Figure Skating Champs Alex & Maia Shibutani: Olympics, Resolutions & Returning to the Ice

Summary

House of Maher – Figure Skating Champs Alex & Maia Shibutani: Olympics, Resolutions & Returning to the Ice

Air date: December 30, 2025
Host(s): Ilona Maher, Olivia Maher, Adrianna Maher
Guests: Maia and Alex Shibutani (Olympic ice dancers, “Shib Sibs”)

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Main Theme / Purpose

This episode brings Olympic figure skating sibling duo Alex and Maia Shibutani (“Shib Sibs”) into the House of Maher living room to talk about their remarkable return to competitive ice dancing after a seven-year break, their thoughts on New Year’s resolutions, the athlete mindset, family dynamics, and more. The conversation is vibrant, open, and filled with anecdotes about the pressures, joys, and misperceptions of elite sports—plus the value of sibling support and how identity continues to evolve well into adulthood.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. New Year’s Traditions and Athlete Mindsets

• Hosts and guests share their ideal New Year's Eve:
  • Maia and Ilona are all about winding down early (“Going to bed early, especially this year.” [03:48] Maia); Olivia and Adrianna celebrate with Dutch-style cook-at-the-table dinners (gourmetten/hormeta).
  • Athletes often miss holiday celebrations due to training commitments.
  • Quote: “You don’t want to wake up groggy on day one. Get things on the right foot.” – Alex [04:07]
• Reflections on resolutions:
  • The group debates whether New Year's resolutions actually work.
  • Maia believes in the flexibility to make changes any day, not just January 1st.
  • Ilona shares that after her Tokyo 2020 goal was canceled by COVID, she's wary:
    Quote: "One time before the Tokyo Olympics, I wrote in my New Year’s goals ‘go to Tokyo Olympics.’ And then guess what happened – covid. So now I don’t write goals anymore." – Ilona [08:27]
  • Adrianna likes the idea of written resolutions as check-ins, with permission to keep moving unfinished ones forward.
  • Olivia keeps a whimsical "running list" of goals (eg. "learn to ride a horse") to avoid pressure.

2. Sharing Goals and Accountability

• Discussion on whether sharing resolutions publicly helps or harms.
  • Adriana describes feeling pressured after sharing a running goal on social media, but admits accountability pushed her to improve.
  • Alex summarizes: “With people knowing, I think people are most likely just supporting you and cheering you, as opposed to you internalizing it and feeling like there’s pressure.” [12:03]

3. Personal Growth, Intentionality & Aging as Athletes

• Maia is loving her 30s and wants to keep discovering who she is, actively tuning out external noise and trusting herself. [12:32]
• Alex’s goal is to be more intentional about his hobby-turned-side-career in photography—making room for fun in creative pursuits rather than just obligations. [13:37]

4. Shibutanis' Return to Ice Dancing

• What prompted their comeback:
  • Last competition: 2018 Olympics; Maia had kidney cancer in 2019, followed by COVID hiatus. Despite never officially retiring, they were away from elite competition for 7 years.
  • Alex encouraged Maia to skate again for fun, not pressure. Rediscovering the joy of movement was pivotal in their decision to re-engage competitively:
    Quote: “There was no pressure… we just felt our own potential and the love of the sport.” – Maia [20:54]
  • Maia articulated how skating again was healing after her health crisis and reconnection with her body.
• Perspectives on “retirement” and comebacks:
  • Maia isn’t bothered by people referring to their break as a “retirement” despite the nuance, but recognizes the public’s assumptions.
  • Alex shares their changed perspective — now competing for themselves rather than chasing judges’ approval:
    Quote: “The separation from competitive skating for seven years gave us an opportunity to experience life in a more dimensional way. Now, we’re doing it very much for ourselves.” [22:45]
• Facing nerves and pressure post-comeback:
  • Maia is more present now, cherishing competition moments:
    Quote: “I just really treasure the moment because… you put so much training and time into preparation. That’s the big change.” [23:32]

5. Process, Pressure & Athlete Identity

• The group discusses the privilege and pressure of high-level sport, nerves as a sign of passion, and reframing motivation to focus on love for the activity.
  • Ilona: "Nerves mean I care. Nerves mean I want to do my best out there." [25:21]
  • Alex on growth mindset: “Allowing curiosity to take the wheel, moving into things with a beginner’s mindset… That was really helpful.” [26:06]
• Importance of teammate/family support in emotional regulation and performance.
  • Alex: “We have won together, we’ve lost together, we’ve learned together. There’s a unique comfort in that dynamic.” [35:11]
• Vulnerability and confidence are discussed: being able to admit doubts with family, and finding the balance between outward confidence and inner vulnerability.

6. Sibling Dynamics & Misconceptions

• On competing and supporting each other:
  • Siblings are often compared or assumed identical; Maia & Alex value having their own identities and experiences.
  • Quote: “It’s really been taking time to build our own relationships, find our own friends, follow our natural curiosities… that have helped us better define who we are.” – Maia [43:15]
• On seeing sports psychologists:
  • They see the same sports psych, both together and individually.
    • Maia: “We work with the same one, and we’ll do team sessions, but then also individual sessions.” [44:17]

7. Figure Skating Explainers & Myths

• Alex and Maia explain the structure of ice dance competitions:
  • Rhythm dance (set theme), free dance (creative choice), how rules have evolved, and the creative constraints that shape routines.
  • Biggest misconceptions:
    • The trope that hockey players and figure skaters don’t get along—totally false.
    • Not all figure skaters do triple axels.
    • Confusion with skateboarding, speed skating, etc.
  • They aim to demystify and popularize ice dance:
    Quote: "I think that we’ve been working hard to try and put ice dance more on the map." – Alex [38:39]

8. Gender, Perception, and Role Model Pressure

• Maia discusses being judged differently as a woman:
  • “There’s more of a focus on the visual versus the performance... now it’s about how strong I feel versus how I look.” [40:47]
• Alex reflects on being overly praised as a young male skater due to lack of male peers—even though Maia was outperforming him.
  • “I was winning participation medals because I was the only boy in the competition, and Maia was winning actual medals.” [41:20]
• The meaning of “role model”:
  • The group agrees being a role model isn’t about perfection, but authenticity and dimensionality.

9. Life Beyond the Rink: Writing & Storytelling

• Alex and Maia have written children's mysteries (Kudo Kids) and a nonfiction book celebrating AAPI heroes.
  • The process drew from their teamwork in skating and commitment to representation.
  • Writing was both purposeful and healing; especially researching Asian American and Pacific Islander figures inspired Maia through tough times.
  • Alex: “The skating is for us, but the books are for others.” [52:13]
• Ilona is also working on a memoir, finding the process cathartic and a way to share under-discussed women’s experiences.

10. Books and Pop Culture

• Maia read 100+ books in 2020 (post-surgery), gravitating toward stoicism and philosophy; she offers to send book recs to the sisters.
• Lighthearted banter about childhood book series (Percy Jackson, Eragon, Redwall, Animorphs).
  • Fun recurring question: “If you were an animorph, what animal would you transform into?”—prompting playful answers like sea lion, medium-sized dog, and bird. [56:33–58:04]

11. Lightning Round & Closing

• Go-to coffee orders: Maia – iced black; Alex – hot black.
• Competitive urges: mostly “dumb stuff, like who could hit the elevator button first.” [45:52]
• Favorite LA restaurant: Major Domo (David Chang’s spot in Chinatown).
• Bad habits: Alex wants to be more on time and stop “picking my nose on camera.” [59:43]
• If Maia could skate to any song: A longer song, not limited by current technical rules. (“Maybe that 10-minute version of Taylor Swift’s All Too Well.”)
• Sibling/family relationships in sport are unique, invaluable, and not nearly as universal as they once thought—"sucks to suck" quips Olivia about people who couldn't work with their siblings. [36:05]

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On goals and manifestation:
  “One time before the Tokyo Olympics, I wrote in my New Year’s goals ‘go to Tokyo Olympics.’ And then guess what happened—covid.” – Ilona [08:27]

• On what changes with age:
  “There’s a lot of external noise all the time, but I’m starting to do a better job of listening to myself.” – Maia [12:42]

• On coming back after adversity:
  “After my surgery… I felt so disconnected. But being active and performing again, more for myself—I fell in love with the feeling.” – Maia [21:44]

• On long-term athlete identity:
  “Allowing curiosity to take the wheel… moving into things with a beginner’s mindset.” – Alex [26:06]

• On family as teammates:
  “We have won together, we've lost together, we’ve learned together… there’s a unique comfort in that dynamic.” – Alex [35:11]

• On role modeling:
  “What people have attached to the term role model is perfection, never doing anything wrong. I’m wary with that word.” – Alona [40:19]

• On writing purpose:
  “The skating is for us, but the books are for others.” – Alex [52:13]

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Meeting the Shibutanis, Holiday Training, Athlete Resolutions – 02:53 – 12:32
• New Year’s goal-setting, accountability, athlete pressure – 07:23 – 13:37
• Comeback after a 7-year hiatus, overcoming illness – 20:07 – 24:29
• Comparing athlete experience, nerves, gratitude, reframing purpose – 24:29 – 27:20
• Sibling support, family dynamics, individual identity – 34:00 – 36:45
• Dispelling figure skating myths, sport explanations – 36:52 – 39:12
• Gender/role model discussions in sport – 40:41 – 41:47
• Writing books, legacy, cultural representation, reading phase – 50:04 – 55:16
• Lightning round (favorites, habits, animals, etc.) – 45:20 – 59:43

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Tone/Langauge

• Warm, supportive, and teasing among siblings; blend of self-awareness and humility from both hosts and the Shib Sibs.
• Honest, introspective discussion about vulnerability, growth, and letting go of perfection.
• Lots of laughter, running jokes (“Girls are magic!” [03:35]), and easy rapport.

