ON FINDING THE ONE… With Miranda Hart, Celeste Barber and Glennon Doyle

Summary

Podcast Summary: How To Fail With Elizabeth Day

Episode: ON FINDING THE ONE… With Miranda Hart, Celeste Barber and Glennon Doyle
Host: Elizabeth Day
Guests: Miranda Hart, Celeste Barber, Glennon Doyle
Date: March 29, 2026

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Episode Overview

This special episode dissects the myth of "finding the one" and challenges stereotypical narratives about love, relationships, and blended families. Elizabeth Day weaves together three revealing, heartfelt interviews with Miranda Hart, Celeste Barber, and Glennon Doyle, each sharing how they found deep connection, acceptance, and love in unconventional ways, often later in life or through challenges. The recurring themes are authenticity, breaking societal expectations, and redefining what it means to "succeed" in love and family.

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Segment 1: Miranda Hart – Late Bloomer, Unapologetic Self [01:28–06:01]

Key Insights

• Authentic Self on First Dates:
  Miranda describes meeting her husband at 51 and her decision going into their first date: “I’m going to be me. I’m not going to rein myself in.” [01:53]

• Story of the “Pizza Incident”:
  She recounts feeling “full-on teenage grumpy” when her pizza arrived looking like a calzone. Instead of apologizing for her reaction, she chose to stand in her honest feelings. Her husband met her in that space, validating her disappointment, which became a foundation for their connection.

  “I’m so disappointed by this. Look, yours is really nice, look at mine. What is that, half a cow’s? … There was a slight moment, he went, ‘No, it is sad, look at that mozzarella, it’s not doing what it should do.’ And I went, ‘Exactly.’ And I was like, we formed this most delicious connection...” – Miranda Hart [03:21]

• Learning Through Fiction:
  Miranda reflects on how her sitcom mirrored her real desires before she believed they could happen for her:

  “I was writing what I knew was possible, but for some reason didn’t think it was possible for me.” – Miranda Hart [05:42]

Notable Quotes

• “You have to be who you've got to be on a first date. You've got to be sophisticated and together and pretty and play games.” – Miranda Hart [05:02]
• “It’s a really courageous thing to do in a society that conditions us to be anything but [yourself].” – Elizabeth Day [05:12]

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Segment 2: Celeste Barber – Early Love, Blended Family Realities [06:08–14:20]

Key Insights

• Confidence and Chemistry:
  Celeste met her husband at 21, boldly telling him, “You’ll be coming home with me tonight.” [06:30]

• Public Perception & Gender Roles:
  She highlights the societal double standard in which men who support successful women are especially lauded:

  “They think that he has given up his life for me… I've given up for—like, you do what you do. But it's not as though he was like, well, I did plan on flying a rocket to space three years ago, but I had to stop that because she wants to be funny.” – Celeste Barber [08:54]

• Insight into Stepparenting:
  Having become a stepmother at 21 to two young girls, Celeste emphasizes the primacy of love beyond familial complications:

  “Love just—you have to. Whatever is going on up here with parents and co-parenting or lack thereof... all that matters... is [the children are] okay.” – Celeste Barber [09:31]

  She notes the reality is more complex than the “just be their friend, don’t parent” standard advice:

  “That is impossible for me... I think if I had my time again... I'd do it differently.” – Celeste Barber [11:18]

• Motherhood, Feminism & Raising Boys:
  Challenges of raising feminist boys in a world that both privileges and pressures them:

  “Letting them know that they are the greatest kings... but at the same time, going, just so you know, it's really fucking hard for women. And men are trash. Not you, but men. No, not dad, but men are trash. No, not Poppy.” – Celeste Barber [12:48]

Notable Quotes

• “I’ve never ever been confident around boys or men... but something happened when I met my husband. I just saw him and I went, yep, lock it down.” – Celeste Barber [06:30]
• “I have so many female friends who have successful husbands... Not once do they get [told] ‘Wow, he’s so lucky’.” – Celeste Barber [08:50]

