Holiday Special: 2025 Lessons, Risky Bets, and an Alaska Surprise (BONUS EP)

Summary

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How to Money

Holiday Special: 2025 Lessons, Risky Bets, and an Alaska Surprise (BONUS EP)

Podcast: How to Money
Hosts: Joel Larsgaard & Matt Altmix
Special Guests: Joe Saul-Sehi and the Stacking Benjamins team
Date: December 27, 2025

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Overview

In this upbeat holiday bonus episode, Joel and Matt join Joe Saul-Sehi’s Stacking Benjamins podcast crew to reflect on the biggest money lessons of 2025 and look ahead to 2026. The conversation is light-hearted, packed with friendly ribbing, but digs deep into the year’s most consequential financial trends—risky investments, changing views on homeownership, AI’s impact, and the timeless wisdom of ignoring political noise in favor of personal financial action.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

Opening Banter & Bestie Energy

• The hosts joke about coming in “second place” in a recent charity fundraising competition, highlighting strong communities in personal finance podcasts (15:28).
• Notable Quote:
  “I was feeling pretty good about myself, about our listeners, Joe, until you started rubbing our face in the fact that...you curb stomped us on the...daff. You’re talking about the Daffy Challenge, right?”
  —Matt (15:44)

Takeaways from the Voices for Good Challenge & Charitable Giving Trends

• Both podcasts raised substantial amounts for financial literacy nonprofits, like Undo Medical Debt and GiveWell-vetted charities.
• Undo Medical Debt (formerly RIP Medical Debt) highlighted for its high-effectiveness—buying and forgiving debt for pennies on the dollar (19:28).
• Matt stresses the value of effective altruism and maximizing charitable dollar impact globally, while also giving locally.

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[22:20] The Top 5 Money Lessons of 2025

Each takeaway is presented in David Letterman-style reverse-order by Joel and Matt, with commentary from the Stacking Benjamins crew.

#5: Emptiness of Political Promises

• Main idea: People increasingly look to government for solutions (e.g., student loan forgiveness, tariff rebate checks), but real, lasting financial progress comes from individual action, not policy changes.
• Key Points:
  • Political headlines create anxiety, but most are “empty promises.”
  • The most effective personal finance moves are independent of temporary political changes.
  • Stay focused: “Circle of Influence” (Stephen Covey) over “circle of concern.”
• Memorable moment:
  “I think there are so many people who are looking to government on both sides of the aisle... and they're looking to the government to fix all their problems. And what I love about personal finance is ... it’s not about policy.”
  —Matt (23:08)

#4: The Year of Riskier Financial Products

• Main idea: 2025 saw a dramatic rise in people pursuing alternative and riskier investment avenues—private equity inside 401(k)s, day trading options, and leveraged ETFs.
• Key Points:
  • New products feel “sophisticated” but come with high fees and huge downside risk.
  • The allure of quick gains is amplified by social media and gamification (see Robinhood’s features).
  • Novelties and shortcuts rarely end well—slow, boring index fund investing still wins.
• Quote:
  “When people are exposed and allowed to invest in more financial products... oftentimes those lead us astray and they lead to higher fees... we've seen some of those things come crashing down.”
  —Joel (27:49)
• Chutes & Ladders Analogy:
  “You want to catch all the ladders, but... there’s all these potential slides that can send you tumbling down.”
  —Joel (31:48)

#3: Renting Is Not Throwing Away Money

• Main idea: The classic wisdom that homeownership is always the cornerstone of wealth is changing—especially in the current economy, where renting can lead to greater savings and flexibility.
• Key Points:
  • Down payments are out of reach for many, and economic cycles shift buying-vs-renting math significantly.
  • Automatic investing platforms make it easier than ever to grow wealth without owning a home.
  • Job security and mobility play a bigger role in housing decisions than ever before.
• Quote:
  “...Just because individuals, our parents generation... say ‘You guys understand how much my wealth is because of this property,’...now it’s easier than ever for folks to use platforms... to invest in the market in a way that was inaccessible to our parents.”
  —Matt (35:31)
• On Job Stability:
  “People are working more jobs, moving more frequently than they have even in 2011.”
  —Joe (38:03)

#2: Government Shutdown—Plan Ahead for Bad Times

• Main idea: The record-long government shutdown in 2025 is a stark reminder that no job is immune to disruption. Having an emergency fund and a “bare bones” budget ready is crucial.
• Key Points:
  • Government jobs were once synonymous with security; no longer true.
  • Everyone should know in advance what expenses to cut in a crisis.
  • Liquidity (cash) is more valuable in emergencies than paying down low-interest debt.
• Quote:
  “Guess what really sucks? To get laid off on a Friday and then Saturday be like, what are we going to cut?...Having done that exercise puts power into your hands...”
  —Joel (39:54)

#1: Artificial Intelligence—The Game-Changer

• Main idea: AI was the story of the year, affecting everything from stock markets, workforce dynamics, and personal finance tools.
• Key Points:
  • Rapid AI advances fueled “Mag 7” stock run-ups and market speculation—are we in a bubble?
  • AI is replacing entry-level jobs (12% of workforce at risk), provoking a re-evaluation of college value and career planning.
  • In personal finance: AI is a valuable tool (e.g., fighting medical bills, finding info), but errors, misinformation, and over-reliance are big risks. Discerning use is key.
• Quote:
  “If at any time in my life I feel complacent and like everything is safe, this year proved that may be wrong.”
  —Joe (51:43)
• On College & Career:
  “There’s something like 30-year-olds are saying: ‘But I was told to go to college and everything would be fine.’ I think we’re seeing a generational shift.”
  —Joel (50:43)
• Podcast Humor:
  “Well, the great thing is [AI] can’t touch podcasting, right?”
  —Joel (54:42)
  “No, not at all.”
  —Joe (54:45)

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Listener Questions & Interactive Segments

Call-In: "Santa Nick" asks about Trimming His Holiday Budget

(64:51)
Santa (in a tongue-in-cheek call) bemoans rising costs of gift-giving, joking about socks full of junk and gluten-free cookies.

• Answer: The team discusses family traditions, defining limits, and the need to sometimes “just say no” as loved ones grow up—e.g., scaling back on gifts for older relatives. Also, the importance of seeking additional income streams if cutting isn’t enough.

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Year-End Investing & “Prediction Markets” Warning

(70:14)
The crew picks up a headline about the expansion of “prediction markets” like sports betting overlaps in financial markets.

• Points:

  • Prediction/gambling features (Robinhood, etc.) make risky speculation easier than ever—dangerous for the average saver.
  • Advisors recommend labeling this “entertainment capital” and keeping speculative plays minimal so they don’t derail your real plan.
  • Social media and gamification amplify the appeal and visibility of unlikely wins, distorting perceptions of risk.

• Quote:
  “Once the plan is good to go, then everything else is fair game. … What’s wrong is if you do that and your plan is blown up, and it doesn’t matter if you’re blowing your plan up because you’re day trading crypto or betting on football outcomes, or because you’re blowing too much of your money on exotic trips … all of that leads to the same graveyard.”
  —Doug (80:33)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Homeownership vs. Renting: “You have to just kind of like lick your fingers, stick it up to the wind and be like, what's going on right now? ... You're going to save a lot of money renting in 2025; in 2011, that wasn't the case.”
  —Joel (36:30)

• On Novelty & Investing: “Are we or are we not more distracted, more ADHD, and we're looking for the next new, shiny, bright thing?”
  —Matt (30:07)

• On Planning for the Worst: “This is obviously the emergency fund. Everybody who listens to this podcast knows about that. It's also something we call the bare bones budget...”
  —Joel (39:54)

• On AI & Careers: "If you are in an industry that is a bit more dynamic right now, you gotta be aware, you can't just blindly enter and hope for the best."
  —Matt (49:22)

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Episode Timestamps of Key Segments

• 15:28 – Charity fundraising wrap-up, friendly rivalry, discussions of charitable giving.
• 22:20 – Countdown begins: The 2025 Money Lessons (Political Promises, Risky Products, Renting, Emergency Planning, AI)
• 35:31 – Housing & homeownership debate
• 39:54 – Biggest lesson from the government shutdown: work security & emergency funds
• 46:48 – What’s #1 lesson of 2025? (AI and its impact across the board)
• 54:42 – AI and the future of podcasting (humor)
• 64:51 – Santa Nick’s call: holiday budgeting pains
• 70:14 – Risky “prediction markets” investing segment
• 80:33 – Entertainment capital and guarding your plan

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Tone & Style

The episode is full of warm, best-friends energy, with plenty of jokes and playful digs (especially over the fundraising contest). The tone is friendly, optimistic, sometimes irreverent, but always focused on practical, actionable financial guidance. Both “How to Money” and “Stacking Benjamins” live up to their missions: making sound money management jargon-free, accessible, and genuinely fun.

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Closing Thoughts

Joel and Matt reaffirm their commitment to “keep podcasting until the AI rips the mics out of our hands.”

• Long-term thinking, focusing on what you can control, and discerning skepticism toward novelty and headlines are the real winners, whatever the year brings.

Matt: “Every time I try to go like the short-term route, man, I end up screwing things up. ... Don’t do that.” (56:03)

Joel: “That's honestly how you win in personal finance—taking that long-term approach.” (56:36)

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[End of Summary]

Transcript

[Joe Saul Sehi]

This is an iHeart podcast.

[Joel Larsgaard]

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[Matt Altmix]

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[Joel Larsgaard]

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[Matt Altmix]

AARP has a bevy of free skill building courses for you to choose from because the steps that you choose to take today will help you to love what you do in the future. And that's why the younger you are, the more you need AARP. Learn more at aarp.org skills hey, it's.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Joel and Matt from how to Money. I I was just in Seattle, Matt, and honestly, it's one of the greatest cities in the world, particularly in the summer. I went on this run by the water. We hopped a ferry across Puget Sound. Just an unforgettable trip.

[Matt Altmix]

That's what struck me. What seems normal to a homeowner. It can be the thing that makes a guest trip really special.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Which is why hosting your home on Airbnb makes sense, right? Travelers are looking for those authentic, memorable spaces. And if you don't have time to manage all that well, Airbnb's co host feature makes it easy. A local co host can help with everything from creating the listing to keeping your place running.

[Matt Altmix]

Smoot Find a co [e-mail] host hey buddy, how's it going?

[Joel Larsgaard]

I'm great. How are you? I always love it when you start the episode. It's so different.

[Matt Altmix]

It's so different than what we normally do. And when listeners hear something like this, they typically know that besties are on the way. Bestie episodes. And it's man, it's like smack dab in the middle of the Christmas break, the holiday season. And I wonder if folks even noticed that we had some excellent bestie episodes lined up for you. We call them besties after all. Why? Not only because you and I are best friends, but also because these are the bestie episodes.

[Joel Larsgaard]

These are good ones. They're still good. They're goodies.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Yeah.

[Joel Larsgaard]

And if you haven't or if it's been a long time since you've heard them, we hope that, like, you enjoy them because, like, gosh, there's still so much good information, especially with the ones that we resurfaced. We're like, these are the creme de la creme.

[Matt Altmix]

There's a good word in there. But that being said, we did want to publish a little bonus episode here for you. We thought folks might want to hear some fresh content. Recently we spoke with our friend Joe Saul Sehi over at Stacking Benjamin's, the show actually that we referenced.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Try saying that three times fast, by the way.

[Matt Altmix]

It's not easy to say Joe Saul.

[Joel Larsgaard]

See Joe Salsi.

[Matt Altmix]

Yeah, you got it. You got it. One more time. But he invited us on because he likes to do a year end recap sort of episode. And we thought, you know what, this might be a fun episode for our listeners to hear as well.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Hear us getting interviewed and.

[Matt Altmix]

Yeah, yeah.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Talking about the, really the things that we thought were some of the most important trends of 2025, how they impacted people's finances and. And Joe harangued us about losing to him in the Daffy voices for good challenge too.

[Matt Altmix]

Did we call him out for having one donor in particular who brought the big bucks? I think I did. I don't want to, I don't want to seem.

