Israa Nasir - Escaping TOXIC PRODUCTIVITY

Summary

---

Podcast Summary

Episode Overview

Podcast: How I Built My Small Business
Host: Anne McGinty
Guest: Israa Nasir – Psychotherapist, Writer, Founder of Well Guide
Episode Title: Escaping TOXIC PRODUCTIVITY
Date: September 2, 2025

This episode delves into the concept of "toxic productivity," examining how modern work culture pressures us toward constant achievement, often at the expense of personal meaning and well-being. Israa Nasir, therapist and author of Toxic Productivity, offers her expertise on rebalancing ambition with self-care, shifting from external to internal validation, and building a sustainable, joyful approach to both work and life.

---

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Roots and Cost of Toxic Productivity

• Why Are We Driven to Overwork?
  Israa highlights how unresolved emotions and societal narratives push us to seek external validation, which, over time, leads to chronic overachievement.

  “Our emotions that are not resolved will compel you to do things to get externally motivated self-worth.”
  (Israa Nasir, 01:16)

• Cultural Shifts:
  Expectations have escalated—success is now measured by “being a founder before 30” and external markers amplified by globalization, technology, and social media (01:41).

  “We have over-indexed on the external… What has come out of that is this understanding that success can only happen if you look like what other people are doing.”
  (Israa Nasir, 01:41)

2. Reclaiming Internal Validation

• Three Practical Habits:
  Israa suggests steps for reconnecting with intrinsic motivation (03:17):
  • Creative Hobbies Just for Fun:
    Don’t monetize or perform them; allow yourself mediocrity.

    “Last year was my year of hobbies … I intentionally made the decision to just be mediocre at it.”
    (Israa Nasir, 03:31)

  • Non-performative In-Person Community:
    Gather for real connection, not for social media.

    “…No one’s taking Instagram photos of your tablescape… The present moment is enough.”
    (Israa Nasir, 04:08)

  • Accept “Good Enough” in Some Areas:
    Choose where to release perfection and focus excellence only where it truly matters.

    “Identify the pieces that are okay to just be good enough and release the pressure of perfection.”
    (Israa Nasir, 04:36)

3. Integrating Rest and Redefining Productivity

• Rest Is Not a Reward:
  It's not something to be earned after finishing all work—it should be woven into daily routines (06:26).
• Types of Rest:
  There are at least seven (physical, mental, emotional, social, sensory, creative, spiritual) and micro-rest matters—a 90-second reset makes a difference (06:49).

4. Healthy Goal Setting and Psychological Flexibility

• Make Goals Small and Adaptable:
  Break big objectives into three-month or 30-day actionable steps. Build momentum with small changes rather than overwhelming yourself.

  “What is the smallest unit of behavior change you can integrate that will move you towards the larger goal?”
  (Israa Nasir, 09:55)

• Value the Journey:
  Emphasize adaptable goals, not rigid endpoints. Enjoy the process, which reduces the anxiety of achievement (09:32).

• The Perils of All-or-Nothing:
  Overly ambitious New Year's goals fail because they’re too drastic and lack incremental steps (09:54).

5. Navigating External Opinions and Self-Trust

• Balancing External and Internal Validation:
  It's normal to feel pride in public recognition, but self-worth must be anchored internally.

  “Your sense of pride in what you do is stronger than the pride you get from the way other people view you.”
  (Israa Nasir, 11:20)

• Building Self-Trust:
  Start by making low-stakes decisions (like buying a dress without asking for input) to retrain indecisiveness (12:46).

6. Rethinking Self-Improvement and the Value of Fiction

• Fiction Teaches Empathy:
  Not all growth comes from self-help; fiction develops critical thinking, empathy, and relational skills—needed for leadership and relationships (15:32).

  “Fiction teaches us critical thinking, deductive reasoning, empathy. And we have to understand that those are valuable.”
  (Israa Nasir, 16:03)

• Self-Help Industry & Deficiency:
  Only pick up self-help books if there’s a genuine need; otherwise, this “industry is about perpetuating deficiency.”
  (Israa Nasir, 16:23)

7. Work Culture: U.S. & Global Perspectives

• America’s “Chronic Busyness”:
  The U.S. has uniquely aggressive work expectations, rooted in its identity and security tied to employment.

  “Work is center to North American identity… it leads to a lot of loneliness.”
  (Israa Nasir, 17:43)

• Other Cultures Place Less Emphasis on Work:
  Comparative anecdotes about New Zealand and Pakistan illustrate alternative approaches where “just being” is valued (20:20).

