Ask HTM - Spending on a Tax Pro, Frugal Practices for Millionaires, & Ending a Termite Bond #1057

Summary

How to Money: Ask HTM – Spending on a Tax Pro, Frugal Practices for Millionaires, & Ending a Termite Bond

Podcast: How to Money
Hosts: Joel & Matt (iHeartPodcasts)
Episode: #1057
Date: November 3, 2025

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Overview

In this episode, Joel and Matt field a batch of listener questions around strategic money moves, covering topics like hiring a tax professional, whether it makes sense to reuse Ziploc bags even as a millionaire, and how to assess the value of a termite warranty as prices climb. As always, the hosts keep the tone light and action-oriented, aiming to empower regular folks with jargon-free, practical financial guidance.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Hiring a Tax Pro versus DIY Tax Planning

Listener Question from Lucas (09:51):
Lucas asks for advice on when and how to hire a tax professional for retirement planning, especially as he and his wife start to maximize tax-advantaged accounts.

• Tax Pro vs Financial Advisor?

  • Joel clarifies Lucas seems to be looking for a financial advisor with tax insight, not just a "tax pro" (10:43).
  • “Even small mistakes can add up significantly, especially as we near retirement and our net worth has grown.” – Joel (11:06)

• Who Needs Pro Help, and When?

  • If still in the wealth-building phase (just maxxing out IRAs/401(k), etc.), it’s likely unnecessary to hire a pro now.
  • Joel uses the Everest “Sherpa” analogy to illustrate that professionals are most vital when managing complex or high-stakes tax situations (13:00).

• When To Hire and What To Pay:

  • It’s not about a hard wealth threshold, but complexity. Most advisors are open to those with $1–2M net worth, but you may just need a “tune-up” consult for a few hundred dollars/hour, not a pricey long-term relationship (15:00).
  • Fee-for-service (hourly) is preferred over commission or asset-based models.
  • Matt reveals his own CPA charges about $500 for a complex return (19:15).

• Never Outsource Awareness:

  • Even with a pro, clients should never “punt on learning for yourself”—passive clients (like some pro athletes) risk being taken advantage of (17:00).
  • “Hiring an advisor is not a reason to punt on learning for yourself ... That doesn’t work out well for a lot of people.” – Joel (17:44)

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2. Frugal or Cheap? Reusing Ziploc Bags as a Millionaire

Listener Question from Ian (23:07):
Ian, a multi-millionaire, wonders if reusing Ziploc bags is frugal or just cheap.

• Hosts Weigh In:

  • Both Joel and Matt agree reusing Ziploc bags is frugal—especially for non-greasy, non-messy items (23:51, 24:11).
  • “I think reusing Ziploc bags is still frugal, not cheap. It depends what you put in it, though.” – Joel (23:51)

• The Value of Small Frugal Habits:

  • Reusing bags for clean foods saves waste and feels rewarding, even if financially minor.
  • For messy foods (like fried chicken), even Joel draws the line.
  • Matt shares he’s reused the same “banana bag” for years—since bananas are self-contained, the bag never really gets dirty (25:38).

• Alternatives and Environmental Impact:

  • They discuss silicon “Stasher” bags, which are more sustainable, but harder to clean—raising debate over whether it’s worthwhile to hand-wash any bags at all (25:54–26:41).

• Frugality as Virtue vs. Obsession:

  • Important not to “major on minors”; small frugal actions matter, but obsessing over pennies while ignoring the big wins (e.g., getting a raise, investing) is counterproductive (29:12).
  • Joel frames intentional frugality as a virtue and a part of his identity: “I think of frugality in the proper context as a virtue. ... It goes beyond just a way to save a little bit of money.” (30:47)
  • Matt: “Intelligent use of money is not just about your overall optimization levels ... more about fulfillment and living according to your values.” (29:49)

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3. Revisiting or Amending a 30-Year-Old Family Trust

Listener Question from Jocelyn (31:48):
Jocelyn’s parents have a 30-year-old trust with multiple rental properties. Should they get a new trust or update the old one?

• First Steps:

  • The trust likely covers all properties under one umbrella, possibly with LLCs for each asset (33:02).

• Amending vs. Restating:

  • “Updating” a trust is called amending, while discarding/rebuilding it is a restatement.
    • Simple changes (new beneficiaries, small asset tweaks) = amendment.
    • Major changes/conflicting old amendments = restatement (34:57).
  • Too many amendments can create confusion, like a “Honda Civic that’s been modded so much you can’t tell what it is anymore” (36:33).

• Legal and Emotional Considerations:

  • Amendments are cheaper/more private, but multiple changes can lead to confusion and even clash among beneficiaries (36:56).

• Action Plan:

  • “We highly recommend reaching out to an estate planning attorney wherever your parents live.” – Matt (37:06)
  • Generally, amendments run three-figures; restatements may be low four-figures if complex (38:00).

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4. Is It Worth Paying for a Termite Warranty That Keeps Getting Pricier?

Listener Question from Katie (44:04):
Katie inherited a termite bond on her Florida home that is getting expensive ($500/yr, up from $150). The plan is no longer offered to new customers, covers full repairs, and she’s never had termite issues.

• Should She Renew?

  • Matt suggests getting the retreatment (already included) done, then reconsider; often, these policies prey on fear and “legacy” anxieties (45:31).
  • “I feel like pest control, generally speaking, feels somewhat like a legacy industry...” – Matt (45:53)

• Assessing Risk:

  • Think locally: wooded or rural area vs urban? Construction type? Proximity to infested neighbors? (46:54, 47:06)
  • Termites are serious, especially in the Southeast—consider DIY pest control as a cost-saving (48:51)
  • Joel recommends using Telstar or termite bait stations, with regular applications (48:51).

• DIY and Self-Insurance:

  • Katie could self-insure (set aside money for potential future repairs) and take preventive measures, especially given her healthy emergency fund.
  • The current policy’s repair coverage is valuable, but only if risk is not already low due to vigilance and prevention.

• Neighborhood “Herd Immunity”:

  • Matt draws an analogy to vaccines: if the block is well-protected, risk declines (50:07).

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• Joel: “Hiring an advisor is not a reason to punt on learning for yourself ... That doesn’t work out well for a lot of people.” (17:44)
• Matt: “Intelligent use of money is not just about your overall optimization levels ... there’s a personal satisfaction in living according to your values.” (29:49)
• Joel (on frugality): “I think of frugality in the proper context as a virtue ... It does become a part of your identity to a certain extent.” (30:47)
• Matt (on pest control): “Pest control feels somewhat like a legacy industry, where for a while there people weren’t treating their homes at all...” (45:53)
• Joel (on timeshare presentations): “Know for everybody out there listening: if you’re interested in going to a timeshare presentation and you are married, they're going to want your spouse.” (07:57)

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Timestamps by Segment

| Topic | Start | |---------------------------------------------|------------| | Episode theme and listener Q intro | 02:02 | | Tax pro/financial advisor question (Lucas) | 09:51 | | Ziploc bags frugal-or-cheap question (Ian) | 23:07 | | Trusts and estate plan update (Jocelyn) | 31:48 | | Termite warranty costs - keep or cancel? | 44:04 | | High yield savings rates/market context | 41:13 |

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Tone and Language

• Warm, conversational, lightly humorous (“sticking to your guns”, “Sherpa analogy”, banter about banana bags).
• Concrete, actionable advice but with self-deprecating notes (“I didn't even sleep at a Holiday Inn last night” – Joel re: not being a lawyer, 32:53).
• Emphasis on intentionality and values, not dogmatic rules.

