03-04-25 - Kato Kaelin - In Studio - Part Two

Summary

Holmberg's Morning Sickness - Arizona

Episode: March 4, 2025 - Kato Kaelin - In Studio - Part Two
Host: John Holmberg
Guest: Kato Kaelin

---

1. Introduction to the Episode and Kato Kaelin's Upcoming Documentary

The episode begins with introductory remarks, highlighting Kato Kaelin's involvement in a new Netflix documentary series titled The Success of the Success. Host John Holmberg welcomes Kato to the studio, setting the stage for an in-depth conversation about his experiences and current projects.

Quote:

Cato Kaelin [00:35]: "Still streaming Homberg's morning sickness online at 98kupd.com Kato Kalin is in the studio with us this morning. And off the Netflix documentary the Success of the success."
(00:35)

---

2. Kato's Involvement in the Netflix Documentary Series

Kato discusses his participation in the four-episode documentary series, emphasizing his collaboration with producer Michael Rudetsky, a University of Wisconsin alumnus. He highlights Rudetsky's impressive portfolio, including work on the Manhunt series about Osama bin Laden and documentaries on significant events like the Boston bombing and the O.J. Simpson case.

Quote:

Cato Kaelin [01:10]: "I'm in for the it's four episode. I'm in four, I'm in parts of all four."
(01:10)

Insight: Kato expresses admiration for Netflix's documentary storytelling, mentioning, "Netflix does such a great job in documentaries. I watch all their documentaries."

(01:42)

---

3. Reflections on the O.J. Simpson Trial and Personal Experiences

A significant portion of the conversation delves into Kato's experiences during the O.J. Simpson trial. He recounts auditioning for roles around the time of the murders and sensing that something monumental was unfolding. Kato reflects on his testimony, explaining his nervousness and commitment to honesty, which sometimes led to perceptions of him being uncooperative.

Quote:

Cato Kaelin [02:08]: "I said I came out to California to act. This is back in 1980 and this ruined..."
(02:08)

Quote:

Cato Kaelin [04:00]: "I was nervous, but I was also there to be 100% honest."
(04:00)

Insight: Kato emphasizes his genuine intent during the trial, stating, "I was there, to be honest," addressing misconceptions about his demeanor.

(04:41)

---

4. Interactions with Phil Spector and Other Celebrities

Kato shares memorable interactions with music producer Phil Spector, describing how Spector leveraged Kato's energy during studio sessions. He recounts sitting beside Spector for extended periods, noting the uncomfortable atmosphere it created among other celebrities present.

Quote:

Cato Kaelin [05:45]: "I had to go to the bathroom. He stopped the session."
(05:45)

Quote:

Cato Kaelin [06:58]: "...Celine Dion made you sit next to him for hours on end."
(06:58)

Insight: Kato highlights the impact of his presence, mentioning, "you have a charisma... that guy's energy is the best," suggesting that his innate energy drew influential figures like Spector to involve him in their processes.

(05:20)

---

5. Post-Trial Acting Career and Opportunities Declined

Transitioning from his trial experiences, Kato discusses his ongoing pursuit of an acting career. He mentions opportunities that came his way post-trial, including lucrative offers to sign autographs and participate in events, which he chose to decline to maintain the integrity of his career.

Quote:

Cato Kaelin [13:38]: "I didn't do anything. I only did stuff that I want to do that was a part of my career."
(13:38)

Insight: Kato underscores his selective approach to career opportunities, stating, "I never did anything... I didn't make money like I did Politically Incorrect," indicating a preference for meaningful engagements over lucrative but trivial offers.

(14:18)

---

6. Launching a True Crime Podcast and Current Projects

Kato reveals his venture into the true crime genre with his podcast One Degree of Scandal. He discusses the podcast's focus on a wide range of crimes, from murders to bank robberies, and his ambition to become a prominent figure in true crime storytelling.

Quote:

Cato Kaelin [15:29]: "I think the O.J. trial is the template of any crime... that trial, it's all every network would call me for any trial of my."
(15:29)

Quote:

Cato Kaelin [16:03]: "I think the O.J. trial is the template of any crime... that trial, it's all every network would call me for any trial of my."
(16:03)

Insight: Kato expresses a deep connection to the O.J. Simpson trial's enduring influence, viewing it as a foundational event for future true crime narratives. He states, "I'm gonna be the face of a true crime in my podcast," highlighting his commitment to the genre.

(16:02)

---

7. Personal Reflections on Fame and Closure

Towards the end of the episode, Kato reflects on his enduring relationship with fame and the lasting impact of the O.J. Simpson trial. He discusses the concept of closure, suggesting that while O.J.'s death provides some resolution, the public's fascination with the case ensures that it remains a topic of discussion indefinitely.

Quote:

Cato Kaelin [18:07]: "I think the closure was... With the OJ's death."
(18:07)

Insight: Kato shares a philosophy of embracing life's unpredictability, comparing his experiences to a college semester that's nearing its end. He emphasizes resilience and positivity, stating, "I really love life," and advocates for giving people the benefit of the doubt.

