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- [00:00]
Joel
Almost all of us have got old stuff that we should be tossing out. But in old 401k, make sure it keeps working for you. A Fidelity Rollover IRA has no account fees or minimums to open. An easy to follow rollover process makes it simple to get started in under 15 minutes. Plus you'll have access to a rollover specialist.
- [00:19]
Matt
That's right, whether you've switched jobs or are just organizing your finances. Learn more@fidelity.com rollover consider all your options and the applicable fees and features of each before moving your retirement assets. Fidelity Brokerage Services, LLC Member NYSE SIPC Joel we've all got different tasks in life that we enjoy doing. For me, that would be closing out the books on our family's personal finances every month. Nerd. But then there are some chores that are more of a pain. And for me that would be grocery shopping, something I try and avoid if at all possible.
- [00:52]
Joel
Well, that's where Walmart steps in because their subscriptions have help you to stay stocked on the items you use most, whether that's milk and eggs or kitty litter and cleaning supplies. Find everything you need for your home at Walmart, in stores, online and in the app. Where do you see your career in 10 years? What are you doing now to help you get there? The sooner you start enhancing your skills, the sooner you'll be ready. That's why AARP has reskilling courses in a variety of categories like marketing and management to help your income live as long as you do.
- [01:22]
Matt
That's right. AARP has a bevy of free skill building courses for you to choose from because the steps that you choose to take today will help you to love what you do in the future. And that's why the younger you are, the more you need AARP. Learn more at aarp.org skills welcome to how to Money.
- [01:41]
Joel
I'm Joel.
- [01:41]
Matt
I'm Matt.
- [01:42]
Joel
And today we're talking Trustworthy Tax Advice with Jasmine dellucc.
- [02:05]
Matt
Yeah, so imagine a scenario where you purchase pretty much whatever you want at the grocery store, right? So you frequently go out to eat and then on top of that you always buy drinks for your friends like no questions asked anytime you go out. Like that's about what it would take to get food, spending up to around 15% of of your average household income. But if you ask me like that sounds insane. It's not how I shop at the grocery store at least. But it is how a lot of Americans think about their tax situation. They almost accept it as like this foregone conclusion on Average, most folks pay a little under 15%. They assume that's just the way it is. But we think there is a more strategic way to approach this inevitable expense. And here to talk about doing that well is Jasmine Deluci. She's a tax attorney, a cpa, and an enrolled agent. Jasmine has a wealth of knowledge around the US Tax code. She started posting online because she believes that tax law should be available to everyone. She even claims it's fun. These are all. These are all the things she puts out there before her videos over on YouTube in particular. But here to talk to us today to share her passion for tax law with us is Jasmine Deluci. Thank you so much for coming on the show.
- [03:15]
Jasmine Dellucci
Yeah, thank you, guys.
- [03:16]
Joel
Glad to have you, Jasmine. First question that we ask everyone who comes on, though, is what do you like to splurge on? Matt and I splurge on good craft beer, even though we're saving and investing all along the way, even while we get to enjoy our splurge here. What about you? What do you like to splurge on?
- [03:31]
Jasmine Dellucci
So, honestly, my default answer is literally tax classes, which is probably not what you're intending to go for, but my default is right now. I'm spending way too much money on NYU tax classes. Actually, literally like what I like to do in my free time.
- [03:48]
Matt
But wow, you look. Breathe in sleep taxes, Full disclosure. A little peek behind the curtain, Joel, before we hit record, ask Jasmine, do you consider yourself a nerd now?
- [03:59]
Joel
I wasn't trying to cast aspersions or anything. I was just asking.
- [04:02]
Matt
So I think here's your answer, Joel. So, okay, well, this is obviously a business expense. That's actually something we'll get to later on in the show. Jasmine. I think that falls under the category of continuing ed further education. Is that right? I don't know if that's mostly.
- [04:16]
Jasmine Dellucci
There are some details with some of the stuff that's for degree education, but yeah, I mean, generally I just love to spend on learning. And so, yeah, usually if it's learning and it's tax related, it's usually deductible.
- [04:26]
Matt
All right.
- [04:26]
Joel
Okay. All right. So is there anything else that Jasmine, that you do for fun besides learn more about taxes or deliver great tax advice?
- [04:36]
Jasmine Dellucci
There is. I was thinking about it. Cause I was like, oh, no, that one's just full business. I mean, literally what I do 24 7. It really is. It's like working out or working. But the thing that I've gotten really obsessed with lately is if you guys know Brian Johnson.
- [04:49]
Joel
Oh, yeah, yeah. The guy who never wants to die, right?
- [04:51]
Jasmine Dellucci
Yeah. So I've gotten into all of his stuff. I'm, like, drinking the olive oil, taking the supplements.
- [04:58]
Matt
Jasmine has paid for the protocol. I'm guessing we can talk about that later, after. We don't want to bore all of our listeners. We've actually kind of gone through this before on the show. That's fascinating. Yeah. To save Joel just the heartache as well.
- [05:13]
Joel
To stop my eyes from glazing over.
- [05:14]
Matt
He hears me talk to guests sometimes. There's one conversation we had with a guest one time that went on for, like, 10 minutes after we stopped rolling. Joel's just like, let's just kind of move on with life. Like, we're done talking about this.
- [05:24]
Joel
Matt's like a Andrew Huberman disciple.
- [05:26]
Matt
So, yeah, I'm more along the ATI Huberman path, as opposed to the Johnson.
- [05:31]
Jasmine Dellucci
Well, hey, if the goal is to live forever and practice tax law forever, then, you know, I gotta put that in one package.
- [05:38]
Matt
You are on the right path.
- [05:39]
Joel
I can't wait till you make those T shirts up.
- [05:40]
Matt
I'll wear. I'm guessing there's very little overlap when it comes to tax law and Brian Johnson. But let's talk about that, though, Jasmine, because you became an enrolled agent while you were still in high school, from what I understand. Yeah, I guess. Why did you do that? How did that come about? Share your history with us a little bit.
- [05:58]
Jasmine Dellucci
Yeah, I mean, really, like, the easiest answer is that my parents were both in tax, so it's something that I'd already been exposed to at a young age. And my dad was an enrolled agent, and he still is. And so, I don't know. I just always, like. I remember in eighth grade, I told my friends, I was like, guys, I'm going to be a tax attorney. And they were like, no, you're not. I was like, you know, so over the years, I just, you know, I think people made me question it, like, maybe I did decide this, like, too early. So I kept looking at other options, and nothing was as appealing to me as continuing on the tax law route. And so then with the enrolled agent exam, you don't need, like, there's really barely any requirements to be able to take it. You don't have to have a college degree. I don't think you have to have a high school. You don't have to have a high school degree. So I was like, well, let's. Let's get started.
