Ask HTM - Gym Edition Frugal or Cheap, Blaming the Baby for Lifestyle Upgrades, and Dipping into Savings for a Camper #1087

Summary

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How to Money – Listener Questions: Gym Edition Frugal or Cheap, Blaming the Baby for Lifestyle Upgrades, and Dipping into Savings for a Camper

Episode #1087 | January 12, 2026
Hosts: Joel & Matt
Podcast: How to Money (iHeartPodcasts)

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Episode Overview

In this “Ask HTM” episode, Joel and Matt answer listener questions about navigating tricky financial decisions, including pulling from savings for a camper, when and how to upgrade your living space after a new baby, and the ethics of staying silent on a missed gym membership price increase. The show weaves together practical advice, personal anecdotes, and thoughtful perspectives on the “money psychology” behind these decisions—all with the hosts’ trademark friendly and relatable banter.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Listener Win: House Hacking Success

• Topic: Highlighting a listener named Jordan’s journey with house hacking.
• Details:
  • Jordan wrote in to share several financial “wins” since following HTM advice: relocating to a lower-cost city, purchasing a duplex (house hacking), living with in-laws to save, and renovating a basement to create rental spaces.
  • House hacking is described as a "drastic" but effective way to reduce the highest expense in most people’s budgets: housing.
• Advice/Episodes Referenced: Listeners interested in house hacking were pointed to a previous episode with Craig Kerlop (author/expert in the space).
• Notable Quote:

  “House hacking is one of those things where you inconvenience yourself...in order to curb what is typically the highest cost in your monthly budget. And it’s just—it’s...If you are saying, I feel like I want to take some drastic measures, I want to make more progress more quickly in my personal finances, something like house hacking…” – Joel, [04:53]

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2. Should You Use a HELOC to Replenish a Drained Emergency Fund?

Listener: Katie from Menominee Falls, WI
Timestamp: [07:40–19:32]
Situation: Katie and her husband used $24,000 from their emergency fund to buy a used camper, intending to immediately replenish it by drawing on their HELOC (at 7.4% interest), but are now questioning if that’s wise.

Advice from Joel & Matt:

• Don’t use the HELOC unless it’s a true emergency.

  • The math doesn’t work: borrowing at 7.4% just to replenish savings earning 3.7% is unwise.
  • A HELOC is best reserved as a backstop for genuine emergencies, not to cover pre-emptive savings.
  • Using a HELOC puts your home at risk and can be frozen by a bank during hardship.

• Rebuild emergency savings as quickly as possible.

  • Instead of keeping status quo on spending, look for “belt-tightening” measures and temporarily cut back less-important expenses—this both increases financial margin and enhances your appreciation of the camper purchase.

• Psychology of Spending:

  • Tie short-term cutbacks to the excitement of the new camper, and get the family on board.
  • Using the HELOC as a planned extension of your emergency fund is risky and should not be a long-term solution.

• Notable Quotes:

  “The reason we want you to think of the E fund as untouchable is because a real emergency could come along. You would find yourself with a cool camper but no E Fund, and then potentially debt on top of that.” – Joel, [12:14]

  “Sometimes making those cuts…can provide that financial balance more quickly, you’re able to save up that emergency fund. But it also just...increases the appreciation that you feel for this new camper that you bought.” – Joel, [16:12]

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3. New Parents Want to Build Generational Wealth for Twins

Listener: Erin from Parkville, MD
Timestamp: [21:00–34:27]
Situation: After an expensive and emotionally taxing IVF journey, Erin and her husband (savers with a 3% mortgage and maxed-out accounts) are expecting twins. She’s overwhelmed by options for building wealth for her kids: 529s, custodial Roth IRAs, UTMAs/UGMAs, or brokerage accounts—and wonders how not to “ruin” her kids with too much help.

Advice from Joel & Matt:

• Maintain Your Financial Oxygen Mask First.
  • Make sure your financial bases are covered—retirement, emergency fund, etc.—before heavily funding accounts for your kids.
• 529 Plans Are Most Flexible and Valuable.
  • Maryland residents get a state tax deduction. Up to $10,000/year (for two kids, married filing jointly) can go in immediately.
  • New rules make 529s more appealing: can now be used for K-12 and some can be rolled into a Roth IRA for the child.
• Beware of Overdoing Generational Wealth.
  • Too much inheritance/aid can rob your kids of drive and the joy of achieving things on their own.
  • “Teaching your kids how to do and think about personal finance, that is the gift that keeps on giving.”
• Flexible Gifting Later.
  • Investing in your own brokerage account and gifting later gives you more control and lets you help when it’s most impactful (e.g. house down payment at age 30 vs. $100k at age 18).
• Memorable Analogy:

  “If you and I were playing a game of Settlers of Catan and I started off with eight victory points and you started off with zero, the game would be far less fun.” – Joel, [27:13]

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4. Is It Frugal or Cheap to Not Remind Your Gym About a Missed Price Increase?

Listener: PJ from Philly Suburbs
Timestamp: [34:38–44:09]
Situation: PJ’s gym was acquired by a larger chain, which announced a 40% rate hike—but never implemented it for “legacy” members like him. Is it frugal or cheap to just say nothing and keep paying the old rate?

Advice from Joel & Matt:

• You don’t owe them a reminder.
  • No notice of a specific price or date; possibly a perk for long-term memberships.
  • If they catch on and raise the price, that’s when you decide what to do next.
• Broader Gym Advice:
  • Calculate your “cost per use” to judge true value.
  • Free trials and proximity matter; so do contract terms and cancellation rules.
  • Know yourself: higher cost might increase usage and accountability for some, home gyms might be more realistic for others.
• Notable Quote:

  “There’s no way I would remind the gym that they’re supposed to charge me more.” – Joel, [41:40]

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5. Do You Really Need a Bigger Space After Having a Baby?

Listener: Andrew (Facebook Group)
Timestamp: [45:24–51:42]
Situation: Expecting a baby, lease on a 1BR apartment runs until Sept 2026—but wanting a 2BR by March/April. How should he negotiate with his landlord to minimize overlap/cost?

Advice:

• Many new parents don’t need to upgrade right away.
  • Babies are small, often sleep in the parents’ room for the first 6–12 months.
  • “Question what you’re bringing into your life. For sure, that has to be part of that.” – Joel, [49:09]—avoid over-accumulating baby “stuff.”
• Landlord Negotiation Tips:
  • Friendly, honest conversations go further than hardline demands.
  • If “mom and pop” landlord – more room for negotiation (sublet, tenant-finding help, reduced rent).
  • Know your lease and local laws: in many states, landlords must seek to re-tenant as soon as possible if you move out; others, not at all.
• Biggest financial risk: Doubling up on rent by moving out before you have negotiated or legally secured a way out.

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6. Should You Buy Gold, Nvidia, Bitcoin, or Ethereum as “Fun” Investments?

Listener: Anonymous (FB group)
Timestamp: [51:42–55:09]

Advice:

• Short answer: Not necessary.
• But: If you feel the “itch” to experiment, limit “risky” or speculative investments to 5% of your portfolio.
  • “The reason we say that…if it allows you to stay the course with the rest of your investments, I’m fine—we’re fine—…but just don’t let it get any bigger than that.” —Matt, [53:35]
• Index funds already include many of the biggest names (e.g., Nvidia), so doubling down is a conscious risk.
• Segregate your ‘fun’ money from core investments to avoid temptation.
• Rebalance yearly if your “fun money” outperforms and grows beyond 5%.

