← How We Made Your Mother
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- [00:01]
Commercial Narrator
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- [01:01]
Josh Radner
Josh and Craig here. We are taking a week off for Thanksgiving, but we're not going to leave you without an episode to listen to. We are going to replay our Thanksgiving episode from season one, which is called Belly Full of Turkey. Great episode. Both the episode of How I Met yout Mother and we enjoyed talking about the episode. What else? Do you have anything to add, Greg?
- [01:23]
Craig Thomas
It's a rerun of a rerun of a rerun. It's a tur. Turkey.
- [01:26]
Josh Radner
It's a tur. Tur. Turkey.
- [01:27]
Craig Thomas
Turkey.
- [01:27]
Josh Radner
Key.
- [01:28]
Craig Thomas
I'm not.
- [01:29]
Josh Radner
I get right.
- [01:29]
Craig Thomas
But yes, please enjoy. This was a great one. This is one of our favorites. Happy Thanksgiving, everybody. And here's a rerun.
- [01:37]
Rishi
Hi Josh and Craig. I'm Rishi from India and How I Met yout Mother was the first English TV series I ever watched before I knew what a sitcom was. And to me it's never been a sitcom. To me it's been a beautifully written slow burn drama by very organic bits of endearing if slightly dorky comedy. And I adore the development of the slightly flawed characters and especially the way the show plays with time. I absolutely love that. And it's a. It's a just masterful filmmaking. It just lets every emotion soak in unapologetically. And in a way, the creators of the show are the hopeless romantics of filmmaking. So here's how I met your mother. Timidly bold, subtly adventurous and slow burn drama with the side of comedy. That's what it is to me.
- [02:27]
Josh Radner
I'm alone. What a pity I will be soon in New York City When I see you. Please permit me to tell you everything in New York City. Hey everyone, I'm Josh Radner. I am joined by my friend Chris Craig Thomas.
- [02:51]
Craig Thomas
Hello, Craig. Hello, my friend.
- [02:54]
Josh Radner
This is how we made your mother. We are talking about the TV series how we how we How I met your mother, which Craig co created with Carter bay, ran from 2005 to 2014. I played Ted Mosby in every single episode of that show. 20 years after it premiered, 11 years after it went off the air. We are watching the whole thing with you spilling the secrets, backstage drama, gossip. It's not that scandalous, but we are spilling trade secrets about how we made this show, what it was like to make this show, what. What is striking us about the rewatch and what we're mostly interrogating. At the heart of this is why this show is so beloved and enduring and why it seems to meet people wherever they're at. And we're as delighted and mystified by that as you are. But we're really happy you're here.
- [03:44]
Craig Thomas
Amen. Well said, man. Now I feel like I have to say something smart. We had a smart intro, then you said something smart. Here's all I have. Here's all I have. Alec loves our producer. He's here too. That's all I got.
- [03:54]
Josh Radner
Hi, Alec. So today we're Talking about episode nine, Belly Full of Turkey. Originally aired when?
- [04:01]
Emily Blumberg
Originally on November 21, 2005. Written by Phil Lord and Chris Miller.
- [04:07]
Craig Thomas
The great Lord and Miller. The great and Oscar winning Lord Miller. They won an Oscar for this episode.
- [04:14]
Josh Radner
Of TV for this episode.
- [04:15]
Craig Thomas
It's the only TV episode that's ever gotten an Oscar.
- [04:17]
Josh Radner
They thought it was so incredible.
- [04:18]
Craig Thomas
So congrats to them for that. This is a great one. It's our first Thanksgiving episode. Those guys are the best. They wrote on season one of Himyim and then went on to many great things including really winning Oscar for the Spider Verse movie. And Cloudy Witchen's Meatballs is the movie that took them away from us and onto greater and incredible heights. The Lego movies, they're geniuses. We got two episodes of their geniuses in season one, sweet taste of Liberty and this one, Belly full of Turkey. So we're excited to talk about it.
- [04:47]
Josh Radner
And we did talk about this around the slutty pumpkin. But it was always funny to be on set and you would be filming the Halloween episode six weeks before Halloween, the Thanksgiving episode six weeks before Thanksgiving. So it was like you were celebrating on set because in this fictional context, you were really celebrating Halloween and Thanksgiving. But it was so out of step with the rest of the world and country. It was always A little disorienting.
- [05:12]
Craig Thomas
Yeah. It sort of weirdly fit in Los Angeles, though, pretending in a place that had no seasons. So it was like, all right, we'll do it whenever.
- [05:18]
Josh Radner
It didn't matter anyway.
- [05:19]
Craig Thomas
It didn't really matter. It sort of, like, worked out, and I liked it because it made the holiday last. I always felt that way. I always felt like, oh, Christmas is right around the corner. It would be like, October, we're shooting Thanksgiving episode. But it just felt very festive. I actually loved that about it. I loved the early holidays we got to have.
- [05:34]
Josh Radner
So let's just. For the folks at home who are. Who are maybe not rewatching with us, but who have seen it or don't remember it as well, like, let's just run through, like, what happens in this episode.
- [05:45]
Craig Thomas
Yeah, yeah. So the two main storylines in this episode, the sort of a story, bigger story is Lily is going back with Marshall to his hometown of St. Cloud, Minnesota, to do Thanksgiving with his family. Lily and Marshall have just gotten engaged, and Lily arrives in St. Cloud to discover that there is a lot more pressure and expectation on her to sort of fit into the Erickson clan and their way of life. They're in Minnesota, and it kind of freaks for are out. And then Ted and Robin are both left behind. They both are not able to go home for Thanksgiving. I like that feeling of the sort of, like, expat Thanksgiving. I used to have those in Los Angeles when we were doing the show. I'm from New York. We would do sort of figure out something to do with friends in Los Angeles and make our own Thanksgiving. Ted and Robin do that. They decide to do something good and go to a food shelter to feed people who could use some extra help. And much to their shock, they discover Barney Stinson there working, who is the superstar of feeding the hungry on Thanksgiving. And this makes no sense to them whatsoever.
- [06:45]
Josh Radner
Yeah.
- [06:45]
Craig Thomas
Those are the two main storylines. Yes.
- [06:48]
Josh Radner
Was this the first time it was revealed that Lily is a native New Yorker? Or had that come up before in the show?
- [06:53]
Craig Thomas
I think we've. We. Yeah. It's come up a couple times talking about her being a Brooklyn girl, but this is the episode in which she says, like, no, I want to end up in Brooklyn. I want to have kids and end up in Brooklyn. Here we are living in Manhattan. The furthest I want to venture from where we are now is Brooklyn, and Marshall says, I might want to move back to St. Cloud. And they clearly have not discussed this as much as they should have.