[Joel Larsgaard]

I'm pretty sure that was a relative.

[Matt Altmix]

So I don't want to seem too much of a sore loser. We're referencing the daffy voices for good challenge that we did, which our listeners did such an amazing job. I mean, we already shared this with listeners. But I'm so proud of at the amount of money that we were able to raise and if we do it.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Again in 2026, he's going down. I'll say that.

[Matt Altmix]

I do think so. But yeah, this episode, a little bonus episode for you here on Saturday. We'll have some more besties for you next week. It's still the holiday season.

[Joel Larsgaard]

But back at it though, in the beginning of January.

[Matt Altmix]

Come on. Yeah, yeah, come there early in January. That Monday, we will be back at it. Excited to bring you the goods. So until then, enjoy.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

We are kicking off our holiday extravaganza weeks and I can't wait. The next two weeks are gonna be so.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Aw.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Oh, gee. I noticed as you sat down, you've got a phenomenal mug in front of you.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Thank you. Lotion and cream. It keeps the wrinkles away. I can't do much about the hairline, but the wrinkles are gone.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Just go to Turkey. Like one of my family members did. Just go to Turkey.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Not that important to me. I asked my barber, she said something about it one time and I said, yeah, maybe I'll do something about that. And she goes, no, you're not. And I just said, oh, really? She goes, no, because if you actually cared, you'd have done it by now. She's like, it's past.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

You missed the window.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

It's past fixing at this point. Like you needed to care about this five years ago.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

I was like, the ship has left the dock. She said, all right, I guess.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Okay.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

There aren't enough dark alleys in Turkey where you can get this fixed. Yeah.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

But out of that, a new holiday was born. A Festivus for the rest of us.

[Matt Altmix]

Foreign.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

From Joe's mom's basement, it's the Stacking Benjamin Show. I'm Joe's mom's neighbor, Doug, and on Friday, you heard what our roundtable team thought we could learn from the events of 2025. But what do others think? Today we welcome the hosts of the how to Money podcast. Two dudes you stackers beat like a Guitar hero drum kid at a nine year old's birthday party last month while raising money for charity. I mean, two amazing, intelligent and handsome dudes. Okay, that's a bridge too far. I draw the line at intelligent. It's Joel Larsgaard and Matt Altmix. In our headline segment, we'll feature an ugly prediction from investment news about 2026. But don't worry, I'll also share a TikTok minute about AI yet again. And I'll also share some incredible year end trivia. And now two guys who Joe's mom says are the rear ends of this podcast, whatever that means. It's Joe and. Oh, Juju. Jj.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

I think she means Doug. That here we are at the rear end of 2025. Yeah, we are helping people dive in. That's what she means.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

Yeah, you're right.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Hey, everybody. Welcome to the beginning of the holiday extravaganza that we have at the end of every year at the Stacking Benjamin Show. I am Joe Saul Sehi and Across the card table from me, it is the one and only the Mr. OG, the number one funkle.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Indeed.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

OG numero uno, rear ends. I was thinking like rump roast. I was thinking like the prime rib roast.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

Joe, did you notice that the font on the number one Funkle mug is the Godfather?

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Oh, it is. Oh, it is, it is.

[Matt Altmix]

So.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

I mean, there's a subtle hint there. Like they all know.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

We swear to God, you're fun. We swear to God. Here, please take a mug. Please, please.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

They have to come into his darkened office every, every Christmas Eve with their hat in hand.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Well, let me tell you all what's coming up here to round out 2025 and kickoff 2026 today, of course, Doug, as you said, Joel and Matt joining us to talk about what their top five lessons from 2025 would be. We heard the roundtables, now we'll hear theirs. We also have a TikTok minute that is nearly as good as that guy from China Airlines we talked about last week, East China Airlines. That thing that just happened. That was really cool.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

Yeah, yeah, it definitely is a true story.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

By the way, thanks to our stacker on Spotify who also sent us the link. Oh, gee. That you sent saying, yeah, that's, that's a fake deal. But this one's not. This one is. We're gonna, we're gonna protect some people today in our tick tock minute. We also have a call in. Anna's not here. And we have a call in today. We normally don't do them without Anna here helping us out with that, but today we're going to take one because it is year end extravaganza on Wednesday, Christmas Eve. For those who celebrate, we are playing Doug and the Three Ghosts. And if you haven't heard this story that we totally came up with on our own about Doug being visited by these three ghosts, about his, his credit it happened and his money habits. Not inspired by anything at all in particular. Just totally came up with it. So that is then. And then on Friday we begin Friday, Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday of next week, we're gonna have six days, seven shows, all kinds of goodness. Some of our best guests from 2023, we're diving back like we did last year. Three years. And we're playing the best of three.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Years ago because everybody already heard this year.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

Yes, we're hoping they forgot. It's like far enough back that they forgot those and we're, we're going to resurrect them for them.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Well, and I'll tell You, these mentors, Doug, are are shows that you want to hear again. I got really excited about those and some of our top episodes with just the three of us. And then our number one show from 2025, we'll also use to kick off 2026. So a great, great year coming up. But we've got one more thing before we welcome Joel and Matt to the basement. We're unveiling it, guys. It's about time. The Stacking Benjamin's Vault is finally open. Finally, the ferrets that spin the wheel here in mom's basement have made the master product. You thought the guides were good. You thought that OG's practice was good. Now you can get the vault.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

Well, is this the thing? Like, every guy has a vault. And when, like, and you've got your best buddy and you're like, dude, if I ever die, like, here's where the vault is. It's all, make sure you get rid of it.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

It's all that, but with your financial information. We call it the Vault because we know how important it is to protect your identity. Stay away from unused subscriptions. Get off the text and email list. The people that are selling all your data. You get all these rando texts, hey, so what are you doing for dinner? You know, those come from just a few places that are constantly selling your data. Protect your credit, run credit, what ifs. It's all finally here. The super tool that we created with the team at ARRAY who protects millions of people like you. And I was super happy to team up with them to bring you the Stacking Benjamin's Vault. So check out stackingbenjamins.com vault. See how it works. Finally take control of subscription management, identity protection, Getting removed from trash list. Controlling your credit stack. Benjamins.com vault gets you there. I'm excited. I've been waiting to say that line OG for a long, long time.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

We've been practicing it, that's for sure.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

We began developing this with the team at ARRAY back this summer. And so it's good to finally get it out there. All right. The two guys who were super happy to talk to today, even though. Doug, you said it. Stackers. You guys kick their butt in the voices for good challenge. We're so proud of the fact that you raised so much money for Gifting Sense Wonderful Karen Hollins tool that helps kids learn financial literacy. And you, you can go to giftingsense.org and check it out. We also thought it was probably time to bury the hatchet. We kind of talk a little trash about them. So good time to acknowledge two guys who are really good dudes actually have a fantastic show. How To Money.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

You better mute my mic because I still want to dunk on them.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Joel and Matt from How To Money coming down to the basement in just a moment. But while we're waiting for them to sit down, we got a couple sponsors that help us keep on keeping on. We're going to hear from them and then we're kicking off the holidays with Joel, Lars Guard and Matt Altmix.

[Matt Altmix]

This time of year it's got me thinking about presents I've received over the years.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Joel.

[Matt Altmix]

Specifically, I'm thinking of one family member in particular would often get me these overly grown up gifts when I was in high school, like for instance a super high quality socket wrench set or like a really nice stereo. Now at the time I thought it was silly, a bit unnecessary. But here's the thing. I still have and I still use those gifts today. They have endured. Similarly, policygenius can help you give your family a gift that can last a lifetime.

[Joel Larsgaard]

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[Matt Altmix]

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[Joel Larsgaard]

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[Matt Altmix]

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[Joel Larsgaard]

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[Matt Altmix]

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[Joe Saul Sehi]

And I'm super happy these guys are in mom's basement. In fact, we are ending the year with the biggest stars we've had all year. Oh, shout out the guys that finished second place.

[Matt Altmix]

Oh, my gosh, what a jerk.

[Joel Larsgaard]

I'm leaving before this begins.

[Matt Altmix]

Yeah, so Joe brought us on just to drag us through the mud, just.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

To say that you guys could go now. No, it's my good friends from HUD of Money, Joel and Matt. How are you guys?

[Joel Larsgaard]

Not. Not as good.

[Matt Altmix]

Now do it. Yeah, I was feeling pretty good about myself, about our listeners, Joe, until you just started rubbing our face in the fact that. That you curb stomped us on the. The daff. You're talking about the Daffy Challenge, right?

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Yeah. Stackers did a wonderful job. But you know what? So did the how to Money audience. And, and what I do want to say, that was really a. It was very hard trying to make fun of you guys for a month. It's not easy making fun of guys that I like as much as I annoyingly like you two. But then the second thing is for a month I was like, when are all these celebrity podcasts that the two of you and us that we're going up against? When are they going to catch us?

[Matt Altmix]

Dude, they never did So I think once you are a celebrity, you're allowed to. I mean, you're opening yourself, you are opening yourself up to criticism. Just the fact that you have a podcast, right. But if you are a true celebrity, okay, you are open to all attacks. And I was super disappointed in the fact that like, you've got some of these other shows. These are like legit stars, folks who are on shows who, what was it like one kid was the voice on, like how to train your dragon or something like that.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Family favorite.

[Matt Altmix]

And I don't know, truly, I don't know much about these folks individually. But yeah, I was a little disappointed to see that they didn't seem like they're encouraging their audience to participate because I think if they had, they would have seen some a bit more participation and more good put out there in the world. But I guess that's more our lane, giving personal finance and being smart with it and being generous. But yeah, I think it's a bit disappointing.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Maybe we should just also say, congratulations, Joe Stacking Benjamin's well done. Proud of you guys.

[Matt Altmix]

You know what?

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Roll in his eyes.

[Matt Altmix]

I did hear Joel say, Matt, you know, it was only like one or.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Two big donors that Joe had. It wasn't. Dude, you should have seen. I swear it was. It was his relatives. He called his uncle. Like, he just like browbeat people around the Thanksgiving dinner. That's what you did, Joe. We know how you did this.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

My dad does have 16 brothers and sisters, so we do have a large family.

[Joel Larsgaard]

See.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

But I'll say this, that we had as. As you guys did. We had a huge number of people that gave. I was super excited to see our community, your community. And even though you said, matt, that's our lane outside of personal finance communities, we're not known that way. Like, people think that the reason you listen to a money podcast is because you're a little greedy and you want more, more, more for me, me, me and you, you guys. And I know that's not true, and I think we really did a great job proving it. We were raising money for financial literacy. You guys were raising money also for some cool, cool sorts of stuff. Yeah.

[Matt Altmix]

My big thing is unfortunately, Sam Bankman, Fried drug truist. What is effective altruism? Through the mud a little bit. Speaking of dragging people through the mud. But I mean, my whole approach is for folks who are looking to, I mean, from a personal finance standpoint, you're looking for the most value. Right? And so the charities that give, well, assesses and more of the Money that you're giving to them is going to impacting lives and saving lives specifically. So for me, I don't know, it makes it. I like the ability to not have to research it. And the fact that they have gone through this vetting process in such a thorough way makes me feel good about every single cent on a global standpoint. But then, of course, leave space when it comes to being able to give locally, whether with Joel and I both give to our church, local schools, different things like that, to be able to participate locally, I feel like the duality. I like that approach on a grand scheme where your money can really go far to literally save lives as opposed to, okay, how do I want my personal life and the people around me to be able to benefit from my own charity?

[Joe Saul Sehi]

100. Can we. Can we talk for a second? Because I think our stacker audience might not know what charities you guys were supporting. Joel, who was. Who were you supporting?

