Impoverished Upbringing to Money Monster w/ Listener Nick Gangwer #986

Summary

Podcast Summary: How to Money
Episode: Impoverished Upbringing to Money Monster w/ Listener Nick Gangwer #986
Release Date: May 21, 2025
Host: Joel and Matt (iHeartPodcasts)

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Introduction

In this inspiring episode of How to Money, co-hosts Joel and Matt welcome Nick Gangwer, a dedicated listener whose journey from an impoverished upbringing to becoming a "Money Monster" serves as a beacon of motivation for many striving to overcome financial hardships. The episode delves deep into Nick's personal experiences, financial strategies, and entrepreneurial spirit, offering valuable insights for listeners aiming to transform their financial futures.

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Meeting Nick: From Listener to Guest [02:10 - 04:38]

Joel and Matt introduce the episode by sharing how they met Nick at a listener hangout at a brewery a year prior. Impressed by his proactive steps to change his life's trajectory, they invited him to share his story with the How to Money community.

Notable Quote:

Matt (02:10): "We realized that his story could be incredibly motivational to the broader How to Money community of all you money nerds out there."

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Nick’s Early Struggles and Determination [04:38 - 13:13]

Nick recounts his challenging childhood in Broward County, Florida, where he grew up in a rough neighborhood with limited resources. His mother worked multiple jobs to support him, but finances were tight—often under $20K annually. Despite these hardships, Nick's determination to escape poverty drove him to take on responsibilities far beyond his years, including working from the age of 12 to help pay bills and support his family.

Notable Quotes:

Nick (05:03): "I just broke down in tears. And my buddy, he's like my brother for life."

Nick (07:21): "Every single second counts, like when I'm in school as well."

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Academic Excellence and Scholarship Pursuits [13:13 - 18:31]

Understanding the importance of education as a pathway out of poverty, Nick excelled academically, taking AP classes and enrolling in dual courses to earn college credit. He meticulously applied for over 200 scholarships, which eventually paid off when he received a substantial scholarship from Coca-Cola, allowing him to attend the University of Alabama debt-free.

Nick emphasizes the impact of documenting extracurricular activities and volunteer work, which set him apart in scholarship applications. His dedication not only secured his education but also laid the foundation for his financial success.

Notable Quotes:

Nick (15:35): "What sets you apart, like, you writing a two-page essay then sending it in or having like these amazing volunteer hours."

Matt (16:18): "And when it came to scholarship time, we sent that piece of paper."

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Entrepreneurship and Real Estate Ventures [22:24 - 36:58]

One pivotal moment in Nick's journey was his introduction to real estate through a How to Money podcast episode on house hacking. Leveraging his savings from various side hustles and scholarships, Nick purchased a house while still in college. Opting for a below-market rent strategy, he transformed his living situation into an income-generating property by renting out additional bedrooms to fraternity members and peers.

Nick elaborates on the meticulous process of securing the property, including negotiating the purchase price and ensuring immediate equity. His hands-on approach to property management—repainting, building decks, and handling maintenance—ensured the property's success and his financial stability.

Notable Quotes:

Nick (22:55): "I just saved up a lot of money because I was like, I really want to go to grad school."

Nick (27:13): "I painted the whole house. I built a deck, I redid the flooring, I did the carpeting. I literally built the house for like an entire year while I was in college."

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Balancing Work, Studies, and Personal Development [36:58 - 43:50]

Nick discusses the challenges of managing multiple jobs, internships, and academic responsibilities. His ability to balance these commitments was fueled by his internal drive to succeed and provide for his future. By saying "yes" to various opportunities, Nick built a robust skill set and a diverse portfolio of experiences that have been instrumental in his financial accomplishments.

He emphasizes the importance of time management and prioritizing education alongside entrepreneurial endeavors. This balanced approach allowed him to graduate with honors while simultaneously laying the groundwork for his financial independence.

Notable Quotes:

Nick (37:39): "Exposure to everything almost. But also my friends were as well."

Nick (40:18): "I have to drive. I don't think I'm ever gonna stop working. Okay, good. Because I'm like, I don't know how."

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Vision for the Future: Goals and Ambitions [43:50 - 58:03]

Looking ahead, Nick shares his ambitious goal to retire by the age of 30. For him, retirement symbolizes financial freedom and the ability to pursue entrepreneurial dreams without financial constraints. Nick outlines his multifaceted approach, including diversifying his income streams through various rental properties and entrepreneurial projects.

He highlights the importance of setting clear, actionable goals and breaking them down into manageable tasks. Nick's methodical planning and continuous learning, aided by resources like Masterclass, underpin his strategy to achieve early retirement and financial success.

Notable Quotes:

Nick (48:24): "I want to retire by 30. It's a testament. It's showing people behind me, showing people in front of me, showing people in my situation."

Nick (52:19): "Knowledge is power. And that's been said since, like, I don't know, night and day."

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Advice for the How to Money Audience [57:02 - 58:03]

In his final remarks, Nick offers invaluable advice to listeners seeking financial improvement. He encourages individuals to step out of their comfort zones, take calculated risks, and trust their instincts. Emphasizing perseverance, Nick advises embracing failures as stepping stones toward success.

Notable Quote:

Nick (57:02): "Get out of your comfort zone and take risk. Just take one risk a month. It might be financially, it might be nerve-wracking, but that's the risk you want to take."

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Closing Remarks and Final Thoughts

Joel and Matt conclude the episode by reflecting on Nick's remarkable journey and the actionable insights he provided. They commend his dedication, resilience, and the strategic financial moves that have positioned him for early retirement and continued entrepreneurial success.

The hosts also share a light-hearted moment reviewing a craft beer, showcasing the camaraderie and friendly atmosphere of the podcast.

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Key Takeaways

1. Early Responsibility and Hard Work: Nick's experience underscores the importance of taking on responsibilities early to support oneself and one's family, laying the groundwork for future financial independence.

2. Academic Excellence and Scholarships: Leveraging academic achievements and diligently applying for scholarships can alleviate financial burdens and open doors to prestigious educational opportunities.

3. Entrepreneurial Spirit and Real Estate: House hacking and real estate investments are effective strategies for generating passive income and building long-term wealth.

4. Balancing Multiple Commitments: Effective time management and the ability to juggle multiple roles are crucial for achieving both academic and financial goals.

5. Setting and Pursuing Ambitious Goals: Clear, actionable goals, coupled with continuous learning and strategic planning, are essential for attaining financial milestones like early retirement.

6. Embracing Risks and Stepping Out of Comfort Zones: Personal growth and financial success often require taking calculated risks and pushing beyond familiar boundaries.

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Conclusion

Nick Gangwer's story is a powerful testament to what determination, strategic planning, and relentless pursuit of financial education can achieve. His journey from a challenging upbringing to aspiring for early retirement exemplifies the transformative power of personal finance knowledge and entrepreneurial initiative. Listeners are encouraged to draw inspiration from Nick's experiences and apply similar principles to their financial journeys.

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Note: Timestamps correspond to the times in the provided transcript.

Transcript

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[Joel]

I'm Joel.

[Matt]

I'm Matt.

[Joel]

And today we're talking impoverished upbringing to Money Monster with listener Nick Gangwer.

[Matt]

Yeah, so we are doing something completely new for our episode today. We're going to hear from a listener, but not in the form of a question that's submitted via a voice memo. But we're actually sitting down and having a real money conversation with, like Joel said, Nick Gangwer. We met Nick at a listener hang about a year ago at a brewery, of course, and we learned. We heard a story, he shared it with us. We learned about the proactive steps that he had taken to completely change his trajectory in life and it was incredibly inspirational to us as personal finance creators. And then more recently, we realized that his story could be incredibly motivational to the broader how to money community of all you money nerds out there. So this is why we were having him on on to share his story with you, the listener out there today. So, Nick, thank you so much for joining us today on the podcast, man.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah, absolutely, guys, I appreciate you having me. Matt, Joe, thank you.

[Joel]

Of course. Nick, glad to have you along for the ride today, man. And Nick, actually, How to Money was Nick's first podcast.

[Unknown Host]

You want to tell us it was.

[Joel]

Well, let's first question that we obviously have to ask you. What's your craft beer equivalent, my friend?

