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How I Built My Small Business
John Clapham - From Volcom Australia/ NZ CEO to RAGLAN SURF EMPORIUM
00:37:52
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- [00:00]
Ann McGinty
Foreign welcome to How I Built My Small business. I'm Ann McGinty, your host. Today's guest is John Clapham, or JC, and I met him in Ragland, New Zealand last year when I walked into his shop, hoping they weren't yet closing and said while huffing from my brisk walk, what time do you close? He responded with a smile, depends on who's asking. And from there we ended up chatting for about half an hour. I left thinking, I want to hear more of this guy's story. JC didn't go to college and worked his way up from tagging surf leashes in a retail shop to becoming CEO of Volcom Australia, New Zealand. He is the co founder of the Ragland Surf Emporium, is a partner of Raglan Roast Coffee, which now has 11 locations across New Zealand, owns a gas station, holds major real estate investments, and continues to consult and build new ventures. In today's episode, we only scratched the surface of JC's journey. But wow, what an inspiration. If you've been tuning in, you know this show isn't about selling anything. It's about sharing meaningful stories and learning along the way. If How I Built My Small Business has brought you any insight, inspiration, or even just a spark of curiosity, there are a few simple ways you can support the journey. Follow the show, share your favorite episode with a friend, or leave a quick review. Each one truly helps me grow this show. Thank you. Let's get started. So jc, what was childhood like and how did you originally get into surfing?
- [02:02]
John Clapham
I was born in Auckland, grew up in Wellington, moved down there with my mum. My mum and dad separated early and then they tried to get back together in Wellington when I was about seven or eight. So mum moved my sister and myself down there. That didn't work out and my mum ended up just bringing me up as a solo mother. My sister and I, yeah, it was really hard, you know, she had to work really long hours just to make ends meet and we were poor, but she gave us a lot of love. At one stage, I only had my school uniform and my rugby uniform were my only clothes. So, you know, that was pretty hard. It just, it made me stronger as a person. I started surfing when I was 14 down at Lowell Bay, and I became addicted to surfing straight away. I lived for surfing. My form class overlooked Lowell Bay so I could see the surf. So I knew I had to go to math and pe. And other than that, I was in the water. And then I left school and I actually started a butcher's apprenticeship six months into It I worked out that I couldn't actually go surfing in the morning. So I gave that up and that's how I got into the surf industry. I started out doing ding repairs at a surfboard shop called Good Times Surf so I could go in at night and repair boards and surf all day. So that was the unreal for me. I started competing in surf competitions. I got sponsored by Hot Tuna and Ocean and Earth and Exit Surfboards, which were actually based out of Ragland at the time. I won the regional under 18 surf comp for Moray Wetsuits and the finals were in Raglan in 87. So I got to come up to Raglan in 87 and came here and man, that's basically when I went. This is, you know, where I want to end up. I want to end up living in Raglan. So I had this long term plan of that's where I wanted to be. I worked in a lot of retail, so I was in South Coast Sailboards down in Lyall Bay and I started working in R and R Sport. I actually was involved in a startup of the Skate Pit, which was an indoor skate park down in Wellington on the harbour there. And that was pretty interesting. We were the cheapest babysitting in town for $3. That was pretty insane. And then I had a mate in Australia that offered me a job working in surf retail in Aloha surf Manly in 91. And I'd actually just split up with my girlfriend of the time. So I was like, yep, let's go. So I went. He offered me a job on a Monday and I think I was in Australia the following Monday and expected to have a bit of a holiday but just he put me straight upstairs pricing leg ropes and it all went from there. So jumped into the surf retail for a couple of years and then met a few people through that and then actually met a guy, Wes Fab, who had gone to America. He, he had the distributions for Burden and had also found this new brand called Volcom. So he came back