B (5:31)

you for having me.

A (5:32)

I'm so excited.

B (5:34)

I'm nervous.

A (5:35)

Oh, please don't be nervous. I'm honored that you're nervous, but I promise that you don't need to be. I've already said I'm such a huge fan of both you and Love Island.

B (5:45)

Thanks, Bill.

A (5:46)

And producer Hannah and I are starstruck in a way that we've never been for anyone else.

B (5:51)

Don't tell the other guests.

A (5:53)

It's just between the two of us and all of our listeners and viewers, it's such a pleasure to meet you in person. It really is. And I really appreciated you being number one in sales as a cabana server. I thought that was hilar. What is the secret to being good at sales?

B (6:08)

Charisma.

A (6:10)

Tell me more. Are you born with it or can you cultivate it?

B (6:13)

I think you can learn. Like, with anything in life, you have to practice it. I'd been a waitress since I was 16 years old. It was the only job I ever had. So you start to, like, think about the types of people you're serving and how to get them to spend more and spend more and, I don't know, be their friend at the end of the day?

A (6:32)

Yes.

B (6:32)

For me, serving was much more than just bringing someone their drink. Especially when I was working in big hotels. I was, like, cultivating an experience for them that went way past. Do you want a pina colada?

A (6:44)

So you were working in this hotel in Vegas, and Mike Spencer Hayter, who we all have to credit with basically inventing one of the best reality TV shows of all time, was on his honeymoon.

B (6:57)

On his honeymoon.

A (6:58)

And I met Mike recently, and he told me this story. And I also messaged him ahead of recording this podcast, and he gave me permission to quote from what he said about you. He said, she stood out from the crowd. Tony was confident, beautiful, and engaging. I knew when I met her that she'd be a star, and she was so relatable. So did you think I'm being scammed? Here's this guy. He says he's a creative director of Bob Island.

B (7:26)

So it's so funny. I really think it was, like a meant to be situation. It was a Monday afternoon. One of my friends actually called out of work. I took her section. The only people in the section were these two British guys. And, you know, I was thinking to myself in the morning, oh, British guys don't tip. I'm not gonna make any money today. And it was so funny because I came up to Mike and his husband, and I Introduced myself to them. I said, are you celebrating anything? Immediately he said, have you ever heard of Love Island? It wasn't like I had spent the day with them. It was such a short interaction before he even brought it up, that I was like, this guy's a bullshitter. Especially working in the job, in the industry that I was in, you get offered all sorts of things. People want to take you out on dates, people want to offer you jobs, they offer you vacations, like all crazy things. And it wasn't until a couple days later, when ITV started contacting me, that I was like, oh, my God, this is real.

A (8:23)

Then when you realized it was real, was there a sense that fate took over and you just thought, actually, I'll say yes.

B (8:31)

I think if it was in any other circumstance than the one I was in, I probably would have said no. Because I remember at first, I'm like, oh, I'm not doing this. I have a great life in Vegas. I have friends. I make money. I can take four months off a year because the pool closes. And even I think it was two weeks after they were flying me to London for one day and one day only. Cause I had to get back home so I could meet the production team. And I was like, I'm not doing this. I was on the flight to London, and I'm like, oh, I'll go see what they say, but I'm not going on the show. And it really took some convincing from my friends. They were like, no, you have to. Some of my friends had watched the show. I didn't. So I don't think I understood the opportunity was so big, you know.

A (9:15)

Yes. I think that really worked in your favor, though, because from the outset, you seemed so yourself.

B (9:22)

Yeah.

A (9:22)

And in a crazy, surreal environment, it must be quite hard for people who don't have a strong sense of self to hold onto that level of authenticity. Did you feel, with all of this sales expertise, did you feel you had to sell yourself?

B (9:36)

I think I got it easy coming onto the show because it was kind of already set up for me. I didn't have to, like, go to a million meetings with producers because I wasn't here. Mike found me. What Mike says goes. So getting on the show, that was easy for me. But then being inside, I've just always been myself. And it's somewhat worked out for me, whether that was in school or in work or in sports, anything like that. So I wasn't trying to pretend I knew it worked for me in the past. So I just carried that onto the Show?

A (10:08)

Yes. What's sleep like? Did you? I can't imagine. Much worse than having to sleep in a communal bedroom.

B (10:17)

That wasn't even the problem. It was the schedule. Because obviously we don't know what time it is. We don't have our phones. There's no clocks anywhere. But sometimes I would sneak a look at a producer's phone when we'd be talking to them, and it would be five in the morning.

A (10:31)

Oh, my goodness.

B (10:32)

We would be up until 5am sometimes. And, like, to my knowledge, we had, like a sleep bank. We would get X amount of hours for the week. So if one day we got 12 hours, the next day we could get six, and then it all adds up. Huh. So, like, on Saturdays, on down days, sometimes we would go to bed and the sun would still be up.

A (10:53)

That's so weird. I had no idea. You had no clue about what time it is?

B (10:56)

No, we didn't know ever.

A (10:58)

So what about mealtimes? So this is so niche.

B (11:01)

No, it's okay.

A (11:02)

Ask away. Did they happen at a regulated time every day, or do you just eat when you're hungry?

B (11:07)

It was catering.

A (11:08)

Okay.

B (11:08)

So we would wake up in the morning, if it's even morning, and we would go out and cook ourselves breakfast. But then immediately after we ate breakfast, lunch would come because it was always at a set time.

