Hexclad: Danny Winer

Summary

How I Built This with Guy Raz: Hexclad – Danny Weiner

Introduction

In this compelling episode of How I Built This, Guy Raz sits down with Danny Weiner, the CEO and co-founder of Hexclad Cookware. Danny shares his remarkable journey from aspiring actor to the leader of a $500 million cookware company within a decade. His story is a testament to resilience, innovation, and the power of taking calculated risks later in life.

Early Life and Career Aspirations

Danny Weiner's initial ambition was far from the kitchen. Growing up in Buffalo, New York, he pursued his passion for film and theater at NYU, dreaming of making it big in Hollywood. After graduating, Danny moved to Los Angeles, tirelessly auditioning for roles. However, his acting career never took off as he hoped.

Danny Weiner [05:51]: “I don't think I ever wanted to be a Brad Pitt level star. I think what I wanted was just enough of it that I could let... maybe go back to New York and call my shots in the theater... make a good living.”

Despite landing a few background parts in commercials and even a minor role in a film starring Sean Connery and Wesley Snipes, Danny felt the sting of unfulfilled dreams. The repeated rejections and lack of substantial roles fostered a growing sense of anxiety and fear of failure.

A Pivotal Accident and Career Shift

Danny's life took an unexpected turn when he was involved in a severe car accident around 1994. The injuries left him bedridden for months, grappling with physical pain and financial strain. This period of convalescence became a catalyst for change.

Danny Weiner [10:01]: “I shattered my right leg. I broke vertebrae in my back... I had to make money. I had no money and... I had this moment. This is one of the pivotal moments in my life.”

Determined to overcome his circumstances, Danny accepted a role helping sell cookware at trade shows, introduced by a friend from NYU. This opportunity marked the beginning of his foray into the cookware industry.

Building a Sales Career

Danny quickly thrived in his new role, leveraging his sales acumen to excel as a sales representative. He partnered closely with Cole McCrae, who would later become his co-founder at Hexclad. Their shared dedication and complementary skills laid a strong foundation for future entrepreneurial endeavors.

From Juicers to Cookware: The Birth of Hexclad

Initially, Danny and Cole ventured into the juicer market with their product, Juice Presso. Although they achieved respectable sales, the business ultimately faltered due to market saturation and changing consumer preferences. Recognizing the need to pivot, Danny's persistence led him to the Canton Fair in China in 2015, where he discovered a revolutionary nonstick cookware technology.

Danny Weiner [37:58]: “I owe it to Xi Jinping, because he showed up at the Canton fair... I found a round steel plate with hexagons all over it. That’s when Hexclad was born.”

Impressed by the hexagon-etched steel surface that promised durability and superior cooking performance, Danny saw immense potential. Collaborating with the inventor, Mr. Lee, they rebranded the product as Hexclad, aiming to bring this innovative cookware to the American market.

Launching Hexclad: Overcoming Initial Challenges

Launching Hexclad was not without its hurdles. Danny and Cole operated on a shoestring budget, funding the venture through personal savings, credit cards, and strategic reinvestment of early profits. Their dedication manifested in hand-packaging orders from Cole's backyard, often resulting in physical wear and tear but ensuring the highest quality control.

Danny Weiner [15:54]: “We were bootstrapped. It was just me and Cole and our assistant. We used outside bookkeeping and a 3PL for handling logistics.”

Struggling to secure investor interest, they faced skepticism about the viability of a direct-to-consumer cookware brand. Undeterred, Danny emphasized the unique selling points of Hexclad: its scratch-resistant, nonstick surface and oven-safe design, which distinguished it from traditional aluminum and Teflon-coated pans.

Scaling Through Costco and Digital Marketing

Their breakthrough came when Hexclad secured a demonstration slot at a Costco store in November 2017. Despite initial nervousness, the in-store demos were a resounding success, leading to rapid expansion across multiple Costco locations.

Danny Weiner [58:12]: “We sold around $5,000 worth of product the first day in one store. It was scary and exhilarating at the same time.”

Simultaneously, Danny honed their digital marketing strategy, particularly through Facebook ads and engaging social media content. By mid-2018, Hexclad had reached profitability, setting the stage for exponential growth.

A Game-Changing Partnership with Gordon Ramsay

The true turning point for Hexclad came during the COVID-19 pandemic. As traditional retail channels like Costco faced disruptions, Hexclad pivoted to online sales, capitalizing on the surge in home cooking. Amidst this growth, Hexclad caught the attention of renowned chef Gordon Ramsay, who became an equity partner and brand ambassador.

Danny Weiner [67:03]: “We started doing amazing things with Gordon. He brought a lot of eyeballs to our brand, which is exactly what we needed.”

Gordon Ramsay's endorsement catapulted Hexclad into the spotlight, driving sales from $170 million to unprecedented heights within a year. His involvement not only amplified Hexclad's reach but also cemented its reputation for quality and innovation.

Global Expansion and Diversification

With Gordon Ramsay on board, Hexclad expanded its product line beyond pans to include knives, cutting boards, aprons, and other kitchen tools. The company embraced a global manufacturing strategy, sourcing materials and production from Japan, China, Slovenia, and the U.S., ensuring scalability and quality control.

Danny Weiner [74:20]: “We want to own the kitchen. We aim to innovate every kitchen category with quality and stylish designs.”

By 2025, Hexclad employed approximately 240 people worldwide, maintaining efficient operations while continuing to innovate and diversify its product offerings.

Insights and Reflections

Danny attributes Hexclad's success to a blend of hard work, market understanding, and strategic partnerships. He emphasizes the importance of controlling the business narrative through direct-to-consumer models and building genuine relationships with both customers and partners like Gordon Ramsay.

Danny Weiner [78:21]: “I try to control the tiller. I have the best chance of us getting to our place successfully by steering the ship effectively through any storm.”

He also reflects on the significance of taking risks later in life, highlighting that age should not be a barrier to entrepreneurial success. Danny's journey underscores that perseverance, adaptability, and trust in one's vision can lead to extraordinary achievements, regardless of age or initial setbacks.

Conclusion

Danny Weiner's story is an inspiring example of how unexpected challenges can lead to transformative opportunities. From aspiring actor to leading a global cookware brand, his journey with Hexclad illustrates the power of resilience, innovation, and strategic collaboration. For entrepreneurs and dreamers alike, Danny's experience offers valuable lessons on navigating the tumultuous seas of business with determination and a steadfast vision.

Notable Quotes

• Danny Weiner [10:01]: “I shattered my right leg. I broke vertebrae in my back... I had to make money. I had no money and... I had this moment. This is one of the pivotal moments in my life.”

• Danny Weiner [37:58]: “I owe it to Xi Jinping, because he showed up at the Canton fair... I found a round steel plate with hexagons all over it. That’s when Hexclad was born.”

• Danny Weiner [46:26]: “Hexclad was a handshake agreement. We trusted each other completely to bring this product to the U.S. market.”

• Danny Weiner [77:44]: “Failure's been one of the best things to ever happen to me. If Juice Presso hadn't failed, Hexclad would not be as successful.”

Conclusion

Danny Weiner’s transformative journey from the uncertainty of an acting career to spearheading a successful cookware empire offers invaluable insights into entrepreneurship, resilience, and the importance of believing in one’s innovative ideas. Hexclad’s rise is not just a story of business success but also a narrative of personal growth and unwavering determination.

Transcript

[Guy Raz]

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[Danny Weiner]

We would literally line up boxes in Cole's backyard and we'd run down a line and I'd be like 12 inch pan, 12 inch pan, 12 inch pan. Hand packaging, hand packaging them to save money. And then we'd be like taping them closed. And we, we had so many paper cuts on our fingers that there sometimes would be little blood spots on the, on the box. And we would have to take Windex and go back and clean the blood off the top of the box and we would drive them to the Costco to sell them.