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Summary Takeaways

This episode goes far beyond a simple profile of Olympic ice dancers—it’s a candid group therapy session on identity, resilience, and the power of pursuing your passions on your own terms, even after setbacks. The conversation will resonate with anyone navigating life changes, sibling dynamics, or resetting ambitions in adulthood.

The Shib Sibs’ message: You can always come back to what you love, but you’ll return wiser if you’ve lived a little on the way. And, sometimes, the best goals aren’t the ones you write down—they’re the ones you follow with intention and joy.

Transcript

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[Maya Shibutani]

So good, so good, so good.

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[Maya Shibutani]

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[Alex Shibutani]

If you were an animorph, what animal would you transform into?

[Adriana]

That's a great question.

[Alona]

A sea lion.

[Alex Shibutani]

And what's the animal that you wish you could transform? Because there's the honest, reflective, like, oh.

[Maya Shibutani]

Yeah, I'm this, but right.

[Olivia]

What would it actually be like?

[Host]

A sea L. Welcome back to House of Mar? A Wave original. Today's episode is sponsored by K18. Help yourself to whatever's in the fridge. The Wi Fi password is Twizzle.

[Alona]

All caps.

[Host]

We have a few house rules here you should know.

[Olivia]

Girls are magic.

[Adriana]

Reading is hot.

[Host]

And so are you. I'm Alona, and my perfect New Year's Eve is honestly, I'd say having a.

[Alona]

Glass of wine and going to bed early.

[Olivia]

Ooh, very dad of you. I'm Olivia, and my perfect New Year's Eve is a Dutch style of eating called hormeta, which is basically like you cook your own food on a grill in the middle of the table, and that's that.

[Adriana]

Well, she stole mine. My name is Adriana, and that's also my ideal. It's just the best way to do it. I was trying to describe it to someone recently and I blanked and I was like, you know, Hibachi, it's like you're your own hibachi. And then I was like, maybe I should have found a different example. Right?

[Olivia]

Dutch Hibachi.

[Adriana]

That's hibashi.

[Host]

Well, thank you everyone for tuning in this year. We've had so much fun. But if you were to tune in on YouTube, you can see the festive decorations we have.

[Alona]

We have orange slices that we'll probably.

[Host]

Put in an aperol spritz later and.

[Alona]

All sorts of fun things. And we all look amazing. So do our. Our guests on the show today.

[Olivia]

Some fabulous people on this couch here.

[Alona]

I know.

[Host]

And to give them an intro, our fourth and fifth Mars siblings are absolute legends who have earned two Olympic medals, three world championship medals, and a spot in the US Figure Skating hall of Fame. And that's not all. You guys have really done a lot. After a seven year break where they became bestselling authors, they've laced up their skates again for one of the most anticipated comebacks in sports. They are the first ice dancers of Asian descent to medal at the Olympics and the first sibling duo from the US to do it. Welcome to the family.

[Alona]

Alex and Maya Shiputani.

[Maya Shibutani]

Hello. Thank you for having us.

[Host]

Welcome home.

[Alex Shibutani]

Who's number four and who's number five?

[Host]

Oh, you're four.

[Alex Shibutani]

No, because I'm older. But I think if age wasn't part of the question, I'd for sure be five.

[Maya Shibutani]

Yeah, you would.

[Alona]

Yeah, yeah.

[Host]

We just said girls are magic and here you are.

[Alona]

It's kind of awkward, right?

[Olivia]

It's just what it is.

[Host]

And the other one, Girls are magic. And Alex.

[Olivia]

Yes, And Alex.

[Alona]

Well, thank you for having us.

[Host]

As we were talking about New Year's.

[Alona]

What is your ideal New Year's Eve?

[Maya Shibutani]

I feel like going to bed early, especially this year. So we're aligned in that way.

[Alona]

All right. 8:00pm I'll zoom you.

[Olivia]

Is that an athlete thing?

[Host]

Maybe. Just I'm not. I don't like. I don't see the thrill in staying up that late for things.

[Maya Shibutani]

I saw the ball drop for 2000 and I'm like, okay, did it. I'm good.

[Adriana]

Clear. Rest of your life.

[Alex Shibutani]

You don't want to wake up groggy on day one. No, right. Like get things on the right foot.

[Olivia]

You want to hit the ground running.

[Adriana]

Right.

[Olivia]

Well, what do you guys typically do to celebrate anything? Do you get, like crazy with it? Do a dinner. What?

[Maya Shibutani]

Normally dinner with friends or family, but then this year I'm pretty sure we're going to be at an ice rink, so. Party.

[Olivia]

Party famously.

[Alex Shibutani]

Do you train on holidays?

[Alona]

They love to do that to us.

[Host]

I Don't know if they'd love to do it to you. I've trained on 4th of July. They love to bring us right back.

[Alona]

In that we have to train on the 1st, so we can't actually do anything on New Year's, so. Oh.

[Alex Shibutani]

All the time they're trying to prevent you from getting into trouble. Taking a step back.

[Maya Shibutani]

The best gift, obviously, being with your teammates.

[Alona]

I love it.

[Alex Shibutani]

Yeah. No, we just got used to.

[Alona]

Yeah.

[Alex Shibutani]

On holidays, so that's kind of like. The rink is open, so we'll be there.

[Host]

Right. That's probably smart because it is just.

[Alona]

Less people in there, so you're almost. Well, this is a great time to do it.

[Alex Shibutani]

Interestingly, though, during the holidays, that's when everyone's thinking of going ice skating, so the rink's kind of busy, too.

[Adriana]

Yeah, that's a really good point, actually.

[Alex Shibutani]

But after January 1st, it's crickets.

[Maya Shibutani]

But it's so nice to see all these decorations because we really don't do anything ourselves just with the time, so.

[Alex Shibutani]

Yeah.

[Olivia]

So we brought the party to you.

[Maya Shibutani]

You did. Happy to do that.

[Olivia]

Happy to do that. The last time we all saw each other was in Paris, though.

[Alex Shibutani]

It was.

[Olivia]

That was the wildest day, though, when we all met.

[Alona]

Yeah.

[Olivia]

Alona's media day post meddling.

[Alex Shibutani]

You did so well. All of you did so well.

[Maya Shibutani]

Very impressive.

[Alex Shibutani]

Someone was holding a sandwich that was being slowly consumed over the course of, like, hours.

[Olivia]

I think I had a wine and a coffee for her, like, ready to go, too. You were fully preppy and you guys were there. You were doing photography for Team USA and content as well. Or how was that for you guys?

[Maya Shibutani]

It was really fun to see the other side of being at the games and supporting Team USA on that side. So for us, our focus was trying to capture what we wish we had had in moment, which was usually photos with your friends and family. And just be helpful in any way possible.

[Olivia]

I love that. Yeah. Alex, you got a family photo of all of us.

[Alex Shibutani]

I did.

[Olivia]

Exhausted. I was my favorite. No.

[Alex Shibutani]

And you were one of the few athletes that brought. I mean, people had friends maybe, but, like, it felt like an entire team and crew. Yes. Entourage.

[Adriana]

She can't shake us. We follow.

[Maya Shibutani]

Yeah.

[Alex Shibutani]

No, but it was really nice. It added to it, I think, because, like, you know, you're tired after performing or competing and doing the thing, and then you're doing interview after interview.

[Alona]

Yeah.

[Alex Shibutani]

It was fun to see your fam along for the ride, too, and those.

[Maya Shibutani]

Are all the people you want to spend time with. Anyway. Right after you're done.

[Olivia]

True.

[Alex Shibutani]

Right. So many athletes go through the process and then they're like, I haven't seen. I haven't called my mom or my dad for hours because I've been doing interviews and Yeah, I mean, they're great.

[Alona]

I guess, but shoot. I was ready to just party with my teammates, but Team USA had me doing interviews after interviews for the culture.

[Alex Shibutani]

For the culture.

[Alona]

Yeah.

[Maya Shibutani]

That's it.

[Adriana]

That's it.

[Alona]

No, it was so great.

[Host]

I mean, you guys are preparing this.

[Alona]

Year as well for hopefully those moments again. Yeah, so I'll be there.

[Alex Shibutani]

Oh, you will.

[Host]

Well, I'm hopefully going to be there.

[Alona]

But if I am there, I'll get on my camera.

[Alex Shibutani]

Yeah, you're working on your index finger.

[Alona]

Snapchat.

[Olivia]

She's going to take the family picture of you guys.

[Alona]

Yeah, I will. You won't use it, but that's okay.

[Alex Shibutani]

Where are our heads?

[Alona]

Yeah, that's a finger.

[Host]

Yeah, a finger.

[Alona]

Right.

[Olivia]

Well, we like to do a little segment called touch grass. Especially during the holidays. We can all use a reminder to breathe and touch some grass and to remind ourselves to just log off. Be in the moment, be with your family, be where you need to be. Thank you to Perplexity for helping us touch some grass today. So I want to talk New Year's resolutions because Ilona doesn't believe in them and they're a big thing this time of year. Do you believe in New Year's resolutions? What are your thoughts?

