3 More Questions (Sanjit Biswas) with David Novak and Koula Callahan

Summary

Podcast Summary: “3 More Questions (Sanjit Biswas)”

Podcast: How Leaders Lead with David Novak
Host: David Novak, with Koula Callahan
Date: June 23, 2025
Guest Referenced: Sanjit Biswas, Co-founder & CEO of Samsara

---

Overview

In this episode of “How Leaders Lead,” David Novak and Koula Callahan present the “3 More Questions” segment, reflecting on the main lessons from David’s interview with Sanjit Biswas. Sanjit, a serial entrepreneur, successfully built two billion-dollar businesses, and his approach to leadership—in particular, his unique blend of engineering mindset, focus on discipline, and relentless customer orientation—serves as the basis for this discussion. David and Koula explore how leaders can foster innovation, embed discipline into teams, and create a culture deeply attuned to customer needs.

---

Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Curiosity and the Power of Boredom

(Timestamps: 01:28–03:37)

• Sanjit advocates for intentionally taking time to “get bored” as a catalyst for curiosity and innovation.
• David’s Perspective:
  • David highlights the importance of being an “active learner,” always waking up with a mindset of discovery and making connections (pattern thinking).
  • Memorable Analogy: “Basically have the mind of a child… they go into a new environment, they go in fresh because they haven’t lived it yet.” (David Novak, 02:42)
• Koula’s Reference:
  • She cites Juliet Funt’s White Space at Work to reinforce the view that time for reflection doesn’t just happen—it must be purposefully blocked out.
• Leadership Takeaway:
  • Making space for personal reflection fuels creativity, allowing leaders and teams to approach challenges with fresh perspectives.

---

2. Organizational Discipline and Culture

(Timestamps: 03:54–06:34)

• Sanjit attributes Samsara's long-term sustainability to discipline across all business functions.
• David’s Perspective:
  • He draws parallels between high-performing sports teams and “dynasty companies,” emphasizing routine, process, and consistent execution.
  • Anecdote: At Yum! Brands, tracking and refilling the new product pipeline was a disciplined, systematic process:

    “If we saw that we were getting a little bit dry, I guarantee you things heated up and we started developing more new products and getting more new products in the test…” (David Novak, 05:23)

• Shared Code:
  • Koula notes that for Sanjit, discipline isn’t just a top-down edict—it’s woven into a “shared code,” much like David’s “how we work together” principles.
  • Culture is actively reinforced via communication, recognition, and daily operational methods.

---

3. Customer Obsession: “Big Eyes and Big Ears”

(Timestamps: 06:34–08:47)

• Key Concept:
  • Sanjit encourages his team to approach customer interactions with “big eyes and big ears,” meaning they both observe (eyes) and listen (ears) deeply.
• David’s Reaction:
  • David is so taken with the phrase that he jokes about adopting it as his own mantra:

    “If there’s one thing that everybody should take from this podcast, in my opinion, is that. Yeah, because it’s such a simple way to think about what you have to do as a leader. Big eyes and big ears. That’s powerful.” (David Novak, 07:51)

  • Being present with customers—seeing their reality and listening to their feedback—enables proactive problem-solving and builds loyalty.
• Koula’s Visualization:
  • She finds the mental image of a “cartoon character with gigantic eyes and gigantic ears” helps her focus on being truly observant and attentive in her own customer meetings.

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Curiosity:
  • “Basically have the mind of a child… they go in fresh because they haven’t lived it yet.” —David Novak (02:42)
• On Discipline:
  • “Dynasty performing companies...they have process and discipline around what really matters.” —David Novak (04:20)
• On Culture:
  • “He’s got process and discipline around the culture. The culture doesn’t happen by accident.” —David Novak (06:12)
• On Customer Focus:
  • “Big eyes and big ears. If there’s one thing that everybody should take from this podcast… that’s powerful.” —David Novak (07:51)
• On Visualization:
  • “I had this vision in my mind of this little cartoon character with gigantic eyes and gigantic ears, and I just love that visual.” —Koula Callahan (08:36)

---

Important Timestamps

• 01:28 — Sanjit’s approach to making space for curiosity and innovation
• 03:54 — Discipline as the foundation for sustainable high performance
• 05:23 — David’s analogy of tracking the product pipeline at Yum! Brands
• 06:34 — Discussion of “big eyes and big ears” customer philosophy
• 08:36 — Koula’s visualization of the customer-focus mantra

---

Flow & Tone

Throughout the episode, David and Koula balance admiration for Sanjit’s technical and entrepreneurial prowess with actionable advice for listeners. The tone is energetic, friendly, and reflective, with practical wisdom and light-hearted banter that bring the leadership lessons to life.