- [07:12]
Josh Radner
Right. Yeah.
- [07:13]
Craig Thomas
So she calls her Brooklyn shot here. This is the most pointedly she's been from Brooklyn in series based on my.
- [07:20]
Josh Radner
Wife, who's from Brooklyn parks, and my wife, who grew up in the Upper east side and now will never wants to leave Brooklyn ever. Even I have to drag her to Manhattan.
- [07:31]
Craig Thomas
You know, you are in Brooklyn as we speak.
- [07:33]
Josh Radner
It's true. But this is a real thing, though, with marriages. I mean, you know, love gets you maybe to the proposal, and then you re. There's so much stuff to navigate and negotiate, especially geography. I mean, that's a huge one. And I just love, you know, so. So when you wrote Marshall, you didn't necessarily write him tall, right? Like, you weren't thinking, like, Marshall has to be tall, like he's from Minnesota with. From big people. But then you get Jason Siegel, who's, what, 6, 4, 6, 4, 6, four.
- [08:06]
Craig Thomas
The runt of the Erickson litter.
- [08:07]
Josh Radner
The runt of the litter, which is such a funny joke.
- [08:10]
Craig Thomas
But that's a.
- [08:11]
Josh Radner
That's a perfect example of the casting. Once you have your cast, you write, you. You tailor the suit to the. To the actor, right? And then Allison, who. Who, God bless her, is not a tall person and, you know, relative to Jason at least. But you have this funny. I mean, it's such a funny thing when she's like half their size, getting pinballing around and kind of getting lost in the sea of bodies.
- [08:37]
Craig Thomas
It's one of those storylines where, like, comedically, you're on solid ground every time you cut to that storyline, every time you're back in that world and she just comes up to the waistline of, like, 7 foot tall Ned Ralsma Erickson brother. It's funny. It's just always funny. It makes me laugh. Every time we cut back to that storyline, it's just like, that is just such a good feeling when you're in edit and you realize you're, like, you're just laughing every time you see that image. And it's just such a good image. The theme of it is, like, it's an image that's funny, but it highlights the theme of the episode, which is trying to figure out how you fit into this new family now that you're going to be a, quote, future Mrs. Erickson, except she doesn't want to take that name. And that comes out at dinner. And no one's absolutely scandalized by that idea there.
- [09:17]
Josh Radner
I thought Ally was so good at playing two things at once. Like, she's playing the. Like, I have a smile on my face and I'M trying to be like a good participant in this insane culture that I'm seeing. And she's quietly, like, freaking out inside. But yeah, she freaks out in such a way that the audience knows she's freaking out. But you get the feeling the family doesn't quite know she's freaking out. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [09:41]
Craig Thomas
Because she has to put that on for Marshall and she loves him so much, but she's like, oh, my dear God, I'm in. I'm. What land have. What portal have I walked through into this other world that I don't fit in? I love how she plays. This is one of my favorite Lily episodes. Certainly one of my favorite Lily episodes in season one. I would argue this is the first time we really do, like, an episode where like, Lily really gets to carry it. I just feel like this is her episode. I say that and then of course, there's so many great moments leading up to this. But I really feel like she is the emotional core of this episode. Maybe in a way we hadn't done as much to in those first eight before this. And I love it. She's Allie Hannigan, man. She's good. She's good at everything.
- [10:23]
Josh Radner
We've established that. But we'll say it again. She's really good.
- [10:26]
Craig Thomas
Say it again.
- [10:27]
Josh Radner
It also, it also kind of illustrates, like, you know, like I U S. Politics is so insanely fractured and, and it's kind of like if you really look at America, it's like Europe. It's a collection of different countries that are like smashed together. Like, Minnesota is different than New York City, is different than Utah, Ohio, California, like Texas, like they're all these different cultures. And I think, you know, there's something so funny about a New Yorker dropped into kind of rural Minnesota and just what that provokes in her. But there's a lot going on. There's like, there's, there's like feminism clashing with, like, traditional stuff. There's the size differences. There's. I mean, her, her fear that she's going to give birth to a 14 pound baby or whatever. How much.
- [11:19]
Craig Thomas
It was so good.
- [11:19]
Josh Radner
It's so funny, the turkey, because every.
- [11:21]
Craig Thomas
Time you see that turkey once you realize the turkey equals her future baby. The turkey's funny every time you see it. And that sort of act break shot where you're sort of like doing that thing of zooming in and pulling back at the same time and the bottom, the back's falling out. It's like a Scorsese shot and she's the Turkey is just looming in the front of frame. It's so great. And then from then on out, she's just always staring at that turkey, thinking she's gonna push one of those through her vagina in a year.
- [11:46]
Josh Radner
And I wrote you this little ditty to sing to you in New York City. We'll be right back at City Harvest.
- [12:01]
Commercial Narrator
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- [12:28]
Craig Thomas
A very happy half off holiday because.
- [12:31]
Josh Radner
Right now Mint Mobile is offering you the gift of 50% off unlimited. To be clear, that's half price, not half the service. Mint is still premium unlimited wireless for a great price. So that means a half day.
- [12:46]
Craig Thomas
Yeah.
- [12:46]
Josh Radner
Give it a try@mintmobile.com Switch upfront payment of $45 for three month plan equivalent.
- [12:51]
Commercial Narrator
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- [13:03]
Josh Radner
And now back to the show. Ted is always looking to the future as his salvation. Like Ted is always looking like, if I could just get these things to line up, the future is going to be glorious. I won't be struggling the way I'm struggling. Whereas Lily kind of looks at this particular future and she catastrophizes it, you know?
- [13:20]
Craig Thomas
Yes, yes. She feels the walls closing in. She feels like she's entered some sort of weird, like handmaid's tale adjacent to the universe where she'll have to birth these giant children for the good of the republic. Giant turkey just pushing giant turkeys out. And her sense, her growing sense of kind of panic and displacement in this episode, it so conjures what it feels like in a way, for I think it's a very relatable thing to have a partner. And you go into their world and now you're 100% in their world. You're on their terms. I'm gonna say this very delicately. My wife is a really wonderful gourmet chef. She's Jewish, she's from Brooklyn. She just grew up with parents who were good cooks. She joined my family. We are Irish cooks. It's not the same. There is more mayonnaise. There's more mayonnaise involved.