- [06:44]
Joel
You go, yeah, Starting young and clearly, obviously something that you like that you enjoy. I'm curious too. You started talking about tax law and offering tax advice on social media. Talk to me about your thoughts on other advice, specifically in the tax realm that you find maybe on social media, on Instagram and on YouTube. I'm sure you've seen some really awful stuff out there. Seems like actually sometimes you talk smack. You throw shade at some of the. Some of the other creators who are offering advice that's less than stellar.
- [07:15]
Jasmine Dellucci
Yeah, yeah, there's a lot of bad tax advice. And that's really how I got started. I mean, I never thought that there would be this many people that want to watch my stuff. So it really wasn't the goal going in initially. It was really like I kept repeating a lot of the same advice to people. People like clients would come to me with the wrong stuff. And a lot of times, of course, where they hear it on social media. And so I was like, you know, I just look at it and be like, okay, this is wrong, this is wrong. And that's how I started. And so a lot of the advice, what I'm noticing is when people post in their realm, whatever it is, let's say their realm is like, honestly, I've seen like a hairdresser posting about hair. And then the minute that hairdresser posts about tax advice, it's like their highest.
- [08:00]
Joel
Viewed post and they're like, ooh, let me go start going in that direction.
- [08:05]
Jasmine Dellucci
Yeah, so that's what I think I keep seeing. And that's why I think a lot of times there's so much bad advice. Like I just saw the other day, there's one account that I don't follow, but I just. Of course the tax advice popped up on my feed. 20 million views for this one incorrect piece of advice. And of course, all the regular posts that they have are, you know, much lower. And so it's like, well, why wouldn't you just keep doing that?
- [08:28]
Matt
That's so fascinating. Like, I'm guessing one of the. I mean, obviously there's a lot of wrong advice and maybe that's a part of how they're garnering others clicks. But like, how, how difficult is it to create and to dispense good financial advice, especially on social media? Because I'm guessing like the, the time constraints that oftentimes that you're given on social media, this is more of a media question as opposed to a tax question, but the time constraints, given the fact that we're just constantly being fed new things to click on, speak to that challenge of creating content for social media.
- [08:59]
Jasmine Dellucci
I initially had that thought where I thought, well, people, you know, because I looked at the other examples of people posting in the tax space and honestly they're not, they're. I don't, they're not posting everything that's inaccurate, but they're doing that thing that you just mentioned where it's like they're kind of posting things that they know like, aren't really kosher but can get clicks. And so I thought maybe there just wasn't demand for that. But what I found is like, I don't know, it's not that hard. You just give accurate information. There's actually a huge population out there that just wants real information and sure, don't be extremely boring about it, you know. So I have done some more fun stuff, but I haven't found that that's fully required. I think to some extent there's just an audience that wants to feel like they can rely on the information.
- [09:44]
Joel
Is it hard to give accurate information given the fact that everyone has different tax situation? So one thing might work for one person, but the same person might not meet the same requirements. So giving that context, especially in a limited time frame, is that hard to pull off?
- [10:01]
Jasmine Dellucci
I think not anymore because I've kind of found what works for me. And so a really easy way for me to do it now is, is I, you know, of course part of it is the reaction, right? So I take what someone's already explained that's inaccurate. I very quickly say it's wrong. And then instead of having to give a full context or explanation, I usually just like, here's a court case that said no.
- [10:22]
Matt
And why I think that's why your stuff stands out too, is like you're not afraid to dive into the actual cases, which I think a lot of folks actually aren't doing. Joel, you mentioned context. Jasmine, what are some of the, like the lowest hanging pieces of tax saving fruit that's out there that a lot of DIY tax filers that they actually tend to miss?
- [10:42]
Jasmine Dellucci
It is actually very difficult as just being an employee. Like almost all of the tax deductions for employees were wiped out back in 2018 on the last tax reform. So one of the biggest changes then was things like home office and mileage and all these like expenses. A lot of times you do have literally just zeroed out and wiped out. So then it really comes down to things that probably people have heard about, but maybe they don't understand enough to execute. So it really does then go in the direction of, I mean Retirement accounts would be one option. Of course, a lot of people talk about the short term rental loophole. So we say loophole, but it's literally like built into statute directly. It wasn't inadvertent. So that's probably the biggest opportunity for someone that is an employee, but is maybe married to someone that's not working full time.
- [11:29]
Joel
Is that the Augusta rule that you're talking about right there?
- [11:31]
Jasmine Dellucci
No. Okay, so that Augusta rule would really be exclusive. Exclusive to business owners.
- [11:35]
Matt
Okay, tell us about that short term loophole then, because I'm not totally sure if that's something that we've talked about here on the show.
- [11:40]
Jasmine Dellucci
Basically you think of like Airbnb like it was basically in statute. It's a way to have a business that doesn't have as high of a threshold as long term rentals. So the. So actually if you kind of go back in history, right, so way back before a couple tax reforms, we have real estate. And it used to be just like this, the holy grail of tax savings. So it was basically you just buy long term rentals, maybe you're a doctor, lawyer, making a ton of money, and you just offset all of your income with regular long term rentals. And what ended up happening, of course, was then during the next tax reform, Congress is like, we don't like this, so we're just going to block it. And so then with long term rentals specifically, it's become, I don't want to say impossible, but I mean, it's really, it's just a very high threshold. Like you basically have to have one out of the two spouses as a full time real estate professional to be able to get that same tax benefit. That used to be much easier. So now when we look at, at the time when that, that tax reform was developed, Airbnb wasn't a thing. And so it used to be really more viewed as, as a full business if you had a short term rental. Now with it being so easy with Airbnb, we're able to use that same law that was already in place. And it just is not subject to that special really high threshold that we have in place for real estate. It's like carved out as an exception where we say, okay, we're not really going to view this as real estate, which is typically passive and not much work. We're actually going to view it like a regular business. And if we're viewing it like a regular business, well then the ability to get, we call it like non passive treatment, like active treatment, like I'M actively involved in it is much lower and it ends up being 100 hours and more than anyone else. And that's a threshold a lot of people can meet while being an employee.
- [13:33]
Joel
Okay. So there's better preferential tax treatment for running short term rentals than there is for running long term. Having long term rental properties.