---

This summary provides a comprehensive breakdown of the episode’s leadership insights, memorable moments, and practical takeaways—ideal for leaders seeking inspiration from innovative business minds like Sanjit Biswas.

Transcript

[David Novak]

Foreign.

[Kula Callahan]

Welcome to How Leaders Lead. I'm Kula Callahan here with David Novak to bring you another edition of Three More Questions. David, the guy that we're talking about today has built not one, but $2 billion businesses from the ground up. It's Sanjit Biswas, the co founder and CEO of Samsara. And, David, I know you love this conversation.

[David Novak]

Oh, absolutely. I think he's an amazing leader. But before we get into it, I have to tell everybody that you're recording live from Brooklyn, New York. You know, you're getting out of that Nashville zone and into the New York area. I hope you're having a great summer vacation. Cool.

[Kula Callahan]

Well, I'm not on vacation. David. Come on.

[David Novak]

We're out here in Brooklyn. Yeah, I know. I know. You're. You're working virtually. Good for you. I'm proud of you. Okay, so anyway, you know, yeah, I love the conversation with Sanjit. He's an amazing leader. He's built $2 billion businesses, as you said. You know, I think for anyone that wants to get insights on how leaders lead in entrepreneurial environments and how they start things up from scratch and scale it, this is a great podcast. And, you know, I walked away with a great amount of respect for Sanjeet and how he leads after having our conversation.

[Kula Callahan]

Well, he's brilliant, and there's just, you know, he's an engineer by trade, but the way that he simplifies these complex ideas so that everybody can understand him and so that he can lead really well, it's just so impressive.

[David Novak]

And one thing I would say about Sanjeet that's very interesting, he's definitely an engineer. Now, engineers are not typically seen as salespeople. Okay, well, let me tell you something. This guy's a salesperson. He's customer focused. He understands his customers, and I think that's the reason why he's been so successful.

[Kula Callahan]

Absolutely. Great segue into our first question. Let's go. Question number one. Sanjay talks about how important it is to take time to get bored and let your curiosity lead you to new ideas and innovation. David, how do you make space for new ideas?

[David Novak]

Well, I wrote a book about it. It is called How Leaders Learn, and it's about being an active learner. And, you know, I think it's basically waking up each day knowing that you don't know everything and there's so much to learn. And not just learn, but do something with it. That's why you become an active learner. So, you know, I think curiosity is a trait that every outstanding leader has, you know, you're just curious about everything that goes on in your business, in the world. And then what you do is you do pattern thinking, and you say, okay, if this is happening over here, how do we do that? You know, in my business? And the one thing that I think is a great thing about curiosity is basically have the mind of a child. And I think that's what Sanjeev's talking about here. Get bored. You know, kids get bored, but, you know, they walk into a store, they go into a new environment, they go in fresh because they haven't lived it yet. And, you know, I think having a fresh perspective, that kid's mindset, I think, is one way how I try to keep learning.

[Kula Callahan]

Another important thing that he talks about is actually carving out time to just let yourself do that. It reminds me of a book called White Space at Work that Juliet Funt wrote. She says that if you don't carve out the space to let yourself get bored and to let your curiosity take over and see things with a fresh perspective, it just doesn't happen. And so I really admire the way that he, you know, he's so in his business and in the weeds and in the tech and engineering of it all, and yet he still carves out time to let himself get bored so that he can have that fresh perspective.

[David Novak]

Yeah, he understands the power of personal reflection and taking the time to think about your business and actually having the power of looking in the mirror not only with your own leadership, but where your business is, and then identifying potentially new ways to go.

[Kula Callahan]

Question number two, something Sanjit pushes on his team, is discipline. And he says that that sense of discipline across all the functions in the business creates more sustainability for them long term. David, how should leaders think about discipline and pushing that part of their culture?

