Friday Flight - Tariff Tantrum, Southwest Succumbs, & The Greatest Grocers #957

Summary

How to Money Podcast Episode Summary

Title: Friday Flight - Tariff Tantrum, Southwest Succumbs, & The Greatest Grocers #957
Release Date: March 14, 2025
Host/Author: Joel and Matt, How to Money podcast by iHeartPodcasts

---

Introduction

In episode #957 of How to Money, hosts Joel and Matt delve into a variety of topics that intersect with personal finances, ranging from the impacts of tariffs on the economy to changes in airline policies and the evolving landscape of grocery shopping. True to their mission, Joel and Matt provide listeners with actionable insights, personal anecdotes, and thoughtful discussions to help navigate the financial complexities of everyday life.

---

Personal Anecdotes: A Taste of Austin

Joel and Matt kick off the episode by sharing their recent trip to Austin, Texas, highlighting their culinary adventures:

• Joel: “[03:00] My taco and brisket consumption went through the roof.”
• Matt: “[03:07] The brisket literally melts in your mouth. So good.”

Their visit to Franklin’s barbecue exemplifies how personal experiences can enrich financial discussions, showcasing the blend of enjoyment and budgeting.

---

Money Tip: Comparing Rideshare Options

A significant segment of the episode focuses on maximizing savings through smart rideshare choices:

• Joel: “[04:18] One ride on our way to the award show, Uber was $27 for half a mile.”
• Joel: “[04:40] Come on, $5 on Lyft.”

Joel emphasizes the importance of comparing prices between Uber and Lyft to uncover substantial savings. Matt adds insight into the behavioral economics at play:

• Matt: “[05:20] It's a very simple thing to do.”

They discuss how minor efforts, such as switching apps, can lead to significant financial benefits, especially in frequently used services like ridesharing.

---

Tariffs and Their Economic Impact

The hosts transition into a detailed analysis of the current tariff landscape and its broader economic implications:

• Matt: “[07:17] We are seeing the ripple effects of that bad policy shake out in some pretty substantial ways.”
• Joel: “[10:47] One economist called it the first recession that is totally unnecessary and could be stopped at any point.”

Joel and Matt explore how widespread tariffs are affecting stock markets, consumer prices, and the potential for an impending recession. They critique the use of tariffs as a blunt economic tool, questioning their long-term efficacy:

• Matt: “[11:54] Tariffs, they, you know, they can be a geopolitical tool if they're used sparingly.”

The discussion underscores the delicate balance policymakers must maintain to avoid unintended economic downturns.

---

Airline Industry Changes: Southwest's New Policy

A major shift in airline policies is examined through Southwest Airlines' decision to begin charging for checked bags:

• Matt: “[12:12] Southwest is now going to start charging for checked bags.”
• Joel: “[13:07] I'd do it if I'm fully retired, if I want to go do my grocery shopping on a Wednesday morning to get that extra 5 or 10% off.”

Joel and Matt express concern over how this move might affect customer loyalty, comparing it to iconic policies at other companies like Costco’s hot dog and drink combo. They predict that altering longstanding consumer-friendly practices could backfire, potentially driving customers to competitors.

---

The Rise of Life Coaches: A Costly Trend

The conversation shifts to the burgeoning industry of life coaches and specialized coaching services:

• Matt: “[16:15] You can now hire a meditation coach. You can hire a vacation coach, for instance.”
• Joel: “[17:35] We're turning to paid experts, and I do use the term expert lightly because the majority of these coaches, they don't have any formal designation.”

Joel and Matt critique the increasing normalization of hiring coaches for various aspects of life, questioning the affordability and necessity of such services. They advocate for leveraging free resources and stronger personal relationships as more sustainable and cost-effective alternatives.

---

Consumer Protection Against Scams: Zelle and Beyond

In an era of digital transactions, the hosts address the rising concern of financial scams:

• Joel: “[27:07] Chase is going to block Zelle payments made on social media in an attempt to reduce fraud.”
• Matt: “[28:24] There have been other scams floating around recently as well.”

Joel and Matt highlight Chase’s initiative to enhance security on Zelle by restricting social media transactions, aiming to curb fraudulent activities. They offer practical advice on safeguarding against scams, such as avoiding payments to unknown parties and scrutinizing URLs for legitimacy.

---

Best and Worst Grocery Stores: Consumer Experiences

Using data from Kiplinger’s analysis based on Google reviews, Joel and Matt discuss the rankings of grocery stores:

• Matt: “[31:22] Yeah, I do hate the fact, though, that it was based on Google reviews.”
• Joel: “[32:20] It made intuitive sense that some stores ranked higher due to customer experience.”

Trader Joe’s tops the list, praised for its vibrant atmosphere and competitive pricing, while giants like Walmart and Kroger fall to the lower end. The hosts emphasize the benefits of competition in the grocery sector, which often translates to better prices and customer satisfaction.

---

Senior Discounts Debate: Ethical Considerations and Practical Benefits

The episode explores the ongoing debate around senior discounts in grocery stores:

• Joel: “[34:24] Senior discounts are a form of dynamic pricing.”
• Matt: “[34:40] If I'm fully retired, I'll do my grocery shopping on Wednesday morning to get that extra 5 or 10% off.”

Joel and Matt support the continuation of senior discounts, highlighting their importance for financially vulnerable seniors. They liken these discounts to dynamic pricing strategies that benefit both consumers and businesses by incentivizing shopping during off-peak hours.

---

Home Energy Audits and Insulation: Saving on Utilities

Addressing home efficiency, the hosts discuss the significance of proper insulation and energy audits:

• Matt: “[35:04] So, if you're going to improve your home insulation, make sure you have a free home energy audit.”
• Joel: “[36:31] Our landlord put insulation in, did a couple of other things, and reap some substantial tax savings.”