[Maya Shibutani]

I believe in them, but I also think it's flexible because we have every day where we can decide how we want to act and be.

[Host]

That's very good.

[Alex Shibutani]

Is that where you stand as well or.

[Host]

I think mine is like, everyone's okay, I'm gonna do this and I'm gonna do this and this. Well, it doesn't have to just be.

[Alona]

This time when you do that.

[Host]

So I'm gonna lose 30 pounds. I'm gonna do this. I just think there's. For me, it's things that I would.

[Alona]

Be cool if I did. I always put kind of out there.

[Host]

Things like enjoy the moment more, be more present. But I'm never. This is what I'm gonna do this year. Cause if it doesn't happen, I will feel like a failure. But it's life.

[Alex Shibutani]

Yeah. Do you think that's the athlete side of you talking in terms of like setting ob?

[Alona]

What's interesting is I don't do anymore. Cuz one time before the Tokyo Olympics, I wrote in my New Year's goals, go to The Tokyo Olympics. And then guess what happened, Covid.

[Host]

So now I don't write goals anymore.

[Maya Shibutani]

Too powerful.

[Host]

That ruined it for me. That was the reason the Olympics didn't happen. Cuz I wrote in my goal.

[Alex Shibutani]

She's saving us from future global pandemics.

[Host]

But not savings.

[Olivia]

Yeah, exactly. The power you hold.

[Alona]

Thank you.

[Host]

Exactly.

[Olivia]

I don't know. Dream.

[Adriana]

I like them, but I also don't think you need to wait as well. Like, I started like a few goals, like in the fall, and I was like. And then I can just continue them. Like I can rewrite them if I haven't completed it. But I think it's such a great time to just check in with yourself and like, what you want. And I think also writing it down has a lot of power instead of just saying it as a physical reminder. But I also think people make them really quickly. They're like, oh, it's the New Year's. I gotta. What am I doing? Whereas, like, I think if you slowly kind of collect them and then make it.

[Olivia]

Yeah, you're like setting yourself up for failure in that way. Like Alona said, I get kind of a kick out of it. I love that. Like, it all changes tomorrow. Like, that kind of energy and there you get this big burst of it at the start. But I have reframed my, like, my resolutions into goals. And I keep like a running list where it's like, learn to ride a horse. Maybe that happens. But it's on my list.

[Alex Shibutani]

Fantastical. Big ideas, big idea.

[Olivia]

Go to medieval times. Like that kind of stuff. But also journal every day. So nothing that I can really let myself down on. And if it doesn't happen, like, maybe I'll learn to ride a horse the next year. So that's where I put it.

[Alex Shibutani]

So you're in the bathroom and the mirror is all foggy and you just write big capital letters. New me.

[Olivia]

New Year. New me. Yeah, literally.

[Alona]

Are you guys journalers?

[Maya Shibutani]

I type on my phone because my handwriting's terrible. So I wouldn't be able to reread anything that I wrote down. So that wouldn't be very useful counts.

[Alex Shibutani]

I think we use our notes section. Like, we write down things that inspire us or things that we see. I don't do recaps of every day because I'm not that diligent with it. But back to the New Year's resolutions thing. Do we feel like it's a problem with sharing it publicly?

[Olivia]

Because I think if you set it.

[Alex Shibutani]

For yourself internally, like, oh, this is what I want. It's a good reminder to think about myself and how I can make improvements to things. But then when someone asks you, so, right, what are you doing? Does that change it?

[Alona]

It puts the pressure on it because then they know accountability.

[Olivia]

It holds you accountable. I think if you tell people, they.

[Alona]

Don'T know my business, but I will say I.

[Adriana]

This is so. I hate talking about this to athletes. I recently created a goal to run a mile under 10 minutes, and I posted about it, and now I got people commenting and I really hate running. I'm like, if I didn't post that video, then I. I wouldn't have to do this.

[Olivia]

Right, but now you're doing it.

[Adriana]

I just did. Shaved 37 seconds left.

[Maya Shibutani]

Congratulations.

[Host]

It is working. But just to clarify.

[Olivia]

Let's clarify.

[Alona]

We had some confusion over the text last night.

[Host]

She said, I shaved 30 seconds off my mile. And I'm like, to me, that's. You should save.

[Adriana]

Saved.

[Host]

You shaved 37 seconds off of your personal best.

[Olivia]

So 10 miles.

[Alex Shibutani]

Yes.

[Alona]

That's what I would think.

[Host]

Right, right, right. So as athletes, that's what we would think. And I was like, that's awesome, Audrey.

[Alona]

Because her personal best is like 10 minutes.

[Host]

Well, let's go for nine minutes after this. She's like, what are you talking about? I shaved 37 seconds off of my. The 11, the 12 minute miles you just ran. I was like, what are you. And so they all think that I'm judging her. They were like, it was in a text chain. Olivia's trying to explain it. And then I was like, okay, guys, what you gotta be, what you gotta understand is when you say that, I.

[Alona]

Think it's off your personal best.

[Olivia]

Right?

[Host]

Sorry, I don't know the logo. You don't know the lingo, the athlete lingo.

[Adriana]

Don't create goals for me. This is my goal.

[Alex Shibutani]

But with people knowing, I think people are most likely just supporting you and cheering you, as opposed to you internalizing it and feeling like, oh, like there's pressure.

[Olivia]

Right.

[Adriana]

I'm glad I posted about it.

[Olivia]

And people are like, holding me accountable.

[Adriana]

Because I'm like, okay, I'm doing it for them.

[Alona]

You're doing it for them.

[Alex Shibutani]

New Year's resolutions for other people.

[Host]

Do it more for other people and.

[Alona]

Their happiness, not mine.

[Olivia]

So do you each have a maybe like a goal resolution, a loose idea theme of something you want to do going into the new year?

[Maya Shibutani]

I'm 31 now, and so I love being in my 30s. And one of the things that I really feel is that I'm discovering more who I am. So I want to stick to that path.

[Olivia]

Love.

[Maya Shibutani]

There's a lot of external noise all the time, but I'm starting to do a better job of listening to myself, so I'd like to continue.

[Olivia]

I feel that way too. Being 30, I feel like I've learned so much of what doesn't suit me and I'm trying to work so hard to make sure. When I feel that, trust it, like lean into that and continue to navigate in that way. So that's a really good one. I like that.

[Alex Shibutani]

I liked being 31. Yeah, that was a good year.

[Olivia]

I was 31 once.

[Alex Shibutani]

As a 34 year old heading into the mid 30s. I'm trying to cling to 31, but it's getting further and further away.

[Adriana]

Let it go.

[Host]

You're going to be 40 soon.

[Alex Shibutani]

No, that's good advice. I know, right? Woo.

[Olivia]

Boom.

[Host]

This job's a microwave.

[Alex Shibutani]

Can we cut to commercial?

[Olivia]

This interview's done.

[Host]

This interview's done.

[Maya Shibutani]

Your goal?

[Alex Shibutani]

Well, that's what you get when you're the fifth sibling, right? It's okay. My goal. I need to think about it a little bit.

[Maya Shibutani]

I know something you told me.

[Alex Shibutani]

Oh, what did I tell you?

[Maya Shibutani]

You said that you wanted to be more intentional about photography.

[Olivia]

Okay, what does that mean?

[Alex Shibutani]

So photography started off as a hobby for me and it was something that I did to kind of like balance out my sports training life. And it was a way to be creative and share memories and connect with people that I was meeting at all these international competitions. And it was really fun. And then it became something that was for a good reason, like an opportunity. And it became a little bit of work. And so when we met in Paris. Well, we actually met at, in November, I think before the games at the promo shoot.

[Alona]

Yeah, the day.

[Alex Shibutani]

But that process started and I was like, oh, now this is pressure. Now I feel like there are expectations. And so I'm going to try to work myself back into doing it just for personal and for fun and see where it takes me.

[Olivia]

And are you still finding the fun in it?

[Alex Shibutani]

I look for it right now with our training, there's not very much time and so I do miss being able to do it. But like when you squeeze in like 15 minutes during your day to take a photo, you don't take very good photos. I went for a 15 minute walk and I got this shot of the sidewalk and this shot of a flower. But you know, it's a process.

[Olivia]

Being intentional.

[Alex Shibutani]

Yes, I think that's a good one.

[Olivia]

Can we look this up?

[Adriana]

Where did the tradition of New Year's resolutions come from perplexity?

[Alex Shibutani]

Ancient Babylon?

[Adriana]

No, it's old.

[Alona]

Ancient.

[Adriana]

Okay.

[Alex Shibutani]

I thought Babylon was ancient without the ancient.

[Olivia]

Yeah, right.

[Host]

No, there was a time before it was crazy.

[Olivia]

Thought the ancient was assumed.

[Host]

No, not bab.

[Alona]

Not the Babylon now though.

[Perplexity AI]

Oh yeah.

[Olivia]

The tradition of New Year's resolutions is usually traced back about 4,000 years to the ancient Babylonians and was later reshaped by the Romans and then by Christian practices in early modern Europe. It's old. I had no idea.

[Adriana]

I would have thought it was a capitalism thing, if I'm going to be honest. Like a Valentine's Day.

[Host]

Right.

[Alex Shibutani]

To get you to buy stuff.