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Conclusion

This episode delivers relatable, concrete advice—whether you’re pondering the value of small frugal habits or facing big decisions about how much professional help to pay for. The hosts remind listeners to balance practical money-saving choices with “living your life according to your values,” and advocate for learning, intentionality, and measured risk, whether hiring a financial pro or battling household pests.

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For more resources, show notes, or to submit your own question, visit howtomoney.com

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Ad sections, beer reviews, and outros omitted as per instructions.

Transcript

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[Matt]

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[Joel]

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[Matt]

I'm Matt and today we're going to.

[Joel]

Answer some of your listener questions.

[Matt]

That's right, buddy. We've got, let's see, five excellent listener money questions to get to. Today we're going to talk about finding a tax professional, specifically a listener. He wants to know how much he should be paying and actually whether or not he should be considering a tax pro. We'll get into all that here in a second. Another listener has got millions of dollars in the bank. He's still using his Ziploc bags. He wants to know how we feel about that, whether we endorse this move or whether we're going to put the kibosh on it.

[Joel]

Are they actual name brand Ziploc bags Matt. Or are they the generics?

[Matt]

Is it Boulder? That's the Aldi brand. Of course I know the Boulder bags.

[Joel]

And of course, in recent months, Costco has launched Kirkland Signature R to the Ziplocs after they're shaking in their boots. Yeah.

[Matt]

Oh, it's been. Dude, I hardly use that. I hardly ever get over to the Costco as much anymore.

[Joel]

Much to your great shame.

[Matt]

I'm really only heading over there to get the Kirkmansegg smoker pellets.

[Joel]

Oh, yeah.

[Matt]

And then also the meat that needs to go on top of the Traeger whenever I do wanna smoke a big old hunk of meat.

[Joel]

That's a good reason to venture into it is.

[Matt]

It's not typically something I'm gonna find at Aldi.

[Joel]

The big.

[Matt]

Like a brisket.

[Joel]

Brisket.

[Matt]

Or a pork butt. I wanted to also highlight one other listener question that's more of a homeowner's question. She's got a question about her termite bond, or termite warranty, I think is.

[Joel]

What she calls it.

[Matt]

But we'll get to those plus more during our episode today.

[Joel]

Yeah, those can be expensive. What do you do when it feels like it's breaking the budget? Matt quickly wanted to mention I stayed for the first time ever at a timeshare resort.

[Matt]

Ooh, do tell the listeners, because I know.

[Joel]

Well, this was just because of the generosity. If they said, hey, I've got extra points. Would you like to stay? Would you like to use some of those points for a free stay for you and your family? And I was like, yes, please. Thank you very much. And it was such a pleasant experience. We had the best trip, and nice to have free lodging when you go. So that was awesome. One of the things. There were some things I really liked about it, including they have this activity center, and we did some family activities. That was a fun, different, unique part of. Of a trip, too. But then there was when I, like, when I signed in or when I, like, checked in, they said, hey, do you want to go to a timeshare presentation? Of course they did.

[Matt]

So, yeah, you started with the pros, but then you got to the cons.

[Joel]

Well, they asked. And they honestly were not ridiculously pushy about it or anything like that. But I said, you know what? I don't know. I think I might be interested in it. What's like, what do I get if I go? Of course. And they said, well, you get seven. Seven free nights at any one of our places.

[Matt]

That's a lot, actually.

[Joel]

Okay, so did you go Like a free. A free week.

[Matt]

I was like, okay, completely free vacation.

[Joel]

And I mentioned the activity center. I was like, wait a second. If I go at this time on this day, my family can go do this activity while I sit in the presentation. And perfect. As like, a personal finance podcast host. I'm like, this is great fodder for the show. Like, I need to have at some point in my life, sat in a timeshare present to know what it's like.

[Matt]

Yeah.

[Joel]

So I was like, this is like.

[Matt]

Matt can't be the only one who's ever sat in a timeshare presentation from 25 years ago. Just like I did it when I was in college.

[Joel]

This is doubly beneficial. Gonna get a free weekend and also have something, some understanding, more understanding of the timeshare industry. But I signed up and then they were like, okay, well, actually your wife has to come with you. And I was like, well, we got our kids here. And so it didn't end up working out. I basically said, yeah, I'm not. It's not worth it from. To that extent if it's just me and they can go do something else.

[Matt]

So you would have done it if.

[Joel]

It was just you?

[Matt]

I would have. How long was the presentation?

[Joel]

Hour and a half.

[Matt]

Oh, that's not so bad. Could be worse.

[Joel]

Yeah.

[Matt]

Either way, I'm proud of you for sticking to your guns and realizing at the stage of life that we're in, our time is just more valuable. Like, we are being pulled in different directions by so many different things. Right. Like, obviously, your. Everyone's mind immediately goes to your career and the time spent there. But then, like, socially, I'm thinking about the time that's being required of me, like, for my kids and all the things that they want to do and the things that they want to tell me about my friend. But then, like, our parents on the other side of us as well, right? Like the older generation, we're kind of. We're being pulled in that way. And so I don't think there's any other time in our life where we're going to feel like we have so little time. It's like a multiplier effect compared to. It's like right now, it feels like. It feels like my time's worth 4x what it was like 10 years ago. And it feels like it's going to like.

[Joel]

Like 10 years from now.

[Matt]

10 years from now, I feel like it'll be four times less as well. But, like, right now, man, it just feels. It's just it's just ramped up. It's ramped up even more.

[Joel]

Yeah. So I had to factor that in. And just like the annoyance, my wife's like, I don't, I don't want to go to that. I was willing to like hang out with the kids while you go, but I don't want to go check that out.

[Matt]

And while you're on vacation. Yeah, that's another multiple. That's another vacation.

[Joel]

If that hour and a half leads to more vacation, then it's like, I don't know, I could justify it.

[Matt]

Vacation time is more valuable too. That's another multiplier as well. Because an hour and a half at home. Okay, whatever. I'm not doing anything. But when you're somewhere you want, like somewhere special you want to. I don't know, there's things I want to be doing that time. That's why I'm willing to pay more for car rentals now. Because the thought of waiting in line or not having.

[Joel]

Do you not have to wait in line if you pay more?

[Matt]

Well, I'm thinking about once I'm going with a more discounted car rental agency and I stood there and there was like 15 people. It took me, I think I told the story. It took me like 45 minutes to get through this line and I looked over at the nicer one that a lot of folks have heard of. There's nobody in line and they're just. The folks are sitting there talking to each other.