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Segment 3: Glennon Doyle – Rethinking Martyrdom & Building New Boundaries [14:34–24:10]

Key Insights

• Model, Not Martyr:
  Glennon’s wake-up call came when she realized she was staying in her marriage for her child’s sake, but wouldn’t want her daughter to emulate that relationship:

  “Would I want this marriage for her? And if I would not want this marriage for her, then why am I modeling bad love and calling that good mothering?” – Glennon Doyle [15:59]

• Inherited Myths About Motherhood:
  She breaks down the cultural narrative that equates motherhood with self-erasure:

  “A mother is a martyr... doing that in the name of your children... [is] a terrible legacy to pass on.” [16:02]

  Paraphrasing Carl Jung:

  “The greatest burden that a child can bury is the unlived life of her parent.” – Glennon Doyle [16:50]

• Setting Boundaries with Loved Ones:
  Glennon recounts telling her mother to resolve her own fears before visiting her new, blended family:

  "Your fear is not my family’s problem... When you are ready to come to the island of our family with nothing but love and celebration, we will lower the drawbridge for you.” – Glennon Doyle [18:37]

• Generational Change:
  Glennon compares living true to oneself, even when family doesn’t understand, to the reality that “our children are not our children… If we’re not doing anything that our parents don’t fully understand, we’re not doing it right.” [21:48]

• Resolution:
  Her mother ultimately not only accepted but championed Glennon’s new family:

  “She has been to now more Gay pride parades than we have… Something about watching me own myself... the only way we can convince people we are okay is to just go about being okay.” – Glennon Doyle [22:52]

Memorable Moments & Quotes

• “The good mothering is about slowly burying yourself, your dreams, your emotion, your personality, your ambition, your desires, and doing that in the name of your children, which is so ridiculous.” – Glennon Doyle [16:02]
• “Boundaries are my best friend. Great loves in my life are Abby, the children, coffee, and boundaries.” – Glennon Doyle [18:49]
• “It’s the quiet concern of those that love us… that’s what’s hardest.” – Glennon Doyle [18:49]
• “[My] job as the mother here is to make sure it never becomes their problem.” – Glennon Doyle, on safeguarding her children from inherited fear [18:37]

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Timestamps for Major Segments

• 00:00–01:21 — Introduction/theme setting
• 01:28–06:01 — Miranda Hart: First date, radical authenticity, and sitcom parallels
• 06:08–14:20 — Celeste Barber: Meeting her husband, blended family, gendered double standards, stepparenting, and raising boys
• 14:34–24:10 — Glennon Doyle: Ending her first marriage, choosing authenticity, boundaries with family, and generational evolution

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Episode Takeaways

• There is no singular or “correct” timeline for “finding the one”; love and fulfillment can come at any stage if you are true to yourself.
• Authenticity is key in both romantic and family relationships, even (or especially) when it feels risky or unconventional.
• Gender expectations and societal scripts are ripe for challenging, particularly around parenting, ambition, and partnership.
• Blended families and non-traditional setups can thrive through radical honesty, boundaries, and love that’s expansive rather than prescriptive.
• Modeling self-trust and wholeness gives children (and others) permission to do the same.

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Notable Quotes at a Glance

• “I was writing what I knew was possible, but for some reason didn’t think it was possible for me.” – Miranda Hart [05:42]
• “You’ll be coming home with me tonight.” – Celeste Barber [06:30]
• “The good mothering is about slowly burying yourself... and doing that in the name of your children, which is so ridiculous.” – Glennon Doyle [16:02]
• “Your fear is not my family’s problem. And my job as the mother here is to make sure it never becomes their problem.” – Glennon Doyle [18:37]

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This rich, forthright episode offers both laughter and reassurance, inviting listeners to question societal pressure around love and family — and to consider what it really means to show up as themselves.