[Olivia]

Buy more journals.

[Alona]

Like buy like. Or the health industry. To get people to lose weight to buy their diet stuff.

[Alex Shibutani]

Big gym package.

[Olivia]

Big gym. Yes, exactly.

[Host]

Big Jim is all doing it. Well, there you go. It's been old. I thought so I guess everyone was.

[Alona]

Doing it back in the day.

[Olivia]

Interesting. In medieval Europe, similar start of year vows appeared such as knights renewing chivalric oaths and the so called peacock vow. By the 17th century, Protestant groups like the Puritans emphasized sober reflection at the turn of the year, encouraging personal pledges to live more virtuously rather than festive access. Virtuously, Virtuously. So this says here sober reflection. So Dry Jan existed back then is what I'm hearing in medieval times.

[Host]

I don't know if it did.

[Alona]

I think that's.

[Alex Shibutani]

That sounds like a push by a big liquid iv.

[Alona]

Yeah, yeah.

[Host]

We gotta look into this. We gotta.

[Olivia]

That's interesting. Well, thank you for plexity.

[Host]

I love the feeling of being at the top of my game.

[Olivia]

And this year I'm taking New Year's resolutions seriously, making sure hair is at the top of my priorities.

[Adriana]

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[Alona]

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[Olivia]

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[Adriana]

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[Alona]

So you can keep using bleach and color. I just use heat and I feel like I've been using a lot of heat because I've been styling my hair much more so K18 has me covered and it still makes me feel like me, you know, they're so good like that.

[Olivia]

Their heat protectant is my favorite. Guys, I think I came up with a resolution I can actually stick to always using K18 before applying heat.

[Host]

You got that? On you.

[Olivia]

I got that. I keep that on me.

[Host]

You got that thing on you.

[Adriana]

So whether you dye it on the regular or just want to keep your long hair from breaking, with K18 you'll have soft, strong, bouncy hair shop K18's.

[Host]

Molecular repair mask at Sephora or get 10% off your first purchase with code [e-mail] that's code M A H E.

[Olivia]

[e-mail] as you may know, my sisters.

[Adriana]

And I love to eat. We're not shy about it and I love to eat without worrying if I'm getting all my nutrients.

[Host]

And this year we are all going to be more proactive about supporting our immune health.

[Olivia]

Huh? There's no right time for better health. There's just now AG1 is the easiest and most impactful habit you can implement.

[Host]

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[Adriana]

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[Olivia]

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[Host]

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[Adriana]

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[Olivia]

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[Host]

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[Alona]

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[Adriana]

That's drinkag1.com mar drinkag1.com mar this episode.

[Perplexity AI]

Is brought to you by Jack Daniels Jack Daniels and music are made for each other. They share a rhythm in the craft of making something timeless while being a part of legendary nights. From backyard jams to sold out arenas, there's a song in every toast. Please drink responsibly. Responsibility.org Jack Daniels and Old Number 7 are registered trademarks. Tennessee Whiskey 40% alcohol by volume. Jack Daniel Distillery Lynchburg, Tennessee.

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[Alona]

Alex and Maya, you've just returned to the ice after a seven year break. What made you decide to return and were you like, really excited for it? Were you a little bit nervous for it?

[Maya Shibutani]

The last time we competed was at the Olympics in 2018.

[Alona]

Oh my goodness.

[Maya Shibutani]

Following that, we never retired. We were still performing in shows and we were teaching seminars also exploring other aspects of life. But then I think it was a circumstance in 2019 where I had kidney cancer. And then there was Covid, where our lives just kind of moved away from the ice naturally. But then Alex had the really great idea to bring me back to the ice just to skate for fun. There was no pressure at that time when he suggested that we get on the ice. It really wasn't to be training like we are now, but we just felt our own potential and the love of the sport.

[Alex Shibutani]

It's always been such a big part of our lives, at least since we were 9 and 12 and we started skating together. And at that time, Maya was going through a difficult personal period and it was something that I thought could allow her to sort of reconnect because sport, the way that we use our bodies, the way that we communicate with others, and then in a creative sport like skating, you express yourself with music and movement. And that's something that we were kind of missing a little bit while we were away from the ice. But it's obviously still a part of you. But it ended up being really fun and it allowed us to kind of re engage with each other in a different way.

[Olivia]

And was it almost like a reclaiming of your body again? Like after having come through this experience, was it that coming back into yourself and reclaiming almost completely?

[Maya Shibutani]

Following my surgery in 2019, I felt so disconnected when that happened. I was 25 and we had just come off of training really steadily for a good 14 years. And so I felt super in shape and fit. But then Alex put it kindly that I was going through A hard time. I was pretty depressed. Depressed and just struggling. But then being active and performing again in that way, more for myself, I fell in love with the feeling.

[Adriana]

Now, you said that you didn't retire, that you took a break. Does it frustrate you when people say that? Like, oh, you're coming out of retirement. Does that phrase annoy you?

[Maya Shibutani]

It doesn't frustrate me because seven years away is unusual. I know that other athletes kind of have a bit of a sticky relationship with retirement, just because that speaks of transition and closing a chapter. So it doesn't bother me at all. But I think that we've just learned through this journey that it's important to follow your dreams and pursue what you want in the moment. Because we all just have this one life.

[Alex Shibutani]

We just look at each other and we're like, that's misinformed. It's an assumption.

[Maya Shibutani]

Right.

[Olivia]

What else are you gonna do?

[Alex Shibutani]

Yeah, it's not a big deal, because we know the choices that we've made and why we've decided to do it again. And the interesting thing about our sport and other sports, where there's subjectivity and judging is you grow up in this climate of trying to do your best, but obviously get a certain score or get the approval of the judges, who then give you your marks, which lead to a certain outcome. And I think that the separation from competitive skating for seven years gave us an opportunity to experience life in a more dimensional way. We have different perspective coming back into it, and so now we're doing it very much for ourselves.

[Olivia]

And have you noticed a change in who you are as a skater from then to now? Like, has there been a big change, or has it just been a natural flow back into it?

[Maya Shibutani]

I feel like I'm even more present when we're competing. People ask us all the time now, are you nervous being out there? I just really treasure the moment because you put so much training and time into preparation. And so that's the big change. Because with time away from somewhere, you really feel the difference. And so I feel more empowered this time around.

[Alex Shibutani]

We wish there were more opportunities to perform in competitions, but, you know, you never know how it's gonna feel. Cause seven years away from. In that environment, you obviously have the confidence that you can, but you don't know how it's gonna feel until you're out there. And so when we stepped on the ice for the first time after seven years, it was like, oh, you know, no, we had the right intuition here. We really enjoy this. This is a Very unique thing that not very many people get to experience. Like, when you take the pitch. Is that the right terminology? When you take the pitch, what are the, what are the emotions that you feel?

[Alona]

You know, I think it's so funny.

[Host]

I'm like, listen to everything you're saying.

[Alona]

I'm like, okay, that's.

[Host]

I'm actually learning a lot too, because.

[Alona]

I'm kind of taking some time off and I'm trying to, like, deal with that and not being on the field. And I feel like that was my whole purpose for so long. And so now I just feel lost in many ways.

[Host]

And I think I liked what he.

[Alona]

Said is coming back and being present and enjoying. I remember I was talking to my sports psych and I was talking about.

[Host]

Oh, you know, coming back for the.

[Alona]

Olympics and there's like so many deals beforehand. And he's like, well, that can't be the reason you come back. You have to come back because you absolutely enjoy, love it. Because you want to spend the moments grinding with your teammates, putting your body in line, the bus rides and whatnot. I thought that was a really good perspective to put it in because I.

[Host]

Think in both of our sports, who.

[Alona]

Knows what's going to happen? You can be selected, you're not. And so that was important for me is enjoy the process.

[Host]

And before games, I just, I feel nervous.

[Alona]

But I love feeling nervous because I think that I just say all the time, nerves mean I care. Nerves mean I want to do my best out there. And I don't know if you guys do it. So we have like a tunnel. So you wait in a tunnel before you go out for a game and imagine the same as you're just waiting there and then you go out there and then after you're probably a few seconds like, okay, this is what I do. This is chill. But it's, it's been an interesting time for me to have. Not have rugby and not to express myself in that way. And I mean, for seven years, you know, you took time off. I think I hope that in this time I'll really realize, oh, this is just something I love to do. Because I did think I did start to get tired of it. I was like, oh, gosh, I gotta go play a sport I love out in the sun with my friends all day. Oh, gosh, that sucks. So I'm trying to reframe it. So it's been really. It's lovely to hear you guys talk about that.

[Alex Shibutani]

Yeah, it's. I think we both unders. We all seem to Understand the privilege and the opportunity that comes with pressure and the stress that relates to that. But one of the things that I think really helped us with our initial transition as we were beginning to not compete on a regular basis starting seven years ago, was allowing curiosity to take the wheel, really moving into things with a beginner's mindset. And I get the sense that having watched you on Dancing with the Stars and all the amazing challenges that you're taking on, the three of you, you just embrace it head on. And the. The beauty of being able to do that with family, and you're taking the skills that you developed throughout your athletic career and translating them one way or another into everything else.

[Alona]

Trying to.

[Host]

It didn't help me as much in.

[Alona]

The Dance for the Star. You guys might kill it.

[Olivia]

You guys are. Eat that up.

[Alex Shibutani]

It must have.