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Notable Quotes & Moments

On House Hacking:

“If you want to move the needle in a significant way…those are the kind of drastic moves that you take.” – Matt, [05:06]

On Helping Kids Too Much Financially:

“Inherited wealth is a handicap to happiness…as much of a death to ambition as cocaine is to morality.” —Matt, paraphrasing Willie Vanderbilt, [26:33]

On Gym Membership Value:

“I think the most important thing that is worth knowing is yourself. Know yourself. Know what it is about the routine that’s gonna help you to stick with it.” – Matt, [39:04]

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Timestamps for Major Segments

• House Hacking Listener Email: [03:05–06:47]
• Replenishing Emergency Fund After Camper Purchase: [07:40–19:32]
• Building Generational Wealth for Newborn Twins: [21:00–34:27]
• Gym Membership Frugal or Cheap?: [34:38–44:09]
• Baby on the Way, Lease Dilemma: [45:24–51:42]
• Investing in Gold, Nvidia, Crypto: [51:42–55:09]

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Episode Tone & Vibe

Friendly, supportive, practical, with plenty of dad jokes, self-deprecation, and story-sharing. The hosts focus both on numbers and the “psychology” of money, emphasizing intentionality, thoughtful tradeoffs, and living a “rich life” that works for each listener’s values and situation.

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[Summary by an expert podcast summarizer with a focus on clarity, comprehensiveness, and preserving the spirit of the episode.]

Transcript

[Podcast Announcer]

This is an iHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human. Run a business and not thinking about podcasting. Think again. More Americans listen to podcasts than ad supported streaming music from Spotify and Pandora. And as the number one podcaster, iHeart's twice as large as the next two combined. Learn how podcasting can help your business. Call 844-844-IHeart.

[Joel]

Welcome to how to Money. I'm Joel.

[Matt]

I'm Matt.

[Joel]

Today we're answering your listener questions.

[Matt]

You know what, buddy? And it was very nice last week to have like a little special kick off the 2026 episode. We should have chosen Word of the year. I was over at your house the other day and you're like, 2026, it's the year of rum.

[Joel]

I'm making rum cocktails this year. I read a book about rum.

[Matt]

I don't know how many times you said that while Kate narrowed so many. Yeah, it was funny.

[Joel]

This is your rum baby.

[Matt]

And I enjoyed the rum cocktail that you made for us, which is a highly underrated cocktail, by the way. Rum cocktails anytime. I've had a good rum cocktail.

[Joel]

If people are interested in kind of like a history of the Americas through the eye of ten different rum cocktails. It's written by a journalist who wrote for the Wall Street Journal called and a Bottle of Rum. And I just finished it and this on a rum kick right now.

[Matt]

Such a great name for a book.

[Joel]

Yeah, I love it. Yeah. So it's like fascinating from the actual liquid alcohol perspective, but it's also fascinating just from like a history of the Americas. Yeah.

[Matt]

So I'm totally going to pick that up.

[Joel]

Highly recommend.

[Matt]

The reason I mentioned that. Wait, what did I say theme last week? Yeah, we kind of. It was like a kicking off 2026 episode. I'm so glad to get back to listener questions. We're going to hear from a listener who's got a frugal or cheap sort of dilemma. Gym edition.

[Joel]

Frugal or cheap.

[Matt]

With it being the beginning of the.

[Joel]

Year, a lot of people have that question going on right now.

[Matt]

Looking forward to that. And their couple is. They're looking to move to a bigger place. They're kind of blaming it on the baby. So we'll get to the bottom of that one. And another couple or family, they bought a camper, however, like a camper van, like an rv, but they dipped into their savings. And so what to do about that? We'll get to those questions. Plus more. Speaking of rv, this has been an ongoing. Not a joke, but. But our kids were like What's RV stand for? They saw it somewhere. Oh, you know what it was? We saw one on the side of the road over the holidays that had, like, caught on fire.

[Joel]

Oh, gosh.

[Matt]

I think everyone was fine, but I was like, oh, yeah. We kept saying rv, rv. They're like, what's RV stand for? I'm like, I'm not gonna tell you. They don't know. They're making all these guesses. But I was talking with Kate later. Do they not know the word recreation or recreational? So we're giving them hints, but I literally. They still don't know. So it's kind of like an ongoing game that we play while we're in the car. All right. Because that's when they think of it.

[Joel]

I like it. I like it. Yeah.

[Matt]

Okay.

[Joel]

Speaking well. So you could live in an rv. Let's talk about real quick. A listener wrote in. We got a bunch of listener emails over the break and try and respond to all of them. Might be slightly delayed in that, but we're working on it. But we got one.

[Matt]

We're all caught up now.

[Joel]

There's.

[Matt]

There's that nice two week delay for the most part where we took a little break.

[Joel]

Yeah. And, well, so listener Jordan reached out and he was like, man, I've been meaning to write for a bunch, a bunch of years now.

[Matt]

So the guy that, who said that, I've had a draft of this in my inbox, but I haven't hit seven.

[Joel]

Yes.

[Matt]

Because he's just building up the wins, basically.

[Joel]

Most def. And so it was just. I love hearing from listeners where they're like, hey, I've been taking, you know, took this or this piece of advice I've implemented in my life and it's changed a lot of things. And they moved to a cheaper cost of living city was Jordan first of all, too. He.

[Matt]

He started listening back in 2018 like he was fresh out of high school. And it's just hard to believe that we've been doing it since 2018.

[Joel]

It really is.

[Matt]

It's kind of, kind of mind blowing.

[Joel]

Closer to a decade than not at this point. But yeah.

[Matt]

Yeah, he just started implementing a whole lot of stuff that we talked about on the show.

[Joel]

Cheaper cost of living city. I'm going to buy a house, but I'm going to buy a duplex instead of a single family house that's super plush and nice for me. I'm going to reduce my cost of living by doing that. He had a bunch of wins listed in there, but I thought the house hacking Thing was worth pointing out at this time of year especially, he said, it's got a basement and I'm going to renovate that and turn it into essentially a triplex, rent that out another space as well and essentially eliminate my housing cost. And we have episodes you can go back and check out on house hacking. We did one with Craig Kerlop back in the day that was. He kind of wrote the book on it, basically. And house hacking is one of those things where you inconvenience yourself sometimes significantly in order to curb what is typically the highest cost in your monthly line item budget. And it's just, it's. If you are saying, I feel like I want to take some drastic measures, I want to make more progress more quickly in my personal finances. Something like house hacking, buying a duplex when most people don't do that, living in one part of it. Craig was like living in the living room, man. And written stuff out by the room.

[Matt]

Craig, you're up. Yeah. He mentioned how he like stuck up a curtain in the living room and he's just like, I'm happy to take the. The living room with no privacy and all of you guys can get the actual bedrooms.

[Joel]

And everyone else was like, craig, put your pants on. You know, like, it's a little awkward.

[Matt]

Well, so what's fascinating with Jordan is. Yeah, he mentioned just a whole lot of stuff that he did, but his biggest wins came from this expense that is the largest expense for most of us. And like, I think the first thing he mentioned too was when it comes to housing was his ability to. They lived with his in laws while they saved up a ton of money. So like, if you want to move the needle in a significant way. Yeah, you consider those things and you glossed over it pretty quickly. But the. So he lived with the in laws, but then they moved from a very high cost of living area to a very affordable area where they did have the ability to purchase not only a home, but the duplex. But those are the kind of drastic moves that you take. And it helps too that he's. He's pretty handy and so he's. A lot of sweat equity went into that home and he finished it, finished out the other side himself has that rented out and now, yeah, finishing out the. The basement, which he also mentioned maybe even taking the foot off the pedal a little bit because there have. Jordan, we haven't heard from you. Maybe you actually had that baby. So they were expecting a baby. They sent their Christmas card and had. What do you call it? Ultrasound on there. And so maybe I hope mama and the baby are all doing well. But he mentioned his family even be able to come and utilize that space right after they've had the baby. So the ability to have other options, like, how great is that? And then, you know what, six months in, guess what, folks don't need to be here all the time. Baby's sleeping through the night. Let's get that place rented.

[Joel]

Yeah.

[Matt]

Start pulling in more. More of that house hacking might even.

[Joel]

Because he lives, you know, right there, Airbnb that John can increase the monthly. Your ability to make money from that every month.

[Matt]

So, yeah, great little side gig for if for his wife. Yeah. So many great things. We love hearing listener wins like that.