8. Money, Security, and “Enough”

• Money as Security in the U.S.:
  Due to structural factors like healthcare, money feels urgent, fueling overwork and a never-enough mentality (21:18).

• Perpetual Striving:
  The pressure to accumulate is mirrored in both success and financial goals.

9. Boundaries, Emotional Regulation & Coping Tools

• How Israa Sets Boundaries:

  • Emotional regulation is key: “The goal is not to never feel stuff … it’s that your emotional reaction is like an uncontrolled activity … the power is in regulating it.” (Israa Nasir, 22:53)
  • Surround herself with honest, supportive people.

• Favorite Emotional Regulation Tools:

  • Self-talk—challenge irrational thoughts with the “So what?” technique (24:00)
  • Voice memo journaling.
  • Keep a quick-access list of comforting activities (“decision fatigue” makes it hard to remember in the moment) (24:38).

10. Understanding & Managing the Inner Critic

• Origins of Self-Pressure:
  The “inner critic” often echoes authority figures from childhood; recognizing its external origins helps reduce self-shame (26:00).

  “It becomes so fused with our self concept… we forget that this is not our voice.”
  (Israa Nasir, 26:07)

• Strategies:

  • Ask, “Who does this sound like?” to create distance from critical thoughts.
  • Move from shame (“I am bad”) to guilt (“I did something bad”), which is easier to process (27:15).
  • Attend to the body—breathing exercises help unwind stress (28:11).
  • “Digital asphyxia”: Notice if you’re holding your breath while scrolling (29:12).

11. Final Reflections

• Advice to Young Self:
  Appreciate your strengths, but don't rush achievement—most things take time (29:56).

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On embracing hobbies for their own sake:
  “Intentionally made the decision to just be mediocre at it … you’re just doing this for vibes.”
  (Israa Nasir, 03:31)

• On redefining “enough” and performance:
  “The antidote is to reconnect with yourself and to ask yourself what nourishes me? Not just what looks good to others.”
  (Host, 31:03)

• On shame vs. guilt:
  “Shame is a really powerful emotion, and shame can make you do destructive things without even you realizing it. Guilt is a much better place to be.”
  (Israa Nasir, 27:15)

• On the “so what?” exercise:
  “You kind of follow this so what line of thinking to help you realize that the thing that feels so big … is not that impactful or consequential.”
  (Israa Nasir, 24:00)

---

Important Timestamps

• 01:16 – Why we seek external validation
• 03:17–05:30 – Three habits to build internal validation
• 06:26–07:37 – Redefining rest and integrating it daily
• 08:41–10:20 – Small, flexible goal setting
• 11:20–13:56 – Self-trust: why it matters and how to build it
• 15:32–17:33 – How fiction and self-help serve different needs
• 17:43–22:16 – Cultural influences on productivity, busyness, and money
• 22:53–24:38 – Tools for emotional regulation
• 26:00–28:11 – The origins of self-pressure and inner critics
• 29:56–30:48 – Advice to her 20s self

---

Final Takeaways

• Seek balance between internal and external validation—anchor your pride internally.
• Use creativity, non-performative connection, and acceptance of “good enough” to reset your motivations and satisfaction.
• Rest is essential and multifaceted; don’t save it for some distant tomorrow.
• Break goals into small, achievable steps and remain adaptable.
• Actively challenge your inner critic and practice emotional regulation with both cognitive and somatic tools.
• Remember, achievement is not a race—it’s about enjoying the journey and cultivating well-being along the way.

---

This episode is essential listening for anyone struggling with chronic busyness, self-pressure, or the relentless pursuit of being “productive.” Israa Nasir’s practical strategies and compassionate wisdom offer a pathway back to balance, authenticity, and joy.

Transcript

[Host]

This is How I Built My Small Business, a show that started with business founding and growth stories in season one and has evolved in season two to highlight more expertise from incredible thought leaders. Each episode is an invitation to learn through storytelling and at the end I always distill the key takeaways for you. Today's guest is ISRA Nasser, a New York based psychotherapist, writer and founder of well Guide, a digital community for mental health awareness. With a master's in counseling and advanced training in cognitive behavioral and rational emotive behavioral therapy, she's dedicated her career to mental health. Isra has built a community of over 350,000 followers with her evidence based approach to mental health and productivity. She's the author of Toxic Productivity where she unpacks the hidden drivers of overwork and offers tools for balance. Her work has been featured in Forbes, Harvard Business Review and Time, and she's spoken at Google, Instagram, Microsoft and major conferences like south by Southwest.