A (11:20)

Okay. I imagine one of the hardest things, along with sleep and not knowing what time it was, is. Is being liked or disliked, both in the villa, but then having to contend with what you think the public perception might be of you.

B (11:34)

Yeah.

A (11:35)

How did you cope with that? Because the first public vote, you and Shakira. I know you and Shakira came bottom, and I just like to apologize on behalf of the British public. You got that wrong. And then what an amazing narrative arc you had because you ended up winning. Yeah, but what's that like?

B (11:54)

I think for me, it was a bit expected being the only first American ever. I think that Americans kind of had a bad rap in this country. Even just abroad, anywhere, America's kind of frowned upon. So I expected it not because of who I actually am, but just because of that simple narrative. People, it was something they're not familiar to, that a lot of people just say no immediately when it's something new and fresh. So the first public vote didn't necessarily shock me. I know I didn't do anything wrong. I think it was further down the line when the people that I was with every day didn't like me. That hurt so much more. You kind of Forget about the public unless there is something like a public vote.

A (12:36)

And is that when you really relied on Shakira and Yaz?

B (12:40)

100%. We were all in the same boat. Like, that's why we call ourselves the Outcasts. We came together because we didn't really have anyone else. I was trying in the beginning. Like, I wasn't mean to the girls. I didn't feel included from the day I walked in there for the simple fact that I was American, even with the boys. I've said this before. It really shocked me that they weren't even willing to give me a chance for the simple fact of where I was from.

A (13:10)

Have you forgiven your fellow contestants who were mean to you?

B (13:13)

Yeah. There's no reason for me to hold a grudge. Like, I'm sorry, but they get enough hate online. I don't need to contribute to that. I feel awful at the way that the rest of them have been treated since coming out of the villa, and I don't know how I would cope. I get very little hate, but the hate I do get hurts me.

A (13:32)

Yes.

B (13:33)

So, like, if anything, I'm, like, praying for them to be okay. I don't hold a grudge. It's hard for all of us. Coming off the show, I wanted to

A (13:42)

spend a bit of time talking about your friendship. Talk me through Tony and Yaz and that final. And there's this iconic image where it's the three of you standing hand in hand. How did it feel being there with your two besties?

B (13:58)

It's hard to put into words. We had struggled for eight whole weeks and been ostracized and left out. And I don't like to use the word bullied. I'm not even sure that that's the correct word. But, like, we felt ganged up on at times. So for us to make it together, the three of us in the final, it was kind of like a. Aha. We did it. And it was just so rewarding to be stood up there with my two best friends. It could have been anyone at the end of the day, but I think our friendship, regardless of our couples, is kind of what brought us to the final. It's what made us survive those brutal eight weeks.

A (14:41)

Do you still speak every day?

B (14:43)

Yeah, every single day.

A (14:44)

Are you in a WhatsApp group, the three of you? Of course. WhatsApp group.

B (14:46)

The outcast.

A (14:47)

It's called the Outcast. Just checking.

B (14:48)

We never called ourselves the big three. That came from the public. We called ourselves the Outcast for sure.

A (14:54)

Who is most likely to send the longest voice note.

B (14:57)

Oh, my God. Yasmin only speaks in voice notes. I swear fingers don't work. I hate voice notes.

A (15:03)

Yaspti, do you?

B (15:05)

I hate them. We don't even use them in America. Really? We don't even use WhatsApp.

A (15:09)

Here's an interesting cultural difference.

B (15:11)

Yeah, we are imessage girlies in America and we just type out what we have to say.

A (15:17)

Who's the most likely to use emojis?

B (15:19)

Probably me.

A (15:20)

Okay.

B (15:21)

Yeah, I love a good emoji. I can't lie.

A (15:23)

What's your most used emoji?

B (15:25)

Probably like the puppy dog eyes or some form of a heart.

A (15:29)

Okay. You said that you had never watched an episode of Love Island UK before. Yeah, for me it's all about relationships and anthropology. Ultimately, it's about how we understand how each other behaves. What do you think? Other than your friendship and your relationship with Cash, what do you think Love island gave you or taught you a bit of confidence?

B (15:53)

Honestly? Because for me personally, I wouldn't really leave the house without makeup. I was a full glam girl to go anywhere not being on tv. But then after the show, I realized people have seen me in every form. They've seen me wake up in the morning with no makeup on. They see me crying, they've seen me angry. They've seen me with a full face. They've seen me before bed with spot patches on like so. Afterwards, I can remain the same. I post without makeup. I go in public without makeup and take pictures with millions of strangers, like so. That's something I really found value in, that I never would have imagined would come from the show.

A (16:31)

Yes. That's so great to hear.

B (16:34)

Yeah.

A (16:34)

Yeah. Have you watched it back? No. No. Would you ever?

B (16:38)

I think eventually down the line, Cash always tells me that I should watch it to see, like, why people loved me so much, because sometimes I forget that. But I haven't seen it. I've seen clips on TikTok and everything, of course, but those are just highlight moments.

A (16:54)

Your first failure is about ignoring your health. Tell us a little bit about this.