[Guy Raz]

Welcome to How I Built this. A show about innovators, entrepreneurs, idealists, and the stories behind the movements they built. Hi guys, I'm Guy Raz. And on the show today, how Danny Weiner grew Hexclad from a backyard business into a 500 million dollar cookware company in just under 10 years. Anything you use to cook, food, pots, pans, Dutch ovens, they're part of a $73 billion global industry known as cookware. Everyone has to cook, right? But surprisingly, at least in the US there aren't that many brands that people know. Sure, you might recognize all Clad or Lodge or even Le Creuset. But for the most part, people tend to buy whatever's cheapest at Target or Walmart. And that's opened the doors to a bunch of new upstart brands over the past few years. One of these brands is called Hexclad. It was launched about a decade ago by two guys who previously worked as sales reps for another cookware company that's no longer in business. Danny Weiner, one of the founders, discovered the pans at a trade show in China back in 2015. He was instantly intrigued by the pans nonstick features and its hexagon like pattern on the surface. Danny would end up teaming with the inventor in Korea, rebranding the product as Hexclad and coming up with a whole new line of cookware with that same surface. In 2024, barely a decade after its founding, Hexclad sold over $500 million worth of its products. Now, when Danny first came across this technology, he and his co founder, Cole McCrae were running low on cash. Their previous business, which was selling high end home juicers, was about to collapse. Danny went to that trade show in China as a kind of Hail Mary move, hoping for a miracle. Even more remarkable is that he never intended to become an entrepreneur, let alone an expert in cookware. Danny wanted to become an actor. He grew up in Buffalo, New York, and studied film and theater at nyu. After graduating, he moved to Los Angeles, where he hit round after round of auditions and cattle calls.

[Danny Weiner]

I don't think I ever wanted to be a Brad Pitt level star. I think what I wanted was just enough of it that I could let. I could, like, maybe go back to New York and call my shots in the theater, you know, and things like that, and bounce back and forth and make a good living. But I didn't have to be worth hundreds of millions of dollars and, you know, be a Harrison Ford.

[Guy Raz]

And you could have. I mean, looking at you, I mean, I could see you in Goodfellas or, you know, you could be, you know, sort of. You could play an Italian, a Jewish guy, or, you know, you like a New York kind of character act type.

[Danny Weiner]

Yeah, you know, listen, you wonder why these things don't work out for you at a given time. Yeah, you know, I always wonder, you know, does the universe give you success when you're ready to handle it? I don't know. Could I have gone down, you know, the wrong path if it had been easy?

[Guy Raz]

So you get to la and what did you do? Did you start to go on auditions?

[Danny Weiner]

I started going on auditions. You know, it was so different than New York because I remember the first audition I went to, I showed up, you know, gave my resume, my headshot, and they lined me up and they were looking at my height. And then they go, okay, thanks for coming in. And I'm like, wait, do I get to read or act? No, I'm the wrong height and I'm like, how about a courtesy? Cause, like, I might be wrong for this. But, you know, I found out, I think they'd hired the girl who was gonna be in it and she was like 5:1. So they kind of wanted a guy who was like 5 8. Now I'm 5 11. It was a very disrespectful process at the time, I found.

[Guy Raz]

So this is a period of like three, roughly three years where you're sort of going back and forth in and out of auditions. And did you ever land? I mean, you must have landed some things.

[Danny Weiner]

It's funny the things that you land that get you going. And like, I don't even have access to this, but a couple of like, short films that never really got anywhere. Maybe they played in a festival, but it was a really good role type of thing. And I can't even go into detail Because I just barely remember them. But then I get like a couple commercials and. And sometimes you have a line and sometimes you don't. Sometimes it's music and you're just on the beach and you're running around and, you know, and you and a girl are running down the sand and you know, and that's the commercial. And you're like, well, I guess it's acting in a way.

[Guy Raz]

Do you remember feeling anxious at that time? Just feeling a lot of anxiety about the future and about life?

[Danny Weiner]

There is a little bit. But I think in a way you still, I would say, you know, now I'm like, I'm probably about 27ish. I'm still dumb enough to think like that. Oh, you know, it's not me, it's them and they're gonna see and people are gonna wanna hire me and. But I think what started creeping in was I don't like failing at things. And I was feeling. Beginning to feel like a failure. And the thing is when you fail, like, look, you know, eventually at the end of the fourth quarter, right, they blow the whistle and the game's over and there's no like, oh, I don't wanna feel like a fail. Well, you did fail today. You failed. So. So now you have to, you know, dust yourself off and decide how do I win next time? Whatever that looks like. And I think that feeling was beginning to creep into my, my mind, that one. I don't want to be seen as a failure. I don't like looking at myself in the mirror when I'm failing.

[Guy Raz]

Nobody. No, but nobody does.

[Danny Weiner]

Yeah.

[Guy Raz]

Yeah. I guess around 1994, you get in a car accident, a bad one.

[Danny Weiner]

Yes.

[Guy Raz]

Very badly injured. And you ended up, like, having to go through rehab and walking with a cane for a long time. Many months back. Brace. What happened? I mean, were you just. I mean. Yeah, I mean, what happened?

[Danny Weiner]

Well, you know, this. It's obviously one of these life changing moments. And you know, it was a bad accident. I shattered my right leg. I broke vertebrae in my back and I had to get better. But. And I. And obviously when you're young and broke now you're even broker, but you're not younger, so. And during that period, I said, number one focus is I have to make money. I don't know what that looks like. I'd never been so poor. You know, I. I had this moment. In fact, this is one of the. A pivotal moment in my life. And I don't know if I've ever told it publicly. I've Told a few friends, but I was on crutches still, so I'd had like pins taken out of my leg, but I had to walk with. With crutches just because my legs weren't strong enough. And, and we lived. My buddy and I had a house in Eagle Rock, California, and we lived kind of on the side of the hill. And I had no money and I, you know, at home I couldn't work yet, so I'd be. Until he came home from work, I'd be sitting in his house. And, you know, we didn't have cell phones then. You know, I don't think we even had Internet then. And the movie Braveheart came out and I remember I had a free movie pass to the Glendale movie theater. So I'm like, I'm going to go see this movie to cheer me up. And I, I crutch down the hill and I go to the bus stop. You know, I have no car now, and I take the bus. I see Braveheart, you know, it inspires me. And I come back and I see there on the side of the road this, this gentleman who's standing there with bags of oranges. And I'm like, look, this poor guy's got to stand out here. I go, how much of the bag of oranges? He's like, $2. I have $2 left after the movie. So I buy the bag of oranges and he puts them in like a plastic shopping bag. And, you know, I'm crutching up the hill and I get almost to the top of the hill and I'm exhausted and the bottom of the garbage bag rips and all my oranges start tumbling out and they're rolling all the way down the hill and I just, I can't chase them. I'm not physically able to chase them. And I look down the hill and I start to cry. And. And the thing is, I'm not a. I don't cry often. And I start crying and I'm like, I can't believe I'm going through all this. And I had that moment of self pity, and then somehow I saw myself like in the third person, you know, on the hill with these crutches with a torn plastic bag. And I just started laughing and I'm like, I can't believe this is what I'm going through right now. But it was a pivotal moment for me.

[Guy Raz]

So. All right, so you go through this sort of traumatic accident and you are unable to work, and clearly you haven't really managed to get any kind of traction as an actor. And I guess around this time you had a friend who. Somebody you actually knew from nyu.

[Danny Weiner]

Yes.

[Guy Raz]

Who was. He was like selling cookware at trade shows and said, hey, do you want to help me out? Is that. Is that what happened around that time?

[Danny Weiner]

That's exactly what happened. I hadn't worked yet, so I was, I was just getting off my, my cane at that point.

[Guy Raz]

Yeah.

[Danny Weiner]

And. But I had to work. I had no money. And he said, listen, you know, you want to come to this convention center? We sell cookware. I'm like, cookware? He goes, yeah. He goes, I need you. I need somebody to help run the credit cards and stuff. He goes, I'll give you 500 bucks. And I'm like, 500 bucks? Sweet. I'm there. And I went and helped him. And it was hard because it's 10 hours on your feet. And I'm like, I'm like. I was in a lot of pain, you know, so. But you know, I saw him do well and he's like, I go, if you need help again, let me know. And he goes, well, I'm doing another one of these in, I don't know, a week or two. Do you want to help me? I'm like, yeah. And I'm like, whenever you need the help. Because at that point I'm like, oh, I do have my days free. I can still go to an audition if I get one. And I can work these Friday, Saturdays and Sundays with him. And then I got good enough at it on my own that the company offered me to do my own events. And, you know, that's the first time where I go, I don't want to do this, but this makes sense because I can make money, I can make it quickly. I can. Don't have to completely kill my dream yet, but I can get a lot of bang for my buck. And I'm getting better and better at this.

[Guy Raz]

So this was. Okay, Your friend is Frankie Buddy. And what kind of cookware were they selling? Pans and pots and pans.

[Danny Weiner]

Yep, pots, pots and pans. And it was like a restaurant line of cookware.

[Guy Raz]

So you. So you basically get a job as a sort of a commission based sales rep for them. And did they, I mean, did they put you through, like, sales training first before. Before you started to go out and pitch?

[Danny Weiner]

So essentially what wound up happening in my case was I had worked for months with my friend. Like, once I started generating income for him as well, he's like, here, I'll pay you more, because you're really Valuable to me. I can go grab lunch and I come back and you've made sales. So by the time I was offered this, you know, this spot, I was very good. Like, I was very trained. I knew the cookware space.