[Isra Nasser]

Why do we pursue the things we pursue? Why do we do what we do? What I was seeing in the research was that our emotions that are not resolved will compel you to do things to get externally motivated self worth.

[Co-host or Interviewer]

And why do you think it is that we feel such a level of. Maybe it's false reward from being so busy keeping ourselves constantly chasing these goals.

[Isra Nasser]

So the way we are wired to operate we need both internal and external motivation and and we need internal and external validation as human beings we need both. What's happened is over time as a society we have over indexed on the external and as our society shifted to a little bit more tech enabled globalization started happening. Jobs became more competitive. Like the narrative around success started to change. It no longer was just oh success is you just have a job and you have a family and you live in a suburb community. It was like you need to have an incredible job, you have to be a founder before 30. And so the pressure really changed late Gen X onwards and that's I think because of the intersection of technology, capitalism. Like I don't think we can talk about this without talking about that globalization. So all of these forces have shaped our culture and what has come out of that is this idea or understanding that success can only happen in if you look like what other people are doing and that's amplified. What happens is people, they overwork, they hustle and grind and you sleep on your death. And then you come to this breaking point where your ambition no longer matters to you. It doesn't spark joy in you because you have over committed and you've overdone. So the idea here is how can we shift to be sustainable over the long term so we don't lose connection to ourselves and, and our passions. And one way is to internalize some of that validation. And there's many ways people can do this. But I talk about three that I find to be easy to access and available for everyone. So the first is engaging in a creative hobby for the sake of creation. So not hobbies to monetize, not hobbies to put on Instagram or create an Etsy shop out of. Don't even track your progress. You don't have to get better at it. Last year was my year of hobbies, and every three months I picked up a new hobby and intentionally made the decision to just be mediocre at it. And you know, it was very challenging, especially the performative hobbies, like improv. I really just like my internal desire to like excel really kicked in on stage, but I really had to be like, no, you're not. You're just doing this for vibes, you know, and so that's a really good way to start building that muscle because it exists. We develop that way, we just lose it over time because of the academic system, the way our parents are, work culture. Right, and now social media. So one is hobbies, one is irl. Communities, digital communities are really amazing for increasing access and connection, but they don't actually give you the benefit of what it means to sit face to face with someone. So having more FaceTime with your community, your friends, your neighbors, in again, a non performative way is very important. So no one's taking Instagram photos of your tablescape. We are just having a dinner and maybe we're eating out of paper plates and maybe it's just takeout, maybe no one is dressed up and we're just sitting on the couch. We need to bring that energy back so that the present moment is enough, so that we don't have to capture it for a future state, state of validation by performing it for the world. The third one is to identify where in your life you can invite some good enough points, you know, before you start a project or before you start planning your trip or whatever it is that you're doing. Identify the pieces that are okay to just be good enough and release the pressure of perfection. So intentionally accepting where you will be good enough allows you to show up better for where it matters, that you are perfect or you are excellent. And so these three things are just habit shifts that we can make that can start Building that muscle of internal validation.

[Co-host or Interviewer]

I like what you're saying. And the first point that you made about non monetized creative outlets really hits home because that's what I've done with this podcast. You touched on a point earlier where you had said capitalism and being in America with it, so capitalistic and it's almost impossible to not at least a little bit compare yourself when you're just starting out your career, when you're in your 20s, going into your late 20s and into your 30s. Most of us, I would think, at some point in our lives live check to check. So how are people supposed to break out of check to check without kind of eating into that sacred time that they've set aside for themselves? The evening hours, the weekends. Like I know that when I was in my early 20s, I worked seven days a week because I felt I didn't have another choice.

[Isra Nasser]

And I think that's a reality for many people. And so the idea of rest and creativity and joy, it's not meant to be a reward you get after you finish your work. I think if we get out of this like black and white thinking that I have to be done work and then only I can rest because now I've earned it or now I actually have the time for it.

[Interjecting Participant or Co-host]

Right?

[Isra Nasser]

That keeps us trapped in the no rest loop.

[Interjecting Participant or Co-host]

So.