- [14:12]
Josh Radner
More potatoes cuisine.
- [14:13]
Craig Thomas
There's a lot more potatoes. Things are cooked differently. There are vegetables at Rebecca are green, and there are vegetables that maybe have grown more brown in their preparation. In some of my family settings, there's just people like to cook things a lot more in Irish world. And I say all this with love for both sides of that debate. But a little bit of that went into this episode. But we went around the horn in the writers room, and I remember everyone had some story like this of either they were the mayo salad, they were the seven layer mayo salad half of their couple, or they went into that. We had a couple of people that were from the Midwest around that table, and they very much had. Maybe not as insane as the seven layer salad, but there was definitely talk of, like, gummy bears, crunched up potato chips. Like, the seven layer salad is actually not for. To anyone unfamiliar. It exists in nature. There's versions of the salad that are very much. People in the writers room very much remembered growing up eating iterations of slightly toned down iterations.
- [15:14]
Josh Radner
Everyone has a normal childhood in as much as it's the only childhood, you know?
- [15:19]
Craig Thomas
Yeah, that's right.
- [15:20]
Josh Radner
Like, you're like, I don't know, was it. It's only when you get older and you start actually comparing and you realize, oh, that was insane. Like, why were we eating that? Like, that was. That was bonkers. But everyone has a seven.
- [15:31]
Craig Thomas
Do you have that in Ohio? Do you. Do you have one versions of that?
- [15:34]
Josh Radner
Growing up in Ohio, we definitely had, like, my sisters and I joke about certain meals my mom made that were part of the rotation that were like, oh, what was that? I mean, there was. I remember there was this dish that we kind of.
- [15:47]
Craig Thomas
Hi, Mrs. Radner.
- [15:48]
Josh Radner
Hi. But it was called chicken divan. It was chicken divan that had, like, a real mayonnaise sauce, and there was broccoli chicken and, like, lemony mayonnaise something. But. But, you know, there was. We were from the land of, you know, the green bean mushroom salad at Thanksgiving with crispy onion rings on top. That's delicious. I will defend that.
- [16:12]
Craig Thomas
There's nothing wrong with that. That's a nice texture, right?
- [16:15]
Josh Radner
That I know they do.
- [16:17]
Craig Thomas
Absolutely.
- [16:18]
Josh Radner
Yeah. But there. But there. There are those things about your childhood, whether it's, you know, something with food or even Basque ice ball is like a thing, which I'm curious, like, where that came from. But there's something so funny about the. The weirdness of a family that to the family, is like, like utterly normal. But to an outsider, you're like, what are you eating? Like, what are you doing? This is not how life is supposed to be lived or meals are supposed to be had.
- [16:49]
Emily Blumberg
Yeah.
- [16:49]
Craig Thomas
I really like the moment late in the episode. I mean, first of all, just like their scene. Jason and Ally's scene in the prison cell is great.
- [16:57]
Josh Radner
So good.
- [16:57]
Craig Thomas
And it's sort of the. That's so great. They're so lovable and real and they're just. It's yet another moment where you just fall in love with that couple. And they just. The moment she says she might be pregnant, his almost immediate response is, we can never let one of our children play bass. Guys ball. It's a death trap. Like, if he sees it through, like, outside eyes for the first time in that moment. And then we've all had that sort of mom of clarity, right? Where you look back at your childhood, you go, oh, that was fucking weird. That was really weird. What we used to do or what we were allowed to do sometimes just with my children now raising kids in 2025, I think of, like, my friends and I when we were 9, like, my daughter's 9. My parents wouldn't know where we were for 16 hours because we were in the woods blowing shit up or whatever.
- [17:42]
Josh Radner
The.
- [17:42]
Craig Thomas
We were doing riding, like, dirt bikes off of jumps next to a cliff. Like, you're just like, what in God's name were we allowed to do this? I'm getting a little bit into, like, old guide material now of, like, kids different. But just the seeing that through fresh eyes is very sobering moment. Ready to go. Oh, that's weird. That's weird.
- [18:00]
Josh Radner
Have we talked about the. The. The podcast Heavyweight? Do you know? Do you know Heavyweight?
- [18:04]
Craig Thomas
No, I don't think so.
- [18:05]
Josh Radner
It's an amazing podcast. This guy, I think Jonathan Goldstein is the name who hosts it, but it's basically like he talks to people who are carrying a heavy weight. Like, the kinds of things that keep you up at three in the morning, like, why did I do that thing? Or why did. Like, if only my life had. If I done this, my life would have been different. And there's this episode where this guy remembers in the 70s, his parents let him and his best friend and these two other, like, maybe his cousins who were staying with them drive their bikes from, like, Pennsylvania to, like, Connecticut or New Jersey. It was a three day. They were like 11, 10, and 9. And they took their bikes and they booked like two hotels to stay at. And it was just like the 70s was like, just go to your uncle's. Like, just drive your bikes to your uncle. It was three. It was three days on bikes, driving, like, you know, 14 hours a day on bicycles.
- [18:59]
Craig Thomas
Oh, my God.
- [19:00]
Josh Radner
And it was. He was like, people don't believe.
- [19:03]
Craig Thomas
Child Services Bike Tour. The call. The call. Protect Child Protective Services Bike Tour. It happened once a year, and then everyone went to jail at the end. But the finish.
- [19:10]
Josh Radner
But I suspect I don't have kids, but I suspect expect that being a parent is a little bit of this negotiation of like, okay, I really appreciated this from my childhood. I really appreciated this from my parents, my childhood home, my schooling. I'm going to keep that. Here's a whole list of stuff. Under no circumstances am I keeping. Like, I'm getting rid of this.
- [19:29]
Craig Thomas
You're curating. It is an artisanal process. It is a handpicked curatorial. What are we leaving? What are we keeping? But then I think that's what's interesting about this episode. Marshall and Lilly have gotten engaged. In the pilot, Marshall and Lily getting engaged is the inciting incident of the entire series, right? And here we are with yet another ripple of that. And the ripple this time is kind of like, where are we going to live? Where are we going to raise kids? Have we agreed upon this stuff? Have we talked about this stuff? And it is always amazing in real life and in this episode how much you kind of haven't covered as you're barreling toward marrying someone or you've already married someone. I won't say who this is because I don't know if it's like, it's religious based material. So I don't want to speak for anybody else, but one of our writers, she said that it was only once she was pregnant with their first child that I forget who was on what side of the debate, but she or her husband, one of them said, like, well, should we raise. You know, I know neither of us is that religious, but we'll obviously be raising our baby. This. This little girl we're having to believe in God. And then the other one of them says, like, I don't believe in God. And then the first one of them goes, what? And it was like, it was the first time they really realized that they've been together for years and we're about to have a child, if I'm getting the story right. And it was like, that was the moment they realized that one of them was an atheist and one of them believed, like, in God and an afterlife and all this. And it was one of those moments I was like, how have we not talked about this in the five years we've been together?