Joel and Matt advocate for taking advantage of free home energy audits offered by utility providers. They share personal successes in reducing utility bills through enhanced insulation and the installation of smart thermostats, emphasizing both financial and comfort benefits.

---

Conclusion

In this episode, Joel and Matt adeptly navigate through a spectrum of financial topics, offering listeners a blend of personal stories, expert insights, and practical advice. From understanding the ramifications of tariffs and airline policy changes to critiquing the rise of life coaches and emphasizing the importance of home energy efficiency, the hosts maintain their commitment to providing valuable, jargon-free financial guidance. Listeners are encouraged to stay informed, compare options, and leverage available resources to enhance their financial well-being.

---

Notable Quotes:

• Joel on Tariffs: “[10:47] One economist called it the first recession that is totally unnecessary and could be stopped at any point.”
• Matt on Life Coaches: “[16:15] You can now hire a meditation coach. You can hire a vacation coach, for instance.”
• Joel on Senior Discounts: “[34:24] Senior discounts are a form of dynamic pricing.”
• Matt on Home Energy Audits: “[35:04] So, if you're going to improve your home insulation, make sure you have a free home energy audit.”

---

Additional Resources:

For more detailed discussions and resources mentioned in this episode, visit howtomoney.com. Links to articles, tools, and further reading are available in the show notes.

Transcript

[Joel]

This episode is brought to you by Navy Federal Credit Union. At Navy Federal, it's been their mission to help members of the military, veterans and their families reach their financial goals. There are a lot of great flexible savings and investing options like certificates with sky high rates that allow you to add money anytime throughout your term.

[Matt]

Plus, Navy Federal gives you access to financial advisors and online tools to help you find the investing and savings plan that work for you. Sign up@navy federal.org Navy Federal Credit Union members are the mission Savings products insured by NCUA Investment products are not insured, not obligations of Navy Federal and may.

[N/A]

Lose value AI is rewriting the business playbook with productivity boosts and faster decision making coming to every industry. If you're not thinking about AI, you can bet your competition is this is not where you want to drop the ball. But AI requires a lot of compute power and with most cloud platforms, the cost for your AI workloads can spiral. That is, unless you're running on oci. Oracle Cloud Infrastructure this was the cloud built for AI, a blazing, fast, enterprise grade platform for your infrastructure, database, apps and all your AI workloads. OCI costs 50% less than other major hyperscalers for compute, 70% less for storage and 80% less for networking. Thousands of businesses have already scored with oci, including Vodafone, Thomson Reuters and Suno AI. Now the ball's in your court.

[Joel]

Right now, Oracle can cut your current cloud bill in half if you move to oci. Minimum financial commitment and other terms apply. Offer and see if your company qualifies for this Special [e-mail] strategic that's oracle.com strategic where do you see your career in 10 years? What are you doing now to help you get there? The sooner you start enhancing your skills, the sooner you'll be ready. That's why AARP has reskilling courses in a variety of categories like marketing and management to help your income live as long as you do.

[Matt]

That's right. AARP has a bevy of free skill building courses for you to choose from. Because the steps that you choose to take today will help you to love what you do in the future. And that's why the younger you are, the more you need AARP.

[Joel]

Learn more at aarp.org skills welcome to how to Money. I'm Joel.

[Matt]

I'm Matt.

[Joel]

And today we're talking tariff tantrums, Southwest succumbs and the greatest groc.

[Matt]

Let's go man. It's our Friday flight. This is our weekly roundup of the headlines of the news stories this week and the headlines that pertain the most to your personal finances.

[Joel]

It's not boring right now, Matt, I'll tell you that.

[Matt]

There's plenty going on. But first, hey, you and Emily had a good time in Austin last week, right?

[Joel]

What's not to love about Austin, Texas? It's a great town. My taco and brisket consumption went through the roof.

[Matt]

So last time you and I were there, literally all we did was eat barbec. Specifically brisket. We went to all the different barbecue places.

[Joel]

Yes. And I finally got into Franklin's this time.

[Matt]

Did you really?

[Joel]

Yeah.

[Matt]

Well, we had no line.

[Joel]

It was crazy, really.

[Matt]

They've lost their edge. The.

[Joel]

It was like a 20 minute line, which for Franklin is nothing.

[Matt]

So we've had it before, but we just didn't have it in the actual. Remember our buddy Carl got us some.

[Joel]

The brisket literally melts in your mouth.

[Matt]

So good.

[Joel]

Yeah, okay. But when I was there. So we were there for the I Heart Podcast Awards. How to money did not win.

[Matt]

Sadly, we did not.

[Joel]

Business podcast.

[Matt]

We didn't bring any hardware home.

[Joel]

To be honest, I wasn't expecting that we would. There were better podcasts nominated than ours, but Planet Money, the good folks over there at NPR won this year. Congrats to them, and it was fun. We really enjoyed ourselves. One money tip that I can bring back, though, from that trip, Matt is. And I flew Southwest. We'll talk about Southwest in a second. But the money tip I can recommend is when you're using rideshare, check both Uber and Lyft before you book. I just didn't realize how large of a disparity there can be between the two. I know that. I was like, oh, it'll be a few bucks difference, and I'll book the cheaper one, of course. But I mean, how. How off can it be? Well, it can be off significantly, I found. So what was the.

[Matt]

What was the diff? I know I'm sure you checked.

[Joel]

So one ride on our way to the award show, I was, like, planning on walking, and I'm always like, can we. Can we ride? Just because I'm, like, looking all beautiful in this dress and it's like, yeah, you are. All right, we can ride. And I looked it up on Uber and it was $27 to go half a mile. I was like, that's crazy town.

[Matt]

27.

[Joel]

And she was like, oh, it's okay, we can walk. And I was like, hold on, let me check. Lift. Let me check.

[Matt]

And you're going soft, Emily.

[Joel]

Come on, $5 on Lyft.