[Guy Raz]

So you're still. And. And so then you become a sales rep for this company.

[Danny Weiner]

Yes.

[Guy Raz]

But you still had one foot in entertainment. Right. You were still kind of going to some auditions now and again, still thinking this was gonna just pay the bills.

[Danny Weiner]

Yes. And you may be overly generous saying afoot. It may have been my big toe at that point, but you know what? There was the point where you're kind of done. And I remember, I think I had a 9am audition, and the alarm went. And I looked and I hit snooze and I went back to sleep. And I knew that day, at that point, I needed to do this. It was producing a very good income. At this point, you saw this as.

[Guy Raz]

Something that, you know. And I think you are admitting this now in hindsight, but that at the time, you kind of felt like that it was not really what you had planned to do with your life.

[Danny Weiner]

No. And. And look, the fact is, very few people are on that, you know, on the. On the plan they set for themselves lying on their bunk bed when they were 12 years old, you know, so, you know, identifying what I was good at and removing ego. I mean, I have a healthy ego, like a lot of people do. And you know what was kind of interesting as I felt like, oh, I'm a frigging salesman, but I was making a good living. And I had a really good friend, another NYU buddy who was a lawyer, and he was seeing me, like, work these weekends and then have the days off, and he's working his ass off. And here, you know, he's got law school loans, and he's like, listen, is there any chance I could get one of these cookware jobs? And I'm like, buddy, you're a lawyer. You know?

[Guy Raz]

Yeah.

[Danny Weiner]

He's like, it sucks being a lawyer.

[Guy Raz]

Yeah, it's a grind.

[Danny Weiner]

It's a grind.

[Guy Raz]

It's a grind. So this really is sort of. Now you're full on into this career, and eventually you get promoted and national sales manager, VP of sales. And while you're there, you meet another. I mean, you become friends with people. One of them would become critical in the future, which we'll get to. But this is a guy named Cole McRae. Tell me a little bit about Cole.

[Danny Weiner]

Cole is one of the most interesting guys I know because I met him right Before I went into the office. So at this point, we're both salesmen when I meet him. And he just, you know, we have similar senses of humor. Like, we like dark humor. We like saying, you know, stuff that other people won't say. So we kind of became friendly. And then when I became his boss, you know, he quickly became the top salesman. He was very, very good. And so he was like my. My main guy. But Cole is also. He does not mince words about stuff. So now just say, I'm in the office a couple years now, and I think I just got made VP of sales. And he, like, he'll come in the office, and I'm his boss. He goes. He walks in, he sees me sitting there. He goes like this. Well, somebody's getting fat. Like, I'm not getting fat. You know, I mean, maybe I put a few pounds. I'm at a desk for the first time. He goes, you're fat. 5:00. You're coming to the gym with me. Okay, I'm like, fine, I'll go to the gym with you. And then he and I started working out. Like, if he wasn't off traveling for a show, we worked out, you know, four or five nights a week, which eventually is where the idea during our workouts of starting our own company came.

[Guy Raz]

All right, we'll get there. But for now, you and Cole are kind of killing it. In the mid-90s, into the 2000s, you become VP of Sales. He's your top sales guy. But I guess around 2009, 10, business starts to shrink. The financial crisis has happened. I guess around that time, I read that you started to look at e commerce to help try to boost sales. E commerce was pretty new. E commerce was relatively new. It's just catching on by that point. Was the company even selling anything online?

[Danny Weiner]

Technically, yes, but not really. At this point in our area, in, say, the kitchenware space, your website and the ability to purchase online was looked at as just a tool to help you sell in person. You don't buy cookware that way. You know, it's kind of like people weren't quite yet. They were just beginning to buy clothes online that way.

[Guy Raz]

So did you ever go to your boss, the owner of the company, and say, hey, we should really. We should get onto these, like, platforms or Facebook, or we should really be doing, like, you know, let's go build a Facebook community and, you know, try to. Try to see if we. If that helps sales.

[Danny Weiner]

So that's exactly what happened. I got excited. One thing I'd noticed at this point was I'd read an article about the. About decline in cookbook sales, which would.

[Guy Raz]

Totally go the opposite way, like, few years later, because it would just skyrocket. But, yes, keep going.

[Danny Weiner]

Well. And, you know, why is this? Well, I'm like, well, there's a ton of great recipes online. People now, like, say people love cookbooks again, you know, and. But at this point, they're like, oh, wait a minute. I don't have to spend $30 to buy to get all these recipes that I don't really like and the 20 that I do like. So they're starting to digest content online. And I became very aware of this, and I'm seeing the Food Network exploding, and I'm like, this is a big deal, and we need to create a community here. And I went to the CEO of the company, and I had Facebook up, and I go, I want to tell you my idea. I go, I don't have it completely fleshed out yet, but I go, this is where we need to be. I pointed at the screen. I'm like, we got to create a community, and then we own the experience with our customer, and this is going to lead to sales. And he quite literally did hand to the face to me, and he goes, listen, kid, this Facebook thing, it's never gonna last. And that was the moment that was. I walked out, and I'm like, I gotta start my own company.

[Guy Raz]

I mean, to be fair, at that time, right, 2010, 11 wasn't uncommon for somebody, especially somebody from older, to feel that way, that this was just a fad, or this is just to post your books and your likes and music. You're listening to your vacation pictures, Right? Like, I think that because this is around the time when, like, Sheryl Sandberg just joins the company. So Facebook is about to transform into a massive advertising platform. But you feel like if they don't change, you might not have a job. Like, the company might not survive.

[Danny Weiner]

Exactly. Because let's face it, you know, people are terrified of change. Right? Because the future is scary. Often, you know, I was scared to say, let's pivot slightly and, you know, really embrace social media. But I. But when I look at it very analytically, I didn't see a downside.

[Guy Raz]

And eventually, the company, it doesn't not exist anymore, Right?

[Danny Weiner]

Yeah, it. They wound up fading out, but at that point, I was gone at that point. I think they locked the doors around sometime around 17 or so.

[Guy Raz]

All right. You and Cole had been talking about maybe doing something together one day. Like if you were to start a business, you were brainstorming ideas around things that you would use in the kitchen.

[Danny Weiner]

Yes, absolutely.

[Guy Raz]

And I guess you start to look for what that product could be. Right. You're still working for the, the cookware company. But how, how did you start to go search for this next thing that you wanted to do?

[Danny Weiner]

So as we, you know, played around with what this could look like, you know, it started at the gym. We talk about ideas now that he had got me back working out. We were both very, very health conscious at this point. And we, we had both become big juicing fans. You know, green juice and, you know, it was like becoming huge at that point. We were reading about like new advances and making cold pressed juice at home with a couple of Korean companies. But they hadn't really. Like the big juicer was like the Jack LaLanne juicer at the time.

[Guy Raz]

Right. And that's. And just for people who like, that's a juicer where you put the carrot in and it grinds it up and it basically is heating the fruits or vegetables. And so you lose some of the vitamin content. But cold press just slowly presses it down. And then the thinking is a juice retains the vitamin content because it's not heated. But generally you can't do that at home. You have to buy like you could buy cold pressed juices. And you were starting to see that there were home versions of this being created.

[Danny Weiner]

Yes. So, so we were doing our research and we thought this, the health benefits are huge. Like, we had seen, like Vitamix cornered the smoothie market, but quite frankly, still, like, smoothies are not as good as vegetable juice.

[Guy Raz]

You were looking for something cool to sell.

[Danny Weiner]

Yes.

[Guy Raz]

And eventually you found a juicer. We did that you liked.

[Danny Weiner]

And we thought we found the holy Grail. Because what was interesting, it was a cold pressed juicer. It had been invented in Korea. And what's great about it was it only had one part to clean. You popped out the center like it was like a giant screw and you just washed it all off. So it was like, wow, this is easy to clean. This is the Holy grail. So, you know, we were very excited about bringing that to market.

[Guy Raz]

And how much, how much were these going to retail for?

[Danny Weiner]

These were going to retail for about US$400.

[Guy Raz]

Got it. Okay. So you have this idea, you go back and you and Cole agree that this is what you're gonna do. And so I'm assuming you both at this point, leave the company to start your own company.

[Danny Weiner]

So by the time I think I left. It took all of 13 into 14 till we were ready to sell this product. So once the product was ready to be sold. That's right about when I left the company.

[Guy Raz]

Yeah. In terms of negotiating it, I mean, you had to make a deal presumably where you would be the exclusive distributor in the United States.

[Danny Weiner]

Exactly.

