come afterward.”
— Tom Breihan (10:17)
“As tacky as it is, the more forward thinking it actually surprisingly is.”
— Chris Molanphy (11:10)
(12:30) – (21:32)
Memorable Exchange:
“That means they got like 16 different songs stuck in their head. That's—they got a whole album's worth.”
— Tom Breihan, on "Stars on 45" and its medley effect (11:54)
(21:44) – (23:32)
Notable Quote:
“What did Woodstock do on the charts? Both as an entity unto itself…it was a hit album, it was a hit movie as well. But also as an instigator and a burnisher of various artists' careers. It has been argued that several careers were made at Woodstock. And I'd like to talk about how the charts ratified or confirmed this...”
— Chris Molanphy (22:11)
“It's just pure shtick…Doesn't need to exist. It's this big, hammy Vegas performance.”
— Tom Breihan on Elton John's "Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds" (06:32)
“Imagine if someone went to number one now by covering like 'We Found Love.' What would the point of that be?”
— Tom Breihan (08:58)
“There's a sort of cheerful sacrilege to that song…”
— Tom Breihan on Stars on 45 (10:17)
“That means they got like 16 different songs stuck in their head. That's—they got a whole album's worth.”
— Tom Breihan (11:54)
“What did Woodstock do on the charts?... It has been argued that several careers were made at Woodstock. And I'd like to talk about how the charts ratified or confirmed this...”
— Chris Molanphy (22:11)
A thoughtful, trivia-packed, and nostalgia-laced dissection of music history, this episode gives listeners an inside look at pop chart obsessions, the randomness and strategy behind #1 hits, and how nostalgia cycles drive the music industry. It sets up next month’s exploration of Woodstock’s myth and numbers, making it a must-listen for pop history buffs and chart nerds alike.