[Joel]

When I saw that email fuels us. Gosh, we have not talked about house hacking in a long time. It's been a minute. We should bring it up based on Jordan's example of what he's been able to accomplish. So, yep, big ups to you, Jordan. All right, let's get on to listener questions, Matt. Or listen, let's mention the beer we're having, too.

[Matt]

Yeah.

[Joel]

Dolce Morte.

[Matt]

Oh, my gosh.

[Joel]

Imperial Stout.

[Matt]

This is a beer by Incendiary. And I'll share all about this as well as that brewery here at the end of the episode. But very, very excited for this beer.

[Joel]

Yeah, this is a good one. Understatement. And okay, we're going to get to your money questions now. If you have a money question, we'd love to hear from you and take it on the show, hopefully even next week. Just go to howtomoney.com ask for instructions, or literally, just record a voice memo on the app on your phone and email it over to us. Matt, let's get to a question. This one is specifically about a big purchase, how to replenish savings after the fact.

[Katie / Erin (Listener Callers)]

Hey, Matt and Joel, this is Katie from Menominee Falls, Wisconsin. Matt, I encourage you to look up Menominee Falls. It is near Milwaukee and a great town to raise a family in. My question is a bit of a money psychology question. My husband and I had been interested in purchasing a camper for a while for our family. And even though we didn't yet have enough cash saved up, we jumped on a used one that came on the market in order to save about $13,000 versus buying a new one. During the purchase process, we pulled $24,000 from our emergency fund with the intention of replenishing it immediately via a withdrawal from our heloc. But now my brain just can't seem to accept the fact that I'd be paying 7.4% interest on the loan from our HELOC just to put the money into a savings account earning about 3.7%. I'm debating now just replenishing the emergency fund as fast as we can and only using the heloc. If we have a true emergency that our emergency fund can't support, we anticipate being able to replenish the emergency fund in two years or less. So between these two options, which one would you choose? Thank you so much.

[Joel]

Bye, Matt. You moving to Wisconsin?

[Matt]

Before we get to your question, Katie.

[Joel]

Let'S address your stalker tendencies.

[Matt]

She said so I actually did look it up. It's Menominee Falls. I guess that's how you say it. She said it pretty quickly. So I'm like, I don't even know what to search because it's not a normal, normal town name. And I can't but think of Manomina from, like, the Muppets. Yeah, but it looks like a beautiful place. Yeah.

[Joel]

Right there.

[Matt]

There's like a waterfall, I guess, at the center of town.

[Joel]

It's real pretty. If you're new to this beautiful park, what you're getting at is that Matt. When people reach out with their emails and questions and they note where they're from, Matt likes to look up those towns and just, like, scour around and see what's going on.

[Matt]

Do feel like it helps me to get to know them a little bit. Like, when you understand context, you kind of. It just. I don't know, it adds more color a little bit, and it just helps me to sort of understand some of the background.

[Joel]

Yeah.

[Matt]

Which I don't know. That's fun to me.

[Joel]

It's really easy to assume that everybody lives in a town or a place that kind of looks like yours and they don't. Like, this world is, like, super geographically varied.

[Matt]

There's a lot of stuff out there. Honestly, it fuels me. It makes me want to, like, go see all these different places out there out there in the world.

[Joel]

Temenominy Falls.

[Matt]

I'm not sure if I'll end up there, but it does look like a wonderful place to raise a family. Love it. But I love that. Katie said, though, this is a site like a money psychology kind of question, you know, like, it's less maybe for her about the numbers and the interest rates and more about how should I be thinking about replenishing these funds, which.

[Joel]

I totally appreciate why I love that she said they opted for a used camper. I Mean, oh, yeah, that's really important because the discrepancy between used and new in that market in particular can be significant. Talking about like a used versus a new house, you know, like, there's a whole lot less of a monetary difference than there is between a used and a new car. And it's even more extreme in the camper market. And you know, we love that you had the money on hand. Even if it was E fund money, like, we, we wouldn't want to see you go into debt for the purchase of a camper, for the purchase of something that's like, hey, this is just a, an rv, a recreational vehicle, which I'm going to teach your kids to say at some point, Matt, don't tell.

[Matt]

Them you're going to ruin all the fun.

[Joel]

Okay. And so especially with rates where they are these days, think about what you'd be financing that at. It wouldn't be fun. Financing depreciating assets is just such a slippery slope and it trips up so many folks. It prevents them from making meaningful money progress for so many years. That's truly what we want. How do money listeners to avoid.

[Matt]

Yeah, and at the risk of just sounding annoying, I would rather see you save additional money for purchases like that in the future. And it's not just that I don't want you to go into debt. I just don't want to see you without this well funded, fully stocked emergency fund for just the downside protection of what life just happens to throw at you. So, like, I understand that a killer deal is hard to resist, Joel. Does that resonate maybe a little bit more with you or just like, oh, I gotta pounce.

[Joel]

Yeah. You make fun of me for how I talk about, like. Cause like, truly, like, how much I pay for something influences how much I enjoy it.

[Matt]

Yeah, well, it's an important.

[Joel]

I don't think everyone feels that way for sure.

[Matt]

But when it's a very expensive purchase like that, it makes it a bit, a bit tougher to pull off. And in her case, it's a want. Right. It's not something that's completely necessary. That being said, you got it. It's, you know, past is in the past. So I hope you have great memories, you got some awesome trips with it, but I would just hate to see you financially exposed in the coming months or even years in a, in a more serious kind of way.

[Joel]

Yes. Because like, what you're getting at is like a job loss or an unexpected medical bill that hits harder when your E fund is dry. You could sell the camper. But you might not get back what you paid. I mean, you might actually, if you got a really sick deal. That's the nice thing about that market. Maybe you were like, I was waiting and waiting and waiting and this was like really undervalued. So I feel like we got a solid deal. We could list it, take better pictures and make money on that. That's cool. But the reason we want you to think of the E fund as untouchable is because a real emergency could come along. You would find yourself with a cool camper but no E Fund, and then potentially debt on top of that. It's a far cry from where you were pre purchase. Sure. And so yes, the HELOC is your new extended emergency fund for the time being. Although tapping it comes with real risks because unlike other forms of debt, you're putting your home at risk when you take out HELOC money. So it's not just the higher interest rate that makes this a less exciting choice. And the truth is, at times it's like a bank could even freeze or cut you off from access to that he lock, which is important to note. You might think, oh, the trusty old heloc. It's always there and chances are it's.

[Matt]

Probably going to be there, but not always.

[Joel]

But it might not be.

[Matt]

Yeah. Well, you specifically mentioned in like a time of hardship, right? Financial hardship. And that's what the banks pay attention to, right? Like if you lose your job, if your salary gets cut in a significant way, if you see your, you know, maybe you're taking on more debt, so your credit score tanks. Banks pay attention to stuff like that. And there's a chance that they could completely cap you. And this thing that you were going to count on when you were going to experience this financial hardship now becomes this thing that is no longer accessible to you. And it's just salt in the wound as opposed to it being something that shows up in a time of need for you. And so that's the downside of fully, you know, you might be like, oh, I can handle the risk, guys. I'm really comfortable with living on the edge. It's like, well, think through this as well. There's other factors there. In addition to the fact that HELOC rates aren't all that great right now. They're pretty high. We've heard from, there's been how many listeners, they've seen the rates tick up pretty significantly and you know, they've been hoping that they would come back down with the Fed cutting rates but it hasn't happened. It's just tough to think about pulling in money that you'd be paying over 7% on, sticking it in your savings account.

[Joel]

Probably closer to eight, Right?

[Matt]

Yeah. Earning significantly less. That's not a great financial move. And so, you know. Yeah, the way that HELOCs work, there's actually no need to do this. You can tap it when the need arises. You don't have to basically pre tap it and stick that money in the bank. You can look to it, you know, when, when the time, when the need arises. And so at this point in the process, I'm with you. I would just save up, like replenish that emergency fund as quickly as possible. Avoid touching the HELOC unless you absolutely have to. You know, fingers crossed that you never encounter a situation where you do need to tap it.