[Isra Nasser]

So I think that the point is to integrate rest into your day to day habits. That requires you to shift your fundamental definition of rest. A lot of us think that resting is like endless times of doing nothing, that you need the whole day to be sitting at the beach to recuperate. But research shows you could do a 90 second meditation and a three minute meditation and that still counts as a restful activity. Thinking about the rest in this microway is really important. And the second thing is research has shown there's actually seven types of rest. So there's, you know, spiritual, emotional, physical, communal, there's seven different categories of rest. And so thinking about what is accessible to you that week. So I think it's about diversifying what rest actually looks like in your life as well.

[Co-host or Interviewer]

And how do you feel about goal setting?

[Isra Nasser]

I think goals are really important. I think the way that we are wired neurologically, we need an endpoint. Otherwise time can feel very overwhelming. I think that there is a danger when we set too many goals. Let's say I'm just going to use my example of writing a book now that is so big. In order for that to happen, multiple things need to be true first.

[Interjecting Participant or Co-host]

Right.

[Isra Nasser]

And so I Could shift my perspective into. My purpose is to share information with people. And then I can create goals around that that are more specific. Specific and time bound. Like really thinking about what can I achieve in the next 30 days that will help me achieve this bigger thing that I want.

[Interjecting Participant or Co-host]

Right.

[Isra Nasser]

And sometimes it's a small thing, like changing your routine. Literally, it will take you four weeks to change a habit in your life. So it's like thinking about it like that. Like, let's say I want to write the book. Just to elaborate a little. I first maybe need to get in the habit of writing.

[Interjecting Participant or Co-host]

Well, right.

[Isra Nasser]

And so maybe for three months, for 90 days, I'm going to make a commitment that I'm going to write for 15, 20 minutes a day, or I'm going to write three pages a day that gets that muscle going. And that makes me more likely to achieve the goal of writing a book versus just being like, oh my God, I got to write a book. And I start writing a book. And the most important part of goal setting is something called psychological flexibility. Psychological flexibility is your ability to adapt when changes happen. So it's your mind's ability to shift perspective and adapt when new information starts coming in, AKA change. So, like, that's a really important part of goal setting because uncertain things happen all the time. Like our entire life is uncertain. So goals are important because it keeps us anchored. But we need to have the ability to adapt our goals as our life changes.

[Co-host or Interviewer]

That would make you enjoy the journey.

[Isra Nasser]

Exactly, Enjoy the journey. You understand the steps that are required for the journey. Right? It gives you more power in knowledge and insight on how things happen. I guess like a more accessible example would be like, January 1st, everyone's like, I'm gonna work out four days a week, it'll be a 60 minute workout session, and I'm gonna change my body by summer. Those people often are no longer at the gym by day 45.

[Interjecting Participant or Co-host]

Right.

[Isra Nasser]

And so why? Because the goal was too big. So going from zero to four days of working out a week is not realistic. So that's what I mean by realistic. Look at your life and think about what is the smallest unit of behavior change that you can integrate that will move you towards the larger goal? Maybe it's just one day a week you start with. Maybe you start with 15 minutes. Right. And then you just build up from there.

[Co-host or Interviewer]

Well, this takes a lot of work to go internal and to really think about what it is that you want to achieve and, and why. How do you feel about other people's opinions of You. Or like, how do you teach others to maybe not care about what other people think of them, Their perspective on how successful they are? I mean, I know so many people who deeply care that their public perception is one of immense success.

[Isra Nasser]

Yes. There's, like, two questions in there. Like, so one is like, how do we stop caring about other people's opinion? Two is, how do you separate the sense of pride you feel from what other people view you as? And I'm kind of smiling when you ask the question, because I'm Asian. I was raised by Asian immigrant parents. Like, this is like the lifeblood of the culture. At least Pakistani culture is like, what are people gonna say? That's like an actual phrase that parents use all the time. So it's like a really big part of many people's fundamental framework and worldview.

[Interjecting Participant or Co-host]

Right.

[Isra Nasser]

Even if you're not Asian. But so the first point is, I think it's okay to feel pride in the way other people perceive you. That I don't necessarily feel like we have to get rid of that. I think what we have to add is that your sense of pride in what you do is stronger than the pride you get from the way other people view you. External validation is important. We don't want to get rid of that. What we want to strengthen is our own ability to see our value even when other people don't. That is the journey.

[Interjecting Participant or Co-host]

Right?

[Isra Nasser]

And so the way to kind of stop caring about other people's opinions, first of all, I'll say to any listener who struggles with this is that this is not like an overnight. There is no quick fix to this because this is a lifelong learning. We learn very quickly, irrespective of who your parents are, that you got to fall in line.