[Joel Larsgaard]

Yeah, I'll just say one of my favorites. It used to be called Rip Medical Debt. They changed their name to Undo Medical Debt. I don't know why they changed their name because Rip Medical Debt had such a. Such a nice ring to it. Right. They're all about eliminating medical debt that people have accrued. Right. So think about like some of the. What we hear right from. From listeners, what. What you see as just a nationwide terrible trend is people have more debt than they've ever had before is. Is what it feels. And medical debt is one of those things that puts people on shaky ground. People don't know how to negotiate it down. And so that's one of the nonprofits I was particularly trying to raise money for was to help relieve people of that debt because it can be sold for pennies on the dollar. And that's what this organization does. They buy the debt and then they forgive the debt. And so that person, they get a letter in the mail and it's like, hey, guess what? You. You thought you had $12,000 in medical debt. You don't have it any longer. And it's. And undue Medical Debt didn't spend 12 grand. They spent a whole lot less than that. So they can forgive medical debt by the insane number. So that. That's. That was one of the nonprofits.

[Matt Altmix]

That's another way that it feels like your dollars are going a lot further because it's like on. On paper, this is how much has been forgiven, but in reality, this is how much? A hundred X. Oh, my gosh. Yeah. That's super cool.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Matt, what was One of yours, let's see.

[Matt Altmix]

So GiveWell was the organization that was vetting some of the charities like, so new incentives. Helen Keller International, both of these are international charities. Where mosquito netting was, was another one as well. But again, just the ability for a very small amount of money to be able to provide supplements where kids are avoiding some of these lifelong diseases.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Insert athletic greens commercial here.

[Matt Altmix]

I know, definitely, dude, I'd try some AG one, but, you know, these are core nutrients and minerals that we take for granted here in the very wealthy, developed western world that other parts of the world that they don't have. Right. And something as simple as. As mosquito nets to prevent kids from getting malaria. And it takes so little money to be able to set these individuals and these families up. Providing incentives for mothers to bring their kids in to receive some of these supplements. It's just. It makes a huge impact. And again, when you're looking to change the world, there's only so much money that, that I have. Joel's got a lot more than I do. And so I'm trying to stretch my dollars, you know, just too little butter over too much bread, perhaps.

[Joel Larsgaard]

But yeah, I hold it over him all the time.

[Matt Altmix]

Do what we can.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

It was such a fun way to spend a month and such a warm feeling that on our last show of the year that we're talking about being able to give and our ability to give and how helpful our communities were. You guys have been able to help our stackers today too, by being our guest of honor in the seat of sharing. What were the, in your minds, five of the biggest things that happened in 2025 that we can maybe learn some lessons from. Do you guys mind if we do these like, David Letterman style? Did you put them in?

[Joel Larsgaard]

Oh, let's do it in like an order.

[Matt Altmix]

Yeah, we weren't watching a whole lot of late night TV back in the 80s and 90s.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Can we start with the clearest, most obvious one, though? It's the cracker barrel logo change. Joe. Like, that's the one I learned the most lessons from. Watch your PR and marketing.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Yeah. Maybe do a little PR marketing stuff before you have to handle the emergency.

[Joel Larsgaard]

PR firm later to try Harry and Space. That was another one that to me really resonated deeply this year.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

You know, Katie and I both cried after that.

[Joel Larsgaard]

So that was that, I believe.

[Matt Altmix]

Oh, man.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

What was your number? Five, gentlemen?

[Matt Altmix]

Oh, are these in any particular order? Which one?

[Joel Larsgaard]

So let's. We got them written out.

[Matt Altmix]

We'll start with maybe some more of the empty promises. That. Let's just talk about politics, Joe, speaking.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Of religion, next, can we do religion?

[Matt Altmix]

Speaking of cracker barrel and alienating your audience, we're just going to cut to the chase. I think there are so many people who are looking to government on both sides of the aisle. Right. Like we saw this in previous administrations, we see this now, and they're looking to the government to fix all their problems. And what I love about personal finance is we hardly ever get into that stuff because it's not about policy. Like, we need to pay attention to how certain things that are actually changing, how they impact your tax bracket and different rmd, just the different laws pertaining to your money. But when it comes to just the. Oh, they're floating this idea. Oh, you got this, you got that. Sometimes it's fun to talk about because it allows us to sort of latch onto a deeper, more substantial truth and what that means for individuals and how they handle their money. But for the most part, what we talk about are things that individuals can do. And there are cost, whether it's student loan forgiveness like last administration or whether it's, you know, at this point in time, additional health savings accounts or.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Or the tariff rebate checks.

[Matt Altmix]

Right.

[Joel Larsgaard]

That were floated this year, everybody's going to get $2,000. And which is funny because it's like a problem that's. Then the solution is the creation of the problem has been done by the people in charge. And then it's like, let's create a solution to the problem that we created. This is like a perpetual thing in the world of politics. And sorry to start off on a political note, but it's just one of.

[Matt Altmix]

Those things, just getting it out of the way.

[Joel Larsgaard]

There's promises right and left and you just have to be discerning. And while it might sound great, like, is it actually going to come to fruition? And yeah, the student loan forgiveness thing didn't. That was struck down. The tariff thing, don't think that's going to happen. The tariffs, I guess, are another one of those things that was like one of the big, big things of this year.

[Matt Altmix]

Yeah, we actually don't have that one down, but that's another one where. Yeah. Should you invest based on what you think, what tariffs are or aren't going to come through? And yeah, I'm sure a lot of folks were thinking that back in April.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

But yeah, when I said yeah there, I did mean, yes, you should. Yeah, I agree. And when I was a financial planner, people would come into my office and they'd see these Headlines. And the first thing they wanted to talk about is, oh, like, pretend it's today. What do you think about tariffs? What do you think about the fact that even the government saying that the cost of our health care is going to go sky high next year? What do we do about the fact that, you know, with the Fed, the changing of the Fed chairman, like, what do we do about all that? And they come in with all this stuff. And when we, to your point, would look at the financial plan and go, hey, you know what? I'm not sure about that. We'll get back to, let's put a pin in that. But in the financial plan, it says that by today, your accounts needed to be at the, let's say, $85,000 for you to be on track, to be on the ladder toward your goals. Are you ahead or behind on that number? And then all of a sudden they get off the idea of all the crap they can't control and they start digging through, you know, looking up their 401k, looking up their investment accounts, and they go, oh, we're a little bit ahead or we're a little bit behind. Then all of a sudden we're talking about, what do you have to do?

[Joel Larsgaard]

Yeah.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

And not about what is somebody else going to have to do. And you know what's cool? All this third party crap never came back again. And we just focused on what we could do.

[Joel Larsgaard]

There was a recent survey of CFP professionals and it found that more of their clients are coming in. And politics is one of the top line items on the discussion. I think people are like, hey, this seems to be happening. This is like, what's going on? How is this going to impact my finances? And the truth is, like, we see legislation that dramatically impacts, like, whether it's raising of the standard deduction, whether it's the new Trump accounts for kids. Right. Whether it is some tweak to the tax code that really does change the incentives for what we do around the margins. Like, those things matter. That's why our Friday flight exists, to talk about the headlines, how they're going to impact your finances. We do it every week. We think it's really important. But of course, the most important thing is the evergreen stuff that you're doing with regularity. No matter who's in the White House, no matter whether the Senate's 60, 40 in favor of red or blue, the actions we take are pretty consistent throughout the years, even though there are tweaks to be made around the margins.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Yeah, great stuff. That's A great place to start. Even though you freaked me out of politics.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Guys like Matt's running for president.

[Matt Altmix]

I just figured we'd go ahead and rip the band aid off, get it out of the way. But I like what you say. Like you're talking or maybe you said too just focusing on what you can control. Right. Is it Stephen Covey, the seven habits, like the circle of influence and then finding ways as you learn more about personal finances and like you are expanding your circle. And those are things that you then have an impact, a direct impact over when it comes to your personal finances and what it is, the kind of differences that you can make in your own life that are going to lead to substantial, lasting change versus the headline of the day.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Well, we got off to a great start. What's number four on the list?

[Joel Larsgaard]

All right, number four is this past year was a year of riskier financial products. And we're talking about private equity inside of 401ks. We're seeing a rise in people day trading options. We're seeing a rise in alternative investment opportunities out there. And we've seen some of those things come crashing down. So I think when we talk about kind of the simple ways to invest often being the best when people are exposed and allowed to invest in more financial products and there's a wider array, more now than seems like ever before, oftentimes those lead us astray and they lead to higher fees. They lead to, man, think about even just some of those, the alternative investment real estate platforms and how people have lost most, if not all of their capital investing in real estate online. And so it seems like this thing I'm going to diversify, right? That's like a way that you might even convince yourself that this is a smart move.

[Matt Altmix]

It's just a bit more sophisticated. It's just like, you know what I'm not going to do. What everyone else is doing at work with a 401k is kind of boring, right?

[Joel Larsgaard]

The index funds, like, I've heard about those things. I'm doing that with some. But man, I really, I should be doing something beyond that, right? Let me delve into some of this stuff that's going to produce higher returns. And of course, when you go to the homepage of any of those alternative investing sites, it sure looks like you're going to the moon a whole lot faster. But what happens is people don't look at the fees, they don't look at the details, and they don't realize that their capital is at risk. And so we've seen a lot of. I think that that come back to bite people on the investing side.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

It's really wild to me that on one hand, you see everybody on Wall street saying, this is a good idea. All these private Equity Investments inside 401ks. We definitely need to do that. At the same time, equity multiple. The real estate company I think you're talking about is blowing up. Right. I mean, they now have had to change their name, which is just whenever a company has to change their name. In fact, the network you guys are on had had to change their name.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Because Matt had to change his names multiple times because some of the things he did in some of the towns that he had to leave.

[Matt Altmix]

That's true.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Yeah.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Yeah.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

It's absolutely horrible. Like, are you kidding me? So what's it about them? Why are so many people talking heads that you see on CNBC or Fox Business? Why do they keep saying, this is a good idea, we need this. You, you, hey, you got all these opportunities out here.

[Matt Altmix]

What do you think? I mean, there's an element of novelty, right? Like, are we or are we not more distracted, more adhd, and we're looking for the next new shiny, bright thing. It's either that or the fact that they're behind and they're looking to make up lost time. Right. They didn't start investing when they first heard about compounding interest, you know, in their early 20s. And maybe some folks, maybe they never heard about it. And I feel for those folks, if you are in a situation where you missed out on some of those early years, yeah, maybe you are trying to pick up lost ground. But I think more than anything, it's just folks, it's like a novelty. It's a stimulus sort of environment that we live in. Right. Like, we are used to the algorithms. We are used to 15 seconds clips of video. I was talking to a comic recently and he's been in some major movies and him and his wife.

[Joel Larsgaard]

That Chris Rock. You heard of him?

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Yeah, yeah, my good friend Chris Rock. I can't believe, by the way, he didn't just go ahead and name drop Joel.

[Joel Larsgaard]

He usually does.

[Matt Altmix]

I try. I'm a humble guy, Joe. But like, we were talking about this sort of series that him and his wife created on YouTube and then he's just like, you know, it's how it is that we create. Content has changed. And like, he's like, I mean, I'm doing it to myself. Like our. You kind of chop it up and create the small, quick little hits, but nobody's Necessarily incentivized to go and watch the whole thing. They kind of are fed the interesting, novel, entertaining thing and then they. They essentially move on. That's the environment that we're in. You take that and expand that beyond entertainment. And if you're talking about investments, I think we tend to expect the same kind of that same dynamic. I think we're looking for that same dynamic in other areas in life. And a lot of ways I think that can lead to incredibly poor outcomes. Right, yeah. New and shiny and novel and better.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Isn't actually always better just a shortcut? Right. I'm thinking about the game Chutes and Ladders that I play with my son. He cheats every time we play. Like, dude gets every ladder and never hits a slide.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

It just sounds like, it just sounds like an excuse for losing to your kid. Joel.

