Trump Busted Selling Pardons For Millions In Insane Influencer Scheme

Summary

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IHIP News Podcast Summary

Episode Title: Trump Busted Selling Pardons For Millions In Insane Influencer Scheme
Date: June 18, 2026
Hosts: Jennifer Welch & Angie “Pumps” Sullivan
Guest: Josh Welch (Criminal Defense Attorney)

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Episode Overview

In this episode, Jennifer and Angie take an unfiltered, comedic, and bitingly insightful look at several major political and legal stories: the psychiatric defense in the Luigi Mangione murder trial; new revelations that Donald Trump sold presidential pardons for millions via influencer intermediaries; the Justice Department’s defense of Elon Musk’s polluting Mississippi data center; and the Trump administration’s dismantling of the Department of Education protections for disabled and marginalized children. The hosts’ irreverent tone and sharp commentary combine with Josh’s legal expertise to break down the latest headlines and their impact on vulnerable communities.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Luigi Mangione Psychiatric Defense (01:00–05:51)

• Subject: Luigi Mangione will assert a psychiatric defense (extreme emotional disturbance) in the high-profile murder of United Healthcare CEO Brian Thompson.

• Legal Mechanics:

  • Criminal defense attorney Josh Welch explains the defense means admitting the crime but arguing for manslaughter over murder (01:31).
  • The defense must be backed by psychiatric testimony and is only presented if the judge finds enough initial evidence (02:30).
  • It is risky: “You’re admitting the commission of the crime up front.” (03:18, Josh Welch).

• Strategy & Public Sentiment:

  • Hosts ask if outrage at profit-seeking health care companies can sway juries. Josh cautions that while lawyers want to play up corporate greed and public disgust, judges clamp down:
    • “Being a greedy piece of shit doesn’t also justify you being murdered right in the eyes of the law.” (04:59, Josh Welch)
  • The hosts note Mangione’s fame in “gay Twitter” partly due to his looks and widespread hatred for insurers.

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2. Trump’s Pardon-For-Profit Influencer Scheme (05:51–10:15)

• Subject: Reuters exposes Trump’s method of giving pardons through influencer intermediaries (e.g., Roger Stone), sidelining DOJ review and charging up to $2 million.

• Legal/Political Analysis:

  • Josh is shocked at “96% of these pardons don’t meet the Department of Justice guidelines” (07:07).
  • Describes an “ungodly” pay-for-play system: “It’s one big grift. Everything is a grift.” (07:07)
  • Applicants gain favor by appealing to Trump’s victim narrative.

• Impact on Crime Victims:

  • Trump pardons often wipe away both prison sentences and restitution orders, leaving crime victims empty-handed.
    • “He has wiped away just completely, with a wave of a magic wand, all of these orders of restitution...” (08:50, Josh Welch)
  • Host summary: “So they were first ripped off by these felons ... and then secondly ripped off by their own country. Probably a lot of these people maybe even voted for this man.” (10:03, Host)

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3. DOJ Siding with Elon Musk’s Polluting Data Centers (10:18–14:24)

• Subject: The Biden Justice Department moves to dismiss environmental lawsuits against Musk’s company Xai for unpermitted, polluting gas turbines in Mississippi, citing national security.

• Host Rant:

  • Lays out Republican party hypocrisy: “On the one hand, we are pro-life ... but on the other hand ... they’re absolutely pro-death.” (11:21)
  • Argues the government’s role is citizen protection, not corporate profit.

• Legal and Social Analysis:

  • Josh centers race and class: “The communities ... are African American communities in the state of Mississippi. So that shows you right there, they don’t care about an African American community.” (12:25)
  • DOJ wasn’t originally party to this suit, but is now intervening to block local environmental action.
  • “People that have more money are treated differently than those that aren’t. ... If you have a shitload of money, millions of dollars, then you can pretty much do whatever you want to in this country.” (13:35, Josh Welch)
  • Critiques working-class support for politicians who “don’t give two fucks about what you’re doing in the middle of Oklahoma.” (13:55)

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4. Dismantling the Department of Education’s Protections (17:11–22:14)

• Subject: The Trump administration gutted the Department of Education, shifting programs for disabled students to Health & Human Services and civil rights enforcement to the Justice Department.