(18:58)

---

8. Anecdotes and Light-Hearted Moments

Interspersed throughout the conversation are lighter moments, including humorous anecdotes about Kato's athletic past and interactions during the trial. He recounts successful auditions, athletic achievements, and memorable incidents, such as an unexpected encounter with O.J. Simpson in a hospital bathroom.

Quote:

Cato Kaelin [20:03]: "I was a pretty good athlete. I came out. I was gonna be a pro ballplayer."
(20:03)

Quote:

Cato Kaelin [25:11]: "I was taking a pee and he just said, well, man, this is after I..."
(25:11)

Insight: Kato's storytelling showcases his multifaceted life, blending personal achievements with notable trial experiences, providing listeners with a comprehensive view of his journey.

(21:17)

---

9. Upcoming Appearances and Future Plans

The episode concludes with mentions of upcoming appearances and potential interactions with O.J. Simpson, setting the stage for future episodes and discussions.

Quote:

Cato Kaelin [25:10]: "No, no, no."
(25:10)

Insight: While remaining light-hearted, Kato hints at more engaging content to come, promising continued exploration of true crime stories and personal anecdotes that resonate with his audience.

(25:53)

---

Conclusion

This episode of Holmberg's Morning Sickness offers an intimate look into Kato Kaelin's life post-O.J. Simpson trial, his foray into true crime storytelling, and his reflections on fame and personal growth. Through candid conversations and insightful anecdotes, listeners gain a deeper understanding of Kato's enduring legacy and his commitment to honesty and authenticity in the public eye.

Transcript

[Dick Toledo]

It's Dick Toledo and new customers right now on FanDuel. Get $150 in bonus bets when your first $5 wager wins. Just visit FanDuel.com KUPD to grab $150 in college hoops bonus bets with a winning $5 bet and prepare for March on FanDuel America's 1 Sportsbook 21 plus in President Arizona first online real money wager only $5 first deposit required. Bonus issued as non withdrawable bonus bets which expire seven days after receipt. Restrictions apply. See [e-mail] gambling problem. Call 1-800-next-step or text next step to.

[Cato Kaelin]

Two.

[Unnamed Host]

Still streaming Homberg's morning sickness online at 98kupd.com Kato Kalin is in the studio with us this morning. And off the Netflix documentary the Success of the success. The, the, the success.

[Cato Kaelin]

Trending for a month.

[Unnamed Host]

It's like a full month.

[Cato Kaelin]

Yeah.

[Unnamed Host]

Coming out of the holidays too. It was like everybody kind of already binged out and here comes the the documentary. Now when they come to you, Cato, and say hey, we got another documentary we want to do, how often do you say yes? How often do you say no? Because you're in this one quite a lot.

[Cato Kaelin]

Yeah. I mean I'm in for the it's four episode. I'm in four, I'm in parts of all four. But this happened because the producer his name is Michael Rudetsky, he's the University of Wisconsin. I'm Wisconsin. So immediately there's sort of loyal to that whole Wisconsin cheesehead thing. So that's what it was. And then I saw he did the Wahlberg Boston bombing. He did the then he did the Boston bombing. Netflix he started he's part of this series that Netflix does on documentaries called Manhunt. That's when he does as Osama bin Laden.

[Unnamed Host]

They're great.

[Cato Kaelin]

So I'd be friend he talked to me on the phone over and over. And they, they really focus on timeline. And then I saw in the documentary of how they do these, these timelines and they did it on this OJ Thing too. And they do such a great job in documentaries. Netflix. I watch all their documentaries.

[Unnamed Host]

Yeah. When was okay. So and so when they ask you and stuff like obviously when did in your life did you just say I have to not fight this. This is just gonna be what I am?

[Cato Kaelin]

Yeah. I, I, that's, that's a great one because I, I said I came out to California to act. This is back in 1980 and this ruined and I. And I, you know, you probably know, the week before the murders actually happened, I auditioned two weeks before I had a call back, and then they filmed me for Dumb and Dumber.

[Unnamed Host]

Yeah.

[Cato Kaelin]

So I read for this with Rick Montgomery casting, and I was going, go ahead. I'm getting these parts. And I had done a few commercials, and I've had my Great Actors Guild card for over 40 years, so. And I used to go to premieres, you guys, all the time. I used to walk the premieres, but no one knew who I was. And so a lot of actors after I became famous thought, the son of a bitch, this guy's doing. He's doing premieres now. Because he said, but I did him before. Anyways, I got the script because Aaron Meyerson was an executive at New Line Cinema. He said, you and I hung out with him. He goes, got to have this script. You got to be in this. So. So I read for D, anyway, so I thought, my life's good. Stuff's happening.

[Unnamed Host]

You were going.

[Cato Kaelin]

I could feel something was going to happen.

[Unnamed Host]

Did I think, boy, did you know that?

[Cato Kaelin]

But. But it's true. Like, you said something big was going to happen, and that's a different way. Blueprint above, I guess said, you're going to be in it in Houston.