[Unknown Host]

Absolutely. I've been thinking about this answer for a while and I'm going to say it's definitely healthy. Like, I spoil myself with my health.

[Matt]

Health. All right.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah. I.

[Joel]

Does this mean Botox? What are we talking, Nick?

[Unknown Host]

Actually, my gym membership, surprisingly. So. I go to Windy Hill and I've been. Look like my first trip to Atlanta, it was so hard to find a gym. Like, I went to like four or five different ones. Like went to the Planet Fitnesses, the Crunch, trying to find all the CrossFit, stuff like that. And I found Windy Hill. And it's a beautiful club.

[Matt]

Yeah, yeah, it's a club. Like you can go there and play squash. Cause I've done that with a buddy before.

[Unknown Host]

Oh, I've lost many times to people double my age. And they will, they'll work you. They definitely get poker face. I. Yeah, I joined there and they have like a little coffee shop. They actually have a tap room as well, so I can work there. Maybe tax write off. I don't know, talk about money, business.

[Matt]

Okay, so like, again, truly, like, we're going to dive into Nick's like, personal finances. Like, do you mind sharing how much.

[Unknown Host]

You'Re paying a month? So it's 225amonth.

[Matt]

Okay.

[Joel]

Does that mean free beers in the tap room? Because I might get my money.

[Unknown Host]

I wish, I wish. Yeah, like I said, one free protein shake or one beer every day.

[Matt]

Well, you can.

[Unknown Host]

No, I was going to say it.

[Matt]

Because if it was all you.

[Unknown Host]

Right.

[Matt]

Yeah, like, they would be losing money. They wonder how much time I would be spending.

[Joel]

100%. Okay, we got to hear too, Nick, how not just your first money podcast, but literally your first podcast episode was how to Money when you were going off to college. How did that come about?

[Unknown Host]

Yeah, it definitely was. So when I was in high school, I applied to so many different colleges, like probably 20 or 30. I applied to everything that could probably accept me. And when I was very blessed, I got a call from the University of Alabama. I probably sent over 100 applications for scholarships. Every single scholarship that was online or that I could fill out myself or even like mail in. I would probably applied to over 200, like, scholarships during, like, in person and online.

[Matt]

Wow.

[Unknown Host]

The University of Alabama called me. I remember this, like, frequently. I was on a bus going to a soccer game and my best friend was sitting next to me. I get this phone call. It's like telemarketer almost. And I was like, I'm not gonna answer it. He's like, dude, you're not doing anything on a bus going to a soccer game. I just answer the phone. I'm like, all right, cool. Answer the phone. Like, hey, is this Nick Engler? I'm like, yes, this is like, this is actually. This is Coca Cola. We want to call you to offer you a first generation scholarship. You are One of the 14 people that are going to go to Alabama.

[Matt]

Wow. Holy cow.

[Unknown Host]

And I just broke down in tears. And my buddy, he's like my brother for life. Nidell, if you're listening, thank you. Thank you so much for letting me answer that phone call. Yeah, he's like hugged me. He's like. He's like, this is. You're going like, let's do this.

[Matt]

That's awesome, dude.

[Unknown Host]

And it was really cool. So I was going to Alabama, got a couple other scholarships offers. Actually was going to go to debt free from undergrad. And I was like, wow. I got this big lump sum of money. I have no idea what to do with it. My mom, like, didn't even make above 20K. And like, I roof over my head. I had food. Like, I was very blessed with what I had. But I never knew, like, people bought cars, had car payments. Like, I just never. We just never had a car that could even work, let alone like, oh, we got to do a finance or have a credit card, stuff like that. So when I got this like big lump sum, I was like, I need to be educated before I go. So I packed up my little baby eclipse, paid for all cash. I saved for like three or four years to get this car all cash. And it was like so ruggedy, so old, but it fit. Everything I had in my, in my, like, closet was there. And I was like, looking for a podcast and I found you guys. I was like, oh, my God. I was like, well, I like beer. I like money. I said, this is going to be awesome. This is cool.

[Matt]

These are my dudes.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah. For my people and listen to it for my two hour drive to Bama and it was amazing.

[Matt]

Nice. He doesn't listen anymore. Folks, I'm glad that you were able to find us early on. So I mean, one of the reasons I think this is going to be a little bit different is like typically we have authors on and it's folks who have written something and so we've been able to read through, you know, their expertise and like something that they've been thinking about and researching for a really long time. But with you, I mean, we're really bringing you on to, for you to share your story. And so we're certainly going to give you the opportunity to do that. We're going to find different ways to kind of pull some different questions out of you. But you want to share just, just your upbringing. You talked about maybe growing up in poverty. You said your mom didn't make more than 20k. Why it seemed like you, you were set on getting out, out of Alabama. Can you sort of share why that was your mission?

[Unknown Host]

My childhood really just I feel like we overcome. I was close every single day and every single person's story is like different and mine. I could easily went left and like gone down the wrong road. Involved in violence. Like when I grew up, I was in a mobile home park in Broward County, Florida. Like 954. Just rough neighborhood. Grew up in the mobile home parks. Just my closest members for me were like selling, trapping, just doing things that people that I moved to like in Alabama would never even do. Like we didn't even see like that kind of stuff. My mom got me out of that situation. We basically like fled the actual DHR program. So I was actually going to be taken away from my mom and because again, I was just almost a liability. Like how you guys talk about assets and liability. I was literally a liability to my mom because she was just working two jobs like put food on the table, loved me so much. And I was just, I couldn't do anything for it because I was like in elementary school, I was in the first grade, second grade. I couldn't bring home any bills to like help pay for it. And so when we went back to Alabama, still in the same situation, but she was grinding like working. And that's when I was old enough to like to work. So I got my first job when I was 12 years old. I was a dishwasher for an Italian restaurant. It was honestly amazing. I got Bring up some extra capital, some cash, and help my mom. Like, the bills, like, the first bills I were paying was like the water bill or like the power bill. And if things would ever go sour, like, I knew how to turn the water back on the road. I knew how to take somebody's cable so we could have some TV or stuff like that. And it's like the skills that you don't want to teach your kid, but also the stuff that you need to survive. I mean, we grew up and like, we had to survive. And then now it's like, at the time we're high school, where I was like, I need to focus. So I took a bunch of AP classes. I applied to dual enrollment at my local college. So I took college courses for free because of my, I guess my free and reduced lunch. I couldn't even click the lowest button because it was like, does your mom make 35k? And I was like, well, it doesn't. Like, does it go any lower than that? It doesn't. It wasn't even. There wasn't even something lower on the paper to fill out.

[Joel]

And so what was your experience with money then? Was it non existent? Was it shameful? Was it. There's just never enough, like, and I haven't even seen examples of there being enough. Like, how did you know that you wanted to get go with money or that you felt like because you had this drive, it seems like, to start working at 12, applying for scholarships, going to college. First person in your family. Where did that come from and how did that transition happen?

[Unknown Host]

I think it came from just my experiences as a child, like growing up. Because I grew up. I mean, I was basically a full grown adult at like 10. I had to be right. Like, I had to cook, I had to clean, I had to go to work. I had to like, look at the bills or help my mom do her taxes. I mean, I just had to. Because if I didn't, like, who was gonna be the man of the house? Like, who was gonna like, provide? Who was gonna try to teach and educate and even grow like our family? At the end day, it was just me and my mom. And I feel like at that time point it was on my shoulders that if I did have a family or like a significant other or a partner, I want to provide for them. Like, I don't want that situation to be in. This is like the same thing everybody says. Like, I want my kids to grow better than me. Like, that's our like the American dream, right? You're like, you want Somebody to have to come before you to have like not struggles or not have to figure out what they're going to do or who are they going to eat or their lights can be on or if the power's turned off. Cool. Let's turn on the stove because it's gas. Now we're hot. Like now we don't have to be cold. It's just stuff like that where it's like, my family's not gonna act like that. My family's not gonna ever go through that. And that was my like mission. I was almost like a drive where it's like, I can't stop now. I have to like be better than my, my peers so I can be the best. And that's like how like when I went to high school, I just played sports and took AP classes, took dual enrollment and got enough scholarships. Cause I had to apply for everything. Got accepted a bunch of colleges and then from there I decided to like pick my head up and do the best I could do like while I was there. Like when I went to college, the word I didn't even know was no. Like I said yes to everything. Every single thing in college I could do. Like I joined just from like a.