B (17:01)

So when I was 17, it was kind of like a hectic time in my life. I was obviously going what we call high school in America. I was playing sports, I had two jobs and I had this boyfriend who I didn't have the best relationship with. And I think it was the most stressful time of my life. At least I thought it was when I was 17. I think all 17 year old girls think that's the most stressful Time of your life. You have no idea, by the way. It gets worse. But I was just piling on stress to my life. And then it started to reflect in my health. And I had all of these gastric symptoms. Stomach pains every day, throwing up, not being able to eat more, tmi. Ones that I don't really want to talk about, But I was just pretending that I was okay and going on about my life. And I remember I went to a music festival in Miami with one of my friends, and I passed out in the crowd, and I just got up and acted like everything was fine. And it wasn't until I came home from that weekend that I told my mom, like, I need to go to the hospital. Something is not right. And it ended up leaving me in the hospital for two weeks when I was finally diagnosed with ulcerative colitis. But it was, like, such a low, low point. And I think it not could have been avoided. My chronic illness is unavoidable. It was coming for me regardless. But I let it get way, way, way too bad.

A (18:25)

And why do you think you let it get that bad? Was it that you felt that you were making something up or that you were making too big a deal of it or that you weren't taken seriously when you were trying to express it?

B (18:37)

I didn't express it.

A (18:38)

Okay.

B (18:39)

That was the problem. I think it kind of relates to the reason why I was nervous today. Once you acknowledge a failure, it's real. I just wanted to pretend like I was fine. I wanted to go to prom. I was getting ready to go to college. Like, all of these really, really exciting things were happening in my life. I don't have time to be sitting in a hospital bed.

A (18:59)

Yeah.

B (18:59)

I was young. I was cool. I was popular. I'm bleeding, you know? Yes. Like, I couldn't get out of bed.

A (19:06)

You poor thing.

B (19:07)

Yeah.

A (19:08)

So those two weeks in hospital, what were they like?

B (19:13)

Probably one of the lowest points of my life. Like, I ended up getting a horrible infection in the hospital so no one could come see me. Even the people working in the hospital had to come see me in, like, hazmat suits so it wouldn't spread to them. And again, this was my senior year of high school. This is the most exciting time of your life. It's graduation time, it's prom time. It's all the fun stuff. I just went to high school for four years, and this is the time you look forward to, and I couldn't take part in it. I was so, so sick. I was losing weight. I didn't look like myself anymore. I couldn't see my friends. I was weak. Like, I had a blood transfusion.

A (19:54)

Wow.

B (19:56)

I was in so much pain every single day. I thought it would never end.

A (20:02)

Did you go to prom?

B (20:03)

I made it to prom.

A (20:04)

Okay.

B (20:05)

So actually this is the interesting part about this, and this is why the whole entire world knows that I have UC Prior to the show. If you googled me, the only thing that would come up is my story of me going to prom because it made the Connecticut local news. The children's hospital in Connecticut made this huge plan for me to get ready for prom in the hospital. They allowed me to go to prom, and then I had to go back to the hospital.

A (20:29)

Oh, my goodness.

B (20:30)

I wasn't famous. I was famous in Connecticut for being sick. But, like, so now everyone knew when I was on the show, everyone knew that I had ulcerative colitis.

A (20:40)

Did you go with that disappointing boyfriend to prom?

B (20:42)

No. He was actually older than me.

A (20:44)

Okay.

B (20:45)

And so that was like. He was a lot of the reason for my stress. He lived two hours away from me, and I would lie to my parents and say that I was going to work, but I was really driving to his place two hours away. And the only reason why they caught me is because I crashed my car in the snowstorm. So it was the culmination of all of these things. I was ignoring my feelings, stressing myself out, and it ultimately, it made you sick. Like, no one else in my family has ulcerative colitis. People say it could be hereditary, but a common theme with all the reports I've read is stress.

A (21:21)

Okay, so for the ignorant among us, and I am one of them, how does UC manifest day to day? Can you ever predict a flare up?

B (21:33)

That's the scariest part about it. You can't. I could eat the same thing 10 days in a row. On the 11th day, I'll be flaring and like, there's amazing medications that you can take that basically shut down your entire immune system so it doesn't attack itself. Because it is an autoimmune disease. Your immune system is attacking itself, but then at the same time, those medications have so many other side effects, they shut down your immune system. So you get sick, you don't heal the same. You may bruise easily, you have allergies. Like, it's all these other things. It's like, which is more worth it. But the worst pain I've ever felt is from my stomach. So it outweighs everything.

A (22:15)

How does a flare up display itself? So you get Stomach pain.

B (22:19)

It's debilitating. You spend the day in the bathroom. You're exhausted.

A (22:24)

Like, do you feel nausea?

B (22:26)

Yeah.

A (22:27)

Okay.

B (22:27)

Nausea, exhaustion, excruciating pain. But you know what the worst part is about it? You wouldn't look at me and think I'm sick.

A (22:36)

Yes.

B (22:37)

So I always say not all disabilities are visible, and people don't really understand what that's like. They don't sympathize with you because you don't look sick, which is the most frustrating thing in the entire world. In America, it's even harder as well because these medications are so much money. One month supply of the medication I was on in America was $30,000.

A (23:03)

How did you cope?

B (23:04)

Health insurance. You have to pay for health insurance and then you apply for these programs. So, like, the drug companies give you basically a debit card, and the same company that makes the medicine gives you the money back for it. If you don't make a million dollars a year, you can't afford that medication. So it was always so hard. It was a constant battle and not to forget that they don't always work forever. I've been on three different medications since being diagnosed because one day they just stop working. If you miss a dose, your body builds antibodies against it and it doesn't work for you anymore. So it's a constant battle.

A (23:43)

That's very tough.

B (23:43)

It was frustrating, especially as a young girl.