[Interjecting Participant or Co-host]

Right.

[Isra Nasser]

Depending on what career you've chosen. Some workplaces really, really demand that. You know, if you are like a young doctor, you have to fall in line. You have to care about what your superiors think of you.

[Interjecting Participant or Co-host]

Right?

[Isra Nasser]

So if you struggle with this and it leads you to people pleasing, it leads you to, like, avoidant conflict tendencies. You don't say what you want or what you need. It's not something that you can make go away in like, 30 days. And that's not the point. The point is for you to slowly build self trust. Again, when people struggle with caring too much about other people's opinion, what's lacking is self trust. What's lacking is the trust in your own ability to care for yourself, in the discomfort of someone's disappointment. It's too overwhelming. So you're like, I don't wanna feel that disappointment because I don't know if I can handle it. So the journey really begins with that. How do you start trusting yourself again? You know, a very low hanging fruit way of doing it is try to make decisions without asking someone for input. If you're somebody who, like, this was me, and to some degree it is me, I'll always text my younger sister before buying outfit because she's younger than me, you know, she's a little more connected to fashion trends and she's more stylish. So I had become dependent on her validation to purchase clothes. Now in order for me to kind of break out of that habit, I did have to start slowly buying like a shoe or a dress without texting her. That was very hard for me. And so the baby step was I would buy it and then I text her, right? And then slowly it shifted away from like, I'll buy it and then she'll just see it when I'm wearing it. It's like in these small ways you start building your own sense of trust. And so this can happen from other things too. This is like a little bit of a low stakes example, but that's how you can do that.

[Co-host or Interviewer]

I was having a little bit of a chuckle when you were saying that because I am notoriously indecisive. And I think maybe it has something to do with the way that I was raised as well. Big family, Asian family, and recently was on a group trip with some friends. And it's like when decisions would come up, what do you want to do? I mean, I think I freeze and I'm like, well, I'm happy to do whatever. What does everybody else want to do? I think that it's really hard to trust your opinion when you haven't had practice with it.

[Isra Nasser]

The answer is in the thing you just said, when you haven't had practice. So it is a muscle that everybody can learn. It doesn't even matter if you have a clinical condition like anxiety or adhd. It's just a learned behavior. It's nothing inherent or moralistic or a lot of times people say that, you know, oh, you're so indecisive. There's like this, like moral judgment to it, but it's not. It's just a learned behavior that we can unlearn.

[Co-host or Interviewer]

Yeah, you're right. We just need to practice it in, in little ways. There was something that you mentioned at the beginning of your book that also resonated with me, and that's when you Were talking about how you used to almost only read nonfiction books and there is something about constantly wanting to better ourselves, right? Like constantly wanting to be a better and better version. So how do you tackle your real deep desire to learn and improve and have that personal development while also understanding that there is a point at which you really need to have more balance?

[Isra Nasser]

I think we have to have balance by understanding that fiction teaches us as well. Fiction teaches us critical thinking. Self help books will give you the solution. They'll be like A plus B equals C. Whereas with fiction you have to read through and kind of do deductive reasoning and then realize at the end it was like, oh, A plus B equals C. Right? You are building intelligence through fiction. You are also building empathy. I think there is a very strong correlation between the lack of empathy societally and the increase of personal individual self help.

[Interjecting Participant or Co-host]

Right?

[Isra Nasser]

Self help is always individual. It's about you. Fiction demands empathy. You cannot enjoy a fiction book unless you drop into that character. You have to understand them. You can't just sympathize with them, you have to empathize with them. And that changes our emotional intelligence. So I mean this is something I think about a lot by the way. And so I think fiction teaches us critical thinking, deductive reasoning, empathy. And we have to understand that those are valuable key skills that are required us, required for us to be in good relationships, romantically, be good friends and also be good leaders at work. If you cannot empathize with your teammates at work, like you're going to be a nightmare to work with, no one's going to want to work with you. And so I had to shift into that mindset and really, really go back to my roots of reading. As we have grown older and especially in this like big boom of personal development, self growth in the last 12 years, every new book that comes out is telling you, hey, like you're missing this fundamental thing, including mine, right? And it is enormously beneficial for people. Like I have learned so much from so many books and so what I say to people, and I have always said this and I don't know like if it's the best thing to say, but I've always said it is. Like only pick up this book if you are at a moment in your life where you need it. Like if you're not strugg struggling with productivity, if you feel kind of good about your job right now and you don't really care about other things, like don't pick it up, pick it up. Pick up any self help book when you genuinely need it. Not because you heard about it in a podcast or you read about it in the New York Times. Because the self help industry is about perpetuating deficiency.