[Joel]

Yeah.

[Matt]

Sounds like you haven't made other financial moves that would also kind of put you in a more precarious position. It seems like this was maybe the one thing I don't hear a whole lot of other expenses where you're paying, making payments on. So that's what I would do. I would just focus on rebuilding that emergency fund.

[Joel]

You could even like tighten the belt in other areas and say, hey, this was our craft beer equivalent. We splurged on the camper. So you know what, for the next three to six months, we're going to tighten our belt when it comes to eating out or another line item in your budget just to make sure that you can replenish that emergency fund a little bit more quickly than you otherwise would. Just living your life with your normal expenses. And you know, even though you're not going to be able to save up the full amount. Right. That you took out for two years, which is what you mentioned in your question. As long as you have a basic emergency fund accessible to you and the HELOC as a backstop, you're probably going to be able to save enough in six months or so where you're not going to be worried about having to tap the HELOC at all. That's true. Have to replenish all the way to make the HELOC essentially unnecessary, even though you'll still have access.

[Matt]

Yeah. You start feeling more and more comfortable with how much money you've got on hand as you build that up.

[Joel]

And I just love the idea. Matt, I don't know how you feel about this, but just for a short time being saying, listen, not bare bones, budget, not all the way, not cutting everything out of your Life. But saying, we just spent a big chunk of money on something that we care about a lot. Let's cut back in some other areas that we care less about so that our. We're not, like, living on a razor's edge for the next three months, six months or longer. Yeah, I just. I just think sometimes making those cuts and it can provide that financial balance more quickly, you're able to save up that emergency fund. But it also just. I think there's something mentally talking about the behavioral side of this to say, actually we're spending lavishly in this one area, but we're cutting back in some of these other areas to make sure that we can actually make. Make it work for us. And I think it can actually almost like, increase the appreciation that you feel for this new camper that you bought.

[Matt]

Totally. Yeah. Yeah, that's. I think that's the money psychology part of it. And what you're addressing here is shifting the focus from replenishing the emergency fund, which is this very conceptual feelings. Not. It's not feelings based. But it's hard to explain to your family that, like, hey, we're just trying to replenish. Replenish our emergency funds so that we have more financial margin.

[Joel]

That's why you can't play soccer in the spring, son.

[Matt]

Less stress. Well, that's super conceptual and very invisible, as opposed to linking it directly to the camper and say. And even. Let's just say, hey, the reason we're doing this is because we want to pay off the camper, and we know that you didn't take out a loan for this camper. But just saying that, saying, hey, we're going to pay off the camper just anchors it to this really tangible, really concrete purchase that almost feels like you are willing to sacrifice and cut back because of this thing that we now have in your life. And I think that's what you're getting at is anchoring it to this very fun thing, get the whole family on board. All of a sudden, everyone knows that, like, this is what we're doing. Like, the family is. They're lined up behind you for 20, 26. This is the focus and why it is that you're. You're cutting back. I think it could just even be fun, you know, I think it feels.

[Joel]

Easier to do if you're talking about a future purchase where you're like, hey, guys, we're all going to cut back.

[Matt]

You don't have it yet, so we.

[Joel]

Can pay for that vacation. And we're all excited about Going to Hawaii or whatever it is. But I think now that you already have it. But you can still do that. I think you can still do that, still create that atmosphere and just find a way to create the like mental excitement in your family to replenish that e fund. Even though, hey, you've already spent the money. I think there's still a way to kind of galvanize the troops. Yeah, galvanize the troops. And remember what's true about, like, what you're striving after, which is to make sure that you're not putting your family financially at risk even though you just made an awesome new fun, big purchase.

[Matt]

Totally. And I think there's even a chance too that as you make some of these sacrifices, it just puts you in a position of questioning some of your expenses and you might even realize, wait a minute, we cut that from our life completely and we don't even really miss it. And oh my gosh, look how much money we were able to save up. What else could we work towards proactively instead of reactively? Sort of like you're saying. I think there's just, I don't know, there's like a new level of intensity that you might be able to unlock as a family as you are pursuing some of these other goals that you.

[Joel]

Might have for yourselves. Experiments and frugality. Yep. They're like worth attempting not just for the sake of saving money, but just kind of like, yeah, well, what can our family get by with? Are we still just as happy? Do we, do we actually need that thing? It's those experiments are always worth running.

[Matt]

That's right. All right, Joe, we got more to get to, including that question about what to do about the gym membership that babies and alternative investments. We'll get to all that more right after this.

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[Joel]

All right, we're back. We got more money questions to get to from how to money, folks, this next question comes from a listener who just had a couple babies.

[Podcast Announcer]

Hi, Matt and Joel.

[Katie / Erin (Listener Callers)]

This is Erin from Parkville, Maryland. I've included my full address in the email because I know that Matt likes to do his Google map thing. Before I get into my question, I just wanted to give you a little bit of background. My husband and I are in money gear 7. We are diligent savers. Everything that can be maxed out is maxed out, plus some additional savings in a brokerage account each month. And the only debt we carry is a sub 3% home mortgage. So now onto my question. After a very long journey with ivf, my husband and I have recently found out that we are pregnant with twins. And we are obviously very excited, but also a little bit overwhelmed. In all my research up to this point, I've learned about all the accounts that you could start for a child of 529 custodial Roth, Ira and Utma and Ugma. And I've really been diving deep into personal finance the last couple of years. So I know what all of these are, but only kind of from the book perspective. And now that it's really time to get thinking about it, I'm not really sure where to start and what to prioritize and what to do. I was even thinking that we could start a brokerage account for each kid and kind of gift them money through their 20s and 30s and 40s when they're hitting those big life milestones. But you did an episode a couple months back, kind of advising against that and really helping your children to develop their own thoughts behind money and how to manage it. And I guess I'm just a little overwhelmed. I know what all of these accounts are. I know what they do, but we don't know where to start. So any help would be appreciated.

[Matt]

Thanks, Joel. Aaron, totally got the memo.

[Joel]

Tell us more about the street view of Erin's house.

[Matt]

Matt. She's doing it, right? Of course I looked it up. Because if she's going to be that blatant about it.

[Joel]

We know you did. All right.

[Matt]

What'd you Find great townhome, the nice park at the end of the street that I'm guessing they're going to probably walk to, and the babies are going to play it.

[Joel]

You'll see Matt there this afternoon.

[Matt]

Aaron at the park, still nice and close to the interstate. I'm like, oh, yeah, like, you can take a whole lot of different jobs, right? Like, because when you're buried in some sort of suburb, that's something you got to consider. I was talking to a friend over the bridge.

[Joel]

The interstate matters.

[Matt]

Yeah. They live out in, like, what we call the county. You know, we always joke about that, but he's just like, you don't understand. It takes us 40 minutes even to get to the interstate. And I'm just like, holy cow. It makes me realize how proximity to interstate and being able to travel quickly, that's important stuff. These are all things you got to take into account.

[Joel]

You don't want to live, like, under an interstate. Overp. Necessarily. But being close to the interstate is nice.

[Matt]

Yeah. We're not literal trolls, but, Aaron, I thought that was quite hilarious that you literally shared your home address. Our listeners know, and I will not share it with anyone else.

[Joel]

Keep it secret. Oh, man. Matt, you what? What would these skills that you have. Like, what sleuthing skills?

[Matt]

Private. Private detective.

[Joel]

Yeah, I guess that's what I was going to say. Like, in the post podcast era, what will you do with those?

[Matt]

The, I don't know, street view, satellite view, looking at terrain, giving it a spin. I like doing all that.

[Joel]

It's fun.

[Matt]

It's fun to explore.

[Joel]

All right, let's go on to Aaron's question. Aaron, we're super pumped for you and your growing family. And IVF obviously can be expensive, and it can be just like this emotionally taxing endeavor, too. Matt, we had friends gone through the process, and they're worried about the finances of it, of course, and just, like, the hopes that they have of growing their family and, like, hey, is the money that we're spending, is it going to lead to that result?