A (23:46)

Yes. And how are you today?

B (23:48)

In remission. Thank God.

A (23:50)

Thank goodness.

B (23:51)

Yeah. Like, it took years. That was one of my biggest fears going on the show as well.

A (23:58)

I was about to ask you share

B (23:59)

bathrooms with 20 people. There's two bathrooms inside, one bathroom outside. But luckily there is a welfare team on the show that. But you have to tell these things, too. They get your entire medical history. If they thought that I couldn't physically do the show, they wouldn't have let me on. And they made sure I had all of the resources in place. There's a medic on site 24 7. God forbid something ever happened. I would have the resources I needed. But luckily, I am feeling good.

A (24:33)

I'm so happy to hear that. Did you have a flare up in the villa?

B (24:36)

No.

A (24:36)

Okay.

B (24:37)

Not once.

A (24:38)

If there's someone listening to this right now and they are struggling with either UC or Crohn's, what advice would you give them?

B (24:47)

Maintain your health before it's too late. Because I didn't. And I was so much sicker than I needed to be. Unfortunately, you have to get colonoscopies every year. It's the Most uncomfortable experience ever. I hear they don't even sedate you here in America. They knock you out. But it's so, so important, because I think you see Crohn's and colon cancer kind of all go hand in hand, and you would never want to be diagnosed with something even worse than you already have. So keep up with your colonoscopies, get on a medication that works for you, and avoid stress at all costs.

A (25:29)

It's so difficult because then avoiding stress becomes stressful sometimes. Do you have to be careful with your diet, or is that not related?

B (25:36)

I don't. Other people do. You see in Crohn's looks different for every single person. It's very unpredictable. Like they tell you in the beginning when you're really, really sick, don't eat spicy food, seeds, nuts, alcohol, coffee. All the things you think would upset your stomach. But luckily for me, I do consume those things, and I am okay. But it took time. When I first got sick, I said I was on the all white diet. Bread, mashed potatoes, rice. Because I was so scared to eat something that would upset me, but I was just living in fear.

A (26:08)

Yeah. And is this something you bonded with Yaz over?

B (26:11)

She has Crohn's, so it's so funny. There's this book called the Body Keeps the Score. Yes. And Yaz and I were talking about it one day, and I said, wait a second. Why have you read that book? She said, why have you read that book? And that's the moment that we found out.

A (26:26)

Does that really help, being friends with someone who fully understands 100%?

B (26:31)

Because they get. When you're having a bad day. I don't know if I can speak for everybody, but it affects my mood. Of course, if I'm not feeling good, I'm kind of a bitch. And it's not just because I want to be mean to everyone around me. My body is fighting itself every single day. And it's frustrating for me mentally to explain that to everybody. So Yaz just got it.

A (26:57)

I mean, to say that you have to manage your stress carefully. The last year for you must have been really challenging. Not only are you winning Love island, which, of course, that must be exciting, but it's super stressful as well, I imagine.

B (27:11)

Yeah.

A (27:12)

But you're then struggling to relocate to the UK and there's all sorts of visa issues and you can't work.

B (27:16)

Yeah.

A (27:18)

How did you manage that stress effectively?

B (27:21)

I think that being sick kind of taught me a lesson that was a bit valuable in this time in my life now. When I was sick, I had to stop and do nothing. When I didn't have a visa, I had to stop and do nothing. To somebody like me, that's devastating. I hate doing nothing. I feel unproductive. But there's also value in doing nothing and taking a step back and waiting for good things to come. So that's kind of what I had to do. I had no choice. As much as I wanted to work in this country, I couldn't or they would have sent my ass back to America. You know, during those months where I was waiting to get my visa approved, I kind of just tried to enjoy the time that I had because now my life is crazy. I don't have a day to sit and do nothing. So I appreciate the times that I did.

A (28:10)

I think that's so wise. And that was going to be one of the things I asked you that. Although we would all wish to take this burden from you, I wonder if your illness has taught you something. And it sounds like it's taught you

B (28:22)

that 100% getting sick so young, you gotta take something out of it. It can't just be a failure. Like, I learned a lot about myself and when to slow down. And it doesn't always have to be, go, go, go, go. Rest is also rewarding.

A (28:38)

Yes. And you don't need to earn rest correct for it to be valid.

B (28:43)

I love a good ROT day.

A (28:44)

Oh, so do I. Those are my favorite days of the week, Tony. I had one yesterday. You have your UK visa. Do you like it here?

B (28:53)

Okay.

A (28:54)

Your favourite thing and your least favourite thing.

B (28:56)

This is my first winter in seven years.

A (28:58)

Oh, I'm so sorry. I'm so sorry.

B (29:00)

And it's been a rough one. There was sunshine out today, though.

A (29:03)

Yeah, but there's been so much rain.

B (29:04)

It's rained every day of 2026.

A (29:06)

I feel so embarrassed. On behalf of the UK, I thought

B (29:09)

I liked Rainbow because I lived in Miami. It rained all the time. That was a great thunderstorm. Cozy afternoon. But now I have to, like, go out and do things and it drives me absolutely insane. But what I love about this country is the love that they've given me. I never thought I would be accepted by a whole nother nation. Of course there's people that don't like me, but, like, a majority of it is love that I never could have imagined.

A (29:35)

When people see you out and about, what do they mostly say to you?

B (29:42)

I get all sorts of different things. Some people just ask for a picture.

A (29:46)

Do you like baked beans yet?

B (29:48)

No.