[Matt]

Club standpoint or from a job standpoint.

[Unknown Host]

Everything. Yeah, everything.

[Matt]

All of the above.

[Unknown Host]

All the above. So when I first went to Bama, I joined a couple just like clubs. Like there was like key clubs, there's a student government body association. I actually joined the rugby team at Alabama and I was playing rugby for three years and it was like an amazing experience.

[Joel]

I actually have a football team too.

[Unknown Host]

They do, they do, yeah. Pretty good football team. Yeah. It doesn't hurt to have a good football team.

[Joel]

But you worked for the football team too, right? I did a side hustle of sorts.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah. So every single year I took a different internships because my thing was like if I can be well rounded like a Swiss army knife, then anybody could hire me. So I had a bunch of internships. I was with the strength and conditioning coaches. So when Coach Cochran was there for Alabama football, I was a strength intern. And I was there like at 5:30am with the walk ons, just like wiping down benches, helping them move weights, doing drills, stretching out players and just like just learning knowledge. Like just like being a bug on the wall. And like when he said to move, I said how fast? You know, like. Cause you're like on the ground, you're a total pole person. So it's like you just gotta be there and help as much as you can. And then from there, I went to the athletic marketing department, learned about sales fan experiences. Like, when that TV hits, like, go. Or when the football team, like, when 15 minutes I count down, we have a script. And that script is down to, like, T minus, like, milliseconds of, like, what's on the scoreboard, who's gonna be on the radio, who's gonna be this Bam, bam, bam. Like, your script's here. It's like. I mean, down to the millisecond. So, like, learning that's like, you have to be, like, detail oriented. You have to have a mission. And, like, every single second counts. And that's how I kind of took my personal. I was like, wow, every single second counts, like, when I'm in school as well. So that's why all these opportunities came. I just, like, said yes to everything and just try to, like, soak up as much knowledge as I could.

[Matt]

It's crazy. Like, so for you, it does not sound like you had mentors. It does not sound like you had somebody in your life early on that you were necessarily looking up to. As to you just saying, I know what is going on around me, and I just don't want this to be my future. Like, it sounds like that. That was a lot of your. Just the motivate, the motivational drive behind what kind of spurred you on.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah, absolutely. I think that was a major part of. Part of it. And then actually, when high school came around, like, I was bringing back up, I was more like a liability. My mom couldn't really afford me, and I saw her struggle. And we had some family friends, like, would. Would pitch in, and I hated, like, asking for money or even, like, being a burden, like staying over a friend's house for more than a week because I had to go to school or, like, because, like, the power was out or, like, she had to go on long trips, and I couldn't, like, be there. So I had a family friend and really good friends, and actually, like, they're my brothers. They're my family. I include them as, like, my mom and dad. Like, they're like my foster family. I started living with them, and, you know, one week became a month, then one month became a year, and then now it's been, I want to say, almost 10 years. I live with this family. Even when I go to Christmas break, I'd go back, stay with them for Thanksgiving. And they're. They're my blood as much as my mom. And I love my mom. Deaf. And, like, we have a really Good relationship. Like, we're gonna kill it. Like, we're gonna be in the top percent soon. So it's like, I still have all my love for my mom and everybody helped me out. And then that family's like another branch that was supporting me. And that's like, I'm very beneficial. I'm very blessed because some people don't have that. Yeah, I got basic, unformally adopted and just. They saved my life.

[Joel]

And did you learn a lot in that relationship?

[Unknown Host]

I did. Because it's funny because I grew up as a single family or like a single family kid. So it's like, I was only child, just me and my mom through everything. Like, I said, date table. It's just me and her just talking about, like, okay, you know, it's just.

[Matt]

Me and mom hanging out.

[Unknown Host]

Hanging out. And then when I go there, like, I have a little sister and older brothers and a big family and cousins and uncles and goofy uncles. And it's like, cool. Cause I'm. Wow, like, this is so cool. Like, I was usually playing video games with two controllers. I'd play both of them, right? And then now it's like we fight over catan and like, who's gonna, like, trade this? It's like the funniest experiences. I get the best of both worlds. I'm like, oh, my God, this is amazing. Like, generally, like, I guess, like, love for a family I definitely grown to have.

[Matt]

That's super cool.

[Joel]

I want to dial in on the scholarship thing for a second. Yeah. So you obviously worked your butt off in high school. And I wonder, well, I'm curious, was that something that you knew you needed to do? Like, you just had to do it because there was no other way to. To get out of where you were. And then secondly, when it came to scholarships, like, the Koch scholarship that you mentioned was huge. That was just this massive payout. Not all scholarships provide that much money. But you applied for a bunch of other scholarships and received other scholarships too. How impactful was that?

[Unknown Host]

Absolutely. I guess I go into high school first. We had this one speaker come in and it was fantastic. Because no one really goes back to your high school and preaches, like, just that kind of world to you. Because I'm just. I was involved in, like, oh, high school practice, like, girls in the locker way, like, kind of that stuff. It's like, not really, like, okay, what's going to do your senior year? What's going to do, like, what's your HCC score? Like, what's. What are you going to do to apply for scholarships. Like, we had, like, a council, like, members or like, that would come up and go, oh, you should probably apply for college because you're. You're a senior year, or you can go into the workforce. Like, almost 80% of my high school went into the workforce. Like, I was only guy in my grade to go to Bama. A bunch of my friends went to, like, other schools. Just, like, a very, very low population of us even, like, went to college.

[Matt]

So was it, like, a guidance counselor there at the school that kind of helped guide you through that process then?

[Unknown Host]

And again, it's like, when you're at, like, a small school and you have, like, 200 students and you have one guidance counselor. How. How can they afford to do that? Like, they're spread so thin already, and they. It's. It's. My high school was 12th through seventh grade. I can imagine how much, like, she had to deal with and then having, like, how to provide for a kid's future as well as so much stress on her. So, like, there's no, like, bad blood, nothing like that. Just got lost in the system, you know? So, like, for me, it was like, I had to set a diary. So this guy, when he came in, he's like, you need to write down everything you do. You go to Kiwanis Club and, like, flip pancakes and, like, give it to the society, or you go to the free beans of rice at the church and, like, you donate and you help. You spend your time, like, document everything. Go to the animal shelter, right? And you walk some dogs, or you just help clean the pens. Like, those people are giving their time for free, not getting paid. And they're, like, providing a service for all the dogs and the animals that need homes. And so you go there and help them out. It's like, that's amazing. Like, but then he was like, I'll write that down. Cause that makes you different. And we had no idea. We were just doing it because, like, we enjoyed going to the church and helping. We enjoyed going and help walking dogs, and we enjoyed going to Kiwanis Club and hanging with the senior citizens and, like, putting quilts and, like, playing chess. Getting beaten chess. And he's like, no, like, that sets you different. Like, no one else would do that. I was like, why not? It was like, you just have a good heart. And me and my group, the friends, I would always do that. Yeah, we should. And when it came to scholarship time, we sent that piece of paper. Like, I think I emailed you my high school resume. It was really, it was like long and I just wrote everything down and like, we're the ones that got these scholarships, these colleges. Like Everybody's making like 3600 ACT scores or like everybody has like 4.0 HP in high school. Everybody's like involved in extracurricular activities. But what's going to set you apart, like, is that you writing a two page essay then sending it in that they're not going to read or you having like these like amazing volunteer hours? That's like, we're like, wow. Like you had this, this and this and this. But also you did this too, like for the community, for people that you enjoy to be around, for the people that were suffering. You helped them out. That's what I wanted, my college. I could teach anybody, I can teach anybody, like math or, or any of those, like, subjects for college. But your personality, your like ethics, your like your individual soul, that's unteachable. Like you're born with that.

[Matt]

Yeah, man.

[Unknown Host]

And I think that's what made like me and my friends different. To be able to get applied for these scholarships and actually like get approved too.