[Matt]

Plus just all that. I mean, not to get too personal, but, like, you're getting shots in your butts for, like, different. I mean, there's a whole lot that goes into IVF that I wasn't aware of until talking with close friends who are just like, yeah, it's. It's pretty intense.

[Joel]

Yeah. Yeah. And, like, so glad it worked for. For Aaron and her husband and just like, you know, maxing everything. And a 3% mortgage, by the way. Oh, yeah. It sounds like they're in a great financial position. They're on the right path. They've got a bunch of knowledge as well. But making the right decision here in this question is going to take more than just knowledge, I think. Right. Like smarts, it's going to take wisdom. I think those are two different things. Right. Like you can have the knowledge of what these accounts do and stuff, but like sometimes like the allocation and how you proceed comes down to a lot more than just knowing contribution limits and whether or not you qualify for those accounts.

[Matt]

Yeah. Knowing which accounts you want to pursue. Knowing which accounts that you want to prioritize for you and your family. Right. Just because they're there doesn't mean you automatically do all of these. Like, these are things that you consider doing. And certainly retirement accounts. I think we all, we want everyone to take advantage of those. But how much you want to take advantage of these accounts and how much of your disposable income that you have now to go towards the future, that's the wisdom part, I think. And that's where it just takes you as an individual figuring out like, how do we strike that balance? But what she's referring to basically though is generational wealth.

[Joel]

Right.

[Matt]

And part of the reason I'm less interested in that is because it just simply takes the fun out of life.

[Joel]

Right.

[Matt]

Like it's not that you can't be helpful where you're going to use your own savings to you to help pay for your kids first car, maybe saving some for their eventual college needs. I just think that trying to build wealth completely for them for their retirement specifically isn't always in their best interest. A larger inheritance can reduce that motivation. Makes me think of the Willie Vanderbilt fortune's children where he talks about inherited wealth. It's as much of a death to motivation as cocaine to happy or. No, I'm totally botching it. No, he says that inherited wealth is a handicap to happiness specifically.

[Joel]

That's what it is.

[Matt]

And that inherited wealth is, you're gonna.

[Joel]

Go somewhere with cocaine, but it's as.

[Matt]

Much of a death to ambition as cocaine is to morality. Basically a complete. And this is somebody that inherited a large sum of money and did fairly well, but even still recognized the downsides of just of granted. This was, you know, the richest person basically probably in the world at the time. But even still on a micro scale, we are also, we have the potential of doing that to our own kids and like I mentioned too, just taking the fun out of it. Like, why do we even play board games? Right? Oh, because there's ups, there's downs, you get to learn, there's strategy involved. Like there's fun and you get to enjoy the process.

[Joel]

If you and I were playing a game of settlers of 10 and I started off with eight victory points and you started off with zero, the game would be far less fun.

[Matt]

Yeah.

[Joel]

Far less interesting.

[Matt]

And I specifically thinking about it in like this, the situation with like our kids. What if we sat down with our kids and we're like, okay, we're gonna play this new game and we just.

[Joel]

Start off and we.

[Matt]

By giving them all the money. Yeah. Monopoly or. Yeah. They've got nine out of 10 victory points. Or for playing Acquired, they've got all the corporations. And initially what are they gonna think? They're like, this is the best game ever.

[Joel]

Yeah.

[Matt]

What are they also gonna say two seconds later? This is boring.

[Joel]

Yeah.

[Matt]

Because you're not playing the game. Like that is like the, the learning and the experiential, the living it out. Like that is the part that makes it interesting. And that's why we're, we're not down completely down on generational wealth. But you got to be really careful in how it is that you, I guess, allocate.

[Joel]

Yeah.

[Matt]

And pass that along to future generations.

[Joel]

It makes me think, I don't know why we had this discussion. I don't know how it got brought up over Christmas break, but my father in law was in town and I was just talking about paying for my own car, working a minimum wage job in high school, saving up. We were just talking about the benefits, the pros and cons essentially of kids working in high school. And I was just like, man, I think one, having that job was so good for me on multiple levels. But then on top of that, buying my own car with money that I had saved, earned and saved was just so huge for me. And it was not a very nice car. Like, it was old and raggedy. It got me where I needed to go. And there's just something, I think at the time I was really jealous of my classmates whose parents bought him a car. It was much nicer than the one I was driving. But I earned that thing, man. And the pride I felt in having done that for myself was huge. Yeah. Nobody can take that away from you.

[Matt]

So all that you learned in that process, you learned not only. I mean, it's just everything. It's everything. How you respond to your employer, how you show up for work, how much of that money that you're earning that you're setting aside for future Purchase versus blowing it. All of that goes like, these are all life lessons that are going to propel them to be able to make even smarter decisions off in their future.

[Joel]

And I think there's ways to help without hurting. Right where, oh, maybe you're matching the money that they have saved to help them buy a nicer vehicle.

[Matt]

I love that idea.

[Joel]

The kind that I was able to buy. Right. That's cool. Because they're still. They've got skin in the game. They're still doing something, I think. Yeah. Teaching your kids how to do and think about personal finance, that is the gift that keeps on giving. That's what you don't want to forget in the process.

[Matt]

And also teach them how to play the game as opposed to playing it for them.

[Joel]

It's also possible to put your own finances at risk. Matt, what you alluded to, right. Like so many folks opening up 529 accounts while they're barely getting the 401k match at work or they don't have enough of an emergency fund built up, this goal is a lower priority than those other goals. It should just be down further down on the list. So saving for your offspring, it really only makes sense if you put the oxygen mask on your own face in the first place. And like some people might say, well, but these are my children. I have to love and care for them. Yes, but like, loving and caring for them also means caring for yourself. You have to do that. Well, at the same time. And it sounds like you do have your oxygen mask on, though, Aaron. And so if saving money for your twins is a high priority and you're well taken care of on the personal front, I think this is something you can explore and move into.

[Matt]

Yep. Yeah, totally. So to the heart of your question, what to prioritize. And we gotta start with 529s because they've gotten so much better over the years. You live in Maryland, which, you know, we'll share that much. I guess she said that at the beginning of your question. Where specifically in Maryland? Not gonna tell.

[Joel]

Matt's lips are sealed.

[Matt]

But that means you get a state tax deduction for putting money aside in your state's 529 plan. And if you are married, filing jointly, you can put $5,000 in per beneficiary per year. So that's 10,000 bucks right there, right out of the gate that you can sock away for their future. And I will say some of the options are a bit more expensive than I would like to see. That being said, if you Just go with a plain vanilla S&P 500. The costs there are low enough, and that plus the tax credit, you're going to be in a great position.

[Joel]

Matt, you mentioned your kids will be in a great position eventually, right? You mentioned how 529 planes have gotten better. Some people might be saying, well, yeah, but I don't, I don't know if my kids are going to go to college. So it feels like the wrong account.

[Matt]

Because that big unknowns.

[Joel]

If they don't, what happens? Right. Well, the cool thing is you can also use $529 for K12 education. If you're like, I don't know, maybe at some point my kids might go to a private school or something like that before they go off to college. Well, that's another good use of those funds. Additionally, you can turn a decent chunk $35,000 of the money that you've saved in that 529 plan into a Roth IRA down the road for their future. So maybe you're kind of splitting the difference kind of in what we were talking about helping your kids save for their future, but you're not, like, doing it for them. That flexibility, though, along with the tax break, makes this our favorite account for the vast majority of folks. Don't forget about the recent Trump accounts. You could snag a free thousand dollars for each child. Oh, yeah, in those.

[Matt]

Yeah, I didn't. Haven't thought about that. With twins paying off, kind of.

[Joel]

I bet Octomom wishes she had waited, you know, because that's like eight grand right there, but it's just totally out of the gate. It's this totally separate account. The only problem with those accounts, Matt, I think people are going to be tempted to put extra money into those accounts. And the truth is they're. They're better accounts for saving. Take the free grand, but don't put more money into those.