A (29:48)

Okay. Have you Tried Marmite?

B (29:50)

Ew, no. Okay, that doesn't even sound good.

A (29:54)

Crumpets.

B (29:55)

We have them in America.

A (29:56)

I don't know if you do, Tony.

B (29:58)

We do.

A (29:59)

Well, I don't know if it's like an English muffin. No, you see, this is a debate I have with my American friends. There are things marketed in American grocery stores that, that claim to be crumpets, but they bear no resemblance to a British crumpet. So I need you today to go out and try like a Warburtons crumpet. And the key is that you need to toast it more than you think. And then if you're a sav. Are you a savory or a sweet person?

B (30:26)

Both.

A (30:26)

Okay, so if you're in a savory mood. Butter, slice of cheddar, flakes of salt.

B (30:31)

Okay, I'm here for that.

A (30:33)

So delicious. I'm actually salivating something. And if you're in a sweet mood, I mean, I don't do sweet encompets, but certain people do jam. Just like an apricot jam and butter deal. Okay, fine. Come back to me once you've tried that. Do you like the. Do you like the king? She like the royal family?

B (30:50)

I don't really know them. Hopefully one day I meet them. I don't know. I've been so busy that I guess I haven't had time to catch up on culture.

A (30:58)

Okay.

B (30:58)

My management team and I want to do like a Tony the Taurus series, but I tried to do it and then I got swarmed by people. So it's not that easy.

A (31:08)

I bet. Have you ever been on the top level of a double decker bus?

B (31:12)

So like, I want to do things like that?

A (31:14)

Yes.

B (31:14)

I want to be a tourist in my own city.

A (31:16)

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B (33:46)

We share the honest highs, lows, and

A (33:49)

the chaos of getting hitched. From budgets to guest lists to family dramas and the things no one prepares you for. We'll have new episodes every Tuesday, so

B (33:59)

make sure to subscribe to NearlyWett on

A (34:01)

YouTube and listen wherever you get your podcasts. Your second failure is having horrible dating habits before meeting Kat.

B (34:10)

That's for damn sure.

A (34:12)

Let's go up to the beginning. Okay, what are some of the worst dates you've ever been on?

B (34:18)

I think there was a lack thereof of dates. Yeah.

A (34:23)

You said you were popular in high school and you were dating an older guy.

B (34:26)

Yeah.

A (34:27)

So was it just that you weren't being courted, you were in relationships but you weren't dating?

B (34:32)

Correct.

A (34:33)

Okay.

B (34:33)

That relationship I was talking about earlier was like my only kind of real relationship and he was a couple years older than me. He was in college in another state and it was just kind of toxic. I think I'm a very anxiously attached person and obviously we didn't live in the same place and he wasn't giving me as much energy as I needed. I was always going to see him. I would stay with him and his football friends in a dirty apartment and use my only free time to be with him.

A (35:08)

Yes.

B (35:09)

And I was exhausting myself and lying to my family, which put a wedge between me and my parents. I think later on in college, I chose bad guys, again, who weren't necessarily seeing me for my value. It was kind of like hookup culture, not respecting myself. It was dark. I worked so hard in every other aspect of my life, but then dating, I kind of just settled for less.

A (35:40)

And why do you think that was?

B (35:43)

I'm still trying to figure it out. All of these past habits are kind of coming back now that I am in a good relationship. And I think being in your first healthy relationship kind of brings up darker parts of yourself that you didn't acknowledge until now. I always questioned why I was arguing with my partners. Was it because they were treating me like shit, or was it because I wasn't as secure in myself as I thought I was?

A (36:10)

Tony, I relate so deeply to what you're saying, and that's so true that when you're in a relationship that is founded on safety and trust, it's really confronting if you've never experienced that before. Because there's a degree. Degree of pain that comes with acknowledging what you used to accept.

B (36:27)

Correct.

A (36:28)

And there's also that fear that it's all too good to be true. I totally get it. You're speaking to someone who I was in long term relationships from the age of 19 to 35. I got married to the wrong person, got divorced when I was 35, and then was a single woman dating in her late 30s. And I'm now married again to an amazing man who I met online. And it took me a really long time to trust in the goodness of it.

B (36:57)

How long was that in between your marriages?

A (37:00)

Wait, so I got divorced age 35, met Justin 39. So four years squeezed in another relationship. Interesting.

B (37:07)

Good turnaround time.

A (37:09)

And I remember a therapist giving me great advice saying, it's time there'll be one day when you feeling anxious that he had this other relationship with this other person and feeling jealous and all those things that will fall by the wayside because you've had more time together.

B (37:28)

Yeah.

A (37:29)

And yours and Kasha's relationship is so deep, but actually it hasn't been that long.

B (37:33)

Not at all, really.

A (37:34)

And so much has happened in that.

B (37:36)

And I think people expect so much from us that it's like, in what world do you meet somebody six months ago, even less than that, and they're moving in together.

A (37:49)

Yes.

B (37:49)

If that was one of your friends and she met a guy six months ago. And she told you I'm moving in with him. What would you say to her?

A (37:55)

Don't.

B (37:56)

Exactly. Yes, but I hear it all the time. Why don't you live together? When are you getting married?

A (38:02)

Yeah.

B (38:03)

Why don't you see each other's family more? There's so much pressure, and we're just trying to find our feet.

A (38:10)

Where do you get your reassurance from?