[Matt]

That's. That's insane.

[Joel]

Insane.

[Matt]

Okay. So honestly, it's just amazing that we live in such that we live in a world where just the swipe of your thumb, you can do that. And the fact that you can save that much money, isn't that crazy? Like that's the beautiful world that we live in. What's crazy. What's even crazier though is the fact that there are going to be people out there who don't take the 10 seconds to hop over to a different app because so many things in our lives have gotten so lubricated, the gears have been greased. Right. Like if there is any friction whatsoever, folks just don't do it. Which is kind of sad. Like, that's my. I don't know. I see that as.

[Joel]

It's a very simple thing to do.

[Matt]

Yes, it's so simple. But if you are so used to things being just handed to you and things being so easy that. Yeah, that's, that's sort of, I guess the sad part of that. The fact that there is somebody who's.

[Joel]

Open the Uber app, I haven't even signed up for the other one.

[Matt]

The fact that there is going to be somebody out there who's going to pay five times more in order to get the ride the way that they're used to doing it. So that's the bad news or the bad slash sad news. But hopping back over to the good news, it just means that there's the comparative advantage. Like that it does not take much in order to save more. And if you're willing to jump through the hoops, do something that's a little bit weird, perhaps shop.

[Joel]

And that's not even weird. That's a shop. Itty bitty hoop. It's so small.

[Matt]

You can just comparison shopping via the different apps.

[Joel]

It's way easier than like googling for coupon codes. Right. Which could lead you down some rabbit holes to some weird websites. So yeah, I just want to mention that to people. Double check before you book with a ride share. I don't use rideshare very much in my everyday life, so I know you do a little bit more than I do and I guess I just forgotten how.

[Matt]

Always check, man.

[Joel]

How expensive it can be especially. And it's not that Uber always costs more than Lyft. I think that that's, that's not the.

[Matt]

Takeaway varies on the time of day, varies on the different. With the different markets, I've also found. So at times certain and I don't even know which app, but you'll get like a really low ball price for a ride, but then they have to find a driver that's willing to commit to that. And so I'm not exactly sure how it works, but sometimes I've done that.

[Joel]

To the wait and save.

[Matt]

Yeah, well, it's not just the wait and save, but it's like somebody will accept it, but then they'll bail on you. And I don't know how it works from a driver's standpoint, but if they're like, oh, my gosh, this is one of those crazy low, low rates. I found that there have been instances where I have claimed the. Oh, okay. It's. I'm saving a lot of money over here. And then I end up having multiple drivers drop the ride. And it's not because I don't tip. Like I've got an excellent rider reviews on my profile. But I think it's oftentimes themselves hopping over to a different app.

[Joel]

Yeah.

[Matt]

And trying to make a little bit more because they're like, okay, I could take that trip and take that ride. Take that person. Or Maybe I'll make 15, 20, $25 more by dropping it hopping over to the different app.

[Joel]

One of the toughest parts about rideshare is like, are they actually going to show up and take you where you want to go? Yeah.

[Matt]

Yeah.

[Joel]

Especially if you do the wait and save thing, which I did, and it worked out fine for me. And it does save you a couple extra bucks if you're booking that ride a little bit ahead of time.

[Matt]

But the unintentional wait and save, sometimes to bite you if you're in a hurry.

[Joel]

Oh, let's talk tariffs, Matt. Should we talk tariffs?

[Matt]

Let's do it. I'm not sure if you've noticed, Joel, the stock market, it has not been doing all that well. And it could be that I did notice. Well, yeah. Who hasn't noticed? I don't know. Hopefully folks aren't looking at their 401ks all that much today. Some folks say that there is a correction. The. An impending correction. Right. Like the fact that there was one that was inevitable as values were already sky high. But the reality of tariffs, the reality, the uncertainty that they create for businesses, plus the higher prices for consumers are clearly playing a role. Those higher prices could be felt as early as this week on produce from Mexico.

[Joel]

Those all important avocados, Matt.

[Matt]

Indeed.

[Joel]

They're not going to be as cheap as they have been.

[Matt]

40% of our imports come from tariff targeted countries. There are even tariff threats now on champagne. Luckily, we are a craft beer podcast here, Joel. That's what we enjoy.

[Joel]

That's because Europe, I think, went after all American goods like bourbon and Harley Davidson. And our president was like, oh, we're going after your champagne.

[Matt]

Then it's getting personal. But once people start seeing these price hikes, I'm curious if the political tides will actually turn because the Trump campaign promises of an economic boom that is at odds with the current policy priorities of levying these tariffs as widely as humanly possible. We've said it before, we'll say it again. Tariffs, they, you know, they can be a geopolitical tool if they're used sparingly, if they're used like a scalpel. But implementing these widespread tariffs is just plain old bad economic policy. And unsurprisingly, we are seeing the ripple effects of that bad policy shake out in some pretty substantial ways. The NASDAQ is in correction territory. The S and P is basically in correction territory as well. We're also already seeing downward revisions in stock market return predictions for this year as to what folks expect the market to end at.

[Joel]

Those are all mostly bogus anyway.

[Matt]

That is true.

[Joel]

And last year they were revising them upward and this year they're all revising them downward.

[Matt]

But even still, it's indicative of how folks are feeling about the stock market in general.

[Joel]

Yeah. And I don't know. I'm sure we're going to be talking about tariffs a lot on this podcast on the Friday flights for many months to come. And hopefully part of our discussion will involve tariff pullbacks. We'll see. And Trump v1, it was kind of more tariff talk and now we're experiencing widespread tariff action. And President Trump, he's basically said, hey, we're trading short term pain for long term gain. The Treasury Secretary has said the same thing. Speaker of the House Mike Johnson has used the analogy of billiards. He says that initial break, it's tumultuous. You send the ball scattering everywhere. But it's a needed shakeup. Right. And I don't know, I guess I have a hard time envisioning the long game, rosy outcomes if these policy priorities remain, if we kind of keep going down the path towards tariffs are the best word in the English language. And then when asked this weekend about the potential for a recession coming about, the president didn't rule it out. He didn't make it sound like it was off the table.