and asked if I was interested in getting involved with him in that and I was like, yep, no worries. So I was working five days a week in the surf shop and then on the two days off we'd go out and try and make clothing. We had this new brand called Volcom. Everyone didn't really know what it was and we just sort of learned as we went along. You know, we were the first distributor or licensee outside of America. The US dollar was super strong back then, so, you know, we imported Some caps. And then we started manufacturing in Australia again. Didn't really know what we were doing, so had some friends that were patent makers. They made patterns for us. We'd go buy the fabric, take it to the cutters, they'd cut it, take it to the makers, they'd make it. Then we'd go to the dye house, we'd go get the buttons put on, we'd get them pressed and then bring them back home, put all the labels on. And then, you know, we would also be selling it, shipping it out, and then chasing up the accounts and following, getting paid in 60 to 90 days. It was really interesting times. You know, like I said before, we just learned on the fly. And everyone that we worked with, you know, they could see that, you know, we jumped in the deep end and were trying to swim to the other side and just really helped us. It was really exciting. It was, you know, learning on your feet. Neither of us had had much to do with apparel in the past. I'd been a sponsored surfer back in the day, so I kind of knew from a marketing side of things what surfers and skaters and snowboarders wanted. And then, yeah, so we just went from there, you know, made a lot of mistakes on the way. Our house had our two bedrooms, which were our warehouse. There was boxes in the hallway. The lounge room was our team room. So we had the likes of Terry A. Harkinson, Bruce Irons, Andy Irons, even though he wasn't riding for us. Dustin Dolan, all guys like that staying in our house. We had all our patterns in our kitchen. Our actual warehouse also was under our kitchen table. So the first time we signed up, Aussie Ride, I remember giving him product from underneath our kitchen table. And then we had a small office as well. We had another guy that was living with us that was a really good chef. So, you know, I think my tax return for that first year was $5,000. Yeah, we just lived, you know, we lived and breathed it. And we made all our own point of sale out the back, in the. In the garage. And, yeah, it was amazing times. It was really cool. And then we finally got a warehouse. And then we started employing some local kids that would work in the warehouse, or athletes, team riders that ended up working in our marketing department. The likes of Joel Spillane, Peanut Teddy Nassif came and worked in our warehouse and went into sales. Just young guys that believed in the dream that we believed in. And I think anyone that said no, we just wanted to prove them wrong. And we just kept going so we just continuously hired more and more people and then built up the business, continued to build our athletes, grow the business. And then the US bought it back in 2011 and I moved back home. So it was shy of 20 years of being in Australia then. So, yeah, came home and, you know, just sort of reset, you know, selling the business was really, really hard. The due diligence you had to do was insane.
- [07:48]
Ann McGinty
Wow, what an incredible journey. And when you went to Ragland in 87, was it a bit of a ghost town?
- [07:55]
John Clapham
Yeah, it was the Wild West. It was pretty qu. I actually stayed out at the Points and I didn't have a car, so I walked from Indicators or Whale Bay all the way into town to get food from the supermarket at the time, which was called Petrols. That shows you how long I've been in Raglan. You know, not a lot of people call that supermarket Petrols anymore. I walked all the way in, all the way back from the Marai out to Whale Bay was just a shingle road. It's now a paved road now. But, you know, it was really cool. But I just got there and went, man, you know, I'm a goofy footer. This is where I want to live. Do you mean? And I, you know, that was always in the back of my mind when I went to Australia as well. It was like, okay, the end plan is be able to pull this off and move back to Raglan, New Zealand and surf left handers for the rest of my life. So that was etched in there from, you know, from an early age.
- [08:49]
Ann McGinty
So when you got back to New Zealand, when did you decide to open the Raglan Surf Emporium?