Transcript

[Elizabeth Day]

This super special episode is brought to you by Bumble. Now, we're brought up to believe very often that finding a life partner, the person that you want to walk through experiences with, your lobster, if you will, is something that should happen quickly. And when you first set eyes on each other, fireworks go off in the background and you get married, buy your house, have lots of kids together, and live happily ever after in heteronormative bliss. But life has taught me that it's not like that for everyone. It definitely wasn't like that for me. In fact, it very rarely plays out like that. And that's okay. Today we look back at three how to fail guests who found their partner at different times in life. First up, you'll hear from the brilliant and hilarious Miranda Hart, who got married when she was 51. She talks through her first date with her now husband. Then Australian comedian Celeste Barber talks about meeting her husband young and, and quickly becoming a stepmother to two children. Finally, American author Glennon Doyle talks about leaving her marriage for the love of her life, Abby, and co parenting her three children with her ex husband in a blended family. I hope this episode brings you as much laughter, reassurance and warmth as each of those guests have brought me. And hopefully it inspires you to refresh your Bumble profile or download Bumble.

[Celeste Barber]

Now,

[Elizabeth Day]

we've come onto the boy.

[Miranda Hart]

The boy.

[Elizabeth Day]

Your husband and I, we dance together.

[Miranda Hart]

Can I just say.

[Elizabeth Day]

Yes, that's. And he's a drummer.

[Miranda Hart]

You said he's a drummer. So I'm very envious of his musicianship.

[Elizabeth Day]

But there was something about. And I'm not going to give away how you met because it's the most amazing story and the most incredible payoff for the book. But there was something about the first date that you had with him that was so important in terms of acceptance. Will you tell us that story?

[Miranda Hart]

Yeah. Well, it's very, very, it's very silly, but because I was, I met him sort of halfway through the story of the book. So it was at the point where I was like, okay, I'm this. Unexpectedly, to me, this story is. And this discovery of this time is learning to be honestly who I am and who I inherently am and how to be a kind, loving version of me, because I think that's, that's basically our purpose is to love and to be kind. And we all do that in our unique, different ways. So I was like, okay, I'm going to, I'm not going to say sorry unless I've made, you know, really need to. I'M going to be me. I'm not going to rein myself in. Okay. So I had the opportunity to go on this date and I thought the reason I'm nervous is because I'm, I've made a little vow to myself to be honestly myself. And so we were chatting, all very easy, very fun from the off. And then we get a pizza delivery and the pizza comes and I'm very, I haven't shied away from saying how excited I am about my pizza because I think pizza's very exciting. And he found that, I'm pleased to say, charming. And he was like, yeah, I'm excited about pizza too. But my pizza arrived and it had done that thing of shunting towards that one end. The mozzarella was leaking everywhere that end of the car. But it sort of flipped a bit so it looked a bit like a calzone. But I don't like calzones. Don't know why, they're just pizzas halved, aren't they?

[Elizabeth Day]

They're too much dough.

[Miranda Hart]

It just don't know what's going on there. So I, in this spirit of just being authentically me, I go off on one, I get full on teenage grumpy. I'm like, I am so disappointed by this. Look, look, look, yours is really nice, look at mine. What is that, half a cow's? Don't know. It's all shunted the mozzarella. I'm so disappointed. I went on and on and on. Was a bit sort of wide eyed. He's very shy, sweet, you know, keep the peace, sort of wide eyed. And this, the inner critic came in and went, apologize, do your thing, say sorry. I'm an absolute idiot. I don't know what I was doing. I was only joking. I thought, no, no, I'm not going to. I was like so, you know, awful, isn't it? Thinking also slightly back of my mind, first of all, problem, get into perspective, privilege, etc. But no, in that moment I was pissed off about my. And there was a slight moment, he went, no, it is sad, look at that mozzarella, it's not doing what it should do. And I went, exactly. And I was like, we formed this most delicious connection and actually sat eating the pizza in a bit of silence. Allah the dog loving, unconditional presence. But because it kick started the freedom for him and for me to just go, yeah, let's, let's start meeting and connecting and if this is going further in this way, let's not do formal, let's not do small talk. It's not who we are. And then when he did text and say, when should we see each other again? I was like, okay, well, he does like me because I was who I was. And probably farted within 10 minutes as well. But it's such a silly example. But it's also really important because I wouldn't have done that before. Yes.