- [20:49]
Josh Radner
Yeah.
- [20:50]
Craig Thomas
And.
- [20:51]
Josh Radner
Well, it's also.
- [20:51]
Craig Thomas
Right.
- [20:52]
Josh Radner
It's also like, we. We have these ideas that love will triumph and love will save the day and love will smooth over everything. And I believe that the base of it has to be that kind of love and attraction and intimacy and all that. But the truth is, building a life with someone is really. You're creating a startup together to be very unsexy about it. Like, you're creating a company that has its own kind of rules and ethos, and you have to hammer out the kind of details. Some of it, if you. If you marry, some of it can be a little unspoken. Like, I don't like. My wife and I both went to college. It's not going to be a debate whether we want our kids to go to college. You know what I mean? Like, that's, like, kind of baked into our thing. But there are other things I'm sure. Sure. We'll have to navigate, and we continue to. So I think this episode's, like, a really great. Especially because I think with a kid on the way, or the potential of a kid on the way, those questions take on a new urgency. Right?
- [21:51]
Craig Thomas
Oh, yes. Yes. And Marshall, of course, doesn't know that until the very end of the episode that that's what's been going on this whole time, which I also like. We, the audience. There's that kind of distant. The dramatic irony of we know and he doesn't know.
- [22:03]
Josh Radner
Yes. Well, that's also a great. That's good writing, because, yeah, we and Lily know something that Marshall doesn't know. So they're actually living in kind of two different universes. And there's something very sweet about Marshall wanting Lily to just, like, delight in the Minnesota snow with him. Like, just like, isn't this great? Isn't this fun? Like, isn't my family wonderful? And they are wonderful in their own giant kind of way.
- [22:34]
Craig Thomas
Yeah. He wants her to be part of this thing that she's kind of not. Right. You can't just parachute in and you're just 100% part of the family. You can love these people. You can love them. They're the people that created and brought you the love of your life. Right. Marshall comes from them. Like, where Marshall says, I am Funyuns, I am mayonnaise. You're gonna have to love those parts of me, too, because it's kind of true. Right. You need to Be that accepted, radically accepted by your partner in some ways. But your partner also gets to have opinions and say, I'm not moving to St. Clair and having kids grow up wailing each other with hockey sticks while trying to put a basketball through a hoop, which, to answer your earlier question, is completely invented. No one was like. No one around the writer's table was like, hey, I did Basque iceball. That was just completely made up.
- [23:18]
Josh Radner
It's almost like Basque iceball is the cock a mouse of sports.
- [23:25]
Craig Thomas
Yes, that's right. An ungodly combination that is fascinating and disturbing.
- [23:31]
Josh Radner
When you marry someone, you know, you. You have to take a real hard look at their family because you're like, I'm marrying that. I'm. I'm marrying. And. And, you know, it's. It's harrowing. It's part of the, like, horror of being a human is like, we tend to turn towards that, you know, as we get older, we, like, cleave a little more than is comfortable for some of us towards what we. How we grew up. I mean, I think that. Yeah, I mean, you can. Like I said, like, it's like the negotiation between, okay, I'm gonna keep this. I'm gonna. But not all of it's conscious, you know, so sometimes, like, our family stuff just comes out. Like, I've been feeling this a lot lately. Like, you. You know when you feel your. Your dad in you and you're like, oh, yeah, wow, that's. That's that thing that I used to see my dad. Like, it's even just the way I'm sitting on a couch. Or my friend Michael. My friend Michael said, yeah, exactly. My friend Michael said, in his childhood, the thing that drove him the most crazy about his father was he could not get out of a seat or a couch without going. Just this groan of sitting down and standing up out of a seat. He was like, you don't have to make noises every time. He said the moment he turned 40, just. He couldn't do it either. Just audible sitting and standing.
- [24:53]
Craig Thomas
He's standing up to blow out the birthday cake for his 40th birthday party. And it's so it begins.
- [24:59]
Josh Radner
Yeah.
- [25:00]
Craig Thomas
The thing I love about the tall. The tall Lily's. The short person in a land of giants is it makes a fairy tale almost out of this thing. That's actually very true. Which, of course, are a parable. Like, of course, parables and fairy tales all come from deeper truths. And the deeper truth is, like, she's in her 20s, she's just gotten engaged she's now really saying, I'm trying to become a grownup. And she's saying, where do I fit? Where do I fit in life? Where do I fit? And the feeling of not fitting into a family of giants and you're just this tiny being in this land of giants. Like, it feels very sort of fairytale supernatural in this great way. That's what I love about the storyline. I think Chris and Phil, as animation geniuses, kind of like, really enjoyed that piece of it, too. And having those visuals, right? Having, like, it's visually funny, it's funny on mute, but it's something true is underneath that. And that's always my favorite thing, when you can make a visual metaphor out of the true, true thing. And this Lily's displacement you in every frame of that story.
- [25:59]
Josh Radner
It's also funny because Ally and Lily are both, like, formidable characters and not recessive. Like, she's not. Lily's not a small, receding character, right? Like, she's. She's small, but she's. She's got, like, might and strength and power. But, I mean, you're right. The visual can't be beat. It was. It's fantastic.
- [26:21]
Craig Thomas
Yes. Very much based on my wife, too, who is five feet tall, but formidable, very strong person. And I think that's why my wife was like Allie Hannigan cast her.
- [26:31]
Emily Blumberg
We can ask Kristen Phil if this is true. So there is a short film called My Wife's Relations by Buster Keaton from the early 1920s. And in it, he sits on the right side of a table. He is five foot seven. The entire table is filled with tall people around him who make much of him over the course of the short film. And I know that. At least I know that Chris knows Buster and is into Buster Keaton. Last man on Earth is a very Buster Keaton y kind of show, especially in those first more silent episodes.
- [27:05]
Craig Thomas
And I've seen that short film because of. Because of you, Al.
- [27:08]
Emily Blumberg
And I do wonder if there was any inspiration. That's my fan question of the day, but I'm actually emailing and asking them that now.