• Impact on Real Communities:

  • Oklahoma schools move to four-day weeks due to budget cuts, displacing poor and special-needs students.
    • “In a state that ranks 50th in education, they are drawing back spending even more...Then pylon if you’re disabled or black. And then it just becomes almost insurmountable to live in America, which it feels like is the design of all of this.” (17:53, Host)

• Cynicism and Outrage:

  • New enforcers: “RFK Jr. ... who castrated a raccoon ... will now be responsible for helping disabled students. And Todd Blanch ... will be responsible for protecting marginalized students. America.” (19:42, Host)
  • Evangelical Christians lecturing on “family values” while supporting policies harmful to marginalized groups: “...then they bully and rat the most marginalized Americans in this country is so disgusting.” (20:56, Host)

• Democratic Missed Opportunities:

  • Josh: “This is a layup for Democrats...everybody is hurting out there. This is an opportunity ... to message this.” (20:56)
  • But: Most red states remain solidly Republican despite systemic harm; “If you don’t like something about where you live and you live in fucking Oklahoma, there’s only one party to blame. Only one.” (21:37, Josh Welch)

• Final Take:

  • “Those Bible belt states, Darling, they are all bottom 10 states. It’s almost as if their higher power knows they’re full of shit.” (22:14, Host)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Trump’s Pardons:
  • “It’s one big grift. Everything is a grift.” —Josh Welch (07:07)
• On Corporate Environmental Abuse:
  • “If you have a shitload of money, millions of dollars, then you can pretty much do whatever you want to in this country.” —Josh Welch (13:35)
• Host Commentary on Republican Messaging:
  • “Their ability to get working class people to vote against their own ... is really the most successful plot.” —Host (17:09)
• On Education Cuts:
  • “Then pylon if you’re disabled or black. And then it just becomes almost insurmountable to live in America, which it feels like is the design of all of this.” —Host (17:53)

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• Luigi Mangione Case & Psychiatric Defense: 01:00–05:51
• Trump’s Pay-to-Play Pardons: 05:51–10:15
• Pardons and Restitution for Victims: 08:08–10:15
• DOJ/Elon Musk Data Center Pollution: 10:18–14:24
• Education Dept. Dismantled/School Funding Cuts: 17:11–22:14

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Tone & Style

• The episode is sharply irreverent, unapologetically progressive, and full of biting humor and exasperation. Jennifer and Angie mix righteous outrage with sarcasm, supported by Josh’s dry, legalistic realism.

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Summary

This episode spotlights corruption, governmental backsliding, and social injustice with a blend of legal analysis, lived experience, and acerbic wit. The central theme is a government rigged by and for those with money and access, to the detriment of the vulnerable. And while the hosts lament the grip of anti-progressive politics in places like Oklahoma, they urge listeners to “pay attention” and see through the hypocrisy—hoping that lived experience will finally shift the political calculus on the ground.

Transcript

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[Host]

Luigi Mangione is back in the news and his defense is saying that they're going to use a psychiatric defense in his murder case in New York. Pop this up. The Associated Press is reporting Luigi Mangione will assert a psychiatric defense at his state murder trial and killing of United Health Care CEO Brian Thompson. Judge says Here to discuss what a psychiatric defense is is criminal defense attorney Josh Welch. Josh, what is a psychiatric defense?

[Josh Welch]

In the State of New an affirmative defense is called extreme emotional disturbance. If you can prove that at the time of the criminal act, then it allows you to get potentially a manslaughter conviction as opposed to a murder conviction. But in essence you are admitting that you did commit the crime. So if he asserts this defense, he is in fact making the admission that I committed the crime, but I did so under these circumstances. Therefore the defense kicks in. What's the takeaway here? From my perspective is that a conviction on manslaughter would give him a significantly less period of incarceration than a conviction of murder.

[Host]

So when it goes to trial, the defense actually has to prove something like the the prosecution has to prove that he did it beyond a reasonable doubt. But in this type of defense, you have to, you have to put on your own case.

[Josh Welch]

That's right.

[Host]

Similar to what the prosecution is trying to prove their their set of facts.