[Matt]

I think that was a wake up call for a lot of Folks like what?

[Joel]

Yeah. And one economist called it the first recession that is totally unnecessary and could be stopped at any point. And it's not that a recession is inevitable, but our leaders seem to be steering us that way. And I guess our advice to you is it's wise to be prepared. As always, it's good to have your personal financial ducks in a row. Americans care deeply about the economy and their ability to grow wealth. And that's still possible for how to money listeners in this environment, including for some buying stocks on sale. But you got to be prepared with liquid reserves and with resilience during the turmoil. I just want to say too, it's not all about avoiding a recession. Are we going to get into a recession or are we not just predictions of. And the Tax foundation had a good write up on this, that of a general economic slowdown, of a reduction in gdp. That means we'll see job loss. That means we might see smaller raises for people. We're just going to see businesses, I think, pinching pennies a little bit more with all of this like incoming impending tariff action looming. And that's just not good for businesses and then it's not good for workers.

[Matt]

I think the big question is whether or not these are negotiation tactics or does he truly believe that terrorists are the are the solution. Is it a gambit or not? Like in my mind, like that is 100% the biggest question and we'll see soon enough.

[Joel]

I hate it for you, your champagne parties, Matt, it's not going to be nearly as fun. So you're going to have to switch the champagne of beers, I guess.

[Matt]

Let's talk about taking our next vacation, Joel. It's the end of an era. Southwest is now going to start charging for checked bags. This is something we figured was coming. The Southwest way of doing things is being upended in an effort to make the airline more competitive. There are still ways for them to set themselves apart. But they were known for the free check bags.

[Joel]

Well, they marketed it everywhere. They plastered it on TV ads, on billboards.

[Matt]

It's what set them apart. It's almost as if Trump had an about face about tariffs or something like this. But no, no, you've always said that they're the most beautiful. Like, yeah, the most beautiful word.

[Joel]

I hate him. And you're like, what changed, man?

[Matt]

So this new policy for Southwest is going to start for bookings made after May 28th. They haven't made it clear as to how much they're going to charge per checked bag yet, but it does seem like $35 is likely going to be the going market rate based on what other airlines are charging.

[Joel]

Matt, I'm not a big fan of checking bags. You're not either. Although I have, and actually I did. I checked a bag on this last trip that I made to Austin largely because I wanted to bring back beer. And I went to the local package store, Texas Beers, brought back some good Texas beer. And it's so beautiful because I was able to bring it home for free. But in a couple months, I won't be able to do that anymore on Southwest, which is a bummer. And I do think that's going to impact kind of the loyalty, right? There have been these, like, articles written, the Wall Street Journal, the Dallas Morning News, I think is what it's called. And man, people who love Southwest are just torn to pieces over this. And I think it's going to impact loyalty. And, you know, while it seems like a smart thing, oh, let's get some money from checked bags like everyone else is doing. This could impact their bottom line negatively if fewer people remain loyal to the airline because their consumer friendly policies are going away. One way to avoid the check fee, by the way, is to have a Southwest credit card. And also just try not to check bags. Matt and I have talked about the Cotopaxi 28 liter backpack before.

[Matt]

It's a beautiful bag. Yes, the most beautiful bag. Joel, it's so great.

[Joel]

And you can pack all your clothes in there for a few days and you can bring that on the plane with you. You don't have to check it.

[Matt]

You can bring it into the office every single day, which is what I do with mine. It's, it's turned into my commuter bag.

[Joel]

If only Cotopaxi would sponsor this podcast because we, we love that bag so much. I'm just curious to see how this works out for Southwest. I just, I'm not enthusiastic about it. Even though I'm not a guy who likes to check bags. I know it was a policy that, that so many Americans really loved and that was something that caused them to look to Southwest. But first, so much of the time before they would even look to other airlines for their travel.

[Matt]

It's all, it's all relative, you know, like all the airlines have been feeling the pinch as people have reduced the amount of travel that they've, that they're partaking in. Compared to the past few years where we saw massive uptakes as folks, folks were looking to get out, right?

[Joel]

The revenge travel scene.

[Matt]

And because of that, all the airlines are looking for ways to, like, they're looking to stay competitive. They're looking for ways to find. They're looking for ways to increase that profit. And when you see somebody like Southwest start to charge for bags, like, what they're doing, like Delta, if Delta sees that, the way I'm looking at it, they're like, okay, well, now we can charge. We can afford to charge our flyers another $10 because, hey, look, even Southwest, even they're charging. So it feels. I don't know, I could see it being less of an onerous thing relative to what the other airlines are doing.

[Joel]

This makes me think, though, it would. It feels very similar to if Costco were to do away with the $50 hot dog drink combo or the $5 rotisserie chicken. Like, if that change. And there have been, like, conversations, supposed conversations between the CEO and people who are like, I don't know, we should look into this. And the threat is basically like, don't you ever change the price on that thing? Because it's a calling card.

[Matt]

I get it.

[Joel]

It's a loss leader. People come in.

[Matt]

It's such a small thing. But baggage fees are a huge part of profits when it comes to the airlines. It'd be more similar, I think, to Costco saying, hey, on all groceries, we are no longer going to limit our markup. Like, it's that big of a deal for the different airlines. But who knows? We'll see. And you still can't beat the Southwest companion pass when you're looking to do a lot of travel with somebody else and have them fly for free except for the 911 fees.

[Joel]

Yeah, we have an article about that. We'll link to that in the show notes.

[Matt]

Yeah, the Atlantic, they had an article about the rise of coaches. Joel, what do you think about life coaches? You know, you ever thought about, that's.