[Joel Larsgaard]

It is, it is. And I berate him for this, Joe. No, I don't. But it's. You want to catch all the ladders, but man, yeah, there's all these potential slides that can send you back tumbling down. And if you look for the shortcuts, just watch out because there's certainly a way that that shortcut could come back to bite you. And in like talking about like leverage ETFs, those are something that have seen kind of more dollars, more influence, and people don't realize that, like a couple bad days of being in this Tesla leveraged etf, I could lose all, all my money that I put in. It's very different than just buying Tesla because you think Tesla's a great company that's going to stand the test of time and be a good investment for years to come. So I guess, yeah, just with many more risky financial products at our fingertips, it's even more incumbent on us to be wary, to be careful what we invest in.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Yeah.

[Matt Altmix]

Well, the thing is too, is like a lot of the companies that are pushing these things are like you've got a love hate relationship with. Right. So I'm thinking of Robinhood in particular. And they've got some awesome stuff. The fact that they're offering a match for individuals on Roth IRAs like that is incredibly attractive. That's when I started paying to have an account with them because I'm like, you know what? I've never had a match in my entire life other than what we pay when we put on our employer hat to ourselves. But truly that is being provided by another entity. And even their 3% credit card, flat across the board, cash back. That's really attractive. I'm using that card is on my phone right now. But then they're also saying, hey, did you know that you can leverage investing.

[Joel Larsgaard]

You can leverage securities?

[Matt Altmix]

All of these. These behaviors that I don't want to see more of our listeners, more of the stackers out there partaking in. And that' where it comes down to us as individuals kind of going back to the first point.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Right.

[Matt Altmix]

To take ownership and responsibility for our own money.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Yeah.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

I think on my side, guys, I think the reason we're seeing so many people on Wall street say this is a good thing, it's just a money grab. I mean, it totally is a. Hey, we need this. I mean, the more we can get regulators out of our way, the more money we can make more quickly. I get my bonus. It's fantastic. I'm like, are you kidding me?

[Joel Larsgaard]

Was it that the whole point of Tony Robbins latest book. Right. Was like, here's how you get outsized returns by going with this company I have a special relationship with. And you're like, oh, okay. Like, this is an advertorial in book form.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

It's incredible. And a long read too. Like a thick book for an advertorial. Made it seem very professional.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

The frustrating thing for people that. That are bored, Matt, to your point, you know, and they think, well, maybe I. Maybe I'm missing something. Maybe there is a shortcut. Just go look for people that have been through that before. Because, man, the number of stories we've seen of people in their 50s even, who found a way to cobble together a retirement, even though they started late and they didn't do any of those things, they didn't do any of those shortcuts. They actually built a foundation, which was super cool to see.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Yeah, that comparison, too, I think that we're all comparing ourselves to people we don't know more than ever before. And that makes it easier to justify. Man, I started too late. I gotta, like, I gotta. What's the catalyst to get me going? And oftentimes it is riskier products, higher returns, your eyeballs get bigger, and you're excited about that. And then you're. And ultimately what happens is it puts you further behind so much of the time.

[Matt Altmix]

Yeah. And Joe, so I will segue us to number three, because you're talking about how, like our parents and the older generations, they built this foundation. They didn't partake in any of those things. And one of the things they did partake in is homeownership. And yes, that's how a lot of folks were able to build wealth because. And that's, it's still the number one asset that Americans have their, their personal net worth tied up in.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Right.

[Matt Altmix]

Their home. But that is changing and that's something that I think we've continued to see this year. And so that's our number three is that renting is not throwing away money. And just because individuals, our parents generation and there are plenty of folks who will die on this hill and they said, you, you guys understand how much of my wealth is because of this amazing property that I have. And I'm not at all saying that. No, that's not true. But I am saying that because of how easy it is for folks to invest because of Automatic enrollment in 401ks, it's easier than ever for folks to use platforms. Like said Robinhood, this is why we have like a, I've got a love hate relationship with them because they do make it so easy for you to invest in the market in a way that was inaccessible to our parents and their, and their parents as well. And so the, the fact that individuals can now find a great place to live that's affordable, that they're going to rent without having to save up tens of thousands of dollars in order to put down a decent down payment. I think that's incredible. They are receiving a good place to live.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Depends on economic cycles. Right? We talk about buying versus renting in 2011 and buying versus renting in 2025. They're completely different discussions based on prices, based on interest rate, based on market trends. So you have to also just kind of like lick your fingers, stick it up to the wind and be like, what's going on right now? And the discrepancy between what you're going to pay when you buy a house for that mortgage and what you're going to pay in rent for a similar single family home. You're going to save a lot of money renting in 2025, in 2011, that wasn't the case. And so you just have to like understand also like what's happening in the market. The housing market is in an interesting spot. Rents have been declining in a lot of places, in particular in certain markets like Austin or Boise that experienced extreme run ups. And so I think it's really important to not just be like, assume that owning a home is the pathway to building wealth. Like that's the way I'm going to make it and realize, well, actually a lot of people that bought homes in the past year are kind of kicking themselves or having a Hard time, Hard go of it.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Well, I think that as the data changes, right. I mean, in the amount of money it takes for a down payment now just continues to go sky high. I was speaking to a gentleman in Southern California. When he bought his first house, he put down $10,000, maybe it's $12,000 now for his daughter, who has a good job making, I think, $85,000 right out of college, you know, nice solid start. She's got to accumulate, you know, five times that just to live anywhere close to that neighborhood.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Yep. Just to sniff a house. Right?

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Yeah. And then there's another thing, too, because I love the fact that, Joel, you mentioned economic conditions are changing, but really, even with the old metrics of don't buy a house unless you know you're going to live there seven years, the statistics even have changed from 2011 to 2025 when it comes to job stability.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Yeah.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

I mean, people are working more jobs, moving more frequently than they have even in 2011.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Yeah.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Yeah, that's true, too. I know people are worried about the job market. We're still relatively low unemployment, historically speaking. But the job market, I think it also feels like a whiplash because, like, post Covid, it was an employee's market, and it was like, are you going to pay me 30% more than my current employer? Then I don't care. I'm not interested. So in some ways, that was really cool to see because we hadn't seen that much power in the hands of workers. The ability to demand more, the ability to jump ship and get paid a whole lot more than they were. And that has changed. I don't think it's maybe as bad as some of the headlines want to make it sound, but I do think it is obvious. It's clearly tougher than it was a few years ago, but we've also had much worse labor markets. The United States, we're experiencing right now.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Joe, how many children do you have?

[Joel Larsgaard]

I have three.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Have your kids ever seen you make that head motion when you're like, probably.

[Joel Larsgaard]

When I'm dancing with their mother.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

They think you're the coolest dad on earth?

[Joel Larsgaard]

No, not at all.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

I'm surprised because with moves like that.

[Matt Altmix]

My friend, ever since he grew out the mustache, I think they. He clicked up a couple notches.

[Joel Larsgaard]

They do like the mustache. The kids are a fan of it. I will say that.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

I said, while we were sitting here at the card table, before we went live, I even told Joel he just looks like a private detective. Like, I just. I don't know, the mustache really does it.

[Joel Larsgaard]

I should probably wear a monocle. Maybe that'll add even more to the mystique.

[Matt Altmix]

You could be alongside Benedict Cumberbatch there.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

Yeah.

[Matt Altmix]

Sherlock Holmes reboot.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

I didn't even want to think about that. So let's move to number two. Okay, what's second on our list of 2025 topics?

[Joel Larsgaard]

We're going to go back to politics briefly here, Joe. Yes, super fun. The government shutdown. Longest government shutdown in the history of our country. And it just points to something so freaking basic, but so important, which is to plan ahead for bad times. This is obviously the emergency fund. Everybody who listens to this podcast knows about that. It's also something we call the bare bones budget, which is planning ahead and saying, like, what could we cut in case of emergency? And it's really important, we think, to have done that due diligence ahead of time, because guess what really sucks. To get laid off on a Friday and then Saturday be like, what are we going to cut? You know, and having. Having done that exercise, I think, puts power into your hands to be able to know exactly what you're going to do in the face of uncertainty and in the face of not knowing when you're going to get another paycheck. And so obviously, tough position for a lot of people on the government payroll for what, 900,000 people to go through and to not know when this is going to end and feel like it's a political football and you are the football being kicked around, that sucks. But there are ways to make that hurt a little bit less with some solid personal finance planning.

[Matt Altmix]

Yeah, it's kind of going back to what you were saying, too, Joe. I mean, it just highlights the fact that in my mind, if you would have said 20 years ago, oh, I've got a government job that's sort of synonymous with stability, with an inability, I don't know, an inability to lose your job. Something that feels very stable and upwards and kind of onwards.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Like being a tenured professor or something.

[Matt Altmix]

Yeah, yeah. But for those folks, that's maybe one of the biggest lessons learned. And of course, not ignoring the current administration's stance towards the size of government. But, like, aside from politics, like, I think it's fair to assess and ask the questions, hey, what jobs? What departments are necessary? Is there a way for us to be more efficient? I mean, that's. We do that constantly in our own lives.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

And so businesses do it and we reward them.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Yeah. Yes. And both sides of the aisle care about that. And have done different things at different points in time to reduce wasteful spending. Right.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Is that where I say right? Yeah.

[Matt Altmix]

Yeah. Only if you agree, Joe.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Well, no, I mean, like, it. Not to get political, but it happened back in the Clinton administration, and it's happened. Yeah. Both Republicans and Democrats have at least certain point given at least lip service to the fact that they care.

[Matt Altmix]

Yes, that's the thing now, too. I mean, regarding lip service, it seems like it's just more. Is. Is it even lip service now? Because that's the thing. Like, again, man, we really are, like, diving into the politics here. Sorry, Joe, but, like, we try to cut this section when we talk about it. We try to talk as apolitical and as both sides of the aisle as possible. But when you've got a current administration that says, oh, yeah, this is something that we care about, and they created this entire new department, and then you see the kind of spending that's going on on some ridiculous stuff, it makes you question that makes you scratch your head and you start to wonder, oh, it's hardly even lip service anymore. Like, there is no concern from a fiscal responsibility standpoint. Like, we are so far past the days of the Tea Party and any sort of semblance to what, taking a personal finance approach from an. On an individual level and trying to apply that to the government. Like, in hindsight, that feels so quaint.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Oh, yeah.

[Matt Altmix]

Doesn't it feel so quaint?

[Joel Larsgaard]

Nobody cares about that anymore.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

Nobody.

[Matt Altmix]

Nobody does. Yeah.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

I was thinking about even reversing that, guys. Just taking this idea of, let's cut wasteful spending and just. Rather than fight with people I don't know on Facebook or X or wherever, pick your place, look inward and go, okay, if I'm. If I'm holding myself accountable here rather than fight about stuff I can't control in Washington, where are my wasteful spending places? Yeah, and by wasteful, I don't mean being judgy, because there's stuff that I love. Like, I'm not cutting out my Andy's ice cream. Like, I freaking love Andy's ice cream. Those people know me. I got to keep that business afloat. It's a focus, helping the community and everything.

[Matt Altmix]

You know, I literally have a line item on my budget, Joe. When this new brewery that opened up in town, and I said, you know what? Craft beer is having a moment, like, in a tough moment, Right. There's more breweries that are closing that close this year. That's our number one. It's. It's craft beer related. Just Kidding. But I want to make sure that they succeed. Right. And so to intentionally spend your money in a way that some people would call wasteful, and we call that the craft beer equivalent, but I literally do that with a local brewery. And guess what? Every date night, my wife and I, we swing by there and we have a beer and we chat.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

And you love it and we love it.

[Matt Altmix]

So great.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Not wasteful at all. But when you're blowing cash on stuff that you don't care about, doordashing, some reheated meal or whatever that you truly don't care about, you know, what are you doing? Love that. What was the point in number two? Where do we, where do we begin?