[Matt]

Sure. Yeah. So you were doing a lot of that out of the goodness of your heart. But then you realized that by documenting that, that was going to obviously set you apart when it came to applying for school. But now the ability to kind of transform some of those pursuits and the things that you were doing into generating income, that's we're going to actually talk about next. So we'll get to that and more right after the break. So one aspect of owning your own business that some folks don't think about is setting aside money for taxes. It's a hassle if you forget about it, but you just got to think ahead some. You got to make those quarterly estimates, then it's no big deal. Similarly, Trust and Will makes creating your will easy and time efficient. Gets you thinking ahead, which is good. But then you can focus on other important tasks. Their website is incredibly easy to use and it's tough to beat knowing that I have the peace of mind, that my wishes are secure and that Kate and the kids are taken care of.

[Joel]

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[Matt]

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[Joel]

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[Matt]

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[Joel]

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[Matt]

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[Joel]

All right, we're back. Still talking with friend of the show, Nick Gangwer. Been listening since those early college days, Nick and man. So fun to have you along. Interestingly enough, one podcast episode that you listened to had a really big impact while you were in school about house hacking. And most people would say, buying a house while I'm in college, impossible. But even given all the things that we've heard so far, the difficulties that you've experienced, you still managed to buy a house while you were in college.

[Matt]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah, I did. Yeah. Okay. Don't remember what number episode it was, but I remember you saying, the best intro to real estate is house hacking. And so I brought it upon myself. When I was an undergrad, I worked as a bartender. I worked as an event menu, like consulting, where people came to me. I build their menus for their bars. So I'd build drink menus, or they have Christmas menus. I'd help them just craft their cocktails.

[Matt]

Like the drink program, which maybe we'll get to this.

[Unknown Host]

Towards the end of the episode, entrepreneurship.

[Matt]

It kind of leads to almost what you're doing now, but please continue.

[Unknown Host]

And so I just saved up a lot of money because I was like, I really want to go to grad school. My family friend, he got his mba, and he was like, you know, once you leave school, are you really gonna go back and do it? Are you really going back and do it? I was like, I've had a lot of people like, oh, wait, you're in school. Just stay in school. Get it done. When I was at Bama, I had a 4.0 GPA graduate with a red cap. And that was my first mission. When I was in undergrad, when I freshman year, I told my mom. I was like, I want to get that red cap. Because I toured and I saw people with red caps. What does that mean? Oh, it's a 4.0 GPA all four years. I was like, mom, I'm do that. And when I got it, I broke down. I was like, oh, my God, Yeah, I got it. So I saved a lot of money. And actually through the University of Alabama, if you have a 4.0 GPA, you can go straight to get your MBA without taking that GRE.

[Matt]

Oh, nice.

[Unknown Host]

And so I was like, oh my gosh, this is brilliant. And when I applied with my scholarship money and then with my gpa, I actually got a scholarship for the first year from my MBA program and I had all this money I saved up for working because that was my plan to pay for it. Cause I just don't really trust if I was going to get one, you know, just like I got to control the controllables, right? And so I can control how I save my money for this next chapter of my life. And when that happened, I was like, well, great, I have this lump sum of money. What can I do? I was like, let's, let's get a house. Let's house hack. How do I even do that? What do I even do? I just listened to podcasts, learned, and didn't really get into, stuck into like the data analytics or like the analysis paralysis. Like, I know like people preach that. Like, don't get stuck into it, don't get stuck into it. Just like practice and practice and practice. So for like 30 days, I did a deal a day, did the numbers, looked around, just driving for dollars, kicking tires with a couple of my professors that they were like really big into the real estate world and they like kind of showed me a little bit and so I could go on my own and I just walked the streets. I mean, I lived in that town for four years, going to college. I know what streets go on. Yeah, I know the market. That's like my home market now. I saw this house and I knew they were on sale. He was for sale by owner for, for a year. I looked up on Zillow, Redfin drove by. I was like, what's wrong with this house? Like, what's going on? Like, no one's, no one's picking this up. Like, this is a great deal. I figured out that the bottom low of the house was never listed. It was never appraised, it was never square footed or never calculated.

[Matt]

No way.

[Unknown Host]

And they had a whole entire section of downstairs. I was like. So they thought it was a three bed, three bath.

[Joel]

Little mathematical anomaly there.

[Unknown Host]

And technically it was a five bedroom, four bath.

[Matt]

Oh man.

[Unknown Host]

And I was like, oh my God, this is crazy. Like I could live here. Like, I don't have a car payment. I don't have the house payment because I can get for my buddies come in there and. Yeah.

[Matt]

So what bedroom did you take? Did you take the lower level? Was it, was it finished out a.

[Unknown Host]

Little more Sketchily, it was bougie for my take on four walls that aren't, like, sagging. This is amazing.

[Matt]

I thought maybe it wasn't listed because it had been added on, renovated in a very haphazard kind of way, and maybe, you know, got the entrepreneurial sort of mindset. I'll take the crappy kind of spot, list the other rooms upstairs for a lot more. But it sounds like that's kind of what you did.

[Unknown Host]

Regardless of the state is detached from the house, all the four units and the three bathrooms were up top beautiful. And I was like, cool, I'll open the door and walk inside to cook my food every single day. I don't care. So I did take the one that was like outside, but it was. I mean, it was perfect. Like, it's. It's cash cow. My. My roommates, like, didn't mind because again, like, bringing it back to when I went to Bama, my tuition, the Dorms was like $8,000 a semester. It was ungodly.

[Joel]

So you're turning something that's an expense into income.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah.

[Joel]

And you used, what, additional scholarship money, money from bartending, all these side hustles to basically save up that little nest egg. Like, you worked your butt off to get that down payment. And when we're house hacking, I'm curious, how much did you put down? You still own this house too, right?

[Unknown Host]

I do. Yeah, I do. So my biggest trouble was actually getting approved from the loan. I found the deal, I had the money for the down payment. I had the agent already worked with them, already did the underwriting. I knew it was going to get deal. And so I went to my foster dad and I was like, hey, like, this is it. Like, this is. This is a unicorn. Like, we have to do this. And he's like, well, I don't really know. Like, he's never done anything like a house before, like real estate or investing. And I was like, listen, I was like, I'll manage it. I'll be the property manager. I'll get the leases. I'll learn. Like, I'll do everything. All you need to do is just sign this piece of paper and you. Well, let's do like 50, 50, like on cash, cash return. And so when he signed the dollar, he made $500 each month until now. And he hasn't seen. He hasn't done anything. I repainted the whole house. I built a deck, I redid the flooring, I did the carpeting. I, like, literally built the house for like an entire year while I was in college. And it's, it's beautiful. That's awesome. Yeah. And so it's, it's doing really well. I paid as a 5%. So I used a 5% conventional loan or a first home. Yeah. And as a 5% down payment, it was 220 asking. I got it down to 210. And when I got it, the first day appraised for like230. So I already had equity in the business or in the property. Mortgage is a thousand. And when I got it, my whole ordeal was like, I struggled to even get a place. My sophomore year of college, like, the rent was several hundred dollars for a small, small shoebox in Tuscaloosa. I was like, there's no way people can afford that. So when I got this house like below market rents because it's kids in my fraternity, like my brothers, and I'm like, listen, I was like, I'm trying to help out. I'm not trying to make any money from this. I'm trying to like one give someplace to live. But also it's affordable. So it's like 200 below market rate. Every single bedroom. Like, I could easily be like, also I pay for utilities too. And that's like, yeah. Because again, like, I'm trying to take.

[Matt]

Those hot, long, hot showers.

[Unknown Host]

So it's like some people could be like, oh, you're done. You could get an extra thousand dollars a month. It's like, what? I didn't do that for that reason. Like, it's an asset. Like, that's the house is worth right now. It's worth about like 290 or 3 or 295. So then like equity is there. But I'm trying to make it a path for like, for other people, my fraternity, other people in Tuscaloosa to like, have that stress off their shoulders. Right. Like, okay, I have to worry about school. I have to worry about surviving, like, like finding myself like all this day and age. Like, what's one thing I can take away from. I can take away this added, like, expense and still make a. A beautiful income property. Yeah, like, it's, it's amazing.

[Matt]

Well, I mean, that's a lot of times capitalism gets, gets criticized. If you take the improper mindset, it's like, well, you're taking advantage. It's like, oh, they could be, they could be paying much, you know, a whole lot less. But I mean, that's what's so beautiful about the open market. Like, it's like this is a situation with the free Market where you can say, all right, this is, I'm willing to list it for this much and make this much money. And then you got guys that are like, oh, I would gladly pay that. And so they're winning. You're winning.