[Elizabeth Day]

Because.

[Miranda Hart]

Because you have to be who you've got to be on a first date. You've got to be sophisticated and together and pretty and play games.

[Elizabeth Day]

Ultimately, that's what that is. It's not showing up as yourself.

[Miranda Hart]

Yeah.

[Elizabeth Day]

Which is a really courageous thing to do in a society that conditions us to be anything but. And I'm so happy for you that you have found that because you so deserve it.

[Miranda Hart]

Thank you.

[Elizabeth Day]

Because you have made so many other people feel fully accepted, to show up exactly as they are, many of whom you'll never meet. And I think that's been an incredible act of generosity on your part. And I'm really glad to hear that you found it for yourself, because you deserve is lovely.

[Miranda Hart]

And I'd sort of written a sort of version of it with Gary and Miranda in sitcom, and then I suddenly realized, oh, wow. I was writing what I knew was possible, but for some reason didn't think it was possible for me. Didn't think it would ever happen. And then he came along,

[Elizabeth Day]

And as part of that, I wanted to ask you about your family. So your hot husband, that's what you call him?

[Celeste Barber]

Yes. Well, that's what the world calls him now. Yeah. That blew up.

[Elizabeth Day]

Well, you're both phenomenally hot and make

[Celeste Barber]

a very hot couple.

[Elizabeth Day]

But I'm so interested in family units that are unconventional, partly because I am also a stepmother, as we were chatting about before. And I'd just love you to tell us the story of your family and how you met your husband.

[Celeste Barber]

We've been together for 22 years, which is a really long time. And we met in a pub. I was working in a bar in Sydney, in Australia, and he walked in, and I've never, ever been confident around boys or men. I've just never been, like, boy crazy. But something happened when I met my husband. I just saw him and I went, yep, lock it down. Like, that works for me. And I just walked up to him and said, you'll be coming home with me tonight.

[Elizabeth Day]

And he went, did you actually say that?

[Celeste Barber]

I actually. I know. Can you fucking believe it?

[Elizabeth Day]

Wow.

[Celeste Barber]

I just walked up to him and said it. I was 21.

[Miranda Hart]

Yeah.

[Celeste Barber]

Like. And I had the worst haircut. Of my fucking life. He still makes fun of me for it. It was. Remember when Halle Berry had that really short when she won the Oscar?

[Elizabeth Day]

Yes, that Monster's Ball.

[Celeste Barber]

I could try that with this hair.

[Elizabeth Day]

Yeah, we have very similar hair.

[Celeste Barber]

And you know what he said to me? He goes, later, he said to me, oh, I thought, oh, God, she must be confident because I have, I had that haircut, you know, if you're going to pull off that haircut, she must be confident. It's been what a long term relationship is when there's children involved, stepchildren involved, long distance involved. But we had a conversation very early on in our relationship that he knew that I, I'm an actor and I'm a comedian and I'm a performer and this is what I am working toward. He knew that and he was like, I would love to, like, let's make that happen. And I'll have the kids, I'll do the. He's such a nurturer. So early on we had that conversation. But it's interesting now that, you know, the success is what it is. He gets such an audience of people going, God, you're so lucky to have him. And I'm like, absolutely. And they're like, you know, you're so good to her. She's so lucky to have you. And I absolutely am. But they think that he has given up his life for me. And I have so many female friends who have successful husbands and not once do they get that audience of going, wow, he's so lucky. And Arpi, my husband even says that. He's like, it's weird. I'm sitting with all, you know, our groups of friends and these people say to him, God, she's so lucky to have you. What a man. And these women are there going, I have to same thing over here with my husband. But there's no audience for it.

[Elizabeth Day]

It's so astonishing how far we've yet to go 100%.

[Celeste Barber]

Especially when it comes to looking at those sort of relationships. People genuinely think, like I say, that he has given up so much for me and sure he has. And I've given up for like, you do what you do. But it's not as though he was like, well, I did plan on, you know, flying a rocket to space three years ago, but I had to stop that because she wants to be funny. It wasn't a thing.