- [13:41]
Jasmine Dellucci
Yeah, you can basically view short term rentals as like, it's just viewed like any regular business. Like if I start an accounting firm, how do we know if I actively participate in the accounting firm? Well, we say, do I spend 100 hours and more than anyone else or do I spend more than 500 hours in the year? So it's a much, much more reasonable threshold to meet versus we've kind of. Congress has basically blocked that for real estate that's not a short term rental.
- [14:07]
Joel
Okay, yeah, I've heard about the real estate professional designation. Matt and I are real estate investors. We don't qualify because, yeah, we don't work more real estate than we do at our, at our full time job. So. And I think that's where a lot of people land on that. I'm curious, let's talk about maybe like just some kind of general tax advice too, or. I've heard you talk about IRS transcripts. I did not know that this was a thing until I started digging into your content. What are IRS transcripts and how can they be helpful to folks who are filing taxes?
- [14:36]
Jasmine Dellucci
IRS transcripts are the best thing ever. I don't know why nobody talks about them, even through accountants. And I obviously speak with a lot of accountants and nobody's as excited about them as I am, but they are. Literally. It's a, it's a record that the IRS has on you and it's something that the IRS uses. Like we know that they actively use it in an automated process. And so obviously I deal with a lot of IRS problems. And so like I would say literally 90% of the problems in IRS notices I see are from matching your transcripts to the return. Like, the IRS will do that for you. And so it's so, so stupid not to have done it yourself. When you're filing ahead of time, you're.
- [15:19]
Joel
A tax professional, so you might be a bit biased, but how would you answer somebody if they said, I don't know, I have a pretty basic tax situation. Is going to the tax software, Is that going to be okay for me or do I really need to hire a pro?
- [15:34]
Jasmine Dellucci
So it really depends to some extent that person who's trying to hire someone, you need to think about what your skill sets are. So I really do think it's based on that person individually. If you're financially savvy, then I actually think, I mean, I've, I've seen professionals do a disservice a lot to clients in general, but especially even smaller, simpler situations because it, because it's so simple. I mean, you could literally plug it into software. So, yeah, actually I'm a huge proponent of that when it's simple. And then the minute it gets too complex, I would say that, yeah, once there's businesses, people tend to, they're just not looking out for the things that they need to be looking out for.
- [16:12]
Matt
What is your take on the. I guess it's only newish at this point, but the Direct File, the IRS direct File service, like, what are your thoughts on that for folks who are looking to, you know, they are looking to DIY it in comparison to some of the other DIY filing services, like TurboTax for instance.
- [16:30]
Jasmine Dellucci
Well, so I haven't used the Direct File. I've got to think it would be fine. So to me, I mean, I see them as all pretty interchangeable where you pull your transcripts. So I would always pull my transcripts. And then all of those software should pretty much get to the same resolution. Especially if you've got. Got W2s 1099 interest, you know, all of the basic tax documents. I don't see any problem with it.
- [16:52]
Joel
You said too that when people hire a pro, they're often too reliant on that professional to, you know, fill out the paperwork properly. How much tax research should we be doing as individuals and where should we turn for that research? Makes me think of, like when we're talking about rental properties, people reach in and say, I want to, I want to have a rental property, but I'm going to hire a property manager first thing. And my advice typically is that you should manage your own property for a couple years so that you know the questions to ask when you do eventually hire a property manager. Tell me how you think that should shake out when we're talking about hiring someone to help you with your taxes.
- [17:29]
Jasmine Dellucci
Yeah, I mean, I believe that people should understand what you know. You have to understand something before you delegate it. And to some extent, there are certain things in our life that are so complicated that it's not worth it. Like maybe, you know, if I'm going to hire an electrician, I probably feel like I should understand everything before hiring that person. But I believe that, like the finance tax realm, it's like, so critical to us that even if you're going to delegate it to someone awesome, you still want to have a pulse on what's going on. And especially if your stuff is simple, then it's like, really a good idea to understand it. So sometimes that can mean maybe you delegate it quickly, but you have a professional that's willing to explain or answer some of that stuff, so you learn. Or you could always handle it yourself if it's on the simpler side, and then delegate it out. But. But I mean, to me, the best place to go would be the resources I'm creating. So it'd be my, my YouTube channel. And then I also have a free tax, tax law community. So actualtaxlaw.com and then I've created like a full community with, like, resources. It's free. It's like people post questions. I do monthly workshops. So I've literally just tried to create as much accessible information as possible. And I think that's a good idea for anyone who wants to understand a bit of what's going on.
- [18:42]
Matt
Jasmine's a total pro. She's getting the plug in there before we get to the end of the episode. Of course, we'll make sure to link to all that in our show notes Jasmine, so folks can know exactly where to find you. But let's say, yes, you do have a small business. Okay. Your taxes are getting a bit more complex. And we've talked about on the show too, just even red flags that might go up that might cause someone to say, oh, this guy is like one of these ghost filers. He's totally going to say, I'm completely eligible for all of these deductions. And in reality, and a massive refund, I'm going to be left holding the bag. How should someone think about vetting a tax bro? I guess, like, are there specific questions that you should ask them?
- [19:20]
Jasmine Dellucci
Yeah, I mean, well, so first off, I believe in, like, you should just always assume you're going to be left holding the bag. Okay, Just to be clear, like, it's not even good. Bad ghost prep, whatever. I mean, not to say you can always sue an accountant. Right? But that's really what it would be because the IRS is, is going to always leave you holding the bag. And then it's whether you then can go back on your accountant, you know, which is a separate question. I mean, as far as vetting people, I would make sure they're licensed, which is not a given. Right. Because you have to be licensed to be a hairstylist. You do not have to be licensed to prepare tax returns. So I think that's like a bare minimum.
- [19:54]
Joel
That's crazy, by the way.
- [19:55]
Jasmine Dellucci
It is crazy. And it's just they tried to pass it, you know, way back and it was deemed unconstitutional. So it just needs to be done by Congress. The IRS just doesn't have control over it. And so bare minimum license. Right. A lot of people will come to me and they'll be like, my CPA did this. And I'm like, this CPA is not a cpa. And by the way, they didn't even put their name on your return. It was ghost preparation. Where it says self prepared ghost preparation, super not allowed, complete violation. That alone. I mean, just seeing that is like, do not hire that person. But then I always say, like a lot of times we have a good gut, you know. And so in general, what I think you're looking for is I would, I would just like get to know a couple people and I, to me, you're always looking for someone that cares. Which it's just we can say, well, how do we know if they care? But it's just, you can tell, you know, like, especially when you have multiple options. And I would go for the person that cares because not only of course do they care more about you as a client, but the person who cares to do a good job. Right. Because tax law just keeps changing. And I think that's what I've seen has made the worst professionals over the years is like someone can say they have 30 years of experience, but if they really weren't enjoying what they were doing and didn't really care the whole time, they tend to just not learn that much. And because there's too much to keep up with, we just have to look stuff up. And so if they don't really care, they're just less likely to do a good job.