[Host]

I don't know, man, because it's so different.

[Alona]

Our sports, right, Is, you know, you guys, you learn a routine. I just don't. I don't do routines. So mine is, whatever they do, I'm.

[Host]

Gonna have to figure out what to.

[Alona]

Do next and be reactive.

[Host]

It was tough, but I think it's.

[Alona]

Been so cool to do all those opportunities. Will you guys ever do Dance with the Stars?

[Maya Shibutani]

They'd make us compete against each other, which I don't know.

[Alona]

How do it.

[Olivia]

Feel about it?

[Maya Shibutani]

Do it.

[Alona]

That'll be good.

[Olivia]

You'll level up again.

[Maya Shibutani]

If you're a fourth sibling, then maybe that's a good thing.

[Alona]

Right?

[Olivia]

I mean, ice dance is. Isn't it kind of described almost as ballroom dancing on the ice?

[Maya Shibutani]

In a way, the way the ice dance has shifted. It's more every type of dance. But on the ice, there is kind of a base through ballroom.

[Alex Shibutani]

Yeah.

[Alona]

Can you explain to us, Olivia? Explain it to me a little bit. But explain the different dances so people can understand a little more.

[Maya Shibutani]

Sure. In ice dance.

[Olivia]

Yeah.

[Maya Shibutani]

Okay. So in figure skating, there are five ladies men, ice dance, pairs, and synchronized skating. But then with ice dance, when you compete, there are two programs. The rhythm dance, which is a program with a theme that's designated by the International Skating Union. And they tell you what they generally want you to do.

[Alex Shibutani]

Each year, it changes. So they commune and decide what the theme is going to be. And it is, I suppose, a way to create a competition format where the audience can sort of watch a genre being performed and the judges have the ability to better compare routines because it's not.

[Maya Shibutani]

It's very cooking show. You all get the same ingredients in the basket kind of.

[Alex Shibutani]

It's not fruits and vegetables, apples and oranges, I suppose.

[Maya Shibutani]

And then there's the free dance.

[Alex Shibutani]

Yes, the free dance, which is you can select any music that you want. Obviously. So many rules. And rules can be very frustrating and restrictive. But also they provide an opportunity to be creative and come up with something unique, really. Figure skating used to be very traditional, so you mentioned ballroom dance and how there may be some similarities. Now they allow you to use lyrics.

[Maya Shibutani]

Change happens, Big Chef.

[Alex Shibutani]

Change happens very soon in our sport. I think one of the reasons why people enjoy watching it on television or when the Olympics happen to be on is because it does sort of feel like a time capsule. Like you're watching it with your grandmother and she's like, oh, this feels like how it felt when I was watching it on television. We like to try to shake things up, though, like shake the snow globe a bit and add a couple of different elements in there. So for us, we're most inspired when we're creating stories and performing things that we have personal connection to.

[Maya Shibutani]

It's like you were saying, where you don't know what the outcome will be, but it's still about the process and how you spend every day. And so we really feel like we have to stand behind what we're creating.

[Alex Shibutani]

Yeah. When you have so little control on outcome and perception, it's better to just do something that you really love as opposed to reverse engineer something that you think will win or that you think people will receive well. Yeah, yeah.

[Olivia]

Interesting. And what do you have to do to qualify for Milan?

[Maya Shibutani]

Compete at the National Championships in January. So similar to gymnastics or I think swimming does it where it's right before. They don't set the team until about a month out.

[Alex Shibutani]

Yeah. So skate well at the National Championships. And it's, you know, nationals are always an intense. I don't know how your qualification works for rugby, but it's just there's a lot of pressure, but not necessarily more pressure than any other competition. Depending on the type of athlete that you are, you want to do your best every single time you go out there. And so it's really just enjoying the experience together. And that's the different perspective that I think we're bringing into it now.

[Alona]

It's similar to us. And I think somebody was recently, I.

[Host]

Was like, oh, yeah, I'm going to.

[Alona]

Try to go for the LA Olympics. Like, okay, so you've made the team. I'm like, no. He's like, oh, but you're going to.

[Host]

Be on the team?

[Alona]

I'm like, no, no, I will know.

[Host]

If I've made the team about two.

[Alona]

Months to a month and a half beforehand. He's like, oh, well, what? Because it is like. I think people get that wrong. Oh, the Olympians. Oh, you're just gonna go to the Olympic Games?

[Host]

No, there's a whole process.

[Alona]

And I know for like some sports it's a month out. Like, you guys, it's a few weeks.

[Host]

Out before you get that last spot.

[Alona]

So it's really a battle until that one moment. Do you guys work with sports? Psych. I imagine you do. Because, like, for you guys, how many dances will you do a day?

[Maya Shibutani]

We're working on the two.

[Alex Shibutani]

We're dancing all the time.

[Olivia]

Right.

[Adriana]

Right now.

[Maya Shibutani]

What kind of project?

[Alona]

They danced in the door.

[Alex Shibutani]

Yeah.

[Alona]

No.

[Alex Shibutani]

So in a competition, it's one program each day. And so those two programs combine to lead to the final result.

[Alona]

And how long will those be?

[Maya Shibutani]

The first one is three minutes and the second one is four minutes.

[Host]

Four.

[Alona]

We have similar sports. Mine is like, of course longer, but it's a 14 minute game. So they're so short and you have to really give it all. So I've really learned again, how we've had to deal with pract pressure. I don't know if you guys do any, like, mantras.

[Alex Shibutani]

I'm.

[Alona]

I'm a big. I talk to myself a lot. I say words. I've been big into breathing. If you do any of that.

[Alex Shibutani]

Yeah, breathing is important.

[Olivia]

Yeah.

[Alona]

Crazy important in general, but also mostly for sports.

[Maya Shibutani]

Do you say things out loud or is it.

[Alona]

I do. I do say things out loud. I'll say, like, words and whatnot and little mantras as I. Like in the Olympics, as I'm going down the tunnel, I'll start just talking to myself. Talking to myself. And I'm like, zoned in. And then I'm breathing in the tunnel. And then as I get out there, like, let's go.

[Alex Shibutani]

No, it's a real. And that's something that I'm sure developed over time for you. You found the things that worked and sort of. When I visualize what our processes become, your control and mastery of your mind and your body and synergizing everything into 14 minutes or everything into three minutes or four minutes. It's like knowing how to pull the different lovers. Yeah, it's like being a DJ and knowing exactly how to, like, cross fade into the next song. And just so that if you. You make mistakes over the course of your career where it's like, I was a little too amped up early on or I was a little too reserved, and I could have used a little bit more energy.

[Maya Shibutani]

But it's so nice for you that you have teammates, and I know that for me, I love having a teammate and a family member there with me because it just makes everything feel even more grounded.

[Alex Shibutani]

I think it takes a lot of bravery to, in that anecdote, when you're saying, someone's like, oh, are you getting ready for the 28 Olympics? And you say, yes, and they're like, oh, are you on the team already? A lot of people can't imagine committing so much time and energy to a goal or a dream that's so far away. If we're talking about New Year's resolutions, that's just like a year ahead, but then we're talking three, four years in the future. But it's being able to separate. Obviously, you're a confident person, or we try to be confident people in order to achieve our dreams. But how do you take that confidence internally, but then also still be like, well, it hasn't happened yet, but I hope that it will.

[Maya Shibutani]

And I think the balance is you can be confident externally and have that inner confidence too. But I think it's so important to be able to be vulnerable with the people around you, which is what I love about family and close friends. Because you can't be one way all the time, right?

[Alona]

Oh, I, I, that's such a great point. I think the confidence that I show, I, I, I'm very confident. But, but also, there are times when it's just so hard. And even in the environment, I am, I, I don't, you know, I am.

[Host]

A great rugby player and whatnot.

[Alona]

But there are times when I'm like, am I gonna be able to get.

[Host]

Back to where I was, the fitness I was. So it's definitely a balance. But having them and working with them, which is great, it can be tough at times.

[Alona]

I mean, as I imagine you all know. But the having a sounding board off of.

[Host]

But it's different because they don't, they don't do rugby.

[Alona]

How is it doing the same sport with your siblings?

[Maya Shibutani]

I love it because we've been through so many ups and downs together. I think in 2019, that was one of the huge challenges for me dealing with a personal health issue, because I felt isolated, even though I had support around me. But as far as being on the ice together, there's so much communication, and we just know each other very, very well. But at the end of the day, we have the same goal, so we Always know that we're on each other's side.

[Alex Shibutani]

And it's not just the accumulation of positive experiences where it's like, oh, I've got this teammate. Where we've accomplished amazing things together. It's the times when things haven't gone well, or the BS that you deal with as an athlete growing up in a sport and navigating all of the challenges and pressures that are associated with that. Like, we have. We have won together, we've lost together, we've learned together. And there's a real unique comfort in having that type of dynamic with a person who you've known well your entire.

[Maya Shibutani]

Life, my entire life, part of yours.

[Alex Shibutani]

Whatever, and most of mine. So I think for us, it's like, really cool to see what the three of you are doing too, because I don't know, we grew up assuming like, oh, yeah, siblings are close. And then you meet more people and they're like, yeah, are you going home for the holidays? It's like, no, I can't stand my siblings.

[Host]

Isn't that crazy when you hear that?