[Joel]

Even being a landlord, you can still, I mean, you've, you've made 80 plus grand just owning this home while they help pay the mortgage.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. And it's like, like you were saying I could, I could rent, put the rent up to 900 bucks a room, but I'm listed till 2028.

[Matt]

Nice.

[Unknown Host]

And I don't have to sting a finger. I'd rather be $100 less a door and make somebody's day and they can sign for years. And now I don't have to worry about finding tenants, screening tenants, like doing all this like rent ready apps or like finding a property manager where I can do everything. They're connected to me. I know them, I see them. If I go down to Tuscaloosa and visit like their family almost, and that's.

[Joel]

Really cool to minimizing that vacancy too.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah, absolutely.

[Matt]

So you saved up the money to put down on that house while you were in school, while. And you know, you didn't gloss over this, but you got the red cap that 4.0 all four years. Like, what do you say to folks who are saying, well, like, you know, the kids, they need to be focused on their studies, make it that way they can get the very top GPA so that they can pursue some of the different extracurriculars, you know, the kind of things that might flesh out a college career. And a lot of times what they'll do is they continue to borrow money as opposed to earning money. But you were doing both. Like, what do you think about that? Obviously, I know what you think.

[Unknown Host]

That's a great question.

[Matt]

It's possible, I, you know, what you're saying is that it's possible to do both. But yeah, I would love to hear you talk about that.

[Unknown Host]

No, 100%. I think that's a great question because it's something that I definitely struggle with in college because I wore so many hats where I was like, well, who would have to be day, right? Like, am I going to this internship where I have to be at there at 5:30 in the morning to go to the football program and do that, or do I have to go to my bartending shift that doesn't end till 3am and I'm walking home pitch black, dark, dodging all the goofies. It's like, or like, okay, cool. Or I have this, like, I don't like, organic chem test that I need to study for. And it's like, I need to be that person at the right time. It's just basically time management. And if you can do that, I mean, gosh, like, I was, had an internship, I had a job, I was on the rugby team, I had practice, I had like social outings I really wanted to go to and build that relationship. But also at the end of the day, like, I'm there for school, I'm there to learn. Like, this is my future. So they take that priority as well. I think what benefited me most is I, I feel like I use my undergrad to build myself, like my personality, my, my person. Like, who, who Nick is. That was my undergrad because I said yes to everything. And I, I mean, Alabama's culture is like so dramatic where like you can connect with anybody, you can talk to anybody, you can see the different cultures that come in there and you can actually build who you are and then that foundation can get you anywhere. Like, a job can be taught. Like anybody can be, teach a job as well. Like, and so it's like building who you are first, then applying that to a future you is like my goal.

[Joel]

Did you miss out on the college experience? Do you have any regrets for the. Because obviously we've established some of the financial benefits and the benefits to you.

[Matt]

At your individual growth, personal development place. Yeah.

[Joel]

But do you feel like, man, I wish I would have taken the pedal off the metal a little bit. Like, I wish I would have chilled out just a bit so I could have enjoyed that college experience or no.

[Unknown Host]

No, I don't think I missed it at all. So, like, going back when I first came, I didn't say no to anything. I founded a club called First Fellows. It was me and Taylor Robinson. She, she was spearheading. She was a president. She thought of everything. She was like, we should really do this because she's a first generation scholarship as well. And she was like, we need some like an organization that's for first Gen because when we go there we have no idea. Like, I can't, I can't go on LinkedIn and see a post for our mom be like, oh, I had such a great time, like touring my daughter around or son around the Lockheed Martin with me today in the office. We do not have that.

[Matt]

Yeah, you're like, what, what's that all about?

[Unknown Host]

My mom doesn't even have a LinkedIn profile. Like, she doesn't Know what that is? And, like, that.

[Joel]

Mine either. But she's much older than your mom. Retired.

[Unknown Host]

But even that experience, like, some people listen might be like, oh, that's. That's. That's weird. It's like. But not to us. Like, we have no idea. Like, that little tiny thing that gives you jobs to connections all about who you know. We've already, like, beaten this horse before. It's, like, who you know, who you get the job. Like, your experiences or your connections, your friends, your co workers. But with us, like, that's a whole world that we're not even a part of.

[Matt]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

And so we first came. Like, my dorm room almost had more population than my hometown. I mean, my town's, like, 10,000 people strong. Like, there's more cow pastures and cemeteries than there are people.

[Joel]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

And I go, here. I'm like, these gigantic buildings. I'm falling over trying to look at them. And, like, all right, cool. Here you are with 10,000 more freshmen. Go. I can't call my mom and be like, hey, where's the dining hall? What's this stuff? So that's like, you got to go in there and just be ready. So we built this, like, organization to that, and that was amazing. From there, again, I didn't join a fraternity. I was like, on my first year, I joined the rugby team, played with them for three years. And then my sophomore year, I went to a group of guys that were hanging around this table at, like, a local pub and was talking to them. Great guys, much, like, trail mix people. Just, like, everybody from all cultures, all identities were laughing or goofing. They're like, yeah, you should come back to the house. Like, we're just doing. Like, we're just gonna watch the. Watch the game. It was like, some basketball game. I was like, oh, cool. I was like, what apartment? Like, apartment. I was like, oh, no, we're in this fraternity. I'm like, oh, my God. It's so cool. Like, I had no idea. Like, y' all were just regular dudes. And, like, I grew up, like, thought that was, like, Blue Mountain State kind of thing. It's like, I don't want. I'm not doing that. I'm not gonna pay for friends. I'm not gonna do this. But it was a gender connection that was like, almost like a. Like, a community. And that's exactly what I need to, like, hold a foundation.

[Joel]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

And people were, like, in there and struggle with money, or they. Or they had a lot of money, or they're, like, a part of like the LGBTQ community or they were straight. It's like you get involved in so much that you just come out such a more rounded person. I think that's college. It's more about is like rounding yourself and finding your identity and developing yourself as well as, like, finding yourself. Because I didn't know exactly what to do until my junior year when I was in college, and I was like, wow. Like, I really do love, like, entrepreneurship. I love consulting. And I would go around and help businesses start, like, promoting themselves. Like, I hope at the coffee shop to make their own, like, coffee beans and to go into stores, I hope with a music venue to make. To build their brand ambassador team. I hope with the dispensary to help, like, their marketing to try to get them, like, started when the hemp was just getting onboarded in Tuscaloosa. And also I worked as a brand ambassador for Anheuser Busch. And so building relationships, talking to people, like, building brand new seltzers that nobody ever heard about, like the Bud Light Seltzer winter pack. You'd be like, trying to promote this drink and be like, hey, like, you should definitely try this because these are the flavors, these are the benefits. Da, da, da, da. And it's like just being that entrepreneurial spirit, I was like, wow, this is what I want to do. I want to work for a startup.

[Joel]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

And I would never known that unless I took the chances and, and developed that.

[Matt]

Yeah. I mean, what I, what I hear you saying, like, you, again, like, you said yes to everything that came across your path, that came across your plate. Right. Like, you took a bite of everything.

[Unknown Host]

Everything.

[Matt]

But I am curious, I do wonder if, if it wasn't for your upbringing, if you would have that same kind of drive. Do you think that that's the case? Because I think there's a lot of folks out there and yeah, you know, they. They've had parents and they've helped them along and they're taking them to the company, you know, and the internships and getting them introduced. But you learned that while you were there in school. But I think a lot of that, it sounds like, to me at least a lot of that was fueled by your upbringing, by the fact that you didn't have that. How critical do you think or how crucial do you think that kind of experience is to, in your case, having that drive to want to go out there and to kill something and to create your own thing?

[Unknown Host]

I think it's exposure, like, so, not.

[Matt]

Necessarily going through it, but just even seeing that these Are options that are.