- [21:20]
Joel
Find someone who likes taxes as much as Jasmine does. Right.
- [21:24]
Matt
Who's taking those classes?
- [21:25]
Joel
Right, Right. Well, I'm curious to hear your take about holistic tax planning. I think for a lot of individuals there seems to be a focus on paying the least amount of tax in the given tax year. Like, how can I maximize my refund? Even all the commercials, like in the tax prep software. It's all about maximizing your tax refund. Woo hoo. And then all the bells and whistles go off and people are super stoked because it's more cash in their account. How do you think about the desire that folks have to pay less tax now versus the ability to Kind of pay less tax in the future. And it just involves, right. Different choices along the way. And how do you coach your clients on that?
- [22:04]
Jasmine Dellucci
I mean, I'm always long term focused, you know, but of course, in general, people are very susceptible to short term gains. Right. So you think about even like, I don't know, the weight loss industry. It's like more exciting to click on, you know, six pack abs in 10 days than the alternative. But yeah, I mean, that's a really good point. With tax, it's, it's so easy for people to sell the short term thing. And there have been so many situations I've seen where that is adverse in general. Right. So it's like if you knew you were gonna pay $10,000 more for the next three years, but then have a tax free sale of your business for $10 million, like you would choose that all day long, like you would choose the $10 million savings. And so I've seen people make a lot of decisions like that. It's typically more in the business owner realm. Or you could speak to retirement accounts as well, the same way. But yeah, to me that's probably one of the biggest differentiators with us versus, I would say most of this like online market. When people do sell, it's just, it's that shortcut way to sell and say, I'm gonna save you a ton of money right this moment. But I always look at it like, if that were my business, what would I want? Well, to be honest, as a business owner especially, there are other considerations. And we want to reduce tax. We also want to reduce IRS exposure. We don't want to, if I can save $20,000 this year, but I might get tied up in a three year long audit with $100,000 bill, like it may not be worth it to that business owner. And so to me, the way I do it a lot of times is like presenting the risks and the benefits both short and long term. And usually business owners have different risk profiles on what they want to do.
- [23:42]
Matt
Okay, well, just a second ago you did say retirement accounts. So on the note of a traditional or Roth, do you have a preference like do you lean towards one over the other, or does it truly come down to the individual and their personal circumstances?
- [23:57]
Jasmine Dellucci
I mean, my personal preference is always going to be Roth, but that's because of assumptions I make for myself. For example, whereas there are some people that traditional can work for. But it really, it comes down to, I mean, for Roth, right. For me, like, I don't even believe in Retirement. Right. So in theory, if I'm going to keep working until I die, which is hopefully 300 years from now, then I would want to do a Roth because I'm going to be making more over time. So it always comes down to your assumptions of where you're going to be later.
- [24:29]
Matt
Yeah. Okay, so then would the traditional apply more to somebody who has maybe a more earthly understanding of their mortality?
- [24:37]
Jasmine Dellucci
Not just that. I think traditional is for someone that probably does not only expects to retire, but then expects to really not make as much. Right. I don't think those are the same thing because in theory, if you're in, if you're investing, you're building assets, you're building value, you very well may be in a higher, you really should be in a higher tax bracket later. And then we're also betting on what's Congress going to do, are they going to increase tax rates? Which is usually our assumption is probably it's going to go up, not down. So you'd really have to just know that when you retire, you're going to be making a lot less than whatever you're currently doing today. And even then you're still giving up control over your money, which is not my favorite thing. And of course I see the back end of it, which is when we prep returns, I see the number of people that need access to their money and just take the penalty. And it's just really the worst case scenario. They take the money, they need it, they have the penalty, and then of course you get taxed in that year. So it throws up their tax bracket for all these other years when they had lower tax brackets, and then the year they withdraw it all in one, it's a huge high tax bracket. So it's really worst case scenario. And you know, so really evaluating whether losing that control of your money is also worth it.
- [25:51]
Matt
Okay, quick final little follow up here. What kind of situations do you see folks in where they are saying, hey, actually like we do need to tap that traditional retirement account where they are kind of getting that triple whammy in effect.
- [26:04]
Jasmine Dellucci
It just varies. I mean, I would say the most common probably is related to business or investment. People make some type of decision that they want to, they need to invest in, in their business, they want to start a business. It's usually they think, oh, I'm going to make more, you know, but you take such a hit. So that's one.
- [26:19]
Joel
Or, or medical, they need a lump sum and they take it from the wrong place. Not thinking about the tax consequences.
- [26:24]
Jasmine Dellucci
Yeah, I mean, a lot of them are aware of the tax consequences.
- [26:27]
Matt
It's just to them, it's just going to be worth it.
- [26:29]
Jasmine Dellucci
Yeah.
- [26:30]
Joel
All right. We've got more to get to with you, Jasmine. We're going to talk about trying to avoid IRS tax audits. We're also going to talk about filing an extension. Why? That might be a good idea for a whole lot of tax. We'll get to that and more with Jasmine Dellucci right after this. Let's talk retirement for a second. To me, it feels like it's getting harder for people to reach their goals for the future. We hear about inflation, rate hikes, the changing market. Are we even saving enough? And things keep changing. Right. And here is where Fidelity comes in. Whether you're saving for retirement or close to living in it, Fidelity can help you get where you want to go, no matter your path or what happens along the way.
- [27:12]
Matt
Yeah, but how? Well, they'll help you to create a free, personalized plan that adapts as your priorities change. They'll also show you what's called timely insights. These are small tips on ways to save and invest to help meet your goals. And you can monitor your plans so you can stay on target. The future is coming and so is retirement. Get ready to take it on@fidelity.com TakeOn.
- [27:35]
Joel
Expenses charged by your investments and other costs and fees associated with trading or transacting in your account. Apply Fidelity Brokerage Services member NYSE sipc.
- [27:47]
Matt
We are back from the break, talking with Jasmine Deluci. And Jasmine, I am kind of curious if you just rolled your eyes when we reached out to you about talking about tax stuff. So this is going to publish?
- [27:58]
Joel
Not too much the kind of person who rolls her eyes.
- [28:01]
Matt
I mean, is there anything that folks can do by the time this episode comes out? Like, are there any actual helpful tax maneuvers that folks can make now or is it just too late?