[Guy Raz]

And how much, I mean, did you have to have a lot of money up front to make this happen? I mean, because obviously you were making a good salary. Cole was probably making a good salary. But I mean, I can't imagine you had millions and millions of dollars to put down.

[Danny Weiner]

No. For this? Well, there were a couple things. One, there was a level of ignorance on our part about exactly everything we would need. But our goal at the time was to really do this slowly and judiciously. So, you know, spending the money, you know, we felt like we could do it carefully and we'd be able to self fund at that point and then kind of reinvest the profits. So it was pretty much ready to sell. Which, which was great.

[Guy Raz]

And, and what, what was it? Brand. What wasn't it called? What was it?

[Danny Weiner]

It was called Juice Presso.

[Guy Raz]

Juice Presso. Okay. Like. And, and, and so the idea was you were going to sell these. I mean, you had this idea of direct to consumer. Right. And was that what you were going to do here?

[Danny Weiner]

Well, it was because we also felt that direct consumer tied in quite nicely with demonstration sales. Because in a way, I can deliver this little demo to one of two ways. I can deliver it to you in person, or I can deliver it to you in 30, 60 seconds with a video on Facebook. And if it's good enough, you'll watch the whole video on Facebook.

[Guy Raz]

And that was your strategy? Let's just go in on Facebook with videos?

[Danny Weiner]

Yes. And it's also like, you know, very quickly we thought, also, this is great. Soon as you're on there, we want you to start sharing your recipes, we want you to start sharing your videos. Now, the thing is, you know, you hope you get the participation quickly because we don't have money. There were no paid influencers at this point either.

[Guy Raz]

Right. Did you guys see the juicer as sort of the first product that would become part of a larger constellation of products?

[Danny Weiner]

Yes, that was it. Like we thought. I never thought we were going to sell $100 million worth of juicers, but I thought, you know, if we could get a suite of products that are complementary in the kitchen space, maybe we have five, six, seven of them. And, you know, my goal was, can we can. We get each one to generate about 10 million in revenue. And if we can, we got a business.

[Guy Raz]

Yeah, sure. Where were you selling them, by the way? Mainly online.

[Danny Weiner]

So at that point we were selling some online, some at trade shows. We try to find like kind of health and wellness and gourmet shows, ones that kind of lend themselves to a higher price point. And we had started selling them with Costco in their roadshow program as well. What we were never Expecting was in 15 that Whole Foods makes an announcement that we're putting a juice bar in every Whole Foods. Fresh squeezed, cold pressed juice that, you know, all of a sudden creation and Jamba Juice. They're going to even make real juice, not just delicious sugar, you know, juice. You know, we were holding hope that people aren't going to pay 10 bucks for a juice. And this was, I've said it before, never underestimate the laziness of the American public, because we want it now, we want it easy. And there's a juice place in LA called the Beverly Hills Juice Club. And I think that's the one I was in where I saw a girl order a juice and she didn't have enough money on her credit card to put it all on one card, I think. And I'm like, wait a minute. That was quite an aha moment. She doesn't have $8 or $7, but she won't make it at home.

[Guy Raz]

So you, you see, I mean, you have this amazing year in 2015, but it's not, you start to feel like this is not going to be representative. This is just a blip.

[Danny Weiner]

You know, again, we were starting to see like the first half of 15 was going well, yeah, we were, we were cautiously optimistic, but then we were seeing a little bit of a plateau. And this is. As we're seeing more and more juice shops pop up, I'm like grudgingly becoming to grips with the fact that this may not have legs.

[Guy Raz]

I want to point something out here which I think is really cool, important and critical, which is you left your safe job as you were getting close to 50. I mean, you had a very good career, a good salary. I mean, you really started this business when you were like 49. And a lot of people think, oh God, that's late. I mean, in fact, it's not. But the other thing is that, and I've said this in the show, there's a lot of evidence to show that late sort of entrepreneurs who are older, not late, but older, have a much higher rate of success because they Come to the table with a lot of experience. But it is scary because the stakes are somewhat higher. Like if you fail at 49 or 50, it's just harder to recover than if you're 25.

[Danny Weiner]

You know, I'm so glad you brought that up because it really, it's very important because the fact is there's something about this country that is both amazing and challenging, which is we love an underdog story, we love a rags to riches story, but also there is this level in, in our country where we want to knock people down when they hit a level of success.

[Guy Raz]

And we celebrate the 25 year olds who fail. We pity the 50 year olds who fail.

[Danny Weiner]

Yeah.

[Guy Raz]

Were you, were you nervous about doing that in your 50s and your late 40s? I mean, was there any part of you like, God, this is, I'm nervous, this is scary.

[Danny Weiner]

There's a level of terror to it. Luckily, I think very often ignorance is bliss. Right. So what you don't know, you know, can't really hurt you, so to speak. So there were certain areas where I've said it a couple times, I was naive, especially starting with Juice Presso and maybe this overconfidence that because I was a good salesman and I really believed in the product, I could convince you that this was in your best interest to buy this. And we saw that business drop month by month by month. And the thing is, this is the hardest thing I've ever had to do in my life. And it was one of the smartest things because I had to look, I had to look very closely at this and go, this business is not salvageable. And my ego wanted to fix it. But the thing is, sometimes you got to pull the plug, right? And sometimes you need somebody else to tell you that. It's very hard looking in the mirror sometimes. You know, very often we're looking all over the place for the reason why we're not doing well and then we skip the mirror. In this place, I played a role, but I misjudged the market. That's what I did wrong. I don't think the way I brought the product to market, the way we tried to sell it, I think we did the right thing there. I misjudged the market and shame on me, you know, and we were in the juicer business like on a Tuesday night at 5pm and the next morning at 9am we were not in the juicer business anymore.

[Guy Raz]

When we come back in just a moment, how trying to avoid Chinese Premier Xi Jinping led Danny to start Hexclad Stay with us. I'm Guy Raz and you're listening to How I Built this. Maybe you've stayed at an Airbnb before and thought to yourself, this actually seems pretty doable. Maybe my place could be an Airbnb while you're away. Your home could be an Airbnb like the place I just stayed at in Palm Springs with an incredible kidney shaped pool and palm trees. It was just perfect. Maybe you're planning a trip for a long weekend while you're gone. You could Airbnb your home and make some extra money towards the trip. Whether you could use a little extra money to cover some bills or for something a little more fun, your home or spare room might be worth more than you think. Find out how [e-mail] host One of the hardest parts about B2B marketing is reaching the right audience. So when you want to reach the right professionals, use LinkedIn ads. LinkedIn has grown to a network of over 1 billion professionals, and that's where it stands apart from the other ad buys. You can target your buyers by job title, industry, company role, seniority, skills, company revenue, all the professionals you need to reach in one place. Stop wasting budget on the wrong audience and start targeting the right professionals only on LinkedIn ads. LinkedIn will even give you a $100 credit on your next campaign, so you can try it yourself. Just go to LinkedIn.com builtthis that's LinkedIn.com builtthis Terms and conditions apply. Only on LinkedIn ads ready to electrify your drive. Hyundai's cutting edge EV lineup is about to change everything you thought you knew about electric vehicles. Prepare to be captivated by a range that's as bold as it is brilliant. From the lightning fast Ioniq 5 and Ioniq 6 charging from 10 to 80% in a mere 18 minutes to the tech packed cabins boasting highway driving assist and blind spot collision warning, Hyundai EVs are redefining the electric experience. And with America's best warranty, including a 10 year, 100,000mile limited electric battery warranty, you'll drive with unmatched confidence. Hyundai's EVs aren't just the future, they're the now you've been waiting for. Learn more about Hyundai's [e-mail] call 562-314-4603 for complete details. America's Best Warranty Claim based on total package of warranty programs. See Dealer for limited warranty details. See your Hyundai dealer for further Details and limitations. Hey, welcome back to How I Built this. I'm Guy raz. So it's 2015, and even though Juice Presso made about $5 million, Danny and Cole know the business doesn't have legs. So they amp up their search for new products. And Danny even heads overseas to check out some Asian trade shows. And there in the basement at the Canton fair, Danny finds it. A new nonstick technology he believes he can turn into a cookware success, thanks in part to one very important man.