[Unnamed Host]

As far as God's plan goes, kind of sucky.

[Cato Kaelin]

Yeah, it's going to be, hey, God, thank you, man.

[Unnamed Host]

Thanks, God. Great plan.

[Cato Kaelin]

Really.

[Unnamed Host]

Thanks a lot.

[Cato Kaelin]

Say to Jesus.

[Unnamed Host]

Yeah, the. The CR Part is. And we talked about this off the air just now, is that I. I've always believed that people like, oh, Cato came out of this like you were trying to be something on the stand. Kato Kalin made you. Made yourself a standout just by being you. I don't think you. Did you intentionally go, all right, just on tv, I'm gonna, like, was there anything in your head that said, I'm gonna. I'm gonna go a little further. I'm gonna push it a little bit, a little more. Cato. Or were you just you.

[Cato Kaelin]

Absolutely not. And you don't even. I. I think the first question or two, you don't even know cameras anymore. You're focused. I'm looking right at the nervous question. Very nervous.

[Unnamed Host]

Insane OG Staring at you.

[Cato Kaelin]

Stomach problems from that still. Oh, yeah. Just everything exacerbates because the years of just ulcer, whatever. So, yeah, I was nervous, but I was also there to be 100% honest. And I think a lot of times people saw me as like a deer in the headlights. And I swear to you, it's because if a question was asked, I go, God, I don't remember in the review. In my mind, I'm going, was that in the review? So I don't realize the camera's looking at me. Looks like I'm trying to make something up. But I'm trying to think in my.

[Unnamed Host]

Head of I've already answered this five.

[Cato Kaelin]

I thought, did. I am. I answered. And I want to make sure I answered everything.

[Unnamed Host]

Yeah.

[Cato Kaelin]

So the pause look right. It made it look like I was maybe not telling the truth, but I understand that.

[Unnamed Host]

Yeah.

[Cato Kaelin]

But no, I was there, to be honest.

[Unnamed Host]

Have you rewatched your testimony?

[Cato Kaelin]

Only in the clips that they show. If it's on a documentary.

[Unnamed Host]

But you never watched back and. No, I see why people thought this.

[Cato Kaelin]

No, no, but I could see. I understand. People could have an opinion.

[Unnamed Host]

Yeah.

[Cato Kaelin]

And I. You know, everybody's going to pay.

[Unnamed Guest]

Between the lawyers, like Cochran and that whole crew, was there someone like, man, this person. I just don't like this person.

[Cato Kaelin]

Or you mean for me. To which person? I didn't.

[Unnamed Guest]

You're looking at.

[Cato Kaelin]

No, but I. I thought if there was a lawyer that I think was the. The best lawyer on their team, I think, was Barry Shack.

[Unnamed Host]

Absolutely.

[Cato Kaelin]

Barry Sheck, who just schooled Ruthless. Yeah. I think that he sort of changed a lot with the. The DNA stuff.

[Unnamed Host]

Here's the thing I've always thought about you, though, is that because of that and what you're saying and having met you today, I now, I confirmed it. Especially after what you said about before you cursed Phil Spector. You have a charisma. You have an energy. And people walk in a room and have a dead energy or they have a live energy. You said Phil Spector made you sit next to him for hours on end. Because in a room full of celebrities say, this guy's energy is the best, and I need to use that right now.

[Cato Kaelin]

100% true. I had a publicist at the time named Lee Salters. He had Frank Sinatra, Michael Jackson, and he said that Phil Spector had called, he wants to meet you. And he met me at a session in the most famous, the Sunset Studios, where everybody mixes their records. So it was with Celine Dion and her husband, who passed away to Renee. And I didn't know where I was going. I was just. The publicist took me and Phil Spector gets up, he goes, you sit here next to me at this huge mixing board, and this guy's like four foot, four, whatever, he's. I thought it was Nadia Cominici. Anyways, I go, Phil C. At the parallel bars. But I'm. I sit there. I could feel every of these. A list. People that were there, actors at the time were like, what is boiling, boiling? Like, why does this Kato Kaelin, a witness, get to sit here? I didn't ask for it, so I did. And he would not let me move.

[Unnamed Host]

No kidding.

[Unnamed Guest]

He said, like, 14 hours.

[Cato Kaelin]

He did this. He did. Celine Dion did the same five seconds of this note. He made her do it. And I'm not exaggerating. I would say 70 times.

[Unnamed Host]

Wow.

[Cato Kaelin]

And I. I could see the husband going, enough. And she was having enough. And it would. It went on. That was the entire time.

[Unnamed Host]

But you were just kind of. Kind of his muse based on your energy that you bring to a room just sitting there.

[Cato Kaelin]

And I could feel how. I could see how uncomfortable Celine Dion was also with me there. After a while, me there. And. And at one point, I had to go to the bathroom. He stopped the session. I went to the bathroom and I went. And while I'm doing that, there's another group mixing and down the studio. This is the 90s, and it was Green Day. And they said, we got to get a photo. And I'm getting a photo, and the publicist is running. Where's Cato? He finds me. He goes, get in there. Phil Spector won't go until you're sitting next door.