- [28:09]
Jasmine Dellucci
I mean, it's definitely limited. So I would say things like, I mean, retirement accounts, always an option. That's going to be the main one, especially for employees. Otherwise, most things economically need to happen in the year.
- [28:23]
Joel
Okay. And so we're starting to think about tax planning for your 2025 taxes, not 2024 taxes necessarily at this point in the year?
- [28:32]
Jasmine Dellucci
Pretty much, yeah.
- [28:33]
Joel
Okay, what's your take on on tax refunds? Because some people say that's an interest free loan to the government. Why would you do that? Other people say, man, it's like this deferred method of savings. It helps me jumpstart other financial goals. Because I don't know, it's kind of surprise money coming out of nowhere. I'm not really thinking about it most of the time. How do you help your clients think about tax refunds and whether they're beneficial or not?
- [28:57]
Jasmine Dellucci
Well, so most of my clients are business owners, so they're usually paying in. They're not usually getting much of a refund. And so, I mean, in general, for them to have gotten a refund, we would have had to tell them to pay too much because they're going to ask us, like, how much to pay in. So we don't. We don't do that. We tell them to pay in what they're required to pay in. I do always ask for their preference, but most people that are a business owner answer that they want to pay in the least possible to avoid penalties. They don't usually answer that I want to pay in extra. It's usually more on the employee side where the withholdings is automatic through your W2. So they might want to withhold just a little bit extra for that peace.
- [29:40]
Matt
Of mind for those employees. Do you ever see scenarios where someone actually does owe the IRS a whole lot of money? They've got a bill. I don't know if that's an accurate way to think about it. You've got a bill that's due to the irs, but are there options for some of those folks out there who might have a large sum that they don't have the cash on hand to take care of?
- [29:58]
Jasmine Dellucci
Yes. Yeah. So you can do a payment plan with the irs. So it's all. It's always due in April. Right. So that's when your tax is due. It doesn't feel like that because people extend, but that's an extension to file, not to pay. And so. But yeah, if you want to either, there's a couple options. Sometimes people will just wait to file until October knowing that they already owe the money, but they don't have it. So you can wait until the IRS knows that you have the money and then just pay it with your return. At that point, it's just going to come with penalties and interest. Alternatively, you can set up a payment plan. It takes a little bit of work to set up. The irs, you know, doesn't make anything too easy. But. But if you set that up, it's actually at a little bit less of a. As far as the penalties that are basically accruing for late payment.
- [30:45]
Joel
You seem to be a proponent of people filing extensions. And like you just said, you still have to pay your expected tax bill by April 15, even if you're filing the extension. But why do you like for people to have that extra time? And why do you encourage people to go with the extension?
- [31:04]
Jasmine Dellucci
Yeah, so, I mean, the main reason is to be able to check your IRS transcripts. So if you don't extend, your transcripts are just not going to be fully populated. But if you do extend, you'll have a chance to check your transcripts. So to me, I would say the ideal scenario is you get everything together in the beginning of the year. You can even have your return prepped in the beginning of the year so you know exactly what you owe, go ahead and pay it in if you owe, and then extend, check your transcripts and then file.
- [31:31]
Joel
And that's essentially to make sure you're not filing and not including information that the IRS has. So you can. So you can. It's like double checking your work.
- [31:40]
Jasmine Dellucci
Yeah, exactly.
- [31:42]
Matt
Very nice. Okay, let's talk about getting in trouble with the irs. Should normal folks out there, should they be worried about getting audited by the irs? Like, you talked about this three year tax battle, maybe like a hundred thousand dollars bill that comes due to attorneys that you might have to strike.
- [31:56]
Joel
Fire into my heart, like, how do.
- [31:58]
Matt
You ensure that this is something that you can avoid?
- [32:00]
Jasmine Dellucci
I mean, you can never guarantee that you won't get audited, but make it less likely. Yeah, I mean, as far as less likely, I mean, I would say the biggest audit trigger that I see all the time is reporting a huge loss on a schedule C that is like basically just like, just ask, just like beg for an audit if you want one. Just like slap. Especially if you want to put no income in the gross receipts line and then just put like negative 50,000. I mean, your, your return will be pulled so fast.
- [32:29]
Matt
Joel does it all the time, though.
- [32:31]
Joel
But then I just moved to South America and it's all fine.
- [32:33]
Matt
I guess he's just gotten lucky.
- [32:34]
Jasmine Dellucci
Yeah, I'm sure there are some people that don't get audited, but man, that is. It's tracked so closely because the number of things that it affects. Right. So for example, I was involved in a case where it wasn't the audit of the individual. This one was actually because they track preparers as well. And so they tracked this preparer a lot of times. The reason they do a schedule C that's a loss or that is really like, looks like a fake business is it generates the earned income credit. So for this preparer, he basically the ratio of the Number of people that had schedule C losses and earned income credits was so high that they knew it was probably fake. And it. And let's be honest, it was. And so they, they audited him actually in this case, but.
- [33:17]
Matt
Oh, interesting.
- [33:18]
Jasmine Dellucci
But that's the number one thing I see. And so if you're going to have a loss, make it a, make it an S corp, probably it would be one option.
- [33:25]
Joel
So what is actually involved in an audit? As someone who thankfully has not been audited, and we're hoping that trend continues for our business too. What, what is involved in that and how painful is it?
- [33:37]
Jasmine Dellucci
It's pretty painful. Like anything with the irs, it's inconsistent. So I'm sure there are, I mean, there are some audits where I'm like, surprisingly like, wow, this one wasn't bad. But that's more the exception in general. It's. It's just such an administratively terrible process. So it's like best case scenario, a lot of the times is literally just you wasting just like a catastrophic amount of time doing just receipt dumping. You're just going back and forth giving a ton of documents. Sometimes the auditors just ignore the documents. Sometimes they just like it's not in a format that they like and so they ignore them again. And so if you don't like that result, then we just taking it further just takes a lot of time. So we go to appeals, we go to IRS counsel, and a lot of times I'm taking some of the stupidest arguments to appeals and IRS counsel because the lower level auditor just, I don't want to, like, they're not bad people, but it's just like, you know, they got the checklist and it's not on there.
- [34:37]
Matt
Yeah, just making your life hard. So let's talk about businesses. Because business owners, obviously, they have the ability to deduct certain expenses that normal folks can't. Sounds like this is more your specialty, Jasmine, but talk to us about that. Different treatment. Like, what are some of the common deductions that business owners are eligible for? Maybe some deductions that they're leaving on the table that, yeah, they really could claw back some of those tax dollars.