- [08:55]
John Clapham
Well, we came. Yeah, we came back in 2018, 2011, and didn't really have, you know, it was just a reset, bring the kids back to New Zealand. And we'd been buying properties since 2000 in Ragland with one of my mentors and good friends, Tony Bruce. He actually was a shareholder in Balkan. So when I came back, I actually, within the first couple of months, bought into the brand Raglan Roast. So I bought a shareholding in that. And then Tony had a surf shop called Gag, and we had our offices for Volkem in Ragland and all our samples and any returns or anything like that would go into the store. And it was just more like a Volcom outlet store. So Melissa, my wife, and I took that store on in 2012 and basically jumped in there, gave it a good cleanup and, yeah, the rest is history. Mel, really, she runs that store. She does an amazing job. She's built that business up to Corsair store. The Raglan Surf Emporium is a big part of our business and Raglan's a destination. So, you know, that was a great opportunity for us to get into something a little bit easier than wholesale and saying that you've got to give it your all, you got to give it 110%. It's a big part of our life now. So we jumped in there again, had a lot of knowledge from running businesses back in Australia and having 70 staff. So it was a little bit easier to come back into that and run one store, one shop front. We did a collab with Rip Curl and opened a Rip Curl store in Ragland for a couple of years. We had a little outlet store as well, but we've now concentrated just on the Raglan Surf Emporium store. I think important part of our Surf Emporium was building a good surf team and we build a lot of young surf team riders that have done really well. And actually big part that I concentrated on was life after surfing or what are you going to do after you've finished competing? And all our older team riders now are all either qualified builders, electricians, one's a nurse, my son's third year at law, and we've got another one of our team riders down at uni and in Otago. So they're all doing really well. And I think that's super important that the surf industry has shrunk and especially for athletes and the money available and the prize money in New Zealand alone, in Australia as well, it's getting really tight. Money for athletes is shrinking. They might make a couple hundred grand. Some of them are probably on 50 or 60. To be honest. It's definitely shrunk compared to the money we were paying our athletes back in the the 90s and the early 2000s. You've got to be the best of the best to really be able to achieve your goals and be able to afford all the Challenger Series and, and stuff like that to actually get onto the, the ct. You know, there's a real strong surfing community, there's a super strong skate community. There's some amazing athletes here. There's no two ways about it. It's just. Just the funding or, or the marketing dollars is just non existent.
- [11:53]
Ann McGinty
Yeah. So going back to the Raglan Surf Emporium, what is it like running that business? Is it seasonal?
- [12:00]
John Clapham
Yeah, it's very seasonal. That sort of October until March, April and then you'd batten down the hatches and get through winter. You come Christmas, Boxing Day, you know, you go from 5,000 to 30,000 people for two weeks. I think that's when you were in the store. Melissa is running that business on a day to day and she's running it like a Swiss watch. It's well fine tuned. My strengths are probably the product side obviously coming from Volkem and building product from scratch. So we're constantly updating our branding of our surf Emporium product and adding new categories in all the time. We have built a really good team and each day you want everyone to get up and go, hey, yep, I'm excited to go to work, not I've got to go to work. So we try to build a really good vibe within the store. And I think the most important thing that we've, you know, learned especially working in Australia was customer service. And that's second to none. And we pride ourselves on that. And you know, all our staff have got amazing customer service. So that does really help in the whole scheme of the Ragland Surf Emporium brand.
- [13:03]
Ann McGinty
I've noticed this in New Zealand in general just in comparison to America. And this is not to knock any of my American friends who own businesses here, but the customer service in New Zealand just, it feels, I don't know what to call it, like more authentic. It feels like you'll walk into a store and chances of the owner being in the store is actually quite high.