[Elizabeth Day]

You have two sons now?

[Celeste Barber]

Yeah, two. 13 and 11.

[Elizabeth Day]

11. Okay. So first of all, I want to ask you about being a stepparent. So Your stepdaughters were 2 and 4 when they came into your life. Is that right?

[Celeste Barber]

Yes.

[Elizabeth Day]

Yeah.

[Celeste Barber]

2 and 4.

[Elizabeth Day]

What do you think is the most important thing that being a step parent has taught you?

[Celeste Barber]

There's so many things. It's interesting when you ask that. I instantly think of the girls, Kai and Sarah, bang. When they were little. They're 25 and 23 now, but in my brain they're little again. And I just think about, I was young when I got, I was 21 when we got the girl, when I got the girls. And I just think, love just. You have to. Whatever is going on up here with parents and co parenting or lack there or whatever, that is all, all that matters. Now look, that's great in theory, but that's one thing that I have learned. Like they just, they have. We just have to make sure that they, those little sausages are okay.

[Elizabeth Day]

Yeah. I think as a step parent myself, one of the key realizations I had after many, many years was my job. My stepchildren are older. My job is actually not to parent because they have two really effective co parents. My job is to be a support system for the parents in that situation. And that really, really helped me, being a support system to my partner. And also it's a completely different situation because they don't live with us and.

[Celeste Barber]

Oh, right.

[Elizabeth Day]

And I think that part of my journey was about letting go of the dream of having my own children, which didn't happen for me. And there was part of me, I think, that for years wanted to preempt the blendedness of our family unit. And I was just trying too hard to. To be parental rather than being myself.

[Celeste Barber]

Right.

[Elizabeth Day]

And sometimes when you decide to show up as yourself, you do end up being parental. It's been an interesting, and it's such an interesting conversation because for obvious reasons, we can't talk about it that much because it involves so many other people,

[Celeste Barber]

so many people and so many different experiences and so many different, you know, perceptions of how it all went down and how it works. But I agree with you, actually, I wanted it all to be one big happy family at all times, no matter what. And it doesn't work like that because as we just say, we're not the only ones in the situation. There are people that don't want to do that. They, you know, have different ideas for it. I found. Yeah, I think we did have very different experiences because I did have the girls a lot and I, it was hard. Like I was their next of kin. I was all of that. So it's like I being their friend. And that's the number one rule when you're a step parent, everywhere you read everything is like, don't parent them. Just be your friend. I was like, well, they are 2 and 4. That is impossible for me. And, yeah, I think if I had my time again, I think about this a lot. It would be different. I'd do it differently.

[Elizabeth Day]

I think they are so incredibly lucky to have you as you are them. But what an amazing stepmother to have just someone who has redefined what it is to be a woman and made it acceptable just to be our authentic, imperfect selves. And to celebrate that, you also have two sons. And I'm so intrigued to hear from you whether you perceive many differences in terms of, now that your sons are entering teenage years, the pressures societally that they face. As someone who has done so much

[Celeste Barber]

for women, it's very different from the girls to the boys. For me, I think, given the time that we're in in the world, I think I find it challenging to raise my boys. Letting them know that they are the greatest kings that have ever lived, and they're kind and they're funny and they're smart, and they deserve everything. And that most things in society are skewed toward them without them feeling like shit. That's hard. You know, I'm such a feminist. These. My boys are feminists. I'm raising them as feminists. That is, I find that very difficult, like, to empower them to be the excellent young, like, you know, rock stars that they are, but at the same time, going, just so it's really fucking hard for women. And men are trash. Not you, but men. No, not dad, but men are trash. No, not Poppy. Men suck. No, not Uncle Ben. Like, it's that thing where you kind of. I have no filter around that sort of stuff with my kids, which I really think I should sometimes because I get myself into a bit of trouble with them.

[Elizabeth Day]

Yes. What's Arpi's take on it?