B (38:13)

Of course, it's nice to hear compliments or words of affirmation, but I think one of my love languages is quality time. Yes, I don't need a vacation. I just like to be together. Yes, it really puts my mind at ease, but I am working on being more secure in myself to where I don't have to ask for anything.

A (38:35)

It's so hard, isn't it?

B (38:36)

I hate being alone, which I've never, ever experienced prior to going on the show.

A (38:42)

That's so. Because you're an only child. So that's really interesting to me.

B (38:45)

I'm an only child. I've lived away from home since I was 17 years old. I loved alone time until the show.

A (38:53)

So what do you think that's about? Was it like immersion therapy? In a way. Because then suddenly you're in a bedroom with 20 people. Right.

B (38:59)

You're never alone. Yeah, for eight weeks, I was never alone. And like, I don't know how many days it takes to build a habit. There's a statistic out there somewhere. But it's definitely eight weeks. I would sleep alone all the time in Vegas, in Miami and Connecticut, but then I never slept alone. When I was on that show coming out, I was with Cash every single day. Not to mention, I don't have a huge support system here.

A (39:27)

It's a lot, my darling. I've been through a lot. And it's difficult as well, because we all, as the viewing public, saw, quote, unquote, the happy ending. And so there's probably that pressure to live out everyone else's expectations of happiness.

B (39:43)

I think I'm going against the grain in that sense, especially with social media. I've kind of proven that you don't have to post every day to remain relevant. If you post moments that you're proud of something worth speaking about, people will still be engaged. I think that I've said this before. I really, really struggled to get on board with the whole social media thing. It wasn't my remote interest before going on Love island, but I kind of had no choice. But still, to this day, I don't post perfectly polished moments. I Post what's real. Of course, there's dinner parties and trips and free stuff, but at the same time, I'm a human being.

A (40:28)

Yeah. I really remember the video you posted saying you hadn't been able to work and you were struggling to get a visa. And it was so uncurated and so real and definitely part of the reason that we all love you. And you went from having 3,000 Instagram followers to now almost a million. So that's unhinged.

B (40:46)

It's crazy.

A (40:47)

Yeah.

B (40:47)

Like, it was just so shocking to me not having a phone for that long and then getting my phone back. Not to mention, my phone number was somehow in my Instagram bio the entire time I was on the show. There was, like, a contact button. So when I turned my phone back on after eight weeks, I had to take the SIM card out. It didn't stop ringing for days. Strangers just calling me.

A (41:15)

Oh, my goodness. Did you have any celebrities sliding into your DMs?

B (41:21)

Oh, Cara Delevingne and Charli XCX.

A (41:24)

Okay. The two coolest.

B (41:26)

Exactly. It wasn't men. Yeah. I don't have a large male audience. I think it's like I'm reaching the right girls in the gays. But, yeah, that was the craziest part. Especially after our ID shoot.

A (41:38)

Oh, my gosh. The iconic ID shoot. The Big three, the Outcast together, styled in such a brilliant way. That was so antithetical to how we were used to seeing Love island contestants. It was. I, I. It lives in my head. Rent free, that shoot.

B (41:54)

People still come up to us every single day. I think the Post has almost 30 million views on it.

A (41:59)

Do you have it framed somewhere in your apartment?

B (42:01)

I'm working on it.

A (42:02)

Okay.

B (42:02)

Yeah, I'm still working on decorating.

A (42:04)

Can I ask you a little bit about your childhood and how you were raised? Because so often when we are anxiously attached, it stems from something that we've experienced. So I've become familiar with your mother because she came on Love island, and I, again, was totally obsessed with her. Leslie. But you grew up with a mum and a dad.

B (42:22)

Kind of.

A (42:23)

Okay.

B (42:24)

I have an iffy relationship with my father.

A (42:26)

Okay.

B (42:26)

I'm sorry. And I think that is where a lot of my dating issues come from. Yeah, I really don't talk about it. People always ask me to talk about my dad, and I never do.

A (42:37)

Okay.

B (42:38)

It's hard because our relationship has been so back and forth for so long, and prior to the show, it was kind of at its lowest. I didn't tell him I was going On. I don't know how he found out, probably from some Facebook post somewhere, that his daughter was on an international television show. But I'm working on repairing that. I think a lot of the times I don't forgive people once it gets to a certain point. And the same way how I haven't forgiven him, it reflects into relationships with men or friends. Like, I cut people off and that's it.

A (43:10)

Yes. I understand that. Has he met Cash?

B (43:14)

No.

A (43:14)

Okay.

B (43:16)

I haven't seen him in three years.

A (43:17)

Okay. Thank you for sharing that. And I'm sorry that you.

B (43:23)

It's kind of a patched up wound.

A (43:26)

Yes.

B (43:27)

Like, I don't sit here and cry about it anymore. I may have used to.

A (43:31)

I think it's so strong of you to be addressing that now and to understand the link.

B (43:37)

Yeah.

A (43:38)

And to be able to work on that so that you're no longer paying the price for someone else's mistakes.

B (43:44)

Correct. I don't blame myself.

A (43:46)

Good.

B (43:47)

I was a kid, after all. His only kid. Both of my parents, only child. So, like, I don't know. When I have kids, one day I want to pour all the love I have in my heart to them because I don't want to have the same relationship with them that I did my parents.

A (44:05)

How's your relationship with Leslie now?