- [27:16]
Craig Thomas
We. I mean, I remember being in the room. I can't remember if speaking specifically that piece was pitched by them or not. It seems like the kind of thing they would pitch. I can't remember. But yeah. And just all the ways it was shot and scripted and the turkey, the huge turkey, like, all of that stuff, so many of those touches were them, so maybe it wasn't. And I remember seeing that short, that Buster Keaton short in College with you, Alec. Alec. Sidebar. Alec is a Buster Keaton aficionadic. I mean, I think that's a. Yeah. A hardcore super fan. And it's. Yeah. What an honor to be even potentially compared to Buster.
- [27:51]
Josh Radner
Q. I again was struck by how great Ally is. Her breakdown in the convenience store is so good.
- [28:00]
Craig Thomas
So good. Hilarious and real. And you feel her. Yeah, she's.
- [28:05]
Josh Radner
She has this ability to like, be so emotionally full, but hit every joke in a way that doesn't sound like she's trying to hit jokes. Like, it's just. It was very good. And I really, I was incredibly moved by the. The jail scene. Like, there's something. I don't know. I'm sure this is overthinking it, but like, like marriage at its worst can feel like a kind of jail or. That was my always. My fear of it was that it would feel like you were trapped. But in. In a way, them sitting in that jail cell, they actually find their freedom together. Right? Like, they find this way to be together in a way that is that. That liberates them from. From at least Lily's nightmare of it. And also realizing that, like, yes, she's with a guy who eats, who grew up eating seven layer salad and playing Basque ice ball, but he also, like, is her man. You know, he's like, he's the. He's the guy for her.
- [29:01]
Craig Thomas
Yeah, there's that great line in there where he's like, you know, I'll tell you right now, I don't want us to become just like my family. And he says, and I don't want you to. I don't. No offense, but I don't want to be exactly like yours either. And she does this great little take just this little cutaway to her, kind of like nodding like, yeah, I get it. Like, my family's crazy too. We didn't even know all the ways her family was crazy yet. Right. We took many seasons to kind of get to Chris Elliot and exploring her weird upbringing. We didn't know all that stuff yet, but she just knew all families are flawed. And it's sort of a nice grown up moment where they say, let's agree that we'll make our own version of our family. And in a way, it's like a little. It's almost like they got married there in that moment in that jail cell. It's like, that's the agreement, right? That's the life we're gonna build together. And it's very sweet. I love how she. What you said about her doing jokes and they don't feel like jokes. A great one. And I'm convinced, I think this was a Kristen Phil line was the thing of like, you know, I grew up just fine in New York and in fact we grew up just fine in New York and then we grew to the proper size and then we stopped growing. I love that line so much. And you sort of cut away to 7 foot tall. Ned Rasma as Marshall's brother. He's great in that epis. Those two brothers, really funny.
- [30:07]
Josh Radner
So funny. The idea like, like growing past a certain size is an indecent choice to make. It sounds like Oscar Wilde or something.
- [30:14]
Craig Thomas
Chose to be 7ft tall.
- [30:16]
Josh Radner
Yeah, like, stop it. It's gross. And this old man, he must admit he fell in love with you.
- [30:26]
Craig Thomas
New York City and now commercials.
- [30:33]
Josh Radner
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- [30:36]
Emily Blumberg
Not sure where to start. Thumbtack knows homes.
- [30:39]
Josh Radner
So you don't have to, don't know.
- [30:40]
Emily Blumberg
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- [30:56]
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- [31:33]
Craig Thomas
End of commercials.
- [31:34]
Josh Radner
Back to show this is we Jordana had to think where she said, you know, you and I talk about this episode and then I record my question. But you and Craig like talk about what I was going to talk about. So it looks like I just haven't been listening to the episode. She comes in. So this is. We have talked about this a little. I like the way she phrases this. We are now at a section of the show that we're very lovingly and simply calling questions and observations from a clinical psychologist and relationship expert who's never seen How I Met yout Mother and also happens to be married to Josh.
- [32:10]
Craig Thomas
It's too succinct. It's too short and sweet. I think we should make it longer.
- [32:14]
Josh Radner
Will someone just. Will someone. Emily, Maybe we'll do the acronym of what that is so we can just start calling it by that.
- [32:23]
Emily Blumberg
I think our co producer Doug has it written down. I don't know if that helps anyone.
- [32:27]
Josh Radner
Because we are an acronymic kind of show.
- [32:30]
Craig Thomas
There's your T shirt. There's your T shirt. That acronym. You want me to put it in the chat?
- [32:36]
Josh Radner
Yeah, put it in the chat. Let's try to read it.
- [32:38]
Craig Thomas
That was Doug, our co producer.
- [32:40]
Emily Blumberg
I don't even know where the chat is. Oh, there it is. There's a chat. Look at that. This is. This is the show, guys. This is behind the scenes. This is how the podcast gets.
- [32:49]
Craig Thomas
We don't rehearse this whole podcast, if we're being honest.
- [32:53]
Emily Blumberg
Oh, there it is. All right, all right, Josh.
- [33:06]
Craig Thomas
I just. I just disappeared. It was this incantation, and Josh just made. I'm in a cloud is a poof. It's like, Let me try to say it again. Maybe he'll come back. Shades of Temple of Doom. Oh, my God. There's definitely some curses words in there, I think, too. I don't know.
- [33:33]
Josh Radner
It does sound like an ancient incantation.
- [33:35]
Craig Thomas
It does.
- [33:36]
Emily Blumberg
It's time for us. I'm just going to play Jordan as quack, quack. Pair of images.
- [33:41]
Josh Radner
Now.
- [33:42]
Jordana
This episode tackles a real hot button issue in laws I personally feel blessed with. Truly incredible in laws. And I'm not just saying that because they're possibly listening right now. Josh and I have families whose values really align. But how to manage in laws when values and customs do not align is a topic that my patients are constantly bringing up. What I say is that family is something most people get to do twice. You have your family of origin, and then you have the family you create. That can pose a real dilemma, which you see Marshall and Lily navigating. What do you take from your family of origin without it impinging on the family you want to create with this new person versus what do you leave behind without feeling like it's a betrayal of the family you came from? And Carter and Craig, I think you very wisely show here that partnership is hard. Merging lives is hard. You're not just idealizing what comes after you've found the person you want to be with. You make it very clear that being single is hard for Ted. But in this episode, I think you're really saying partnership is as well. It's just different kinds of hard. And at the end of the day, it's really about what kind of hard feels most aligned for you.
- [35:06]
Craig Thomas
She's so much better at talking than me. Should she host a podcast? Do you want to fire me? Because she's just so good. What can. Dear God.