[Olivia]

The amount of people that are like, because, you know, I assisted you to alone, I'm like, we all have this. We work together. People are like, I could never work with my sibling. I'm like, sucks to suck. I love what I do. It's my dream job. These are my people. I mean, there's pros and cons, of course, to any relationship, working or family wise, but it's good cause they have you, no matter what. They've seen you through every phase of life and are still there for you at the end.

[Alex Shibutani]

Apparently not, though.

[Olivia]

Apparently not other people, I guess.

[Adriana]

Sorry.

[Maya Shibutani]

But for us, with the seven years away, it was so important to have separate individual experiences. And I really feel the growth in that regard. Because when we're back on the ice as teammates, we're able to pull from different things. It's not all the same thing.

[Alex Shibutani]

Yeah, we can teach each other or sort of advise each other based on those different experiences, which is cool.

[Olivia]

Interesting.

[Adriana]

What are some common misconceptions about figure skating? Obviously there's a lot of media about it. What is something they get wrong?

[Maya Shibutani]

If you watch any figure skating movie, it's usually that we don't get along with hockey players or something. Right?

[Alex Shibutani]

Right.

[Alona]

Ugh.

[Alex Shibutani]

They smell, they mess up the ice.

[Maya Shibutani]

We get along with hockey players. The women's team for Team USA is awesome. And then all the guys that we've met, I think there's so much mutual respect with other athletes where it's super easy to get along and build rapport right away.

[Alex Shibutani]

Yeah. I think you just were very fortunate to have reached a level where like being at the Paris Games and meeting athletes from a completely different season of sport, it's so fascinating to learn about the process. And you do see these interesting parallels and similarities. And everyone requires so much commitment and there's a lot of sacrifice. And so that being a misperception that hockey players and figure skaters don't like each other, I think that's more sort of catered towards movies. When there's a will, they won't they sort of dynamic.

[Olivia]

He's the hockey player, they get along. In the books I read, I'll tell you that.

[Maya Shibutani]

Another one. Not all figure skaters can do a triple axel. That's one of the first questions that we go like, can you do a triple axel? It's like, no, that's not our discipline. And then when people say skating, they're like, oh, oh, skateboarding. And we're like, no, figure skating. Close, close almost, but no.

[Alex Shibutani]

Growing up, you would meet someone at school and they'd be like, oh, what do you do? And I'd say, oh, I skate. And the first thought is like, oh, skateboarding. Can you do an ollie? It's like, no, no, no, it's like ice skating. It's like, oh, so like speed skating. No, no, not speed skating. It's like figure skating. And then ice dance is like, what's that?

[Olivia]

Yeah, right, right.

[Alex Shibutani]

But I think that we've been working hard to try and put ice dance more on the map.

[Alona]

Oh, for sure. Yeah, I do think that's so right. The idea that athletes are competitive or judging of each other, I've not seen that much. When you're in the Olympic village, you start watching every sport there is and have such respect for it.

[Host]

It's so funny.

[Alona]

The comments, the negative comments I get are always from people who aren't in sports. And then I have the best rugby players in the world who are the men's rugby, who are the nicest. To me, it's like there's a camaraderie there. I think athletes respect athletes, whatever. Discipline, right?

[Olivia]

And always like putting the good name of ice dance out there. Do you feel this pressure to be like squeaky clean role models or what is that like?

[Maya Shibutani]

Maybe when we were younger, because we teamed up when we were 9 and 12 and I think just growing up in an environment where everyone is kind of aware of who you are, it makes you more on watch, kind of.

[Alex Shibutani]

Even pre social Media just constantly being judged, you know, in a sport that is judged. Right.

[Maya Shibutani]

But now I feel like it's so healthy to just be yourself because we're all so dimensional. And that's really what I would want in a role model, is someone who's able to not just be squeaky clean and perfect all the time.

[Olivia]

That's Alona's. Alona's like, sometimes she'll post things. She's like, well, I'm an adult woman. Like, I'm a. I'm a role model, but also I am an adult woman who is her own person. I'm not going to dim myself to be what, you know, society thinks I should all the time.

[Host]

Yeah, well, because there's a lot that.

[Alona]

Comes with that role model title and so much about being perfect and doing all this. And I'm like, I am great at that.

[Host]

Like, I'm a good person, but also.

[Alona]

So there's stuff about me I wouldn't want you to replicate in all this. So I think I am a role model, but I think what people have attached to the term role model is perfection. Never doing anything wrong.

[Host]

It's like, no, I get mad.

[Alona]

I do all this. I've said the wrong things before, so.

[Host]

I'm wary with that word.

[Alona]

I do think I am one, but.

[Host]

I'm wary with it.

[Maya Shibutani]

You're really great.

[Alona]

Thanks. I was fishing there.

[Alex Shibutani]

You're really great. I said it too.

[Alona]

Yeah.

[Alex Shibutani]

Trying to retain this.

[Olivia]

Girls are magic.

[Alex Shibutani]

Reading is hot.

[Olivia]

Speaking of girls being magic, Maya, do you feel like you're judged differently as a female athlete versus a male athlete?

[Maya Shibutani]

Definitely. I think there are certain conversations that female athletes have to navigate, whether it's how you're perceived. There's more of a focus on the visual versus the performance. And I feel like what's been so healthy for me this time around is that the way that I reconnected with my body and got in shape. I was very patient with myself on my timeline. And it's more about how strong I feel versus how I look.

[Olivia]

Love that.

[Alona]

And for you, Alex, any problems?

[Olivia]

Any problems being a male athlete? You wanna join this conversation?

[Alex Shibutani]

Obviously, when I was growing up in the sport, I received a lot of positive reinforcement. There's a lot of encouragement that gets directed towards young male skaters because people don't wanna lose them to other sports. And there's maybe an awareness that if you are a male skater, you might be receiving from other communities for being in the sport of figure skating. And so I was always, like, encouraged almost unfairly when I Didn't deserve it. I was winning participation medals because I was the only boy in the competition. And Mai was winning actual medals. She's winning war. But people were telling me, oh, Alex, you did such a great job. So I'm sitting in the backseat with Maya with my fake participation medal being like, yeah, we're the same. We're both good at this. And when we started skating together, that was more a wake up call because it's like, oh, she's like, so much better than me.

[Olivia]

Interesting.

[Alex Shibutani]

Yeah. But I mean, I don't think that there's really. It's unique that we're in a sport where men and women work together.

[Alona]

Right.

[Alex Shibutani]

And then it's even more unique that we are siblings in this sport where there aren't very many.

[Adriana]

How is it when people compare the two of you? I. That was my thing growing up. I hated being compared to them. That was like my whole shtick. It was something that I always tried to, like, shove. But it feels. Feels inevitable when you guys are partners together. Has it gotten better? How do you deal with it?

[Maya Shibutani]

I feel like that just happens with siblings all the time. I mean, with us, usually they'll either package deal us where they just assume that we're completely the same, or that we're twins even though we're not, and assume that we like all the same things, or they'll compare us to each other. And that can really kind of mess with your sense of self as you're growing up. But it's really been taking the time to build our own relationships, find our own friends, follow our natural curiosities that I think have helped us better define who we are.

[Alex Shibutani]

Yeah, some of those identity things can really, like, set themselves on you or come from external places at a very young age simply based on the assumptions that people make because of who's the oldest one or who seems to be the most outgoing in that particular moment. And that can kind of follow you through your life where it's like, oh, Alex is the outgoing one and Maya's the quiet one. Well, actually, Maya is. Is only going to say something that's worthwhile when there is something to say. And Alex just runs his mouth all the time, you know, like those types of things. You and me both are interesting to navigate, but we always have conversations about it and try to give each other the space to be individuals. And it's cool to be able to, you know, be the Shibutani siblings or the shib sibs or whatever. And so we try to make the most of It. If people want to put us together and see us as a singular entity, it's like, okay, well, then there's a power in that.

[Olivia]

Maybe. Alona asked earlier about, I'm now wondering, sports psychs. You say you do see them. Do you see one separately or ever together, since you are a team, how does that work?

[Maya Shibutani]

We work with the same one, and we'll do team sessions, but then also individual sessions.

[Olivia]

Cool.

[Maya Shibutani]

Interesting.

[Alex Shibutani]

It's really helpful to be able to break that down, because especially even with family, there are experiences that you go through in life, or as an athlete in this case, that people might not be able to relate to as much as they try. And to be real with them opens up a window or a door to something that they could then become very concerned about. But it's just the reality of what your experience is. And someone who's professionally able to navigate that with you is super important to have.

[Maya Shibutani]

But then when it comes to identity as siblings, I feel like we give each other the space to explore, but then also the support because we're able to have those conversations about, oh, how did that experience make me feel? Or, what do you think? Or like, I remember asking Alex, what do you think? Am I too quiet? And he's like, no, no. You're just very thoughtful. And so it's nice to have someone reframe the situation who knows you and.

[Olivia]

Can see that to be loved is to be known. We're gonna do a quick lightning round, A shib sib lightning round. Ready?

[Alex Shibutani]

Yes.

[Olivia]

Go to coffee order.

[Alex Shibutani]

But how do we do this with two people?

[Olivia]

Say it at the exact same time.

[Alona]

Shout it into the mic.

[Olivia]

What are the.

[Alex Shibutani]

I need rules.

[Alona]

We'll do fourth sibling, then fifth sibling.

[Olivia]

Yeah.

[Adriana]

Okay.

[Maya Shibutani]

Iced black coffee.

[Olivia]

Iced black coffee.