[Joel]

Gonna be my next job. In fact, if you want me to be your life coach, just shoot me an email. I charge the low fee of $500 an hour.

[Matt]

So that's something you've heard of. But there are coaches across the Internet who specialize in a myriad of different subjects. You can now hire a meditation coach. You can hire a vacation coach, for instance. You could like Disney coaches, specifically, let's say, if you. Your. If your destination is Orlando. Of course, we've talked about on the show, financial coaches, like budget coaches, they exist as well. We're going to be a little more biased and think that that might be a bit more helpful. But the hourly rate to hire these folks can be hundreds of dollars. And the question I'm asking is how many folks can actually afford that? I'm all for folks getting out there and they're trying to be scrappy and they're trying to carve out their own little niche out there in the information economy that we live in. But, man, I think I'm afraid of there being more and more folks who are looking to these different services and these coaching programs that are being offered and thinking that they're the solution, that they are necessary in order for them to achieve some of the different goals.

[Joel]

Yeah, it's becoming more of, like, a societal norm where it's like, oh, yeah, I just hired a coach for this thing over here. This random.

[Matt]

It feels like food delivery. Everyone's doing it. But like, man, how much is that costing you? That costs a lot of money, right?

[Joel]

Well, it's. And I mean, I think it's. It's kind of odd, I guess, that we're turning to paid experts, and I do use the term expert lightly because the majority of these coaches, they don't have any formal designation. They were just like, yeah, I think I'm going to become a life coach. I'm going to hang my shingle and hope that people come and pay me big bucks to give them that advice. But, I mean, given the wealth of free information that's at our fingertips, Matt, I think it shocks me even more. And as the author put it in this Atlantic article, they said hiring a coach has become the new asking a friend. And we used to turn to friends and loved ones and relatives. But because I think of our fracturing friendships, communities, and relationships, that we're less connected with our neighbors than ever before, we've kind of become accustomed to paying for more things, paying for advice, even. And so while maybe, hey, tread lightly.

[Matt]

There as far as paying for advice, you're going to start stepping on Emily's toes.

[Joel]

I think even. Even my wife would, as a therapist, that there are at least some people who have come in to see her. If they had good friends to talk to about some of these things, they might not have needed professional help in the same way.

[Matt]

Yeah, like, we've all. We've talked about the downturn in the number of friendships we have. But I also, like, I do think it's less about the quantity and maybe more about the quality, because what does a coach do? A big part of what they do is they hold you accountable. And maybe what we need are just better friends where there's a degree of accountability, which is easier Said than done. Because I'm sure there's a lot of friends out there, a lot of folks out there who are. Have friends, and they're just like, man, I just want to be a buddy.

[Joel]

Like, I don't want to feel like a sounding board. Don't tell me what to do.

[Matt]

Yeah. I don't want to feel like I'm prying or I don't want to feel like I'm asking too many questions. Like, you don't want to get all up in their business. But, like, I think that's a bit at the core of what it means to be a good friend is to ask some of those harder questions. And so as opposed to just sitting there and shaking your head yes. Yeah. And then talking about whatever. Whatever other different subject you want to talk about, maybe what we need are just like, deeper, higher quality friends. Which even sounds kind of gross coming out of my mouth. Like, oh, what you need are higher quality friends, my friend. I don't want to be the one.

[Joel]

That says that, you know what? I'm gonna go find myself a higher quality friend right now. This makes me think about, though, Matt, just, like, all the courses that people sell to and that's become also really normalized. And our goal here is to give, like, free information. Even people that we have on sometimes that sell courses or that that will. Will sell you a product or they will sell their time to you, we want to bring that information to you for free. So I think about Mr. Passive, who we had on recently to talk about making money in vending machines. I thought that was awesome. And that's such a cool conversation. Yeah, he sells a really expensive, like, mentorship course or something like that. We would say, hopefully you can glean enough from the free content that you don't have to fork over big bucks for that. And I think the same thing is true. Let's say you're planning a trip to Disney. There are so many free resources out there, whether it's on YouTube or blogs that have made it. They've basically figured out the formula and they're serving it up to you on a platter. And it's not an individual relationship where you're paying someone hundreds of dollars an hour to kind of construct it on your behalf. But if you're a little savvy and you can DIY some of that research, you can save a ton of money. So it's not that a coach can't be helpful at times. I guess it just feels like we're overly reliant on coaches these days, and that article in the Atlantic, it struck a chord with me.

[Matt]

Yeah, totally agree, man. It's almost as if folks don't want to take responsibility for their own actions. And almost. And by having a coach, you almost have someone to blame, like if things don't work out. But we've got more to get to, though. On our Friday flight, we're going to talk about whether or not senior discounts should still be a thing. We'll get to that more right after this. This episode is brought to you by Navy Federal Credit Union. At Navy Federal, their mission is to help members of the military, veterans and their families achieve their financial goals. That's why they offer great savings and investing options like certificates. Certificates come with sky high rates and some even have the flexibility to add money anytime during your term.

[Joel]

Whether you're saving for a home, a new car, or your future, their options could help you get there. And certificates are just the beginning. Navy Federal also provides financial advisors to help you manage your investment portfolio, along with online tools to guide your savings plan. With their support, you'll have everything you need to take charge of your finances. So don't wait. The sooner you start building your financial future with Navy Federal Savings and investing options, the better off you could be in the long run.

[Matt]

Sign up@navy federal.org Navy Federal Credit Union members are the mission Savings products insured by NCUA Investment products are not insured, not obligations of Navy Federal and may lose value. Hi, this is Joel and Matt from the how to Money podcast.

[Joel]

We're almost out of the cold winter months and the way I plan to help myself make it through is to think of the great travel I have planned this summer. Like the road trip I want to take with my kids out west. I'm going to take the whole month off, head towards Seattle for my cousin's wedding by car. I'm already plotting all the different Airbnbs we can stay at along the way.