- [35:14]
Josh Radner
You know, we were talking. Yeah. What she. I think I mentioned this, but there's this Ram Dass thing where Ram Dass was this great spiritual teacher that I got to know a little bit. And he said that the question most people. More people ask him than any other question is, should I get married? Should I marry this person? Should I get married at all? And he said his answer was always the same. It doesn't matter. He said, if you get married, you're gonna have these problems. If you don't get married, you're gonna have these problems. He's like, problems either way. So, yeah, I think. I think we think I could make a certain decision. This is what Ted does. If I just get this partnership decision right, the rest of my life will be struggle free or it'll all work out. And my experience of life is. It's like. It's just new problems. You know, every opportunity is just new and somewhat interesting problems. You know, the mind loves a juicy problem to solve. But I think her. Her larger point is so well taken about merging lives, and it's perilous. It's tricky.
- [36:12]
Craig Thomas
Yeah. And I always think of your best friend in childhood is the person who could agree with you on the rules of the universe you were creating. Do you know what I mean? It's like, we're gonna play this game. We've got our little Star wars guys or whatever we got, or we're gonna play this game, invent a sport. We're gonna pretend to be the characters of the movie, and you have that person that you sort of just can do improv with, and you sort of weirdly, mostly agree on the rules of this universe you're creating. That's essentially what you then try to do when you have a partner, a romantic partner later.
- [36:46]
Josh Radner
It's like both our imaginations took us into the same room.
- [36:49]
Craig Thomas
Yeah.
- [36:50]
Josh Radner
And we're kind of like inhabiting that together. And there's something so satisfying about play being that level. There's a kind of, like, fundamental agreement or handshake around how we're playing. Yes. And that's not. It's true. It's not unlike marriage, you know, that, like, I think a lot of marriages fail because you ultimately realize you were inhabiting different universes, you were inhabiting different, you know, value systems or, you know, just. Even the Shock of like, wait, you believe in God? Like, there's certain things that people just don't discuss. I mean, my wife and I, like, we. I mean, we've never stopped having, like a very big, big conversation. But, like, we're not exactly small talk people. Like, we jumped right into big talk. So we covered an enormous amount of ground very quickly of what was meaningful to us.
- [37:42]
Craig Thomas
Yeah, yeah.
- [37:44]
Emily Blumberg
I was gonna say, Craig, that honestly, it's. It's how I felt about you the first week we met. This idea that we had. We had inhabited the same made up universes.
- [37:58]
Craig Thomas
Yeah.
- [37:59]
Emily Blumberg
A couple. Couple miles apart from each other, but somehow it was like, oh, there's another one.
- [38:07]
Craig Thomas
Reference. We might as well have been hanging out watching the same shit. We just. We dove, Right. This is Alec and I meeting in the very beginning of the first year of college at Western University. And we were right into the conversation as if we'd been having it the whole time.
- [38:18]
Josh Radner
Right.
- [38:19]
Emily Blumberg
Because you had been having it with Andrew and your friends. I'd been having it with Joel and my friends. And all of a sudden I was like, oh, well, let's just do that. Let's just continue that one. And it's probably also what you and Carter connected on early on, also with music. Comedy.
- [38:34]
Craig Thomas
Yeah. Especially with music at first. Yeah, yeah. And those moments with your friends that become your forever friends are as precious as meeting the one. And it's the same mechanism. Marshall's wisdom. Marshall has been this goofball the whole episode, Right. He's out there playing Basque ice ball. He's not really picking up that Lily is having a minor nervous breakdown now that she's supposed to be. And Mrs. Erickson, but the moment he hears she might be pregnant, it's like he snaps awake into this, like, higher level of adulthood. He goes, we're gonna make our own life. We're gonna make our own family. It's not gonna be slavishly like mine or emulate the craziness of yours. We get to do our own improv game. And we can. Yes. And each other in that improv game. And that's the best part of couplehood, right? When you can do that.
- [39:18]
Josh Radner
Yeah. And not to. I wanna also say that I was also struck by how deeply good Jason is in that jailhouse scene.
- [39:27]
Craig Thomas
So good.
- [39:27]
Josh Radner
So good. Really? There was just like. I don't know, there was something about that scene where you go, oh, these people are right together. Like, I get why these people are together. You know, they weren't just thrown together by sitcom writers. Like, this is. This makes sense. Like you. I mean, you guys created characters that make sense together, and that's not easy to do.
- [39:48]
Craig Thomas
You know, it's one of the most adult he is so far in the series. You know what I mean? He is silly. He is singing. Being a lawyer better be awesome. He is, you know, and this is a moment where he sort of promises to her. He promises away her fears by saying, we're gonna define stuff on our own. And I really love him in that. He's very. He's a grownup in that moment. He's been a kid in the episode up till there, and he turns into a grown up in that jail cell of all places. And he played that great. The two of them were so great. It's just the kind of thing. You watch that scene, you know, I remember shooting that, and you just watch that and you go, I think we got a TV show here. I think this is gonna. I think this has legs. Cause you can do a whole story about them going to Minnesota and we're out of home base. Right. We're not in New York. We're not talking about dating. It's not Ted trying to land the one. It's Marshall and Lily in a jail cell in St. Cloud. And the show still works. That's a good. That's a good sign. That felt good.
- [40:40]
Josh Radner
I also love Jordana's point about that. You get to do family twice, and the first one you say, and the second one, you make a choice. I mean, you could argue you don't.
- [40:53]
Emily Blumberg
You.
- [40:54]
Josh Radner
You don't make as much of a choice. Like, there's the imago. There's the, like, the kind of patterning you fall. You actually choose a partner that mirrors something about your childhood with, like, a little bit of an upgrade, hopefully. But. But the show, you know, I forget who said this, but, like, all TV is about family. Did you ever hear that? Like, every TV show is about family? Yeah, I mean, some of them are literally about family, like Sopranos or. But Cheers is a family. Like, it's the family at the bar. How I met your mother's a family around a booth. You know, like, I've been rewatching mash.
- [41:23]
Craig Thomas
Which is people thrown together in Korea, and they're a family, you know, people that had never met. Yeah. It's so great.
- [41:28]
Josh Radner
It's like the DNA of television is, like, families gathered around this. This box. So it's always, like, reflecting back various notions or forms of family, and that's what makes it work.
- [41:43]
Craig Thomas
Yeah. And I think that's why this show lives on, because this show does give that vibe. And I think at a time when people really want to feel that feeling of community, and it's not so easy to find.