[David Novak]

Well, when I've looked at dynasty performing companies, companies that get consistent results year in and year out, one of the characteristics that they have, Kula, is that they have process and discipline around what really matters. They understand what is absolutely critical done in their business, and then they put process around it to make sure that it's done, and then they have the discipline to make sure that they execute that process. I think if you think about anybody that's a high performer, whether it's in sports or in business, they're very disciplined around doing the things that are going to make them successful. You know, if you're going to be a golfer, you. You've got to have a great short game. I mean, you got to be able to putt so they spend time, you know, more time, you know, putting and working on their short game around the greens. Then they even do their long game because they know that's where the money's really going to be made. And so I think that you can look at it from a sports perspective that way or you can then look at the business. You know, for example, one of the things that I knew we had to have was we had to have a full pipeline of new products for each year if we were going to be successful. So we tracked our product pipeline like you couldn't believe. I mean, if we saw that we were getting a little bit dry, I guarantee you things heated up and we started developing more new products and getting more new products in the test because we knew that if we didn't have new ways to excite our customers, we were going to be dead in the water. So we put discipline around it. And I think that discipline is critical to driving high performance.

[Kula Callahan]

Another concept that Sanjit talks about in the episode is this shared code. And it's really, you know, David, what you call your how we work together principles, but it's the shared code of what they do to make their culture what it is and to create sustainability long term. And so this sense of discipline is not just something that he preaches from the top. It's something that every individual, team and person in the company functions within. And like you said, I think that obviously it's what's made them wildly successful and allowed them to keep growing year over year.

[David Novak]

Yeah, and he's got process and discipline around the culture. The culture doesn't happen by accident. He has many, many vehicles that they use to really communicate to their people what the culture is and then drive home, you know, how important is it that they executed through the way, how they pay their people, recognize their people, and basically just do business day to day.

[Kula Callahan]

Question number three. Sanjit and his team have a concept when they're meeting with customers. And the concept is this big eyes and big ears. And I just love that, David. And I know that you really loved it in your conversation. What can other leaders learn from this approach to interacting with customers?

[David Novak]

Well, I have to tell you that I love this phrase, big eyes and big ears. In fact, I didn't really hear it from Sanjeet. It's going to be my phrase from now on, you know, because I think he should have big eyes and big ears. And what I love about it is that you need to have big eyes. When you are going into a restaurant, for example, you need to have big eyes and see everything that's going on and happening for your customers. And he would do that as he'd go into manufacturing plants. He'd look around with big eyes and see potential problems, areas that they could do work on that would help their customers get even more effective and more efficient. So I love the idea of having big eyes and then having big ears. You know, unfortunately, I have big ears anyway, but I'm talking about really big ears. And in terms of being able to listen, and you know, what he's really saying here is when you're dealing with your customers, you got to listen so that you can respond to the voice of your customers. But if you don't listen first, you're never going to be able to respond in an effective fashion. So I love this. Big eyes and big ears. If there's one thing that everybody should take from this podcast, in my opinion, is that. Yeah, because it's such a simple way to think about what you have to do as a leader. Big eyes and big ears. That's powerful.

[Kula Callahan]

It's really powerful. And I love that it's both of those things. A lot of time when you're meeting with customers or even with your team, some of the times, what they say is not always the reality of what's happening. So you got to have both, right? You're listening to their feedback, of course, and then you're also just observing what are they doing that could be done more efficiently? What are customers doing that they're running into? That's a problem that we can solve for them. So I just love it. And I had this vision in my mind and of this little cartoon character with gigantic eyes and gigantic ears, and I just love that visual. And next time I go talk to one of our customers, I'm going to have that visual in my mind so I can just stay really focused on having big eyes and big ears.

[David Novak]

Oh, there you go. You just created a new character. You got a new character. I would trademark that idea immediately and not give Sanjit any credit.

[Kula Callahan]

Well, that does it, David. For our edition of three more questions for today, thank you so much for tuning in to how leaders lead. We're on a mission to make the world a better place by developing better leaders. And if you carve out a little time with us each and every week, we'll help you build the confidence you need to lead. Well.

[David Novak]

And coming up next on how leaders lead is my conversation with Bob Jordan, the CEO of Southwest Airlines. Sam.