[Danny Weiner]

I think one time somebody asked me, well, who do you owe it all to? And I go, in a way, I owe it to Xi Jinping, because he showed up at the Canton fair this day to cut, like, the opening day ribbon or something. And I'd been at the preview day the night before, and I met somebody. I don't even remember what it was. He had some interesting product. And I said, okay, I'm going to meet you tomorrow at noon. And I go to show up, to walk into this hall, and there's just 30 Chinese soldiers there, and they've got their guns there, and they won't let me in. And apparently I'm being directed. I got to go down three flights of steps into the basement, walk all the way, and come back up on the other end. And I'm like. I'm looking at my watch, and I'm like, damn, Xi Jinping, you're making me late to my meeting. And so I head down into this basement area, and I think for anybody who's ever been to a trade show like this, they'll sell every last bit of real estate they can get somebody to set up a booth in. And I'm walking down there, and this is another one of the moments in my life where I'm like, I'm not on my phone. I'm not looking right. I'm looking left. And I look and I see this round plate, steel plate with hexagons all over it. And I go, that's interesting. So I walk over, and immediately, you know, they. Most of these booths, they hire, like, young college students because they can speak some English. And this girl comes up, she goes, oh, do you like that? That? You know, she's like, yes, we invented that. That's the line. Everybody says it could be 10 booths selling the same tea kettle. And they'll all be like, oh, we invented this. We invented. You know, they're all claiming ownership. And I'm like, okay, sure you did. I go, this is interesting. Have you. Have you ever made a frying pan with it. And they go, oh, yeah, we're experimenting with them right now. And I go inside their booth and they show me one pan. And I'm like, well, this would never sell in America. And a gentleman walks up and he spoke English. So we started talking. He was, yes, we're really developing, you know, the frying pans and that. And I go, oh, I used to be in the cookware business. And he goes, oh, we're like, well, so where do you sell in the US And I started saying, well, you know, we've sold all over. And then I get to. And I've also done a good amount of business with Costco. And his eyes lit up. He's at Costco. Oh, we would love to do business with Costco. So I kind of jumped on that. And I'm like, well, you know, I know them very well, but I go, I think I've seen this. I lied. I'm like, I've seen this all over the Canton Fair. He goes, no, no, this is ours. I go, no, come on, tell me the truth. And he goes, and he gets a book. And in the book he's just got page after page of global patents. And I'm like, did I actually run into the real deal? Like the guy who actually did invent this and has the patents to prove it? Because I've never seen anybody pull out a book with patents before.

[Guy Raz]

Yeah, and you. And oftentimes you go to these trade shows and there's like 40 of the same version of the same product. But this was. He's basically saying, no, no, I'm the inventor. This is our product. Can you, can you explain what it was about it that. That appealed to you right away? I mean, it's, it's a non stick pan with these like, hexagon shapes on the, you know, on the lining of the pan. Why did it, why was that intriguing to you? Why was that interesting to you?

[Danny Weiner]

Well, for a couple, a couple reasons, so to say. Essentially what they do is they laser etch these hexagons. So the nonstick is sitting in the removed portion of metal. So it, it sits slightly recessed. So one of the biggest problems with nonstick pans with people, you scratch them with a metal spatula and then they wind up peeling and flaking and they, they get into your food and they.

[Guy Raz]

They last three months.

[Danny Weiner]

Yeah, exactly. And also they don't, they don't sear very well. You know, essentially, to get a good sear on a stainless or on a nonstick pan, you have to overheat the pan, and you will destroy the pan to get a sear. So I'm like, wait a minute, you got this steel, which you can get a sear at a lower, medium heat. I'd been selling cookware for 15 years. At that point. I'm like, people complained about not getting a good sear. They complained about their nonstick peeling. And then they're like, oh, by the way, because of the design, it's also oven safe to at least 500 degrees.

[Guy Raz]

So just to be clear, I mean, most nonstick pans are and were aluminum pans.

[Danny Weiner]

The vast majority were, yes.

[Guy Raz]

There were some. I mean, I think scan pan was doing steel and a couple other.

[Danny Weiner]

All clad was doing it for a while, but the most part it was.

[Guy Raz]

Aluminum with a coating of, you know, that Teflon style coating. Yes, right. Which still. You can still get them versions of that. And this was different because it was ste. It was steel, which I. Which conducts heat better. Well, aluminum does too, but. But steel is preferred by, like, serious cooks. And then. And it had this nonstick element, but it was different. It wasn't like Teflon. It was these etched hexagons.

[Danny Weiner]

Yes.

[Guy Raz]

That. That covered the whole surface of the pan.

[Danny Weiner]

Yes.

[Guy Raz]

So you come across this brand. What's the guy's name, by the way?

[Danny Weiner]

His name is Mr. Lee.

[Guy Raz]

Okay. So you start to talk to him. And at that trade show, at that point, I can't imagine you were thinking, I want to sell these, or were you. Were you thinking, I got to lock this up?

[Danny Weiner]

I knew they had something special. It was not ready for the western market, but I was excited about it. So, you know, when I went back to my hotel room, I was alone and I called Cole, you know, and I'm like, this might be a winner. You know, we talked about it, and then essentially I went back the next day. We talked more. They're like, look, we're going to make some new samples a little bit deeper because they were too shallow. And I go, great. I go, I'll help you. I know what'll sell in America. So that was in the spring of 15. I wound up spending almost, I'd say, until around August 1st of 16. So we probably spent 16 months working on the pans together.

[Guy Raz]

Okay, I want a bunch of questions. So basically, once again, like with the Juice Presso, you've got to come up with a deal where you are going to be the exclusive distributor of this product, presumably for a country or territory, maybe more. But this was different because it wasn't just that you were going to distribute his products. You were actually, you wanted him to design, to use his technology to design cookware, to design pans, pots, other things that you wanted to help him build because you had experience in that. How does that work?

[Danny Weiner]

Well, I would say he was already working on cookware. He was thinking of the needs of the Korean market, which are slightly different than the needs of, say, the US market. So I was giving him feedback of what I would need to make that product successful in the US and really this in the beginning was a handshake agreement. You know, there was a lot of faith on both parts. And I know this is strange, but we trusted each other. Like, when I still see him, I'll fly over once a year at least to see the factory. And he and I just look at each other and we kind of laugh and hug because there was a lot of trust in it. He's like, I'm not going to sell to anybody else in America and you're going to trust that I'm going to make the product great and not cut you out. And for that first year, we both openly said we're taking chances on each other because they were very small. He just had this great idea and he had a factory to produce it. And I told him my plan and I said, you know, I want to be a direct to consumer cookware brand. I go, I want to sell online because I want to control the story. And by the way, this unique design needs its story told.

[Guy Raz]

How many people did you have working for you?

[Danny Weiner]

Was it just you and Cole at that point? We were so bootstrapped. We were, me and Cole and our assistant. As full time employees in the office.

[Guy Raz]

You were doing everything and then you'd outsource things like maybe some sales and bookkeeping.

[Danny Weiner]

So, yeah, so we used, yeah, we used, you know, we had a 3 PL handling stuff for us. We, you know, used outside, Outside bookkeeping. We had at that time, because we were still growing, the roadshow at Costco. So maybe we only had about 15.

[Guy Raz]

Employees there, but they were all on contract.

[Danny Weiner]

Yes.

[Guy Raz]

How did you pay for the initial orders of. I mean, by this point, the, the, the, the pans and the pots are starting to be made and manufactured in Korea. Where did you have the cash to even pay for those first orders?

[Danny Weiner]

So we'd gotten to the point that we were kind of, we were breaking even on the juicer, so maybe a tiny bit of profit there. In like, say, May ish June, we placed our first cookware order at the end of July, we kind of had it perfected. We made the cookware. We could only afford one 20 foot container at the point because we, Cole and I had to come up with the money out of, you know, our pockets. And we found a way. It was even. It was cheaper for us to send the cookware over unboxed, so we could fit more in a container and then box it in Cole's backyard.

[Guy Raz]

Roughly how much money did that cost you?

[Danny Weiner]

That first order wasn't that much because it was a small container. I think it was around $75,000 worth of product.

[Guy Raz]

And then once you sort of package and sell it probably would sell for at least twice that.

[Danny Weiner]

Yeah, probably more like three.

[Guy Raz]

Three times that.

[Danny Weiner]

Yeah.

[Guy Raz]

And by the way, did you have a name for it yet? I mean, they had a name for what they came up with, but you were going to brand it as something different, right?

[Danny Weiner]

So, yeah, we had to make the boxes. And Cole and I, it was 9:30 at night, and we had to trademark something the next day, 9am and we're like. Cole's like, what about Hex Clad? I'm like, no, I don't, I don't, I don't like it.

[Guy Raz]

Hexagon and clad. Like, you think like, there's all clad. There's other cookware that is clad. Yeah, clad. Yeah.