[Unnamed Host]

Hurry up with Billy and get in. So my point being with this, though, is that your energy is there. It seems as if you may have been destined for fame.

[Cato Kaelin]

This, this.

[Unnamed Host]

That maybe this was going a complete. Obviously your dream would have been for it to completely go a different direction.

[Cato Kaelin]

Look.

[Unnamed Host]

And you were going to find. This was going to find you no matter what. Took the long way around. Right. Yeah.

[Cato Kaelin]

Yeah, I did. I even. I said my byline should be, never has a man done so little to be recognized by so many.

[Unnamed Host]

Right.

[Cato Kaelin]

Because. And I did.

[Unnamed Host]

But that's you. You said 250 people testified.

[Cato Kaelin]

Yeah.

[Unnamed Host]

In that trial. And you're the only one that people are like, oh, Cato did this, Cato did that. Like, you people know you.

[Cato Kaelin]

Yeah, I.

[Unnamed Guest]

He was connected a lot.

[Unnamed Host]

Well, yeah. But it's also just. Nope. None of us knew that, like, your presence on screen, your presence as a person and in the room is a large energy.

[Cato Kaelin]

Oh.

[Unnamed Host]

It doesn't necessarily mean it's great because now I know I'm going to kill somebody. And I know that that's what you do. No. It's just so strange to me that that was the path you were destined to be on.

[Cato Kaelin]

You know, I, I agree. And it's sort of like I met, like I was telling you, I. I love people. I really do. And I think I'm positive. And I think people like Phil Spector, Robert Blake. When you. Who else killed someone else? I was like, I met them all and they all liked me.

[Unnamed Host]

Yeah.

[Cato Kaelin]

And it was like, so strange that their. Their path later on. They were insane.

[Unnamed Host]

Yeah. No. Okay, so when. So you get. You get through, we'll go to this, a little chronology. Chronology. You. You get into the trial. You. You immediately after all this happened, you said, the McDonald's conversation with the inspectors are talking to O.J. in the kitchen. He looks at you and says, follow my timeline. Or else kind of, remember we ate. We ate in the kitchen kind of thing. Yeah.

[Cato Kaelin]

He didn't. He just said, katie, you remember we ate in the kitchen? And I. Absolutely not. And I, I told him that, and I walked out.

[Unnamed Host]

And I think he did he know at that point. Oh, crap. Cato's onto me.

[Cato Kaelin]

I think I.

[Unnamed Host]

When's the last time you spoke to him?

[Cato Kaelin]

That was probably it. That was. It moved out. I kind of got like that.

[Unnamed Host]

So you had the vibe immediately? Like, I got a. This is a chaotic mess.

[Cato Kaelin]

Yeah.

[Unnamed Host]

I gotta get out.

[Cato Kaelin]

And everybody was bringing food. All. All people were coming by for condolences. Yeah. The Jacksons. Michael was there, but some of the Jacksons, a lot of celebrities are there. And it was like, oh, they're condolences. O.J. we're so sorry and all that. And I kept thinking, God, this is just. I feel like I'm so out of place.

[Unnamed Host]

Yeah.

[Cato Kaelin]

And they were looking at me like, I'm gonna be. In hindsight, I'm going, they. I'm gonna be this witness, I think, in a trial.

[Unnamed Host]

Yeah. Did you feel. Did you have doubt at all, or did you pretty much know, oh, he's on. Like he knows something. Maybe he didn't.

[Cato Kaelin]

There's something. Something's going on. But at the time, I was thinking, there's no way OJ can be involved because he was in Chicago.

[Unnamed Host]

Right.

[Cato Kaelin]

He took a flight, so. And no one knew the timing yet of anything. And the day of the Monday morning, after the police have came to my room at like 5:30, they escorted me into the main house.

[Unnamed Host]

And that's how you found out?

[Cato Kaelin]

I found out Tom Lang told that Nicole's been killed. And then I found out overhearing it. And then they had me walk out with a police officer. I met a Police outside. And they took me to a station where I stayed there for at least eight hours.

[Unnamed Host]

Just because you were probably.

[Cato Kaelin]

They're on the list.

[Unnamed Host]

Yeah.

[Cato Kaelin]

I did interview with the. In my room. I had four detectives question me going through all the stuff, and I had no idea why.

[Unnamed Host]

Wow.

[Cato Kaelin]

Of everything I wore. And then I went down there. But I remember that I was escorted out by detective. He said, watch out for the blood.

[Unnamed Host]

On the patio?

[Cato Kaelin]

No, on the floor. He had these wooden, like, pegs and there were blood. And then I thought, I think that's a detective sort of trick where they. Yeah, they kind of want to know, like, watch. Like if you're aware of it. Like if a person. Yeah. Like I already pre knew. So I was like, no. Oh, my God. There are blood drops.

[Unnamed Host]

Yeah. Oh, my God.