- [13:23]
John Clapham
Yeah, totally. I think that's super important. Back in the day there used to be a sports store on every corner of every town and now there's just big branded surf stores like Rebel or Nike and stuff like that. And it's the same with the surf industry. The mums and pop stores are getting gobbled up by the majors and that's gonna happen. You know, there's a lot of stores that guys have started and their kids aren't even interested and, and taking them over and running them. So they're either getting bought out or they're shutting down. Unless you're in there and you own it, there's no buy in sometimes and some people are in some of those stores just to get paid. It's a job and we're trying to make, especially in our store at a career and I think that's super important. And then that's buy in and then that gives you better customer service. I just enjoy talking to people as well. The amount of finding out, especially if you hear an accent, hey, where you from? What are you up to? And nine times out of 10, if they're from Hawaii or California, I'll know someone or from Australia. Especially in the surf industry, we all know someone as a friend or we've worked with them. So it's totally different from running a $30 million company, coming back down to a retail store 9 to 5, selling blocks of wax and T shirts. And I've got other projects on, but that's a fun one, just to get in and talk to people and find out what's going on. 90% of the people that walk through that door are on holiday, so they're excited, they're all pumped up and they want to have a chat. And all our staff, hey, you know, go around and get a coffee at Raglan Roast, and people are looking at you going, man, I've just walked into your story and now telling me to leave it. But they go around, have that coffee and guarantee it, you know, nine times out of 10, 10 times out of 10, they'll come back and go, that's the best coffee I've ever had. And they'll go, right, go grab one, take it back to the wife, give her the coffee. It's going to be the best coffee ever. And you're going to be allowed to go surfing every day and, you know, just generally welcoming everyone and having a good time and talking to them. And I'm not in the store that much, but, like, when I am, just try to talk to as many people as possible and see what's going on.
- [15:21]
Ann McGinty
And, you know, we certainly did that when I walked in. When you were working running Volcom in Australia, what do you think you learned the most from that, that you were able to take over into running this?
- [15:35]
John Clapham
Yes. Some of the biggest lessons is integrity and respect and believing in what you're doing. We worked on the basics, which is, you know, calendar and deadline driven. You know, the calendar is king. Most of all, was having a good team around you. You know, staff is our biggest asset, and it goes home every night, and you don't know what goes on behind closed doors. And you hope that they come back every day. And it's like a family. You want to treat people like you want to be treated, speak the truth, call it how you see it. That's the most important thing for me on strengthening a relationship is being real and being truthful. And I think Richard Wilcock, one of the founders of Volcom, told me, you know, surround yourself with good people, people that are going to be better than you are, and you're going to learn from them at one Stage. We had a CFO from the Tofen Group in Eastern Europe. The business he was working for, we had turned over a billion dollars. We had an ex sales manager from Billabong. You know, I just had really good people around me and I just learned so much from them. And then the best part of all is when we did sell out to the usa, Dougal Walker came in, who's ex Billabong guy. And I got to spend six months in a transition period with him when he took over as CEO of Volcom Australia. And the stuff I learned off him was second to none. And he was amazing and he taught me so much, even though I was on my way out.
- [16:53]
Ann McGinty
What did he teach you?
- [16:54]
John Clapham
Oh, just, just about business and, you know, just how to look at things and pumped my tires up a bit as well and said I'd done a great job and you need to hear that. You want to hear praise from other people of what you're doing. And sometimes it's hard when, you know, you're at the top or you're at the CEO. Back when I was there, you know, you were competing against everyone. You're competing against the Hurleys and the Billabongs and the Quicksilvers and the rip curls and Dougal. Yeah, it was a great six months with them. So taking that and coming to the surf emporium was just about the product quality at every level. You know, strive for excellence, clean, organized, on time, and the big one, inventory, you know, it's like your checkbook. You've got to keep it balanced, don't oversell product, manage our purchases. And the big one is, it's not like fine wine. It doesn't get better with age. You need to move that old stock on as quick as possible. And then leveraging resources, you know, purchasing, marketing are two of the most important things that we need to work on and leverage all the time. And then relationships, that's a big one. You know, build, strengthen and keep our relationship strong with staff, retailers, team and vendors and customer service, which we'd seen from a. A sales point of view. You know, we've dealt with some of the smartest retailers in Australia. You know, Chris Athos had owned Suffection. I had, you know, I was really close to him and he taught me a lot. And then even working in Aloha Surf with Tim Hanrahan and just his customer service of welcoming people in and just basically making them feel at home and being excited to be in the store. So it was really, yeah, just the customer service and Then just knowing the product that we needed to put into our store and definitely for the Raglan Surf Emporium brand to create that from scratch and build that up to what it is. And you know, you travel around the world and you see the T shirts on people and you're like, wow, that's, you know, that's really exciting. And nine times out of ten you've touched that T shirt, you've actually had to tag it or whatever. So that brought back early memories of Vulcan when we had our warehouse within our unit and you know, we'd touch the product from start to finish and then it would go out. So that's always been something that we've already really enjoyed and it was just coming back and resetting. And being a single store door versus running a 30 million plus dollar company is day and night. But there is a lot of things that are similar just on a smaller scale.