- [41:52]
Josh Radner
Wait, we have not talked about the B story.
- [41:56]
Craig Thomas
That you're in. Weren't you in that B story?
- [41:58]
Josh Radner
I was in it. We haven't talked about it. Real quick. I mean, it's so funny. Those two guest stars, I remember being delightful. Really funny.
- [42:09]
Craig Thomas
Yeah, they were really funny.
- [42:11]
Josh Radner
It's so funny. One thing that really struck me about it is this notion of, like, piety or outward kind of virtue. And I think there's something. Again, I am. I will subject every moment of this show to, like, the most rigorous college lit reading, you know, class. But there's something about the. Anyone. I have found this in life, people who are outwardly pious are not quite to be trusted.
- [42:40]
Craig Thomas
Like, it's like there's.
- [42:42]
Josh Radner
There's something about, like, all the people that are the do gooders in the episode are actually, like, pretty ethically slippery. You know?
- [42:49]
Craig Thomas
They're slippery. Yeah. And it's funny because it's all before sort of Instagram, sort of performative piety beginning. This is 2005. But, you know, if Instagram existed, those people that were stealing the food would have 100% had pictures of themselves nobly serving.
- [43:06]
Josh Radner
Less fortunate. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But it's also, it's. It's kind of Ted's thing about dating. Like, especially if you're meeting people. I think we've talked about this, but, like, if you're meeting people that you weren't introduced to by friends or people who don't know your friends, you're just meeting strangers in the world and you're like, I don't know if you're a good person or not. Like, I don't know if you believe. Behave honorably when no one's looking. But it's so. It's such a funny reveal that Barney's there and he's like, the top.
- [43:36]
Craig Thomas
So funny. And it's a mystery. This. This show thrives on mysteries, even in a little. The B story of this one. There's this mystery. How is Barney here? What's actually happening here? And the fact that that storyline ends in a strip club on Thanksgiving and Marsha and Lily's ends in a jail cell, and both stories feature public urination. I must admit, I took a little pride rewatching it. I was, like, well constructed. I was trying to remember. We must have realized that Lily's Gonna have to pee on a stick as part of this story. So why not have her get arrested for doing that in a weird. And then it must have been like, at some point. We're like, okay, what crime could Barney have committed that he got sentenced to community service? We're like, it has to be pelvic urination, so there's a double P in the episode. To those writing students out there, you want at least two urinations per script. You're welcome. This is my TED Talk. My Ted Mosby Talk.
- [44:29]
Josh Radner
That's so good. That's so good. Oh, there's also something that Neil made me laugh of. Like, remember when he in Slutty Pumpkin, Kind of like with. With. He. He put on the other costume and tried to be like, yeah, these guys are all jerks. He also has, like, a way he fronts as, like, hey, I'm a do gooder. Like, he's got. Yeah, yeah, he's got his.
- [44:53]
Craig Thomas
These guys are cool. They can stay.
- [44:54]
Josh Radner
Yeah.
- [44:55]
Craig Thomas
He's so comfortable in the room.
- [44:57]
Josh Radner
So comfortable.
- [44:58]
Craig Thomas
He's so good.
- [44:59]
Josh Radner
He's so, like, not shocked to see them. Like, they're so shocked to see them. And he's like, hey, guys. Okay. It was his casualness that really made me laugh.
- [45:09]
Craig Thomas
He's really funny. The way he played all that. And his picture of himself, his employee of the month. It's a very funny. It is a very funny B story. It has a great ending. It has great little great intercuts between those storylines. Not just the double p, the double PPRs, but just, like, great. Those stories actually fit together very nicely, and it's a great B story. It's just like, this was Marshall and Lily road trip movie, right? It's this. You got. You were. You were trapped in the B story in this. I remember, though.
- [45:35]
Josh Radner
I remember really enjoying the. The food pantry, like, shooting that stuff.
- [45:40]
Craig Thomas
Yeah.
- [45:40]
Josh Radner
And I think it. There's sometimes, like, pleasure in being the B story.
- [45:44]
Craig Thomas
You know what I mean?
- [45:45]
Josh Radner
Like, the pressure's off.
- [45:46]
Craig Thomas
You just.
- [45:47]
Josh Radner
Yeah. Like, you work a little bit less, so you have, like, a little more time away from the stage.
- [45:51]
Craig Thomas
That's funny.
- [45:52]
Josh Radner
And you get to, like, come in and just, like, be funny, because B stories are generally, like, the comedic. Like, more comedic, so you're not having to carry, like, a heavy emotional load. But I remember having really, like, a fun time with Kobe, and those guest stars were just, like, pretty delightful. And, yeah, I remember enjoying this episode. I remember being like, it's fun to.
- [46:12]
Craig Thomas
Be on this show throwing. Throwing portobello mushrooms at People. It had good energy. It just had good energy. And it's Thanksgiving. It was our first Thanksgiving episode. We went down to do a bunch more, but it was our first time we got to end a Thanksgiving episode. And when that song by the 88. That again, Chris and Phil were, like, friends with the band the 88. And they were like, we gotta use this song youg Belong to Me. And that was their pitch. And that song's so beautiful. And that song playing through that montage of Lily finally coming back and fitting into that family, reassured that she and Marshall are gonna make their own family. And Ted and Robin and Barney at the strip club and that song playing over that. I got choked up watching it. I don't know if it was just me feeling nostalgic, but it didn't we.
- [46:53]
Josh Radner
Bring the 88 on to play at one of our holiday parties? It might have been.
- [46:56]
Craig Thomas
I think we did. Yeah, I think we. But they're the band in the Best Prom Ever episode. We liked them so much. We liked using their music so much that when we later used them in this season, they're the band.
- [47:08]
Josh Radner
They sled it all. Wasn't that his name?
- [47:10]
Craig Thomas
Yeah. Yeah. And they were great guys.
- [47:13]
Josh Radner
Yeah, totally great.
- [47:13]
Craig Thomas
We had them do a weird cover of an acoustic cover of Mr. Roboto off of Mr. Roboto playing @ the strip club that we were gonna end the episode on. But it was deemed, I think, too weird. But it's great. I don't remember if we ever used it or released it or did anything with it. It was great. But you belong to me Ending that episode is just lovely. And it's the first him Thanksgiving.