- [34:59]
Jasmine Dellucci
I mean, so as far as deductions, so I know the way a lot of people paint it is like they'll say, oh, there's like these, you know, number of pages in the tax code or number of deductions. Like, it's really not like that. There's no like limit, limited number. So business owner, we've got the oversighted statute that Everyone likes to point to, right. 162A ordinary necessary business expenses. So that's. I mean, that's literally the rule. So there's not like a limited number of deductions. It really comes down to what you need for your business is probably a deduction. And then because certain areas are subject to abuse, we do have certain limitations on a lot of those personal items. And so that's where a lot of my content ends up being focused around, because everyone that posts just quotes the statute and ignores all of the rest of the law. But there's not really a limit. It really is. I mean, that's why when you think of things like cell phone, it's not like there's some special cell phone statute that tells us that your cell phone's deductible. It's just the fact that if you can prove your business use of it, then you can deduct it.
- [36:01]
Joel
So what are the biggest misconceptions then, about deductions? And how do people tend to screw that up?
- [36:07]
Jasmine Dellucci
I mean, the biggest one that I see is people reading the statute saying ordinary and necessary. And then they're like, oh, well, I think, you know, insert here is ordinary and necessary. You know, I think I needed to go. I'm trying to think of, like, the most ridiculous. I needed to go to the gym to be really fit. So I see, like, things like that, right? Which kind of makes sense logically if you're like a personal trainer. And so you start using your brain, which is not how tax law works. So I see a lot of that. There's like, a lot of, like, you know, but this person's on only fans, so they get to deduct all their cosmetic procedures. And so, you know, we just. We have law in place. We have court cases in place that. That tell us the answer. And a lot of those personal items.
- [36:47]
Matt
What's tricky, though, is that, like, there are certain things that we like, certain expenses we incur as individuals that are ordinary and necessary to, like, human living. So, for instance, like meals, right? It's like, no matter what, to survive, like, you probably have to eat lunch. And so I've seen it discussed where if it's beyond what's ordinary and necessary, like, so, for instance, when it comes to a meal, it's like, okay, would you have already purchased that? Well, yeah, sure. To just not be hungry in order to be healthy. But if it's something that's, like, special. So, for instance, if it's a fancy lunch where you're gonna take a Client out. Like, I've seen you even cite a certain court case where it's like, well, you're not gonna be expected to go there with your mom's peanut butter and. Or not your mom, but like, the peanut butter and jelly sandwich that he made. I immediately reverted back to high school days. But, like, it's expected that you would partake in that lunch as well, to not be weird. So, like, it's an interesting dynamic how on one hand, if it's ordinary and necessary to the operation of the business, it's. It's like, yes, you're allowed to deduct that, but basically it needs to be above ordinary and necessary on, like a personal standpoint in order for it to even be considered. Is that maybe a helpful way to think about it?
- [37:59]
Jasmine Dellucci
Yeah. So the way the tax court sees it is they see two statutes that are conflicting. So we've got 162A ordinary necessary business expenses, and then we have 262A, which is that personal family living expenses are not deductible. So that's the way they approach it in all their cases where they say, well, there's these two conflicting statutes and they've had to just draw a line depending on the type of expense. Say, you know, at some point this is just. And that's that term, right? Inherently personal. At some point, this is so inherently personal that we're just not. Even if you show that, like you talked about business at lunch, it's like you were going to eat. And so usually with those types of things, it just comes down to abuse. Honestly, it's like, why do they do this? I think to some extent it's just to prevent abuse. And so with things like food, it just don't. It. It's like, you know, it's the. What's the phrase? Like, pigs get fed, hogs get slaughtered. It's kind of like that.
- [38:56]
Joel
So you want to, like the abuse of those deductions. Is that more likely to trigger an audit? If you are getting a little too greedy with some of the things you're claiming?
- [39:06]
Jasmine Dellucci
I wouldn't say necessarily to trigger it, but once you're in the audit, to lose. Yeah.
- [39:10]
Joel
Okay, gotcha. Something else you made a video about recently. You talked about family, business, travel. And that's something else where people can get caught up on the wrong side of kind of the whole deduction thing. How can people know if, like, a family trip, a vacation is deductible or not? And like, what if you're mixing business and personal? How do People think through that.
- [39:32]
Jasmine Dellucci
You know, my answer is always like what does the tax law say? You know, especially for something like travel, it's not so much. I think when we default to like our gut reaction like oh, I think this is really business related. It's just not, it's just off base, you know. And in something like travel, IRC 274 is so extensive. It is because travel is such a high abuse area. You know, Congress is aware of that. So they literally created extreme amounts of statute for so many different situations. So, so when it comes to travel, it would literally be like what are the requirements? And that's why in that video specifically I did, that's one narrow area of 274. Like 274. I'm about to do more videos because there's, there's so much. It's like depending on the situation, if it's international conference, that's under literally has a separate statute than if it's a domestic conference. So every area is different. But for bringing your family on family Trips, we've got 274M3. So we've got a specific statute that literally tells us it's a three part test. We have three requirements. Have to be an employee of your business, not a board of director, tenanting and contractor, but have to be an employee. They have to do bonafide business work. Right. So that of course again the danger is always like you interpret it yourself. So you go oh yeah, like it was super necessary for them to be like there. You know, they were chit chatting with my colleagues. But what we know from court cases is that's not considered bonafide business. And so then that more substantive work really for the business and then it goes to if it would, if it would have otherwise been deductible had you not been there. But I guess if you're, if you're trying to go like not tax law and just how you said like how to think about it. I mean would you do it for not your family?
- [41:19]
Joel
That's probably a good threshold.
- [41:20]
Matt
Yeah. A good filter to kind of run it through. All right, Jasmine, we are. We've got some more topics to get to like passing wealth along to your kids, the tax treatment of those assets. We'll get to that and more right after this. We've all got some old things laying around. But listen, if one of those things is an old 401k, well it is time to take care of it. Whether you've recently left a job or you're just making Time to get your finances in order. Fidelity can help you explore options for your old 401k. A fidelity rollover IRA has no account fees or minimums. Plus you can choose from a wide selection of investments.
- [42:02]
Joel
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- [42:23]
Matt
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- [42:41]
Joel
All right, we're back. We're still talking with Jasmine Deluci talking about taxes. Jasmine, one, one question I have for you is like, there's so many commercials out there, especially this time of year, claiming that these companies can help you navigate IRS issues. And man, I feel like even on your channel you've talked to people who have hired the wrong person to help them interface with the irs, and it's just led to a lot of pain, a lot of wasted money. How do you help people think through those claims that like, hey, just pay us a bunch and we'll solve your IRS tax problem?