[Matt]

Yeah, yeah, I would not load up on those. I would rather see you stock more money away, let's say in your own name, just inside of a simple tax advantage retirement account or even your own brokerage account. And like this is if you want to set aside more money for your kids. Like, you could opt for an atma, but again, I just think it's the wrong priority. There are other potential downsides, and you don't want to underestimate, too, just how much more life might cost. Having two additional mouths to feed and having other things that you want to do as a family. There's maybe not a whole lot of that in the first couple of years, but pretty soon, man, those kids are gonna be, like, running around. You're gonna want to pour into them again, not from a financial standpoint, but in a life experience standpoint. And some of the lessons that they're gonna learn while they are under your roof, that is irreplaceable time. Whereas they can always earn. Go off and earn money.

[Joel]

The cool thing, too, about building up that money in your name inside of a taxable brokerage account is you can gift money to them down the road. At times, it might feel better and more age appropriate. So instead of like, hey, guess what? Of, you've got 100,000, you're 18, and you've got $100,000 saved for your future. You can say, oh, actually, you're 32. You're about to buy your first house. Let me help you with that down payment. And at that point, like, the cake is baked, right? Like your. Your child has turned to an adult human with a fully. Whose brain is fully formed. And you're like, all right, I think they're on the right track. Let me maybe help them with some of their financial endeavors instead of, like, doing it for them. I think maybe that's just a better way. It gives you kind of more control over your finances and how and when you give that money away. And there's just also no real tax liability for you giving that money away down the road either, because of that high gift tax exclusion.

[Matt]

That's right, Joe. Let's hear from our next listener. This is a fitness question. No, he doesn't want to know your daily fitness routine. This is more of a frugal or cheap. Let's hear it.

[PJ (Listener Caller)]

Hey, Matt and Joel. This is PJ from the Philly suburbs. Love the show, and thanks for the awesome community you've built. So I've got a frugal or cheap question that I thought could align well with timing and gym membership season. Like you guys, I'm pretty dedicated to exercise. I go to the gym almost every day, and it's really a key part of my day. My gym is a bit pricier than some big national chains, but I've actually used your advice to break it down per use or visit. And honestly, I'm probably paying less per use than people at cheaper gyms who barely go. So about a year and a half ago, my gym was sold to a larger regional chain. And one of the first announcements they made, shocker. Was a big rate increase. Base level members were looking at something close to a 40% increase, and the Email said that charter and legacy members would be contacted individually about special pricing plans. Well, three months went by, no call, no increase. Another three months, still nothing. And eventually I forgot about it entirely until recently. So here's the dilemma. I consider myself an honest person, but I also feel like it's not exactly my job to reach out and remind them about this potential 40% rate hike. So I wanted to get your thoughts, frugal or cheap, to just keep paying my current rate and let it ride. Thanks so much, guys, and love the show.

[Joel]

Don't worry, pj. I reached out to your gym on your behalf to let them know that you should be paying 40% more.

[Matt]

Yeah, a higher bill is on its way. Thanks a lot, Joel.

[Joel]

Yeah, and TJ's gonna. Or PJ's gonna mail me some. Some hate mail, I think now. Yeah. Just kidding, pj. I wouldn't do that. I wouldn't ratchet out like that. And Matt, this is an awesome question this time of year, because gyms are like, everybody's thinking about gyms.

[Matt]

I was like, PJ's question moved to the top of the list when this one showed up. Yes.

[Joel]

I was like, I don't usually wish.

[Matt]

We could have taken it last week.

[Joel]

Honestly, I don't usually watch football, but I told you, my father in law was in town, so football was on tv. And I was shocked at the number of gym commercials.

[Matt]

No way.

[Joel]

Yes. Like Planet Fitness this and that. And I was like, oh, it just totally makes sense. New Year's Eve, New Year's Day. That's when most people sit around eating.

[Matt]

Wings and you're, like, eating and drinking.

[Joel]

I feel like a slob.

[Matt]

You feel terrible about yourself.

[Joel]

I got to do something. All right, I'll sign up for the membership.

[Matt]

That makes all the sense in the world.

[Joel]

Yeah.

[Matt]

That is your target audience. Somebody who wants to change their ways while they're in the midst of their former ways.

[Joel]

Well, let's talk about gems for just a second before we get to, like, the specifics of PJ's question. Like, they can be a worthwhile expense. Right. If you use it. Matt, we talked about how you were spending a ton on a gym membership before you built out your own home gym.

[Matt]

Oh, yeah.

[Joel]

And it wasn't wasted money like, you were glad to spend that money. It was.

[Matt]

I loved it.

[Joel]

Yeah. It was a line item in your budget that you were happy about. And that is true for a lot of people. Right. Right now, there are lots of deals being offered, but let's just say for a lot of people. The best deal might be like a free trial membership. Like give it a go, check it out for seven days. I like it. Go with a friend to their gym. If before committing, like Matt, we're members for a little while, usually just during a couple of winter months at a local rock climbing gym. And we've got like free guest passes. So if a friend wants to come with me, come on, I'll let you check it out before you like buy the merchandise. And like, you know, having a friend could be the ticket also to sticking with your workout goals.

[Matt]

Accountability, baby. Yeah, man.

[Joel]

At least in my opinion. Also, proximity is super helpful. Like if the gym is 30 minutes away, how, how likely are you actually going to be to go?

[Matt]

Yet another check in the box of the home garage gym? Yeah, it is so close.

[Joel]

Same with running. I literally walk out my front door and I just go, he's already running. Look at him.

[Matt]

How do you left his driveway.

[Joel]

It doesn't take long to get started.

[Matt]

I guess. While we're talking about gems, broadly speaking, look out for enrollment fees because a lot of times they kind of sneak those in there. Like you see the monthly price, but then they're like, oh yeah, by the way, there's this enrollment fee, but $99. That being said, this time of year I think you can get those waived oftentimes. But just know the ins and outs, just the hidden, the potential hidden fees. Know the contract, know the cancellation rules too, because you know, even if you aren't locked into a 12 month contract, which I think should be avoided because you just never know whether or not, you know, that's a long time to commit to something you're not totally sure you're going to love or not. But you might have to notify your gym, let's say 30 or 60 days out before you want to cancel.

[Joel]

I don't want to hit on a sore spot, but this happened.

[Matt]

This is exactly the situation I found myself in. It was annoying to say the least, but there's just, just something to be aware of. Yeah, there's a ton of different gyms out there. You know, there's a, there's a wide range of options available to you as well as wide pricing differences between these different gyms. You know, so you got the more expensive ones, but they often come with more coaching, they come with smaller classes. It's not just having access to a bunch of, a bunch of equipment. And you might find that it's worth paying more for that. Maybe not. I think the most important thing that is Worth knowing is yourself. Know yourself. Know what it is about the routine that's gonna help you to stick with it. I think about a friend, and he's gotta have skin in the game. If he isn't paying something, he's less likely to show up. He needs a coach there telling him what to do. I got another friend. He likes variety. And so he. He was at the gym I was at, and then he bounced to this other gym for close to a year. Now he's doing hot yoga. He's like, you know, I think I just.

[Joel]

True Renaissance man, that core strength.

[Matt]

And we're in there, we're sweating. And I think for him, I didn't say this to him, but I'm like, oh, man, you just really like. I think what he likes is the variety and learning new things and switching things up and not getting kind of bogged down in what to him might seem like a boring routine. To me, I see predictability and structure, and that seems wonderful. But for him, I think he just likes to switch it up. Know what it is about the experience that's going to allow you to make the most progress?

[Joel]

I think that's a good point. I think a lot of people see the commercial and they're like, 15 bucks a month. What have I got to lose?

[Matt]

And why not?