[Unknown Host]

Out there even seeing it, I mean, like, well, we grow our strongest when we're under pressure. Like we experience things or we like all the failures we have, we find one success story from. And I think that was my whole thing is I was exposed to everything almost. But also my friends were as well. Like my city wasn't. We didn't have like millionaires in our city, nothing like that. So all my friends were struggling around me as well. And I see what the struggles were and like what they did to overcome them or like what they didn't do to overcome them and they're still there or that are. Or that are like going the opposite way for me. And you take that with you when you do go off to a whole different college or a whole different experience or even if you don't go to college. Like, you don't even have to go to college this time of year. So like right now in our current like financial situation, you could explore. It's like even moving to Atlanta. I had no idea who anybody was here. Like, I didn't know where to live. I didn't know where to stay or who to talk to. I just came here and I just again said no or I didn't say no at all. Like, I just said yes every single day. I came opportunity. Like, I went out one time, I saw they're hiring for a bartender and I was a. Wow. Bartender experience.

[Matt]

I've done that before.

[Unknown Host]

I already had a full time job and I was like, cool, I'll just, just apply. We'll see what happens. He's a. Hey, man. I said, I need someone right now. I. My buddy just quit.

[Joel]

I literally slapped a SA apron on. Let's go.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah, let's go. And I was like, all right, let's, let's go. And so I brought it to that night. They're like, oh, this is amazing. I met a bunch of friends. They actually introduced me to the industry. I know a lot of sales reps and interns. My like, kind of like going to my future job. That connection helped me so much. Like, I got my job now from doing that, from being like, oh, cool, there's a sign that says hiring, let's do it. I mean, I'm here right now. I'm ready to go.

[Matt]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

And so, yeah, I guess just exposure to stuff that is not there and taking advantage of stuff that is there is what made me like, I guess get off my shoes and be able to tackle all those things or wear those different hats that I was Trying to do and try and be like, I'm not missing out the college experience, but I'm gaining real life experience that no professor could teach me.

[Matt]

So when we met you, you had two jobs. I remember one of them was for like one of the race companies like Spartan Race or Tough Mudder.

[Unknown Host]

Which one was it? I worked for Spartan Races.

[Matt]

Spartan Race in addition to the beverage industry. Is it just that you've got the drive? Like, I'm, I'm trying to connect the dots for folks out there who are just like, am I just a slacker? Is it for you? Is it just that you've got this pent up energy that you've got this drive? Or is it something outside of you that you're trying to pursue? Like, is it like, do you have your eyes set on some kind of goal, some kind of financial goal or a lifestyle goal? Or is it more internal that you're just like, this is just who I am. Or is it maybe a little bit of both?

[Unknown Host]

No, I think that's a perfect question. I think it ties into again like the podcast where y' all talk about like building your goals and making sub goals. And so I built a five year plan by, by 20, 30, I. Or by I'm 30, I want to be a millionaire. Like I want to retire. And that's, that's my goal is to.

[Joel]

Retire and to retire by 30.

[Unknown Host]

To retire by 30 is my goal. And every time I, every time I talk to people like, oh, that's crazy, it doesn't happen. But also like when Bill gets like, oh yeah, I'm going to vent this people like, that's, that's wild. I joined this like masterclass thing on. It's like an app. You can draw a masterclass. Have you tried that? Yeah.

[Joel]

Or no, I think I haven't. I did Aaron Franklin's masterclass on smoking or actually one of those videos, but I've not. I can't smoke Meats.

[Unknown Host]

So the CEO of Walt Disney, he has his masterclass on there and he was like good friends with Steve Jobs. And he came to him and he was like, hey, I'm going to show you something. I want you to be all in. And he was like, what are you going to show me? He said, well, it has to be off the books. He's like, I think I have something you can put all your ABC shows on. And he shows them this little like the ipod with the screen. He's like, this is what people are gonna be using. And he's like, that's crazy. He's like, this is insane. He's like, he said, this is the first one. You're the only one that's seen this. And now, I mean, we're attached to our phones. I have a screen on it. And it started right there. And so it's like people think you're crazy for saying something, but it's like that man was crazy. I bet he thought the same thing. Like, there's no way someone's gonna watch something on that tiny little screen. Or I can put shows or movies or televisions or sports or anything like that. Now, boom. It's everywhere. I mean, everybody has one. And if you don't have one, you're trying to get one, right? It's like, it's, I guess, having that exposure to being that drive and trying to get to someplace that you're not. And so that's why I wrote these goals. And under these goals, like my five year plan to be there, I'm like, okay, now my first goal is to do rental properties to help me with that goal, right? So my baseline, if I can make like $8,000 a month, I'd. Living like a king, right? Like, I don't need anything crazy. Like I live below my. Below my means right now, and I live below my means when I was 8 years old and in still in college. And so having that like the growth of income when people. What's it called when you say on the show it's like inflation of your income.

[Joel]

Oh, compounding returns.

[Matt]

No. Life. Lifestyle creep.

[Unknown Host]

Lifestyle. Thank you. Yeah. Lifestyle creep. I. I just feel like for me, that's not even a word in my definition or a word in my dictionary because I've tried so hard to keep that. That ceiling already below that, that I've never really hit that. Like, even when I was telling you earlier, when I moved to Atlanta, I toured so many different apartments, I crashed on waste cost for a whole week. I made all these appointments, and they're like $2,000, $2,100, $2,400. I was like, oh my God, I don't know if I can live in Atlanta. I don't know if I can go to work anymore. And when this one popped up on Facebook, I saw the price. I didn't even tour it. I was like, sold. I don't care where it is. I was like, this is the price. It's in my budget. Like, I'm living below my means and I live in a shoebox. But it's my shoebox and it's beautiful. And I love it. And so I think, yeah, actually I just think going for that exposure again of being the uncertainty of where you're in, going towards having that drive, but also staying below your means can really push you in a situation where you can succeed.

[Joel]

That's beautiful. All right, we got a few more questions we got to get to with you, Nick and I'll cover a little more about your future and where those goals are headed and how you're going to get there in the coming, what, five years? We'll talk about that in a little more right after this.

[Matt]

We've all got some old things laying around. But listen, if one of those things is an old 401k, well, it is time to take care of it. Whether you've recently left a job or you're just making time to get your finances in order, Fidelity can help you explore options for your old 401. A fidelity rollover IRA has no account fees or minimums, plus you can choose from a wide selection of investments.

[Joel]

Learn more about options that may give you flexibility for using your money today and for your future. It's an easy to follow rollover process that makes it simple to get started online in under 15 minutes. And just in case you need any help along the way, you'll have access to one of Fidelity's rollover specialists. So why leave that 401 lying around? It's time to make sure you keep your money from working as hard as you do.

[Matt]

That's right. Learn More about a 401k rollover at fidelity.com rollover consider all your options and the applicable fees and features of each before moving your retirement assets. Fidelity Brokerage Services LLC Member NYSE SIPC.

[Joel]

What does the future hold for business? Ask nine experts and you'll get 10 answers. Will we have another bull market in 2025? Or we're going to get a bear market? What about inflation? Will it continue to calm or will higher prices remain sticky? Wouldn't it be cool if someone could invent a crystal ball that would give us some foresight?

[Matt]

Well, until then, Joel over 41,000 businesses have future proofed their business with NetSuite by Oracle, the number one cloud ERP bringing accounting, financial management, inventory, HR into one fluid platform with one unified business management suite. There's one source of truth giving you the visibility and control you need to make quick decisions. With real time insights and forecasting, you're peering into the future with actionable data. When you're closing the books out in days, not weeks, you are spending Less time looking backwards and more time on what is next. Our business is really small, but if we needed netsuite, we would be pumped about the time, the cost savings that it provides. Whether your company is earning millions or even hundreds of millions of dollars, NetSuite helps you to respond to immediate challenges and seize your biggest opportunities.

[Joel]

Speaking of opportunity, download the CFO's Guide to AI and Machine Learning at netsuite.com the guide is free to you at netsuite.com howtomoney that's netsuite.com howtomone hey there, Joel. Here with my buddy Matt from How to Money, Matt Summers, right around the corner. I know you got that travel bug. What adventures do you have planned?

[Matt]

Oh, man, you are going to love this. We're planning this epic road trip up the east coast with the entire family. Just think, lighthouses in Maine, monuments in D.C. plus everything in between.

[Joel]

That's amazing. I'm jealous. But thinking about stowing away in your luggage. But wait a second. How are all six of you going to take this road trip?

[Matt]

Okay, so initially we were thinking about taking an rv, but I found some really awesome Airbnbs along our route. Places with something for everyone. And what I really love is that with Airbnb is we can always start our days with like a. A good breakfast at home. Like it's our home away from home. And I love that routine. I don't know if you've ever tried getting a family of six out the door, let alone trying to find some breakfast in a middle of a city that you're not super familiar with. It's a challenge. Plus, it's a budget killer.