- [43:18]
Jasmine Dellucci
Yeah, it's the number one. I mean, that's a huge scam industry. I would be very careful of anybody claiming that they're definitely going to reduce your burden. I mean, the thing about it is, I know a lot of times people use like the fear of the irs, right? And I do think there are concerns about the fact that the IRS is difficult to work with, administratively frustrating to work with, but they're not typically malicious. And so things like trying to get rid of your tax debt to some extent you qualify or you don't. And really the person you want on your team is someone that's again, going back to like, caring, right? Someone that cares to actually help you and is going to, gonna be with you to get through what is a very administratively difficult process. And a lot of times it really, those, those companies, you know, they take all their money up front, so why would they still care, you know, six months later? Because that process is gonna take, I mean, typically a year, at least a year.
- [44:15]
Matt
How, how much of your business or how Much of your time do you spend defending clients or working on these. On these audits?
- [44:22]
Jasmine Dellucci
I spend a good amount of time. To me, I view it as I want to stay up to date on everything the IRS is doing, and it's so inconsistent that I have to have a lot of data entry points to see exactly what's going on. So I do. It is one of my favorite things to spend time on.
- [44:38]
Matt
Okay.
- [44:39]
Jasmine Dellucci
Yeah. So the ones that I spend time on are usually. I like to spend time on the ones that it's a dispute. So it's a lot of times, like, the tax is at dispute. So an IRS audit would be an example. Or it's an IRS notice. That's incorrect. Right. So we're trying to remove a couple hundred thousand dollars in tax, for example. I don't spend so much time. My partner actually does. My dad. He spends time on the ones where you owe the irs, but you can't afford to pay them.
- [45:04]
Matt
Got it, man. Okay. So Jasmine loves it. She's a glutton for punishment. That's what she's saying. Going back. So you kind of touched on this a second ago, how you expect taxes essentially to go up in the future. It's part of why you're a fan of the Roth is that because of the fact that you're just looking at the numbers and you're like, these numbers don't compute. And so therefore, you're like, all right, taxes have to go up.
- [45:25]
Jasmine Dellucci
Well, I mean, historically, tax rates have been higher, and it's usually easier to pass tax increases than tax decreases, it seems like. So that's more of just a guess.
- [45:35]
Joel
Yeah. And. Well, I guess even right now, we're kind of at a point where we're going to have some sort of new tax law no matter what. Right. Either the Tax Cuts and Job act will be extended or it'll sunset. And maybe it's not extended. Maybe there's some new formulation. Like, how do you think about the uncertainty around tax law right now?
- [45:55]
Jasmine Dellucci
I don't know if I think about it too much. For me, I know that tax law is just going to keep changing. It's like, just the way people seem to be wired. There's always special interests. It's such a political topic that I just make the assumption, like, every five years or four years now at this point, there's going to be a lot of new stuff for me to learn. And so that's really the way I approach it. Just, like, very logically. I'm like, if I just stay up to date, then I can always maximize what we've got.
- [46:21]
Matt
Yeah, that makes sense. It's honestly probably a good way to think about it.
- [46:24]
Joel
It's like a moving target for sure.
- [46:25]
Matt
Yeah. Well just, that's just the formation it takes. And yeah it's constantly, it's ever evolving, which is oftentimes why like there's not a whole lot of times that we say to considering hiring a professional, but specifically with it when it comes to tax law, it is constantly changing. There are so many nuances. I don't know how many numbers and letters that you've stated so far during this conversation but like it's so much to keep up with and it pertains to how much it is that you're going to end up paying in taxes.
- [46:50]
Joel
A lot of money at stake to on your business.
- [46:52]
Matt
But for, for folks out there who are looking further ahead off into the future, generational wealth is what we're talking about here. Like what's the best way you think to pass on wealth alone to future generations? Because obviously, I mean we've talked about before retirement accounts, they don't have that step up basis. How can folks have that to where their kids, folks who are inheriting that money pay the least amount in taxes possible.
- [47:14]
Jasmine Dellucci
It's the best option, is always real estate. And so real estate has such a strong lobby. We've got such favorable tax laws for real estate and I think that'll just continue no matter whenever I see tax reform. Like the real estate lobby is just so strong they find a way to weasel into even things that weren't intended for them at all. And so with, with real estate, I mean the classic thing is you obviously purchase real estate, we know it goes up in value but the tax law actually gives us credit as if it goes down in value, which is a great payoff. And then as long as you just don't sell it, let your kids inherit it, you get the step up in basis and you can just keep playing that game, you know, forever.
- [47:55]
Joel
Brilliant. Love it. Jasmine, thank you so much for taking the time to join us on how to Money today. Where can our listeners find out more about you and the content you're creating?
- [48:03]
Jasmine Dellucci
Yeah, either at my YouTube so axleverage or I also have actualtaxlaw.com I created totally Free Community. There's no, I'm not like upselling people or it's not some like, I mean a lot of times people create free stuff that's not really helpful. But this is really just me trying to provide free value For a lot of people that I feel like a lot of times are hiring the wrong help or not hiring help or are just like often left in a worse position than they should be.
- [48:28]
Matt
Very cool. We'll link to all that. Jasmine, thank you so much for talking with us today.
- [48:32]
Jasmine Dellucci
Of course. Thank you, guys.
- [48:34]
Joel
All right, Matt, that was a, that was a great conversation. I feel like Jasmine is smarter than I could ever hope to be.
- [48:40]
Matt
I think you have to be when it comes. Well, everyone has got to be scared of Joel. No.
- [48:46]
Joel
Like, it's not a hard, I guess, hurdle to jump over.
- [48:48]
Matt
No, you've got to be pretty buttoned up, especially when it comes to the details. Especially when it comes to some of the, like the business law or the business tax sort of sector of. When it comes to tax planning. What was your. You have a big takeaway?
- [49:01]
Joel
I was going to say that intersection of passion and. Oh yeah, like, yeah, she's really got it.
- [49:06]
Matt
I don't think I've ever talked to anybody who is as excited about tax law.
- [49:10]
Joel
No.
- [49:10]
Matt
As Jasmine.
- [49:11]
Joel
Me neither.
- [49:12]
Matt
The fact that she's. Yeah, she's like, I'm either working or working out. So actually I'm glad you pushed her on. Come on, like, what's something that you, the others are going to say that this is a dumb issue of your money, not just furthering education.