B (44:08)

Oh, she drives me nuts. She drives me absolutely insane. But I love her to pieces and. And she's probably the most supportive person I could ever imagine. She screams my name from the rooftops. Would I have advised her to make a TikTok account prior to the show? No. Over my dead body. But it happened and it worked out for her and I think kind of won the public over. She spoke for me when I couldn't speak for myself. People love her.

A (44:40)

Yes. She always shouted your name from the rooftops.

B (44:43)

100%.

A (44:43)

Yeah. And she was the person. She came into the villa and she was like, you need to pay attention to this man. Catch it. And thanked him. In a very moving exchange, I thought, is she still his number one fan?

B (44:55)

Oh, my God, yes. Can do no wrong in her eyes.

A (44:59)

Okay.

B (45:01)

That's why I'm like, okay, maybe just adopt him then. Because she loves it.

A (45:07)

Have any of your dysfunctional exes been in touch with you since you won the show?

B (45:10)

No. The one that I was speaking about earlier hasn't said a peep.

A (45:14)

That means that he's definitely seen it.

B (45:16)

Oh, yeah. Everyone has seen it. Like, I'm definitely the most famous person to come out of Newington, Connecticut. My parents went to the same High school as me. It's a very, very small town.

A (45:26)

Okay.

B (45:27)

Nobody ever leaves.

A (45:29)

I bet you've made the front page of that newspaper again multiple times over.

B (45:33)

It's funny because I've lived in so many different places, so people in Connecticut have given me recognition. I've done interviews with my college in Florida. People in Vegas have recognized me. Like, I thought I could escape it when I went to America. It follows me.

A (45:52)

Have you made up with Cash's brother and sister?

B (45:54)

Oh, yeah.

A (45:55)

That's just something that I really needed to ask you from my personality.

B (45:57)

Everyone always nags me about this one. No, not you, but the public. They always ask, like, do they still hate you? I think people forget that they were also viewers of the show. They only see 45 minutes to an hour a day of 24 hours. They're very tight knit, that family. And he is their protector. If anyone had a sibling that they saw crying on television, they would be upset at the person who caused those tears, no matter the situation. They're younger than me, they're both 20, they're twins. And I think that they were defending the person who's defended them their whole lives. And I've seen them numerous times. I've met his whole family before and no one holds a grudge because they know me in real life.

A (46:47)

It's lovely hearing you talk about that. It was really lovely seeing how close their bond was on screen and how Cash clearly is their protector. But it was also really lovely seeing your ownership and accountability and your understanding of their closeness and your respect for it. When you look back on your Love island experience prior to Cash, when you look back at the Harrison of it all. I'm sorry to bring his name.

B (47:09)

It's okay.

A (47:09)

In this lovely Voldemort.

B (47:11)

We'll call him Voldemort.

A (47:13)

Do you think that was the death rattle of your bad dating decisions?

B (47:20)

100%. Never again. But I was repeating old unhealthy patterns because I didn't know any better. I've mentioned this before as well. I kind of needed him to stay in the game.

A (47:37)

Yes.

B (47:38)

If Harrison wasn't there, I would have had nobody. Yes, I was stupid and I went back one too many times. But if I didn't go back, I would have been gone. I wouldn't have made it to the final. I wouldn't have met Cash. Harrison kept me in long enough to get me to Costa More and meet Cash.

A (47:56)

Yeah, it's that idea of fate again. Also probably quite nice that you stayed in the game and you had by the final, this control experiment of what could have been. And I think the fact that you were with Cash, who had said that he loved you the night before the final when there were no cameras, he must have just thought, oh, thank goodness.

B (48:14)

I dodged a bullet. Still to this day, I believe that viewers love a redemption arc. If all of that didn't happen, I'm not sure we would have won. Yes, it was such a good storyline for television. I wasn't doing it for that, but it made the show what it was, and it showed lessons for young girls. It showed dating patterns in modern society. Like, it showed what it is like when you are with someone who really loves you and how rewarding that is. So it's not a total failure.

A (48:52)

We dodge the bullets, and we can be grateful for them, too.

B (48:55)

Yeah.

C (48:58)

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A (49:26)

Experian.

C (49:28)

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A (49:29)

All.

C (49:29)

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B (49:30)

And I'm Poodle.

C (49:31)

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A (49:33)

We are two ridiculous homosexuals who love

C (49:36)

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A (49:48)

All.

C (49:48)

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A (49:59)

Your final failure is that sometimes you fail to be kind to yourself.

B (50:03)

I do.

A (50:05)

Oh, Tony. So. So you say here that you tend to be your own biggest critic. So do you have this constant inner hater who's.

B (50:16)

I wouldn't say hater. It would be critic. I don't hate myself, but I want to be the best at everything I do. That also ties into why I wasn't posting, because I kind of hold myself to a certain standard. If it's not something that I would want to consume as a viewer, I'm not gonna post it. Basically, our job as influencers is to sell things to people. If it's not good enough for me, I'm not gonna sell it to you in that sense. But then it's hard because hate gets to me. But chances are I already thought worse of myself. Wow. You know?

A (50:54)

Yeah, I do know. How does overnight fame affect that?

B (51:00)

I think it puts everything under a magnifying glass. I read every single comment. It doesn't matter how many there are. It's like I almost look for validation for the negative things I think about myself already.

A (51:14)

Yes.

B (51:15)

When I know things aren't true and they come at them, it's like, oh, whatever. I brush it off. But, like, if you tell me my nose is big, I've known this my whole life, you're reassuring the things I already thought about myself and it hurts. Or in the beginning, when I wasn't 100% sure that cash liked me because of my dating history, when a million people are telling you he doesn't like you, he was just with you to get to the end. This, that, and the third, it just reassures all of the negative things I already thought about myself and my relationship.