[Danny Weiner]

So Cole's like, coming, and I'm like, we can think of something better. And then finally, like an hour later, he's like, dude, come on, we got to come. All right, Hexclad. And people have always like, we love your name. You know, your. Your branding company that came up with it. They did great. Nah, Cole just came up with it at 9:30 and. And then we just, we had to go start making the boxes the next day. And. And in fact. And we've gotten compliments on our logo, the hexclad logo. We had no money to hire an artist or a company to design it. So I found a website that does these contests between artists all over the world.

[Guy Raz]

Yeah.

[Danny Weiner]

So I put it up there, like 299 bucks to make the Hexclad logo.

[Guy Raz]

All right, so you've got a logo, you've got this initial order, but if you want to go big, you need some serious money behind this to generate, to basically get some inventory produced. And so did you. I have to imagine you thought, well, let's go out and raise money. I mean, this is 2016. I mean, this is the height of the. I mean, there's a lot of money going to DTC companies at that point.

[Danny Weiner]

This was the start of it. So I went out, tried and raised.

[Guy Raz]

Money and mostly in LA or New York or both.

[Danny Weiner]

Mostly in LA and up north. And I may have had one meeting in New York and I got this. There were a couple things. Like one, they didn't get the pan. And I'm like, am I not explaining this technology properly? But they were like, okay, it's different. I go, yeah. I go, this is a, a new advance in a tired old business that hasn't known any innovation since Teflon came out. Essentially, it's.

[Guy Raz]

And it's scratch proof. It's nonstick scratch proof.

[Danny Weiner]

I want to say scratch resistant. If you dig in there with a knife, you can, you can scratch it. But if you're cooking normally, you grab a metal spatula, metal spoons, whisks, it's fine. And these, they're like, okay, that's good. But. And they go, okay, well listen, forget. Let's just say everybody loves your idea. How are you going to get shelf space? And I went, aha, I don't want shelf space. They're like, what? Yeah. I go, I don't need all clad shelf space at Bed Bath and Beyond. They're like, well, how then? I go, we're going to be the first direct to consumer cookware brand. We are going to take out the middleman. We're going to market to our customers and start a journey with that. And people were like, you cannot sell cookware that way. People don't buy their cookware that way. You know, they looked at me like I was out of my mind.

[Guy Raz]

So there wasn't a single investor you met with that was interested in a few people?

[Danny Weiner]

Mildly interested, but not really. And look, I didn't completely blame them. Part of me was like, you know, I'm like, I need to maybe do a better job of telling this story. But really what it is was consistently people were like, nobody's going to buy cookware this way. And it was, and it was. These were hard nos. They weren't like, let's go to committee. They were like hard nos. And so during, during 16 and 17, you know, we, I cashed out my 401k that I'd had, my retirement, my Roth, my. I took all the money out, paid penalties, everything I'd had saved up. I had 90% of my life savings by the, by the time we hit tied up in the company, we, we applied for credit cards and we were paying one credit card with another credit card. You know, we may have even exaggerated a couple things to get, get another credit card.

[Guy Raz]

How much money did the two of you have to put in?

[Danny Weiner]

I would say we were probably flirting with like around, between the two of us, like 800 grand, 900 grand that we had in.

[Guy Raz]

Yeah, you know, that's scary. I mean you're, because at this point, you know, you being 50 over 50, saving that amount of money, you know, you're, you're already thinking, okay, in 15 years I'm a retirement, I've got so to take four or five hundred thousand dollars of your whole life savings out, pay the penalties to put into this thing and then if you're wiped out, that's not going to be good.

[Danny Weiner]

Yeah, I'm probably going to be tending bar again or, you know, or selling until you're selling. Yeah. I'll tell you guy, it was, that was terrifying. And this is the part where I, you know, I want to encourage entrepreneurs orders. But I would wake up panicked at 4am in 16 and 17 because we now we're all in, you know, still with the juicer we'd started, you know, breaking even. At least we're not feeding the machine, so to speak. And I still had money in the bank, but now this took more money to develop and we were very good at stretching a dollar, but it was frightening.

[Guy Raz]

Why were you so confident in this product? I mean, it's a kind of a rhetorical question. But you went to all these VCs and they looked at it and what they're looking for is innovation, right? Like an AI wired, Internet connected pan or something that is very different. And to most of them they just saw a pan that was not, was a slight variation on Teflon. To them, right, you're saying, no, no, this is totally different, it's rev. But why, why did you, even after hearing all that pushback, why did you think that this was so special?

[Danny Weiner]

Well, you know, Cole and I had spent a good chunk of our adult life selling cookware. Yeah, we know that people buy it, people cook, people are cooking more. You know, I think I had mentioned now I'm also being validated by the explosion of Instagram chefs, of food content producers, you know, and I got questioned by my boss and by other people. Now I've been proven right on this and I was confident and I knew this, I knew that I could sell that. This was a great product. So we launched our website in November of 16 and I still have the email. We sold a 10 inch pan. Why this person bought it. We started, you know, running Facebook ads. And I wanted to understand what people were reacting to. So as we hit that end of 16 and beginning of 17, I think I even booked a trade, a gourmet show. And I went there with Hexclad and nobody knew it yet. And. And I remember it was like all day Friday. I didn't sell anything. And I'm like, I'm worried. And I had one of my. One of my best friends came with me at the time. He's like, I'll help you out. We'll do it. You know, he was a good salesman. And. And we hadn't sold anything. And it was 1:00 on Saturday. I'm like, oh God, maybe I am wrong. Well then one o'clock, I finally connected with somebody and they're like, I'm gonna get it. Okay, I'll take it. And then I kept demoing. I'm like one after another. And all of a sudden, cut to three hours of me not like just talking non stop. And we'd sold 18 of our frying pan sets. And also I was realizing what was resonating with people and what wasn't.

[Guy Raz]

What was working and what wasn't.

[Danny Weiner]

What I'd realized was I. I found I was not only just promoting the benefits, but I was apologizing for the things that weren't as good about it. Like, for example, if you take a Teflon pan out of a box, the Teflon pan will clean up easier. Now, our pan is going to clean up much better than an aluminum or a stainless steel pan, but it's only going to clean up about 85% as well as a Teflon pan. But the benefit is you don't have to worry about metal and all those other things. And once I honed in on all that stuff, then we started connecting and people started buying.

[Guy Raz]

So what. What about. I mean, because it was supposed to be direct to consumer. Were your Facebook ads. It doesn't sound like the Facebook ads were really moving product.

[Danny Weiner]

Well, we had no money, first of all, so we were only. We could. We were spending like a thousand bucks a month at 16. But also what this gave us an opportunity to do. As we did a couple of these shows, I was able to take my learnings and then tweak the Facebook ads a little bit.

[Guy Raz]

Right.

[Danny Weiner]

And then what happened was I decided to take a chance to reach out to my Costco connection.

[Guy Raz]

All right, so you decide. I mean, you had this in at Costco with a juice presto.

[Danny Weiner]

Yes.

[Guy Raz]

And you and Cole say, let's try this again. Let's try to bring these pans to Costco. So I think about a year after you get your first shipment in, you get a chance to do an in store demo in Costco. This is November of 2017. Is it in one Costco or is it going to be in multiple Costco's?

[Danny Weiner]

What they do is they give you one test store with a couple of backup test stores. I mean they have the option that if it's completely disastrous, they could pull the plug, I guess. But I think usually they're going to give you a few stores and so.

[Guy Raz]

Where did you, did you go yourself to demonstrate it?

[Danny Weiner]

I went there. I relied on one of my old reps from my old company who was looking for a new opportunity and we've been talking and he really liked the product and he's like, I'll do it for you.

[Guy Raz]

Wow. So really, if you get into Costco, it's not a guarantee that you're going to succeed. There are products that did try Costco and don't exist anymore.

[Danny Weiner]

Oh yeah.

[Guy Raz]

Because their margins are very slim. They require, I mean they demand a very low price and you gotta move product in order to make money there.

[Danny Weiner]

Yes. It's scary, but I also knew, I went back to me standing at the St. Louis Food and whatever gourmet show when we had done it months earlier and I just saw like, I knew what people did in demonstration with this. Like they, it resonated, they liked it.

[Guy Raz]

What kind of foods did you make? Just omelettes.

[Danny Weiner]

Yeah, like, oh, because they want to see an egg cook. And I think we did cheese, you know, and then we make a quesadilla for them, some sticky stuff and, and then talk about the deal and show about the value. Props like, you know, you make some dumb jokes like, ladies, this is husband proof cookware. You can use the metal spatula, whatever it might. But when we got that opportunity, Fountain Valley, I remember we sold in the neighborhood of $5,000 worth of product that first day in one store.

[Guy Raz]

And is that, I mean, that sounds like a lot to me. Is that a lot?

[Danny Weiner]

Sure. Yeah, that's a lot.