[Celeste Barber]

We're aligned.

[Elizabeth Day]

Yeah.

[Celeste Barber]

In that. We're aligned in. I mean, he's. He'll be the one that sometimes goes, okay, Mum, we get it. Because I'm like. And another fucking point. Like, another thing. But no, he's absolutely the same. He's. Yeah. An excellent feminist.

[Elizabeth Day]

And how did that realization affect how you parented your children in the aftermath of your first marital breakup?

[Glennon Doyle]

Well, the way my life actually works is I say these wise things on podcasts, and then I promptly forget everything in my real life. Okay, so what I Learned and know in my head is that all feelings are fulfilling and that beautiful people are not made through lack of pain and lack of struggle. That beautiful people are made from overcoming and overcoming. What that looked like in my parenting is, I will protect my children from all pain forever. That they will never feel anything, that no raindrop will fall on top of their head. Right. This is none of my spiritual knowledge translated to my real life. Okay. So when I fell in love with Abby, even with all of the pain in my marriage, I initially decided that I would stay in my marriage. And I could give a lot of reasons for that, but mostly it was just that I felt that I could not hurt my children in that particular way. And then one day, I was braiding my daughter Tish's hair, and I looked at her, and I realized, oh, my God, I am staying in this marriage for her. But would I want this marriage for her? And if I would not want this marriage for her, then why am I modeling bad love and calling that good mothering?

[Elizabeth Day]

Wow. Yeah.

[Glennon Doyle]

Right? And, Elizabeth, the answer is simple. It's the same as every other message given to women. It's because through osmosis, through modeling, through overt messages, I was tamed into believing that a mother is a martyr. Right. The good mothering is about slowly burying yourself, your dreams, your emotion, your personality, your ambition, your desires, and doing that in the name of your children, which is so ridiculous. Right? It's such a burden, and it's such a terrible legacy to pass on to our children. Right? Because then they, too, believe that they have to become martyrs to prove their love. And it never ends. It's why Carl Jung said, the greatest burden that a child can bury is the unlived life of her parent.

[Elizabeth Day]

Yes.

[Glennon Doyle]

So, yeah, eventually I just decided, okay, I just have to reject these cultural messages of goodness. You know, we all want to be good. That's because we are good. It's just that we have to define what good means for ourselves. Because if we default to the cultural messages of good for women, those messages will always tell us, in one way or another, disappear. So I decided for myself that what I wanted to be for my children, I didn't want to slowly die for them. I wanted to show them how to bravely live. I wanted to be a model, not a martyr. And I decided that what that meant is that my children will only allow themselves to live as fully as I give myself permission to live. So that means just trying to resist settling for any relationship, institution, et cetera, that is less true. And Beautiful than the one I would want for my children.

[Elizabeth Day]

You talk as well about the island of your family. And it's funny because you're friends with heroes of mine. So the idea of you, Brene Brown, and Liz Gilbert all sitting around for dinner is enough to make me orgasm. I'm like, I want to be there.

[Glennon Doyle]

Best sentence ever. Yeah.

[Elizabeth Day]

You were on Brene Brown's amazing new podcast recently, and you told the story of the island. And I think it's so interesting that you were talking to her about it because she's been so influential for me in terms of setting boundaries and how setting a boundary is not a negative thing. But we as women have been taught that it is. We've been taught that it's selfish and self indulgent and somehow unfriendly. But tell us about the island when it came to something your mother said about your new family setup.

[Glennon Doyle]

Yeah. First of all, telling women not to have boundaries is same. Same. Right. It's just another way to say a good woman disappears. Don't have needs, don't have expectations. Because that's all that boundaries are is just saying, I have needs.

[Celeste Barber]

Yeah.