- [47:32]
Emily Blumberg
All right, so as we wrap up, I'd like to tell you this. First of all, I did email Chris and Phil in the middle of talking about this Buster Keaton theory. Phil has this to say. His answer was, were you thinking about this Buster Keaton scene? His answer was only subconsciously. But then he said. They said. This episode, he said, was mostly from going to a girlfriend's house for the weekend and realizing for the first time that I was not from America. I was from Miami.
- [47:59]
Craig Thomas
Ah, that's good. That's good. Yes. I mean, everybody in that room had some story about feeling so displaced, visiting a spouse's or significant other's place. I forgot that Phil. Yeah, Phil had that. That's a hilarious way to put that. I love that so much.
- [48:13]
Emily Blumberg
All right, so to wrap this up, I think all three of us, and you two especially, so many things are. We've run into so many coincidences, so many people. I saw you here. I did this. Just how I met your mother. Univers is just so big that we cross some interesting paths. Josh, when you recommended that we listen to Magic or Math from this American Life, which we did link to in an episode a couple episodes ago, had you listened to it recently?
- [48:43]
Josh Radner
No, it's been a couple years.
- [48:45]
Emily Blumberg
All right, so I'm going to play a clip from it, which is a little mind blowing. It's just a little moment here from Magic or Math. Here we go. He's setting up the story that he's going to tell in this part of this American Life.
- [49:01]
Josh Radner
I'm going to set up this date. I mean, you're just made for each other.
- [49:05]
Craig Thomas
You have to meet each other.
- [49:06]
Josh Radner
And she was determined to make that happen. Maybe you can see where this is going.
- [49:11]
Emily Blumberg
This is, in fact, my very own How I Met yout Father story.
- [49:16]
Craig Thomas
I just remembered it as you began to play it, because Josh recommended that and I listened to it maybe a year ago, and Josh recommended it, and I. I remember loving that. There's like a little. Our show, little Nugget.
- [49:28]
Josh Radner
I did not remember that at all. Remember? Well, that phrase. I mean, you guys injected that into the vein of culture. Like that is a phrase people toss around.
- [49:37]
Craig Thomas
Yeah. Among others. And when they come back, it always trips me out. And I think people are starting to not even know maybe where some of it began.
- [49:49]
Josh Radner
So this is a letter we received. And if you would like to send us a written letter or a voice note, just go to how we made your mother.com contact and then it should be pretty clear. But we love hearing from you what How I Met yout Mother means to you. Any sort of How I Met your mother related stories you want to share with us, Maybe they'll make it onto the air. We have a great time sifting through these and reading these. This is a wonderful, beautiful letter we received from Declan from Australia. And here it is. Hi, Craig and Josh. If you read this, I've put this as a general question.
- [50:27]
Craig Thomas
General question.
- [50:31]
Josh Radner
But it may fit equally well for episode nine, Belly Full of Turkey, as that's the first episode I saw and how I started watching the show with my dad. The show means more to me than I can express for many reasons, but mostly because I watched it with my dad. Dad, I have something I want to share with you both, regardless of whether it makes it onto the podcast. I was introduced to him through my dad, who happened to be watching episode nine, belly full turkey, one night I was maybe 14 or 15 at the time, and I walked in on the scene where Ted was talking to Tracy the stripper and then said, and that, kids, was how I met your mother. My dad was roaring with laughter at this, but I didn't get the joke, so I asked him to explain it. Instead of explaining it, he suggested I sit down to watch. The first episode made us both a cup of coffee and started a new tradition for the two of us. We watched many shows together as one of our ways of bonding, but Himyim was the first one. We would often sit together after each episode, drinking our coffee and talking about the episode or discussing theories about the show, who the mother was, what was with the pineapple, and why Future Ted was telling the story. Anyway, looking back, watching him together marked the shift of the. The start of the shift in my relationship with my dad to the one we would have as adults. Now, 17 years after watching Himyim with my dad, I resonate strongly with Future Ted and his story. I'm increasingly finding myself telling stories about my dad since he died and sharing who he was because it's such an inseparable part of who I am. The memories of watching the show with my dad will always make him a show I keep coming back to, but it's the honest and raw emotion of the characters in the show wearing its heart so openly on its sleeve that makes it so important. You all managed to create something magic by having a comedy show that also demonstrates to everyone watching that whatever you're feeling and experiencing is just so very human. And thank you so much for creating a show that means so much to me and so many others. Thanks so much, Declan. That's really lovely.
- [52:15]
Craig Thomas
Wow, that's beautiful. My God, thank you for sharing that with us. How special. It's so humbling. It's such an honor that the show could be that for somebody and that they could be part of your memories with your father and that it could be part of your growing up process in that way. And that's. That's. That's incredible.
- [52:35]
Josh Radner
They should add, like a sixth love language to the love language book. Like How I Met yout Mother. Sharing How I Met yout Mother is a love language for people. Yeah, we.
- [52:44]
Craig Thomas
We. We.
- [52:44]
Jordana
It's.
- [52:44]
Craig Thomas
It's. It never doesn't blow my mind when we hear something like that. And the generosity of fans to. To share those types of stories with us is. Means everything. Thanks, you guys.
- [52:55]
Josh Radner
I am guilty. Please acquit me. All sins are forgiven in New York City.
- [53:03]
Emily Blumberg
How we Made youe Mother is hosted and executive produced by Josh Radner and Craig Thomas and is presented and distributed by the Office Ladies Network and Odyssey. This episode is also executive produced by Jenna Fisher and Angela Kinsey. The show is produced and edited by Me, Alec Lev and our co producer is Doug Matica, our audience. Our audio producer and mixer is Alex Reeves at Pointe Blue Studios. Our digital content producer AKA Gen Z Master is Emily Blumberg. Artwork by John Morrow. Please follow rate and review the show on Apple Podcasts or your podcast player of choice. It really does help the show. Our theme song is New York City by our own Josh Radner with additional music by Craig Thomas and Andrew Mag. Special thanks to Lola Kennedy and Elliot Connors. Visit how we made your mother.com to learn more and click on the contact page to send us an email or a voice message. Your stories and questions are an important part of the show. Subscribe to Josh Radner's Muse Letters on Substack and check out his music and everything else@joshradner.com order Craig Thomas's debut novel, that's Not How It Happened, wherever books are sold, and check out his other published writings@craigthomaswriter.com and you can subscribe to My own Dead Fathers Society, also on Substack, to learn more about how you make a difference. This show's ongoing campaign to raise money for congenital pediatric heart disease research. Check out the Make a Difference tab at the top of our website. People will and in fact, dance.
- [54:46]
Josh Radner
The real question it just hit me. Am I in love with you or just New York City?