- [19:15]
Ann McGinty
Do you miss the Volcom days?
- [19:18]
John Clapham
I miss the Volcom days. I miss, yeah, just the camaraderie and the team. I was lucky enough and been lucky enough to go and consult with the Mad Hois in Australia and got that sort of vibe back again, which was really good. And also consulted with Stacy Surfboard. So I've been over to Oz and done a couple of those stints over the last couple of years, which is great. It puts you back in there and it stimulates, you know, all those thoughts and energy that you used to have back in the day. So that was great. And yeah, I definitely do miss it, but we've got it. Like I said, we've got a great team now in the surf Emporium and yeah, it's just on a smaller scale now that, you know, now it's about different things, you know, like family and the boys are growing up now, but they've become good mates. They've gone from, you know, our sons to become good friends, which is super important. Working on my health. Freaking knees. I've had two hip resurfaces and then I sort of had a tear on my meniscus. You know, work on getting my surf fitness back to 100%. You know, when we first came back to New Zealand, I used to be one of the first out in the water in the dark at indicators. Every morning I'd be running around the rocks and I'd be coming in as guys were going out seven in the morning and already clocked up three or four waves. So I really want to get that back into it. So lots of saunas and ice baths and Stretching. And I've actually just got involved, involved with a local, Johnny Rickard. His dojo is called the Refinery and he does a lot of training there. So I've been doing some training with him and actually helping him on the size with his business and making sure that, you know, he's got a good business plan. And we're actually coming together and doing the collab and working with a lot of our athletes. So that's super exciting as well and I've really enjoyed that. So, yeah, it's definitely different stage in our lives right now.
- [21:00]
Ann McGinty
Yeah, it's the same for us. We've been focusing on health and wellness and fitness and just staying healthy.
- [21:07]
John Clapham
Well, yeah, staying healthy, eating healthy, not drinking as many beers as you meant to. That I had. Not that I meant to. That I have been. Yeah, but that wellness is a big. It's massive. You know, it wasn't there when I was running Volcom.
- [21:20]
Ann McGinty
It was.
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John Clapham
If you had issues, you kept it to yourselves. So it's. It's unreal to see everyone's coming out and, and talking about mental health and trying to fix it. And that's something that Johnny and I have touched on. Refinery and again, you know, working with our athletes and making sure that there's life after surfing. They can still be the best out there in the points and sit in the lineup at Manu Bay. But it's also important of what are you going to do if you don't make it in competitive surfing? You know, how long can you afford it? That's the hardest thing is all that travel and competing and entry fees and accommodation and car hire and stuff like that. And those marketing dollars are definitely shrinking. There's no two ways about it. We're all aware of it.
- [22:01]
Ann McGinty
There is that, that mental side that you mentioned. It's sort of similar to someone who is trying to become a famous musician or like make it big in Hollywood. And they hit these incredible milestones. Like what? Billy made it to the Olympics. I think I saw a post on his Instagram and he was talking about the letdown after the Olympics. Like how mental it got.
- [22:24]
John Clapham
Oh, definitely. You got 20 minutes, catch the two best waves or sometimes even 15 minutes. And that ocean, you've got to be in sync with it. There's so many different things going on.
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Ann McGinty
So many variables, so many variables.