[Guy Raz]

I guess if you're doing 20 grand a month, doing five grand in a day is pretty awesome.

[Danny Weiner]

Yes. And in the road shows, your schedule, they're 10 day events. So I think when we finished we were flirting with around US$40,000 in that 10 day period.

[Guy Raz]

And what was the goal? What did you, what was the metric that you had to hit in order to prove it out?

[Danny Weiner]

I'M guessing we. We more than 3 xed what they were hoping for.

[Guy Raz]

Wow. All right, so you prove this out, and now you are going. And what does that mean? Does that mean they come back to you and say, okay, well, let's go national.

[Danny Weiner]

Well, immediately they're like, great numbers. And we already had store two and three scheduled, so that means those are going to go through in the couple days between the starting of stores two and three. They offer us two or three more stores, and we're like, yeah, let's do them. Well, now store two goes equally as well. And we're like, we cannot afford to have inventory sitting around. So now we're running into inventory problems. And we were still at this point, like, having product come in unpackaged because we couldn't afford. So we would literally line up boxes in Cole's backyard, and we'd run down a line and I'd be like, 12 inch pan, 12 inch pan, 12 inch Pan, 10 inch pan, 10 inch pan.

[Guy Raz]

Hand packaging.

[Danny Weiner]

Hand packaging them to save money. And then we'd be like, taping them closed. And we had. We had so many paper cuts on our fingers that there sometimes would be little blood spots on the, on the box. And we would have to take Windex and go back and clean the blood off the top of the box, and we would drive them to the Costco to sell. To sell them. Yeah, it was, it was. It was scary and exhilarating at the same time.

[Guy Raz]

When we come back in just a moment, how Danny and Cole turn this backyard business into a $500 million company in under 10 years. Stay with us. I'm Guy Raz, and you're listening to How I Built this. Here's a tip for growing your business. Get the Venture X business card from Capital One and start earning unlimited double miles on every purchase. That's right. With unlimited double miles, the more your business spends, the more miles you earn. Plus, the venturex business card has no preset spending limit, so your purchasing power can adapt to meet your business needs. The VentureX business card also includes access to over a thousand airport lounges. Just imagine where the VentureX business card from Capital One can take your business. Capital One, what's in your wallet? Terms and conditions apply. Find out [e-mail] venturexbusiness. Hey, welcome back to How I Built this. I'm Guy Raz. So 2017-2018 is a pivotal time for Danny and Cole. Costco puts hexclad into more and more stores. And sales grow, and the guys figure out how to make ads work for them on Facebook and really connect. Connect with customers.

[Danny Weiner]

So essentially, what was happening in. In the first half of 18 was we were, I would say, putting almost 100% of the money back into the company. There was no taking salaries. There was no, you know, there was none of that. I remember, like, finally the first time Cole and I took a paycheck in July of 18, and we were each able to take, I think, $10,000. And that was like, we were like 10,000 bucks. We made it.

[Guy Raz]

So. All right, so 2019, the direct to consumer side of the business really takes off. And do you remember roughly what you got? I mean, 10 million in sales in 2018. Do you remember what you guys did in 2019?

[Danny Weiner]

We almost doubled that. So we were up in the 1819 range and. Yeah, and by the way.

[Guy Raz]

And profitable.

[Danny Weiner]

And profitable. So really we were profitable by the middle of 18.

[Guy Raz]

But you still had to be somewhat nervous because you had seen with the juice press, awesome sales, and then the whole thing just fall apart.

[Danny Weiner]

Yes. I mean, you're always going to be a little nervous. And I guess if you're not nervous, you're not doing your job properly. Right. You should always be concerned because of.

[Guy Raz]

Course, then you hit 2020, which is the COVID year, and now all of a sudden, all eyes turn to really, to computers and phones. Everyone's stuck inside. And a lot of direct to consumer businesses, Peloton and others just went crazy. And did it also have that same effect on. On sales for you guys? Were people just ordering cookware because they were stuck at home now?

[Danny Weiner]

Well, well, there were a couple of things. And what was interesting about that was as. As we're selling right along with the production capacity of our factory. Costco shut down the Costco roadshow.

[Guy Raz]

Right.

[Danny Weiner]

Because of the pandemic in March, they became groceries only. And if it wasn't groceries, they weren't selling it. So now we had all this additional product that we'd paid for. So essentially now you were expecting to sell X, not X plus y. But Cole and I, you know, now we're heading into April 1st. We're like, we don't know quite yet that people how long they're going to be locked up and how long they're going to be shopping. We're still doing pretty well online. This is before nobody, no one was talking about a payroll protection plan yet. This was just. That was a couple months away. And then we also went, well, we got all this cookware. How much money do we have in the Bank. And I remember we had a million bucks, and we just looked at each other and we're like, let's blow the whole million on advertising on meta. And we spent a million bucks in April, and I think in February, we were doing a million a month online, and we sold $5 million in April online.

[Guy Raz]

Wow.

[Danny Weiner]

And we're like, wow. So we go, eh, I will probably be able to start taking a salary again in May.

[Guy Raz]

Yeah. I guess that summer, summer of 2020, somebody on your team, because you'd staffed up, I mean, you had to staff up. Right. And you had somebody who noticed that Gordon Ramsay had been following you guys on Instagram.

[Danny Weiner]

Yes.

[Guy Raz]

And so obviously, you reached out to him, probably the most famous chef on the planet, I guess, initially, to give him pans, right?

[Danny Weiner]

Yeah.

[Guy Raz]

To send him some gifts.

[Danny Weiner]

You know, it's been such a strange journey. And even that's like, one of them, you know? I mean, Gordon Ramsay is the biggest chef on the planet, and they know him everywhere. And when. To see that he was following us on Instagram was like, wow. And I. You know, what I learned later was somebody gifted him a pan, I think, during the pandemic. And he was home like everybody else. He's cooking every day for his kids. And so we did reach out, and we're like, can we send you some more pans? And whoever answered on his team said, sure. And then we also just said, does you know Gordon involved with the cookware company? And they were like, I don't think so. And that led to her like, well, we'd love to talk. And I don't know. A few days later, I was on a call with Gordon's business manager, and, you know, we're discussing, you know, what could this look like? I mean, it's a bit surreal.

[Guy Raz]

And initially they were thinking, okay, maybe a commercial. Right. That you wanted him do a commercial.

[Danny Weiner]

He threw out the options. He's like, you know, Gordon, like, if he likes your product, you know, he do a commercial. It's expensive. But he also probably, like, a million bucks, I would guess, at least, you know. Yeah. He never gave me an exact number, but I knew it was a lot. And then, you know, and it's short term unless you keep buying it. But then he said, but Gordon likes your product. You know, he. Gordon's, by the way, a very, very shrewd businessman. And he's like, he likes your product, and I think he'd love to participate. And I'm like, well, let's see what that looks like.

[Guy Raz]

And the idea would be, hey, maybe he actually becomes an owner. Part owner.

[Danny Weiner]

Yeah, that's what we were, that's what we were looking at. I mean, really we wanted to say, like, were we a good fit? What are our goals? How do they fit ethically together in a way, that's one thing I think that Gordon and I have in common. We're both very hardworking. We don't want to half ass anything. My product is a great product. It's well made, it performs well, and I won't sell something that way. And Gordon's the same way. And we kind of saw that in each other. And Gordon's very enthusiastic and he's got great ideas, like ways you can market stuff. And so we got on this call and I was intimidating. You know, I just go on the screen, it's like, we're on right now, but there's the biggest chef in the world on the other side. And we start talking, and I had 20 minutes scheduled for the call, and Gordon and I talked for an hour and 20 minutes and we just talked about everything we could do. And, and I think when we got off the call, everybody involved was like, yeah, this makes sense.

[Guy Raz]

You know, then you just had to get it, get the lawyers to hash out what it actually would mean. And, and so you, of course we know. I mean, people who know Hexclad know you made a, you came to an agreement with him. And, and what did that mean? I mean, it meant that he would post on social media, you would, you would film videos of him using it. What, what was it going to mean to have him as a brand ambassador and an equity holder?

[Danny Weiner]

You know, we had put faith in our relationship with Mr. Lee early on. With your hopes that there's a follow through with everything. Yes, there's a contract that has X, Y and Z deliverables. If, if that was the way we approach this relationship, I would say I don't even know if we would still have a relationship with Gordon because it's been like a, a very fluid type of relationship. Like, yes, we're gonna do a certain amount of content every year and Gordon's gonna collab on some posts with us. And, you know, and he's like, I want to use the cookware in a lot of my restaurants. And that was all good, but what he didn't need to do, and it's not in any contract, was, I'm gonna put it on all my TV shows. So, you know, we started doing that and like, they called me and he's like, you know, I know we've been talking about doing something in Canada. He goes, I'm going to be in Vancouver at the end of February. Why don't we do an event? He didn't have to just offer that. It's like he does stuff like he's always thinking, like, what can we do to take this to the next level? And the next level. And the next level.