[Joel Larsgaard]

Just, it was like government shutdown. Be prepared.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Oh, cash.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Know, cash on hand. There's stuff that can come out of left field and just kind of smack you in the face most of the time. You can't be like, you don't have forewarning. But you know what, you do have the ability to plan for the unexpected.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

This is also where I think, you know the argument of don't pay down debt that has a low interest rate, continue to just make payments on it, also falters because really focusing on free cash flow during that time, like people that had a lot of free cash flow, I'll bet, had a ton of easier time getting through the shutdown if they lost their job than people that needed every single penny of that paycheck.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Yeah, that's true. Although when you think about it, if you're making extra payments towards, let's say, a low interest rate mortgage, you're taking some of what you could have done, which is kept it liquid in the case of an emergency, you've given yourself optionality with that money and you're not losing much in the process. If it's in a high yield savings account paying 3.75 and your mortgage is three and a quarter, prepaying the mortgage, not only does it not make a ton of math sense, but it also cost you liquidity in the case of one of those unforeseen circumstances coming down the pike.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Yeah, I like both sides of that argument.

[Joel Larsgaard]

I like my side better. But you know, whatever.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

My side's probably better, but we'll.

[Matt Altmix]

Yeah. Ladies, Ladies.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

But I do like the idea, I do like the idea, Joel, of this. This is what I used to tell my clients that were paying down debt directly to their loan, which was if you're one payment away from paying your house off and you can't afford to make that last payment do they only take away the one piece, a little tiny chunk of the house that you didn't pay or do they take the entire house?

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Yeah.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

And they take the entire house.

[Joel Larsgaard]

It's true.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

I still like the idea of. It's not always about the interest rate discussion. It is often about free cash flow. I mean, we evaluate stocks based on free cash flow. Will evaluate, you know, people. Healthy living is free cash flow. And if I can create more free cash flow in my life, how cool is that? Because then I can go with Matt to the.

[Joel Larsgaard]

That's right.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

To the Grab the Beer brewery and keep them in business.

[Matt Altmix]

Grab some ice cream after the fact too.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Beer and ice cream. We'll get all the high caloric intake.

[Matt Altmix]

We're. We're healthy folks over here in the basement.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Can't imagine. All right. We're up to the number one. I got goosebumps. Just can't wait. Okay, what is the number one thing we should have learned from in 2025?

[Matt Altmix]

Do you want to switch it up? Do you feel like we need to go bigger? Something that impacts.

[Joel Larsgaard]

You're going to go out. What are you going to do? Going to pull something random.

[Matt Altmix]

Do AI instead of. It kind of impacts everything.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Okay.

[Matt Altmix]

Sorry. Is it okay that we're having an on air conversation as to whether what we should actually deliver on radio?

[Joe Saul Sehi]

It's great radio.

[Matt Altmix]

Everyone loves to know how the sausage is made, Joe.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Yeah, they do.

[Matt Altmix]

I think AI like, it's got to be at the top.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

Right.

[Matt Altmix]

Because not only have we seen its impact when it comes to investments, I mean, is or is not the stock market run up? Does it have more or less to do with the Mag 7? And pretty much all the gains that we've seen this year has to do with that. Are we in a bubble? There's a lot of folks who are saying that, that that might be the case. What do you think, Joe? Bubble.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Yay.

[Matt Altmix]

Nay.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

I think at some point the stock market always comes down.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Yep.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

That's what I think. I think it's not a matter of if, it's a matter of when. And so if you're prepared that it's going to happen. I don't know if it's going to happen tomorrow, next week or three years from now. But it's always funny. People are like, do you think the market's going to go down? Yes.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's just a matter of when and how much. Right.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Yeah. So bubble, I don't know. That's above my pay grade.

[Joel Larsgaard]

So from the macro level from the stock market level, AI, certainly one of the biggest stories of the year. And then on the micro level, when it comes to careers, how AI is implemented, how that's impacting the job market. Also, when it comes to using AI for personal finance, there's pros and cons to that in some ways. Like, I was asking it about 529 accounts in my state, and it totally led me astray and told me I could contribute half as much as I was able to and get a tax break. So I was like, glad I know better than you. But then there are other ways in which I've seen people be able to use it effectively. Like one of those instances being like, I got this, like, really insane medical bill. What do I do in response to this? And we have, you know, podcast episodes about that with, like, experts. I know you do too, Joe. That's a really important topic. But AI can help you, like, fight demand and clutch your money back from the system that's trying to steal your dollars. Because there's so much inefficiency in the healthcare system and there's so much, like, over billing and there's so many ways that you can go about even as simple as, like, well, how much money do I make and do I qualify for a full forgiveness of this bill that I've received in the mail? So I think AI is one of those things where I'm curious to see where it goes over the coming years. There's some positives, but there's some negatives. And again, discerning individual, like, that's what so much comes down to. Right. You just have to be discerning in the age of AI because there's like a lot of fake stuff out there and then there's some helpful parts of it.

[Matt Altmix]

Yeah, yeah. So like, so we're talking about it at an investment level. You're talking about it, like, on a personal level, how you can use it as a tool, but then just from a, from a workforce standpoint as well. Right. And there's reports about it that it's capable of replacing currently 12% of the current workforce. I think that's something that we've got to really wrestle with and trying to figure out for. And folks are like, that's. I think that's one of the encouraging things too. Right? The fact that people are responding to it. Like, you see folks who are applying to be computer science majors, like, you are seeing people respond to the writing on the wall and they're saying, okay, yeah, I don't see I don't see a future. I thought I was going to do that. But let's maybe, let's pivot a little bit. And I think giving, I think as individuals we have to be, especially if you are in an industry that is a bit more dynamic right now, you gotta be aware you can't just like blindly enter into that and assume hope for the best. Like these are decisions that we have to make trade offs that we have to make and evaluate. Like what is this gonna mean for me, for my industry as well? Not just using it like a tool, which I think everybody's pretty much doing. Right. Like there's no, we're not gonna argue one way or the other there. Like it's like essentially it's replaced Google for me.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Right.

[Matt Altmix]

Like I. These are the same dumb questions of like, if you look at my history, it's like stuff that I should know, but I just Google because I want to double, I double check.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Don't look at his history, you don't.

[Matt Altmix]

Want to know Joel's is Katy Perry in space.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Yeah, it is. Love those memes, all the memes. I'm here for them. But there's something like 30 year olds are saying like, but I was told to go to college and that everything would be fine. And I think we're seeing a generational shift too where Gen Z teenagers are like, I'm seeing what's happening up there. I think I might need to take a different route. I'm seeing the writing on the wall with AI. I'm seeing what happened to the generation that went before me. And it's not that. And we would never suggest that like college is like a ripoff or a ridiculous idea for most people. But again, you have to think twice, think about well, how much is it going to cost? What sort of education am I get? What am I going to be able to do with that education? At the end of the day, in the world of AI, you have to ask those questions in a much deeper way to make a good decision. And I think in particular the cost of it matters so much if you go to college for 150 grand or if you can get that same degree for $12,000. There really is that level of disparity between different schools that you can, you can choose to go to when it comes to scholarships, when it comes to financial aid, when it comes to prestige. And getting the degree for a whole lot less matters even more now.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

I think a great stoic perspective on everything you guys just said, it just makes me think of if at any time in my life I feel complacent and like everything is safe. This year proved that. That that may be wrong. Yeah, that, that, you know, my job is safe because I'm a lawyer. Look at the destruction AIs had on the bottom layers of legal firms and the number of jobs that got replaced there very quickly. Look at what's going to happen to truck drivers over the next several years as he's self driving trucks, you know, come online more and more and more. Look what's largely happened in. Well, shoot. Pick a ton of fields in, in journalism where, you know, this Pakistani newspaper just got caught leaving the prompt at the bottom of the article that was supposedly written by.

[Matt Altmix]

I didn't see that.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Oh, this was great. Just stellar journalism. Where it says write a. Write a piece for me. Xyz.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Well, the great thing is it can't touch podcasting, right?

[Joe Saul Sehi]

No, not at all. And yet this year we saw. Have you seen, have you seen those fake podcasters and how good they are?

[Joel Larsgaard]

I haven't. Are they good?

[Matt Altmix]

Google X. Yeah, The Notebook.

[Joel Larsgaard]

I should be worried.

[Matt Altmix]

It. It's really impressive because they can imitate what people come to expect out of a podcast. But honestly, like, I mean, I'm not personally too concerned.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Maybe I should be.

[Matt Altmix]

Joe, you let me know after the fact, we'll hit, we'll stop recording and then you let me know if I should be shaking in my boots.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

But I just think we should always be concerned. I mean there should always be. I think it's a great perspective. Right. When you plan, plan for the worst and then when the best happens, you're always grateful. Yeah.

[Matt Altmix]

Yeah. I guess there's an element of always looking over our shoulder. But like, what I'm speaking to is the fact that so much of what and I'm sure you've seen this, right? Like so much of what we talk about. Yeah, we're talking about personal finance, but we are, man, we're. This is going to start getting really insider baseball. But like we're drawing on personal stories. It's about stuff that we're doing today, things, lessons that we have learned as individuals. You don't get that with no large language models. I don't know, like, does a is Gemini placing an Instacart order and learning that it's paying 50% more, you know, for its Aldi order. That's something that I literally, I learned recently. You know, that really pissed me off. Like, I was almost embarrassed to share that because I'm like, I'm like the frugal Aldi leftover eaten son of a gun that doesn't throw any of his leftovers away. And then I was like, oh, my gosh, I got duped. They fooled me, they tricked me. And that's not something that happens to computers, right?

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Computers all know reason you went to Aldi in the first place. Got ripped away from you.

[Matt Altmix]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. There's something about that that feels doubly bad. Like if it happened at Whole Foods, I'm like, yeah, what do you expect? I was like, oh, artisanal beef jerky. Of course I was gonna pay a premium for that, but not for my. What's it, the Aldi egg brand or whatever. Something Happy Farms. Not for happy Farms. Like, come on.

[Joel Larsgaard]

I wouldn't treat you like that.

[Matt Altmix]

If I'm getting Happy Farms cheese. Like, I'm expecting to pay slightly more than, like, government cheese prices, you know? Like, come on.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Those are the types of stories that AI doesn't give you, but you do get on the how to Money podcast. So, guys, thanks for sharing five stories that we can learn from this year. Let's talk about what's at how to Money. You guys know both our listeners are probably asleep at this point, so say something that you normally wouldn't say on air about what's coming up. Like some big reveal of some big topic that's going to happen at how to Money that the Stacker universe will know first.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Matt's going to start live streaming on Rumble, but he's going to do it nude. And I just think it's going to be really appealing to a wide.

[Matt Altmix]

Trying to supplement the How Do Money income with a little bit of additional only fans kind of revenue to start streaming in here.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Matt, here's my wallet. Damn it. Just sign me up.

[Matt Altmix]

I just got a notification that some like a Joe. Joe SS Just Joe Seeley, who can pronounce that name. The benefit here is that I don't have to pay taxes because that's a tip.

[Joel Larsgaard]

That's right.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

See that? We both win.

[Joel Larsgaard]

I love it. Amen.

[Matt Altmix]

Yeah.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

All because of the new government rules. What's coming up on how to many.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Guys, dude, we're going to keep podcasting. We're going to keep. Until the AI takes over, until they.

[Matt Altmix]

Rip microphones from our hands, the necessity.

[Joel Larsgaard]

For us to exist in any way, form or fashion. We're going to keep doing it and just keep interviewing interesting folks. We answer listener questions and the Friday flights, I think are my favorite. Or we're just like, talking about stuff like this like, what is top of mind this week? How does it impact your money? And then typically in that we try to give like a evergreen sort of lesson that comes from it. Well, here's, yeah, here's how it might impact your finances. But then what's the long term approach to that? Because that's honestly how you win in personal finances taking that long term approach. Every time I try to go like the short term route, man, I end up screwing things up. Whether it's like a home reno or like, yeah, like trying to get a gift for my wife. I'm like, I'm just going to make it super quick. And then it's like a crappy gift. And she's like, why'd you get this for me? Don't do that.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

That's. And that's at the how to buddy podcast. We're finer podcast are found.

[Joel Larsgaard]

True story.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Thank you so much for mentoring our Stackers guys.

[Matt Altmix]

Glad to be here.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Thanks for having us.