- [49:25]
Joel
I think, like, I don't know, I love what we do and there are elements that I would be doing of this job whether or not I got paid. Like, I'm just fascinated by personal finance. So. I get that. I get that. Although I don't know if I'm as into it as she is into taxes, but. Okay. So I think my big takeaway from this conversation happened right there at the end where she's talking about the benefits of real estate when trying to transfer generational wealth. And you and I, we talk about real estate. We've actually become less keen on pushing people towards investing in rental real estate in recent years given that it's just more difficult financially to pull off. But I think that's actually a really good point to, to highlight here is that if one of your key financial goals is to leave an inheritance for the next generation, the best way to do it from a tax standpoint is, is to invest in rental real estate. So if, if that goal of investing in real estate is a super long term thing, if you're like, I'm going to own this thing until I die and I want my kids to inherit it, I think then it's Beneficial from multiple standpoints. You're minimizing the transaction costs, obviously, of buying real estate. You get to see the appreciation, you get to get the cash flow, and then you get to pass that asset onto your children where that value gets reset. Exactly. Which is pretty great. One of the coolest things about real estate, and every time it's so funny, I was thinking about a property that I own that I'm having to clean it up and find a new tenant, and it just is kind of a pain. It's like my least favorite time when I have to turn over that property because it just requires more effort. And I was like, you know what? My kids will be thankful that I held onto it someday. I could sell it right now and pay the tax. But hey, this is a long term investment. And just because this is a pain today doesn't mean it's not going to hopefully payoff in spades tomorrow.
- [51:05]
Matt
Heck yeah, man.
- [51:06]
Joel
Don't. By tomorrow I mean, like decades.
- [51:07]
Matt
Yeah, yeah, Don't. Don't hit that easy button. That's what I was going to say. When it comes to thinking about that my big takeaway is going to be when she was talking about the risk associated with taking different deductions. And I think this applies to whether you are an individual or a business. And essentially what I heard her say was that just because you can take a certain deduction doesn't mean you should. And I think when, like, it immediately made me think about investing for your future. And just because you can invest all of your money in crypto doesn't mean you should do that. And in fact, that there's, I would say, a higher likelihood of there being a worse outcome were you to do that. So I don't know. I just like that overall takeaway. Just because you can, that doesn't necessarily mean that you should.
- [51:48]
Joel
Yeah, but yeah, I mean, I guess if you, if you put it all in crypto or if you had five years ago, people would say, matt, that I would have crushed. Yeah, but there's still. There's still so much more risk.
- [51:59]
Matt
I think there's a lot more folks who have lost a tremendous amount of money, though, kind of messing around with something specifically like crypto, but.
- [52:05]
Jasmine Dellucci
All right.
- [52:06]
Matt
Our beer that you and I enjoyed during this episode was a seaquench ale, which I think we're supposed to read as sequential.
- [52:14]
Joel
Oh, okay.
- [52:15]
Matt
You think so? Oh, maybe like, I'm trying to talk back to the numbers a little bit. This is a beer by Dogfish Head. What are your thoughts here?
- [52:21]
Joel
All Right. So this was, I thought light, refreshing. It was briny, had some lime action going on.
- [52:26]
Matt
It had some salt for sure. Man.
- [52:28]
Joel
It was almost like the beer equivalent of a low key margarita and so.
- [52:32]
Matt
But, but even less boozy. Yeah, like it was more like lemon, lime. Lemon lime. Gatorade.
- [52:37]
Joel
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [52:38]
Matt
Because of the salt. Because like that's what Gatorade and Powerade, that's what those drinks have going on. Right?
- [52:43]
Joel
Yeah.
- [52:43]
Matt
You're a runner now. Like you're, you're hammering some of those sports drinks. Like that's what you got to have some sodiums in there.
- [52:48]
Joel
That's right.
- [52:49]
Matt
That's what they got going on.
- [52:50]
Joel
This had the electrolytes. It brought it.
- [52:51]
Matt
Yeah.
- [52:52]
Joel
And this was, I thought this was really tasty.
- [52:54]
Matt
And you're run a race and they had this over on the side. Would you go for some of that?
- [52:57]
Joel
Oh, for sure.
- [52:58]
Matt
Probably would.
- [52:58]
Joel
Yeah. Unless I was like going for a PR or something like that, but. Because I doubt a beer is going to help me in my quest. But this one, this one is tasty and I like that it's just kind of light and refreshing. It's not over the top. And I'm always a fan of kind of salty, briny beers. I think of like Westbrook's Goza, that being like the classic super duper briny, briny beer. And this, this was like a much lighter version of that. But now it makes you want to go.
- [53:20]
Matt
This is even better.
- [53:20]
Joel
Harder in that direction.
- [53:21]
Matt
And this is even better for something like the beach though. Like you're sitting there like, like, just so you know folks, we love the big heavy craft beers, but that is not the kind of style you want when you're sitting there under a hundred degree sun out here on the beach.
- [53:33]
Joel
True story.
- [53:34]
Matt
All right, that's gonna be it for our episode talking about tax today with Jasmine Dellucci. We'll again make sure to link to some of the things that she mentioned up on the website@howtomoney.com buddy, that's gonna be it for this one. Until next time, best friends out best. Asking the right questions can greatly impact your future, especially when it comes to your finances.
- [54:10]
Joel
So if you're looking for a financial advisor you can trust, certified financial planner professionals are committed to acting in your best interest. That's why it's gotta be a CFP. Find your CFP professional@letsmakeaplan.org Joel, we've all.
- [54:26]
Matt
Got different tasks in life that we enjoy doing. For me, that would be closing out the books on our family's personal finances every month. Nerd. But then there are some chores that are more of a pain, and for me, that would be grocery shopping, something I try and avoid if at all possible.
- [54:41]
Joel
Well, that's where Walmart steps in, because their subscriptions help you to stay stocked on the items you use most, whether that's milk and eggs or kitty litter and cleaning supplies. Find everything you need for your home at Walmart, in stores, online and in.
- [54:55]
Matt
The appeni con la ultima moda piesas comodas y lijeras. Mes clay combina lo nuevo de tus marcas favoritas y cre a luxori ginales quese acuesto como las polos de San Jones Bay con un pantalone en el godon, un simple sweatery jeans de hay and a cuentral bolso de lis claiborne que siam pras querido ys andalias que convenen paranochas mascalidas, elije piyamas lijeras y frescas de ambres to familia ides Cuban lo Nuevo de Primavera JCPenney Valela Pena.