[Co-host or Interviewer]

How do you feel about this concept of like chronic busyness? And is it something that you've seen across nations or is this America's problem?

[Isra Nasser]

I definitely think it's like a North America problem for sure with some Western European nations, but predominantly at a global scale. It's definitely a North America problem. But then you can also see that North American countries have some of the highest GDPs in the world. So there is a reason, right? I have a lot of friends who work in finance and I'm always like, we should, blah, blah, blah, four day work week. And they're like, the countries that employ it are either really, really tiny or their GDPs are failing. And so it's like this constant battle between capitalism and wellness. But I think that work is center to North American identity, right? The nationhood or the story of America is you can come here and you can build yourself from anything, from nothing to anything, right? It's in like the origin narrative of America. So it's very hard to kind of take that away. The factories came up here, like invention happened here, right? But in other countries, like I grew up in the Middle east, like the relationship to work is very different and those countries are very wealthy as well. And they operate right, but it's not centered to their existence. I'm originally Pakistani and work culture is very different there. And so I definitely think that there's a pro and con to each. I think that the way our work culture is set up, it leads to a lot of loneliness. Like you're kind of seeing this in, in South Korea, right? Like the work culture there has become so immensely toxic and so the birth rates were falling and so they had to create this like mandated, like cut off time to work. And like they're trying to implement a four day work week so that people can have time to have families and have children. You know, there are, there are some places in East Asia that are adopting this culture too. But I think it's just about coming back to balance. I think we need to be productive, we need to have innovation, we need to be creative and work hard. But the way I see it is these type of spurts of very unhealthy or imbalanced productivity should be exceptions in your life. They should not be the rule in your life. So even in the workplace there are going to be sprint times where you're just like, I gotta get this. Like me when the book was coming out in November, six weeks before, I was just like 18 cylinders. Like, I don't, you know.

[Interjecting Participant or Co-host]

Right.

[Isra Nasser]

I was just going so fast. But I knew that I had a deadline. I knew this was an exception. And I think that's what we need to bring into our regular lives is high spurt, like high productivity. Like, no boundaries. Doing work till like midnight. Like that should be exceptional.

[Co-host or Interviewer]

Yeah. And yeah, not the norm.

[Host]

For sure.

[Co-host or Interviewer]

I asked you that question because I also have a very multicultural family. My husband is from New Zealand. And it's probably one of the most obvious differences that I've recognized between their culture and ours is Kiwis truly know how to just be without doing. And I know very few people in America who can just be. And I just have wondered, like, where did we go wrong? Like, is this hitting us in early childhood? Is it our education system or is it the cost of living? Do we just want too much? Like, are we such consumerists that we need so much money? And so then that drive for money is causing us to kind of be workaholics and overachievers. Like, how do you feel about money and its relationship to why people are chronically busy?

[Isra Nasser]

You're kind of speaking to a socio political cultural context. Right. And there's no one singular answer as to like, why America is the way it is. But America just has more potential.

[Interjecting Participant or Co-host]

Right.

[Isra Nasser]

Like, people don't move here because they don't want potential. Like, as somebody who's an immigrant, my parents moved from Middle east to Canada. Like, and Canada is part of, like, of this conversation of like North America. There is potential to achieve a lot. People are just kind of like, striving to use money as a way to protect their futures, you know, in a way that I don't think we did before. In the US if you don't have a job, you don't have health care, you need to work in order to go to the doctor. Like, that is always mind blowing to me because it's just not a good system. Right. We're the only country with like, medical debt. So money is a really important thing, but I think it provides a lot of security and safety to people, and so it drives you to do more. However, there's like, other factors that also play into it.

[Co-host or Interviewer]

Yeah. And I think that I see a little bit of overlap in the, you know, enough is never enough when it comes to success. But I also feel that many people feel that enough is never enough when it comes to money too. So I just. There's a little bit of a parallel there. As a therapist, I know you have well guide, which I believe is a digital mental health support group or system. And you're writing, you're speaking. I mean, you are quote unquote, very successful in what you're doing. What kind of boundaries do you set for yourself?