[Joel]

Is that an anomaly or is that always true?

[Matt]

I don't know. Experientially that's true. And so because of that, and I've also had, I told the story about when the more affordable option didn't have my car, which then sent me on a hours long wasting mission in order to find a vehicle that I could take. Anyway, all that being said, I'm just pointing out that they need to be paying a premium while you're on vacation because the hours spent while you're on vacation are. Those are really valuable, man.

[Joel]

Just know for everybody out there listening, if you're interested in going to a timeshare presentation and you are married, they're going to want your spouse. And in fact I think they typically they're obligated. Your spouse has to be there. That's a fellow decision maker. And so you, they're going to want to make sure both of you sign on the dotted line and not just you. So you can't do it if your spouse isn't willing to.

[Matt]

That's so Interesting that.

[Joel]

Don't force them to come along and force your kids to come. Like, I was just like, no, I got to do that.

[Matt]

Don't want to do that. It's so interesting. I would almost think the opposite. I would almost think that if both of them are there, like, there's one person who's gonna say, no, no, no. Like, we're not gonna sign on the dotted line here. Like, there's one person in the relationship who thinks more rationally. Yeah, rationally. Logically, perhaps. And another who might get carried away. And that. I guess there's all different rhymes and reasons that they do it the way they do.

[Joel]

Well, that next vacation I was already plotting. I had to kind of start roll back that. That back in my mind. All right, let's mention the beer we're having on this episode. This one, of course, is by beer. Oh. Because it's called the scars on greedy palms. And they have just the most interesting names of their beers. I think they just like, put in some sort of dystopian word generator or phrase generator, and that's what they put on all their beers.

[Matt]

I think they can train whatever AI model on their previous names of their beers and come up with an infinite number. 100% of new beers. Yes. That would also taste delicious.

[Joel]

That's right.

[Matt]

I can't wait to talk about this one at the end for sure. Already.

[Joel]

So good. All right. And if you have a money question, we would love to hear from you. Just. Yeah, think what your money question is. Record it into the voice memo app on your phone. Just state your name at the very beginning, send it back over to us, and hopefully we can take it next week on the show. We'd love to have an abundance, a variety of your listener questions to take to help you as an individual, but then also to help all of the how to money community as well. Matt, let's get to the first question for this episode. This one specifically about finding somebody to help them out with their money.

[Lucas]

Hey, Joel and Matt, Big fans. My name is Lucas from Escalon, California, and I had a quick question on how to go about seeking and choosing a tax professional to help plan for retirement. My wife and I are in a stage now where we're looking at hopefully maxing out our IRAs and other tax advantaged retirement accounts, but don't really know where to go next. And so we're looking for wisdom, but we also don't know who to go for for wisdom. So any advice that you could give on how to seek those Professionals who to look for how much money to spend when seeking those professionals would be tremendously helpful. Thank you so much, Joel.

[Matt]

Lucas is looking for wisdom. He came to the right place.

[Joel]

Did he?

[Matt]

All right, get talking.

[Joel]

Oh, I thought you were referring to yourself, humble as always.

[Matt]

No, I'm referring to you, my friend.

[Joel]

Well, I don't know if that's true, but we'll do our best here, Lucas. And first you said you were looking for a tax professional, but you also then mentioned saving for retirement. So it doesn't necessarily sound like you're looking specifically for a tax professional, but maybe for more like a financial advisor who kind of keeps their eyes on the tax ramifications of different choices you might make, which totally makes sense. And it's, it's, I think it is one of the biggest reasons that you should consider hiring help is because the tax ramifications, the downstream impacts of even small mistakes that we might make, they can add up significantly, especially as we near retirement and our net worth has grown significantly. It's something that you really do need to pay attention to.

[Matt]

Totally.

[Joel]

Yeah.

[Matt]

So for instance, let's say you're trying to simplify your portfolio by selling certain holdings in your taxable brokerage account. Well, you are likely going to run up a tax bill potentially even into the five figures, maybe even more. And that could be avoided with proper planning. There are many investors and a lot of folks who are listening who might be diligent about saving and investing, but that being said, they may not be as in tune with the tax code as well as the consequences of buying and selling some of their different assets.

[Joel]

I'd be curious to know, Matt, even for everyone listening like to do, how do money listeners understand what percentage understand the difference between something like short term and long term capital gains taxes and when you pay what and what the time period is involved in there? Right. Like that's kind of a, that's even like 101 in some ways. But I think a lot of people don't necessarily know the difference there.

[Matt]

And a lot of it comes down to the fact that one of these things we do frequently, typically every single month as we dollar cost average into the market and then some of these other decisions are rarely done. And because of that we, we're just less experienced typically with that. But when and how much it is that you sell, like I almost see it as much of an art as a science. And I'm not talking about timing the market, but you do, there is a way to avoid as much of the.

[Joel]

Tax Bill as possible.

[Matt]

And having the help of a pro who has walked, I mean, hopefully like hundreds of other clients through similar circumstances, that can help you to avoid some of the potential tax stumbling blocks that you might run into.

[Joel]

Yeah, it's almost making me think of like someone climbing Mount Everest. Matt. If I wanted to go climb Everest, which I have zero desire to do that, but if I did, I would probably hire one of the fabled sherpas, right. Who's like, scurried up and down the mountain, carry all your stuff for you. That would be nice, right? Get up with a little bit lighter load. And it's amazing, like, how those sherpas, because they're used to that climate, they. They're used to the mountain and the conditions, they can carry that stuff and still be like 10 times faster than the average person going to climb. And I think it's part of it. Yeah. It's just that experience that they have, the knowledge that they have, and there is something really, really valuable about that. But if you're in the wealth building phase of your life, Lucas, like looking to fill up those tax advantaged accounts, you can likely do a lot of that stuff on your own without the help and the added expense of a tax professional. So right now you're trying to max out your IRAs and your workplace accounts, which is wonderful. It's something that we applaud and that we recommend. This show really is built and geared towards people like you to give you the advice and the encouragement you need to keep on pressing towards that goal and to build that net worth up while you're in your working years. But you might not need a professional to help you pull that part of it off. Right. That. That might be something that really is within your own grasp. It's all about, like, growing the gap between earning and spending, diversifying, keeping costs low, like the stuff we talk about pretty regularly. And you're doing that quite well at this point. And so I would just kind of take a long, hard look at exactly where you're at. You might need hired help in the future, but do you actually need that hired help today? Like, instead of climbing Everest, if you're like, I'm just gonna do a 5,000 foot mountain, right. I'm gonna climb that thing on. I can do that on my own. Like, that's the state. Maybe that's the stage, you know, you're in. And once you get to Everest levels, that's when you do need the Sherpa to come along with you. But yeah, so much of that depends on where you actually find yourself, what stage of the wealth building process you're in.