[Matt Altmix]

Great to see you, Joe.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

Hey there, Stackers. I'm Joe's mom's neighbor, Doug, and today I'm putting up the stocking so that when Santa climbs his fat butt down our chimney, he'll know exactly what to do first. I put my own stocking squarely in the middle. Of course, with Joe's way, way down at the end, the dude's getting coal anyway, so it doesn't matter. But speaking of Santa Claus, here's a term our newest stackers might not know. What's the term involving St. Nick, which describes the upsurge of stocks that happens at the end of many years during the last week of December. I'll be back right after I go check out my own stock portfolio. Let's see. Well, looks like I've got beef stock and chicken stock. That's incredible. Damn, they expired in 2019. Time to call my broker at the Piggly Wiggly.

[Matt Altmix]

This time of year, it's got me thinking about presents I've received over the years. Joel. Specifically, I'm thinking of one family member in particular would often get me these overly grown up gifts when I was in high school. Like for instance, a super high quality socket wrench set or like a really nice stereo. Now at the time I thought it was silly, a bit unnecessary, but here's the thing. I still have and I still use those gifts today. They have endured. Similarly, Policygenius can help you give your family a gift that could last a lifetime. Security man.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Man, we wouldn't want any how to money listener to be one of the nearly half of American adults who say they'd suffer financial hardship within six months if they lost their primary income earner.

[Santa Nick (Caller)]

No.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Policygenius is the simplest way to shop for and buy life insurance. Policygenius helps you find your most affordable policy that meets your needs. They answer questions, handle paperwork and advocate for you throughout the process.

[Matt Altmix]

That's right. With Policygenius, real users have gotten 20 year $2 million policies for just $53 a month. Don't wait until next year. Give your family the gift of security today with Policygenius. Head to Policygenius.com to compare life insurance quotes from the top companies and see how much you could save. That's PolicyGenius.com youm probably think it's too soon to join AARP, right? Well, let's take a minute to talk about it. Where do you see yourself in 15 years? More specifically, your career? Your health? Your social life? What are you doing now to help you to get there? Well, there are tons of ways for you to start preparing today for your future with aarp.

[Joel Larsgaard]

What about that dream job you've dreamt about? Sign up for AARP reskilling courses to help make it a reality. How about that active lifestyle you've only spoken about from the couch? AARP has health tips and wellness tools to keep you moving for years to come, but none of these experiences are without making friends along the way. Connect with your community through AARP volunteer.

[Matt Altmix]

Events, so it's safe to say it's never too soon to join aarp. They're here to help your money, your health and happiness live as long as you do. That's why the younger you are, the More you need AARP. Learn more at aarp.org wisefriend this message is sponsored by Navy Federal Credit Union. As the holiday season rolls around, Navy Federal knows that you strive to do everything you can to bring cheer and joy to your loved ones. And as a credit union dedicated to serving all veterans, active duty and their families, they understand that every little bit counts.

[Joel Larsgaard]

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[Matt Altmix]

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[OG (Joe's co-host)]

Hey there, stackers. I'm soup lover and guy who insists chicken and stars is way better than chicken noodle. Fight me. Joe's mom's neighbor, Doug. I gotta admit, I'm feeling warm and cozy here in Joe's mom's basement. Heck, this hot water heater puts off enough heat that only three of my toes aren't even numb. But speaking of heat, the stock market often heats up the last week of the year and investors have a St. Nick related term for it. What do they call this surge in stock prices during the last five days of trading? It's called the Santa Claus rally. And now here come two guys rallying back to the mics to finish out 2025 in the strongest way possible. Well, you know, for them, it's Joe and og. Good effort, guys. Good effort. Now get back out there and try your best. Mom's proud.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

We get the participation trophy. You participated in the holidays. Good for you.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

I cut up a whole bunch of oranges for you later.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Super. Do I get a Capri sun as well? By the way, Doug, I haven't had chicken and stars since I was like nine. Oh, gee. When's the last time you had chicken and stars?

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Maybe never.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

Actually, it's so much better than regular chicken and noodle.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Is it? When's the last time you had it, Doug?

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

Probably in the last two months.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Really?

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

We buy it regularly. I love chicken and stars. Absolutely.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Now, now, now I want to buy it.

[Joel Larsgaard]

It's.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

You're gonna be like, he's right, damn it.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

It's gonna set me back A$12 and it's on you.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

That's crazy.

[Joel Larsgaard]

That.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

That can of soup is a buck 12.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Yeah. And it's so basic. How about that? That's a blast from the past. Thanks to Joel and Matt for hanging out. Oh, gee, I saw the look on your face. Not surprising to you at all that they also thought, AI, the big news from 2025, do you think it's going to be. I think it's going to be even bigger in 2026.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

I'm waiting for it to do something magical. I think right now it's at some level souped up Google. And I find it funny that when you Google something now, it's like the AI answer is this. It's like, so the other Google answer is this.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Right.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

You know, like it's just a in depth Google answer supposedly. You know, AI, I Don't know.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

It does drive me crazy when you ask serious questions like would you like me to ask CHAT GPT? Well no, I was hoping you could just answer it like I don't care as long as you give me the right answer. Do whatever you want.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

Everybody is talking about and kind of bitching about the AI that's more consumer facing, I'll say with all the crazy videos that are getting made or you know, the chatgpt type answers. But the real miracle part that most of us aren't talking about, seeing, thinking about is all of the coding that it can do. All of the heavy lifting on basic code structures to create apps that we never see that people are able to do now with almost no or much less coding experience. Stuff has to get cleaned up by more experienced technologists. But there's a lot of fundamental foundational tech stuff that it is doing that unfortunately, yeah, it's taking away some entry level jobs but that's where I think the real impressive stuff is, is happening. We just don't see, we see all the other.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

We're seeing the chrome, just the chrome around the edge. Yeah, yeah, there's a bunch going on under the hood. Well let's pivot away from that to our next segment which is that time. Time to talk to somebody who said you know what, I better call Saul. See hi and oh gee. This is the part of the show where we shine a light on your questions. Normally we've been tackling these. In 2026 we'll be teching with our friend Anna Ellum and we're going to be doing those a lot in 2026. So stacked benjamin.com voicemail and we already have a few but we can always use more. But we do have a special one that mom's friend Gertrude said we should probably listen to today. This call comes to us from Nick.

[Santa Nick (Caller)]

Hello Joe and Og, this is Santa Nick calling from the North Polaska. I have to say I travel around the world once a year and love catching up on the show. It's a jolly good time even though I don't learn a thing. Here's my question. I've got terrible budget problems. Several years ago I told the missus that I'd give presents to a bunch of kids. I don't know, pay it forward. She said, you'll become a legend, that sort of thing. Well I have to say it's gotten out of hand. Every stinkin year I load up my sleigh, I mean my pickup with all of these toys. It used to Be trucks, trains and bus Barbies. But now they want iPads, Xboxes, and thousand dollar phones. I mean, I give these ankle biters everything they ask for and they always just come back asking for more. I know what you're going to say, Og and before you say it, I've already tried to cut my costs. We had the great idea of stuffing things in socks to limit the amounts, but before you know it, that just became an add on. And now these rascals all expect a sock full of junk and their silly presents. Oh, greedy little. And all for what? All I get in return is a few Christmas cookies and now they're all gluten free. Where's the fun in that? Between us, I've even gone so far as to hire a bunch of undocumented workers. They're out in my workshop behind the house making knockoff purses and jewelry as we speak. I wouldn't be surprised if the feds knock on my door tomorrow and shut us down. And if that weren't a big enough problem, we use deer in our delivery system and the animal rights people are breathing down my neck. I really, truly don't know what to do anymore. So here's what I need to know. How do I cut when there's nothing left to trim? What would you do if you were me? Thanks, guys.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

That voice sounds familiar. I feel like we've heard that before.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Undocumented workers.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

But what do you do? Oh, gee. When you're just trying to control your cost and you're really not sure where the income's coming from, just say no.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

I tried that this year. My mom got all super mad. I called her and I said, hey, I need you to do one thing for me when I was a kid and tell them, Tell me how this works for you guys. Because, Joe, you guys, you had a big family. Doug. Not as big of a family, I don't think. With the nieces and nephews. Did you guys have big, like grandma, grandpa holiday parties where all the aunts and uncles, cousins, nieces and nephews are at one place?

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Did you.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Did you all do that?

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

Yeah.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Yeah, yeah.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

What was the rule on the kids getting presents? Which adults got what Kids presents. And when did you stop being a kid? Any idea? Was it firm or was it just kind of whatever? In my house, it was always a pretty firm cutoff.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Oh, I don't know. I felt like sometime during college years, it just went bye bye.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

Yeah, I would agree. It was.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Ours was very, very crystal clear. After high school, you didn't get Any presents except for grandma and grandpa would get you a present, obviously. But you know, because before that there was, you know, aunts and uncles, we had godparents. That's how we did it, was the godparents would give you gifts because we had lots of cousins. But yeah, it was very clear. It was like, once you're out of high school, we're done with that now you're just here as an adult to enjoy the company, basically. And so I sent that to my mom. I was like, hey, this is what I'd like to do. And she's like, you deal with that with your siblings. And I'm like, well, the only person it affects is me because I have an 18 year old in college and my other brother who has his kids are 30. And I'm like, I just, I don't want there to be any surprises. And since you're the grandma, it should.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Come from you declare it go.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

This is how it's gonna be. Because it's my party, we got in a fight about it. But yeah, that's what I would do. I would just go, no, you're 30, man. You're not getting anything from. I'm not the Funkle for you. I'm the Funkle for like the five year old ones. That's how I control costs.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Well, I think sometimes it's also an income problem, right? I mean, it truly is. You gotta just go look for income opportunities, look for a way to kind of score, raise. Maybe all these different houses he stops at, maybe he gets a little something something from them.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

At my house, he's turning around that little screen that says, I'm just gonna ask. It's just gonna ask you a couple of questions.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Exactly.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Does that happen to you guys? Yet on the, with the UPS guy, he's like, I just need the name and quick signature. And I'm just gonna ask you a quick question right here.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

Not with a UPS guy.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Oh no, it doesn't happen with your.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

No, no, I haven't had that.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Thanks for the call, Nick. If you've got a call for us, we're happy to help. Stackingbenjamins.com voicemail all these ankle biters get you Uncle OG don't want to get.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

No presents for no ankle biters anymore. I'm trying to get out of it. My mom won't help me.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

If there is a tradition here, that segment may be one of my favorite traditions. Let's do a quick headline.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Hello, darlings.

[Joel Larsgaard]

And now it's time for your favorite part of the show our stacking Benjamin's headlines.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Our headline today comes to us from investment news. Again. We had one last week and I'm turning there again this week. OG because this piece written by Greg Greenberg, expect change in investor behavior in 2026 as prediction markets expand. And I'm like, what is prediction markets? Prediction market.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

If you think gambling is. Is addictive, this isn't gambling at all. This isn't sports betting. It's sports predicting.

[Joel Larsgaard]

It's way different.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

This is a whole piece. It's a whole piece on sports betting moving further into the mainstream and now prediction markets and platforms like Robin Hood and Stackers. You just heard me let Matt talk about his love hate relationship with Robin Hood without saying a word. Aren't you proud of me? I waited until they left before I'm saying anything. But they are accelerating into the space this year adding these new features and so.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Features.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

This whole piece, OG Is advancing advisors talking about how do you work with clients to avoid this place where many of the brokerages seem to be headed?

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Is the, the question is how do you tell clients not to do this? Is that your question?

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Well, but what if they continue to do it? You know what I mean?

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Care. I don't. I mean, I mean at some.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

It's on you.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Well, okay, so at some level this is no different than sports betting.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Right.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

The headline that I got out of this was, I mean, not out of this particular piece here, but just this whole industry is. This is a spin off of sports betting for the states that don't allow sports betting. It's like there's different apps and you know, because like, oh, well, this is fantasy sports. You can do that here for money. You just can't bet on how many touchdowns your favorite player is going to have. It's like, okay, what are we doing? It's like when they. A little crass. It's like when they banned all the websites in different states. They're like, you can't go to those websites anymore unless you use a vpn.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Right.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

And then you can.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

It just reminds me of just so. It just reminds me of growing up in Michigan and there were no alcohol sales until noon on Sunday.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Yeah.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Because God's position changed on alcohol.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Yeah. Exactly at noon is when. When Jesus said, and let there be drunks.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

This is when the water changed into.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Wine on the eighth day. He said, thou must be drunk after the first quarter of the NFL.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Some of these arbitrary rules just cracked me up.