[Joel]

Yeah, that's true. Sounds like cha, to be honest. And you know that's actually what makes hosting on Airbnb so special, right? You're giving travelers a chance to really live like a local. They even have the co host feature, which gives you access to a network of high quality local co hosts who can help take care of your home and your guests when you're not there. Find a co [e-mail] host.

[Matt]

All right, we're back from the break, talking with Nick. And Nick, right before the break, you're talking about living below your means, specifically when it came to housing. And what that gives you is it gives you options to be able to do other things, to pursue other goals. And I'm curious because you said even earlier that you want to be able to retire by the time you're 30. So my question, do you actually want to retire when you're 30 years old, or do you just want to financially have the ability to retire? Because I'll share, and we've talked about this on the show, but my view personally of work has changed. When I first learned about fire, I was just like, dude, I'm doing this. You know, Like, I'm there crunching the can I retire yet? Calculator. You know, reading the Mr. Money Mustache post, that was like, everyone's. A lot of folks who out is, like, in our generation, that was like, their gateway drug to the fire community. The shockingly simple math behind early retirement.

[Joel]

Probably been viewed millions of times, was.

[Matt]

The name of that post. But I'm curious. Yeah. Do you want the ability to retire when you hit 30, or you literally want to retire and want to do something, like, completely off the books, maybe, where you're not even earning money? I'm curious.

[Unknown Host]

No, I think I'm a hustler. I think, like, that saying earlier, I have to drive. I don't think I'm ever gonna stop working. Okay, good. Because I'm like, I don't know how.

[Matt]

You'Re planning to go from, like, full throttle pedal to the metal. I'm just not gonna work anymore for the rest of my life.

[Joel]

For some reason, with all the football talk we had earlier, all I can think of is Rudy from the movie, you know, like, the Notre Dame walk on. And I'm like, nick, you're. You remind me of him, like, that motor that he had to succeed, like, despite his obstacles.

[Matt]

Right.

[Joel]

The fact that he was, like, shorter than everybody else, he wasn't as big. You can't play on the Notre Dame football team, man. And then he does, like, you just have that kind of motor. So when you say you want to retire at 30, I'm like, what does that look like for you?

[Unknown Host]

Yeah, I think retiring for me is finally being able to do my entrepreneurship goals. For me, retiring at 30 is a momentum. It's a testament. It's showing people behind me, showing people in front of me, showing people in my situation. It's like, oh, my God, this guy's crazy. But every single thing he's talking about, he's actually doing. Like, I hate talking and speaking and preaching before without, like, you know, action speak louder than words. And I'd like to have my words out there because I rethink everything every time I talk to somebody. But also, it validates it. Right? Okay, cool. I told this person, I'm gonna do this accountability. More motivation, more accountability to actually make this achieve. And, like, through those Goals like add sub goals like, okay, cool, I want to do three rental properties. Well, how do I get the first rental property? Okay, cool, I need to have 10% down payment. How do I do 20% down payment? Like breaking down these goals to where it's like when you eat an elephant, what, one bite at a time, right? And that's what I'm trying to do with these major goals. Like, I do have these major goals to retire when I'm 30, but I'm actually managing them very, very well. And when I do do that, for example, I have this spreadsheet and every single tab has a crazy idea, has a crazy idea on it. For example, it's like Laundromat, it's townhomes development, it's a storage units complex. It's like developing a startup company. It's opening up a dispensary, it's doing like different jobs. And every single time I click on this tab in my Excel spreadsheet has a list of action items. What am I doing? How am I moving? And so I probably have 20 different projects, entrepreneurships, side hustles, things that I'm doing, and they're all growing, but they're growing 1% each. So people are like, oh, you're so divided, you're not spending much time. Like, how do you get so effort? I'm like, okay, well if I'm free, if I have time, I click one that I want to work on and I see my progression and that's like slowly, like biting the elephant one bite at a time until one goes to fruition. And like all these failures are just like a no. Like, I love a no. I, I love a no so much because once I get a no, it's closer to the next yes. And that's how I succeed.

[Joel]

I'm curious because you went to college, you got an mba, but clearly there's a lot of self education in your journey as well, right? So it wasn't just go to college, get a degree, get a job. Like, there's so much like self effort that had to go into figuring the things out. Because again, you weren't born with someone whispering these things into your ears, telling you, hey, this is how you play the game, this is how you buy real estate and build an empire so you can retire at 30. You, you have really had to kind of DIY all of that. What does that look like? Is that just kind of a continuous improvement way of thinking on your part? Like, I'm always digging in, trying to learn the thing that I don't know when I hear the idea so that I can figure it out. Like, how is your brain working on that stuff?

[Unknown Host]

I just think I love to be a sponge, honestly. I love learning. Sounds so nerdy, but I love it. I just, like, just to be able to. I mean, knowledge is power. And that's been said since, like, I don't know, night and day. Right? And. But when people have this knowledge, sometimes don't share it. And so how are you gonna find this knowledge out? Like, this tactic. Knowledge is. It's. It's. It's like, invaluable. Or like, you can't even measure it. How this tech acknowledges passed down. Like, okay, cool. Well, you bought five rental houses. Well, how'd you do that? Oh, actually, I knew the guy that was selling them off market, and then he actually knew the bank, and then he actually knew that you can get a loan for 0% down payment. And then now I have 200 doors. Well, that makes it sound different. Like, you can't really trust people doing the Internet. You have no idea. Like, some post I got hired by LinkedIn or like, a post for Locky Martin or, like, PNC or these big banks.

[Joel]

How'd you get to home plate? Well, I started at third base. Like, oh, cool.

[Unknown Host]

Exactly.

[Joel]

How do I do that?

[Unknown Host]

So. And like, my generation, we compare ourselves every single day, every single day with this. This screen that's attached to people's hips. Or even just like, all my friends are like, oh, I want to be at this position. I want to be at this. Or I want to have this table and do this. Where. Then show off this. It's just. It's so chaotic. It's so toxic. And just to separate that self, like, I didn't have TV when I grew up. I. We had no cable. We had no. We had little bunny ears to even, like, put those things on. And I didn't really care. I don't have cable now. I don't even have TV. I don't have YouTube TV. Nothing like that. I have Masterclass, which is like, basically educational software where you can have teachings based on cooking, planting, educational businesses, how to do real estate, how to win at poker. Like, it's literally educational classes in every single aspect you can do. And that's why. That's my YouTube. That's my education. It's right there. It's like, I love those videos. I took one on, even one of, like, sex appeal. It was really cool to even see. Like, they have everything. Everything. I was like, oh, I want to be educated, like, everything is so cool. To just learn about. Cause I'm like, well, I had no idea this. Or like even planting or. It's like, you see like the molecules I have to like feed your plants with these, like nitrogen and phosphate. And like I've.

[Matt]

Sweet. Now I know this.

[Unknown Host]

No, but it's like if everything now.

[Matt]

My plants don't die.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah, exactly. Like, it's just cool to have that knowledge. You never know when you're going to need it in a situation.

[Matt]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

And I guess that's why. Yeah.

[Matt]

So you, you've laid out some of the different financial goals that you've had. And you mentioned the masterclass on sex appeal. So it made me think it think this direction. But like, what are some other goals?

[Joel]

Like, clearly you watched that a long time ago, Don.

[Matt]

Check. That was the first checkbox. No, I guess I'm curious. What are some of the other goals you might have in life? Like whether it's relational or social or like you mentioned that fitness club. That's like one your, you know, that's like your, your craft beer equivalent where you're spending a lot of money. Obviously you're spending money on masterclass as well. You highly value personal development. What are some of the. Do you have other goals in. In other sort of arenas of life? And are you pursuing those as much as you are with your finances? Or do you wish that you were pursuing those as ardently?

[Joel]

Or do you.

[Matt]

Yeah, I'm curious. If you look ahead and you're like, you know what? I'm going to shift gears and at some point it's going to. It's going to look a little bit different.