[Matt]

Yeah. And so it's not a hard and fast rule that you should hire a pro once you reach the $1 or $2 million net worth threshold. But it is often when advisors are more likely to have you on as a client, although different fintechs out there have changed that. But it's also when the stakes are high enough for this kind of decision to matter. And where should you turn then at that point? Well, head over to howtomoney.com advisor. That is a great place to look for a properly vetted fee only fiduciary advisor. We've partnered with the great folks over at Wealth Ramp and you can hire someone by the hour. You can even hire them now, even if you're maybe just looking almost for more of a tune up as opposed to an ongoing relationship just to answer some of the questions that you might have. Or maybe this is something you want to, you've got your sights set much further down the road and establishing an ongoing relationship is something that could, could.

[Joel]

Pay off as well. And this is where paying attention to the compensation model matters a ton and what it is that you need. So you might go to howtomoney.com advisor and say, well, I want to link up with somebody and have an ongoing relationship and have like an in depth financial plan created. And you can do that and that can cost a lot or, and it might be worth it again if you are in some of those, some of those later stages, wealth preservation stages. But if you're kind of early on, you're like, I just have some really significant questions and I would like to spend a couple of hours with somebody who really knows what they're doing and has helped other people kind of think through the ramp up phase. You can do that too, right? And you can find somebody who will just, you can pay an hourly fee to and you can feel really good about getting great advice without paying, forking over nearly as much and having an ongoing relationship where you continue to pay them year after year. So how much should you be spending to hire this pro? Well, that also depends. But we like the fee for service model, like paying someone an hourly rate. I just think it helps overall align incentives really well. They're just, there are so many flawed models that tend to lead to poor outcomes in the advisor client relationship, specifically ones where there are commissions for selling certain products. And then you have to think twice about whether or not your advisor is recommending an insurance policy because they stand to benefit financially by selling you that policy or if it's because it's actually the best thing for you. And yeah, truth be told, depending on all the stuff we don't know about your finances, maybe things are getting complicated enough where it makes sense for you to hire someone in the near term. But we also just want to stress that hiring an advisor is not a reason to punt on learning for yourself, Matt. I think that's one of the most important things when we talk about advisors. Some people think this means I can check out of my financial life by hiring this pro to handle it for me. And that doesn't work out well for a lot of people. You see the stories of professional athletes in particular hiring someone to manage their finances and then they end up destitute because that person took advantage of them. It's kind of like managing a rental property. You still want to know the ins and outs of what it looks like to do proper and effective landlording before you hire someone to do it for you.

[Matt]

That's right. And in regards to specific amounts, typically when you are looking at the assets under management model, you're looking at at 1% and I'm pretty sure wealth ramp's average is actually much less than that on average. But you can do that. Or if you're looking at the hourly rate, it oftentimes just a few hundred bucks. If you're looking for more of that one time service. And you know what he was saying early on too that he was looking at hiring a tax professional. If that is actually the scenario that he's in. I would just say just to start asking around because I think starting conversations with friends and I think you'd be surprised at the folks who you think hey man, they've got it going on. Figuring out who they use for their CPA for their accountant could lead to a great conversations with them. You also might be surprised because they might be like saving for retirement. What are you talking about bro? But I think that could be a good way to find someone there local to where you are. If you are looking for someone who you can go to in person, show up there in the office and have a great conversation. And I will say personally, my accountants, I pay around 500 bucks for my personal return and that comes with a whole host of handling. We've got a pretty complicated personal tax return situation with investment properties and owning your own business, Joel. It's almost like we have a very similar tax preparation process that you only have to go.

[Joel]

It's true.

[Matt]

But hopefully those are some numbers that can get you, I guess, thinking in the right direction. Lucas But Joel, we've got more to get to. We are going to hear from a listener who thinks it might be time actually for her parents to to update their trust. So we'll hear from her plus others right after this. This message is sponsored by Navy Federal Credit Union. As the holiday season rolls around, Navy Federal knows that you strive to do everything you can to bring cheer and joy to your loved ones. And as a credit union dedicated to serving all veterans, active duty and their families, they understand that every little bit counts.

[Joel]

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[Matt]

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[Joel]

Offer ends January 1, 2026 my how time flies 2025. It's going to be gone before we know it. But before it's gone, there's a lot of life to live right, including a lot of kid activities, the holiday get togethers, and a whole lot more. All this activity though, it can cause us to put off tasks on our to do list. But juggling a million plans shouldn't mean your future doesn't make your to do list. Trust and will turns estate planning from a When I have time task into a quick, straightforward process ensuring you're protecting your family's future. Today. Go to trustandwill.com how2money to get 20% off their simple, secure and expert backed estate planning services.

[Matt]

That's right. It makes me think you mentioned kids, Joel. I might be done having kids at this point, but my friends, my neighbors, they aren't. I've got family members who have a fresh baby at home as well and it is such an amazing season of life. But those changes should also bring about a reassessment of whether or not you've got your estate planning ducks all in a row. Trust and will makes it simple and straightforward. Their easy to use website is simple to navigate and plus all your information, all your documents, they are securely stored with bank level encryption.

[Joel]

Add some peace of mind to your Future with trust and will go to trustandwill.com howtomoney for 20% off. That's 20% [e-mail] howtomoney as a small business owner, you don't have the luxury of clocking out early. Your business is on your mind 24 7. So when you're hiring, you need a partner that works just as hard as you do. That hiring partner is LinkedIn Jobs. When you clock out, LinkedIn clocks in. LinkedIn makes it easy to post your job for free, share it with your network, and get qualified candidates that you can manage all in one place.

[Matt]

Yeah. Let me tell you how it works. First, you post your job. LinkedIn's new feature can help you write job descriptions and then quickly get your job in front of the right people with deep candidate insights. You either post your job for free or you pay to promote, which by the way, gets you three times more qualified applicants. And then just sit back and rest easy knowing that you are getting the highest quality candidates. Based on LinkedIn data, 72% of small business owners using LinkedIn said that LinkedIn helps them to find the best candidates. Find out why more than two and a half million small businesses use LinkedIn for hiring today. Find your next great hire on LinkedIn.

[Joel]

Post your job for free at LinkedIn.com howtomoney that's LinkedIn.com howtomoney to post your job for free. Terms and conditions apply. All right, Matt, we're back. Time to get some more listener questions. This one is kind of a fun. Frugal or cheap?

[Ian]

Hey, Joel and Matt, this is Ian from Virginia. In one of your Replay episodes last week, you mentioned something about reusing Ziploc bags. I just want to know, is that still frugal or cheap? Even though I have a net worth in the multiple millions, I still reuse Ziplock bags. So I'd like to hear if you two could make me change my mind on that or maybe agree with me. Thank you very much.

[Matt]

All right, Joel, you gonna make Ian change his mind? Prove me wrong is what Ian's saying.

[Joel]

I do like that. I'm down to try to change his mind. I also appreciate his want to.

[Matt]

Yeah, because you're down with that, right?

[Joel]

I'm down with it, yeah. And I just want to say, like, we love taking frugal or cheap questions. And I personally, I think reusing Ziploc bags is still frugal, not cheap. Oh, yeah. It depends on what you put in it though, because I'll reuse Ziploc bags for some things. In particular, some of the things I perpetually bring to work, which Matt sees me snacking on, are almonds.