[Matt Altmix]

Yeah.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

I spend my life looking for incongruencies. So those Types of things really crack me up. But this is basically nothing more. I'm going to use a sports betting piece of it. This is nothing more than a futures contract that you can do with your favorite team. And so the question is, is this profoundly different than any other sort of futures or options trade? And as long as you understand that the mathematics are the same, which are an insane return if you're correct in exchange for $0, not 0, return $0 if you're incorrect and the likelihood of being correct is whatever, and then that's how it's priced. So this is gambling at its finest. And if you do this with your investment portfolio as a way to entertain yourself, so be it.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

One of the advisors in this piece, Rob Wolf, said that emotion and confidence routinely overpower discipline, probability thinking. When you're either doing sports based betting or you're doing these now these predictive markets things, adding clients, betting, just say.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Sports betting because it's the same. Well, but, but there's other areas.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Yeah, that's what I'm saying. This is going to spill over into what do you think the Dow is going to do? What do you think that, you know, who's going to win the election, who's going to, you know, you can bet on whatever you want. Adding clients often underestimate how quickly small repeated losses add up over time. So we go from this thing where our brain, this discipline, probability, thinking of, hey, I'm going to stick with the index fund because the probability is I'm going to win much more often than I lose. And all I need to do is get these small incremental wins far more often than I get the small losses. But I love what Wolf says here, which is these tiny, sometimes small losses, oh gee, they just add up quickly. And all of a sudden now it turns into, well, I just got to bet a little bigger to, quote, win it back.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

There's a whole town built on this thinking and you only have to go to Las Vegas one time with an open mind and say, these fine folks here did not borrow this money to build this big building. They've got a pretty good system here for extracting capital from the average citizen.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Yeah, they know the ROI before they break ground.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

I mean, the other day the, the Powerball was at a billion. I don't know what it's at now, if anybody won it. But you know, did you guys, did you guys play it when I was At a billion?

[Joe Saul Sehi]

I 100% played it, absolutely.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Why?

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Somebody's got to donate to that thing to make it keep going up. Why not me?

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Yeah, well, the reason that you buy the $3 ticket or whatever or 30 bucks worth of tickets because you bought 10 of them is because you go, some idiots got to win this thing. It's one in a trillion. But you know what? Some a hole gets hit by lightning every year too. So so far, you know, might as well be me.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

I walk out in the parking lot, get hit by lightning and I won, but in a different way.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Yeah, that's how it works at the casino. That's how it works in the options market. I mean, the Internet is littered with people in the last five years who have figured out option trading, not figured out, who have learned about option trading. And you see, just like everything else. This is why I absolutely abhor everything about social media. Because you only see the stuff that people want you to see. You know, I mean, just look at it from like a reality TV show, right? What is the most exciting part about the reality TV shows? Just generally speaking, what do you like the most?

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Just the fact that it's unpredictable. What's going to happen next?

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

That's not the answer I was looking for, Doug.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

Car crashes.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Yes, absolutely. You want to see the big wins and the big losses. Like you want to see the relationships that blow up because, you know, you got the little sneak peek camera and you didn't know that Betty was cheating on Joe with Alan and now Alan's gonna, you already know. And you're waiting for that thing to come to a head, right? Because you wanna see the trainer. Oddly specific on social media, we wanna see the wild extremes. Nobody videotapes their day and goes, yeah, so today I got up at 7:50 like I always do and took a little longer shower than normal. It was 15 minutes and seven seconds.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Are those Cheerios?

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Yeah. No, I ran out of Cheerios. So today I just didn't have breakfast and I reacted to that like a normal person did and went, I'll have a Pop Tart instead. And then I had a cup of coffee and then I sat and watched the news. It's like, no, that's what real life is. But when you see people who, for lack of a better term, like to just brag about what's happening, they don't talk about all the boring stuff. They go, hey, I put a hundred bucks in this option trade and made a thousand. I put ten thousand in this thing. And you see all these big wins, these big giant success stories. Because that's the, that's the interesting thing. You're on Reddit the stuff that they feed you is the stuff that you linger on, which is the stuff that is the most exciting stuff. Right? I like reading the story of the idiot that put 1,000 bucks in something and turned it into 100,000. That's interesting to me. I go, wow, what a lucky sob. That's pretty cool. But I also know the other side of that. Same thing with Instagram. You see the stories about the people who, you know, had the miraculous weight loss or fly the private airplanes or whatever, whatever it is, you know, shoot the great golf score. You don't see the story of the person who sat on the range for 15 hours a day all summer to have the one good round. You know, it's just. It's not the thing that's exciting.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Well, it's why when you see. When they're playing poker, when you watch poker on tv, they only show you the cool hands. They don't show you the hours and hours between the big hands the casino.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

System is built on. There's got to be some idiot out there that's going to pull this lever and win a million bucks. Somebody's going to do it. I might as well be me. And I'm going to put a dollar in and see, and I'm going to put another dollar in. And what's. What's $10? And if I just do, you know, I just do $10 a day.

[Matt Altmix]

Like, that's not a lot.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

I like the analogy around options that it's always been here, but I also think it's far more accessible than it's been because options were so opaque to so many people. And now it's in our face. Robin Hood, you know, gamification masters. In fact, one of the advisors, Taylor Knof, says, as a result of gamification, the culture has shifted. And I see people as likely to talk about this beating the market as they are a football game. Like, people are going to go, oh, on my app, I invested in the fact that I thought the market was going to go up tomorrow, and guess what? It did. And so I turn this amount of money into this amount of money, and it's so cool. And again, because of social media, we're only going to see the wins. But it's going to be far more often on these platforms than we did with options. Because what the hell's a put? What the hell is a call? People got lost in the names. So let's talk about what really to do about it, what these advisors are talking about. Rob Wolf again says most of his clients OG have some type of quote, entertainment investment that captures their attention even for a brief time. And he says he's got this section of the portfolio he and his client have carved out called the entertainment capital bucket. So it just is entertainment. It's almost like when I go to Vegas, I set money aside and I'm like, I don't care if I win or lose. This is entertainment money. I'm just having fun with this money. This is not capital. If I lose it all, it's just the cost of entertaining myself. So how much money do I put in this? But his big thing is whether it's traditional day trading, collectibles, crypto, other more speculative stuff, he says he wants to make sure his clients label it correctly. It's not about whether you do it or not. Like, like, it is a losing battle for advisors to go, yeah, you shouldn't do that. Well, they're gonna freaking do it anyway. Instead, label it correctly so in your brain, you don't cost yourself your entire future.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Ultimately, this comes back down to your planning. And I'm a big believer in once the plan is good to go, then everything else is fair game. Because some person, to your point about entertainment, some person's entertainment is going to the movies and having a bag of popcorn and a cherry Coke, and that's like a fine Tuesday afternoon. Some other people like to go skydiving, and some people think that's a good way to spend a Tuesday afternoon. I'm not the judge of what you value as excitement or entertainment. If you like to go on vacation, and your vacation is, I go to my lake house and I like to drink a cup of coffee and watch the sun come up over the lake. Some people say, that sounds really super boring. I like to go on vacation and do a big hike, or I like to go on vacation to these exotic locations. That's what really gets me excited. There's nothing right or wrong about that. What's wrong is if you do that and your plan is blown up, and it doesn't matter if you're blowing your plan up because you're, you know, day trading crypto or betting on, you know, football outcomes, or because you're blowing too much of your money on exotic trips that are nuking your plan, all of that leads to the same. The same graveyard, right?

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Same outcome.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

If your plan is good, then the rest of it doesn't matter. Now, reasonable people can disagree as to, you know, how one should spend their free time and their excess capital. And some people would say just like, anybody who goes, oh, skydiving is really stupid. And I can't believe you'd waste your money doing that. And that's the parlance we use, right? Can't believe you'd waste your money doing that. And I know people who do skydiving to that. That's not wasting their money.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Like, that's the best experience they could ever have.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

They love every second of it. That's what they want to spend their money on. Some people like to go, you know, and flaunt trips down the Rhone River.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Who would do that?

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Right.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

By the way, it's pronounced Rhine. The Rhine River. The Rhone would be next time, probably.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Yes. Okay.

[Joel Larsgaard]

All right.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Some people think that's a waste of money. Some people like to spend it. Right. It's just. I don't have any value judgments in how you spend your money. What I will tell you is if you're nuking your plan because you think that, oh, well, this is my investment account. I'm investing in futures trading. No, you're not. You're gambling. And you might be right. That's the dangerous part. Honestly. I told the story a couple summers ago about when it was raining at the cottage and I went, holy crap. You can gamble in Michigan on your phone slots.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

That's a slippery slope.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

The worst thing that happened, happened. I won $8,000 on my phone on a Tuesday afternoon. I mean, it was. I guarantee. I've given all that back. And all the visits back to Michigan.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Happened with my son. I taught him how to play craps in Vegas. He thought it was the greatest thing. Luckily, he lost before we left town.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

My kid did the same thing, too. He went to. He went to the casino as soon as he turned 18, he won, you know, 100 bu. And he's like, that's the easiest $100 I've ever made. I'm going tomorrow. I'm going tomorrow. He went, like, a whole bunch, and then he ended up losing it all on one trip. He goes, that's the dumbest thing ever. That place sucks.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

My son came back to the hotel room and slammed the. You know how hard it is to slam a hotel door? And he still managed to slam the hotel door. And Cheryl's like, thank God he lost. Thank God.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

How'd it go, Nick?

[Joel Larsgaard]

Yep.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

He was on a hot streak. A fascinating story, and I do think. I do think.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

So this is sticking around, basically. That's the more I do think investment.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

News is on to stuff. This is going to get bigger. This is going to be big news. In 2026. I don't think they're wrong willing to it on our show notes page is stacking benjamins.com if people want to dive in more and if you want to dive in even more to topics like this the 201 newsletter you can sign up for and man we got a lot of great while we're giving out kudos, let's give some kudos to Kevin Bailey who writes the 201. Always following up and digging in deeper to these curated topics from the same topics that we talk about on the show. It's always free. You also then will know when we're going live on YouTube if you sign up for the 201. You'll also see when our bad groups our Benjamin's After Dark groups are meeting up. You'll get all the latest stacking benjamin.com201 by the way let's while we're talking about community wandering out on the back porch, our our Benjamin's After Dark group in Minneapolis St. Paul had their end of the year party. I don't know Doug, did you see this? What Chris Luger and Veronica Barnas and our stackers, they had an ugly Christmas sweater party. People engaged in ax throwing which I've always wondered ax like what's the liability insurance on that place?

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

Yeah, I don't know how they stay in business.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

You.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

I really don't.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

I always wonder.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

I do know I walked into one one time and when I saw how much it cost. Yeah, no, I'm out. I can do this in my backyard for free.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

The Meetup group team, they came up with cupcakes. The cupcake is a regular green frosted cupcake with an elf and they have. They put my face in the place of the elf's face.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

I don't like the suggestive way you're straddling that candy cane, Joe.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

That is scary as hell. I'm afraid it's my face. Like oh God, get that off there. Big thanks to our Benjamin's After Dark group leaders who make financial literacy and just hanging out with like minded people so much more accessible. Right now we have groups in Minneapolis, St. Paul, in Seattle, groups coming online in Southern Minnesota and in Boston in the near future. And we're talking to people in Dallas right now and had somebody reach out from Tucson. If you want to know more about starting a group, a bad group, Benjamin's After Dark group, write to me. Joe stacking benjamin.com if the Tucson group.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

Gets together, I absolutely will go. I have a strong connection as long as at least one meetup is at Tanya's because they have the best burrito known to man.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Excellent.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Yeah.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

If you're anywhere in the state of Arizona, go to Tanya's for the breakfast burrito in Tucson. It'll change your life.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Oh, gee, I love Doug's. He's like, if you have it in Tucson and if it's on the day that I already plan to be there, I'm not coming special. And if you have it in the morning so we can get a breakfast burrito and it's at Tanya's.