[Guy Raz]

Yeah, I mean, he is a very good. I mean, he's probably easily the best, the best sort of food entrepreneur on the planet. I mean, in part, he's a great chef. He's got a Michelin three star restaurant, but he's also a personality that's managed to become so much bigger than his restaurants. And, you know, I imagine that, I mean, having him again, you know, it actually reminds me a lot of a story we did on the show a year or two ago about Andrew Shoes, a brand that was founded by, you know, three Swiss guys, not very well known. They scaled it on their own. They, they turned it into a real powerhouse. And then Roger Federer became really interested in, in doing something with him. He's Swiss. They were Swiss. And it, you know, and Roger Federer's involvement helped take on to the next level. You know, all of a sudden it wasn't just a really popular shoe brand. It's like, now we're one of the most popular running brands on the planet. And it was started in 2012. So there's a lot of parallels there. Right. Like, you guys got it to a pretty great point.

[Danny Weiner]

Yeah.

[Guy Raz]

But then Gordon Ramsay is interested and he can help you really supercharge it.

[Danny Weiner]

Exactly. I mean, I think we would have continued to scale. And he'll sometimes, you know, poke fun with me when we talk. He'll be like, oh, you know, thank God you got me. And, you know, and I'll joke, I'm like, thank God you got me too. And, and we're a good team. But yes, like, look, Gordon, Gordon brings you eyeballs. And that's what this business is about. Right. You want eyeballs. Because if you have a good product and you get the consumer's attention, when they're ready to purchase, they're going to consider you. So Gordon gets a lot of people to consider our product. Maybe that didn't stop know about us.

[Guy Raz]

I mean, in that first full year that he was a partner, I read that your revenue is $170 million. And there's no question that that was a huge help.

[Danny Weiner]

Absolutely. Absolutely. You know, it was huge. I, you know, maybe we, we had, we scale that Year maybe we do get it. We do 100% again and we go to around 100. I, you know, it's always hard to guess, but I know this. When you get somebody like Gordon who's passionate, you know, you add that all together, it's just a recipe for, for growth.

[Guy Raz]

Yeah. No question about it.

[Danny Weiner]

Yeah.

[Guy Raz]

But I mean, this is now expanded into like, if you go to the Hexclad website, you know his signatures on there. And it's not just pans and pots. I mean, it's like you guys are doing knives and you're doing cutting boards and aprons and other tools. I mean, there is like a, this is like a bunch of different things that you are now you've really expanded out into a bunch of different places.

[Danny Weiner]

So, like, we do want to kind of own the kitchen. And that was when, like when I met with Gordon, I talked about this. Like, I, this is what I want. I go, I want to innovate in every kitchen category. So when we can innovate, bring something new, a better mousetrap, we're going to do it. If we can't totally innovate. I want to make something that's of the finest quality, that just looks sexy as hell.

[Guy Raz]

It's amazing because in a. I mean, of course it was a long. I'm sure it's felt like a very long journey, but right. 2017 to 2025 and you probably, you might hit 700, 800 million this year. Who knows how many people now work for Hexclad? How many employees do you have around the world?

[Danny Weiner]

We have in the neighborhood of. And by the. I should know the exact number, but we are hiring pretty regularly still globally, I'd say we're around 235, 240.

[Guy Raz]

So pretty efficient for the amount of revenue you're bringing in. And, and everything is still made in Korea or have they had to build second factories in other Asian countries?

[Danny Weiner]

So we make different things in different places, like I told you. Like our steel is manufactured in Japan for that. The cookware, most of the cookware is made in China actually. Our wood products are made in Slovenia. Our eco friendly aprons here in la. So we, so we do have a lot of global locations where we do manufacture and we're looking to expand that and diversify further in the next year or two.

[Guy Raz]

So Danny, here you are, 60 years old, 59 still.

[Danny Weiner]

I'm clicking 59.

[Guy Raz]

Okay. But this is your 60th. No, I mean, I think this, you should be immensely proud. You know, you're hitting your 60th year and you start a business at 50, you know, that's a big risk. And it was a while before you saw any money. And now you are, you know, a majority owner here. You have no investor still. I mean, Gordon Ramsay's an equity holder and. But no outside investor still.

[Danny Weiner]

We got one outside investor last year we did release that.

[Guy Raz]

Oh, that's right, Right, right. Gordon Ramsey's Fox.

[Danny Weiner]

Fox partnership of Fox and Studio Ramsey Global.

[Guy Raz]

They put in 100 million. Yeah, no, I mean, it's. It really is an amazing gamble slash sacrifice to make, and then to see it pay off is. I mean, it just must be an incredibly fulfilling feeling, you know, just this, like, gratifying. That's the word I was looking for. To be able to sit there and be like, we did this. We made it.

[Danny Weiner]

This worked. You know, it is. And I. And I hope, like, you know, I hope people, if they get one thing. And I love that you brought up my age multiple times because we are taught, like, you know, you know, there is a fear if you're gambling your. Your livelihood. You got a. A husband or a wife and you got kids. You got, like, I didn't have that, so it was easier. So, you know, I'm not as brave. Right. I was only screwing over my. Myself if. If. If I failed. Really? Yeah.

[Guy Raz]

It's still something.

[Danny Weiner]

It absolutely is. And it is. It is terrifying. But I think that if you see a hole in the marketplace, if you think you have a better mousetrap, don't go to the roulette table, but, you know, kind of. But take measured risks on yourself and on the fact that you have something that the market wants, because that's how great stuff happens. That's how we get innovation. And I applaud it, even for people that failed with it. I mean, you know, failure's been one of the best things to ever happen to me. If Juice Presso hadn't failed, hexcloud would not be as successful.

[Guy Raz]

When you think about the journey you took, you know, and where. Where you are now, how much of where you got to do you attribute to the. To the grind and the work you put in? And how much do you attribute to. To luck and timing? You know, just people just watching social media and getting into cooking and. I don't know. What. What do you. What do you think?

[Danny Weiner]

I mean, that look. That's a really good question. Is there luck involved? There is chance. Whatever we want to call it. Luck. Chance. Did a pandemic help? Yes. Do I think we were already wildly successful. Yes, we were. You know, there's stuff I can control. I can't control a pandemic, right? I can't control, you know, a boom or a recession. I can control my work ethic, you know, that I can control. I can control me knowing that I have turned over every rock to make sure this is the best product that I've looked at, every marketing plan, to know that this is one that's going to bring us a set level of revenue next year. I can control that. And it's kind of like, you know, being kind of out in rough seas, you know, I can man the tiller, right? I can stay there and I can forego sleep. I can't control which wave is coming when. If I'm controlling the tiller, I have the best chance of us getting to our place successfully. And so I think that's what I try to do in my life and in my business is be the best guy at the helm to be able to control any storm that happens. Because it's going to come, right? It's just a matter of time.

[Guy Raz]

Danny.

[Danny Weiner]

Thanks, Guy. Thank you. This is fun.

[Guy Raz]

That's Danny Weiner, CEO and co founder of hexclad Cookware, by the way. During his time trying to break into Hollywood, Danny landed a few background parts in commercials. But his potential big break, he got a role in a film called Rising sun, starring Sean Connery and Wesley Snipes.

[Danny Weiner]

It wasn't even a bit part. It was like I was a cop. Two, like a couple cops show up and you can't even see me in it, which was so disappointing because originally I had a line and it was showing. I don't know. It's like one of these. Like, just the facts, please. Even though I did get to meet Sean Connery.

[Guy Raz]

Thanks so much for listening to the show this week. Please make sure to click the follow button on your podcast app so you never miss a new episode of the show. And if you're interested in insights, ideas and lessons from some of the world's greatest entrepreneurs, please sign up for my [e-mail] or on substack. This episode. This episode was produced by Kerry Thompson with music composed by Ramtin Arablouei. It was edited by Andrea Bruce with research help from Kathryn Cipher. Our engineers were Gilly Moon and Jimmy Keeley. Our production staff also includes Alex Chung, J.C. howard, Chris Masini, Sam Paulson, John Isabella, Iman Ma'ani, and Elaine Coates. I'm Guy Raz, and you've been listening to How I Built this. If you like How I Built this, you can listen early and ad free right now by joining Wondery plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Prime members can listen ad free on Amazon Music. Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short [e-mail] survey.