[Matt]

Nice. I think that's a great idea. There's nothing like a cross country road trip during the summer months, and staying at Airbnbs is a great way to experience all the different towns and cities on the route. Plus, while you're gone for this long stretch of time, you could also be hosting guests in your home on Airbnb, making some extra money in the process. I was an Airbnb host myself for a while and I loved it. It was easy and it gave me the chance to make some extra cash.

[Joel]

And now hosting your home is easier than ever on Airbnb with the co host feature, access a network of high quality local co hosts who can help you handle everything from getting your home ready to helping your guests once they arrive with whatever they may need. Find a co [e-mail] host all right, Matt, now it's time for the ludicrous headline of the week. This one comes from a website called the Morning Call, and the headline reads, how to set and invest your emergency fund. I prickled when I saw that headline. You know how I feel about investing emergency funds. Those two words should never go hand in hand. They shouldn't be in the same headline. I clicked through so I could hate whatever words were written inside of that. And then I was like, wait a second. The byline is by friend of the show, Christine Benz, over from Morningstar. I was like, I know Christine is not advocating investing your E fund. And she wasn't. Fortunately, she agrees that emergency funds need to be liquid. But I was just like, man, I know that the person who writes the.

[Matt]

Book, don't blame it on her.

[Joel]

They don't always write the headline.

[Matt]

It's the editor.

[Joel]

The editor wrote a terrible headline. And because it's the ludicrous headline of the week, even though the content inside of the article was good, I can still add this in and say, I hate it. It sucks.

[Matt]

We'll give Christine, though. We'll give her a buy.

[Joel]

Can you imagine if your emergency fund was invested right now?

[Matt]

You don't want to do that.

[Joel]

Stock market's down 10% and you're like, wait a second. I thought I had 20 grand on hand for emergencies. Now I've got 18.

[Matt]

Not so good, actually. One of the things. So if you actually dig into the article, I will say one of the things she mentioned was that you need to have your money in the right receptacle, which I don't know if we've ever used that specific term before, but I love that. And I think I love it because I spent last week, I used my time and built this storage bin rack shelf system in one of our new closets.

[Joel]

Okay.

[Matt]

And in order to house the, you know, like the big 27 gallon totes or bins that you can buy from Home Depot, in order to house those, I can put like 4 across 5 tall. You do the math. That's 20 bins, Joel. But I've been thinking a lot about bins and storage and different things like that. And so maybe that's why that's. That word stood out to me because guess what? I'm not going to Put in those storage bins. I'm not gonna put your underwear. Yeah, my underwear or my socks. Because guess what?

[Joel]

Broccoli.

[Matt]

I need that on a daily basis. I was thinking. Yeah, I was thinking in the kitchen. Like, I'm not gonna put a lemon squeezer or a cocktail shaker or a blender, things like that in there, you know? Why? Well, I guess I make cocktails more often. But when it comes to, like, making smoothies, like, we never. We rarely make smoothies. Maybe once every couple of months.

[Joel]

We're smoothie people.

[Matt]

Y'all do it. Y'all do it a lot. But, like, even still, I don't want it to be way off. Upstairs, in a room, in a closet, in a bin. It needs to be down there in the kitchen. Sure. You kind of put it to the back of the cabinet, perhaps in the lemon squeezer. I mean, we're using that thing fairly often. So where do you keep that? Oh, you keep it right at hand. In a similar way, the act of investing your dollars means that that money is tied up for a long, much longer period of time. And that is not how you want to approach your emergency funds specifically. But Vanguard, they actually highlighted how 401 hardship withdrawals are becoming more common. To our chagrin, it's getting easier to access 401k dollars that are supposed to be locked up for retirement. For a while now, we've had the thousand dollar, no questions asked rule thanks to the Secure Act 2.0 back in 2022, which means that folks are turning their for cash in a pinch to their 401ks. And it's still relatively rare that folks are doing this. Almost 5% of folks with a 401k tapped it last year, but it is a record high.

[Joel]

So, like, what I'm pointing out has substantially increased.

[Matt]

Yes. The trend is not going in a direction that I like. It's like, I see 5%. I'm like, that's not a huge deal. But I hate the fact that that is a new record high because it has never been easier to grab that money. And if you need cash, we're just here to let you know that grabbing it from your retirement account is a bad way to solve that problem. It's going to create more problems and it's going to lead to less wealth down the road. You have unnecessarily interrupted that compounding growth.

[Joel]

Just because you can doesn't mean you should. And you're right. Yeah, it'll have a lot of negative consequences.

[Matt]

Speaking of blenders and smoothies Makes me think about when I decided to make a sandwich smoothie in college. Joel. Just because I could.

[Joel]

Yeah.

[Matt]

I quickly learned that did not mean I should.

[Joel]

It was terrible, man. I think we've talked about this before. Maybe not on the show, but when my little sister had jaw surgery growing up and we had to blend everything up for her for a few months. That's rough. Oh, that's rough. I just remember having to like walk out of the kitchen. I was like, I cannot even smell this right now. All right, Matt. Later this month, Chase is going to block Zelle payments made on social media in an attempt to reduce fraud. Half, apparently of all Zelle scams originate on social media.

[Matt]

I believe it.

[Joel]

So I mean, social media's got, yeah, it's right for that kind of stuff. And Zelle has come under fire for not protecting users in any meaningful way. This might cause, I think, some annoyance for some Zelle users who buy stuff via social media, but it's going to protect a whole lot more. You know, this is, I think a good reminder to be incredibly careful using P2P apps like Zelle Venmo Cash app, because just more consumer protections are coming, but they're thin and they're certainly not coming from the oversight of government agencies. So use two factor authentication and only send money to people you know or to verified folks. Matt, one of the thing this makes.