[Alex Shibutani]

Yeah, iced black. No, hot black coffee.

[Olivia]

Okay. Hot black coffee.

[Alona]

Oh, interesting.

[Maya Shibutani]

Interesting read into that.

[Host]

I'm done with this cold.

[Adriana]

What are you competitive with each other about?

[Maya Shibutani]

Are we competitive with each other? This is meant to be lightning round.

[Host]

We are similar kids.

[Alex Shibutani]

It was dumb stuff. Really dumb stuff, like who could hit the elevator button first?

[Olivia]

Fair.

[Alex Shibutani]

You know, who got to hit it. I think that we're competitive together about the things that we care about.

[Alona]

Who is your favorite athlete? Current fave skater?

[Maya Shibutani]

I mean, I feel like coming out of Paris, you're everyone's. Don't look at me.

[Alona]

Maya.

[Host]

I knew they were gonna say that stuff.

[Maya Shibutani]

No, it's true.

[Alex Shibutani]

Well, that's why you asked the question.

[Host]

I was fishing again.

[Maya Shibutani]

I feel like there's been a real shit shift in athletes in this country, but it's really been led by female athletes. And I think that you just did such an amazing job of being authentically yourself, and that's what I love so much. Obviously, the player that you are on the field, but the person that you are.

[Alex Shibutani]

Yeah. And it's a shift that's taken generations. Like, so many athletes have been a part of it. But it felt like during a spotlight moment where the world was really focusing on the games and Paris being such a spectacle, you really popped for being yourself and being real and excited about your sport. And then to see you carry it in with all this momentum into growing the game and being a strong voice for your community, it's awesome.

[Maya Shibutani]

And this isn't a lightning round answer, but we were behind the scenes.

[Olivia]

Yeah, you were there.

[Maya Shibutani]

We saw you with your family. We saw you when you were tired. We saw you with your teammates. And just the type of character that you showed in every, every situation, that's what you hope for.

[Host]

Clip that one. Remember that. Thank you so much.

[Alona]

Guys, get back to them.

[Host]

Get back to lighting.

[Olivia]

Okay. Best restaurant in la.

[Maya Shibutani]

Should we give up our spots?

[Alex Shibutani]

You don't have to. I see people who do that about this.

[Host]

Like, I see who tick tocking. Like, I. I was gonna gatekeep this place. Gatekeep it.

[Olivia]

Go ahead.

[Host]

Gatekeep it. Okay.

[Olivia]

If you love it, don't let the people know. Tell me off the.

[Alex Shibutani]

We can say a restaurant that we like. That is people go there.

[Olivia]

Okay.

[Alex Shibutani]

We really like Major Domo. Oh, Major Domo's in Chinatown, north of downtown. I'm giving a geography lesson on Los Angeles now. David Chang is.

[Olivia]

Yeah, I was gonna say it's David Chang's restaurant.

[Alona]

I was like, hold on.

[Alex Shibutani]

We got a really beautiful patio. It's a nice place to go with friends. A lot of shareable plates.

[Maya Shibutani]

Sometimes we'll just go and have a nice dinner with each other.

[Alex Shibutani]

That's right. Most of the time, we just go there together.

[Host]

That's what we do.

[Alona]

We go to a lot of nice dinners just together. We do some of the most fun things. And it's just three again.

[Olivia]

Once again, I love that. We got to go.

[Alona]

How's your handshake? Are you a solid. Do you solid handshakes, Alex? Yeah, it's good handshake.

[Host]

That's my pet peeve.

[Alona]

Bad handshakes.

[Alex Shibutani]

I'm like, what's weak?

[Host]

What is that? We judge people based on.

[Olivia]

I do.

[Alex Shibutani]

Maya doesn't like. You don't like the.

[Maya Shibutani]

When people try and crush my hand. Don't love that.

[Olivia]

That's what I do when I do like a man my age, I'm like, good. I grab the upper arm too, and.

[Alex Shibutani]

I'm like, did ya?

[Olivia]

Right. I boost her dominance early is what I'm trying to say. That was an amazing lightning round. Thank you for that.

[Host]

The holidays have been flying by.

[Alona]

I actually cannot believe that New Year's is literally tomorrow.

[Olivia]

Oh, my God. I have to pick a dress and figure out where we're gonna be at midnight.

[Adriana]

Our living room.

[Olivia]

Could it be our couch?

[Alex Shibutani]

Yeah. Whoa.

[Alona]

Whoa.

[Olivia]

Interesting. I'll get dressed up.

[Adriana]

I know Times Square always has a ball drop, but I was kind of confused. Why is that the main attraction?

[Host]

I think I might know a way to find out. Perplexity is an AI powered answer engine that searches the Internet in real time to give you fast, high quality answers. Resources. No chatbots here. Say you're curious about the origins of the New Year's Eve ball drop in New York City. You can ask Perplexity, and it will give you a detailed answer in seconds, complete with links to the latest sources so you can easily verify information or dive deeper.

[Olivia]

Perplexity says in the 1800, time, balls were installed so ships could see a ball fall at a precise time each day to set their clocks. In 1907, the owner of the New York Times used that old time ball idea to create a lit ball that would descend from a pole in Times Square. It falls exactly at midnight to signal the start of the new year so millions of people can experience the same exact moment together.

[Host]

Perplexity. Ask Perplexity anything at pplx. AI Forward slash. House of Mar.

[Adriana]

We have authors in the house. Welcome.

[Host]

Welcome.

[Adriana]

Maya and Alex wrote a series of children's books called Kudo Kids, about siblings who solve mysteries together, as well as a book called Incredible Asian Americans and Pacific Islanders who Changed the World. Take us through your writing process.

[Maya Shibutani]

We were so fortunate that we were able to transfer working together in a form of storytelling on the ice to a different type of storytelling through writing. And so I'd say there was a lot of give and take and equal participation, which was fun. We both always loved reading growing up, and so writing kind of was just a fun next step.

[Alex Shibutani]

Yeah, we read a lot of the same books either at the same time, you know, raced through Harry Potter, for example. It's just one of those things that, you know, you grew up with siblings, and you watch a lot of the same stuff, you read a lot of the same things, and it occupies a lot of Your cultural encyclopedia, like, you know, your personality is driven by these characters and these stories. And so it was really exciting to have this opportunity to intentionally create characters or tell the stories of real people from the Asian American and Pacific Islander community where there wasn't a lot of representation for us when we were growing up in literature and trying to create more depth to the bench of what kids now have accessible to them. That was definitely more of the mission driven focus of it, but again, still being a really good time creating and conceptualizing.

[Maya Shibutani]

There was a lot of purpose behind writing because we were thinking about the audience. But then it was also pretty healing, especially the nonfiction books where we were doing research about figures who are historic and contemporary from the Asian American and Pacific Islander community. That process definitely made me feel less isolated in my experience, because I think sometimes it's so easy to have a challenge and be like, I'm the only.

[Host]

One who's ever gone through this right now.

[Olivia]

Right?

[Alex Shibutani]

Yeah.

[Maya Shibutani]

But then you kind of have a better sense. And so to gift that information to the next generation was really fulfilling.

[Alex Shibutani]

And that's one of those things too, where, you know, a rugby match, or in our case, like a skating performance, they're meaningful in the moment, but as we sort of progress through this interesting phase of, like, technology and where can you find things to watch and how long is it actually there for? Those things are not necessarily as permanent or as culturally stable, but a book is still something that can last. And so we're really proud of the work that we've done with our writing because. Because it feels like it will outlive anything that we've done. The skating is for us, but the books are for others. Have you guys started writing? Maybe doing some.

[Alona]

I'm writing a book.

[Alex Shibutani]

That's awesome.

[Host]

I'm writing like a memoir, autobiography.

[Alona]

And I kind of found almost the same way, very cathartic to write. First I was like, I don't have enough to say. What do I gotta say? And then I start writing and I, I was like eight hours one day, just typing it all out and sharing so much.

[Host]

So it's been really cool. And I like that, that maybe the rugby's for me and playing it, and then the book will just be there. I, I, I want to share my story.

[Alona]

I love it. I think, like, some things that I know so many women go through, but we don't talk about. And I want to talk about it. I want to be open with it.

[Host]

It's been fun.

[Alona]

I, I want to write it myself too. My own you know, have my voice be really sharp, shown through it.

[Host]

So I've just been writing and writing.

[Alona]

And I have a lot down, but I don't think I want to put it out yet until like after the Olympics. So what was cool is I was able to write during the Paris Olympics and write all my feelings down as. As it was happening.

[Host]

So, yeah, I'm writing.

[Alex Shibutani]

That's great.

[Olivia]

Hear about it later. Watch this space.

[Host]

Watch this space.

[Olivia]

You will hear more. But so it sounds like reading was prioritized in your household growing up. Is it still a big part of your lives today? If so, what are you reading? Yeah, it's what we love asking.

[Maya Shibutani]

I feel like it's more listening to podcasts just because we're always on the go. So this is in rotation. But then also we love entertainment podcasts because I think that really engages the storytelling aspect of what we love about figure skating. So whether it's about television and film, things like that. Sports. You listen to a lot of sports podcasts too.

[Alex Shibutani]

You went through a really intense book reading phase though.

[Maya Shibutani]

Yeah, I read over a hundred books in 2020. Wow. This was just post life altering surgery where I was like, I need all the knowledge.