[Unknown Host]

No, absolutely. And that's a great question as well. I think for me, like, having all these like, hats that I keep referring back to is like, you know, your financial hap or your, your social hat, your social cues, or like your fun money spends that you guys have in your. In your buckets. It's kind of like my, like my social spend. Or like last weekend I was at a wine tasting for work. And so I was there for three hours and I got invited last minute, say, hey, there's a new bar that opened up. We'd love to come. Like with a DJ there. Like, we're gonna go have a couple drinks. Like, would you want to come and just like hang out with us? Like, I could have said no. I was at a tasting for four hours in the blazing sun.

[Matt]

It's like, you're probably spent.

[Unknown Host]

Exactly. And it's like. Or I can go and have this experience with my friends. That one, I see them maybe once a week. Like, we'll go have a fun time, and we'll just, again, just enjoy the town. And so, like, I did that as well. And then you get home pretty late. But also, like, I did a little bit of work, I did a little bit of fun. I did a little bit of play and a little bit of education. So, like, people think that the work week is, like, Monday through Friday. Well, with my job, I can technically go work Sunday through Sunday. And so why not just work all seven days a week? But it's like, instead of your nine to five, we're spending, like, five, six hours of, like, continuous work. You do two hours of work each day. I don't mind waking up on a Saturday and, like, enjoying the game or hanging out with friends and then, like, doing, like, working for two hours or bringing my iPad someplace or, like, reading the book in the park and then doing little emails, like, fixing up some work. So that way I can take my Mondays, my Tuesdays, my Wednesdays, and break the day off in half to where I can meet my. My health goals, where I can go to the gym in the morning every day, or I can go hang out with friends and go to the park, or I can grab a coffee with friends. I haven't talked to you so long. It's. Or, like, call my family on the weekends and not be stressed out. Because work is all I'm thinking about. Right. Because it's a part of my daily life. Like, my role is what I took on. Like, I applied that job for a reason. Like, I want to work because I believe in it. Like, I work out because I believe in my body. I want to make it better. Like, I love my friends in the social life because that's who I'm surround myself with. So why am I defining that to a day of a week that somebody just claimed? It's now called Monday, not called Tuesday. 24 hours in a day. We have all the time. Like, again, back to, like, time management. And what do you value? And I think I value experiences. And I'm only here for so long, so I'm trying to live exactly what I want to and. Yeah.

[Joel]

All right, last question for you Are the how to money audience. You've been a part of the how to money audience for a long time.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah.

[Joel]

So there's a lot of people out there listening who have heard your story, and they've been listening to the same show you have, and they want to make progress with their money. Right. They've got goals that might look different from yours, but they're not terribly different. Right. And in many ways they probably overlap. What's your advice to everyone out there? Like what, what do you want them to know as they walk away from listening to this?

[Unknown Host]

That's a really good question as well. I would say, if I had one, it'd be to get out of your comfort zone and take risk. I don't know where I saw this from, but it was, I think it was on a masterclass article, YouTube video I was watching. It was just basically like, just take one risk a month. It might be financially, it might be nerve wracking. It might like, give you the butterflies, but that's the risk that, that you want to take. That's the leap. You want to jump because you got to trust your gut. At the day, like, I was so nervous, I couldn't eat, I couldn't sleep, I couldn't even eat before I signed those documents for the paper for the house. And all the numbers look amazing. Everything was perfect. Like, every called up to a buddy. I said, hey, like, do you. Am I. Is my math wrong? Is the math, Math thing? I don't know. I just want you to make sure. And he's like, he's like, if you don't sign it, I'm gonna sign it. All right? I said, okay. And it could be like a, like shining gold, 100% positive. And you still get that, like, nervous, but that's still a risk. And you just gotta leap and. Yeah, just, just leap. You gotta take the risk.

[Matt]

Nice. You gotta go for it.

[Unknown Host]

You gotta go for it.

[Matt]

Yeah. I think a lot of times, especially in our lives today, things are handed to us. Like there are these set worn paths. And not to get too, you know.

[Joel]

Philosophical or path less taken.

[Matt]

Poetic perhaps, but it takes looking beyond those different paths, those well worn paths, and like considering something completely different and whether that's a life, very specific life experience that has gotten you to that point or whether that's just saying, you know what, maybe I will like sign up for masterclass and being encouraged by whatever their message is to say, you know, I am going to try something new, but to be able to push ourselves in that way. But Nick, we appreciate you taking the time to chat with us, share your story with not only us, but listeners as well. And should we have. Is Nick gonna kind of review the beer?

[Joel]

I think he should.

[Matt]

All right. So normally we do like the big takeaway, but I feel like we. Yeah, Joel kind of set you up to be able to provide that.

[Joel]

He provided the big takeaway on this.

[Matt]

Big takeaway to take those risks.

[Joel]

Oh, I learned a lot in this episode. So the beer that we had on today was called Electric Jellyfish. I picked this up when I was in Austin and Texas. It's from a brewery called Pint House. So, Nick, I know you like good beverages. What was your take on this ipa, my friend?

[Unknown Host]

Electric Jellyfish. I'll have to give a smooth 8 out of 10. Yeah, yeah. It's actually really nice. It's well crafted, very smooth and so has like electric back, the back end. I guess that's what the name is for. It's actually really good. I enjoyed it.

[Matt]

Yeah, yeah. It's got like that fresh, kind of fresher hot presence where it's got a.

[Unknown Host]

Little bit of that bite at the end.

[Matt]

Yeah, yeah.

[Unknown Host]

Hey, I'm here to party.

[Matt]

Yeah. This is a New England hazy Joel. You liked it?

[Joel]

Yeah, I liked it too. I was, I was gonna say, like it wasn't as electric as I thought it was gonna be though. I thought it was gonna zap my tongue and it didn't. So I just appreciate the fact that my mouth is intact.

[Matt]

Maybe that's the difference between somebody who only drinks not. You don't only drink hazy, hazy IPAs. But Nick's over here crafting cocktails which. So you're like wine tastings and things like that. What's like, what's like your drink, your. Your go to drink if you're at home and you're just like, man, I want to go home and enjoy a drink.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah. I've actually stayed away. It's crazy because I've been a bartender for years. I've been a bar manager.

[Matt]

So because you're surrounded by it so much during the day, you go home and you kind of like basically detox.

[Unknown Host]

Well, actually I kind of switched my whole like perceptive of like the beverage industry. I actually been switching more to like the hemp beverages, the THC drinks. And so like I have like a little drink at night I have with friends and it's non alcoholic so I feel like the health benefits are there. But also I can still wake up in the morning and have an amazing workout. Right. I can still do work with friends and that's been my main kick. Is these like THC beverages.

[Matt]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

Blowing up right now.

[Matt]

Is it nowadays? That's one of Yalls brands.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah. I work for nowadays and that's the brand I represent and I love it.

[Matt]

Do you think a big part of that is because there's less sugar. Like my wife and I, we've been talking a lot about just the impact of sugar. So not only in like our day to day diets and food and what we consume, but like, man, there's a whole lot of sugar when it comes in, in beer and alcohol. Does it get converted into sugar as well? Like, once you consume it?

[Joel]

There's a whole lot of like a.

[Matt]

Master class on nutritional science that I don't understand, but that's fascinating. Maybe, you know, there's less of that going on.

[Unknown Host]

In fact, alcohol is 9 kilocalories, you know, proteins, 4 carbohydrates, 4 fats is 7. Alcohol is 9.

[Matt]

So that's pretty weighty. Yeah, we're doing it to ourselves, Joel.

[Joel]

And we need to change our ways.

[Unknown Host]

It's a cheat day. It's a cheat day.

[Matt]

But it's so delicious. So good.

[Joel]

All right, well, that's going to do it for this episode. Nick, thanks again for joining us and yeah, appreciate you sharing your story. Until next time, Best friends out.

[Matt]

Best friends out.

[Unknown Host]

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[Matt]

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[Unknown Host]

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[Matt]

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[Unknown Host]

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[Matt]

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[Unknown Host]

Talkspace works with most major insurers, including Tricare. Match with a licensed therapist [e-mail] military go to talkspace.com military to get started today. That's talkspace.com military.

[Matt]

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[Unknown Host]

Don't always leave your team to do the work. That's been the most important part of how to lead by example.

[Matt]

Listen to Leading by Example executives making an impact on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Unknown Host]

You're listening to an iHeart podcast.