[Matt]

Me think of, send that test payment across.

[Joel]

That's right. My neighbor across the street had random people showing up to his house this week to pick up things that they said they bought on Facebook Marketplace.

[Matt]

No way.

[Joel]

And it turns out someone gave them a fake address to pick up the goods. They had already paid the person for the goods they were buying. Never pay somebody ahead of time until you're actually in full possession of that item and go to a well lit public place to pick up that item. That's rough. So they were showing up and they were mad at him and he's like.

[Matt]

You were not talking to me, sorry.

[Joel]

Right?

[Matt]

Yes.

[Joel]

He's like, that's not me.

[Matt]

And have yourself to blame.

[Joel]

Police had to show up. It was, it was a thing, it was, it was a bummer and I hate that that happened to those people. But just you cannot pay for something sight unseen.

[Matt]

There have been other scams floating around recently as well. So the ftc, they highlighted a jury duty scam. Folks are getting texts and phone calls and are being told that they missed jury duty. You know, you know, that's a proper activity that a law abiding citizen should be partaking in.

[Joel]

And that mail can get lost in the shuffle. You might think it's piece of trash or something like that.

[Matt]

Likely that that could have happened.

[Joel]

You're like, oh, I forgot. Oh, no.

[Matt]

But then you're told that you've got to pay a fine because you missed jury duty. And then if not, if you choose not to pay, you're going to be swiftly arrested. Which reminds me a lot of some of the different utility scams. It's like, hey, like, a business gets a call in the middle of, like, their peak hours, and like, we're about to cut your power. And they're thinking, well, we can't lose these customers. They end up paying right there on the spot. Another scam that I personally received a text for is the EZ Pass carpool lane scams. And so if you live in a state where you can pay money to avoid traffic in certain lanes, you could receive a text telling you that you have unpaid tolls. And then the text and the link to pay come from a scammer. Of course, it looks totally legit. In our case, it literally says, like, easypass.com but then it's got more letters. And if it's not the actual domain, it looks like the. Like a legit domain. But then you keep looking, trace that thing all the way off to the right, and you'll see. So I literally looked it up. It's specifically, the real domain on this particular scam is dot Z, not Z xin, which I guess is pronounced Zen, but it's primarily for, like, Chinese citizens, evidently. So there's a chance it originated in China, but it looks totally legit. Don't click it. Don't. Certainly don't copy and paste it to your browser and do whatever it tells you to.

[Joel]

Emily got the text and she did.

[Matt]

She really.

[Joel]

I got it too. And she was like, I didn't. I didn't click. But it did look official for a second. It made me look twice. And she was like, do I have an unpaid. I was in there the other day. Did we not update and put money on the toll pass? And I was like, no, no, no, no. That's a scam. But it can get the best widespread. Who should know better, right? That's for sure. Fortunately, neither of us clicked through and paid them money. Now let's talk about grocery stores. Kiplinger detailed the best and worst grocery store chains in the country. What they did was they used Google reviews from across the country to try and spot trends. And so Trader Joe's took the top spot in their analysis. Costco and Wegmans took second and third. Lidl and Aldi still take a respectable eighth and ninth, which just makes you.

[Matt]

Think that still first of my heart.

[Joel]

Yeah. We have so many grocery stores in this country, by the way. And so let's talk about the worst ones. King Supers Save a Lot, Kroger and Walmart. Those were the worst four, according to Kiplinger. And so, you know, price obviously isn't the only consideration, because Lido Linaldi would have been, like, top three for sure if that were the case. And we're just so fortunate to live in a country where we have so much competition in the grocery store space. I know we've experienced a lot of inflation in grocery prices over the last few years, and nobody likes to see that, but we all benefit from this increased competition. And it's just important to note you're likely to have a better experience at some of the top spots, some of the places that are ranked more highly, and a lot of those, you're gonna pay less, too. Matt.

[Matt]

Yeah, I do hate the fact, though, that it was based on Google reviews, because, you know, that somebody was in there, let's say, at Aldi, and they had just a sour interaction with an employee who's standing there stocking the shelves. Or maybe they're like, I have ever.

[Joel]

Had a bad interaction with an employee at Aldi, man.

[Matt]

Some people. It depends on your store, man. It depends on the store, the manager, the folks that they've hired. Sometimes, especially with Aldi. I'm just coming to Aldi's offense here. If they've never stuck a quarter in a. In a shopping cart before, they're just kind of like, I couldn't get a cart.

[Joel]

They're locked up.

[Matt]

How does that. Does that even work?

[Joel]

Yeah, because it feels weird. It takes some getting used to.

[Matt]

Yeah. A little tip. You can go to the cashier and ask them for a quarter, and they're allowed to give out a certain number of quarters per shift, so. Well, that's one way around that.

[Joel]

It also, specifically, to me, it made intuitive sense to see some of these stores at the top and.

[Matt]

Yeah, specifically, because, of course, they know how to sing and entertain. Like, ring bells. It's like a party when you go into a Trader Joe's, man, I'm like, are you all making, like, rum cocktails or something over here? I feel like I want to be a part of the island scene here.

[Joel]

It's not like they're charging ridiculous amounts more either. Like, Trader Joe's has pretty solid costs on a lot of what they offer, so Vibe makes sense that they're the top spot. And let's talk about senior citizen discounts, Matt. Like when you go to the grocery store, certain grocery stores incentivize seniors to come on certain days with a discount. So Publix is a grocery store chain in the Southeast. They give folks who are 60 and older 5% off every Wednesday. Fred Meyer offers 10% off on the first Tuesday of every month. And that's not all. There are more discounts at other grocery stores too. But the New York Times had an interesting article about whether or not senior discounts should just go away altogether. And the article was based on a reader who is questioning the ethical nature of age based benefits. But the author. I was glad the author kind of defended our senior citizens here, Matt. They basically pointed out that this not only helps seniors who might be financially vulnerable, which, which is a lot of senior citizens, especially if you're living on a fixed income. The grocery store, though, isn't terribly crowded during those incentivized times. It's kind of like incentivizing people to come to see a matinee movie. Yeah, there's a re. It's like, hey, who's free at like 1 o'clock on a Thursday? Not many people.