[Isra Nasser]

It requires a lot of emotional regulation. I genuinely believe that emotional regulation is the key to making it in anything. Relationship, friendship, parenting, whatever, Instagram content creation. The goal is not to never feel stuff because you'll always feel it. You're a human person, right? It's that your emotional reaction is like an uncontrolled activity in your brain. The power is in regulating it and talking yourself through it. It's also really important to surround yourself with people who are going to keep it real for you, who you can talk with, you can share, and they don't need to be in the same industry as you, but they can be real with you and they can say, hey, this is not necessary, or you're spiraling, or I think asking for help and reaching out and being vulnerable with like two people or three people, that's really helpful in helping set boundaries.

[Co-host or Interviewer]

And aside from this, are there any other tools that you use for that emotional regulation that you had mentioned?

[Isra Nasser]

For some people, affirmations are really helpful, but for me, I just need to talk myself through it. And the conversation is either you follow your irrational thought, right? So, oh, if you don't post today, your analytics are going to drop, okay, so what? And then blah, blah, blah will happen because of that, okay, then, so what, right? And then, so you kind of follow this, so what line of thinking to help you realize that the thing that feels so big for you is actually not that impactful or consequential, so you kind of like lay bare your own irrationality through talking to yourself. And so that's a really powerful cognitive tool that you can use. And then I also do a lot of like, voice memo journaling. I can't always sit down and write, but I'll use the Voice Memo app and just kind of like get the thoughts out and it's not going anywhere. No one needs to hear it again. Even I don't. But it's helpful to just get it out. It's another form of journaling if you don't like writing. And then I also have a list of things that I enjoy doing when I feel bad. And it's in my notes app. Because when you feel bad and when you Feel like very activated. You can't access the logical part of your brain just because the way the brain is working in that moment, the front part of your brain has shut down and that's a logical center, right? So a lot of times like you can't even remember like the most basic things that help you feel better. You just can't. And so having it written down in a note on your, on your phone is like so helpful. You can just like pick it up and you know, we have decision fatigue right now on streaming. So just write down four movies that you really like. Going back to an album like you like listening to that makes you feel better so you're not searching in that moment.

[Co-host or Interviewer]

I really liked that one where you were saying, well, so what? And then you answer it, okay, oh well, so what? After that. That's a really great exercise that I'm going to try to remember. I know that self pressure is something that I personally struggle with. I know other people that struggle with it. And I was also wondering if you have any ideas for where that self.

[Host]

Pressure actually comes from.

[Co-host or Interviewer]

Because my logical brain can say, okay, now is the time to just relax, stop worrying about that. But then I'll have this pressure that I'm not doing enough. Sometimes the self pressure can be too great and it's not well placed.

[Isra Nasser]

Self pressure is effectively your inner critic, right? And the inner critic is this voice that we have in our head that is developed over time that is usually like a mix of parent, some teachers, maybe you had, some friends who you had some negative experiences as a child with. It's usually a voice that developed very early on in life that polices you. And it becomes so fused with our self concept that we, when we get into adulthood, we actually forget that this is not our voice. So when you're resting and there's a voice telling you you are lazy, get up, there's a pile of laundry on the floor. Like, what kind of person leaves their laundry on the floor? We believe this is our voice telling us this. It's not. It is our inner critic, which is a separate voice. So when we want to kind of combat self pressure, we have to first identify the inner critic. You know, I think it requires some introspection, but not time consuming introspection. You can really just pause and ask yourself who sounds like this? In my life, every time you have a negative thought that's critical of policing or shaming, literally all you have to do is just be like, who does this sound like? And you'll be like, oh, My gosh. It sounds like my mom, right? Or it sounds like that whatever PE teacher who told me that I couldn't run or whatever, right? And so like, that itself, in this small habit, will create this distance. So what we're looking for is to create distance from the thought so that we can externalize it and that we can manage and process. Because when it's fused with our sense of self, what you feel is shame, not guilt. Shame is a really powerful emotion, and shame can make you do destructive things without even you realizing it. When you actually push it out, it first becomes guilt. Guilt is a much better place to be in because guilt is I'm doing something bad. It's so action oriented, you'd move to change how you feel, right? But guilt is easier to release than shame. Shame is very core. So the first thing you want to do is you want to like, hey, like, who does this sound like? Right? And then just kind of start going from there. Then you can do the so what Conversation. Then you can fact check yourself, right? Whatever this thought is, you can say, is this true? Is there evidence for it?

[Interjecting Participant or Co-host]

Right?