[Cato Kaelin]

It is, it's. It's really interesting. I think detectives do. I, I think they're really great detectives that worked on this case. And that's.

[Unnamed Host]

Do you think that they played with evidence because this documentary leads that way? You don't.

[Cato Kaelin]

I don't.

[Unnamed Host]

What about the glove being positioned differently?

[Cato Kaelin]

I don't think so, because no one knew that I heard a noise at the time and it was. No way they could have planned something.

[Unnamed Host]

No, there's two different pictures. Like, the documentary proved that. Like, when they first found the glove, it was facing this way. And then later there's pictures it's facing or it's moved.

[Cato Kaelin]

Was that the one in Gretner Green, though?

[Unnamed Host]

No, no, that was the one behind you.

[Cato Kaelin]

Oh, see, I, I didn't know that.

[Unnamed Host]

Was the one that. Was it found?

[Cato Kaelin]

Oh, yeah. I, I like. I, I don't know. I don't think personally someone would have planet a glove. Why.

[Unnamed Host]

And that's the thing. Like, what do you. What's your theory that OJ's hopping? Because I've been to that house. I'm a creep. Like, the, the wall that you leap over isn't little.

[Cato Kaelin]

No.

[Unnamed Host]

There's a bush around it.

[Cato Kaelin]

Well, it's, it's only. It's like probably a foot and a half or so. You could walk a body through maybe a little bit more. OJ's a big guy. But the house next door has got a fence, right?

[Unnamed Host]

Yeah.

[Cato Kaelin]

The property line is right there. So the theory was that he jumped.

[Unnamed Host]

Over and, and hit your wall.

[Cato Kaelin]

The air conditioner.

[Unnamed Host]

Oh, okay.

[Cato Kaelin]

Air conditioner stood out, you know.

[Unnamed Host]

Right.

[Cato Kaelin]

And that's. He didn't expect that.

[Unnamed Host]

But then the glove falls off or just leaves it or it fell out of a pocket. Or something.

[Cato Kaelin]

And then the other one's left at the crime scene. So that's bizarre.

[Unnamed Host]

And you didn't see him between then and when he left for sure?

[Cato Kaelin]

No, only until the limo driver came.

[Unnamed Host]

Okay.

[Cato Kaelin]

And that was the door that's packing up stuff at the. Because his luggage was out in front of the door, except for this one duffel bag, which is 20ft away.

[Unnamed Host]

Yeah.

[Cato Kaelin]

And it was a. Like a college backpack. And I, like, went to get it. I went to get it. He said, no, no, I got it. But he made a point of saying, no, no, don't.

[Unnamed Host]

Don't touch that.

[Cato Kaelin]

Don't touch that.

[Unnamed Host]

Unreal. Holmberg's morning sickness. And then so you get into the trial, you get that, and then everybody wants a piece of Cato. And it invented reality TV as we know it kind of. I mean, this whole deal, that's Larry.

[Cato Kaelin]

King's motto, was it did the reality. First reality star.

[Unnamed Host]

You were by far the first reality star and created networks and everything else. And you've done a couple reality shows. What haven't you done? What has Kato Kaelin been offered that you're like, I am not doing this.

[Cato Kaelin]

Tons of going to appearances to sign Broncos and gloves.

[Unnamed Host]

Really?

[Cato Kaelin]

Oh, yeah. And for big money. Tons of it.

[Unnamed Host]

How much do they offer you for a glove signing?

[Cato Kaelin]

At that time, probably it was. I. I got everything was at least 7,500 just to show up and sign some gloves. Well, to do an event, but go to a mall, whatever. Gloves and. And Broncos.

[Unnamed Host]

Cancel the glove signing. I didn't know that. I'm sorry. We were gonna have to sign some myses.

[Cato Kaelin]

No, no, it's different now. It's 30 years ago.

[Unnamed Host]

It's 75 bucks, and inflation prices went up. I've got some mittens. Yeah. I'm sorry. We don't have that budget. 7,500 bucks.

[Cato Kaelin]

Surgical gloves, too.

[Unnamed Host]

And did at any point yourself. Why not?

[Cato Kaelin]

No, no, I never. I never did anything. I only did stuff that I want to do that was a part of my career. And I. I didn't make money like I did Politically Incorrect. It was scale, like, very, very cheap. But stuff that I would have done because of my career.

[Unnamed Host]

Yeah.

[Cato Kaelin]

I didn't do, you know, certain things I did get invited to certain things that I wanted to always do, like the Kentucky Derby, the Indy 500.

[Unnamed Host]

As a guest of someone would take you as. You know.

[Cato Kaelin]

Yeah.

[Unnamed Host]

Get you in there.

[Cato Kaelin]

Well, like, it was incredible because they had a private jet with the George Fam. I think Indy had the owned the Track.

[Unnamed Host]

Yeah.

[Cato Kaelin]

So a few times. Anita Madden, who had passed away, but to her Kentucky Derby parties were amazing. People hated me at those two, actually. Why it's here. And I was like her. Her date or she was like the biggest socialite of Louisville.

