How I Built This: Advice Line with Chieh Huang of Boxed

Host: Guy Raz
Guest: Chieh Huang, Co-founder of Boxed
Date: April 16, 2026
Format: Advice Line – Founders call in for feedback

Episode Overview

This Advice Line edition of How I Built This features Guy Raz in conversation with Chieh Huang, co-founder of Boxed. Together, they offer hands-on, strategic guidance to three early-stage founders facing pivotal business and growth challenges. In the episode’s spirit, Chieh reflects on the journey (including Boxed’s bankruptcy), shares learnings from success and failure, and provides thoughtful, candid feedback on each caller’s business.

Key Discussions and Insights

1. Chieh Huang’s Post-Boxed Journey and Lessons Learned

Timestamps: 04:20 – 10:12

• After Boxed went public and subsequently filed for bankruptcy in 2023, Chieh speaks openly about the emotional toll and the lessons learned.
• Chieh emphasizes that in hindsight, he wouldn’t trade the experience:

  "If we had a time machine and we travelled back to my parents’ garage...I would say, sign me up now. Because the people I’ve met, the people we’ve helped, the things I’ve learned, I just wouldn’t trade it for the world." (05:36, Chieh Huang)

• He now co-founded Pelgo with Frank d’Souza, focusing on affordable, scalable outplacement and job transition services—addressing job loss due to AI.

2. Caller 1: Alec, Founder of Surfing Cow (Natural Skincare Brand)

Timestamps: 10:39 – 26:29

Business Background

• Alec’s brand, Surfing Cow, makes natural skincare for “people who live outside,” including a mineral sun balm and moisturizer. Their unique ingredient is beef tallow—a nod to heritage formulations.
• Revenue scaled from ~$74,000 in year one to a projected $220–250K. Manufacturing is all done at home.

Challenge

• Alec seeks advice on scaling without sacrificing the brand’s “soul,” maintaining quality and radical transparency while considering manufacturing and possible fundraising.

Advice & Notable Quotes

On Scaling Production:

• Guy Raz: “You can’t make this yourself in the long term… You’ve really got to find somebody who can make them for you... focus on locking down the formula.” (16:52)
• Chieh Huang: “Your number one job right now is to make sure this thing can scale so the wheels don’t fall off in the coming months... Getting the working capital to actually begin professional manufacturing...that’s something you’re going to have to figure out pretty quickly.” (16:20)

On Raising Capital:

• Chieh Huang:

  "...Most businesses are quite binary... this is going to be really big... or we’re going to see it nowhere. And actually when you think about the dilution you’ll take from outside capital...if this becomes a billion dollar business...you’re not going to find a very sympathetic Chieh when you say, ‘Oh my gosh, but I had to sell 15%.’... But you know, what you don't want to have happen is that it could have been a billion dollar business, but you didn't want to give up 15%." (21:43)

• Guy Raz:

  "If you do raise money...I wouldn’t raise more than $50,000 at most...with small checks from people you know that believe in this.” (23:09)

On Finding a Manufacturer (Co-Man):

• Guy Raz:

  "You really want to visit these places and talk to people. Part of it is instinct and you will make mistakes... It’s like dating not marriage, and I think that’s how you have to approach any relationship you enter into." (25:17)

On Maintaining Brand Soul:

• Guy Raz: “The core here, the foundation here isn’t the cow part, it’s the surfing part. That’s who you are. That’s what this is. It’s about a lifestyle.”

3. Caller 2: Jessica, Founder of Tail Cinch (Equine Products)

Timestamps: 29:35 – 38:24

Business Background

• Jessica started Tail Cinch, a brand offering reusable tail ties (hero product) for horses, largely to eliminate the waste of traditional electrical tape and improve animal welfare. The products are being adopted beyond the polo market, including by general horse owners.

• Annual revenue: $70K–$80K, steady over four years.

Challenge

• Should Jessica list on large retail platforms (Chewy, ValleyVet) despite thin margins, to boost awareness and growth?

