Podcast Summary: "How to make (and keep) friends"
From: A Slight Change of Plans (featured on How To Be A Better Human by TED)
Host: Dr. Maya Shankar (with special guest Dr. Marisa Franco)
Date: February 16, 2026
Overview
This episode is a deep dive into the science and art of adult friendship. Dr. Maya Shankar explores with psychologist Dr. Marisa Franco—author of Platonic: How the Science of Attachment Can Help You Make—and Keep—Friends—why friendship is often undervalued in our lives, how it profoundly shapes our identity and wellbeing, and evidence-based strategies to make, grow, and maintain friendships as adults.
Key Discussion Points & Insights
Why Friendship Is Undervalued
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Friendship’s Place in Our Lives:
Society often puts romantic and familial relationships above friendship, influencing many to deprioritize platonic connections.
“Not prioritizing our friendships can harm our health and our well-being.” — Host, [01:37] -
Personal Reassessment of Relationship Hierarchies:
Dr. Franco describes realizing, after a breakup, the importance and depth of her platonic relationships.
“Here I was thinking I didn’t have love in my life when I had evidence of just how loved I was every week.” — Dr. Franco, [04:55]
The Transformative Power of Friendship
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Friendship Expands Identity:
Each friend broadens our sense of possibility, identity, and experiences.
“Each person that we interact with is an advertisement for the kaleidoscope of ways in which we can live.” — Dr. Franco, [07:51] -
Community Makes Us More Fully Ourselves:
Freud: Experiencing different emotions with different friends enriches our lives.
“I would hang out with my friends and feel like I’m just filling with life.” — Dr. Franco, [07:51]
The Science of Friendship and Health
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Broad Support Networks Build Resilience:
Diverse friendships help both mental and physical health; having multiple support sources is protective (e.g., even making you less likely to catch a cold!).
“People…were less likely to actually contract the common cold when they had a diversity of support.” — Dr. Franco, [09:53] -
Friendship Strengthens Romantic Relationships:
Spending time with friends doesn’t take away from romantic partnerships—it can improve both partners’ mental health and acts as a buffer during relational conflict.
“If I make a friend, not only am I less depressed, but my romantic partner is also likely to be less depressed.” — Dr. Franco, [10:41]
Making Friends as an Adult
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The Myth of Organic Friendship Formation:
In adulthood, friendship doesn’t ‘just happen’—intentionality is crucial.
“People that thought friendship happened without effort were more lonely over time.” — Dr. Franco, [11:51] -
The ‘Mere Exposure Effect’:
Repeated exposure increases mutual liking—regularly sharing space (work, hobbies, places of worship) matters.
“The more that we become familiar… we like them more, they like us more.” — Dr. Franco, [13:16] -
Overcoming Fear of Rejection:
People generally underestimate how much others like them—a concept known as the “liking gap.”
“People like you more than you think they do.” — Dr. Franco, [14:12]
If you believe you’re likable, you act more openly—creating a self-fulfilling prophecy.
Maintaining and Deepening Friendships
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Risk Regulation & Investment:
The more you signal to a friend that you value them, the more invested they’ll likely become.
“Showing affection towards friends, being generous... is going to deepen the friendship.” — Dr. Franco, [20:55] -
Mutuality Over Reciprocity:
True friendship isn’t tit-for-tat. It’s about understanding and meeting needs based on context, not “keeping score.”
“A relationship is never going to be 50/50... There’s gonna be a period when you’re giving more…” — Dr. Franco, [22:36] -
Navigating Life Transitions:
Open communication is vital when friends’ lives diverge (e.g., becoming a parent).
“It’s the set of assumptions that tends to pull us apart. Whereas when we can actually have the conversation…” — Dr. Franco, [23:26]
“Friendship can ebb and flow… If we have an ebb, let’s not assume the friendship is over.” — Dr. Franco, [25:45]
Handling Conflict in Friendship
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Conflict Is Part of Intimacy:
Avoiding or suppressing issues leads to withdrawal, not resolution.
“Being a good friend means me getting over it… and then realizing, oh, I’m actually just withdrawing.” — Dr. Franco, [27:48] -
Ambivalence and Repair:
Healthy friendships can weather and repair ruptures, leading to greater intimacy.
“Not realizing that part of intimacy is conflict. And so friendship is also going to require the same set of skills.” — Dr. Franco, [27:48] -
How to Approach Hard Conversations:
Frame them as acts of love, use “I” statements, take perspective, and ask for future needs.
“Frame the conversation as an act of love: ‘Hey, I want to talk about this because you’re so important to me…’” — Dr. Franco, [29:18]
Friendship Breakups and Grieving
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Ghosting and Ambiguous Loss:
If a friend is still invested, choose a closure conversation over fading away; otherwise, you risk inflicting “ambiguous loss.”
“If you don’t tell them, you trigger something called ambiguous loss.” — Dr. Franco, [32:26] -
Legitimizing Grief After Friendships End:
Society doesn’t always acknowledge friendship grief, but it's real and can be as painful as romantic loss.
“If there’s one thing you should know about grief, it’s that you can’t just suppress it and push it away.” — Dr. Franco, [35:07]
Reframing Friendship: Everyday Investment and Generosity
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Treating Friendships Like Romantic Relationships:
Dr. Franco challenges herself: Would she invest as much in a friend as she would for a partner? Small acts can profoundly strengthen the bond.
“This is the work.” — Dr. Franco, [37:15] -
The Most Valued Trait in a Friend Isn’t What You Think:
Research shows people prize “ego support”—feeling valued and cared for—over charisma or wit.
“The number one trait people valued was this concept, ego support: someone making you feel like you matter.” — Dr. Franco, [38:09]
Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments
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On the Hierarchy of Love:
“Why have I been told that this love [friendship] doesn’t count?”
— Dr. Franco, [02:57] -
On Expansion Through Friendship:
“Each person that we interact with can bring out a new and different side of our identity.”
— Dr. Franco, [07:51] -
On Adult Friendship:
“We can’t assume [friendship] happens organically anymore. We’re gonna have to try.”
— Dr. Franco, [11:51] -
On Mutual Support:
“A relationship is never going to be 50/50… There’s gonna be a period when you’re giving more. There’s gonna be a period when you’re getting more.”
— Dr. Franco, [22:36] -
On Letting Go:
“It sounds cruel, but it’s a lot less cruel than not giving someone any closure.”
— Dr. Franco, [34:50]
Timestamps for Major Segments
- [02:57] – Dr. Franco’s personal revelation on the undervaluing of friendship
- [07:51] – How friendship expands identity
- [09:53] – Research: friendship and physical/mental health
- [11:51] – Intentionality in adult friendship
- [13:16] – The mere exposure effect
- [14:12] – The liking gap and self-fulfilling prophecies
- [20:28] – How to maintain current friendships: risk regulation and investment
- [22:36] – Navigating mutuality when lives diverge
- [25:45] – Flexibility and long-term friendships
- [27:48] – Addressing conflict as an act of love
- [32:26] – Friendship breakups, ambiguous loss, and closure
- [35:07] – Grieving friendship loss
- [37:15] – Reframing how we prioritize and care for friends
- [38:09] – What people truly value in their friends: ego support
Final Takeaways
- Friendship deserves intentional attention and cultural elevation equal to romantic love.
- Making and keeping friends requires effort, vulnerability, and generosity.
- Healthy conflict and honest conversation are fundamental to maintaining strong bonds.
- The most cherished quality in a friend is making each other feel valued.
For those inspired by this episode: call a friend, invest in your friendships, and trust that small gestures and honest conversations can deeply strengthen your social world.