[Unnamed Host]

Did you ever do an event where you're like, oops, mistake. Shouldn't have been here. This is not good.

[Cato Kaelin]

No, no.

[Unnamed Host]

None of the shows or anything else. So you're fine. Do you call this your career?

[Cato Kaelin]

No, I like what I still look at. 30 years. I'm still pursuing acting. I'm still got my say card. Trying to get the insurance to keep up. I'm still purs. It's been. It's tough.

[Unnamed Host]

Yeah.

[Cato Kaelin]

And you walk in a room and.

[Unnamed Host]

Everybody can't do it. No one will see a character here like you're gonna out.

[Cato Kaelin]

I shared a show with Brady that I did. I think it's the most incredible crime series. And I'll have a meeting on Thursday with it again. And it's just called Wrong Place, Wrong Time.

[Unnamed Host]

Yeah. I didn't know anything about it.

[Cato Kaelin]

After this. I'd love to you to see it even during one of the universe 10 minute breaks.

[Unnamed Host]

Yeah, I know. For Christ's sake. That's your fault. We usually break these down a little better.

[Cato Kaelin]

You know how many gloves I sign, so. But yeah, so I got, you know, I. I figure I probably should be the face of a true crime in my podcast.

[Unnamed Host]

Totally agree. Yeah.

[Cato Kaelin]

Is just, you know, one degree Scandalous has just taken off and you know, and it's called.

[Unnamed Host]

It's one degree of scandal. Of scandalous.

[Unnamed Guest]

And there's an episode today, right?

[Cato Kaelin]

Yeah, actually we have. After 30 years of not seeing Tanya Brown, Nicole's sister is our guest today.

[Unnamed Host]

Oh my God.

[Cato Kaelin]

On our Today show. And she's amazing to see this. And stories. And a week before that we had Jeffrey Toobin and we started getting a lot of these great guests and it's all even. It's scandal. Even though it's 30 years later, we still put everything up to date. What's going on?

[Unnamed Host]

Is the podcast about most of. Or is it all sorts of different murders?

[Cato Kaelin]

Everything. Any kind of crime, even bank robberies. But it's all true crime. And we're probably gonna go to Brian Kohlberger. We're gonna go live to Idaho. I don't know if it's gonna be Moscow because they move it. But yeah, we're gonna do all this because people are just relating to it. And I kind of want to be the fixture of all you Know, I think the O.J. trial is the template of any crime. That trial, it's all every network would call me for any trial of my.

[Unnamed Host]

Opinion in that it's the 911 of like events for that time. I mean that is the defining moment of a, of a generation. Where were you for 911 by the way? Just in case, I don't know, like were you. We were at the airport or anything.

[Cato Kaelin]

I was not actually at 9 11. I.

[Unnamed Host]

You weren't recording with Muhammad Atta the day before and like had a nice session.

[Unnamed Guest]

He had him sit next to him.

[Unnamed Host]

Kendall, sit with me immediately. I like, did you. Where were you for 9 11? That's a good thing.

[Cato Kaelin]

I was at home. So I was at home. Yeah, I did.

[Unnamed Host]

Whose house were you living at then?

[Cato Kaelin]

I was, I'm pretty stupid. I live behind my own place now. Anyways. No, I actually was at home. But my first phone call was to Bill Maher.

[Unnamed Host]

No kidding.

[Cato Kaelin]

Yeah. Because we were close buddies at that time and we're still friends, but it's nothing like. He's too world famous.

[Unnamed Host]

Gigantic.

[Cato Kaelin]

He's gigantic. But I called him and it was 911. It was ironic. It was 911.

[Unnamed Host]

Yeah.

[Cato Kaelin]

So that was it. That was calling about that and just watching like everybody else did on tv.

[Unnamed Host]

I've read that in the past. I don't know how if this is still true, if this was just an interview thing. You said that, you said there'll never be closure to this for you.

[Cato Kaelin]

No, I think the closure was. Yeah. With the OJ's death. Yeah, I think, yeah.

[Unnamed Host]

Oh, was that when the interview happened? It was like. I think it was last summer. I read like you had said this is just never going to be over. Even with him dead.

[Cato Kaelin]

Yeah, but I don't think it's going to be. I think anytime his trial it always will come up. But I think, I don't think the Goldman's will ever have closure. I think the death helped with the closure that he's gone. I just think like I said, it's never hard to lose a parent. So my heart goes out to the kids and of course everybody should know it's about Rod Nicole.

[Unnamed Host]

Absolutely. At all times.

[Cato Kaelin]

And to know her is to know that she was a honestly a beacon light and a great mom and no one should forget that. So. And I never. And I never will forget that.

[Unnamed Host]

And so yeah, there's even for you, the closure is like again, it's radical acceptance of what's happened to you. You just have to kind of Embrace that. This is the path you have to take.

[Cato Kaelin]

Yeah, exactly.

[Unnamed Host]

I think, because you could be bitter. You could be. You don't have any of that.

[Cato Kaelin]

You know, I really love life.