[Josh Welch]

It's an affirmative defense and before the jury can be instructed on the defense, the judge has to make a finding that there is sufficient proof and I assume it's going to come in the form of psychiatric testimony from different evaluations they've had on him to help support this theory. Again, it's still an admission by Mr. Mangione that he did in fact commit the crime. But, but it has to do with his mens rea and the fact that he was under this extreme emotional disturbance at the time of the occurrence to where he thought that the commission of this crime was somewhat different than what it was. It was mitigated to a certain extent as a normal thought process in his mind. Again.

[Host]

So does. Does the jury have to. Can they reject that defense and then he's admitted that he's.

[Josh Welch]

They can. And just think of it in terms of like in any bar fight you get into, a defendant might assert the defense of self defense. In other words, I was being struck first, therefore I'm going to assert the defense that I was protecting myself. A jury can in fact say, no, the evidence doesn't show that you were struck first. It shows that you were the aggressor. We're here in the same context. The jury could hear this psychiatric testimony and say, hey, I think this is bullshit. I don't think this guy really felt that way or thought that way. And they can reject that defense if they want to, and then he could be pet. Potentially convicted of murder. So there's a risk associated with running this defense up the flagpole. And the risk is that you're admitting the commission of the crime up front.

[Host]

So as a criminal defense lawyer, if you know that the psychological soil with the American electorate with a potential jury pool is that these health care companies are denying people cancer treatments, are saying, I'm sorry, that's not covered by your insurance, and that there is a real appetite in the electorate sl jury pool that these health care executives are killing people. As a criminal defense attorney, is this a gamble that you are going to play into this trial? Are you going to try to slip that in? Can you do that? Because that's why this is so famous. I mean, everybody on gay Twitter will say it's famous because he's hot and everybody hates health care companies. But is it, is that something that you're going to try to slip in as a criminal defense attorney all the time? The egregious denials for profit by these healthcare companies?

[Josh Welch]

I think what you're asking me is like, is it okay to tell the jury, listen, this son of a bitch deserved to be killed and here's why. And obviously judges are the gatekeepers of things like that and they're not going to allow criminal defense lawyers to get that egregious with those suggestions. And so they're going to try to keep stuff like that out. But yes, as a Criminal defense lawyer. You want to paint a picture that what Mr. Mangione was going through, how he was grieving. You want to show the greed of these corporate CEOs, but again, a trial judge is going to limit the amount of that evidence that's, that's admissible simply because being a greedy piece of shit doesn't also justify you being murdered right in the eyes of the law. Even, even. Even though you want to suggest it. And a lot of people in the public believe that or they've echoed those things in a court of law, those things don't apply.

[Host]

I think this trial is going to be super big, so I want you to stay locked in on it to support, to report to our viewers exactly what's going on here. Let's shift gears. Keeping in the legal genre. People are paying Trump for pardons, as has been reported. But there's a little hook to it here that I didn't see coming. Pop this up. Trump gave pardons in exchange for up to $2 million through influencer program, bypassing the Justice Department. Next slide. A Reuters investigation found Trump's clemency now flows through a paid network of influencers appealing directly to him. With the Justice Department sidelined, 96% of Trump's pardons broke Justice Department rules. Some intermediaries charge up to $2 million for access. That access is enhanced when an applicant can craft a narrative that resonates with the president's own sense of victimization. I am no criminal investigator. I am no criminal defense lawyer, but this in and of itself, what I just read to you, sounds like it's a bunch of crimes.

[Josh Welch]

Well, to me, what jumps out off the screen is the fact that 96% of these pardons don't meet the Department of Justice guidelines. Now, that, of course, is under a normal regime and leadership of the Department of justice. But 96%, that's an ungodly number. So what he's done is he sidelined the Department of Justice. He set up his own porthole for pardon request. He's got these influencers like Roger Stone running out front where they can literally money grab 2, $3 million per hit, if the people have that much money, simply for Roger Stone's access to Donald Trump to sit down and try to sell him on some bullshit theory as to why this person was convicted. It was a weaponization of Biden's Department of Justice, blah, blah, blah. It's unheard of. It's all. Again, everything we talk about in the Trump administration always comes down to one thing and that is, it's one big grift. Everything is a grift.