[Olivia]

What were you gravitating towards?

[Maya Shibutani]

Stoicism.

[Olivia]

Whoa.

[Maya Shibutani]

Yeah.

[Alex Shibutani]

So could you explain stoicism?

[Host]

Yeah, thanks, Alex. I was gonna ask that too. I was like, stoicism. I love those books as well.

[Maya Shibutani]

Being stoic isn't just about having like the stiff upper lip that you kind of think about, but it's more about how do you holistically think about. About life and the time that you have. And so I found that to be very helpful.

[Olivia]

Wow.

[Adriana]

Do you have a few favorite books from that time?

[Maya Shibutani]

I'll have to send you a list.

[Alona]

Please do.

[Maya Shibutani]

Out of the hundred. I'll whittle a look at her.

[Alex Shibutani]

Gatekeeping. Gatekeeper.

[Olivia]

Gatekeeper.

[Maya Shibutani]

Gatekeeper.

[Host]

We are big readers.

[Alona]

We love it. And so, like, as you can tell, it's been a way that we can always escape. I don't know.

[Host]

Did you read what was the series that you loved?

[Alona]

She was a reader young, like as a kid. As a kid. Like, were you Aragon?

[Alex Shibutani]

Oh, I read those. Christopher Paolini, Right. I think he was pretty young. He was a teenager when he wrote those.

[Olivia]

Really?

[Maya Shibutani]

Yeah.

[Olivia]

Oh, my gosh.

[Adriana]

I was a big Percy Jackson.

[Alona]

Percy Jackson.

[Maya Shibutani]

Ooh, those are good.

[Adriana]

Got me into reading. And then I just like consumed those so fast and it snowballed into every other series.

[Alex Shibutani]

Yeah, I read the series Redwall. Did you ever hear about that? I'm older. Older. He's awesome. But the library had all these red wall books and it was like this world of animals who were eng. Engaged in, I presume, like battles and politics. And it was very immersive.

[Olivia]

Like a warrior cat.

[Alex Shibutani]

Yeah, kind of. Yeah. Warrior, yes.

[Host]

Do you guys remember the books where.

[Alex Shibutani]

That would have been a better name.

[Alona]

For it that people would like transform into animals.

[Olivia]

Metamorphosis.

[Alex Shibutani]

Something.

[Olivia]

Animorphs.

[Alex Shibutani]

Was it animorphs? Yeah.

[Olivia]

And the COVID was them.

[Alex Shibutani]

Like, the covers were kind of eerie.

[Maya Shibutani]

I remember eye catching.

[Alex Shibutani]

Right, right.

[Olivia]

Eye catching.

[Maya Shibutani]

They knew what they were doing.

[Host]

If you were.

[Alex Shibutani]

If you were an animorph, what animal would you transform into?

[Adriana]

It's a great question.

[Alona]

A sea lion.

[Alex Shibutani]

And what's the animal that you wish you could transform? Because there's the honest, reflective, like, oh yeah, I'm this.

[Olivia]

But what would it actually be?

[Host]

Like a sea lion. I love those guys.

[Alex Shibutani]

Oh, like, you know, an actual sea lion. Not a lion that lives. Lives in the sea.

[Olivia]

No, like an actual.

[Alex Shibutani]

Like a lion that can swim or the sea lion that actually.

[Adriana]

I think you're sea lions.

[Alona]

I think I'm.

[Host]

Sea lions are in there.

[Olivia]

Loves us.

[Host]

Any animals for you guys Try.

[Adriana]

What is it?

[Host]

I don't know.

[Alona]

Like, I'm not.

[Adriana]

I don't really connect to animal. Some people are such animal people. That's not really me.

[Alex Shibutani]

So it would be an animal that lives in isolation. The lone wolf.

[Olivia]

Howling wolf.

[Alona]

She would do it. Wolf.

[Olivia]

I'd probably be like a bird. Like a blue footed booby or something like that.

[Host]

We saw these too.

[Alona]

Get out.

[Olivia]

Oh, they were just in Mexico.

[Adriana]

That's.

[Alona]

We went on a tour and we.

[Host]

Saw blue footed boobies and we swam with sea lions.

[Olivia]

Whoa.

[Adriana]

Okay.

[Alona]

Crazy.

[Adriana]

Got really close.

[Alona]

Got real close.

[Olivia]

Animals. What were they going to be?

[Maya Shibutani]

I think dog.

[Olivia]

What kind?

[Maya Shibutani]

Medium sized.

[Olivia]

Medium sized.

[Maya Shibutani]

Okay. Yeah.

[Olivia]

Hypoallergenic or.

[Maya Shibutani]

Sure.

[Host]

Okay.

[Olivia]

The medium one. Perfect.

[Alex Shibutani]

Not too much shedding. Gosh. I don't like birds, but I think I would probably be a bird.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Alona]

Interesting.

[Alex Shibutani]

The ability to migrate and change locations.

[Olivia]

And fly just to get the hell out of here.

[Alex Shibutani]

I'm sort of like converging the. What type of superpower would you want? I appreciate flight.

[Olivia]

Flight and invisibility.

[Alex Shibutani]

Yeah.

[Olivia]

Thanks for asking. Okay. Thank you so much for joining us in our book. Nock. We are now going to. Since you're part of the family, you got to keep up your part the of. Of the. You know, your. Your weight. Here we. We have some chores for you.

[Maya Shibutani]

Okay.

[Olivia]

If that's okay.

[Alex Shibutani]

What's the chore list?

[Host]

You're gonna choose either laundry, dishes, or dusting.

[Alona]

And then you just have to answer.

[Olivia]

Corresponding prompt for which chore you want to do.

[Alona]

Which chore would you like to do, Maya?

[Maya Shibutani]

I'll go with laundry.

[Olivia]

Laundry.

[Host]

Share a song you would skate to.

[Alona]

If there were no rules.

[Olivia]

Ooh. If the council hadn't spoken.

[Adriana]

Didn't commune.

[Maya Shibutani]

Picking a song. That's so hard. What I would probably do. This isn't artist specific. Not shouting anyone out, but something longer than three or four minutes.

[Olivia]

Really?

[Maya Shibutani]

Yeah.

[Olivia]

You want to be out there more?

[Maya Shibutani]

I want to be out there more without the rush around to do certain technical elements. Because I think that when there's that time limitation, it's obviously pretty restrictive.

[Olivia]

Yeah.

[Host]

So how long is that Taylor Swift song?

[Olivia]

Taylor Swift has a 10 minute long, all too well version, so maybe there it is. Yeah.

[Alona]

Yep.

[Nordstrom Rack Advertiser]

Yep.

[Alona]

Yes.

[Alex Shibutani]

You said that you're. You're. You're maybe feeling a little bit of, like, untethered. Yes. You need something to dance is the answer. Experienced dancer, for sure.

[Olivia]

Alex, Dishes or. Or dusting is left.

[Alex Shibutani]

I have allergies, so I'll do the dishes. Perfect.

[Olivia]

Share a habit. You want to start or stop?

[Alex Shibutani]

Stop. In 2026. Picking my nose on camera.

[Alona]

No.

[Alex Shibutani]

Let's see. Do I have any habits that are.

[Alona]

It's so funny because I also look to Olivia, I'll be asked questions, and.

[Alex Shibutani]

I'm like, what are the bad habits?

[Host]

What do I like?

[Alex Shibutani]

You could put together a super cut. It wouldn't be super. It would be an extended clip of Maya just standing by our car waiting for me to get there to go to the ramp. Drink? Yeah. Yeah. I would work on trying to be better about being on time.

[Olivia]

Good one.

[Alex Shibutani]

Yeah. I mean, I do. Like, I lay my floor so I can, like, jump into them right when I wake up. Coffee cup.

[Olivia]

Firefighter mode.

[Adriana]

Yes. Yeah.

[Alex Shibutani]

If I had a fire pole, then maybe it would be.

[Olivia]

That's what the problem is. You're late because you don't have a firefighter pole.

[Alex Shibutani]

Yeah.

[Maya Shibutani]

Right.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Alona]

When are you setting your. How much before you have to go?

[Alex Shibutani]

I have a. I'm one of those people with so many alarms. Yeah. It's like five minute increments. That's probably the problem. Maybe I need to delete them once I use them.

[Adriana]

That's what I do.

[Alex Shibutani]

You do?

[Adriana]

I have no alarms except for the one for the day.

[Maya Shibutani]

Impressive.

[Olivia]

I think 20,000.

[Alex Shibutani]

What's your email number at. On your phone, like the notifications number zero.

[Maya Shibutani]

Wow.

[Alex Shibutani]

Wow.

[Alona]

Mine's like 2,000.

[Maya Shibutani]

We don't belong on this couch.

[Olivia]

Yeah. Thank you so much for coming over to our house. Alex and Maya. You can find their books Kudokids incredible and Amazing in stores and online. Now best of luck at Qualifiers. Follow them Ayashubhutani and alexhubutani or together Hibsibs on Instagram.

[Adriana]

Thanks so much for coming over to the House of Mar A Wave Original.

[Host]

Be sure to watch, subscribe on YouTube and listen wherever you get your podcasts.

[Olivia]

Plus follow the show on social media ousofmar for clips and behind the the scenes content. Thank you for being here.

[Host]

This is so good.

[Olivia]

This is awesome.

[Alona]

Now get back on the ice. Get out of there.

[Olivia]

Do us proud.