[Matt]

I'm looking over right now. Oh, that is kind of a crummy looking bag.

[Joel]

It's seen better. A few rounds of almonds in it. Mango is another one which gets less nasty and messy. And even almonds aren't too bad. So I'll reuse an almond bag three or four times. Mango bag, six or seven, maybe.

[Matt]

Oh, well, yeah, I completely agree. As opposed to, like, say, bringing some fried chicken and it's all greasy in there. Like, that's gross. Yeah, like, yeah, don't use that. I'm not done with that. Although I'm curious. Okay, so the bag that I think I've used reused the most in my backpack every day when I come to the office with my lunch. I put my banana in a special pouch so the banana doesn't get dented up. Because you don't want it next to, like, the Tupperware containers, the hard edges.

[Joel]

Well, and bananas, for some reason, like, it'll. The sticky.

[Matt]

Well, stickiness on the outside.

[Joel]

I was gonna say the flavor profile will seep into other things if it's close to it for too long. That's true.

[Matt]

I don't mind that, though. Everything gets to taste like banana runts.

[Joel]

Nah, I don't want that.

[Matt]

The best kind of runt.

[Joel]

I want to eat. I want my banana flavor when I eat banana. I don't want it when I eat other stuff.

[Matt]

But that being said, like, I truly.

[Joel]

Think fried chicken that tastes like banana.

[Matt]

Man, I don't know. It sounds pretty yummy, my banana bag. So, like, I take it and I throw it in there because of the, like, the stickies, like the SAP or whatever that comes out of the banana peel. I don't want that getting all over the inside of my backpack. And so that's why I stick it inside the bag and then I roll it up and toss it in there. But I truly think that I've had that bag for, like, for years. Because why would I change it out? Because the banana comes in its own Ziploc bag. It comes in its peel.

[Joel]

That's right.

[Matt]

And so it's not like, unlike most.

[Joel]

Foods, it has its own pouch. Yeah, pouch, exactly. Well, then I think we could highlight that there are other options right there. Like reusable Ziploc bags, stasher bags, or one of those, like, the silicon bags which you and I tried out.

[Matt]

We tried those.

[Joel]

I still use them sometimes.

[Matt]

Especially, like, kind of A pain in the butt.

[Joel]

If we make kids, the kids paying. Oh, you mean to wash out? Yeah, yeah, they can be.

[Matt]

Well, that's. That's the thing. Because some containers, like Tupperware are super easy because I can throw them in the dishwasher.

[Joel]

Yeah.

[Matt]

Flip them over and they're going to get clean. Whereas those stasher bags, they want to close. Like, their default position is shut. Yeah. And so sticking those in the dishwasher to try to get clean.

[Joel]

Oh, no, you got to hand wash them.

[Matt]

See, that's you don't like to do.

[Joel]

Okay. I'm hand washing stuff a lot.

[Matt]

Hey, that raises another question. Are you hand washing Ziploc bags? No, if you're. If you're.

[Joel]

If you're tossing it. No, I'm tossing it.

[Matt]

If you're washing a Stasher bag, what's the difference?

[Joel]

Because they hold up better. There's a good deal. I'm not going to wash the Ziploc bag.

[Matt]

I'm just.

[Joel]

Because. And if it's currently holding up, though, why not Bag isn't high enough to get me interested in washing and how those aren't going to dry. Whereas the stasher bag, you can leave it open and dry it.

[Matt]

Can you?

[Joel]

Yeah.

[Matt]

Okay.

[Joel]

Yeah, you can. I'm living pretty here. Living proof that you can. So, yeah, they have, like, generic equivalents, too, because the stasher bags can be kind of expensive.

[Matt]

That's the name brand.

[Joel]

Yeah. And you have to decide, well, how many uses is it going to take to pay off? We have a few that we use. And I will say, for certain things, they're helpful. I guess it'd also be better for the environment over the long term. But if you're being thoughtful about that. Reusing plastic. Your plastic bags like your Ziplocs.

[Matt]

Yeah.

[Joel]

And I guess.

[Matt]

Which are just as easy to wash and dry.

[Joel]

Not true.

[Matt]

Okay, so I was just thinking through this. Here is why it is true. Because when you. I don't know if you do this, but if you take a Ziploc bag and this is helpful, A, when you're loading it. But it also, B, when you're. When you're trying to get it to dry, but you fold back the zip. You know what I'm talking about, you cut, you cuff it, essentially. Still not as easy, but then it will stay upside down and it will dry out. Whereas again, the stasher bags, they want to shut.

[Joel]

They.

[Matt]

They just want to stay moist and wet and clammy and gross, man.

[Joel]

Not true. Not true.

[Matt]

That being said, I'm not. I'm also not out there hand washing Ziploc bags because I'm just not doing that right now.

[Joel]

Well, and they're so little value. Like I don't know what they cost per bag. That'd be interesting. I should run have run the math on that before we took this question. My guess is they're what, like 8 cents apiece, 12 cents apiece, something like that. Ziploc. Yeah.

[Matt]

Yeah.

[Joel]

So I don't feel terrible, but it is nice if I'm like, if I can bring that down to 3 or 4 cents per use essentially by reusing those for non messy items. I'm totally down to do that.

[Matt]

I get that.

[Joel]

Part of the reason we like to take frugal or cheap questions too is because it can be a hang up for people who lean overly frugal. Right. They border on cheap and they major on minor things because ultimately when it comes down to your decision on whether or not to reuse Ziploc bags, it's not going to make a major difference in your wealth building efforts. But some people are so concerned with pinching pennies and they're leaving big bucks on the table in terms of negotiating their pay or invest in their own human capital. And there can be this tendency to major on the minors to think in like have just short sighted thinking in the personal finance space. But in retort to what I just said as well, Matt, I've also just begun to think that my frugal choices, they're not just about how large my net worth is and how big it can grow. I don't want a brand new car because I don't value it. Even if my bank account says I can afford it, even if my bank account says I can afford unlimited Ziploc bags and I don't have to reuse them. There's something I value about being able to reuse things and not flippantly throw away money. I get that. I think there's a, I don't know if it's a gamification aspect, but I guess it can be to me at times is, yeah, do I have to upgrade that thing? If not, I don't want to. Sure.

[Matt]

Yeah. So Ian, I would say no matter how big your net worth gets, don't be so cheap as to not reconsider your spending habits from time to time in order to maximize the value of the dollars that you've amassed. But also don't become so flippant that you completely disregard these small ways to make or to save money. That matter more than just the actual dollars or the pennies that you might be clawing back.

[Joel]

Right.