[Host]

Let's talk about a lot of the people that he is pardoning have robbed people out of money, have absolutely stolen from people, and they have bravely hired attorneys, had class action lawsuits and received a verdict wherein the person who stole from them is supposed to face accountability, but also more importantly to them, receive restitution. And so when the President does this and you have people that like invested in things, their retirement accounts, kind of Bernie Madoff, miniature Bernie Madoffs that he's pardoning, what happens to their restitution when the President pardons their crimes?

[Josh Welch]

Oh, he has the authority and he has done this, in fact, and we've talked about this, in fact, he's wiped away just completely with a wave of a magic wand, wiped away all of these orders of restitution that these defendants are ordered to repay. So, for example, let's say that you're the CEO of a company and you defraud your investors, you defraud the stockholders of tens or 20, 30, 40, $50 million, and you're convicted at trial. And the court also makes a finding that restitution is owed to these victims in the amount of $70 million. Well, when Trump grants one of his pardons to one of these pay for play individuals that reach out through a social media influencer like Roger Stone, he also wipes away the one chance that these victims of crimes have to be paid back to be made whole to receive restitution. And that's the part of it that is jaw dropping. These innocent victims, these pardons reach far more than just the defendants and their families and their freedom. It reaches all of these victims of crimes that are looking forward to that payday of restitution to be made whole for the fraud that was perpetrated upon them.

[Host]

So they were first ripped off by these felons that had been found guilty and then secondly ripped off by their own country. Probably a lot of these people maybe even voted for this man.

[Josh Welch]

That's right. That's right.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Okay.

[Host]

Daily moving along the doj, same subject is arguing that Elon Musk's data center powering grok has the right to pollute. Pop this up. The New York Times is reporting the Justice Department is seeking to throw out a lawsuit against Elon Musk's company Xai over the data center's air pollution, saying it has the right to run polluting gas burning turbines in Mississippi despite not having permits for them. The department cited national security concerns saying Elon Musk Co. Had played a crucial role in the in the Iran war. It also argued it has the authority to stop environmental lawsuits brought by citizens. Mississippi's in the Bible Belt state. Joshua and I grew up in a Bible Belt state. What amazes me about the Republican Party is their ability to tell people, on the one hand, we are pro life. We value life so incredibly much that we think if you're raped by your uncle, that's God's will and you're going to have to have that baby. That's how much they value life in a real twisted, sadistic kind of way. Right? But on the other hand, when it comes to corporations completely plundering the environment, which is going to cause cancer clusters, generational health issues, warming of the climate, etc. They're absolutely pro death. And this by the DOJ. We pay the government to set up safety net for its citizens. And the Republican Party has brilliantly said, oh, we think government needs to be run like a business. What's the point of a business? To make a profit? That is not the point of government. Government is to protect its citizenry. From your vantage, from your career, when you see the DOJ siding with these corporations that are plundering the earth, what stage of fascism here do you think we are?

[Josh Welch]

Well, I think what we haven't talked about, and I'll answer your question in just a second, what we haven't talked about is the communities that are impacted by this pollution. African American communities in the state of Mississippi. So that shows you right there, they don't care about an African American community. I think there are 27 natural gas turbines that are owned by this company that are putting these toxins into the airway in violation of the Clean Air Act. And the Department of Justice wasn't even a party to this lawsuit. So understand this. The Department of Justice and the state of Mississippi intervened. They stepped in the middle of this lawsuit and said, hey, we're asking the court to dismiss this. We think it should be dismissed. And for the reasons that you stated up front, they're basically saying we don't have a permit, we don't have the right to do this stuff. But this is an important company. It's involved in, you know, all this bullshit. You can hear the Iraq War, all this stuff as an excuse. And it just shows you once again, a prime example of capitalism in this country. And people that have more money are treated differently than those that aren't. And that couldn't be become more and more apparent daily as we watch this administration that if you have. We just talked about the pardons. If you have means or money and access to President Trump, then you can get something done. And I don't know why the people in states like Oklahoma or Mississippi that live in a small town somehow think that Donald Trump and these people are somehow champions of their causes, that they give two fucks about what you're doing in the middle of Oklahoma. These guys are all about money. And if you have a lot of money, if you have a shitload of money, millions of doll dollars, then you can pretty much do whatever you want to in this country. But if you don't, if you own a small business in Paul's Valley or in Norman, Oklahoma, and you play by the rules and you pay your taxes, well, guess what? You're Pay attention. Watch the news. Read these stories.