[Joel]

Often those are the people that, like, they pay the money and they forget to cancel. Just like they would like a streaming membership because it's 15 bucks a month. And you can rationalize it. You're like, I will get there at some point. That's why I think a lot of people at those big gyms, something like 40% of people go once a month at most. There's just. There's a lot of people at those big gyms who are signed up, who just aren't using it. The people who are are getting a great deal. Like, they know what they want and they're actually, like, taking advantage, even though it's cheap. But maybe a higher price point would actually, with more service, would actually get you to use it. Okay, but let's get to the heart of PJ's question. There's no way I would remind the gym that they're supposed to charge me more. It's. It's not even like they sent a notice telling you the price was going up, what date you should expect the price increase. That would be a bit murkier because you're like, hey, the price didn't go up. You told me it was going to. Specifically. They just kind of vaguely hinted at the fact that it would probably go up at some point and they'd be reaching out to you. I think there's a decent chance they're not charging you more because you've been a member for a long time. Maybe they don't want to.

[Matt]

Yeah, I think that's true.

[Joel]

Don't want to lose you. Maybe you're an asset to the gym in a way. I don't know.

[Matt]

Yeah, but they need more of those legacy members around to hold it down.

[Joel]

Right?

[Matt]

Because if, yeah, if they raise prices on everyone and everyone ends up bailing as everyone.

[Joel]

I don't know. Yeah, gyms have a community vibe. Right. And you don't want to lose some of the people who've been there the longest. They're stalwarts in that community.

[Matt]

Those good looking guys like pj, right.

[Joel]

Buff dudes. Maybe they've just postponed the price hike because of an angry response to that initial email or they just don't have their act together. But either way, no, I don't think it's your job to remind them. I think they can if they start charging you more. That's when you kind of come to a crossroads if you figure out how you want to handle it.

[Matt]

Be prepared though. It sounds like again you get excellent use of your gym membership, but that price increase is going to mean maybe a bit of a, like a budget tweak. Maybe it means reallocating like a little bit of money from over here to over here now, but it still sounds like you're going to get plenty of value from that, that gym membership at.

[Joel]

A higher price point.

[Matt]

By the way, he mentioned how he's breaking it down per use, like the price per use metric. Dude, I think that's so helpful, especially for anyone who's considering, considering joining a gym. Because if the membership is, let's say 60 bucks and you're thinking that's fairly affordable, but you go once a week, well then you got to ask yourself, is it worth me paying $15 a pop every time I go in there? But if it's $120, which is, oh my gosh, that's even more expensive. Let's say you go five times a week. That's only $6 a visit, which makes it much easier to justify, I think, the higher monthly cost. So it all comes down to, like you said, what it is that you're getting out of it and don't sleep on building at your own home gym as well. I'm a huge proponent of that. You listen to the podcast so there's a bit of a DIY spirit with you. With you. Pj.

[Joel]

What's the website that you used again for that that another listener recommended? Garage gym or something?

[Matt]

Well, there's multiples, so street parking was one where there's, where there's programming, but that cost money. So I found one that's completely free and it's a more of a CrossFit style workout. That's pushjerk okay dot com. And there's somebody that runs that thing that's a CrossFit coach and they update it every day. Like the night before, there's a, there's a workout. So that's, that's what I wake up in the morning. That's what I do.

[Joel]

So I don't know, pj. If the price I come, the investment.

[Matt]

That goes into building out a gym.

[Joel]

I think PJ can easily justify spending the money because he's there frequently enough. But he also might say, you know what, actually, this is the perfect impetus for me to try the home gym. Yeah.

[Matt]

And if so, reach out. PJ and I can get you more deets on what I ended up doing in my garage.

[Joel]

All right, we got more to get to on this episode, Matt, including investing in gold. We'll talk about that bitcoin and more right after this.

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[Matt]

All right, buddy, we are back from the break and of course it is now time for the Facebook question of the the week, which is from Andrew. He wrote I'm curious for those in a similar situation with a new baby on the way. We are currently living in a one bedroom apartment and need to move to a bigger two bedroom apartment in March or April of this year for more space. Our lease ends in September of 2026, so there is a large overlap here. I'm about to chat with our landlord about our situation, but I'm curious what other creative ideas anyone has for minimizing money during this transition. Should we negotiate a lease break? Ask for a sublet, ask to cover rent until they are able to find a new tenant. Ask for reduced rent from when we move to September or in September. Those are some of the ideas that I had would appreciate anyone else's perspective or other creative ideas. Thank you. Joel, what creative ideas do you have for our listener? Andrew?

[Joel]

Gotta always say congrats. New baby coming soon. It's exciting times. So many How To Money babies.

[Matt]

Yeah.

[Joel]

I love it. Dude.

[Matt]

We really do need to get on the we need one how to Money Wednesday.

[Joel]

I want to.

[Matt]

I know.

[Joel]

Okay, let's.

[Matt]

I want to make that a priority for this.

[Joel]

Let's do it.

[Matt]

Okay. Well timestamp it folks. If you can check in with us. If you haven't heard anything about the HTM1C.

[Joel]

That's right. So some how to Money listeners. This is a Facebook question. After all, had good feedback on this. If you're not a member of the how to Money Facebook group, please go join. Check it out. Great group of like minded folks helping each other out. What a lot of people said, Matt and I completely agree with this is that a new baby doesn't instantly mean that you need more space. Right. And honestly the first six months are often a great time. Your baby's often like sleeping in your room, in a crib or in a co sleeping sort of situation.

[Matt]

So the Rockin Sleeper got canceled or.

[Joel]

He had that for a long time. It worked really well.

[Matt]

Yeah. Evidently it's not safe.

[Joel]

Yeah.

[Matt]

Apparently some kids it wasn't great for him.

[Joel]

Yeah. But I think that's almost actually exactly how much extra time you have in your LE 6 months between April and September. So I guess my first piece of advice would be to not assume that you have to break this lease or that you actually need a bigger space. Your current apartment might suit you well even after the baby comes. Maybe not for like years, but I think through the end of your lease it will. Dude.

[Matt]

It makes me think of a friend of mine back in the day. They lived in this tiny. Funny that you and I Record in our little carriage house. But they were living in this super tiny carriage house, one bedroom, really small. And they had their first baby.

[Joel]

And.

[Matt]

We'Re also gonna get hate mail for this. He put the baby in a drawer of their dresser.

[Joel]

Oh, wow.

[Matt]

Not overnight, but just to, like, demonstrate to his wife that, like, look, babe, we don't need more space.

[Joel]

I would.

[Matt]

Absolutely not. And he's a. Let's say, let's be honest. He was an overly frugal.

[Joel]

Let's hope it was a guy. Vintage dresser. Those are made a lot better too.

[Matt]

Super sturdy even. Still, don't. We absolutely do not recommend for anyone out there to put your babies in a dresser with the drawer open. There's so many reasons that you don't want to do that. True. But it's less about the baby. Like, the point he's trying to prove.

[Joel]

Is, like, babies are small.

[Matt]

Like, they don't take up a whole lot of space. It's not the baby, though. It's all the stuff. It's all the baby stuff. It's the stroller.

[Joel]

It's the.

[Matt]

Oh, we need the. We need the little one that breaks down easily that we can throw in the car. Oh, we need the. Bob. You know, dude, I got to keep up my running routine. I'll run with the baby. Oh, I need the. What else do you get? Oh, changing table or changing pad?

[Joel]

Oh, here's.

[Matt]

Okay, here's a tip for you, Andrew. We never got a separate changing table. Get they. I'm sure they still make these.

[Joel]

The molded peanut looking thing.

[Matt]

The molded, wipeable, cleanable changing pad that you put on top of your cool dresser. So you can still use the dresser. Here we go. So you can still maintain that mid century look without buying an entirely new piece of furniture, piece of equipment.

[Joel]

So question what you're bringing into your life. For sure, that has to be part of that. You're gonna get some stuff that and some of the stuff is gonna be big and maybe for a few months you're gonna be like, where do we put it? Ah, we're a little overloaded. But I think it's. Given the financial stakes of this, trying to stick it out in the least makes sense.