[Unnamed Host]

Yeah.

[Cato Kaelin]

And I know I compare it to being at college. It's like a semester before, you know, it's over, so. And I lost my par. And my brother lost his son recently. So it's sort of like, God, I know. It's so precious. So I'm like, let it roll. Yeah. And I do. And I always pay for it. I really, like, give the people benefit of the doubt. That don't love me. Don't know me. That's fine if you don't know me.

[Unnamed Host]

Yeah. Up until June 14, 1994. What's the weirdest thing that ever happened.

[Cato Kaelin]

To you up before that?

[Unnamed Host]

Yeah. What's something that would have been your tale to tell before that, like, you had the moon landing land on you. Like, what. Before that was your, like, claim to fin. Like, Kato Kalin has this story.

[Cato Kaelin]

You mean. So I. So I would get this question right. Because. So you mean what. What did it happen before the trial ever happened?

[Unnamed Host]

All of your. What. What? You became Kato Kalin over. Prior to that, you had.

[Cato Kaelin]

I won Kato pass and kick twice.

[Unnamed Host]

There it is. That's all I'm asking. You won punt, pass and kick two times.

[Cato Kaelin]

I was a pretty good athlete.

[Unnamed Host]

Is that right?

[Cato Kaelin]

I came out. I was gonna be a pro ballplayer. Baseball. But I also did football. I was the quarterback. I was the.

[Unnamed Host]

I was passing kick national. So you went to the Super Bowl.

[Cato Kaelin]

I went to the first level. So I got Andy Reid. I didn't get as far as him, but Andy Reid also was there. Yeah, but I. Yeah, I could throw.

[Unnamed Host]

So that was your. That was your thing.

[Cato Kaelin]

At one point, I could throw at 60 yards.

[Unnamed Host]

So when people used to, like, had this not happen, they'd be like, you know, cato won punt, pass and kick. That was the family brag. That was the.

[Cato Kaelin]

No, I. Well, I. We went to state baseball. So that was. And my first audition ever in California. My first audition. I. First one, I landed a national Coca Cola commercial. I thought, that's really easy. So I think that was a great thing. Paul Ventura is the director. He follows me on Instagram. And I mentioned to Paul and he just recently wrote me probably two weeks ago and said, I still have your Taft Hartley contract. I kept. He didn't even know. He just has my contract. And he goes, would you like a copy of it? This is because I. I was at A party. And someone had contacted me and said, you got to get on the phone with this guy. It was Paul Ventura. And I said, of course I remember you. Paul. Paul is a huge director.

[Unnamed Host]

Yeah.

[Cato Kaelin]

So.

[Unnamed Host]

And he kept your contract.

[Cato Kaelin]

My contract for that Coca Cola commercial.

[Unnamed Host]

How about that? What are you selling that for?

[Cato Kaelin]

I don't have it.

[Unnamed Host]

Was he gonna. You were to buy it from him. That's pretty awesome. All right. It's amazing. And then so. And. And what am I missing? What. What haven't I asked you? What's something everybody.

[Cato Kaelin]

My houseguest key. I've got all this. We got so many things. How much money is on the Toad board? Yeah, we're going to do this for the.

[Unnamed Host]

When you were beach tennis club, when you were leaving, you couldn't have ever anticipated how big this is going to be. Would you ever think about stealing anything out of Rockingham before you left? Or did you?

[Cato Kaelin]

I didn't.

[Unnamed Host]

You didn't take anything out of the house? Picture off the wall, Nothing?

[Cato Kaelin]

Nothing. I didn't take anything. I got my stuff and I can't piss.

[Unnamed Host]

This guy.

[Cato Kaelin]

I didn't have that much stuff. I probably left stuff, actually. Really? Yeah. I got out of there. My two best buddies helped me move. And the day I moved, that was pretty much immediately. There are helicopters everywhere.

[Unnamed Host]

Yeah. Did you. Did you. Did you get to be friends with anybody else from the trial and still are?

[Cato Kaelin]

Yeah, I think I became friends with Jill Shively. Did my.

[Unnamed Host]

Okay.

[Cato Kaelin]

My podcast. Tom Lang. I've seen Detective Lang. Detective Lang had to. And by the way, he did the Hillside Strangler.

[Unnamed Host]

Yeah.

[Cato Kaelin]

He did the Wonderland murder cases. Lots of serial killer cases. So I'm fascinated with true crime. So were you before. And also I think Robert Shapiro became friends and his son died. I was his son was Grant also. That died with an overdose. But I think it was Grant, during the trial, asked for an autograph during the trial. It was like during a break, so I did. Can I do this?

[Unnamed Host]

Yeah.

[Cato Kaelin]

So I thought it was like, this is so bizarre that I'm doing an autograph. And so, you know.

[Unnamed Host]

Did you follow OJ's Instagram?

[Cato Kaelin]

No, I did. I think it was on Twitter or Twitter.

[Unnamed Host]

You're right.

[Cato Kaelin]

Yeah, I didn't. But everybody would. Anytime. Yeah, people would.