[Glennon Doyle]

But the thing about boundaries is that they're my best friend. Great loves in my life are Abby, the children, coffee, and boundaries. But the interesting thing about boundaries is that they are harder to hold with people that we deeply love. When I first told my parents about me and Abby, my mom was scared to death. Okay, My mom and I are best friends, just completely codependent. Okay? We talk six times a day. Most of that I don't want to change. But she was so afraid. And I could hear her fear in every conversation and every question. It was just, you know, what will the world think? How will the kids friends treat them? What will the Internet say? Just all this fear. Because mothers sometimes think that worrying is the same thing as love. It's not. But I fell into that trap too, sometimes. So I found myself getting really defensive every time I talked to my mom. Just like becoming seven years old again, you know, just incessantly explaining why I was allowed to do what I wanted, why I was okay. Because I don't think that it's the hatred from enemies that shakes us from our knowing. I think it's the quiet concern of those that love us. That's what's the hardest. And one day I was talking to my mom, and I heard her say, your dad and I are coming to visit next week. And I heard myself say, no, you can't come here because you are still afraid And I can't let you bring your fear to my children because they are not afraid. Right. I taught them. They were raised to know that love in every form should be celebrated and that it is best to be yourself and let the world catch up. But if you come and you bring your fear to our home, they will see it in your eyes and they will help you carry it because they love and trust you. So I have to tell you this really hard thing, mom, which is that your fear is not my family's problem. And my job as the mother here is to make sure it never becomes their problem. So go figure out your problem. And when you are ready to come to the island of our family with nothing but love and celebration, we will lower the drawbridge for you. But not one second sooner. And that was out of all of the tellings, out of all of the telling the world about me and Abby. That was the moment, Elizabeth, that I became an adult.

[Elizabeth Day]

Yeah. Just hearing you talk about it, I would find that so terrifying. Having to do. Isn't that stupid that it's just that something that terrifies us?

[Glennon Doyle]

No, it's not stupid. It's universal. I know some of the fiercest activists in the world get up on podiums in front of thousands of people. They say the things, they preach liberty and freedom. They know it. And then they come home and they cry about their moms.

[Elizabeth Day]

Yeah.

[Glennon Doyle]

It feels like the ultimate untaming. It's just a reframing. It's like, of course, the best way to honor our parents is to trustfully the women they raised. Right? And of course, if we're not doing anything, they don't understand we are not living into our place in. In the world because we live in different worlds. Our parents were conditioned and programmed in a different world. Right. And they had us for the future. It reminds me of that Kahlil Gibran poem that's so beautiful on children that says, your children are not your children. They are life's longing for itself. It's like we are. If we're not doing anything that our parents don't fully understand, we're not doing it right. And the terrible part of that is that if our children are eventually not doing anything that we don't understand, they're not living into their place.

[Elizabeth Day]

Right.

[Glennon Doyle]

So eventually we will have to allow them to make their own islands and hopefully just approach them with nothing but love and celebration so that they will lower the drawbridge for us.

[Elizabeth Day]

How did your mother take it?

[Glennon Doyle]

At first, on that phone call, she said, I hear you, and I will think about what you've said. I had the miraculous situation where my mother. Now Elizabeth, for sure Abby is her favorite daughter, and she has two other ones. Okay. She has been to now more Gay pride parades than we have. She is, for certain, the fiercest activists of our family. She works to plan trans remembrance ceremonies. She goes to every activist meeting in her town. She. Something about watching me own myself. I just think that really at the heart of it, people that love us just want us to be okay. Right. Her fear was her desperation for my okayness. And it turns out that the only way we can convince people we are okay is to just go about being okay. And so her watching me trust myself, watching us walk through the pain, but watching my family come out the other side, truer and more beautiful than we've ever been. It's like that thing where you see a cheetah and it makes you return to your cheetah. Right. She needed to watch me untame myself so that she could do the same thing. And, yeah, it's been so beautiful, but I know a lot of people who don't get that miracle.

[Miranda Hart]

Yeah.

[Glennon Doyle]

Right? And that doesn't mean that it wasn't the right thing to do.

[Elizabeth Day]

Yeah. Oof. That was an emotional one. Thank you so much for listening to this episode of how to Fail with Me. Elizabeth Day. This episode was brought to you by Bumble. Helping turn dating into real conversations and connections.