- [22:37]
John Clapham
And, you know, some of the best get knocked out in the first round and some of the not so best can make it to the final sometimes it's pretty crazy. It's a really hard sport. And again, with the refinery, we've done a ledge of the Ledge, which is a contest that's running up until the end of August, where we're basically the best barrel at Manu Bay. We're giving away $2,000 for men's, $2,000 for women's, and then $1,000 for under 20s. And it's free to enter. All you got to do is get your video of you in that barrel and post it to our Instagram accounts. And there's $5,000 in prize money. Plus we're given $250 per filmer that films the video of the barrel. So, again, that's something just trying to give back. And hopefully that money is going to help the kids that do win those contests go and compete in other contests. That's been really good for us to give back there that way as well, and free. So, you know, the kids are out there. There's a surf academy here in Raglan, and I had one of the teachers the other day. It's like, man, when we do drills now, half the kids just sit out the back waiting for a wave to get barreled on. Sorry, it was pretty classic when they.
- [23:45]
Ann McGinty
Said that, but that's a pretty cool competition that you set up.
- [23:48]
John Clapham
Yeah, it is. Chrissy Malone, our surf team manager, came up with it. We're talking about we need to have a barrel comp at the Ledge. And there was a contest last year that ran, and leading up to it was pumping, there was insane waves, and all the local kids were looking really good. Day of the contest, it was over the weekend. I think the first couple of days was quite small, and a lot of the kids that we thought local kids from here that were going to get through and be in the finals got knocked out. And then the swell jacked up to what would have been perfect for them, but they were already out of the comp. So we came up, you know, after that when, hey, you know, like you talked about that barrel contest, why don't we run it over a period of time? This is its second year now. We. We ran it last year, but we only ran it for a couple of months. This year we're running it for five to six months. Another mate of mine, Stewie, came up with the. The name Ledge of the Ledge, and we just went from there. Calling on my contacts in Australia, we've got Tommy Carroll, Ronnie and Vaughan Blakey that are commentators on the wsl, Matt Benrose, who is the international team manager for Volcom, and Chrissy Malone. They're all judges, and that's just calling in a favor on friends. So, yeah, we've got run at Grassroots and kept it pretty low key, but we want to continue to grow that and make it bigger and bigger. And I think the most important thing, it's free. Anyone can enter. Hopefully the kids that do win can then use that to help them compete in contests or at least go on a surf trip to Bali that, you know, money that they never had before. So that's the concept behind that.
- [25:14]
Ann McGinty
Who is doing all of the designs that you guys have? Because I'm pretty sure that my family walked out with at least a sweatshirt or a T shirt each. Because your designs are quite cool.
- [25:25]
John Clapham
Yeah. Again, we've got a number of artists that work with us local guys. We've got Anaru, who's an ex TNC graphic artist. He's done a lot of stuff for us there. Jamie Brown, who is an ex Falcom graphic artist, he did that original logo that you're wearing there. And then we've got, you know, a town one. We just build it as we go along and just depends on what artist is available. You know, when we're traveling around the world, if we're going snowboarding or we're going to Hawaii, we definitely look for inspiration within in those areas there especially, you know, I've just been in Australia last week, so going through all the retail and sussing out what's going on and, you know, front embroidered prints or stuff like that, there's a lot of trends that you can follow as well.
- [26:08]
Ann McGinty
With your brand and that's a nice little perk to be able to turn a leisure trip into a business trip. So you've been in the surfskate industry for so long. Do you see any gaps in the marketplace?
- [26:22]
John Clapham
I think there's great opportunity for the smaller brands now, and I think gone are the big days of two $300 million companies. I think companies sitting just under that 20 mil mark, there's a lot of opportunity. You can be profitable. You can go to bed at night and sleep. You know, I think that's the most important thing. There's nothing worse than going, oh, my God, are we going to pull this off? You know, I've been there, done that, and it's not good. It's not good for your mental health. Like we spoke about before, the big guys are sorting themselves out right now with Billabong, Volcom, you know, all being under the same umbrella. I think they've got some work to do there, but they seem to Be getting on top of stuff now, just coming back and hearing that. But I think the likes of the Mad Hois, small brands like that, there's a lot of opportunity in the marketplace right now. Online is definitely the way to start a brand right now versus bricks and mortar. But there is opportunity out there and I think a lot of the retailers want some fresh and new alongside of the majors that build the industry. There wouldn't be an industry without them, so we need them. But there is opportunity for new brands, definitely.