[Matt]

We're still paying rent, right. So if we get some butts in.

[Joel]

The seat, to me, that's a form of dynamic pricing. And so seniors and the rest of us, we should all be price sensitive and we should let those incentives sway us. If I'm. Matt, once I'm fully retired, if I want to go do my grocery shopping on a Wednesday morning to get that extra 5 or 10% off, I'm going to do it.

[Matt]

Yeah, Joe, the weather's been nice lately. Windows have been open. You, you love this time of year, don't you? Oh, man, you don't have to run your AC or your heat. You're kind of like in this, in between, sort of. It's like instead of it being like a purgatory, as in like a bad thing, it's kind of like a good thing. Yeah.

[Joel]

Oh, it's the best. I agree. I think it's. It's one of my favorite things to see how long I can go without running either the heat or the AC at all.

[Matt]

Just like get the fans cranking. Yeah. What we have to do, man, I realized last week that my sleep was suffering and I'm like, oh, it's because we still have like the Winter blanket on, because we let the temperature drop so much in the winter, but it means I'm, like, not sleeping as well. So we had to, like.

[Joel]

It's also because you're not sauna ing before bed like I am. My sleep has improved.

[Matt]

Have you seen your sleep scores? Sleep scores go up. Well, something that's gonna help folks to keep their utility bills low to keep from having to turn on their AC or their heat next fall or next winter, is to make sure that you have enough insulation. Cnet, they had an article about getting a free home energy audit, which it turns out a lot of different electricity providers offer to their customers. And the author, he found that he had almost no insulation in his walls, costing him massive amounts of money. And there are often incentives for making energy upgrades as well. And that's before you even, like, buy the electricity provider. And that's before considering any of the different federal tax benefits as well.

[Joel]

Those two things combined can really bring down the cost.

[Matt]

Heck, yeah. He was specifically in Massachusetts, and it was going to be completely free for his, in his case, the landlord, to get insulation put in the walls, which not only does it make it more comfortable from a temperature standpoint, but it acoustically is nicer as well. Especially if you got roommates. You don't. Yeah, you know, you don't hear your roommate in the room next door. Like, you know, you want, like, a little bit more privacy, and all of a sudden you're like, I thought I needed a bigger place. Turns out all we needed was to not be able to hear each other all the time.

[Joel]

Well, we made a similar move in our little clubhouse here where we work and record the podcast. Our landlord, we were like, hey, do you know about these discounts? Because it'd be awesome if you made some of these improvements. And we'll sign a lease, we'll stay longer. And it was a win. Win. Where.

[Matt]

So much more comfortable.

[Joel]

Yeah, so much more comfortable up here now. So he put the insulation in, did a couple other little things, and reap some substantial tax savings and electricity bill savings.

[Matt]

30% off.

[Joel]

Yeah, yeah.

[Matt]

Those federal benefits.

[Joel]

And then they might not have done it, I don't think, if we had not made the suggestion.

[Matt]

Sure, yeah. And the different utility providers, they've got those rebates as well. Georgia Power is offering, it's like 75% off. Smart thermostats. And so we're getting a couple Google nests. Normally these things are 130 bucks, man. We're paying like $32 a pop. You're limited to two. So we're going to go ahead and replace one of the other ones that, that isn't so smart and they look good as well. And they're going to help us to save a ton of money. So it's a win win.

[Joel]

Even if you have to pay full price, which many times you don't because your electricity provider is being generous because it's a win win situation, takes a.

[Matt]

Load off the system.

[Joel]

But even if you had to pay full price, it's often worth it, right, to have those smarter thermostats that learn how you behave and that don't run your air conditioner when you're out of the house during the day or something like that. Right. So yeah, or at least they run it at a higher temp if you forget to change the setting.

[Matt]

That's my favorite thing to do is if you forget. And we don't have the smart thermostats. So we can't do this yet until we get the new ones installed. But I remember at our old place because we had installed nests, the ability to check it from your phone and be like, oh, and you crank that thing down to where you want it knowing that you're saving yourself a ton of money. That's such a good feeling.

[Joel]

It really is. And I'll be curious to hear from a how to money listeners who avoids running their air conditioning the longest. If, if you can wait till, like, I don't know, mid June, let me know. I'd be rough. I'd be curious if you can make it that far and if your family allows you to live if you try to do something like that. All right, that's gonna do it, Matt. For this episode, we'll put links to some of the stories we mentioned up in the show notes on our [e-mail] that's right.

[Matt]

So until next time, buddy.

[Joel]

Best friends out. Even if you're a money whiz, it can still be helpful to have some professional backup and advice. I talk about personal finance every day of my life and I was still able to get massive value chatting with a CFP from Domain Money. They analyze every aspect of your financial life and help you build a personalized plan with clear steps to reach each one of your goals.

[Matt]

That's right. And for a limited time, they're doing free 30 minute strategy sessions. So start today by booking a free strategy session with one of their experts by going to domainmoney.com howtomoney I am.

[Joel]

A current client of Domain Money. I received a financial plan as part of the compensation for Domain Money's advertising on the podcast, and therefore I have an incentive to promote Domain Money in.

[Matt]

A world of economic uncertainty and workplace transformation. Learn to lead by example from visionary C Suite executives like Shannon Schuyler of PwC and Will Pearson of iHeartMedia, the Good Teacher explains the great teacher inspires. Don't always leave your team to do the work. That's been the most important part of how to lead by example. Listen to Leading by Example executives making an impact on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.