A (51:47)

For the record, you have an exquisite nose.

B (51:49)

Thank you.

A (51:50)

I've never once thought it was big ever.

B (51:53)

Thank you.

A (51:54)

Is Cash good for you in terms of handling all of that?

B (51:59)

100%. He's been on social media, working towards being a content creator, making his dance videos for years. He always tells me, don't read the comments. Don't read the comments. I don't know why I can't stop.

A (52:13)

Do you have strategies for managing it that you're introducing?

B (52:17)

I'm trying. This is all so new to me. So when I was, like, thinking of these failures, it was kind of hard for me. Cause I feel like they're all pretty recent.

A (52:28)

Yeah.

B (52:29)

I hate talking about failing.

A (52:31)

Actually, what we talk about when we talk about failure, we talk about growth and understanding ourselves and every single one of your failures. What I appreciate about them is that they reflect who you are. You're so real in what you choose to share, and that is a kind of superpower.

B (52:47)

Yeah. Like, I can't even sit here and lie to you. This last six months has probably been one of the hardest of my entire life.

A (52:54)

I'm sorry.

B (52:55)

Mentally, socially, like, I'm trying to get used to being here, but I can't just go walk outside and enjoy myself.

A (53:04)

Yes.

B (53:05)

All of the things that I used to be able to do if I was having a bad day aren't as accessible to me anymore. Whether that's even just sitting on the couch with my friends. My friends aren't here.

A (53:15)

Yeah.

B (53:17)

Or making friends is Kind of hard for me right now because I don't trust people. Yes, I trust Cash, I trust Shakira and Yasmin, but we're all busy. So I'm just trying to regain, I think, the confidence that I've lost in the last couple of months. Yeah, I say I've gained confidence in the sense that I can go out without makeup and this, that, and the third, but I'm still doing things that scare me every single day.

A (53:45)

And as you say, there's a loneliness there that you're not. Not familiar with.

B (53:49)

Correct. I've never felt this lonely, Tony. It's sad, but at the same time, I kind of do it to myself because, don't get me wrong, I could call my friends more. I don't like. I don't want to say burden them, but I don't like to sit here and say, woe is me, because there are so many amazing things going on with my life right now. And I know that all of my friends back home are still working waitressing jobs and working their asses off the same way how I was. So I don't want to brag. I don't want to sound ungrateful when I'm like, boo hoo, my life is so hard, but it is.

A (54:29)

Do you feel that it's a weakness to admit that you're nodding?

B (54:35)

Yeah, definitely. I want to act like I'm okay.

A (54:41)

Yeah.

B (54:41)

But it's been hard.

A (54:43)

You are worth a grown up love that makes you feel safe and secure. And you are worth the love that we are showing you en masse as the general public. And that probably feels so unfamiliar and difficult.

B (54:57)

It is, for sure. And I think I pour all the love that I have into other people, but sometimes I forget to give it to myself.

A (55:04)

Yes, but you are worthy of your own love, too.

B (55:07)

I know, and I'll learn that. But this is all still so fresh to me. At the same time, this is the most crucial point of my career. To position myself in a way that it's long lasting. And I'm not just known for Love Island. Like, I want my voice to be heard by the masses, not people who only watch a dating show.

A (55:27)

Preach. What do you want to do next? What is the goal?

B (55:32)

I want to take Maya Jama's job. I want you to.

A (55:36)

I mean, I love Maya Jama, but I want you to. That would be brilliant.

B (55:39)

Not even necessarily her job, but I want to go into presenting. And when I see myself in those situations, it just makes me realize how much I'm capable of how old are you? 25.

A (55:49)

You're so young and you have such a wise head on your shoulders. Like it's really. That's. Yeah. I am not surprised that you are dealing with all of these feelings at 25. Your 20s are such a cluster at the best of times, but when you go on Love island and end up winning it, I can't even imagine how amplified. So you are doing brilliantly and you are exactly where you need to be. What advice would you give to pre Love Island, Tony? There's this guy at the pool on his honeymoon and he's like, have you ever heard of Love island uk? And you agree to go on it. What advice would you give her now?

B (56:30)

I don't think there is advice that you can give anybody before going on Love Island. I think I did it the best way possible, blindly, with no expectations, no idea of what was to come. Not even what I would tell myself, but what I would tell anybody. Not just about going on Love Island. If you want to move to a new country, if you want to start a new job, do it.

A (56:54)

Final question. You were top at sales in your former job as a cabana waitress. If you had to describe yourself as a dream, as a cocktail that you served, what would it be?

B (57:07)

A Miami Vice. Because it's the best of both worlds. Half strawberry daiquiri, half pina colada, extra rum on top. Because now I'm like kind of half British, half American.

A (57:23)

Love it. And there's a little bit of mischief in there too.

B (57:25)

Yeah, that's for sure.

A (57:27)

Tony, thank you so, so much for coming on.

B (57:29)

How to Fake that felt like a good vent session.

A (57:32)

I'm so glad that's what we're here for. You were amazing.

B (57:37)

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A (58:11)

Please do follow how to fail to get new episodes as they land on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Amazon Music or wherever you get your podcasts. Please tell all your friends this is an Elizabeth Day and Sony Music Entertainment original podcast. Thank you so much for listening.