[Matt]

Because intelligent use of money is not just about your overall optimization levels. I think there's a personal satisfaction in like a fulfillment side of things too, where you get to live your life according to your specific values. And so like, just because you can spend money in a more absurd way doesn't mean that you should. Like there is something intrinsically rewarding to live your life intentionally, to live a well considered life. And even when like the eventual outcome might be similar to where you would have ended up had you not thought about it. Right. Like on the surface you might have two people and oh, they look really similar or some of the purchases that they make. But I think how it is that they arrive to that point has all the difference in their life, fulfillment and satisfaction and something that kind of empowers as to why it is that they did the thing to begin with. Does that make sense? Yeah, there's more enjoyment that I think you can get out of life when you've thought through some of these things.

[Joel]

And I guess when it comes down to it, I think of frugality in the proper context as a virtue. And when you think of something as a virtue, it goes beyond just a way to save a little bit of money. It. And I don't know, maybe this is overstating it, but it does become a part of your identity to a certain extent. And I don't want to be like the frugal guy, right? Like in like the nerdiest way possible, but I do think that like, intentional frugality in the right places truly does reach that level of virtue, at least in my conceptualization of it.

[Matt]

Totally agree, man. Yeah, it's about throwing your weight behind the things you truly care about and then like, not hardly giving any attention to the things that you don't care about.

[Joel]

I'm still not picking up pennies though. Sorry. I will.

[Matt]

I'll leave it for my kids now. Actually, Kate and I were walking around the neighborhood. We saw a bunch of change and I started kind of going for them and I was like, yeah, actually, let's leave it. Tell the kids about that and they can come up here. Give them incentive to head up to the cul de sac.

[Joel]

Pretty soon the reason to pick them up is going to be because they're a relic from a bygone era.

[Matt]

That's true.

[Joel]

All right, let's get to another question, Matt. This one is from a listener who has a question about helping her Parents out.

[Podcast Announcer]

Hi, my name is Jocelyn and I'm from the San Francisco Bay Area. My question is related to my parents estate plan. They have a trust that's at least 30 years old and they own multiple rental properties. It's actually not clear to me whether each property has its own trust or everything is included under one. But this trust hasn't been reviewed in decades. So I'm trying to figure out what's the best next step. Should they just get a new trust drafted or is it actually a thing to get an old trust reviewed and updated? Open to your thoughts and thank you for all the help.

[Matt]

All right, Jocelyn, I think this is a really important question. Thank you for sending this one our way because I think any way that you can help your parents to get things squared away now is going to benefit you when your parents pass. And this doesn't even include like if you've got siblings as well. This is, it's like a PSA that you're doing, you know, on their behalf as well. And by the way, this, we're going to kind of, we're going to wade into more like legal territory. Joel, you and I, we are not lawyers, we are not estate planning attorneys.

[Joel]

And I didn't even sleep at a Holiday Inn last night.

[Matt]

Jocelyn reached out to us and we're going to do our best to help inform you a little bit and to at least give you our thoughts on estate planning from more of a personal finance standpoint.

[Joel]

And usually kind of like what you're alluding to, Matt, is people, they don't address some of these issues until it's past time and that can create significant issues. Something that can be like a small task on the front end can be an enormous burden for family members left behind if not addressed properly. Right. So I've seen this recently where like just something as simple as not changing a beneficiary. Right. Can have cascading impacts on the family that's left behind and grieving. And so it's really important to think about the stuff on the front end. Jocelyn is a wise daughter to be doing that. Jocelyn, it doesn't sound like you want to get all up in your parents business just for the sake of it. Right. It sounds like you just want to make sure that they have their ducks in a row. My guess is that those rental properties are in a single revocable living trust because each rental property can still have its own LLC designation if that's the case, which provides legal protection for each of those rental properties for your parents while still ensuring that they didn't have to create a rat's nest of trust. And so that's likely what they did did when they created this many decades ago. But I guess you'll find that out in this process.

[Matt]

That's right. But Joss, multiple decades. Holy cow. I think he said 30 years. It's definitely time to review this trust because a lot, a lot could certainly have happened over these years. Right. Like we're maybe talking to new members of the family, maybe new assets, a different split as to what assets are going to go to which person. But whether your folks end up simply updating. So that's the term that you used. Whether they do that, whether they update the trust as opposed to scrapping it all together and starting fresh. It depends on the scope of the changes that they are looking to make. And by the way, updating the trust is actually called amending the trust. So, like, not unlike the amendments to our Constitution.

[Joel]

Oh, do you have a favorite amendment, Matt, that you want to share with us now?

[Matt]

Which one repealed the 21st?

[Joel]

Oh, yeah, the undoing of Prohibition.

[Matt]

Yes, exactly. That's one of my favorites too. But if they are wanting. So that's an amendment. But if your folks are wanting to make a fairly straightforward change to their trust, like the ones I just mentioned, then an amendment should totally suffice. So for instance, adding a new beneficiary like that is something that can totally be accomplished via an amendment.

[Joel]

True story. On the other hand, if you're going to make significant changes to the trust, and over the years the trust has multiple amendments. Well, which it doesn't sound like that's been the case, Matt, because they haven't touched it in 30 years.

[Matt]

It's been sitting, gathering dust.

[Joel]

Yeah, but that would be when restating the trust could likely make more sense. Right, because if not done well, all the new amendments could conflict with each other, making it difficult to understand what's going on and what your parents actual wishes were. So it could create some vagueness in the trust that you don't want to exist.

[Matt]

Yeah. Alluding to more of the rat's nest scenario that you alluded to earlier. That's totally what happens when you keep on like bolting on these new fixtures.

[Joel]

To this, which amendment supersedes which one? And what was the original intent of the framers of this trust?

[Matt]

I almost picture like a, like a 88 Camaro or something like that. And like over the years it's had new owners and like everyone keeps adding things on. It's like, oh, the spoiler. Not the spoiler. Pipes out the side. Oh, we're. Put this on the engine. And man, after 20, 30 years, you start looking at this thing and you're like, does this thing even run? Is it even possible?

[Joel]

In high school, it wasn't Camaros, it was Honda Civics. That's what people used to mess with those and add on all sorts of stuff.

[Matt]

A Honda Civics, at least they get good gas mileage.

[Joel]

But then you couldn't even tell they were Honda Civics at the end of the day. So I think that's kind of your point. There's also the issue of privacy. Right. That's lost when you make amendments, because as beneficiaries, they can see the history of the amendments, which could lead to some drama and some potentially hurt feelings.

[Matt]

Exactly.

[Joel]

But I think it's worth considering an amendment since those are generally more affordable and easier to pull off than doing a complete reinstatement of the trust or restatement of the trust.

[Matt]

Yeah, restating the trust is sort of like if you strip the Honda Civ down to its frame and like completely rebuild the thing from scratch, as opposed to just like slapping on a new accessory. But, Jocelyn, again, this isn't something that we're experts on. And so we would highly recommend reaching out to an estate planning attorney with your folks. And this is actually assuming, too, that your folks are. You said that you are there in the Bay Area. This is assuming that your folks are as well. But you want to reach out to an estate planning attorney wherever, in whatever state that your folks live in. And I just think this is a great way for you to proactively get the ball rolling. You're having these conversations with your parents, and it's just going to be a better way to understand what it is that your parents, what they've got going on, and ultimately what their wishes are like. That's the whole point of the trust as well. For them to be able to direct their resources, their assets that they've worked hard and accumulated over the years, that they're going to the right people in the right directions that they wanted to.