- [27:25]
Ann McGinty
You mentioned sleepless nights.
- [27:27]
John Clapham
Yep.
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Ann McGinty
What have been the hardest moments in business?
- [27:31]
John Clapham
Hardest moments in business is probably that recession in 2008 when we had to lay off 20 plus staff in a day. You know, we just had to, we had to make cuts to make the business survive. And that was, that was the hardest day for me, definitely. You know, again, the company was like family, the staff were like family. It was really hard to let everyone go and then some harder than others. Sales were going down, we had to be profitable. That was definitely, you know, something I probably wouldn't wish on my worst enemy. Got through it in the end. But I was lucky with Mel, Mel being super strong and we just had, we had a young family. She was like, look, I'll look after the boys. You just deal with this and just fight and scratch our way through it and got it back up to be profitable again and, and sold the license back to the USA and came back home. So, yeah, that's the hardest thing is any business budget, you gotta do your budget and you gotta do it on the worst case scenario. You gotta have all those what ifs. When I was consulting for the Madhuis and Stacey, it was looking at everything and a lot of people are blue sky, oh, we're gonna get 20% growth and DA, da, da, da. And you've gotta go, well, what if budget for the worst case scenario and everything else is cream. The numbers don't lie. Constantly going back to your budgets and looking them, updating them, working on cash flows and stuff like that. And that there will help you enjoy business a bit more if you're just like, oh, no, I'm going to kill this. This is going to be unreal. We're on. You're going to be up against the wall before you know it. So I think, yeah, that's super important is knowing your numbers, budgeting, worst case scenario, and then everything else is cream on top of that. And then, you know, you can go back and readjust them every quarter or every month if you want. But You've seen people do it and, and sometimes it does, but nine times out of ten it won't. And you just gotta be really prepared for the worst case scenario and then just work from there.
- [29:24]
Ann McGinty
Yeah, prepared. And also know when to cut your losses.
- [29:28]
John Clapham
Oh yeah, that's a hard one. Cutting your losses. The what if, what if we keep going?
- [29:32]
Ann McGinty
It's just, it's gonna turn. What other advice would you give to young people today, especially aspiring entrepreneurs?
- [29:45]
John Clapham
You know, schooling nowadays is totally different and I think, you know, if kids aren't into it, get out, but go and do an apprenticeship. You know, surrounding yourself with the right people, having clear idea of what you want to do and setting out and doing that and making sure that you're enjoying it along the way. I think, you know, if you're going to build a company and you've got people coming in, you want them to want to work for you and go to war for you and stand next to you and believe in you and follow you. And I think that's a super important thing, is being a good listener and leading your team in the right direction. You surround yourself with people that are going to strengthen your weaknesses. Like I said before, a cfo, like I knew marketing and we knew product, but we got good CFO in, we got a good sales manager in, good production people in. So they're just strengthening what you already know. Don't ever think that you know everything and everyone should be listening to you. Like be open minded and bring people in that are going to challenge you and make you step up to the plate. I think that's the most important thing in business is having good people that are going to challenge you on a day to day basis and bring the best out of you.
- [30:54]
Ann McGinty
So looking back at your career and just the last 20 odd years or so, what is it that you're the most proud of? Like what is success to you?
- [31:05]
John Clapham
Success to me is, you know, I didn't have a degree, I didn't go to university and just giving a chance, improving ourselves that we could do it and that we built this brand and we built all these people. We gave people jobs and opportunities that are now in the surf industry and other areas, started up their own brands, just having a go and being able to bring along a lot of people with us that have remained in the surf industry. As bad as it sounds, meeting my wife in the surf industry was really exciting and she was the Burton brand manager for 10 years. So that's how we met. To still work with her today, that in itself, you know, to be married to someone and be in a business partner with them is real challenging. And then, you know, lifetime friends is a big thing for me as well. And a lot of those guys that I have worked with in the past were still good friends. And a lot of them, it's just you pick up where you left off. You know, it was just like yesterday. You might see them for a couple of years and it's just back and as simple as they are, that's the things that sort of mean the most to me. I owe a lot to surfing and the surf industry as it has put me here today. You know, all the hard work has paid off and, you know, at the end of the day, I just want to keep surfing.