[Isra Nasser]

What's the evidence for and against, like, you can do this? Like, a lot of cognitive work. And at the same time, I think it's really helpful to learn how to relax your body when you're feeling uncomfortable. That was my problem because my defense mechanism is intellectualizing. I can just, like I can cognitively do all the things, right? I can do the distance, I can do the fact checking. But I was not very in touch with my body, so my body would be wound up. I would be stressed. Like, my shoulders would be up to my ear. Like, I'd be restless. I would feel uncomfortable. Like, I just was so disconnected from my body. It's kind of like thinking back, I'm just like, wow. So it's also helpful to like, really get into your body. And the easiest, smallest way is to deep breathe. Four deep breaths, Take it in for four, hold for two, let it out for six. Just super simple. Then you can go into the more complicated, involved, somatic practices. But just the most basic thing is just take a couple of deep breaths and like, relax your body.

[Co-host or Interviewer]

So important. I think a lot of us shallow breathe without even realizing it throughout the entire day.

[Isra Nasser]

It's called, like digital asphyxia. I don't know if you've heard the phrase, but you might notice that you're actually holding your breath while you're scrolling. That's crazy. Like, once I noticed it, I couldn't not notice it. Ooh. Because your body's so stressed, because of the scrolling, because it's so overwhelming for the brain that it actually you can hold your breath for some time and not realize it. That makes you feel really bad.

[Co-host or Interviewer]

Yeah. Wow. That's making me also want to check in on my kids and make sure that they aren't holding their breath throughout the day.

[Host]

Yeah, we need to breathe like our cells. They need oxygen. Well, so just as a final question.

[Co-host or Interviewer]

Here, if you could go back and sit down and have a conversation with yourself when you were in your early 20s, how do you imagine that conversation would go?

[Isra Nasser]

I think that a, I would tell her that I admire a lot of things about her. I would tell her that her fearlessness, her like, ability to like, leap and just do the things without fear. I took her to amazing places. So I would definitely tell her to keep that. I think it's important to appreciate the things that have helped you come this far. So I would say that. And the second thing I would say to her is to maybe not be so concerned with achieving fast. Really just things take some time. Like it's okay, like it's not a failure just because it didn't happen as fast as you wanted. Like, I think I was very consumed with speed, you know, and if it wasn't happening fast enough, it wasn't good enough. I think I would tell that person to slow down a little and appreciate things a little bit more.

[Co-host or Interviewer]

That's very sweet.

[Isra Nasser]

Yeah.

[Co-host or Interviewer]

Well, isra, thank you so much for coming on and it's been a great conversation. Thanks for coming.

[Isra Nasser]

Yeah, thank you so much for having me. I loved your last question, by the way.

[Host]

Today's key takeaways Understand where motivation comes from. Unresolved emotions often push us toward chasing external validation. As humans, we need both internal and external motivation. But today's culture puts heavy pressure on achieving success in outward performative ways. The antidote is to reconnect with yourself and to ask yourself, what nourishes me? Not just what looks good to others. Other ways to reconnect with yourself are Engaging in a creative hobby purely for the joy of creating, not for any performance or productivity. Invest in real life community, friendships, family and groups where you feel grounded and connected. In real life, practice self acceptance by giving yourself good enough points in areas where perfection just isn't necessary. Rest and joy aren't rewards you earn only after finishing your to do list. They're really essential daily practices. Even a 90 second to three minute break can reset your mind and body. Remember the seven types of rest that you may need. There's physical, mental, emotional, social, sensory, creative, and spiritual goals anchor us. But instead of focusing only on the big picture goal, ask what can I realistically achieve in the next 30 days? These shorter horizons keep motivation fresh, and it reduces overwhelm. Big spurts of productivity are normal, but they should be the exception and not the standard. There will be times when you really need to work overtime, but you shouldn't be doing that all the time. Build rhythms of sustainable output rather than living in constant overdrive. Try the so what? Technique when something feels overwhelming. This will help you see whether it's truly as big as it seems. Keep a note in your phone listing activities that lift your mood. When you're down, you can easily access this list and use logic to guide you back to things you know. Help when we're emotionally dysregulated, it can.

[Co-host or Interviewer]

Be very hard, if not impossible, to think logically.

[Host]

When you hear a harsh, critical inner voice, ask whose voice does this sound like? Naming it helps separate it from your true self. And then practice compassion and speak to yourself like you would a good friend. And finally, achievement is not a race. So slow down, take deep breaths throughout the day, and remember, life isn't just about reaching the finish line. It's about the entire journey. That's it for today. I release episodes once a week, so come back and check it out. Have a great day.