[Santa Nick (Caller)]

Wow.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

Well, the great thing is they serve the breakfast burrito the whole time they're open.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

I mean, to be fair, that's kind of how. That's kind of my travel plans too. Oh, we're having a meetup. Sounds great. As long as it's on the day that I'm going to be there and I can get there in the manner in which I please and I. It starts when I want and I get to leave whenever I want. Sounds great. I'll be there.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

I'm. I will go better than that because I can get to Tucson relatively easily. So, yeah, put the group together. Make it happen. Neighbor Doug will be there. Just make sure that there's a Tanya's breakfast burrito waiting for me wherever you have your meetup.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Two more things we want to talk about community wise. We've been waiting for six months to finally release the Stacking Benjamin's Vault. So to keep your money safe, your credit, your privacy, your ID protection, get you off. Not just the normal subscription list that is sucking money out of your pockets, but also get you off of those lists that are sending you all kinds of spam and, well, and even worse than spam, frankly, the places where a bunch of the scammers go to buy your information. Get off all of those lists and more. There's so many things that you can do with the vault. We'll be talking about it over the course of next week. Stacky benjamins.com vault we have had some nice people, Doug, who've also said very kind things about us on podcasting platforms. And Doug, you've been raving about this one all day.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

I do. Mostly because I love who it came from. Joe, this is from Curly Q 2024. Can we just. Can we pause for a minute to talk about how great this person's fries are? They are absolutely. The better fries.

[Matt Altmix]

Curly.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

I love curly fries. Every chance. Do you want the regular fries or the curly fries? No question.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

That's not even A question.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Okay, how about this one? One of our new restaurants in town is a place called Bubba's. They have a few of these around the south. At Bubba's, Doug, you can get regular fries, seasoned fries, or tater tots.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Oh, tater tots. Yeah.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

Until you said tater tots, that was an easy decision, but now I know. And if it was seasoned tater tots.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

The seasoned tater tots for the win. If they make curry tater tots, like, okay, take my wallet.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

Blown. Well, here's what the master of all fries said to us in a review. He said or she. They said. A fun and valuable finance podcast, Stacking Benjamin's delivers valuable financial insights without feeling overwhelming. The advice is practical, the hosts keep things entertaining, and the guest interviews are always worthwhile. A great listen for anyone wanting to improve their financial literacy. It's like they stole our mission statement.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

I. I feel like it. Thank you so much, Curlicue. And I can't wait for you to hear some of the holiday extravaganza coming up this week, because the best ofs that we chose from 2023. So relevant today. So, so, so relevant today. And we're excited to.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

I thought for sure you were going to say, and I can't wait for you to invent curly tater tots, please.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

And it doesn't be there. Or it's. And. And go do God's work inventing curly tater tots. All right. Thank you so much for spending the year with us stackers. We've got so much more to come. We can't wait for you to hear it. Coming up on Wednesday. It is Thursday. The tale as old as time. Doug and the three ghosts. Doug. Speaking of, Doug, what are the three things we should have on our to do list after hearing today's episode?

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

Well, Joe, first, take some advice from Joel and Matt. If you focus on what you can control, the events of 2026 and beyond won't control you. Second, how about our headline, huh? Betting on where the stock market heads next is awesome.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

If.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

If you want to lose money, let's stay with a winning hand. As Kenny Rogers said, you got to know when to hold them, and that's 99% of the time. But the big lesson. You didn't think I was going to sing that, did you? But the big lesson. Don't share any betting analogies with Joe's mom. She'll brag that she's got 2 to 1 odds that I'm definitely loading the dishwasher after dinner tonight. Two to one. You can't say no to that lady. It's one to one odds. She's like a cartel controlling the betting line here in the basement. I don't even really know what a cartel is, but I bet it looks a lot like her. Thanks to Joel and Matt for putting on their big boy pants, painting on a brave face, and shuffling down to the basement to join us. Even though you all pounded them like a keyboard during tax season during the Voices for D. Good challenge. Great job Stackers. You can hear their great show how to Bunny wherever podcasts are streamed. Like wherever you're listening to us right now. This show is the property of SB Podcasts, LLC, Copyright 2025 and is created by Joe Saul Sehive. Joe gets help from a few of our neighborhood friends. You'll find out about our awesome [e-mail] along with with the show notes and how you can find us on YouTube and all the usual social media spots. Come say hello.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Oh yeah.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

And before I go, not only should you not take advice from these nerds, don't take advice from people you don't know. This show is for entertainment purposes only. Before making any financial decisions, speak with a real financial advisor. I'm Joe's mom's neighbor Doug, and we'll see you next time back here at the Stacking Benjamin Show.

[Matt Altmix]

This time of year it's got me thinking about presents I've received over the years.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Joel.

[Matt Altmix]

Specifically, I'm thinking of one family member in particular would often get me these overly grown up gifts when I was in high school. Like for instance, a super high quality socket wrench set or like a really nice stereo. Now at the time I thought it was silly, a bit unnecessary. But here's the thing. I still have and I still use those gifts today. They have endured. Similarly, policygenius can help you give your family a gift that could last a lifetime.

[Joel Larsgaard]

Security Man Man. We wouldn't want any how to Money listener to be one of the nearly half of American adults who say they'd suffer financial hardship within six months if they lost their primary income earner. Policygenius is the simplest way to shop for and buy life insurance. Policy Genius helps you find your most affordable policy that meets your needs. They answer questions, handle paperwork, and advocate for you throughout the process.

[Matt Altmix]

That's right. With Policygenius, real users have gotten 20 year $2 million policies for just $53 a month. Don't wait until next year. Give your family the gift of security today with Policygenius head to policygenius.com to compare life insurance quotes from the top companies and see how much you could save. That's PolicyGenius.com youm probably think it's too soon to join AARP, right? Well, let's take a minute to talk about it. Where do you see yourself in 15 years? More specifically, your career, your health, your social life? What are you doing now to help you to get there? Well, there are tons of ways for you to start preparing today for your future with aarp.

[Joel Larsgaard]

What about that dream job you've dreamt about? Sign up for AARP reskilling courses to help make it a reality. How about that active lifestyle you've only spoken about from the couch? AARP has health tips and wellness tools to keep you moving for years to come. But none of these experiences are without making friends along the way. Connect with your community through AARP volunteer.

[Matt Altmix]

Events so it's safe to say it's never too soon to join aarp. They're here to help your money, your health and happiness live as long as you do. That's why the younger you are, the More you need AARP. Learn more at aarp.org wisefriend this message is sponsored by Navy Federal Credit Union. As the holiday season rolls around, Navy Federal knows that you strive to do everything you can to bring cheer and joy to your loved ones. And as a credit union dedicated to serving all veterans, active duty and their families, they understand that every little bit counts.

[Joel Larsgaard]

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[Matt Altmix]

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[Joe Saul Sehi]

Welcome to the after show everybody. This is the part of the show where we talk about important financial stuff and to end the year. I started the recording midway because we're.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

Talking about cleaning up.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

I was telling Og and Doug that I'm in the grocery store and you know, we buy the industrial strength packet of toilet paper and so I don't often pay attention to the price and there was an end catch 1 percenter with these mega rolls.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

Tell me how rich you are without telling me how rich you are.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Remember, remember we did the show a couple weeks ago, the Friday episode OG where you talk about when you make over X amount, you no longer worry about the restaurant. What number is it? Where you just don't pay attention to the price of the toilet paper. How come that didn't make your analogy? But right on the end cap, it said on sale for 25 bucks. It was the stuff I like. The ultra cushy absorbent. Yeah.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

Super strong 70 grit.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Just the stuff that feels nice. You know, I don't need to have the Doug Truck stop toilet paper because when they give you those narrow toilet paper rolls, like you're not fooling anybody. I'm going to wrap this thing 18 times to make up for the fact that you decided to go.

[Matt Altmix]

Hold on.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

No, no, no. You don't do that, do you?

[Joe Saul Sehi]

What do you mean? What do you do?

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

It's a five square maximum per pole. No, in our house. Yeah. Five squares.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Even if you go cheap as all.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Gets talking about the truck stop.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

I'm talking about you go cheap with that narrow stuff. I'm sorry, your five square rules gone.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

That's my complaint is that ours, while it's Charmin and it's supposedly the, you know, quilted and the thick and all of that stuff, it's narrow and I don't get it. And you go look up online because I've been to other people's houses that have nice wide rolls of toilet paper. Like I want that. And then I, I like, I measured mine and I go online and see how wide as the whatever the other brands are.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

This would be a great like Larry David skit. You walk out of somebody's bathroom just.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

With a tape measure.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

You're at a holiday party and you're just going off. Where do you find this?

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Like American Psycho, but instead of the business card, it's paper.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

And I'm still, I'm still. I haven't pulled the trigger because like, oh gee, we're on subscribe and save. Have been since COVID So it's just too easy to let it roll and have the giant box show up on our doorstep. I feel like I might be ready to switch brands to get that extra eighth of an inch width.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Got to tell you, it's worth it.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

My grandpa used to tell me that you only needed one little square. And what you did was you poked a hole in the middle, right? And you took that little piece and you held onto that and then you'd use your hand, and then the paper was to wipe off your hand. And then that little piece that you poked through, which is the part that you.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

There's no way your grandpa told you that.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

That is 100% what my grandfather told me.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

There's no way. This explains so much. Speaking of.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

You only knew.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Speaking of, say you're wealthy. Say you're redneck without saying you're red.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

This grandpa.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

All right. Speaking of another thing, did you guys notice how much I. I was kind of squirming around as I sat down at the card table?

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

My bill thick as ply as you thought, huh?

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

My belt cream's not working.

[Matt Altmix]

No.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

How does your. How does you say you've eaten too many Christmas cookies without saying you feed too many Christmas cookies?

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

Or digging in. Belt buckled. Digging in a little bit.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

No, it broke it. My belt completely. 100 broke. Look at this. It is completely busted. Like, it is busted.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

You broke the leather, dude.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

I broke. No, no, no.

[Matt Altmix]

It's the.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

It's the little metal piece.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Worse. It's the steel part.

[OG (Joe's co-host)]

He broke the steel part. Time to put the shortbread away.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Yeah.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

So talk about say your whatever without say or whatever. Oh, my God. Not good.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

All sort of problems in your house, Joe.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

I'm not a quitter, though, so let's bring back out the Christmas cookies.

[Matt Altmix]

This is Sophie Cunningham from Show Me Something. Do you know the symptoms of moderate to severe obstructive sleep apnea, or osa, in adults with obesity? They may be happening to you without you knowing. If anyone has ever said you snore loudly, or if you spend your days fighting off excessive tiredness, irritability, and concentration issues, it may be due to osa. OSA is a serious condition where your airway partially or completely collapses during sleep, which may cause breathing interruptions and oxygen deprivation. Learn more at don'tsleep on OSA.com this information is provided by Lilly, a medicine company at CVS. It matters that we're not just in.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Your community, but that we're part of it. It matters that we're here for you when you need us, day or night. And we want everyone to feel welcomed and rewarded. It matters that CVS is here to.

[Matt Altmix]

Fill your prescriptions and here to fill.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

Your craving for a tasty and, yeah, healthy snack. At cvs, we're proud to serve your community because we believe where you get your medicine matters. So Visit [e-mail] or just come by our store. We can't wait to meet you. Store hours vary by location.

[Matt Altmix]

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[Joe Saul Sehi]

Athlete meetups, discounts from brands you love.

[Matt Altmix]

And a custom welcome gift mailed direct to your doorstep. This winter, show your support as they race for the podium. Head to insider.usski and snowboard.org and join today.

[Joe Saul Sehi]

This is an iHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human.