[Host]

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[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

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[Host]

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[Josh Welch]

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[Host]

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[Host]

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[Josh Welch]

Really? It's impressive.

[Host]

It really is. Okay, and last story I want to review with you. Pop this up, Kylie. New York Times. The Trump administration took its most aggressive steps to dismantle the Education Department by breaking away key programs for disabled students and the enforcement of civil rights laws in schools. And so not only is this completely racist, I want to also point out to a lot of our listeners that might not know this. In a lot of rural towns in Oklahoma, their funding for schools. In the richest country in the history of the world, the funding for schools in rural Oklahoma has dried up so much that they have changed to a four day school week where the kids go to school only Monday through Thursday. In a state that ranks 50th in education, they are drawing back, spending even more, which creates all sorts of obstacles for the pro family, traditional family, family values, God, guns, and Jesus group. Because then these working class people, what do they do on Friday where a lot of these kids are very poor, that's where they got their lunch and their breakfast and then their parents have to go to work and there's no nobody to take care of them. Then pylon if you're disabled or black. And then it just becomes almost insurmountable to live in America, which it feels like is the design of all of this.

[Josh Welch]

Josh, I, I think Trump has always made it a priority for him to dismantle the Department of Education, and I think he's delivering on that promise. They don't want a system where government can help and, or educate people. That's when they lose. When people become educated, when they learn more, when they progress more, that's when administrations like the Trump administration start to face consequences. So this is all by design and it's all designed to hit the lower income minorities of this country. They just don't care about them. And so like you said, if you're living in a small town in rural Oklahoma, you depend on your government to a certain extent. You depend on your school system. You depend on these things. And if you don't have them, it's going to hit your pocketbook. And so we can only hope that people are paying attention and they see these cuts or they see the lack of enforcement of these things in real time, and they pay attention. You have to pay attention.

[Host]

And the changes move programs for disabled students into the Health and Human Services Department and the enforcement of civil rights laws in schools to the justice department. So RFK Jr. The guy who castrated a raccoon, kept the penis to study it at a later date, will now be responsible for helping disabled students. And Todd Blanch, the person who sat down with convicted child sex trafficker Ghislaine Maxwell and probably has a pardon just folded up in his pocket, just waiting for the politically opportune time to roll that out. He will be responsible for protecting marginalized students, America. So the man who protects child sex traffickers will now be responsible for protecting our most marginalized citizens in America. And all of this is voted in with a mandate by evangelical Christians. That sanctimonious lecture the electorate about traditional family values and how Jesus Christ is their Lord and personal savior, and then they bully and rat the most marginalized Americans in this country is so disgusting.

[Josh Welch]

And the people that experience this in real time need to pay attention. I mean, this is a layup for Democrats. Like these things are happening across the country. The economy is in dire straits. People are suffering economically. So again, you can just remove the politics and just stick to the messaging of this. The facts are the facts. Like everybody is hurting out there. And this is an opportunity for Democrats once again to jump in and try to message this. Because you and I both know in Oklahoma and other states like Oklahoma, people are inclined to vote against their own financial interest. They do it day in and day out all the time. But when it hits them personally, you would hope that they can see this for what it is. I mean, I know here in Oklahoma, the Republicans have controlled both houses in the state. They've had the governor, they've had the Lieutenant Governor, they've had the attorney general, they've had both US Senators, they've had all four US Congressmen. So if you don't like something about where you live and you live in fucking Oklahoma, there's only one party to blame. Only one. You can't say Joe Biden, this. You can't say Democrat this. I'm sorry, that doesn't work. It's a all Republicans and all of

[Host]

those Bible belt states, Darling, they are all bottom 10 states. It's almost. It's almost as if their higher power knows they're full of. All right, that's all we have. Please, like, subscribe and comment and we will be back later with more news.