[Matt]

I think that's a great. A great conversation to have.

[Joel]

For sure.

[Matt]

It's worth at least broaching the conversation with your partner. But when it comes to your landlord, I don't know if your landlord's corporate or if it's an individual. If it's the latter, though, if it's like more of a Mom and pop style landlord. I think there's likely going to be a lot more room for negotiating because I think most landlords are going to be more than willing to just try and find another tenant earlier than planned, given your reasoning specifically. And so just reach out, be really friendly about it, know that they don't owe you anything, but just be nice. Right. Just tell them that, you know, I'm not here to break the lease, but if there is an option here, like, can we find another tenant? Yeah, find a way to exit early, we would really appreciate it. Also say, hey, I know we've got a baby, but we're gonna keep it spic and span in here. Like, you let us know when you're gonna schedule showings. We're gonna make this place look really, really good for you. Like, help me help you, basically, is what you're trying to say to your landlord. And I think that that would go a really long ways in them being willing to consider it.

[Joel]

Well, I think keeping it friendly is crucial because according to your lease to your state laws, you might have little to no recourse.

[Matt]

Yeah, yeah. You're not owed it, Right.

[Joel]

In some states, actually, if you say, hey, I'm leaving, then the landlord is obligated to find a new tenant in short and as quickly of a time as they gain as possible. Right. To mitigate your damages if you were to leave early. But in other states, they're not required to do a thing and they can just like sit on their hands and charge you rent. So know your lease, know your local laws so that you don't make a massive financial mistake here. Signing another lease before you've tied up loose ends with your current landlord. Worst case scenario could be a big, big problem for you. Don't do that, don't do that. Worst case scenario, you're stuck in a smaller space than you want to be for a little bit longer than you need to. But hopefully if you can broach the conversation in a friendly manner, you might be able to get concessions that you're not necessarily owed, but the landlord is happy to provide because you've been a good tenant and they're happy to, yeah, get another person in there. They also have more of a timeline to work with too, potentially, if you're like, hey, we'll pay half rent through this such date, I mean, you could probably find a mutually agreeable arrangement. You just have to be proactive, I think, in talking about that with your landlord. Totally.

[Matt]

Okay, let's speed round. I want to do one more here. And because I already teased to it earlier, but this is from an anonymous poster. Is they a good idea to invest in even a small portion of a portfolio into gold or Nvidia if already represented in the total index or S&P 500? What about Ethereum, Crypto or Bitcoin? Joel, what do you think? Is it a good idea to invest in these things? Yes or no?

[Joel]

That's a tough. Do I have to say yes or no? Yes or no? Maybe. Probably not. I'm going to say it's certainly not necessary. It's one of those things where you can, if that's what you're interested. Interested in and that's what you care about. Like, I think a lot of folks who have done a lot of investing, they followed kind of the basic tenets of investing and they do well over time investing in the s and P500 or a total stock market index fund. Like, they're like, well, what's next? And they start to want to get a little cute with it, right?

[Matt]

They want something a little bit sexier. But it's not necessary. And I'll just say no.

[Joel]

Okay, not necessary. No, no. Yeah, it's not necessary. But like, do you. If you want to, you can, right? And so that's where our kind of like 5% rule comes in, where we say, hey, if you're doing 5% the right stuff with 95%, the basic boring stuff with 95% of your investments, then you can have fun with a side portion of the money that you're investing. So you want to make sure it's like firewalled, it's sandboxed, it's completely separate. Whether that's like with a separate brokerage, that's what I do. I have my kind of fun investments essentially that are definitely less than 5% of my overall portfolio with a different brokerage firm. And I just like keeping it completely separate that way. Matt, I don't know if you do the same, but no, I keep all my.

[Matt]

All that money is all co mingled. It's all messy.

[Joel]

It used to be separate though, right? Because didn't you move?

[Matt]

Yeah, but then I started investing more because I specifically, we're talking about Robinhood here. That's where. Well, I've got multiple brokerages where I've got crypto invested in, which makes it sound like I'm a crypto baller. But it's 5% or less than my portfolio, overall portfolio. And the reason that we say that is specific. So no is not necessary. No, you don't need to. But if it allows you to stay the course with the rest of your investments, I'm fine. We are fine with you investing up to 5%, but just don't let it. Don't let it get any bigger than that. And if it does, I would also rebalance at the end of the year. Make that a priority as well. But I'm. I'm fine with it if you want to.5% or less.

[Joel]

And what you're getting at, too, is it can be a pressure release valve of sorts, where it's like, okay, 5%, this. This scratches the itch. So that I'm not messing with the 95% bulk that's carrying me where I need to get in the. You know, in regards to wealth building and saving for my future and for retirement.

[Matt]

So if.

[Joel]

If that allows you to stay the course with the bulk of it, go have fun with 5% of it. And if that means buying more Nvidia, which especially you probably don't need because you have a lot of Nvidia inside of your total stock market OR S&P 500 fund or whether that's. You can, though, if you Bitcoin. Yeah. You know, I mean, I owned.

[Matt]

I own Tesla shares outside of the S&P 500 because I think the electric cars that they make are awesome. Like, that's just one of the small little itches I scratch, just like Warner Brothers and some of these just individual companies where we're just like, oh, what about this? What about that? Okay, can I buy a share for, like, 50 bucks and then not think about it for the rest of the year? Yeah, I'm able to do that. And if you are able to do that, have fun. Yeah.

[Joel]

All right, let's get back to the beer.

[Matt]

Let's do it.

[Joel]

This one's Dulce Muerte. It's an imperial stout by Incendiary Brewing Company. Matt, you actually met the owner and brewer over the holidays, right?

[Matt]

Yep. Yep. So we got a massive thanks to Brandon, who started this brewery with him, and a buddy of his started this brewery. But, dude, this was an amazing beer. Holy cow. What'd you smell? What'd you pick up on the nose right out of the gate?

[Joel]

Well, I feel like. Got a little bit of that bourbon oak. Right. And then a little bit of that vanilla.

[Matt]

The sweetness, it was sweet.

[Joel]

I told you. It smells like it was aged in rum barrels. That's how much sweetness it had going on.

[Matt]

You just have rum on the mind.

[Joel]

I do.

[Matt]

I was gonna say, it smells a lot sweeter. Than it actually drinks because it's like that heat kicks in, that heat with that vanilla and it almost like. I don't know how to describe this. It almost has like this wetness to it that I wasn't expecting. Almost like a salty, like a brininess. Like there's almost like a saltiness to this that added this entire level of complexity and depth in addition to all the notes that you expect with like a. More of a Mexican. Mexican, I was gonna say.

[Joel]

You mentioned heat and that's because it has habanero peppers in it. Right. And that is real heat right there, dude. Very. That is very unique. Not many beers include peppers, but that's why this is one of my all time favorite styles of beer and this is such a good representation of it because I love that little heat kick to the back of the throat that you get in a Mexican style stout.

[Matt]

It's so good.

[Joel]

Oh, it's so good. It's so good. And this is just a delicious one. I think I tasted the vanilla and the peppers the most on this beer, but I love like all the different little flavors and nuances in beers like this, especially ones that are just well done.

[Matt]

So, yeah, this was a phenomenal beer again by Incendiary.

[Joel]

And I think he.

[Matt]

I think they've got multiple locations. We talked about some of the different spots that they have opened up, but yeah, this one, I guess is headquarters in. Headquartered in Winston Salem up there in North Carolina.

[Joel]

Nice.

[Matt]

Yeah, it's good to have another North Carolina beer other than Barry Ole Wicked Weed, some of the big ones. But there's plenty of other great breweries out there as well.

[Joel]

Most def. Go find your local brewery. Go grab yourself a beer.

[Matt]

Give them some love. Yeah.

[Joel]

All right, that's going to do it. For this episode, we'll put links to some of the sites and resources we mentioned in the show notes up on our [e-mail] that's right.

[Matt]

And until next time, buddy.

[Joel]

Best friends out.

[Matt]

Best friends out.

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