- [32:17]
Ann McGinty
Yeah, I too feel like that's all that really matters. And I feel like some people understand that earlier than others. I definitely didn't feel that way in my 20s. So just as a final question, if you could go back and talk with yourself when you were in your early 20s, what would you say?
- [32:37]
John Clapham
What are you doing? Just believe in yourself, look everyone in the eye, speak to everyone, say thank you. Did you say hello? And just from a business point of view, the numbers don't lie. Just, you know, be looking at those budgets. You got to look at the worst case scenario and then everything after that is cream and probably slow down a bit more and enjoy it. You know, there's no finish line. It's just, you know, it's a marathon, not a race. And I feel a lot of people are racing to get somewhere, but they never get there. If I could have my time again, spend more time with my family and, you know, enjoy them more instead of just going to work the whole time and just doing this for them. And then we now sit here, you know, they're 20 and 23 and they're off doing their own things, but I'm good friends with them, so, yeah, probably the most important thing would be like, remember to breathe, like, enjoy what you're doing, but also spend more time with the family and take it all in. Head down, bum up, and if you believe in yourself, great things can happen.
- [33:42]
Ann McGinty
JC it's been so good to catch up again and to see you. I hope to see you again when we're in New Zealand next.
- [33:50]
John Clapham
Yeah. Or vice versa. When we're over there, we'll come and see you.
- [33:53]
Ann McGinty
Yeah, please, yeah. Today's key takeaways. When opportunity presents, jump at it and give it 110%. A willingness to learn and adapt is often more valuable than formal credentials. Sometimes the next big thing isn't happening in your backyard. Look outside your industry and outside your country. What's trending in a surf shop in Australia might spark an idea for your cafe in California. If you happen to discover a new brand or idea, there could be opportunity. Stay curious about how others are innovating and broaden your perspective. You never know who you may meet when you put yourself in places where you interact with people on a daily basis. Look people in the eye, be genuine and build lasting relationships with people you interact with throughout your career and life. These relationships can lead to further opportunities or collaborations, but most importantly, to lifelong friendships. Surround yourself with people who are going to strengthen your weaknesses and challenge you and bring the best out of you. Lean on your network, your mentors and team to help fill in the knowledge gaps along the way. Great leaders don't have all the answers, but they can build teams that do. Being a good leader means having a team that wants to work for you and that believes in you. Be a good listener and pump up others tires along the way. Create a culture where people are excited to come to work, not feeling like they have to go to work. Ideally you want buy in from your team, not for them to just look at what they're doing because it's a job just to get paid. But if you approach your team from the mindset of trying to make it a career for them, you're more likely to get buy in. And if your team is excited to go to work, it will show in their customer service. And customer service is so important. After the call, JC mentioned how on a recent trip to Australia he walked into a surf shop and one staff member was looking at videos on YouTube and another was behind the register looking down. Nobody greeted him, which was shocking to him. On a customer service level you have to make your customers feel at home. It's often the little things, the eye contact, conversation, asking questions that convert someone from a browser into a loyal customer. Community engagement can drive brand growth. A creative youth competition with a fun prize isn't just marketing, it's culture building. Tie it to social media, involve local judges and let your brand become a meaningful part of your community. Know your numbers. The numbers don't lie. Always understand your cash flow, profit and loss and worst case scenario. Anything above that worst case scenario is cream. But make sure to work out those what ifs. Believe in yourself. If school isn't for you, that's okay, but that means you've got to start working and learning in the real world. And lastly, slow down a bit more and enjoy the journey. There is no finish line. It's a marathon, not a race. People seem to be racing somewhere, but there isn't a finish line. Spend more time with your family if you can. And remember to breathe and enjoy what you're doing. That's it for today. I release episodes once a week, so come back and check it out. Have a great day.