[Joel]

And this should not be an expensive endeavor. I mean, we're talking three figures, not even four figures in all likelihood. I mean, depending maybe low four figures.

[Matt]

Restatement could cost a lot, depending on the complexity involved. But an amendment isn't something. And again, the fact that it hasn't been touched, I feel like. And if there aren't actually any major changes, it seems like an amendment that addresses some of these issues might be all all she needs.

[Joel]

Yeah, might be a simple fix. All right, man, we've got more to get to, more questions to get to from listeners, including one about, like, pest control, and it's getting kind of expensive. Is that something I should ditch? We'll get to that more right after this.

[Matt]

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[Joel]

That's why, for a limited time, you could earn a $250 cash bonus when you spend $2,500 with Navy Federal's cash rewards and cash rewards plus cards in the first 90 days. But the giving doesn't stop there. You could also earn up to 2% unlimited cash back with these cards. So saving up for whatever the season brings just got a little easier.

[Matt]

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[Joel]

As a small business owner, you don't have the luxury of clocking out early. Your business is on your mind 24 7. So when you're hiring, you need a partner that works just as hard as you do. That hiring partner is LinkedIn Jobs. When you clock out, LinkedIn clocks in. LinkedIn makes it easy to post your job for free, share it with your network and get qualified candidates that you can manage all in one place.

[Matt]

Now let me tell you how it works. First, you post your job. LinkedIn's new feature can help you write job descriptions and then quickly get your job in front of the right people with deep candidate insights. You either post your job for free or you pay to promote, which by the way, gets you three times more qualified applicants. And then just sit back and rest easy knowing that you are getting the highest quality candidates. Based on LinkedIn data, 72% of small business owners using LinkedIn said that LinkedIn helps them to find the best candidates. Find out why more than two and a half million small businesses use LinkedIn for hiring today. Find your next great hire on LinkedIn.

[Joel]

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[Joel]

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[Matt]

Buddy, we are back from the break and it is now time for the Facebook question of the week, which is from Susan and she wrote, I have savings languishing away in a low interest money market at my bank. I've been thinking of putting it into a High Yield savings account. I already have an Amex High Yield Savings set up with about $20,000 in it, but the interest rate has gone down multiple times in two years and has never gone up. Is that the case with all high Yield Savings accounts?

[Joel]

Yeah. Yep.

[Matt]

Yeah, that's pretty much that's what we've been seeing.

[Joel]

So if that's the only question, let's move on. No, I mean truly, every High Yield savings account has seen rates drop and there's really no exception to this rule that I'm aware of, except for maybe one Matt, one savings rate that I can say rates have not gone down at all. They've not gone southward. And that is only with the giant banks. They haven't changed their savings rates not one bit. Isn't that impressive.

[Matt]

Yeah, there's nowhere but up when you are at 0.01%.

[Joel]

Avoid those dummies, the giant banks, because they don't change their savings rates, but that means they never move them upward. So I guess just by staying the same, they're starting to look slightly more competitive with true high yield savings accounts. But yeah, I mean, because of the downward movement in rates.

[Matt]

Yeah, the Fed, man. Yeah, they've been lowering those rates.

[Joel]

That impacts a bunch of different sectors of the economy. But the saddest part for me, I really hate to see like we went through this era of savers making essentially nothing. And I just hate to see savers getting crushed. And so rates are still obviously higher than they were six or seven years ago. But yeah, to see him go back down kind of brings a tear to my eye.

[Matt]

Yeah, the past three or four years were nice if you were sitting on a good amount of cash. But as the Fed has Lowered rates. I mean, savings rates. That's one of the most immediate responses that you see. You hear from your bank, basically within hours of the Fed announcing a rate cut.

[Joel]

Yeah, you're just like anticipating that email. It's there.

[Matt]

And if. Yeah, um, but I will say Amex's rates are actually.

[Joel]

They're pretty solid.

[Matt]

They are totally in the upper echelon of online savings accounts. And so if you're happy with the product and you're happy with the customer service, I would totally just stick with them. Like, you can always find a slightly higher rate. Cit, for instance, has a slightly higher rate than what it is that Amex is offering. I think AMex is around 3.5%, but it's often not worth the headache of switching banks. Unless. Yeah, if you got a ton of money, like, I mean, if, you know, I don't know, if you go from 20 to 60 to 70,000, I might say, yeah, I don't. I might try to grab that extra 0.25%. That does add up over time.

[Joel]

Even with 20 grand, it's totally worth going from big bank to one of our favorite online savings.

[Matt]

Into the accounts, into the threes.

[Joel]

Yeah, that. That jump is worth it. But trying to go from like three and a half to 3.9 or something like that, I just. I don't think it's worth it. The hassle for most people. But yes, Susan, savings rates are going down. Your. Your bank is not treating you unfairly. It is just what's happening in the market right now. Let's get to another question. This one comes from Katie. She says thoughts on termite treatment, warranties and other options. When I bought my home in 2017, I inherited a termite policy. My house was treated during construction with a trench and barrier system that is reapplied every 10 years. It was done at time of construction, 2004, again in 2015, and is due again this year. I've never had any problems with termites, and my house was inspected last year with no issues. My home is in Florida with frame construction and hardy board siding. Since I bought the home, the cost of renewal has gone up every year. Started around 150 bucks, but it's ballooned to almost 500 bucks a year. The company that originally sold the contract was a large regional provider that has since been bought by a bigger company. I'm considered a legacy customer because my policy, and this is a long question, by the way, which includes cost of any repairs, not just treatment, is no longer offered. As long as I Maintain the policy. I'm covered, but once it's canceled, I can't get it back. I'm paying the renewal this year because it's a retreatment year and that's already included. But with the price continuing to rise, I'm wondering whether it's worth the cost going forward. I have a good emergency fund. Should I just self insure or are there other options I should be looking at?

[Matt]

Well, first off, I think what she said about it's a retreatment year, so yeah, that would be. I think it would be unwise to stop paying right now. Like you've been, you've been paying into this thing. Go ahead and get that last treatment. But I would totally consider not paying the next year, not renewing that thing. This is. Joel. This is like an industry that I feel is more clouded with fear a little bit.

[Joel]

Right.

[Matt]

Like it feels like such a. She said she's a legacy customer. I feel like pest control, generally speaking feels somewhat like a legacy industry where for a while there when people weren't treating their homes at all and we didn't. Folks didn't know better and there's like a lot of brush up against their house and houses were getting termite damage and yeah. Across the country we needed to make a whole lot of changes. But I feel like we've wised up. Right. And I think there's a whole lot of common sense that we can put to use and say maybe you shouldn't put all that firewood up against your house. Like there are some things like that.

[Joel]

It'S a breeding ground for insects that you don't want in your house.