Advice & Notable Quotes

On Expanding to Large Retailers:

• Chieh Huang:

  "Yes, I do think it is worth it to go on those platforms... as long as you're not losing money and you know data will show whether you're cannibalizing your customers or not, it can be an excellent way to get the brand out there." (35:51)

• Che caution:

  "What you have to really worry about is not so much the erosion in margin but also the working capital... Retailers are going to expect really long payment cycles... so your thin margins just became even thinner." (35:51)

On Product and Market Expansion:

• Guy Raz:

  "Now you're talking about a much bigger total addressable market...there’s an opportunity to really innovate in these kind of stale products that people have been buying for decades... No one’s really disrupted or changed." (37:30)

On Overlapping Pet Markets:

• Chieh Huang:

  "If you own a horse, there's a very high likelihood that you own other pets... targeting that audience via Chewy and some of the pet specialty platforms might not be the worst idea." (38:02)

Market Size Reality Check:

• Guy Raz:

  “Apparently, the total addressable market for just horse products—gear and apparel—is $20 billion.” (38:50)

4. Caller 3: Eli, Co-founder of My Makor Coffee (Functional Beverage)

Timestamps: 42:32 – 55:21

Business Background

• Minneapolis-based organic coffee blended with anti-inflammatory spices (cacao, turmeric, cinnamon, chaga mushroom, cayenne, ginger). Distribution: DTC plus local/regional retail.
• On track for $200–300K sales, 300 subscribers/month, mostly online.

Challenge

• The spice blend (esp. cacao) slows the brewing process, causing overflow with drip machines at high volumes—risking customer churn. How to balance health impact, mass appeal, and operational reality?

Advice & Notable Quotes

On Product Adaptation for Scale:

• Chieh Huang:

  "...Do you want to be right or do you want to be happy?... In order for the blend to be to your standard...but for it to have big uses...you might need to modify the formula a little bit." (46:57)

  • Suggests a formulation adapted for office/commercial drip machines, since “office coffee is like a knife fight of an industry.”

• Guy Raz’s suggestion:

  "Literally just say, best brewed in a French press... While you’re trying to formulate something that would...down the road you want this to be in K cups... But in the meantime... best brewed in French press or pour over." (44:44, 50:43)

On Expanding Formats and Ease:

• Guy Raz (citing Justin’s Nut Butter):

  "What changed... was... the pouches... Could you do something...like... single serve freeze dried coffee pack that also has, say, 10% of the freeze dried herbs and spices...an instant version of this for people to take on the go... Just an idea." (53:38)

On Moats through Difficulty:

• Chieh Huang:

  "...With challenges come sustainable moats. If you’re able to have that proprietary grind, that could be really interesting because anyone who’s going to copy this...will have to figure out and walk through the same difficult steps that you’ll walk through." (49:56)

Closing Reflections

Final Advice from Chieh Huang (55:50–56:53)

"I would tell myself that... the reward is the journey... every entrepreneur experiences the same thing. It’s problem after problem. And it gets tough, lonely, stressful. But as I’ve walked the path for now, almost two decades, I enjoy it... I think you’re going to find me... back on the show when I’m 75 with a new company, because I think solving problems and... affecting people in a good way... So if we took that time machine, I would say, listen, you’re gonna have ups, you’re gonna have downs, but enjoy the ride because it’s gonna be worth it."

Memorable Moments & Quotes

• Radical Transparency in CPG:

  "You’re like the Bridgewater Associates of the beach. It’s wild."
  (20:17, Chieh Huang to Alec/Surfing Cow)

• On Funding and Dilution:

  “If this becomes a billion dollar business... here’s $100 bill, dry your eye.”
  (22:34, Chieh Huang to Alec)

• On the Reality of Entrepreneurship:

  "It gets tough, it gets lonely, it gets stressful. But... enjoy the ride."
  (56:42, Chieh Huang)

Notable Timestamps

• 04:20–10:12: Chieh’s post-Boxed journey, founding Pelgo
• 10:39–26:29: Surfing Cow: scaling, soul, manufacturing, fundraising
• 29:35–38:24: Tail Cinch: market expansion, retail platforms, innovation
• 42:32–55:21: My Makor Coffee: product optimization, brewing challenges, format innovation
• 55:50–56:53: Chieh's reflection on entrepreneurship

Tone and Takeaway:
Guy and Chieh’s approach is warm, humorous, hands-on, and candid. They consistently acknowledge both the highs and lows—emphasizing iterative problem-solving, authenticity, and embracing the messiness of building something new.

For Founders:
If you’re at a similar inflection point, consider:

• Focusing early on scalable infrastructure (manufacturing, operations)
• Seeking mission-aligned, small-scale capital before running out of bandwidth/capacity
• Experimenting with formats and channels, even if it means iterating the product for different uses (e.g., office vs. home)
• Protecting the soul of your brand, but not at the cost of missing out on outsized opportunity