[Unnamed Host]

What did you think of that? That's where the impression.

[Cato Kaelin]

I thought it was pretty bizarre. Yeah. I thought it was bizarre that he ended everything with.

[Unnamed Host]

Yeah, what do you get it? But he always ended up with. I'm just saying, yours truly. Yeah. Well, he Started with yours truly, ended with yours truly. Yeah, yeah, we'll get to. That's coming next.

[Cato Kaelin]

But it would pop up on my feed.

[Unnamed Host]

Yeah. And you'd see it and you just.

[Unnamed Guest]

Your boys.

[Cato Kaelin]

I just. I just kind of, you know, I. I didn't do either, but I definitely wasn't going to follow him. And I think he got the luckiest break of his life, but he should have. I think you hang out, hang around with people that are a bad influence. He just had friends that after this thing, he should have just never been heard of.

[Unnamed Host]

Like you were destined for a famous moment in your world. He was destined for trouble. Like it was. He was. It was going to eventually get him.

[Cato Kaelin]

Yeah. I think that's why the 12 years.

[Unnamed Host]

In Vegas or in Nevada.

[Cato Kaelin]

Exactly.

[Unnamed Guest]

I thought it was interesting. The documentary is pointing out the fact that OJ just what crushed him is he was like America's sweetheart in his mind. He didn't want to ever lose that. And he was kind of.

[Unnamed Host]

Because of that.

[Cato Kaelin]

Yeah, I think so. I think he just said, I don't see color. I just. I'm oj.

[Unnamed Host]

Yeah.

[Cato Kaelin]

Yeah. I think that he started believing his own.

[Unnamed Host]

Well, the one crazy thing that's in the documentary is when he's getting carted away and sees all those people by his house and he says, how come there's so many n words in Brentwood? Yeah. He didn't see himself as a. Like, he was racist in a weird way.

[Cato Kaelin]

Yeah.

[Unnamed Host]

Towards. He just saw everyone as lesser.

[Cato Kaelin]

But I think that came from his. His people, his circle. His circle of people that wanted him to make money for them. That sort of thing. It's like, oj, you're international. You're not a color.

[Unnamed Host]

Yeah.

[Cato Kaelin]

So I think he's green. Yeah.

[Unnamed Host]

Yeah, he's green. He's a green person. He just brings money to the party and makes more.

[Cato Kaelin]

Eats marzipan.

[Unnamed Host]

We have Kato Kaelin in the room for. And OJ's gonna join us next. I hope you're ready for that. Do you have questions for oj? Would you. We're gonna find out in a second. Cato can. You don't have to force yourself. This isn't the trial.

[Cato Kaelin]

Grapefruit juice.

[Unnamed Host]

You can just sit back and get the GJ while OJ talks. He may have questions for you.

[Cato Kaelin]

Okay.

[Unnamed Host]

And then anybody who has a question for Cato Kalin. And maybe OJ and OJ will correct some things. If you're going down the wrong road, you can email [e-mail].

[Cato Kaelin]

Maybe the best show Ever, you think?

[Unnamed Host]

Have you talked to OJ in any sort of way since?

[Cato Kaelin]

No. No, no.

[Unnamed Host]

Will this be the first faux or otherwise chat with OJ Depositions.

[Cato Kaelin]

Last time I saw OJ I was taking a pee and he just said, well, man, this is after I.

[Unnamed Host]

You're peeing with him?

[Cato Kaelin]

Yeah, no, I'm peeing. I couldn't pee because I was too nervous. This is after deposition. I'm not joking. I was. I couldn't even. I was doing the old tickle the butt trust to get me going, you know, and, hey, would you run that thing for me? But it's true. And it was after I'd done two hours of totally destroying him in the civil trial.

[Unnamed Host]

Oh.

[Cato Kaelin]

And it was civil trial.

[Unnamed Host]

He pops in.

[Cato Kaelin]

He pops in and you're. Yeah. And I. I got clinched up. I'm. By just him and I in the bathroom. So I was.

[Unnamed Host]

He didn't have a guard with him, I guess it was civil trial. You don't have to. Oh, my.

[Cato Kaelin]

It's. True story. It was very bizarre.

[Unnamed Host]

That is.

[Unnamed Guest]

And that's all he said?

[Cato Kaelin]

Yeah. I. Why? Zipped up and I was out.

[Unnamed Host]

All right.

[Cato Kaelin]

Wow.

[Unnamed Host]

That made me uncomfortable.

[Cato Kaelin]

It was a lot. Remember Ben Stiller zipping up? That was me.

[Unnamed Host]

Yeah.

[Cato Kaelin]

I didn't care about the pain, the.

[Unnamed Host]

Beans over the Frank. How'd you do that? Kato Kalin's with us. If you have any questions. Holmerget90kupd.com we can even take calls. Our phones suck, so they hardly ever work. Right. But if you want to try 585-9800, we'll talk to Kato with O.J. next, it's 98, Arizona's most powerful rock radio station. He said fully erect. 98.