[Matt]

Absolutely. And so I think thinking through that, I think thinking through whether or not you are in a more rural wooded area, I'm going to be more likely to say. To say yes to maintaining that pest control versus a more urban environment where there's hardly any trees around and it's mostly concrete. Or think. And she mentioned how her home is constructed. It makes me think about your old house that was like literally made of concrete.

[Joel]

Yeah.

[Matt]

Like the outside, there was no entry. They couldn't. They couldn't. And so I think this is.

[Joel]

The neighbors both have termite. Do they have termite treatments going on? And that's kind of insulating you to a certain extent from the need.

[Matt]

Yeah, it's true. Yes. I think these are just all maybe.

[Joel]

Go knock on their door.

[Matt]

They're just all considerations. It's not this like world ending thing. Termites are bugs and you don't want them for sure. And they can cause a lot of damage. But I think by implementing some common sense, I think that can help you to decide whether or not this is something that you want to keep up yourself, whether you want to cancel altogether or just continue to pay.

[Joel]

I mean, it's kind of like I put this in the category of you should go to the dentist twice a year and you should get your oil changed every 3,000 miles. Those are good rules of thumb. But it's also true that if you go to the dentist once a year and you get your oil changed every 5,000 miles, you're going to be okay.

[Matt]

You know, especially if you are running on synthetic oil.

[Joel]

Right, exactly. So and I get the $500 a year. Like, it's like, I don't want to spend that much on this. I've got other goals, other things I want to do with that money. But I think the horror stories about what termites have and can do, they often keep people paying the price. Exactly. Even. Even if they, like don't want to. But they're like, gosh, I don't feel I'm between a rock and a hard place. I don't have another option. But you have to weigh the risks and the potential rewards of keeping the coverage versus ditching it. And Matt, I don't have one of these contracts on my home, but we also regularly DIY pest control using a product called Tal Star. We have a post on howtomoney.com about how we DIY our own pest control. Telstar does not work the same way. It does not kill the termite colony. But if you spray it regularly around your house, it creates a barrier or like essentially a repellent for those termites. But mark your calendar, spray the perimeter of your house regularly, which essentially means every three months. And that website where we buy Telstar, they also sell the termite bait stations that you can install yourself. The ones that the professional pest control companies are using might switch over to.

[Matt]

The base stations instead of spraying.

[Joel]

And this is like, that's even more effective then. Right? So there are, I think, ways to also say, listen, I don't want to like just stop and do nothing and see what happens. Just roll the dice. But like, I do want to take some preventative measures, but also, like, do I really need to pay someone 500 bucks a year for that? Probably not.

[Matt]

Yeah, totally. Ultimately this is something that you can do for a lot less money, Katie. But if you were to actually have termite activity or God forbid, an actual like full on infestation you would, of course, be on the hook for repairs. And so that's something that, that you mentioned, Joel, that the plan that she has covers repairs, which is. I mean, that's pretty great. And also I'm going to note that she mentioned that she's in Florida. Termites are much worse in the Southeast. And so I would factor that in for sure as well. It all comes down to risk and whether or not you're willing. Whether or not you're willing to roll the dice. And actually, I'm thinking about what you said about reaching out to neighbors because. Because there is a certain element and to maybe touch on a hot topic, hot button topic, like, it makes me think of, like, people who choose to or to not get vaccinated. I'm not gonna judge either way. In a similar way, there's a herd. There's a level of herd immunity.

[Joel]

Right.

[Matt]

And if everyone around you is taking. Taking great care of their home, and whether it's they're spraying themselves or whether they've got these great termite bonds, these warranties in place, chances are you are gonna be much less susceptible to having termites. But that being said, if you look around and everyone around you is being a bit reckless, a bit careless, like, everyone around you is like, they're stacking all the wood up against their house, and you live in the middle of the woods. Yeah, I'd be. I'd probably sign up for the having someone else take care of this, because that's not something I would want to. I'd want to mess with.

[Joel]

So not. Not simple and easy or straightforward, but I think there are things you can do to get away from this expensive obligation, DIY it, and still feel pretty comfortable about your prospects for avoiding termite damage.

[Matt]

Totally agree.

[Joel]

All right, let's get back to the beer. Matt. This one was called the Scars on Greedy Palms. It was an ipa. It was burial. But also they did this in collaboration with Cloudburst Brewing, which is out of Seattle. What were your thoughts on this ipa?

[Matt]

Cloudburst. That sounds like such an appropriate name for a brewery out of Seattle where it rains a ton. This beer was so stinking. Good, man. It smelled incredibly dank right when we cracked it and poured it, but at the same time, it drank so fresh. I don't know if I've ever had a beer that was so dank smelling, but then so fresh tasting. So it was simultaneously hoppy, but it was also balanced as well. It was bright and light, Joel, but at the same time was earthy somehow. This beer packed like all the ends. Yeah, it did all the spectrums into one singular beer. And I thoroughly enjoyed it. So good.

[Joel]

I can't say. I don't know whether this beer was akin to walking out in like a. A 50 something degree morning where it's like crisp and beautiful and luscious.

[Matt]

It's a little chilly, but then the warmth from the sun is warming your face. Yeah, it's somehow got it all.

[Joel]

It's. Yeah, exactly. I was gonna. There's like a mixed thing in there because I'm not cold. I'm so happy. Yes. And I feel bright and sunshine and this beer like ran that gamut and so. Yeah, I really, really enjoyed this one. And I'll get more if I can because it was that good.

[Matt]

Maybe that was because of the Simcoe Dyna boost.

[Joel]

I know I was looking at some of it.

[Matt]

I don't even know what that is.

[Joel]

I know, I know. I was like, sounds like something from the movie cars that Lightning McQueen would put in his engine or something. I love it.

[Matt]

But that's going to be it for this episode. You can find our show notes up on the [e-mail] hey, leave us a review. If you enjoy this episode and you haven't yet done that for us. And of course you can do that. Wherever it is that you are currently listening to this episode, buddy, that's going to be it. So until next time, Best friends out. Best friends out.

[Joel]

We're teaming up in Daffy's Voices for Good Charity Challenge, competing with other podcasters to see who can raise the most for charity. I've chosen Fire, Undue Medical Debt and the Hope Effect to defend free speech, eliminate medical bills and and care for orphans.

[Matt]

And I am taking the effective altruism route by supporting GiveWell's top global health charities that save lives for just a few bucks. [e-mail] voicesforgood by December 2nd to back these charities and for a chance to win a trip to the 2026 iHeartradio Music Festival in Vegas. That's daffy.org voicesforgood Time is precious, and.

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[Matt]

Here we have the Limu emu in.

[Joel]

Its natural habitat, helping people customize their car insurance and save hundreds with Liberty Mutual. Fascinating. It's accompanied by his natural ally, Doug Limu.

[Matt]

Is that guy with the binoculars watching us?

[Joel]

Cut the camera. They see us.

[Matt]

Only pay for what you need@liberty mutual.com Liberty Liberty, Liberty. Liberty Savings Fairy unwritten by Liberty Mutual Insurance Company affiliates excludes Massachusetts.

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