How to Be Anything, Episode 10: How to Teach Dogs to Find Cancer

Host: Emily McCrary
Guest: Dr. Cindy Otto, Founder, Penn Vet Working Dog Center
Date: September 10, 2025

Overview

This episode profiles Dr. Cindy Otto, a veterinarian and leading expert on working dogs, especially their roles in disaster search and rescue and medical detection. The narrative weaves through Dr. Otto’s experiences at Ground Zero after 9/11, her pioneering research on the long-term health of rescue dogs, and her bold work training dogs to detect cancers in humans and even their own species. The episode is a moving, detailed look at an unusual, highly specialized profession—and the foundational, nuanced relationship between trainer and dog.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. A Life-Changing Day: Dr. Otto at Ground Zero

• Dr. Otto was called up as part of Pennsylvania Task Force 1 immediately after the 9/11 attacks to care for the search and rescue dogs at Ground Zero.
• She describes the harsh conditions: debris, constant calls for dogs, and the priority to protect the canine teams' physical and mental well-being.
• [03:53] Dr. Otto:
  “One of the things that, as a medical professional, I was really concerned about was these dogs need to have a break and they need some rest so that they can actually do their job as good as possible.”
• Handlers would stage survivor "finds" in the rubble to keep the dogs motivated as live rescues became rarer.

2. Long-Term Impact: Health Study of Rescue Dogs

• Motivated by concern over exposure to toxins, Dr. Otto led a 15-year longitudinal study tracking 95 rescue dogs present at Ground Zero.
• The research revealed surprising canine resilience:
  [06:43] Dr. Otto:
  “We really anticipated that if there were going to be some problems, they would show up in the dogs before they even showed up in the people. And surprisingly, we weren’t correct on that. The dogs did remarkably well.”
• The rates of cancer and mortality were similar in deployed and non-deployed search dogs, challenging assumptions and highlighting adaptability.

3. Human and Canine Bonds in Disaster Work

• The study also measured psychological impacts on handlers.
• [07:48] Dr. Otto:
  “We found that dog handlers were more resistant to PTSD as first responders if they had their dogs, that the dogs were helpful…But if their dog died…the risk shot way up.”
• Explores the emotional symbiosis and “alchemy” between handler and dog.

4. The Penn Vet Working Dog Center: A Legacy

• Dr. Otto converted her 9/11 experiences into action, founding the Penn Vet Working Dog Center in 2012, described as a "legacy of 9/11."
• The center trains dogs for diverse specialized roles: search and rescue, police work, detection of invasive species, and, notably, disease detection.
• Training mimics chaotic environments, and programs focus on both physical and mental conditioning for canine “athletes.”
• [10:44] Dr. Otto:
  “Physical fitness is huge.”

5. How to Train a Dog to Climb a Ladder…Or Find Cancer

• Training complex behaviors (like ladder climbing) relies on understanding and teaching proprioception—the dog’s awareness of their own body and movement.
• [11:01] Dr. Otto:
  “The first thing you have to do is you have to teach them. They have back feet.”
• Highly specialized lines, some named after 9/11 victims, carry on both a genetic and symbolic legacy.

6. Teaching Dogs to Detect Cancer

• Medical detection training uses “click on sniff”—marking and rewarding the dog when they correctly identify a disease sample among controls.
• The challenge is high: samples may carry other odors (from benign disease, stress, lifestyle) that dogs must learn to ignore.
• [14:20] Dr. Otto:
  “We don’t want the dog to be relying on those cues because we know stress itself has its own odor…We can train dogs to detect a bomb. Of course we can train them to detect a disease. Well, we learned a lot. It’s not the same.”
• Dogs are used not as diagnostic tools in the wild, but as gold standards to help humans develop technological "electronic noses."

7. Reverse Engineering the Canine Nose

• Dogs, compared in studies with chemical analytical techniques, often outperform technology—especially when real-world variables (like pet hair) are present.
• [17:28] Dr. Otto:
  “The chemists were able to do pretty well. But if the shirt had pet hair on it, the chemistry really struggled. Whereas the dogs were like, ah, you got a cat, oh, that’s cool, no problem. But you also have Covid.”

8. Detecting Cancer in Dogs—A Personal Dimension

• The host’s touching story of losing her own dog to hemangiosarcoma, a fast-moving cancer, leads into Dr. Otto’s current work teaching dogs to detect this disease in fellow dogs.
• Dogs are showing promising accuracy (70–80%) in distinguishing hemangiosarcoma samples.
• [20:26] Dr. Otto:
  “We’re absolutely convinced that there is an odor associated with this cancer…The dogs are going to be our gold standard for telling if it’s there or not, because the dogs don’t care about some of these confounding factors.”

9. The Art of Human-Canine Relationship

• Dr. Otto reflects on her own dog, Dolce, and what forges unbreakable bonds:
  [22:26] Dr. Otto:
  “Working together builds the relationship…Instead of yelling at the dog, you’re listening to the dog and you’re actually in a dance and a partnership…By looking in a dog’s eyes, you elicit oxytocin, the bonding hormone, both in you and in the dog. But you have to take the time.”

Notable Quotes

• On resilience:
  “The dogs were incredibly resilient.” — Dr. Otto [06:43]

• On dog-handler bonds:
  “There is a huge and amazing and beautiful relationship…things go up and down the leash.” — Dr. Otto [07:48]

• On cancer detection:
  “We’re actually to the point where we’re absolutely convinced that there is an odor associated with this cancer…The dogs are going to be our gold standard.” — Dr. Otto [20:26]

• On training philosophy:
  “It just changed it. Instead of yelling at the dog…you’re listening to the dog and you’re actually sort of in a dance and a partnership.” — Dr. Otto [22:26]

Segment Timestamps

• [01:57] Dr. Otto’s 9/11 Ground Zero experience
• [03:02–04:45] Caring for rescue dogs after disaster
• [05:36–07:34] Long-term health study findings
• [07:48–08:29] Handler psychological health and resiliency
• [08:38–09:15] Founding of the Penn Vet Working Dog Center
• [10:44–11:34] Training canine athletes and teaching new skills
• [13:06–14:43] Training dogs to detect ovarian cancer
• [16:12–17:28] Comparing canine detection to chemical methods
• [19:52] The host’s own story of losing a dog to cancer
• [20:26–21:29] Dogs detecting cancer in other dogs
• [21:54–23:48] Dog-person relationships and the making of a bond

Memorable Moments

• The detailed description of staged “finds” at Ground Zero to keep dogs motivated ([04:13]).
• Dr. Otto’s pride in naming trained dogs after 9/11 victims ([12:28]).
• The host’s poignant personal story on canine cancer ([18:14–19:52]).
• The observed power of positive training in building relationship and trust ([22:26]).

Conclusion

This episode offers an intimate, multi-dimensional portrait of those who train working dogs for the highest-stakes jobs—and the remarkable animals themselves. Dr. Otto's story is anchored in history and modern science, but also in deep affection and mutual respect. For listeners, it's a window into a world where curiosity, tenacity, and trust—between humans and dogs—can lead to breakthroughs that save lives, canine and human alike.